Since there are few of you who don't agree with me saying that game has no P2W. Let me re-iterate and explain. I have a very different definition and opinion on what is P2W and what isn't. P2W is when you pay real money to gain advantage over players who don't. But what if there is absolutely no noticeable advantage in TL? Ill give you an example. TL has a blessing/pitty system on leveling traits, which are the ultimate minmax end game gearing system. Accumulating 500 blessing guarantees 100% success chance on next level up. P2W would be having and item in cash shop, that you CANNOT obtain by playing the game, only by spending real money, that will give you those 500 blessing on use. Giving you clear advantage over every other player who doesn't pay real money. Now in TL, you have marketplace where real money currency is used to buy gear and mats. A gigawhale can spend real money, gear himself fully and minmax everything and on PAPER he gets the advantage, but you have to look at the bigger picture and apply that into practice. Anyone that has played TL knows that PVE and dungeons are easy where a player with full blue gear can clear it, so having maxed out gear doesn't mean anything. It is the same in PVP, which is large scale open world PVP, where a gigawhale can get melted by 2-3 full blue geared players, before he can even deal any damage. So now you have a gigawhale that spent 10k USD to max out gear to get advantage on paper, but in practice it doesn't mean anything. Everyone is equal when there is 200vs200 alliance wars. You can see how meaningless P2W is and how little effect it actually has on F2P players. As a matter of fact it even benefits F2P players, as gigawhales will buy their mats and gear and eventually F2P players can get enough real money currency to gear themselves. On 19:25 in bottom right corner you can see that I sold gear and mats to earn 9200 LUCENT, which is around 90-100 USD in real money. I'm not trying to defend P2W and microtransactions and sure I misspoke when I said the game has no P2W. It is P2W, but you have to apply it to the game and understand do you even gain an advantage if you P2W. Every MMORPG is different in terms of P2W and thats why TL has very minimal amounts of it that actually would affect F2P players. Don't just listen to what people on reddit and other streamers and creators say about P2W. Every game is different. Try the game and see for yourself.
TL;DR it isnt pay to win if a f2p player can get the same gear by just grinding 1000 hour that a p2p can get instantly. Cope but ok if that's your definition. Especially for castle sieges for guilds which clearly is the only goal for endgame really. Top end guilds that only let whales in with maxed gear, I dont think your '3 f2p players can beat a single p2w player' is going to be that good of an arguement. Now you have 200 players froma guild having the power of 600 people. Doesn't sound so trivial.
@@IncubiAkster the gap between fully whale stacked purple gear player and a normal f2p isn't big. It could become big once legendary gear is introduced, but right now, the difference in damage is very minimal for both pve and pvp.
Some people font want to waste their precious time and or money if it's something they can avoid. Some people can play games all day Some half the day etc so u can't expect them not to wanna go see who says what about a certain game they wanna play. People don't have to experience something to know it isn't for then and thats been a long running meme. I don't have to go play forspoken to know that game isn't for me based on its gameplay and info. Why tf would I waste my time trying to prove to myself otherwise when I can visually see. You don't have to experience something to form an opinion and it's not like this is the very first game to ever come out with systems like this. There are similar games with similar systems so yes alot of us can form our opinion without playing. I think once the gaming community whether it be streamers or players quit telling other people how to feel about a game they happen to like we'd be in a better position.
@@richardgreen5756 thats like going to a burger place, trying their burger, not liking it and forming an opinion that burgers from other fast foods are exactly like the one you didnt like. But in reality its different, and so is every mmorpg. Just cause you saw similar issues in other games u played doesnt mean its the same. You cant form valid opinion about something until u try it.
1: Stronger you are more hunting events you win giving your more materials faster to make the books to upgrade skills. (Thats called an advantage... and you can pay for that advantage...) 3: World bosses now drop loots based on damage apparently, more damage better chance of a drop. (so stronger you are you have an advantage) 2: You can get guarantee traits if you use the same tier and only have fail rates and blessing mechanic if you are upgrading a trait with a dif color tier. 4: If you need to get growth stones you can swipe multiple times on the market to do so, they are not hard to get if you have the money. You can dissolve items for materials and buy materials. 5: PvP is not just guilds, if you are a PvP player in 1v1 you easily dominate (plenty of 1v1 happens). Even if you are in a guild who is P2W geared out you dominate. We have guys in our guild hitting 4k crits with bows and over 8K if they hit a heavy attack that does double damage.... literally one tapping people. We have maxed out tanks who literally can't be killed in mass guild wars lol. 6: If you need solent and want to be a degen then buy off market with real money and sell to in game vendor for solent, problem solved.... or just farm it, I can farm 600k+ an hour. Prob more I've missed. This is really no bottleneck, the only bottleneck is the market if you cant find the traits you want, I have not come across that issue. At the very minimum you can max out a full blue set of gear levels and traits in a couple days or even instantly if the market and money allows..... depending on the market of the server of course. But, if you are a whale and money isn't in option it can be done as I have seen in done in my guild multiple times. I started a new character with 25-30 hours of gameplay so far on it and I' m all blue fully maxed levels and traits on all gear now starting on purple. How is that not P2W. It's the definition of P2W.....
XD alright alright we get, your awesome, your guild is awesome you all deserve medals and should totally play the game professionally because you’re just sooo good, congratulations 😂
This video is super good! Very well done, I’ve played 100s of hours too and this is very good overall explanation especially with the dev changes for levelling etc… also for the dungeons there is harder modes coming too haha!
I'm very glad that more harder dungeons are coming. I like learning mechs and finding most optimal patterns, but so far its been quite easy. I skipped a lot of small stuff and details, and kept the video focused on bigger more important things.
Please stop posting the same comment on every TL videos on the platform, NCSoft marketing department. Instead of doing these, how about you go and teach your good friend, ArenaNet, a lesson in product PR? Guild Wars 2 has little to none marketing nowadays .
this is literally whats wrong with the game, much like albion, you cut your playerbase hard when you don't have dedicated servers. this game will not last, literally like how black desert is dead, or albion is dead, or foxhole is dead, none of these 1 server for all games last, none of them at all.
You can tell if the character creation AI system is any good by how well Asmongold is being created as playable character. How well did TL do? Does it look like Asmon?
ESO is my favorite mmo of all time due to the skill combat and nearly limitless character builds. 10 years playing and still thinking of new tanks, dps, healer, and hybrid builds. I wish other mmos would allow that much flexibility. Otherwise, I've been eyeing Throne and Liberty here for a long time. I played the very first closed event. I liked where it was going. Look forward to trying it again once its out. Thanks for giving your thoughts with your experience.
@TheNaughtyPetey I've heard positive things about GW2. Have yet to try it. Thanks for the info. I'll definitely look into its character building capabilities.
@@TheNaughtyPetey Not sure about this, played both for years and I'd say they are on par. ESO maybe wins out due to the fact that you can combo both Champion points + weapon skill points + actual skills. In GW2, you really only have your skill points + weapon skills, no? Been awhile since I played GW2 though, it just didn't feel as customizable b/c in GW2 people usually favored the meta builds more. Please correct me and then it will give me a reason to try out GW2 EoD again.
I’m against P2W but the game looks incredible, it’ll be a fresh start, and I don’t think I’d mind grinding a game I enjoy doing the grind. New World was lots of fun for me and I rather enjoyed the gathering grind and 700 gs wasn’t bad.
One point you are very wrong about is why fast paced action combat MMOs dies out. It's because all of them had atrocious P2W monetisation with very bad new player experience. Just look at lost ark. 90% of players, who still play lost ark in the west play it because of combat. If not the combat and amazing raids, the game would be long time dead already. Same With Tera, BDO and co.
Thanks, great vid. I was wondering, is there a PvP like instances, where you queue and you fight team vs team for rewards? Warzone pvp isntances basically
It's true that there is no equality in MMORPGs. Players who spend a lot of money will always have an advantage in obtaining items from merchants. No matter how good your skill play is, you may still lose to players who spend money
It is just Phase 1, they didnt release all content just yet, they announced in new patch they will add new dungeons, Classic wow in P1 had 4-5 dungeons to spam also. Regarding bots i dont mind them, they help me out kill monsters faster while farming contracts :)
When WoW came out i believe it took you few months just to reach level 50 :-D Fewer pahts of dungeon was not and isssue due to totaly different approache :D
but when there are pvp events is there anything divides you into factions or groups or do you have to do it with your friends to join the group first? well done for the review i like it
sounds like a nice game, what are specs for hardware for this game? also if I play an hour or 2 a day is it gona be enough to keep up with other players or i should pass? i dont think endlessly playing video game wont affect personal life...
I played 1440p full EPIC settings on rtx 4070 and ryzen 7700x and I had no FPS issues so far. Lowest it goes is to 80-90 in big city. I have a benchmark video on my channel so feel free to look there, but I mostly run around the world that isn't crowded. As far as it comes to grind, it is grindy game, but also dependent on RNG. I honestly have not played that much since KR release, maybe 3-4 hours in the evening just doing events and dungeons. You don't have to grind, but it will speed up your progress. I haven't done any mob grinding or sollant farming and I was able to push all my gear to high level as f2p. If you understand the market and how to make lucent for free you can avoid grind to a certain degree. Its deffo nothing like Lost Ark in terms of daily grind.
I understand that you are fan of the game but what are you smoking "I can assure you that the current version of the game has absolutely no p2w elements", the fact that you can buy basicaly anything within the game with $ is p2w, and this game isn't even hiding it so idk why the balant lie. Also lost ark was and i assume still is P2W, you can easly swipe to get everything maxed out and get your card sets quicker. The fact that as free to play player you can also get all that gear doesnt mean that the game isn't pay to win, sure you can grind something for ungodly hours or just swipe your card and get it instantly, that is p2w not pay to progress faster (progress faster would be buying potions that would give you x% more exp or something like that, not just option to buy straight up BIS gear and mats for upgrade). As much as watching rest of your video was interesting it's gotta be one of the most retarded takes on p2w elemnts in the games that i have seen so far :|
as a player that tested the kr version too for over 100 hrs I can confirm that p2w do exist, a more realistic approach is saying that the game has an average p2w factor as many other korean mmos, but we also have to consider the fact, that this game is very strongly controlled by end-game pvp guilds, so being able to whale out your gear faster and make huge whale guilds, will make them dominate servers and make the game more p2w, since the equipment will obviously make you way stronger and you will win gvg thanks to this factor (Which leads to controlling areas and generating more resources for your guildies)
Meaning of pay-to-win in English in computer games, involving or relating to the practice of paying to get weapons, abilities, etc. that give you an advantage over players who do not spend money. What advantage do you get in a game where end-game is large scale PVP. A game where 3 sub-par geared players can melt a gigawhale. PVE is easy and you can clear every dungeon with blue gear. Like I said, every MMORPG has different form and different definition of P2W. Buying gear with real money gives you advantage only on paper, but in practice is much different. If you don't like games that have cash shops and P2W elements, you are in the wrong gaming genre. It's a F2P game, how do you plan the company makes the money? Money doesn't grow on trees, and video games are essentially a business, and if the business isn't making money from a project, it gets shut down.
So far its very expensive to swap weapons and builds, but plans are already in motion to reduce the cost and introduce skill transferring in future patches. Right now best way it to level up new char with 2 different weapons. Nothing is shared between alts so you won't have any other benefit from playing new char. By the time its out on NA/EU everything should be more balanced and easier.
"I can assure you that the current version of the game has absolutely no Pay 2 Win elements, it is like Lost Ark" - You can't be this out of touch, is this satire?
Fanboys love to twist P2W to mean all sorts of things other than the fact that a game is P2W ANYTIME you can pay money to gain some kind of advantage (ie progress faster, convivence, increased power, etc)
I have a different definition of what P2W is to what everyone else thinks P2W is. Ill give you an example. TL has a blessing/pitty system on leveling traits, which are the ultimate minmax end game gearing system. Accumulating 500 blessing guarantees 100% success chance on next level up. Pay to win would be having and item in cash shop, that you CANNOT obtain by playing the game, only by spending real money, that will give you those 500 blessing on use. Giving you clear advantage over every other player who doesn't pay real money. What P2W isn't, the ability to spend real money on cosmetics, food and HP potions. Even spending real money on premium currency isn't pay to win, cause you DON'T WIN ANYTHING. PVE is easy, PVP is numbers game, so even if you have someone that spent 10k USD in the game to minmax every possible gear piece, that player will get melted in 2 secs in PVP by 3-4 players. If 10k USD spent to stay alive for 2 secs in PVP is winning to you, then I have nothing else to say. Paying real money makes you stronger, but you don't win anything. You lose
Welcome to literally every live service game worth a shit in 2024. Its a business. They have bills to pay. Ur never stopping p2w, battlepasses, loot boxes, or real money items in games now a days. Deal with it or go play something else
@@FRESHY_GG Dude the game is completely pay to win what are you even talking about. One of my mates has already spent $3k+ gearing out with epics and traits etc and he dominates in PvP, so much so he has 2000 kills and 300 deaths. Sorry mate, this game is very much P2W. Your traits example means nothing because if you use the same tier traits it’s a 100% success rate lol so you are wrong there is a gaurantee you only get blessings if you use a Blue on purple for example at that would be a 10% success rate. Purple on purple however is 100% success rate. My mate who’s spend $3k is always sending me slips of him taking out groups of guys and the only reason is his gear that he paid for with real money. Group PvP example means nothing either, plenty of 1v1 PvP goes on at night or whatever it is on the PvP areas. I’ve got over 350 hours so far and yes this game is a major P2W. Even I’ve spent a little to get some good gear and traits… how is that now pay to win lol.
TL took inspiration from Lineage 2, so a lot of things will be very similar from that game. But in terms on content, you would need to try it to decide. Right now whats important to me is that devs are listening to feedback and fixing very fast all the issues, while keeping p2w very minimal. Thats what should be important nowadays. Content will come
They should charge a monthly fee. Not alot but it would greatly impact the bots. A free a game where you can just change your ip and pop right back on and bot all over again
Bots are being slowly but surely dealt with, but even with strict KR verification they still manage to go through, so I'm slightly worried that amazon wont be able to do anything against them like they did with Lost Ark
@@FRESHY_GG I have never known a mmo that can get rid of them. I do not think it is possible honestly. Even a monthly fee greatly helps, but still only so much. I am waiting for the release in the U.S. I heard today there has been a ban on anyone outside of Korea. I came damn close to getting it yesterday. I am soooo glad I did not
@@CopperRavenProductions yea they banned a lot of accounts and a lot of western players got caught in the crossfire. Bots are something we have to learn to live with as its hard to get rid of them.
WOW has monthly sub, but bots are operating 24/7 . Only solution is sub and active team who is hunting them. But that cost a lot of money and companies are just not investing back in the game enough for that, instead they putting auto systems that partly not working, and even they banning few hundred or thousand for bot's is still worth to pay sub and get ban and do it again :)
Is there any other activities outside of usual grind on open field and in dungeons? Like is there fishing, cooking, housing and so on? Are there special skills to it? How is trading? Something like selling of soulshots and spiritshots and make profit out of it like in La2? What about politics on the servers? Could guild manage taxation in cities, build stuff, conquer areas? And if not, did developers mentioned about it as for plans for future? Great video btw!
1. No life skills, gathering is very basic, anyone can gather any node regardless of level 2. Player trading doesn't exist, there is only marketplace where real money currency is used to purchase and sell items and mats 3. Castle siege allows winning guild to get rewards from tax and most likely set their own tax in that castle. No building, and conquering only in node wars by capturing them.
Saying it's not P2W then saying it's just like lost ark ..... I know Korea and the west have different culture, but over here Lost Ark is a textbook P2W game.
all games that have progression systems are 'p2w' the cost is either time or money. Even Everquest, FF14, WOW. All of them are p2w by the standards that everyone holds Lost Ark too
@@telleryoutube4458 not true kiddo. in WoW, everyone pays and starts the same. it's your skill that makes your game more or less time-consuming based on what you do. in games like LA and this one, it's a clear donation p2w.
dumb question, this is the korean version but is in (what I see) perfect English. is that just how korea releases games these days? just english and not Korean?
not a dumb question, throne and liberty KR version allows you to change the language in the settings(text) to english, the voice overs are still in korean though.
Very nice video! Gave back a little more trust in TNL to me. Luckily. Since I really miss a more modern version of Lineage 2 (say L3), this has my hopes up to scratch the itch in the meantime. That being said. It still seems to me like a blown up mobile game. That is not a good thing.
It really bothers me that they still cannot make their games play smoothly during large scale pvp or pve. It shouldn't be a thing. They should check how the game performs and limit the amount of players to th3le point where it's 60 fps playable at max settings for a good machine. World over might be harder to plan for, since any amount of players might decide to fight a world boss at the same time, but for instanced group content, I really don't see a valid excuse.
I'm sorry...zero P2W...you lost all credibility with that statement right there. And yeah Lost Arc is 100% absolutely P2W as well. No modern PC MMO game has the old definition of P2W anymore. That distinction is only really relevant in mobile games. P2W now is can you buy power...even ones you can grind out with real money? And the answer to that is ABSOLUTELY yes in both T&L and LA case. And really, that answer is yes to a VAST majority of modern PC MMO games as well...which is starting to make that kinda irrelevant as well. So what really matters in the modern market is what is the conversion rate of real money to time saved. So 3k lucent is worth around 750k won...which in USD is something like 60 bucks...but realistic that is 75 bucks since the conversion if 1k won is 1 buck in most other games from Korea. 75 bucks for 100+ hours. So basically, you can have 100 hours of grinding in this game for 75 bucks...or 75 cents an hour. That is pretty bad. Even if we cut out 30 hours for storyline play, that is basically a buck an hour. Which would have been a GREAT conversion rate 15 years ago. Now, it is god damn awful. And bots has zero effect on the economy...BWHAHAHAHA. This is a game you can't fall behind on is true...because you can pay money to catch up. Not for the reason you gave. Otherwise, you can't fall behind in WoW's endless gear treadmill with each release because you can get lucky and just get the new BiS item right away. Which is an idiotic statement. The amount of copium in this review to try and make this game look good is kinda obscene...but these three really take the cake.
People kept parroting the same thing about Lost Ark and I gave it a few hundred hours, but dude the catering to microtransactions and gated content just so that you're incentivised to pay killed ruined that game. And this games progression and service system seems to be 90% similar to LA, even to the bots grinding mats. Seems like a waste of time if you're looking for something different from the dozens of other microtransaction hell Korean mmos.
Hey there, I just found this game and am a huge fan of PVP / games of it in T&L style. I have a smaller partnered channel but its active & Id love to participate if possible somehow. Awesome commentary, you earned a sub, and thx for the vid!
I disagree with what you said about combat ... the only reason action combat mmos died out was never because of the combat it was because the games themselves were just bad overall the only reaskn alot of tab target mmos thrive is because theyre just the only good ones around or have a niche/cult following. Eso has a hybrid between action and tab target and is very successful and consistently play and bdo might not be the best but is still played by many.
Unfortunately the dungeon system and the crafting system look exactly like Lost Ark and that's not a good sign. dungeon runs are limited to a quantity just like the loot system Unfortunately you can't expect a good mmorpg from Korea that is player friendly
I want to try this game out but I feel like this is another MMO that wants to have all of your time. As someone that wants to enjoy other games, and also has other hobbies, I’m unsure if I would ever stick with it.
No it seems like you can play it on your own pace cause there’s a lot of players so even. If you feel like falling behind you will be on par with the new players anyways
Game progress with time. After 1 month, there is still content that hasn't been unlocked and events and bosses that need to be unlocked. You can hit level 50 in like 2 days and hit max level blue weapon in 3 days. You will more often feel like there is nothing to do, rather then that there is not enough time to do anything. You don't really fall behind if you don't play.
@@nickh4354 Its not attitude but as well MMO's doesn't mean you have to spend 12h+ a day to achieve something. as people have lifes, jobs, kids, hobbies. Games must be created the way that everyone could enjoy, not only those who don't care about their life and just sit near computer all day.
For the leveling and questing I was hoping it would encourage players to group up...I am tired of playing an online multiplayer game and end up soloing it through majority of the quests like everyone else. It just destroys the social aspect that makes MMORPGs great.
@@FRESHY_GG yeah not a fan of that either. If endgame is where the game is at and I need to spend 30-40 hours to get there then they should just have dropped me in endgame to begin with.
@@Mish0Picka Have you ever played an MMORPG? No MMORPG will throw you straight in end-game. You learn the game and its system through questing and leveling, so by the time you reach end-game you're not a complete noob and clueless about 99% of the game.
@@FRESHY_GG yes I have played plenty of them. What I wanted to say I dont like the system where you are not encouraged to team up earlier and enjoy the game until endgame not just play for the endgame. And no what you say isnt true for games like Guild Wars 1 & 2, New World etc.. If its all about the endgame all you needed was a tutorial about endgame. The whole journey of getting to it should be equally enjoyable and fun. Modern games modern audience, all the same shit anyway.
I was very disappointed as this appears to be a good looking game, but surprise! It is not available in the US and looks like it won't be for a LONG time. Steam just says "coming soon" which is Steam speak for somewhere between "long a$$ time" and "the day before the end of the world". What would be helpful is if you detailed for us the steps you took to be able to play this game. Did you have to use a Korean VPN?
Since there are few of you who don't agree with me saying that game has no P2W. Let me re-iterate and explain.
I have a very different definition and opinion on what is P2W and what isn't. P2W is when you pay real money to gain advantage over players who don't. But what if there is absolutely no noticeable advantage in TL? Ill give you an example.
TL has a blessing/pitty system on leveling traits, which are the ultimate minmax end game gearing system. Accumulating 500 blessing guarantees 100% success chance on next level up. P2W would be having and item in cash shop, that you CANNOT obtain by playing the game, only by spending real money, that will give you those 500 blessing on use. Giving you clear advantage over every other player who doesn't pay real money.
Now in TL, you have marketplace where real money currency is used to buy gear and mats. A gigawhale can spend real money, gear himself fully and minmax everything and on PAPER he gets the advantage, but you have to look at the bigger picture and apply that into practice. Anyone that has played TL knows that PVE and dungeons are easy where a player with full blue gear can clear it, so having maxed out gear doesn't mean anything. It is the same in PVP, which is large scale open world PVP, where a gigawhale can get melted by 2-3 full blue geared players, before he can even deal any damage. So now you have a gigawhale that spent 10k USD to max out gear to get advantage on paper, but in practice it doesn't mean anything. Everyone is equal when there is 200vs200 alliance wars. You can see how meaningless P2W is and how little effect it actually has on F2P players. As a matter of fact it even benefits F2P players, as gigawhales will buy their mats and gear and eventually F2P players can get enough real money currency to gear themselves. On 19:25 in bottom right corner you can see that I sold gear and mats to earn 9200 LUCENT, which is around 90-100 USD in real money.
I'm not trying to defend P2W and microtransactions and sure I misspoke when I said the game has no P2W. It is P2W, but you have to apply it to the game and understand do you even gain an advantage if you P2W. Every MMORPG is different in terms of P2W and thats why TL has very minimal amounts of it that actually would affect F2P players.
Don't just listen to what people on reddit and other streamers and creators say about P2W. Every game is different. Try the game and see for yourself.
TL;DR it isnt pay to win if a f2p player can get the same gear by just grinding 1000 hour that a p2p can get instantly. Cope but ok if that's your definition. Especially for castle sieges for guilds which clearly is the only goal for endgame really. Top end guilds that only let whales in with maxed gear, I dont think your '3 f2p players can beat a single p2w player' is going to be that good of an arguement. Now you have 200 players froma guild having the power of 600 people. Doesn't sound so trivial.
@@IncubiAkster the gap between fully whale stacked purple gear player and a normal f2p isn't big. It could become big once legendary gear is introduced, but right now, the difference in damage is very minimal for both pve and pvp.
Some people font want to waste their precious time and or money if it's something they can avoid. Some people can play games all day Some half the day etc so u can't expect them not to wanna go see who says what about a certain game they wanna play. People don't have to experience something to know it isn't for then and thats been a long running meme. I don't have to go play forspoken to know that game isn't for me based on its gameplay and info. Why tf would I waste my time trying to prove to myself otherwise when I can visually see. You don't have to experience something to form an opinion and it's not like this is the very first game to ever come out with systems like this. There are similar games with similar systems so yes alot of us can form our opinion without playing. I think once the gaming community whether it be streamers or players quit telling other people how to feel about a game they happen to like we'd be in a better position.
@@richardgreen5756 thats like going to a burger place, trying their burger, not liking it and forming an opinion that burgers from other fast foods are exactly like the one you didnt like. But in reality its different, and so is every mmorpg. Just cause you saw similar issues in other games u played doesnt mean its the same. You cant form valid opinion about something until u try it.
Your opinion of pay to win being yours doesn’t mean it’s the right one lol.
1: Stronger you are more hunting events you win giving your more materials faster to make the books to upgrade skills. (Thats called an advantage... and you can pay for that advantage...)
3: World bosses now drop loots based on damage apparently, more damage better chance of a drop. (so stronger you are you have an advantage)
2: You can get guarantee traits if you use the same tier and only have fail rates and blessing mechanic if you are upgrading a trait with a dif color tier.
4: If you need to get growth stones you can swipe multiple times on the market to do so, they are not hard to get if you have the money. You can dissolve items for materials and buy materials.
5: PvP is not just guilds, if you are a PvP player in 1v1 you easily dominate (plenty of 1v1 happens). Even if you are in a guild who is P2W geared out you dominate. We have guys in our guild hitting 4k crits with bows and over 8K if they hit a heavy attack that does double damage.... literally one tapping people. We have maxed out tanks who literally can't be killed in mass guild wars lol.
6: If you need solent and want to be a degen then buy off market with real money and sell to in game vendor for solent, problem solved.... or just farm it, I can farm 600k+ an hour.
Prob more I've missed. This is really no bottleneck, the only bottleneck is the market if you cant find the traits you want, I have not come across that issue.
At the very minimum you can max out a full blue set of gear levels and traits in a couple days or even instantly if the market and money allows..... depending on the market of the server of course. But, if you are a whale and money isn't in option it can be done as I have seen in done in my guild multiple times. I started a new character with 25-30 hours of gameplay so far on it and I' m all blue fully maxed levels and traits on all gear now starting on purple.
How is that not P2W. It's the definition of P2W.....
XD alright alright we get, your awesome, your guild is awesome you all deserve medals and should totally play the game professionally because you’re just sooo good, congratulations 😂
is there anything like openworld pvp to claim things?
things like alliance and horde in WOW?
You can't max out everything in 100 hours this guy payed to win it's obvious.
Cheers, very good video. Cant wait for release!
Great video as usual🎉
This looks like a lot of fun to try out!
Very informative Video. Thank you a lot for your time and work!
This video is super good! Very well done, I’ve played 100s of hours too and this is very good overall explanation especially with the dev changes for levelling etc… also for the dungeons there is harder modes coming too haha!
I'm very glad that more harder dungeons are coming. I like learning mechs and finding most optimal patterns, but so far its been quite easy. I skipped a lot of small stuff and details, and kept the video focused on bigger more important things.
Damn i loved your lost ark stuff. Hope you have fun
Many thx 4 the testing and summary
very detailed video. Kudos!
Super je video! Hvala
Great video and break down of the game, might try it out !
Thank you for your kind explanation.
I think that The TL is very very exciting game.
Have a good time with it.
Please stop posting the same comment on every TL videos on the platform, NCSoft marketing department.
Instead of doing these, how about you go and teach your good friend, ArenaNet, a lesson in product PR? Guild Wars 2 has little to none marketing nowadays .
Amazing video - everything described accurately without too much bias. Keep up the good work!
Karakterrr seemed funny :) thankx for the great video and explanation !
the fact there are no other channels and server is the best for me i hate when all the games got servers and zones
this is literally whats wrong with the game, much like albion, you cut your playerbase hard when you don't have dedicated servers.
this game will not last, literally like how black desert is dead, or albion is dead, or foxhole is dead, none of these 1 server for all games last, none of them at all.
@@mis8866 bdo lasted well over 10 years, it's not the server infrastructure that hurt the game at the moment.
Lmao that Asom char was actual pretty good
good informative video, thanks
1:20 i just died when he used Asmon as the reference 🤣
You can tell if the character creation AI system is any good by how well Asmongold is being created as playable character. How well did TL do? Does it look like Asmon?
ESO is my favorite mmo of all time due to the skill combat and nearly limitless character builds. 10 years playing and still thinking of new tanks, dps, healer, and hybrid builds. I wish other mmos would allow that much flexibility. Otherwise, I've been eyeing Throne and Liberty here for a long time. I played the very first closed event. I liked where it was going. Look forward to trying it again once its out. Thanks for giving your thoughts with your experience.
„I wish other mmos would allow that much flexibility”. Guild wars 2 has even more flexibility than teso, so just you know
@TheNaughtyPetey I've heard positive things about GW2. Have yet to try it. Thanks for the info. I'll definitely look into its character building capabilities.
@@TheNaughtyPetey Not sure about this, played both for years and I'd say they are on par. ESO maybe wins out due to the fact that you can combo both Champion points + weapon skill points + actual skills. In GW2, you really only have your skill points + weapon skills, no? Been awhile since I played GW2 though, it just didn't feel as customizable b/c in GW2 people usually favored the meta builds more. Please correct me and then it will give me a reason to try out GW2 EoD again.
Thankyou Freshy. This information is really clear and concise 😊
Thanks man. Waiting for global release
Thanks for the video! It's highly informative
I’m against P2W but the game looks incredible, it’ll be a fresh start, and I don’t think I’d mind grinding a game I enjoy doing the grind. New World was lots of fun for me and I rather enjoyed the gathering grind and 700 gs wasn’t bad.
good video bro
great work - thanks!
One point you are very wrong about is why fast paced action combat MMOs dies out. It's because all of them had atrocious P2W monetisation with very bad new player experience. Just look at lost ark. 90% of players, who still play lost ark in the west play it because of combat. If not the combat and amazing raids, the game would be long time dead already. Same With Tera, BDO and co.
Excited for the Playsation open beta, i got in for the APR 10
have fun
This is basically a P2W game without all the P2W aspects. I'm actually excited for this game again.
you forgot the "yet"
I cannot wait for the global release
Thanks, great vid. I was wondering, is there a PvP like instances, where you queue and you fight team vs team for rewards? Warzone pvp isntances basically
Upcoming in the future patches..been confirmed in last dev letter
@@FRESHY_GG awesome, thx!
The graphics look beautiful
good video.
I hope this keeps growing and hearing the community. Also hope comes to consolez
I wanna play this already!!!
soon
It's true that there is no equality in MMORPGs. Players who spend a lot of money will always have an advantage in obtaining items from merchants. No matter how good your skill play is, you may still lose to players who spend money
try guild wars 2 men.
Awesome videos dude! one question does the gundegons and most of the content have like a DPS meter or something like that?
Not yet, but will be implemented
It is just Phase 1, they didnt release all content just yet, they announced in new patch they will add new dungeons, Classic wow in P1 had 4-5 dungeons to spam also. Regarding bots i dont mind them, they help me out kill monsters faster while farming contracts :)
When WoW came out i believe it took you few months just to reach level 50 :-D Fewer pahts of dungeon was not and isssue due to totaly different approache :D
Can you kill the bots on forced pvp?
Keep going bro u r doing good, i really liked ur content & best of luck for future Videos.
This makes me excited for GW3.
Yes in 2027
but when there are pvp events is there anything divides you into factions or groups or do you have to do it with your friends to join the group first? well done for the review i like it
No factions its just free for all in events. Only your party and guild can be ally
sounds like a nice game, what are specs for hardware for this game?
also if I play an hour or 2 a day is it gona be enough to keep up with other players or i should pass?
i dont think endlessly playing video game wont affect personal life...
I played 1440p full EPIC settings on rtx 4070 and ryzen 7700x and I had no FPS issues so far. Lowest it goes is to 80-90 in big city. I have a benchmark video on my channel so feel free to look there, but I mostly run around the world that isn't crowded.
As far as it comes to grind, it is grindy game, but also dependent on RNG. I honestly have not played that much since KR release, maybe 3-4 hours in the evening just doing events and dungeons. You don't have to grind, but it will speed up your progress. I haven't done any mob grinding or sollant farming and I was able to push all my gear to high level as f2p. If you understand the market and how to make lucent for free you can avoid grind to a certain degree.
Its deffo nothing like Lost Ark in terms of daily grind.
No way Asmon was generated with hair.
I think a new version of this video needs to be made because it’s been heavily updated since this. Especially the p2w aspects.
will be done before global release
they need to add arena for small scale pvp with rewards (1 vs 1 , 3vs 3, 5 vs 5) or other small scale modes
the game looks so beautiful that i'm finally going to buy a 2k pc. Been on a £500 pc for the past 10 years
Im buying one too just for this Game
I understand that you are fan of the game but what are you smoking "I can assure you that the current version of the game has absolutely no p2w elements", the fact that you can buy basicaly anything within the game with $ is p2w, and this game isn't even hiding it so idk why the balant lie. Also lost ark was and i assume still is P2W, you can easly swipe to get everything maxed out and get your card sets quicker. The fact that as free to play player you can also get all that gear doesnt mean that the game isn't pay to win, sure you can grind something for ungodly hours or just swipe your card and get it instantly, that is p2w not pay to progress faster (progress faster would be buying potions that would give you x% more exp or something like that, not just option to buy straight up BIS gear and mats for upgrade). As much as watching rest of your video was interesting it's gotta be one of the most retarded takes on p2w elemnts in the games that i have seen so far :|
as a player that tested the kr version too for over 100 hrs I can confirm that p2w do exist, a more realistic approach is saying that the game has an average p2w factor as many other korean mmos, but we also have to consider the fact, that this game is very strongly controlled by end-game pvp guilds, so being able to whale out your gear faster and make huge whale guilds, will make them dominate servers and make the game more p2w, since the equipment will obviously make you way stronger and you will win gvg thanks to this factor (Which leads to controlling areas and generating more resources for your guildies)
Meaning of pay-to-win in English in computer games, involving or relating to the practice of paying to get weapons, abilities, etc. that give you an advantage over players who do not spend money.
What advantage do you get in a game where end-game is large scale PVP. A game where 3 sub-par geared players can melt a gigawhale. PVE is easy and you can clear every dungeon with blue gear. Like I said, every MMORPG has different form and different definition of P2W. Buying gear with real money gives you advantage only on paper, but in practice is much different. If you don't like games that have cash shops and P2W elements, you are in the wrong gaming genre. It's a F2P game, how do you plan the company makes the money? Money doesn't grow on trees, and video games are essentially a business, and if the business isn't making money from a project, it gets shut down.
how hard is it to swap weapons? is it like leveling up a new character or is it way faster once you hit max level?
So far its very expensive to swap weapons and builds, but plans are already in motion to reduce the cost and introduce skill transferring in future patches. Right now best way it to level up new char with 2 different weapons. Nothing is shared between alts so you won't have any other benefit from playing new char. By the time its out on NA/EU everything should be more balanced and easier.
"I can assure you that the current version of the game has absolutely no Pay 2 Win elements, it is like Lost Ark" - You can't be this out of touch, is this satire?
Fanboys love to twist P2W to mean all sorts of things other than the fact that a game is P2W ANYTIME you can pay money to gain some kind of advantage (ie progress faster, convivence, increased power, etc)
I have a different definition of what P2W is to what everyone else thinks P2W is. Ill give you an example.
TL has a blessing/pitty system on leveling traits, which are the ultimate minmax end game gearing system. Accumulating 500 blessing guarantees 100% success chance on next level up. Pay to win would be having and item in cash shop, that you CANNOT obtain by playing the game, only by spending real money, that will give you those 500 blessing on use. Giving you clear advantage over every other player who doesn't pay real money.
What P2W isn't, the ability to spend real money on cosmetics, food and HP potions. Even spending real money on premium currency isn't pay to win, cause you DON'T WIN ANYTHING. PVE is easy, PVP is numbers game, so even if you have someone that spent 10k USD in the game to minmax every possible gear piece, that player will get melted in 2 secs in PVP by 3-4 players. If 10k USD spent to stay alive for 2 secs in PVP is winning to you, then I have nothing else to say. Paying real money makes you stronger, but you don't win anything. You lose
Welcome to literally every live service game worth a shit in 2024. Its a business. They have bills to pay. Ur never stopping p2w, battlepasses, loot boxes, or real money items in games now a days. Deal with it or go play something else
Literally buy ingame currency with cash lol @@Roughneck7712
@@FRESHY_GG Dude the game is completely pay to win what are you even talking about. One of my mates has already spent $3k+ gearing out with epics and traits etc and he dominates in PvP, so much so he has 2000 kills and 300 deaths. Sorry mate, this game is very much P2W.
Your traits example means nothing because if you use the same tier traits it’s a 100% success rate lol so you are wrong there is a gaurantee you only get blessings if you use a Blue on purple for example at that would be a 10% success rate. Purple on purple however is 100% success rate. My mate who’s spend $3k is always sending me slips of him taking out groups of guys and the only reason is his gear that he paid for with real money.
Group PvP example means nothing either, plenty of 1v1 PvP goes on at night or whatever it is on the PvP areas.
I’ve got over 350 hours so far and yes this game is a major P2W. Even I’ve spent a little to get some good gear and traits… how is that now pay to win lol.
when will be the global release?
Hopefully first half of 2024.
There are NO random loot drops, everything is tied to questing and the cash shop, that's PTW.
When can we play finally?
Just started playin on console. Any tips thanks in advance
not exp on console sorry. but do watch my other videos
@@FRESHY_GG will do thank you
Is this game offer anything new to the genre except good graphics?
TL took inspiration from Lineage 2, so a lot of things will be very similar from that game. But in terms on content, you would need to try it to decide. Right now whats important to me is that devs are listening to feedback and fixing very fast all the issues, while keeping p2w very minimal. Thats what should be important nowadays. Content will come
They should charge a monthly fee. Not alot but it would greatly impact the bots. A free a game where you can just change your ip and pop right back on and bot all over again
Bots are being slowly but surely dealt with, but even with strict KR verification they still manage to go through, so I'm slightly worried that amazon wont be able to do anything against them like they did with Lost Ark
@@FRESHY_GG I have never known a mmo that can get rid of them. I do not think it is possible honestly. Even a monthly fee greatly helps, but still only so much. I am waiting for the release in the U.S. I heard today there has been a ban on anyone outside of Korea. I came damn close to getting it yesterday. I am soooo glad I did not
@@CopperRavenProductions yea they banned a lot of accounts and a lot of western players got caught in the crossfire. Bots are something we have to learn to live with as its hard to get rid of them.
damn i was just thinking of downloading the korean version... well guess we gonna wait then @@CopperRavenProductions
WOW has monthly sub, but bots are operating 24/7 . Only solution is sub and active team who is hunting them. But that cost a lot of money and companies are just not investing back in the game enough for that, instead they putting auto systems that partly not working, and even they banning few hundred or thousand for bot's is still worth to pay sub and get ban and do it again :)
Hi, I couldn`t find any way to play this game. It seems is not released yet...
Its playable in KR with verified KR phone and vpn
if you know archeage can you make tank like in archeage? full cc no damage
Yes, tanks are very strong classes in PVE and PVP, you can go full damage reduction, CC and just be invincible
Is there any other activities outside of usual grind on open field and in dungeons?
Like is there fishing, cooking, housing and so on? Are there special skills to it?
How is trading? Something like selling of soulshots and spiritshots and make profit out of it like in La2?
What about politics on the servers? Could guild manage taxation in cities, build stuff, conquer areas? And if not, did developers mentioned about it as for plans for future?
Great video btw!
Trading in this game doesn't exist, you can only sell everything in action house, end
First castle siege comes at the end of this month. The controlling guild should be able to profit from taxes
1. No life skills, gathering is very basic, anyone can gather any node regardless of level
2. Player trading doesn't exist, there is only marketplace where real money currency is used to purchase and sell items and mats
3. Castle siege allows winning guild to get rewards from tax and most likely set their own tax in that castle. No building, and conquering only in node wars by capturing them.
So i guess the best call is to wait for global release, where the game will be in a better state.
yes. this is beta test for EU/NA XD
Is there housing in this game?
@@Darkah no
new update in KR, shows that there will indeed be indoors housing as well.
When will this be available?
Q2 2024 most likely
Saying it's not P2W then saying it's just like lost ark ..... I know Korea and the west have different culture, but over here Lost Ark is a textbook P2W game.
is it already out ?
"It's not p2w, it's like Lost Ark".
Mate I played around 8000 hours of Lost Ark and let me tell you. It's giga p2w.
all games that have progression systems are 'p2w' the cost is either time or money. Even Everquest, FF14, WOW. All of them are p2w by the standards that everyone holds Lost Ark too
yup, wow even without p2w is p2w
@@mephs-l2 ??? what does this even mean ???
@@telleryoutube4458 not true kiddo. in WoW, everyone pays and starts the same. it's your skill that makes your game more or less time-consuming based on what you do. in games like LA and this one, it's a clear donation p2w.
I want to bust to this game!!!! Hope it's doesn't play out like Lost Ark....
What did you not like in Lost Ark?
Uhh... 1500 hrs.. and i spent alot of money.. i loved it but it wasnt healthy@@FRESHY_GG
@@FRESHY_GG No, I loved it ... 1500 hrs but spent alot of money and it wasn't healthy..
Is this game open world pvp like Aion? Or just event pvp ????
Full open world. No loading screens
dumb question, this is the korean version but is in (what I see) perfect English. is that just how korea releases games these days? just english and not Korean?
not a dumb question, throne and liberty KR version allows you to change the language in the settings(text) to english, the voice overs are still in korean though.
The game have an option for Eng/Kr language, but KR version's voiceovers are Korean only
huh interesting.
@@daoch. the game is ready for global but amazon is slow
indeed they are...@@FRESHY_GG
How did you get to play the game already ? I would love to try this game now if I'm able 😂
U can play on KR. There are guides on yt on how to play so check them out
Playing this!
Very nice video! Gave back a little more trust in TNL to me. Luckily. Since I really miss a more modern version of Lineage 2 (say L3), this has my hopes up to scratch the itch in the meantime.
That being said. It still seems to me like a blown up mobile game. That is not a good thing.
Just try it and see for urself
If I wanted to buy the battle pass would I be able to pay with paypal or something and not get banned by ncsoft?
You need KR credit card and KR phone number to buy anything on KR version. They don't support paypal
You forget, the longer the game is out the more lucent items will cost... happened with lost ark
Wouldn't it be the opposite? Long the game is out, more items are available meaning the supply is higher then demand, meaning prices go down?
It really bothers me that they still cannot make their games play smoothly during large scale pvp or pve. It shouldn't be a thing. They should check how the game performs and limit the amount of players to th3le point where it's 60 fps playable at max settings for a good machine. World over might be harder to plan for, since any amount of players might decide to fight a world boss at the same time, but for instanced group content, I really don't see a valid excuse.
Open world mass content was fine for the most part for me. Its better optimized then most other games, but always room for improvement.
When's the global release
Most likely Q2 2024
I'm sorry...zero P2W...you lost all credibility with that statement right there. And yeah Lost Arc is 100% absolutely P2W as well. No modern PC MMO game has the old definition of P2W anymore. That distinction is only really relevant in mobile games. P2W now is can you buy power...even ones you can grind out with real money? And the answer to that is ABSOLUTELY yes in both T&L and LA case. And really, that answer is yes to a VAST majority of modern PC MMO games as well...which is starting to make that kinda irrelevant as well. So what really matters in the modern market is what is the conversion rate of real money to time saved. So 3k lucent is worth around 750k won...which in USD is something like 60 bucks...but realistic that is 75 bucks since the conversion if 1k won is 1 buck in most other games from Korea. 75 bucks for 100+ hours. So basically, you can have 100 hours of grinding in this game for 75 bucks...or 75 cents an hour. That is pretty bad. Even if we cut out 30 hours for storyline play, that is basically a buck an hour. Which would have been a GREAT conversion rate 15 years ago. Now, it is god damn awful.
And bots has zero effect on the economy...BWHAHAHAHA.
This is a game you can't fall behind on is true...because you can pay money to catch up. Not for the reason you gave. Otherwise, you can't fall behind in WoW's endless gear treadmill with each release because you can get lucky and just get the new BiS item right away. Which is an idiotic statement. The amount of copium in this review to try and make this game look good is kinda obscene...but these three really take the cake.
when does this game come to NA?
Q2 2024 hopefully
When does this game to the western people so we can start playing??
Q2 2024 probably
It just needs a double jump and climb feature
People kept parroting the same thing about Lost Ark and I gave it a few hundred hours, but dude the catering to microtransactions and gated content just so that you're incentivised to pay killed ruined that game. And this games progression and service system seems to be 90% similar to LA, even to the bots grinding mats. Seems like a waste of time if you're looking for something different from the dozens of other microtransaction hell Korean mmos.
One big guild will control de server, since will have al.yhe good stuff and Zerg all.pvp events
Yes but when in Europe??? I cant wait
the bald one approaches
Lineage 3 ;)
Hey there, I just found this game and am a huge fan of PVP / games of it in T&L style. I have a smaller partnered channel but its active & Id love to participate if possible somehow. Awesome commentary, you earned a sub, and thx for the vid!
is there any point in playing this game if you are solo
Im playing solo, but u can always join a guild thats casual for extra activities. Its more fun with other people
are there any american /western Throne and Liberty content creators? everyone on youtube as a fucking thick foreign accent.
Looks good, we will see how much time they need to ruin it and let it die
I disagree with what you said about combat ... the only reason action combat mmos died out was never because of the combat it was because the games themselves were just bad overall the only reaskn alot of tab target mmos thrive is because theyre just the only good ones around or have a niche/cult following. Eso has a hybrid between action and tab target and is very successful and consistently play and bdo might not be the best but is still played by many.
Unfortunately the dungeon system and the crafting system look exactly like Lost Ark and that's not a good sign.
dungeon runs are limited to a quantity just like the loot system
Unfortunately you can't expect a good mmorpg from Korea that is player friendly
try it, maybe u change ur mind
I want to try this game out but I feel like this is another MMO that wants to have all of your time. As someone that wants to enjoy other games, and also has other hobbies, I’m unsure if I would ever stick with it.
No it seems like you can play it on your own pace cause there’s a lot of players so even. If you feel like falling behind you will be on par with the new players anyways
Game progress with time. After 1 month, there is still content that hasn't been unlocked and events and bosses that need to be unlocked. You can hit level 50 in like 2 days and hit max level blue weapon in 3 days. You will more often feel like there is nothing to do, rather then that there is not enough time to do anything. You don't really fall behind if you don't play.
With that attitude, I'd say MMO's aren't for you
@@nickh4354 Its not attitude but as well MMO's doesn't mean you have to spend 12h+ a day to achieve something. as people have lifes, jobs, kids, hobbies. Games must be created the way that everyone could enjoy, not only those who don't care about their life and just sit near computer all day.
Is this considered lineAge II successor?"
i played till lvl 50 and 1 week more i would say no its to early , there is no open world pvp , lvling is to easy
Is throne and liberty a lost ark clone?
Lineage 2 more like it
Gotta hope this doesn't turn into an Archeage 2 moment a year or two after release
Anything is possible
Global release date ???
unknown
a player that dont use female avatar, finally a normal gamer
always gigachad and bow
For the leveling and questing I was hoping it would encourage players to group up...I am tired of playing an online multiplayer game and end up soloing it through majority of the quests like everyone else. It just destroys the social aspect that makes MMORPGs great.
thats cause end game matters and leveling and questing is just something that gets you to end game.
@@FRESHY_GG yeah not a fan of that either. If endgame is where the game is at and I need to spend 30-40 hours to get there then they should just have dropped me in endgame to begin with.
@@Mish0Picka Have you ever played an MMORPG? No MMORPG will throw you straight in end-game. You learn the game and its system through questing and leveling, so by the time you reach end-game you're not a complete noob and clueless about 99% of the game.
@@FRESHY_GG yes I have played plenty of them. What I wanted to say I dont like the system where you are not encouraged to team up earlier and enjoy the game until endgame not just play for the endgame. And no what you say isnt true for games like Guild Wars 1 & 2, New World etc..
If its all about the endgame all you needed was a tutorial about endgame. The whole journey of getting to it should be equally enjoyable and fun. Modern games modern audience, all the same shit anyway.
@@Mish0Picka fair enough
I was very disappointed as this appears to be a good looking game, but surprise! It is not available in the US and looks like it won't be for a LONG time. Steam just says "coming soon" which is Steam speak for somewhere between "long a$$ time" and "the day before the end of the world".
What would be helpful is if you detailed for us the steps you took to be able to play this game. Did you have to use a Korean VPN?
You need KR phone number or account that was verified with KR phone number and VPN. There are guides on how to play KR TL
How can you play on Korean servers
Buy KR verified account and buy VPN
I can see a lot of Guild Wars 2 influence in the design here.
Main inspiration was Lineage 2 for TL