Is Having So Many Hapkido Systems Good For The Art?
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- Опубликовано: 8 сен 2024
- In this episode, Gio and guest Steven Reich discuss the breaking up of Hapkido into many different systems and organizations, and whether or not this is good for the art of Hapkido.
HAPKIDO FAMILY TREE:
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The very Korean name will play a big role i assume, since Taekwondo started or ended up like that.
The dictator Park Junghee had an issue with General Choi Honghee who used the name Taekwondo for the first time but anyway that dictator Park was the one who merged all Gongsoodo, Tangsoodo and Taesoodo guys (all differen Taekwondo styles and systems) into one World Taekwondo Federation style.
Since Hapkido already has so many variable throwing skills, if it studies and adds a bit of Ssireum 씨름 skills in its own way into its system then claims that it is from 씨름 Ssireum rather than AikiJujitsu system.
I think then the Korean government would support also Hapkido as a national martial art and in this way i believe that it can have a strong existence in martial art industry like Taekwondo.
Korean government only supports and gives benefits and credits to Taekwondo as a national martial art of Korea.
It is really sad since I believe Hapkido is way much better than Taekwondo in terms of system.
In upcoming 2018 July I am going to meet the president of Sinmoo Hapkido Federation in Seoul... (Not Jihanjae Dojunim)
I might talk about this idea to him...
I hope to see the big one union of Hapkido. no matter it would call in a different name in the future.
Greetings from a black belt under GM Song in Toronto, Canada. Great convo.
I started Hapkido in the late eighties. I trained there because it had judo type sweeps and throws, powerful kicks, joint locks and absolutely no forms. They actually called it Hapkido Karate back then because no one really knew what Hapkido was except for Billy Jack fans, yes, I have the hat too. I think the changes you see in Hapkido are exactly what Hapkido should be:
The pursuit of a highly effective self defense based martial art.
Different techniques that have proven to be more effective must be introduced. If Hapkido was the first MMA, just as more modern MMA, it must continue to evolve, as it did from its beginning, if it wants to remain relevant as a true self defense martial system. Boxing, and wrestling techniques must be borrowed in coordination with Hapkido’s devastating kicks, and focus more emphasis on the jujitsu/judo submission techniques and throws. After all, those techniques are already present in the system, perhaps just not emphasized in some systems. Hapkido has some very powerful techniques and concepts, but any true self defense art must evolve when certain techniques are proven to be superior. You can still retain the super flashy techniques that aren’t practical for self defense, for demonstration purposes to draw in more students and children into the schools, but the core of Hapkido should be to offer a powerful, coherent, legitimate, practical martial art of self defense for those that are truly interested in defending themselves and their loved ones. There are plenty of other traditional martial arts that hold on to antiquated techniques and forms that although they give students the ability to compete in a non-combatant environment, they do little to prepare their students for an actual altercation in a self defense event.
If Hapkido was the first MMA, and the art was designed to evolve over time, I would agree with you. The pursuit of being an effective martial artist would certainly dictate that you must evolve to meet the latest trends. But while some Hapkido schools might adjust to this to ensure that their students become more effective, That is their choice. I don't think it was mapped out in Hapkido to do so. Hapkido is certainly a very broad system, but it is still a system, and it has a finite number of techniques. I think it's great when Instructors improve on Hapkido by adding boxing and wrestling techniques etc. My Hapkido school was like that too. But to me, Hapkido is Hapkido, and Hapkido schools should focus on that first.
Excellent discussion
I feel the same way, but its all about the money. I tried Kuk Sool Won and they were telling me that their system didn't come from Hapkido and it was a better system. As I got further in ranking some of the techniques wasn't as affective as it was in hapkido. When I tried to explain, that's where my troubles began. My instructor thought I was there to challenge him. I respect him to the fullest, I feel if some isn't working try to keep an open mind to something that does work even if it came from a duck.😊
ceewright07 when GrandMaster Suh changed it from the circular motion to the more linier motion it's changed alot of the schools have not learned the original technical methods or the strength training, of the hands iron Palm for just and example, which make the circular strikes effective, in Kuk sool. I train with Chief Master Marlin Sims in Atlanta. And his techniques works
The circular motions came later with Hankido added to several masters of Hapkido. Kuk sool Won has hapkido origins and a bunch of other style added to it by the founder. We have a few episodes where we talk about these coming out soon.
Kuk Sool Won & Hapkido are related.. I've studied both and Tomiki Aikido
@@sirlawrence2125 Sims is the best master they ever turned out. At first I didn't understand why he left, but years later I get it. He said he left it to protect it.
@@jkdbuck7670 Hey Did he elaborate on protecting the system
Good video. I come from a Hapkido background. I was always told that Hapkido was the "ugly cousin" to Aikido. Are school was/ looked like a mix of Aikido, Judo, and Tang Soo Do. I currently train BJJ & Judo but still incorporate my Hapkido into the mix.
Interesting discussion, but there is only one Hapkido...from Choi Dojunim...the rest are not Hapkido...they can call it what they want...Choi Dojunim NEVER added anything from Korean native systems...
Ji did not use the name Hapkido until after Choi Dojunim and his students were already using the name Hapkido...
High kicking, forms, addition of weapons not part of the original curriculum is not Hapkido, and not part of Choi Dojunim's original principles and tenets...
Jungki Kwan Midwest I highly respect Dojunim Choi but your comment? Wow!
Jungki Kwan Midwest interesting!
Wow is right. Its hard to call something original if its not being tough by the original master. I believe hapkido is still being used as a respect for the art and the founders.
From what I was taught there were originallyl 13 kwans. That during Japanese rule over Korea they outlawed Korean Martial arts but Koreans studied in secret. After the Japanese rule, they brought all the Hapkido masters got together and all those that were similar styles merged into a kwan and after all the means we're filtered there were 13 kwans left standing (very condensed and simplified version of the history)
@@charlesreimer6649 that's taekwondo...there were never 13 kwans of hapkido. The art did not exist in Korea until 1948. The first major splits did not happen until the 1950s.
There are many high level students of Choi Dojunim in Daegu City that teach similar curriculum, and the if you speak Korean, it is the same...
Really? Hmmm. Who are they? I only know of Master Lim Hyun Soo (JungKi Kwan). Are there any others?
Jungki kwan Hapkido by Lim Hyun Soo in Daegu city in South Korea is to my knowledge the orthodox and unchanged Hapkido of Founder Choi Young Sul
....And yet, there are still so many other Hapkido systems out there with more recognition and followers.
Let me put it this way, In our society, we have many people, many restaurants, many customers, so what is the problem? The people? The restaurants? Or the intended customers?
IMHO as long as they sell a good food, nothing could be a problem that is exactly the same condition for Hapkido world. The Hapkido society absolutely don’t needs to follow no such organization, period.
The word Combat is is moot All Hapkido is made for combat.
Its just a way to attract a new generation, but it does combine more techniques than older traditional style teachers.
Since it is unlikely that we will ever get back to "one system:," I think the biggest thing the different systems need to establish is a agreement on what the bare minimum you should know and be able to do at each rank, each system can add onto it, but there should be at least uniformity on the minimums. this way if you are a 5th gup at one school and have to move to another for whatever reason, the instructor has an idea of your level of core competence and can work to get you up to speed instead of trying to take a best guess where you are at and possibly doing somehting insulting like making you go down several levels because you haven't learned some of the things the new school may require. .
Nevermind found the link on your Hapkido Origin video, thanks!
Where can one find that Org chart that you used in the video.
Hey David you can find it on line. I'll see if I can get Steve to place the link on the comments
I would love to see the hapkodo family tree. Do you know where I can find it? I saw it a week ago and can't find find now. And the link also doesn't work... Thanks
Yeah, the link stopped working years ago. I don't know where to find it now. Sorry man. But if you should ever find it, or something like it, please share it with us. Thanks!
Form what i know, choi called his system yawara, then, to "koreanize" it he started calling it Yoo kwon sool", that system had around 100 techniques, then kicking and striking was added creating hapkido
At a time, many masters tried to unite all hapkido systems but it failed, they started wearing orange doboks
Great vid! Very informative! How could I get my hands on that chart you showed at 3:48?
I found that chart online while digging up info on Hapkido. I put a link to it in the description, but it appears that it has recently been pulled down. Perhaps if you do your own digging, you might be able to find it somewhere else online. If you do dig around, please let me know if you find it!
@@LikeWaterProductions I definitely will let u know if I find anything, but I have done my own research. I cant find anything though. Any suggestions on Search ideas?
@@MrTruerythmn I found this Hapkido family tree by accident while looking up info on one of the Grandmasters, who just happened to also be on the tree.
@@LikeWaterProductions o wow. Great! Can u put the link in the description for me?
@@MrTruerythmn No no. I was referring to the original family tree I used on the show, and was simply offering a suggestion on how you might find it online, or another one just like it, if it exists. My apologies for the confusion!
I Song Moo Kwan HapKiDo SabomNim Ramon Navarro have been teaching this art since february 1977
umm... Good conversation.
As a Hapkido master and practitioner in Shanghai, China.
I do share the similar opinion with you two.
However I wish that they change the name of Hapkido into something sounds similar to 씨름 Ssireum.
Taekwondo came all the way from Gongsoodo [Karate-do in Korean reading system] then to Tangsoodo, then to Taesoodo, then to Taekwondo...
As far as i remember this is how the name has changed back in time after Korean war.
Since Hapkido has many throwing skills like Korean traditional martial sport[art] Ssireum, I wish somehow Hapkido to be called something similar to Ssireum-do like Taekwondo similar to Taekkyon.
I wish Japanese Aikido goes its own way and Korean Hapkido goes its own way as Taekwondo did.
I personally do not like Korean martial art to have a root from Japan.
Personal opinion...
Kitty Do i
I feel the high kicking hapkido is a tad kwon do variant. But to each his own....I study tactical hapkido which is a modern version with a,self defense focus only and conceptually driven....keeping the traditional concepts that are universal but also has trapping and modern weopons.....low kicks ki strikes, locks .it's fine for me as self defense is my only interest....not katas
Which variant and where Sir?
Hapkido's High kicking is not a taekwondo variant sir, Hapkido has his own kicking style, that is actually bigger that taekwondo's one. For example in hapkido we find kicks like jokdo cha miro nokki, taetaebo chagui, andari cha nokki, dwidora chagui (different form the tkd version) etc.
I hope this comment cleared your doubts and i excuse myslef in the case i made some english mistakes.
Thank you
As time passes on you will start finding hapkido just as a name with new approaches and techniques. Everything evolves, specially here in US because of MMA it has been a game changer.
The thing is that HapKiDo is thought so ones you domain the art you can make it your own or that would be, it would become your own style and that is like all the kids iun a family are boys and they would all use their last name no metter what and would not change it even if some of those kids develop lets say forms or Kata in japanese or its korean term is Hyung and want to make it different but once you see what they do is all HapKiDo with forms and some other ones that still call it HapKiDo but have forms these are watered and not pure HapKiDo. This is SabomNim Ramon Navarro 6th Dan in Song Moo Kwan HapKiDo from the country of Panama, this system belongs to KwanjangNim Park, SongIL 9th Dan founder of this system the Song Moo HapKiDo and there is a lot more to say like and about why is DojuNim Ji, HanJae 10th Dan and fathero of I would say in respect of modern HapKiDp and will add that the main style from almost all HapKiDo ariginal korean Masters from back in the early 1960 had all the bunch of kick that HapKiDo is known for and the original hapkido has a minimum of more than 150 kicks and around 3,000 thecniques and it was from the Sung Moo Kwan HapKiDo and he, Ji HanJae evolutioned latter and became Sin Moo HapKiDo
Yeah But There has to be One definitive System Chois System with adendems as Kicking Foot sweeps take downs But in studying Chois Original System some practioners leave out many of his techniques Why they feel there out dated but in doing so they fail to see the total understanding of his technique and lose its foundation I watched them and cynical of there adaptions which look fancy for appeal but not practicality
I agree that there should be 1 universal standard for Hapkido, but at this point, I fear that ship has sailed.
Choi had a small amount of material in his system that is why some of his top early students added.
That is correct. Nothing wrong with adding and taking away from an existing style. There is things that dont work with me, so I have thrown them away from my techniques I have learned. I like realistic techniques, some techniques just look good but won't work in a real situation.
Yes, he teached yu kwon sul, then, striking and kicking techniques were added creating HapKiDo
Not BS styles, there are only two main lineages, Choi and Ji...
Hapkido came from jujitsu. Hmmm
Hapkido has dungeon breathing, it doesnt have katas
Originally
Right. I believe some master just created katas from a mixture of tae kwon do for their curriculum.
You might as well ask humans to re-unite and standardize ALL christian churches/denominations.