You are great, but for the 1 hour podcast i think everybody would agree that a webcam would be preferrable. It is always nice to see a person you talk to (trust me I am leading the team of 50+ developers across the globe who also doesn't like to turn the cams on lol, but they are not on the podcast on the other hand...)
I unironically think entire PoE2 should be balanced around warrior as golden standard. Basic vanilla warrior mace build is the most balanced class that has exact gameplay that PoE2 was promised to have. Endgame enemies should be adjusted until warrior plays comfortably, then the rest of the classes should be balanced around that level.
"Warrior with a mace" is too broad of a term. I can just run and scream at enemies until they explode. What you really mean is extremely janky attacks that are hard to do because of delays, being pushed around and forced to attack in place. It's horrendous. The most basic "melee" attack in this game should be a cleave from poe1 that you could use while moving with some speed penalty and slams should be big hitting, big aoe bonks, also while moving, but maybe with a bigger penalty, and let the warrior have passives on the tree to reduce the penalty. In general, melee skills should be able to WASD move while attacking, and faster than ranged skills. Also, get rid of accuracy for melee or set it to "with 90% chance to hit, you deal 90% of the damage". There is no possible way to "balance" other skills around only mace skills. The best you can do is delete anything that isn't a mace skill. Like, what do you think is an actual valid solution? Give casters a chance to whiff spell casting, maybe triple base cast time? Limit the ranges to which projectiles fly and aoe spells can be cast? Maybe give bows and crossbows ammunition to force them to carry more? I would really like to know what your idea of minions would be, to make them as bad as mace skills. Probably deleting their default attacks and only having skills with cooldowns for each minion, eh?
I think so too, the warrior and even the merc plays as I expected the game to play when they frist talked about it. the only problem is the enemies didn't get the news and none of the enemies support that play style making both feeling horrible. Game needs to be slowed down considerably to fit they play style they wanted/talked about before release
Warrior is also stupidly OP, offensively speaking, but just has a bunch of very unfun game play mechanics that do not work with how the enemies are designed. The effectiveness of armor with the hp totals we get is one, of course. But beyond that, well, you use an ability like Sunder and you're stuck in place for a bit, while enemies hit you. It sucks and makes you not want to use that skill, but alas, the totem to put it on is a higher tier skill. And the mace tree has a bunch of issues like that, just horrible quality of life.
I would like it if towers were rarer, but had it so that you could climb floors and the number of tablets you can put in as well as the vision radius increased per floor. You could also make them Act themed boss rushes. Juicing your area would just be doing 1 tower, and climbing like 3-4 floors, and slamming your tablets.
Sandbagging or not, criticisms or not, I’m absolutely loving the game. I have over 100 hours into it as a dad with a family and a full time job. I have given GGG my original $30 plus an additional $30 to buy all the stash tabs I personally needed as well as expanding my guild stash (the uniques tab is HUGE for a guild of friends who are sharing everything they don’t need, absolutely worth the money). While I enjoy hearing everyone’s criticisms and can even agree with them, I haven’t enjoyed a game this much in a long time. I’m going to go broke when they start putting out MTX for guild hideout components. I’ve probably spent 10 hours refining my two guild hideouts.
Timestamps: 0:00 Huge PoE2 Patch Upcoming????! 0:48 PoE2 Nerf Predictions FIRST 11:50 PoE2 Change Predictions 26:38 MMOs Versus ARPGs and Learnings 44:50 New Patch Adding NEW CONTENT? 47:45 State of the Game and Elon Musk PoE2 Silliness :( 54:23 What PoE2 Can Learn From Last Epoch and Vice Versa 1:02:39 Lore of PoE2 1:03:33 Final Thoughts on PoE2 Right Now HUGE THANKS TO GAVRYN FOR HOPPING ON! The full stream continued my HCSSF if you're interested: ruclips.net/user/live1iGiQ8gkx6c?feature=share
To answer the question what Warrior feels like at endgame; you'll need to spec into Block to make up for armor, you'll need to accept that you won't be able to zoom because all monsters have on death effects which will trigger if you stampede or shield charge into them. Yes you will be able to completely and utterly destroy everything in your path but if you miss a single ranged mob either normal/magic/rare, they will be the death of you because of bad tuning on projectiles all doing max penetrate through armor with max accuracy. You can clear T15, T16 and chaos tower, but every map feels like a gamble as to whether you'll get the wrong type of mob, with the wrong type of modifier, with the wrong type of on death effect and projectiles.
I honestly never heard about the pierce through armour with max acc...but it would make so much sense to why white mobs still fuck me over if I dont 1 shot em....lets hope its bugged and not intended lol
Yeah warrior is very weird, I remember having a very hard time in act 3 when monsters were dealing a lot of damage, even just basic melee attacks from trash mobs were hurting a lot. I was speccing into armor and had around 65% damage reduction. Ithought it was not so bad and I didn't understand how it could be possible to feel so fragile. Iwas conviced other classes had it harder because they are supposed to be more fragile, right? Now I play ice strike monk in the campaign and I straight up don't care about defense. Most monsters are frozen in one or two hits, even bosses are frozen very quickly and I can remove 75% of their life when they remain frozen. This is absolutely nuts. Class imbalance is insane, when you only play warrior you don't realise how much imbalance there is 🤣
@noreluss i only play Warrior and I know it's completely unbalanced; everyone is specing into energy shield because armor and block are vastly inferior 😂
@@Basuko_Smoker I can't say this with 100% certainty, though it is very suspicious that with 71% armor and 59% block, max res + chaos I can literally tank any phys attack, even from bosses, though a single arrow from a crossbow does more damage 😂 get 10 archers/monsters flinging projectiles and I will have to use the flask multiple times to tank through or one shot them
One of the main reasons these strong, screen clear builds are popular in the first place is because of the sheer amount of BS in the game. Clearing an entire screen before random, non-telegraphed, one shots have a chance to kill your character is a necessity at the moment for melee players. Especially, when death means you lose the Tablet effects, lose the loot that dropped, lose the endgame mechanics, lose the juiced Waystone, lose XP, and lose all your portals. The Invoker Monk doesn't need to be touched. The build isn't overperforming, it's just the only melee class that actually feels fun to play. There are no broken interactions or any bugs being exploited. At worst, take away the ability to stack 5 bells at once but leave everything else alone.
The Tower issue should be solved like this: Make 80-90% normal Towers: just slot in the tablet no need to run it. 10-20% of Towers are big Towers with Rare Modifiers and always containing a Boss. Also the Big towers boost the Tablets.
After leveling two characters with Maces, I started to play Witch and Ranger, and it baffles me that Supercharged Slam got nerfed on day one for the reason of "We don't want an ability to be so strong it feels mandatory to use" when Lightning Arrow and Skeleton Reavers are so insanely overpowered that it feels like a self imposed nerf to not use them the moment you get them until you get a very specific and refined build. I hope the Infernalist Demon Form bug I found get fixed at least. After respec'ing out of Demon Form, I can no longer use Solar Orb. Used it to Font of Rage my Reavers and Flame Blast as a spell from myself. I'm also hoping that they remove the stupid armour mechanic that makes your armour worse the more damage you take, it never worked in PoE1, not sure why anyone thought it would work in PoE2. Getting hit for 100 and having 80% DR and getting hit for 1000 and having 40% DR just shouldn't be a thing, it's so backwards. Maces also are in a horrid place for usability. They feel good to use but just aren't good. They just need to tune them to what quarterstaves are. quarterstaves seem like they're probably 90% of Melee by now. So either Maces are where they want Melee to be, or quarterstaves are where they want melee to be. So either quarterstaves will get nerfed through the floor or Maces will get buffed by insane amounts. I also feel like the campaign felt so good to go through, but when I compare it to endgame is, it feels so backwards. For maps to match what the campaign felt like, they need to double or triple the HP but reduce the damage of enemies to 1/2 or 1/3 of the damage. The threat should be enemies as a group like the campaign, rather than white-blue-yellow mobs just one shotting people. They did say the goal was to have only bosses being potential one-shot threats, but it's been the opposite to me. On-death effects are super awful too, like you both mentioned. Especially when the visibility can be so low on them. Beyond that, I'm hoping we get Swords. I want more melee skills.
I feel like the only thing that could make mace skills better while retaining the slow chunky damage theme, would be to incorporate some defensive layer into the skills. I don't want two handed maces to be fast like a quarters staff, and increasing the damage isn't really an option when bosses already melt. So, the defensive component could be the primary differentiator. They could add a % reduced damage taken buff during slam and charge up animations. Also, leap, stampede, and shield charge could use some polishing. The leap travel time needs to be faster than actual running. Why can't I leap over enemies? It feels half the time I click somewhere I end up 5 meters short of my destination because some white mob blocked the path.
@fadingdimension The biggest problem I found with Mace skills wasn't necessarily the time spent using them, but that you were completely exposed during. I died during the +1.4 Total Attack Time windup of Sunder a handful of times because enemies could just rapid dash up to me and use one attack and kill me, while I had over 70%DR. It needs another defensive layer to help mitigate that, and/or they need to make it so Armour DR isn't dependent on the size of the hit you're taking. Maces feel the way they should, but they shouldn't be punished for their designed playstyle. In contrast, I actually like the design of Leap Slam now. I don't think it should be a travel again. That really broke it's purpose in PoE1. I loved using it as a stun buildup tool. I had it equipped with more stun buildup support and more AoE, and with it consuming Armour break, I could use it to majorly stun enemies. I think with the higher mana costs as well, it forces people to use it for effect than for travel. I do think being in the air should give you s for ground effects though. Edit: Also, I leap over enemies all the time? Not sure why you couldn't.
Make towers a wave based system. The further u go, the more precursors you can put in. Have a boss at the very end to maximize tower range and precursors
I feel the nerfs will kill the fun. I understand bringing things in line, but destroying fun just to forcing the speed of the game down is a huge no bueno.
On death effects are interesting when you're fighting multiple mobs. You kill one, it explodes, now that area is denied and you have to fight the remaining dude in the smaller area you have. That's neat. Waiting for explosions after death to loot is dumb though. Towers: activating a tower points towards the nearest citadel.
I like the guys that get bloated with red and explode. It's very visible. On-death effects are, in general, okay, as long as players can see those first before any other graphical crap.
The least they could do is make the on-death effect lethal for everything in its area rather than just the player to make it useful like the Diablo 3 eel hag things which you could kite in to a pack and explode.
Oh yeah, it's so neat as melee to have to run around mobs for 90% of the time and barely find a (dangerous)chance to attack once or twice. It's so neat to have 90% of the screen be unable to step on, while being chased by volatiles, mirages, storms, crap spawning on you. While you have to somehow stop in place, if you want to attack. (yes, with ranged, it hardly matters)
No they are not , go through the list of uniques and you will see that atleast 50 of them are used in Meta builds at this moment out of 273. Then you probably have another 50 thats used for low level twinks and levling. They have to be very careful with uniques though
I agree, I find loot relatively disappointing and I indeed miss the dopamine of finding a good unique, or one without downsides that are bigger than their upsides :D
What a pleasant discussion. Both dudes feel just super nice. I listen to podcasts while working and this one is now my favorite. Good vibes and positive feels is what the world needs more. Thank you Tri and Gavryn!
@@Ugoofy1 well, you literally have every single other popular Podcast nowadays for that...i guess....Idk i like this vibe where they actually talk without bs, yet respectfully
My takes on some balance changes coming from a player with 3 lvl 90+ and 3 level 85+. stormweaver arcane tempo node and archemage can keep their same dmg numbers but need to double the requirement per breakpoint. For example lets say currently archemage gives you 8% more dmg per 100 mana change it to 8% dmg per 200 mana this is a 50% nerf( this is honestly not a big deal but would still be good without scaling out of control) next is stormweaver acane tempo being permanently up. No other ascendancy gives you this kind of dmg and sustain with no downsides. Bloodmage first ascendancy is basically we are going to make all of your spells cost health and allow you to get life remnants. Early this is a huge crutch that you either ignore ascending or just wait till the 2nd ascendancy to worry about it.(personally i think they need to just combine this node with the spell leech and the perhaps change the spell leech node to increase effect/add mana leech to spells/ make a portion of leech instant.) monk invoker is well designed and half of chylula monk is too. The darkness nodes that remove spirt should instead convert spirit into more darkness. This 1 change would make a huge difference to those nodes as currently at lvl 100 you can only have 700 darkness. Ranger is in a great spot and doesnt really need any adjustments. Witch i already touched up on bloodmage. Infernalist is 1000% stronger early scales insanely well and the fact that demon form is easy to maintain even through the campaign without capping it just makes sense why there is a much larger player base playing it. The only thing about it is that the nodes that reserves health for stacks feels like it should belong to bloodmage. But other then that great place. Mercenary both are great with gemling probably edging out the other juat due to its ascendancy just working with everything with no drawbacks. Warrior needs help. instrad of more armor from chest piece being on ascendancy it should be increase armor applies to elemental damage as well.(even if it is at a reduced amount) there is a node about 7 points out from start that already gives increase effect of chest piece. Aftershock chance needs buffed. Warbringer seems to be in a decent spot to be honest havent played or looked too much into this ascendancy but seen some videos of the singer barb(i know this isnt d2 but basically what ascendancy is) For skill changes besides archemage. The heralds need a charge system. Basically let generate a charge every 0.25 seconds having up to 10-15 charges. This way they can still chain just not until everything is dead on the map in 1 swing. Banners having no affect while kn back is dumb. They should grant a small bonus to you while on your back and an empowered bonus when placed. Bell is currently bugged and allows to have more out than you should as it is a limit skill so i think once bug is fixed it will not be as overpowered. While on the topic of skills i think some skills need to be adjusted to when they are available to pickup. For example frostbolt being a aquired from lvl 3+ skill gem but your get frost bomb at level 1 makes no sense. Same with flame wall and fireball. GGG basically pigenon holes sorcs to spark but not allowing the basic skills for each element not be aquired from start. Instead you get spark and flame wall and never look back because the combo is amazing at all points of the game. For towers i want them to have a boss at the end and after beating the tower you can "scout" the next citidel. After completing 3 towers the location of the citdel appears on map. In fact take this a step further and make each of the citdels have their own unique towers(like corrupted towers) and make corrupted towers give progrss to discovering a citdel of choice. Need more essence and strongbox nodes on atlas. As currently not worth the points as not enough synergies on atlas.
For 57:25 Items being sniped by Bots just don't let anyone buy items that they can not equip. Simple Solution and the higher the mods on the item the more gold it costs. It automatically lets a noob know this might be valuable in some way idk.
Id happy just to get a skill point after doing 100’s of maps. Or better gear. Something to feel like im progressing. At this point it feels like the game is bugged on console with the complete lack of anything
A lot of stuff will probably get nerfed. POE 2 is supposed to be tactical slow paced arpg. And after a few weeks of player tinkering poe 2 reverted back to poe 1 speed gameplay.
2:10 Yay, now that all the no lifers got rich off of these builds the rest of us can get nerfed back down and have to wait till reset to get a fighting chance in the economy again.
Being completely honest, class balance is FAR from the biggest issue with the game right now. What is even the point in having a variety of builds if the base endgame is so tedious and unfun. That is where all focus should be from GGG IMO
I agree that class balance is not the biggest issue, but it can be improved relatively easily with some number tweaks (improved, not fixed). It will also be healthy for the early access that people play different classes, instead of most players playing the same one.
I agree that the fight is more important than dealing with the effects after a mob is defeated. The only on death effects that feel good to the player are beneficial to them. My go to example of a good on death effect is mob duplication, ie splitting into more mobs on death, or the other modifiers on this minion besides this mod get duplicated on a nearby mob.
There are so many big things that need to be addressed, I honestly have no idea what they will be focusing on as top priorities at this time. The big ones of course are optimiziation issues with servers, console performance problems, constant crashes; these are probably the first issues that need to be dealt with because it makes the game unplayable for a lot of people who paid to be able to play. Then for gameplay, basically warrior class as a whole, minions AI, death penalties being unbalanced (especially given current performance issues for many people), majority of maps being boring/tedious, too much RNG involved everywhere within game mechanics, POE tradesite update, many QOL measures from POE 1 being removed from POE2. These are just some of the things I see mentioned over and over again that I agree with. On top of all this, they still need to finish the rest of the acts and characters and create a new endgame to replace the current one for full access since the one right now is a placeholder apparently? I don't know if they will be able to fit all that in 1 year. I will see what things are coming in the next few patches to see how this will play out, but if all that the patches do is just nerfing a bunch of builds and not addressing the actual problems, we are in for a rough and long journey to full release.
I appreciate the weight the single death system brings, because it makes things feel more hardcore and less free. But on the flip side, part of why hard boss fights are fun is getting beat down, learning from mistakes, and going again. So while I don't want to go back to 6 tries per map, I wouldn't mind a system that gives you one last chance after you die. Close all but the last portal, and give people one last shot at redemption. Other than that, I'll just say I definitely enjoyed the slower and more deliberate pacing of the early acts than the more zoomy endgame. I'm hoping they find a way to reign things in, because as it stands now, it barely feels like a new game after a point.
This is my take aswel. Xp loss on death is annoying but needed, otherwise you could just brute force your way to 100 without any real skill. High levels mean something. Every time I get a level now its like the best thing ever and super satisfying. I don't like loosing a map/boss on death though. Just let us use our 6 portals up and then we loose the map. A lot of people are just paying others to run a pinnacle boss for them because the risk is too great. Loosing a breach stone after grinding hours and hours or running the sekhemas trial for an hour to get your final ascendancy just to get a "you loose" screen pop up just sucks really. Something needs changing when you'd rather just pay someone to do it for you as apposed to having your time wasted. So that defeats the whole point of earning this end game content and engaging with it properly.
My take - infinite one portal, but every death lowers rarity and quantity of items by at least 25%. And make acquiring atlas points for other mechanics than maps require deathless bosses. This way we can learn mechanics and be rewarded only for gitting gud.
One portal map is probably good. But need to adjust some things. Like losing the extra content on the map doesn't seem good. Losing the loot and exp. is already punishment enough, probably. Because when you lose the extra content, the empty map becomes a chore you have to do just to get to the better maps. It makes it boring and annoying to play, which is not good.
RE: death. Give 3 portals. First death gives "shame" debuff. -33% item rarity for remainder of map. Second death ups it to -66%. 3rd death you're done.
it is not only the resourses the BM uses that are crazy, the mana cost in general is soooooooo out of proportion that it is insane. This is the reason you only see viable spell builds with Archmage
One thing that might not be thought about is I don’t think you can even check a rares modifiers on console and those random on death visuals can eat your frames
some of those effects are delayed by 3-5seconds after death too, with no visual queues. drives me insane when i roll away from a mob in case it explodes on death or something and i roll into an area i killed something a few seconds ago and some effect pops and 1 shots me.
The fact that you can unspec all boss difficulty in the atlas passive tree and stack waystone drop chance in order to make citadelles bosses easy and drop 3 crisis fragments seems kinda unbalanced
Speaking of on-death effects, why not just make them non damaging ones? Like drop some frozen on mud terrain on the ground that slows you down, or lowers your damage/defenses or something? Pretty decent middle ground that GGG could agree on maybe.
Or at least make them visible and working properly. Died in trial of chaos because, for some reason, my character was able to push and drag volatile cores of monsters when they were priming to explode. As in, I walk through the volatile, it starts to explode, and my character moves it while walking. Why is that a thing, volatile plants don't do that.
Having DarthMicro instead of Talkative on the Tavern Talk podcast is such a stupid move. This guy loves PoE/PoE2. And Darth is just a guy who goes where the hype is.
Lol have u watched just a single stream of him? Hes actually very critic about a lot of things, just yesterday he spend couple of hours collecting the further critics of the community and wording them right for the interview tomorrow. Cool down. :)
I'm currently running MoltenBlast on a deadeye, dual-wielding the unique mace, Olrovasara, and it's been awesome! The main interaction is to use FrostWall to build up the lightning damage from the maces. With Deadeye you can get enough atk speed that it makes it feel really good :D
I love my warrior, I feel like im playing a souls game. I never played with my magic or op stuffs in those games, and I'm doing the same with this game, I love a good challenge
Quarterstaff with Herald of Ice and Thunder is the most fun I have had playing the game. It works, it taught me a lot about the games core mechanics. And it falls apart when bossing so it has its cons. Hope they don't go nuclear with them and somehow keep the feel when they proc.
@@radio671 Just remember you are playing an early access version of the game. Balancing will happen a lot most of the time this will include nerfing your favourite build. Stormweaver, Invoker and deadeye make up like 75% of the player base so its obvious these builds are getting nerfed. I play Sparkweaver and I just know my build is about to get gutted, comes with the territory. Ice monk is probably the second most op build in the game so you can bet its going to be tuned down bit. Another thing to keep in mind is that when the game fully releases and even maybe before that (Early access leagues) our current characters will be locked behind EA and basically have to start fresh anyway.
@@radio671 you can have that type of fun in PoE1. PoE2 has a different vision and that isn't blowing up the map and zooming around. It is the reason why PoE2 is not meant to replace PoE1. It is meant for people with different preference in ARPG genre to play their preferred vision of the game similar to WoW Retail and WoW Classic or Oldschool Runescape and Runescape.
I suspect you're underselling the changes. 0.1.0g/h/i/j/etc can account for all balance changes to classes and adjustments to endgame systems. That we're getting 0.1.1 suggests content. My bet is on either 3rd ascendancy for existing classes, or one-or-more new classes. Keep in mind that they _floated_ a 6 (to 12) month early access. If 6 months was ever going to be a realistic possibility, they'd have to push a new class every month.
@@brian5948 ^_^ they _might_ have a full reveal and complete community podcast with both Jonathan and Mark _just_ to talk about balance and how their Christmas was.
"If 6 months was ever going to be a realistic possibility, they'd have to push a new class every month." - Not necessarily, they can release them in chunks of multiple classes at once. And why take 6 months instead of 12? It's just an estimate, which can be very wrong. 6 months is obviously the most optimistic estimate possible. They might have a new class, it would be a little surprising though. Especially since they took a long break. Still, some things were ALLEGEDLY close to being ready for beta release but didn't quite make it.
As there is no strength/intellect based playable options as of right now, we really need to fill that spot with either Druid or Templar with it as a priority. It would open up build variety for Warrior, Witch, Sorceress options too. Ofc Warrior has a desperate needs of it mostly, aside from the known problems it has right now.
everyones talking nerf this and nerf that when i actually feel like the current top builds being invoker/deadeye/stormweaver are an actual benchmark for how a build should operate as opposed to making then trash like other class choices
Counterpoint: Those builds already have a place in PoE 1. Why even make a separate game with the promise of a slower and more meaningful combat if endgame builds become the same zoom-zoom screen clearing and skipping boss mechanics by one-shotting them? They've shown that a slow and methodical ARPG can work with the campaign. IMO I would like to see the endgame brought closer to that state.
@@LazyPandaBum I agree. I've had significantly more fun in the early campaign (acts 1-3) than I did later in the game. Once it got to the point where things started zooming, it lost that interesting arpg/souls hybrid feel, and just reverted to PoE 1. I would even go so far as to say I had more fun clearing ToS on warrior than I did blasting through content on monk or sorc. Personally, I enjoyed the first 3 acts of PoE2 more than any other arpg experience I've had to date.
@@LazyPandaBum its quite evident when start doing activities like simulacrum you need to be putting out ALOT of damage to succeed. having done all the content in the game as of this moment its 100% a matter of most classes being weak as opposed to the aforementioned classes being overpowered. my spark says around 150k on the tooltip and simulacrum is still a tough encounter. you honestly just sound like that typical reddit guy who got to maps, struggled to progress/sustain and starts coping in any way they can
@@TheDeadlockArchives I am in that scenario too with spark at 150k+ and unable to complete simulacrum. But I don't think that's a build/character issue but the mechanism itself. The mobs spawning that is invul for that first second and pushing you to the ends of the map and simultaneously cornering you amongst other mobs and fatal projectiles, it's a bit much. The game itself requires a rebalance, not the builds. The current 'meta' isn't exactly what GGG had in store or rather what they announced POE2 is supposed to be, but it's a good measure to what the state of the game is at the moment. It's a waiting moment for what GGG plans to do going forward.
I very much disagree with the trade arguement. I think the way PoE handles trade is extremely fundamental to how the economy stays vaguely functional as more and better item keep entering the game and it gives that social inconvenience that helps players bond socially in what is otherwise more of a single player game. I love it in the currency exchange as that doesn't impact the loot progression, but if they ever implement an auction house for rares and even uniques I fear the game might move past me. On an unrelated note; this is where GGG decides if they take everybody down to a nerfed version of what warrior is now but with functional armour and adjust mobs to where that feels good, or if they try to readjust everything towards where Poison Concoction is basically at with decent clear and bossing dps but without the instakilling that the herald chain or spark do.
Howa nerfed Archmage nerfed, None of these streamers are original...They literally follow whatever the strongest builds are..."Bloodmage"...He's really off the meta....You cant say in one breath "Youre a hipster for builds" and then talk about the tech you saw for playing your next build...I love how everyone says "Monk was my first build" Like they didn't employ the broken tech as soon as it was found....My first build was a sorc and I was using Cast on freeze Comet...Big brain right...GG How bout you buff some shit?!
my two biggest things - remove on death effects - and change maps layouts to have like 90% less deadends/or - give indicators where to go from the beggining of the map
I think monk is fine, but herald of ice with pork rind is kinda busted and bell is bugged because it clearly isn't intended you being able to drop multiple. The herald loop takes a decent chunk of investment in dual damage typing and 60 spirit.
Extend the range of the precursor in each tower and make them harder to obtain. For example towers are fewer and further between with a Unique boss and layout in each tower. Simple
On the topic of towers, my biggest issue with them so far (at level 84) is how rough the map layout feels - the walls hiding the enemies inside each room until the last second (often too late) Also, there are too many. Maybe it would be cooler if they were rarer but gave a much bigger vision range?
I don't know if the speed at the end game is that much of a concern honestly. +0 Simulacrum is VERY difficult even for builds that can do other pinnacle bosses, and it requires really good clear to stay alive. The fact they put it in that way it is suggests that the end game is supposed to be faster-paced. It's not like the mechanic is new, Delirium has been play-tested in PoE1 for years at this point; they knew what they were doing.
you know, the thing i know for sure is.. ACT 6 or 5 boss is ATZIRI. If she's in act 5, then beast is in 6. If she's in 6 then it's probably some form of 'beast enters into atziri, morphs her and woohooo'
Looking at armor damage mitigation chart, simply increasing the amount prevented by 2 classes (1000 armor mitigates 16% damage from 1000 damage hit to 50% damage) is a step for right direction. I also prefer boosting less viable layers to same viability as ES, Mind Over Matter. If life bonuses of str were to be increased, then it forces every life build into str stacking, so there needs to have life synergestic nodes on tree. Maybe more life regen, life on block or life recouped based on damage mitigated?
During the exact moment you said "on death effect" I just died to cold on death effect after shattering a rare and istantly dodge rolling after the kill from one effect to the other which I totally did not see.... lvl 93, ice strike monk 50% in on the bar
GGG could change both the towers mechanics and the 1-portal system at the same time, making that each tower influence on a map gives you +1 portal to use if you die
58:52 I don’t personally believe that fear of economic problems should stop ggg from moving forward. Economy is already in shambles. Idk how they could make it worse.
Great Podcast again, it’s getting better and better, keep it up A lot of Human enemies use Playerskills, so in regards to Daggers, Claws, Swords we’ve have already some impression of what they will be able todo can‘t wait to Ninja
I think if they left towers how they are, but made tablets refresh maps within their radius that'd be great. It's a bummer to exhaust maps in a section that has a lot of layouts you like.
The fake news on armour being bad is out of hand. It's supposed to protect you from lots of little hits, not 1 shots. and it does that pretty good. it is BROKEN like ES? No. People keep referencing kripp's video on armour, but they didn't look at his second video where he said he was wrong? :/
The only thing i wanna they to address are those Rare with 7 affixes in a cocaine trip running at 200 KM/H at you, and you cant do anything about it because the Rare is untangeable or whatever is call when you cant hit them far from you.
It's proximal tangibility. And that combined with mana drain is just wild stuff. I keep my basic skill on my bar solely for when I run into a mana drain. Because they almost always are fast af and there's no escaping the drain.
i dont think there is anything wrong with es. es has no recovery in poe2. no leech, no on kill and you have to invest much more skillpoints into it then in poe1. a buff to armor would not be bad, yes.
@@RoeDeerMusic I think the main problem is the imbalance between ES/AR/EV, the mechanics need a bit of tweaking. Comparing it to poe1 is not really a way to go about it
@@Chris3s comparing es to armor and evasion is kinda wrong cause u cant. you can only compare es to health cause thats the same function, a buffer or better the choice of your buffer. if we talk about armor/evasion/block we talk about your choice of reducing damage. comparing es with evasion is like.... comparing dmg to magic find.
One more thing to mention monsters in on going telegraph animation should not teleport with ghost walker mod, Imagine some big rare preparing big slam you know you have to dodge and you surely stand miles away from that monster and you think you are safe, guess what that rare can just teleport on you directly miliseconds away from executing the slam and kill you in a blink with no way to avoid
It would be so interesting if towers instead of taking a waystone instead required you to put the tablet in to start the area. Breach would cause you to do a massive timed breach similar to the boss area and reward you with the tablet effect plus breach stuff at the end Expedition could start with a detonation charge at the beginning and make you follow along and kill the mobs along the way (Don't really know how to make this interesting without making it too hard) Ritual could literally be a massive ritual area with ritual affects going on and you get rewarded favour as well as the tablet effect at the end Delirium could be a race against the fog to the end of a linear map and maybe you need to kill enough mobs to get the reward, so players don't just book it to the end Regular tablets could just be the regular tower map I guess...
you mentioned mechanics for towers - I could get behind this idea. Like a crafting mechanics to help with some deterministic crafting. Like a harvest bench type affair. That is available when you click the end of tower. I could see a nice link with betrayal mechanics. Like a mini game within the map system.
towers are fine, it's not meant to be meanigful or rewarding, it's doing exactly what GGG want it to do. So sick of you retards trying to create the game, let the people we know can make good games do the thinking you smooth brained fuck
Mapping will be very limited with 1 Dead attempt, either fixing the drop to match the risk or bring back 6 Portals or tweak it around every Mod = 1 more extra attempt while Citadel or Boss map will automatically let you go with 6 portals attempts. And I agree, Quater staff as a whole don't need a nerf but adjust is require. PS : The Inquisitor look really cute on your thumbnail lol
Also making maps extremely stressfull. Even if you manage to beat it, the stress of losing the map should you die makes it extremely unfun, atleast for me
Make one portal that can be used infinitely, but also make the death penalty be a stacking map rarity and quantity decrease. Make it like 25%, so after 4 deaths you get pretty much nothing, but you could learn boss fights or complete a map to go further. And obviously prevent getting atlas points or achievements when you die in that location. Just let us practice.
There's technically less on screen than in PoE1, but the visibility feels so much worse, especially with Delirium or Strongboxes. The maps have a lot of visual noise already, then you add different flavors of fog and hide circles underneath it all, it's maddening. It's like they forgot what game they were designing when they started making the endgame mechanics.
After reaching endgame I had to reroll a new character because my mercenary using crossbows feels really bad and gets me killed because of a reloading bug that prevents me from attacking for up to 10 seconds at times. I was losing a lot of currency on my maps because I'd die while my character couldn't do anything.
If you have a bow on secondary and use auto-swap for the ice bow skill that jumps back, it blocks your crossbow and forces slow movement until you dodgeroll. Other than that I noticed some delay in reload that's tied to FPS. Sometimes adds like 1-2 seconds extra to reload. In general crossbows are strong, but have no available builds for phys damage. I tried playing with armour break + high velocity rounds that apply bleed, but it's awful and aggreviated bleed doesn't even work. I added poison and just that doubled the dot damage... But also, on a different character I apply much stronger dot with just corrupting cry...
@Kuzka_ no, I'm talking about if you dodge roll while reloading or get stunned while reloading, it stops the reload animation and takes anywhere from 5-10 seconds for the game to realize it needs to reload. Clicking reload manually doesn't work, but the skill gem emergency reload fixes it.
Evasion needs a higher level penalty, Bell needs a cooldown and a damage nerf(perhaps an ICD on the proc), with the new gem system you're able to stack so many support gems ontop of eachother there is no way thats ever going to be balanced without hurting the inidividual abilities
I feel like the fundamental problem is that PoE 2 endgame doesn't feel like PoE 2, it feels like PoE 1 and the classes that could be dropped into that game without issue (Monk / Archmage Sorc) are doing well.
'they really succeeded with quarterstaff'? I'm sorry? There are like 5 skills everyone is using on quarterstaff while the rest are very bad: very conditional, bad AoE, bad damage, unnecessary movement, fixed animation time, and etc. They did not succeed at all.
you kill enemies so fast that they don't get a chance to attack you so the only thing they can do is run at you at maximum speed then have a death effect trigger otherwise nothing will hit you :P
Personally, I don't think Archmage should receive much of a nerf. Maybe a little, but what's really needed is better alternatives to Archmage. Why don't we have a Spirit Skill that scales Ignite or various elemental Magnitudes? I would love a Spirit skill that scales Ignite magnitude based on total mana, as an example.
With Archmage, the scaling isn't even when the problem begins. For me, when starting mapping, in a non-MoM build, just a measily 1200 mana, it was providing 96% extra lighting damage, or, if my build has no extra damage from anywhere, that doubles my damage. Meanwhile, the alternative, provides less than 60% more damage (and keep in mind your main damage dealing ability will very likely have some more damage support gems)... for one element... picked at random. As to how to nerf it, the very first place to start is with quality. 20% = 2% more per 100 damage. This means, when you first get it, that quality is probably a 50% increase in the ability's effectiveness, and that'll drop to like a 33% increase later. It defies belief that anyone thought this aspect, let alone the rest of archmage, is remotely balanced. And then you'd have to nerf the base % bonus per 100 mana as well. The scaling just takes an ability that is already stupidly overpowered before it and turns it up past 11, to something like 9001.
Thanks so much for having me Tri, this was a blast and big congrats on 50k!!🍻
Use the video
You're a good dude
you should really consider doing video podcasts instead of just audio. It makes the conversation much more natural :)
But great talk otherwise, thanks
You are great, but for the 1 hour podcast i think everybody would agree that a webcam would be preferrable. It is always nice to see a person you talk to (trust me I am leading the team of 50+ developers across the globe who also doesn't like to turn the cams on lol, but they are not on the podcast on the other hand...)
@@wtfpwnt2Umm who actually watches a podcast like a tv show? Lol they are for putting on in the background.
I unironically think entire PoE2 should be balanced around warrior as golden standard. Basic vanilla warrior mace build is the most balanced class that has exact gameplay that PoE2 was promised to have. Endgame enemies should be adjusted until warrior plays comfortably, then the rest of the classes should be balanced around that level.
Even warrior has many one button kill everything builds, heck there is even a 0 button kill everything build, you literally just run around.
Preach brother these are exactly my feelings
"Warrior with a mace" is too broad of a term. I can just run and scream at enemies until they explode. What you really mean is extremely janky attacks that are hard to do because of delays, being pushed around and forced to attack in place. It's horrendous. The most basic "melee" attack in this game should be a cleave from poe1 that you could use while moving with some speed penalty and slams should be big hitting, big aoe bonks, also while moving, but maybe with a bigger penalty, and let the warrior have passives on the tree to reduce the penalty. In general, melee skills should be able to WASD move while attacking, and faster than ranged skills. Also, get rid of accuracy for melee or set it to "with 90% chance to hit, you deal 90% of the damage".
There is no possible way to "balance" other skills around only mace skills. The best you can do is delete anything that isn't a mace skill. Like, what do you think is an actual valid solution? Give casters a chance to whiff spell casting, maybe triple base cast time? Limit the ranges to which projectiles fly and aoe spells can be cast? Maybe give bows and crossbows ammunition to force them to carry more?
I would really like to know what your idea of minions would be, to make them as bad as mace skills. Probably deleting their default attacks and only having skills with cooldowns for each minion, eh?
I think so too, the warrior and even the merc plays as I expected the game to play when they frist talked about it. the only problem is the enemies didn't get the news and none of the enemies support that play style making both feeling horrible. Game needs to be slowed down considerably to fit they play style they wanted/talked about before release
Warrior is also stupidly OP, offensively speaking, but just has a bunch of very unfun game play mechanics that do not work with how the enemies are designed. The effectiveness of armor with the hp totals we get is one, of course. But beyond that, well, you use an ability like Sunder and you're stuck in place for a bit, while enemies hit you. It sucks and makes you not want to use that skill, but alas, the totem to put it on is a higher tier skill. And the mace tree has a bunch of issues like that, just horrible quality of life.
I would like it if towers were rarer, but had it so that you could climb floors and the number of tablets you can put in as well as the vision radius increased per floor. You could also make them Act themed boss rushes. Juicing your area would just be doing 1 tower, and climbing like 3-4 floors, and slamming your tablets.
What a great idea
endgame atlas is bad, theres no way around it
Cool idea definitely 👍 I’m all for it
Love this idea!
you wouldn't want to lose towers badly and get someone to clear it for you.
Sandbagging or not, criticisms or not, I’m absolutely loving the game. I have over 100 hours into it as a dad with a family and a full time job. I have given GGG my original $30 plus an additional $30 to buy all the stash tabs I personally needed as well as expanding my guild stash (the uniques tab is HUGE for a guild of friends who are sharing everything they don’t need, absolutely worth the money). While I enjoy hearing everyone’s criticisms and can even agree with them, I haven’t enjoyed a game this much in a long time. I’m going to go broke when they start putting out MTX for guild hideout components. I’ve probably spent 10 hours refining my two guild hideouts.
Timestamps:
0:00 Huge PoE2 Patch Upcoming????!
0:48 PoE2 Nerf Predictions FIRST
11:50 PoE2 Change Predictions
26:38 MMOs Versus ARPGs and Learnings
44:50 New Patch Adding NEW CONTENT?
47:45 State of the Game and Elon Musk PoE2 Silliness :(
54:23 What PoE2 Can Learn From Last Epoch and Vice Versa
1:02:39 Lore of PoE2
1:03:33 Final Thoughts on PoE2 Right Now
HUGE THANKS TO GAVRYN FOR HOPPING ON! The full stream continued my HCSSF if you're interested: ruclips.net/user/live1iGiQ8gkx6c?feature=share
You quickly became my favorite poe content creator and I look forward to every new talk.
Neversink interview maybe?
The end game is fundamentally broken....but the combat is fundamentally amazing.
To answer the question what Warrior feels like at endgame; you'll need to spec into Block to make up for armor, you'll need to accept that you won't be able to zoom because all monsters have on death effects which will trigger if you stampede or shield charge into them. Yes you will be able to completely and utterly destroy everything in your path but if you miss a single ranged mob either normal/magic/rare, they will be the death of you because of bad tuning on projectiles all doing max penetrate through armor with max accuracy. You can clear T15, T16 and chaos tower, but every map feels like a gamble as to whether you'll get the wrong type of mob, with the wrong type of modifier, with the wrong type of on death effect and projectiles.
I honestly never heard about the pierce through armour with max acc...but it would make so much sense to why white mobs still fuck me over if I dont 1 shot em....lets hope its bugged and not intended lol
Yeah warrior is very weird, I remember having a very hard time in act 3 when monsters were dealing a lot of damage, even just basic melee attacks from trash mobs were hurting a lot. I was speccing into armor and had around 65% damage reduction. Ithought it was not so bad and I didn't understand how it could be possible to feel so fragile. Iwas conviced other classes had it harder because they are supposed to be more fragile, right?
Now I play ice strike monk in the campaign and I straight up don't care about defense. Most monsters are frozen in one or two hits, even bosses are frozen very quickly and I can remove 75% of their life when they remain frozen. This is absolutely nuts.
Class imbalance is insane, when you only play warrior you don't realise how much imbalance there is 🤣
@noreluss i only play Warrior and I know it's completely unbalanced; everyone is specing into energy shield because armor and block are vastly inferior 😂
@@Basuko_Smoker I can't say this with 100% certainty, though it is very suspicious that with 71% armor and 59% block, max res + chaos I can literally tank any phys attack, even from bosses, though a single arrow from a crossbow does more damage 😂 get 10 archers/monsters flinging projectiles and I will have to use the flask multiple times to tank through or one shot them
@@glitchasaur yeah, even White mob Ranged attacks feel way too strong
One of the main reasons these strong, screen clear builds are popular in the first place is because of the sheer amount of BS in the game. Clearing an entire screen before random, non-telegraphed, one shots have a chance to kill your character is a necessity at the moment for melee players. Especially, when death means you lose the Tablet effects, lose the loot that dropped, lose the endgame mechanics, lose the juiced Waystone, lose XP, and lose all your portals.
The Invoker Monk doesn't need to be touched. The build isn't overperforming, it's just the only melee class that actually feels fun to play. There are no broken interactions or any bugs being exploited. At worst, take away the ability to stack 5 bells at once but leave everything else alone.
The Tower issue should be solved like this: Make 80-90% normal Towers: just slot in the tablet no need to run it. 10-20% of Towers are big Towers with Rare Modifiers and always containing a Boss. Also the Big towers boost the Tablets.
and shut those people down who say this is too hard, just do it GGG!!
i like that better tbh. Cause i feel like if they make every map or tower have a boss. The bosses will be way too repetitive
Yeah, that sure seems like 1 decent solution.
After leveling two characters with Maces, I started to play Witch and Ranger, and it baffles me that Supercharged Slam got nerfed on day one for the reason of "We don't want an ability to be so strong it feels mandatory to use" when Lightning Arrow and Skeleton Reavers are so insanely overpowered that it feels like a self imposed nerf to not use them the moment you get them until you get a very specific and refined build.
I hope the Infernalist Demon Form bug I found get fixed at least. After respec'ing out of Demon Form, I can no longer use Solar Orb. Used it to Font of Rage my Reavers and Flame Blast as a spell from myself.
I'm also hoping that they remove the stupid armour mechanic that makes your armour worse the more damage you take, it never worked in PoE1, not sure why anyone thought it would work in PoE2. Getting hit for 100 and having 80% DR and getting hit for 1000 and having 40% DR just shouldn't be a thing, it's so backwards.
Maces also are in a horrid place for usability. They feel good to use but just aren't good. They just need to tune them to what quarterstaves are. quarterstaves seem like they're probably 90% of Melee by now. So either Maces are where they want Melee to be, or quarterstaves are where they want melee to be. So either quarterstaves will get nerfed through the floor or Maces will get buffed by insane amounts.
I also feel like the campaign felt so good to go through, but when I compare it to endgame is, it feels so backwards. For maps to match what the campaign felt like, they need to double or triple the HP but reduce the damage of enemies to 1/2 or 1/3 of the damage. The threat should be enemies as a group like the campaign, rather than white-blue-yellow mobs just one shotting people. They did say the goal was to have only bosses being potential one-shot threats, but it's been the opposite to me.
On-death effects are super awful too, like you both mentioned. Especially when the visibility can be so low on them.
Beyond that, I'm hoping we get Swords. I want more melee skills.
I feel like the only thing that could make mace skills better while retaining the slow chunky damage theme, would be to incorporate some defensive layer into the skills. I don't want two handed maces to be fast like a quarters staff, and increasing the damage isn't really an option when bosses already melt. So, the defensive component could be the primary differentiator. They could add a % reduced damage taken buff during slam and charge up animations. Also, leap, stampede, and shield charge could use some polishing. The leap travel time needs to be faster than actual running. Why can't I leap over enemies? It feels half the time I click somewhere I end up 5 meters short of my destination because some white mob blocked the path.
This would be my comment if i wasn't so lazy, thank you sir! :D
I'm waiting for daggers and traps 🙏
yes we need more melee skils, faster and with more movement included :D
otherwise I will just spec into quarterstaff with my titan 🤡
@fadingdimension The biggest problem I found with Mace skills wasn't necessarily the time spent using them, but that you were completely exposed during. I died during the +1.4 Total Attack Time windup of Sunder a handful of times because enemies could just rapid dash up to me and use one attack and kill me, while I had over 70%DR. It needs another defensive layer to help mitigate that, and/or they need to make it so Armour DR isn't dependent on the size of the hit you're taking. Maces feel the way they should, but they shouldn't be punished for their designed playstyle.
In contrast, I actually like the design of Leap Slam now. I don't think it should be a travel again. That really broke it's purpose in PoE1. I loved using it as a stun buildup tool. I had it equipped with more stun buildup support and more AoE, and with it consuming Armour break, I could use it to majorly stun enemies. I think with the higher mana costs as well, it forces people to use it for effect than for travel. I do think being in the air should give you s for ground effects though. Edit: Also, I leap over enemies all the time? Not sure why you couldn't.
Make towers a wave based system. The further u go, the more precursors you can put in. Have a boss at the very end to maximize tower range and precursors
I feel the nerfs will kill the fun. I understand bringing things in line, but destroying fun just to forcing the speed of the game down is a huge no bueno.
On death effects are interesting when you're fighting multiple mobs. You kill one, it explodes, now that area is denied and you have to fight the remaining dude in the smaller area you have. That's neat. Waiting for explosions after death to loot is dumb though.
Towers: activating a tower points towards the nearest citadel.
I like the guys that get bloated with red and explode. It's very visible. On-death effects are, in general, okay, as long as players can see those first before any other graphical crap.
The least they could do is make the on-death effect lethal for everything in its area rather than just the player to make it useful like the Diablo 3 eel hag things which you could kite in to a pack and explode.
Oh yeah, it's so neat as melee to have to run around mobs for 90% of the time and barely find a (dangerous)chance to attack once or twice. It's so neat to have 90% of the screen be unable to step on, while being chased by volatiles, mirages, storms, crap spawning on you. While you have to somehow stop in place, if you want to attack. (yes, with ranged, it hardly matters)
Hopefully, they will address uniques. 90% of them are completely worthless outside of twinking low-level alts.
I'm pretty sure that's by design
No they are not , go through the list of uniques and you will see that atleast 50 of them are used in Meta builds at this moment out of 273. Then you probably have another 50 thats used for low level twinks and levling. They have to be very careful with uniques though
I agree, I find loot relatively disappointing and I indeed miss the dopamine of finding a good unique, or one without downsides that are bigger than their upsides :D
Hold alt over your unique and see what the item lvl is. Higher item lvl has higher Stat scaling. Unique are fine.
They are even trash then as easy and fast as you can level if you know the campaign in and out like I do now.
Bro. Whatever Toxic Tri says GGG will do, expect theyll do the opposite.
What a pleasant discussion. Both dudes feel just super nice. I listen to podcasts while working and this one is now my favorite. Good vibes and positive feels is what the world needs more. Thank you Tri and Gavryn!
it's annoying, no edge or personality.
@@Ugoofy1To each his own. Luckily you are not forced to watch this.
your parents never loved you
@@Ugoofy1 well, you literally have every single other popular Podcast nowadays for that...i guess....Idk i like this vibe where they actually talk without bs, yet respectfully
i do the same, been binging this channel while i work! love the content.
what im looking for most is them bringing endgame in lign with ACT1, buff the mobs remove the crazy haste they have, nerf builds hard across the board
My takes on some balance changes coming from a player with 3 lvl 90+ and 3 level 85+. stormweaver arcane tempo node and archemage can keep their same dmg numbers but need to double the requirement per breakpoint. For example lets say currently archemage gives you 8% more dmg per 100 mana change it to 8% dmg per 200 mana this is a 50% nerf( this is honestly not a big deal but would still be good without scaling out of control) next is stormweaver acane tempo being permanently up. No other ascendancy gives you this kind of dmg and sustain with no downsides. Bloodmage first ascendancy is basically we are going to make all of your spells cost health and allow you to get life remnants. Early this is a huge crutch that you either ignore ascending or just wait till the 2nd ascendancy to worry about it.(personally i think they need to just combine this node with the spell leech and the perhaps change the spell leech node to increase effect/add mana leech to spells/ make a portion of leech instant.)
monk invoker is well designed and half of chylula monk is too. The darkness nodes that remove spirt should instead convert spirit into more darkness. This 1 change would make a huge difference to those nodes as currently at lvl 100 you can only have 700 darkness. Ranger is in a great spot and doesnt really need any adjustments. Witch i already touched up on bloodmage. Infernalist is 1000% stronger early scales insanely well and the fact that demon form is easy to maintain even through the campaign without capping it just makes sense why there is a much larger player base playing it. The only thing about it is that the nodes that reserves health for stacks feels like it should belong to bloodmage. But other then that great place. Mercenary both are great with gemling probably edging out the other juat due to its ascendancy just working with everything with no drawbacks. Warrior needs help. instrad of more armor from chest piece being on ascendancy it should be increase armor applies to elemental damage as well.(even if it is at a reduced amount) there is a node about 7 points out from start that already gives increase effect of chest piece. Aftershock chance needs buffed. Warbringer seems to be in a decent spot to be honest havent played or looked too much into this ascendancy but seen some videos of the singer barb(i know this isnt d2 but basically what ascendancy is)
For skill changes besides archemage. The heralds need a charge system. Basically let generate a charge every 0.25 seconds having up to 10-15 charges. This way they can still chain just not until everything is dead on the map in 1 swing.
Banners having no affect while kn back is dumb. They should grant a small bonus to you while on your back and an empowered bonus when placed. Bell is currently bugged and allows to have more out than you should as it is a limit skill so i think once bug is fixed it will not be as overpowered.
While on the topic of skills i think some skills need to be adjusted to when they are available to pickup. For example frostbolt being a aquired from lvl 3+ skill gem but your get frost bomb at level 1 makes no sense. Same with flame wall and fireball. GGG basically pigenon holes sorcs to spark but not allowing the basic skills for each element not be aquired from start. Instead you get spark and flame wall and never look back because the combo is amazing at all points of the game.
For towers i want them to have a boss at the end and after beating the tower you can "scout" the next citidel. After completing 3 towers the location of the citdel appears on map. In fact take this a step further and make each of the citdels have their own unique towers(like corrupted towers) and make corrupted towers give progrss to discovering a citdel of choice.
Need more essence and strongbox nodes on atlas. As currently not worth the points as not enough synergies on atlas.
For 57:25 Items being sniped by Bots just don't let anyone buy items that they can not equip. Simple Solution and the higher the mods on the item the more gold it costs. It automatically lets a noob know this might be valuable in some way idk.
Id happy just to get a skill point after doing 100’s of maps. Or better gear. Something to feel like im progressing. At this point it feels like the game is bugged on console with the complete lack of anything
A lot of stuff will probably get nerfed. POE 2 is supposed to be tactical slow paced arpg. And after a few weeks of player tinkering poe 2 reverted back to poe 1 speed gameplay.
it only feels like poe2 in the first 2 levels then it just devolves into poe1
Buff armor and evasion, nerf ES to some extent. Buff physical damage by 20%, put caps on AM scaling, make rarity not affect currency like Poe.
Phys dmg does seem kinda crap. You can do a lot of things with elemental, phys doesn't really have anything.
2:10 Yay, now that all the no lifers got rich off of these builds the rest of us can get nerfed back down and have to wait till reset to get a fighting chance in the economy again.
Love to see the different viewpoints presented in a string of great interviews. Grats on 50K!
Being completely honest, class balance is FAR from the biggest issue with the game right now. What is even the point in having a variety of builds if the base endgame is so tedious and unfun. That is where all focus should be from GGG IMO
I don't agree I'm enjoying the endgame, but I totally see why some might find it tedious
I agree that class balance is not the biggest issue, but it can be improved relatively easily with some number tweaks (improved, not fixed).
It will also be healthy for the early access that people play different classes, instead of most players playing the same one.
We really need an in game auction house and I'd love to have settlers of Kalguur in poe2.
I agree that the fight is more important than dealing with the effects after a mob is defeated. The only on death effects that feel good to the player are beneficial to them. My go to example of a good on death effect is mob duplication, ie splitting into more mobs on death, or the other modifiers on this minion besides this mod get duplicated on a nearby mob.
There are so many big things that need to be addressed, I honestly have no idea what they will be focusing on as top priorities at this time. The big ones of course are optimiziation issues with servers, console performance problems, constant crashes; these are probably the first issues that need to be dealt with because it makes the game unplayable for a lot of people who paid to be able to play. Then for gameplay, basically warrior class as a whole, minions AI, death penalties being unbalanced (especially given current performance issues for many people), majority of maps being boring/tedious, too much RNG involved everywhere within game mechanics, POE tradesite update, many QOL measures from POE 1 being removed from POE2. These are just some of the things I see mentioned over and over again that I agree with. On top of all this, they still need to finish the rest of the acts and characters and create a new endgame to replace the current one for full access since the one right now is a placeholder apparently? I don't know if they will be able to fit all that in 1 year. I will see what things are coming in the next few patches to see how this will play out, but if all that the patches do is just nerfing a bunch of builds and not addressing the actual problems, we are in for a rough and long journey to full release.
I appreciate the weight the single death system brings, because it makes things feel more hardcore and less free. But on the flip side, part of why hard boss fights are fun is getting beat down, learning from mistakes, and going again. So while I don't want to go back to 6 tries per map, I wouldn't mind a system that gives you one last chance after you die. Close all but the last portal, and give people one last shot at redemption.
Other than that, I'll just say I definitely enjoyed the slower and more deliberate pacing of the early acts than the more zoomy endgame. I'm hoping they find a way to reign things in, because as it stands now, it barely feels like a new game after a point.
This is my take aswel. Xp loss on death is annoying but needed, otherwise you could just brute force your way to 100 without any real skill. High levels mean something. Every time I get a level now its like the best thing ever and super satisfying. I don't like loosing a map/boss on death though. Just let us use our 6 portals up and then we loose the map. A lot of people are just paying others to run a pinnacle boss for them because the risk is too great. Loosing a breach stone after grinding hours and hours or running the sekhemas trial for an hour to get your final ascendancy just to get a "you loose" screen pop up just sucks really. Something needs changing when you'd rather just pay someone to do it for you as apposed to having your time wasted. So that defeats the whole point of earning this end game content and engaging with it properly.
My take - infinite one portal, but every death lowers rarity and quantity of items by at least 25%. And make acquiring atlas points for other mechanics than maps require deathless bosses. This way we can learn mechanics and be rewarded only for gitting gud.
One portal map is probably good. But need to adjust some things. Like losing the extra content on the map doesn't seem good. Losing the loot and exp. is already punishment enough, probably.
Because when you lose the extra content, the empty map becomes a chore you have to do just to get to the better maps. It makes it boring and annoying to play, which is not good.
U are doing awsome job since first infos about PoE2, gz man, u rly deserve it:).
RE: death. Give 3 portals. First death gives "shame" debuff. -33% item rarity for remainder of map. Second death ups it to -66%. 3rd death you're done.
it is not only the resourses the BM uses that are crazy, the mana cost in general is soooooooo out of proportion that it is insane. This is the reason you only see viable spell builds with Archmage
One thing that might not be thought about is I don’t think you can even check a rares modifiers on console and those random on death visuals can eat your frames
some of those effects are delayed by 3-5seconds after death too, with no visual queues. drives me insane when i roll away from a mob in case it explodes on death or something and i roll into an area i killed something a few seconds ago and some effect pops and 1 shots me.
The fact that you can unspec all boss difficulty in the atlas passive tree and stack waystone drop chance in order to make citadelles bosses easy and drop 3 crisis fragments seems kinda unbalanced
Speaking of on-death effects, why not just make them non damaging ones? Like drop some frozen on mud terrain on the ground that slows you down, or lowers your damage/defenses or something? Pretty decent middle ground that GGG could agree on maybe.
Or at least make them visible and working properly. Died in trial of chaos because, for some reason, my character was able to push and drag volatile cores of monsters when they were priming to explode. As in, I walk through the volatile, it starts to explode, and my character moves it while walking. Why is that a thing, volatile plants don't do that.
Or just not make them so strong, like there's no reason a trash mob that can't even damage me can 1 shot on death.
Having DarthMicro instead of Talkative on the Tavern Talk podcast is such a stupid move. This guy loves PoE/PoE2. And Darth is just a guy who goes where the hype is.
Lol have u watched just a single stream of him? Hes actually very critic about a lot of things, just yesterday he spend couple of hours collecting the further critics of the community and wording them right for the interview tomorrow. Cool down. :)
I'm currently running MoltenBlast on a deadeye, dual-wielding the unique mace, Olrovasara, and it's been awesome! The main interaction is to use FrostWall to build up the lightning damage from the maces. With Deadeye you can get enough atk speed that it makes it feel really good :D
They need wayyy more life mods on the tree
I love my warrior, I feel like im playing a souls game. I never played with my magic or op stuffs in those games, and I'm doing the same with this game, I love a good challenge
Spray and pray tactics put me to sleep. I'm happy smashing and rolling my way through maps.
@sirdro1339 this is the way
Quarterstaff with Herald of Ice and Thunder is the most fun I have had playing the game. It works, it taught me a lot about the games core mechanics. And it falls apart when bossing so it has its cons. Hope they don't go nuclear with them and somehow keep the feel when they proc.
if they nerf this ill be pissed off, what happened to letting builds be fun
@@radio671 Just remember you are playing an early access version of the game. Balancing will happen a lot most of the time this will include nerfing your favourite build. Stormweaver, Invoker and deadeye make up like 75% of the player base so its obvious these builds are getting nerfed. I play Sparkweaver and I just know my build is about to get gutted, comes with the territory. Ice monk is probably the second most op build in the game so you can bet its going to be tuned down bit. Another thing to keep in mind is that when the game fully releases and even maybe before that (Early access leagues) our current characters will be locked behind EA and basically have to start fresh anyway.
@@Wi11iamNZ fair enough but its always a scary thought that your build will be completely fucked
@@radio671 you can have that type of fun in PoE1. PoE2 has a different vision and that isn't blowing up the map and zooming around. It is the reason why PoE2 is not meant to replace PoE1. It is meant for people with different preference in ARPG genre to play their preferred vision of the game similar to WoW Retail and WoW Classic or Oldschool Runescape and Runescape.
I suspect you're underselling the changes. 0.1.0g/h/i/j/etc can account for all balance changes to classes and adjustments to endgame systems. That we're getting 0.1.1 suggests content. My bet is on either 3rd ascendancy for existing classes, or one-or-more new classes.
Keep in mind that they _floated_ a 6 (to 12) month early access. If 6 months was ever going to be a realistic possibility, they'd have to push a new class every month.
lol I admire your optimism
@@brian5948 ^_^ they _might_ have a full reveal and complete community podcast with both Jonathan and Mark _just_ to talk about balance and how their Christmas was.
"If 6 months was ever going to be a realistic possibility, they'd have to push a new class every month." - Not necessarily, they can release them in chunks of multiple classes at once.
And why take 6 months instead of 12? It's just an estimate, which can be very wrong. 6 months is obviously the most optimistic estimate possible.
They might have a new class, it would be a little surprising though. Especially since they took a long break. Still, some things were ALLEGEDLY close to being ready for beta release but didn't quite make it.
As there is no strength/intellect based playable options as of right now, we really need to fill that spot with either Druid or Templar with it as a priority. It would open up build variety for Warrior, Witch, Sorceress options too. Ofc Warrior has a desperate needs of it mostly, aside from the known problems it has right now.
INB4 another 2 year vacation before the patch drops. /s, excited to see what they have in store for us (map tab?!)
everyones talking nerf this and nerf that when i actually feel like the current top builds being invoker/deadeye/stormweaver are an actual benchmark for how a build should operate as opposed to making then trash like other class choices
Counterpoint: Those builds already have a place in PoE 1. Why even make a separate game with the promise of a slower and more meaningful combat if endgame builds become the same zoom-zoom screen clearing and skipping boss mechanics by one-shotting them? They've shown that a slow and methodical ARPG can work with the campaign. IMO I would like to see the endgame brought closer to that state.
@@LazyPandaBum I agree. I've had significantly more fun in the early campaign (acts 1-3) than I did later in the game. Once it got to the point where things started zooming, it lost that interesting arpg/souls hybrid feel, and just reverted to PoE 1. I would even go so far as to say I had more fun clearing ToS on warrior than I did blasting through content on monk or sorc.
Personally, I enjoyed the first 3 acts of PoE2 more than any other arpg experience I've had to date.
@@LazyPandaBum its quite evident when start doing activities like simulacrum you need to be putting out ALOT of damage to succeed. having done all the content in the game as of this moment its 100% a matter of most classes being weak as opposed to the aforementioned classes being overpowered.
my spark says around 150k on the tooltip and simulacrum is still a tough encounter.
you honestly just sound like that typical reddit guy who got to maps, struggled to progress/sustain and starts coping in any way they can
@@TheDeadlockArchives I am in that scenario too with spark at 150k+ and unable to complete simulacrum. But I don't think that's a build/character issue but the mechanism itself. The mobs spawning that is invul for that first second and pushing you to the ends of the map and simultaneously cornering you amongst other mobs and fatal projectiles, it's a bit much. The game itself requires a rebalance, not the builds. The current 'meta' isn't exactly what GGG had in store or rather what they announced POE2 is supposed to be, but it's a good measure to what the state of the game is at the moment. It's a waiting moment for what GGG plans to do going forward.
It has to get faster then the campaign somewhat so that you feel a sense of power creep. But a few builds are to nuts and endgame bosses die too quick
30:23 pause is 100% my fave feature added in PoE2.
anybody got any info? any leaks?
I very much disagree with the trade arguement. I think the way PoE handles trade is extremely fundamental to how the economy stays vaguely functional as more and better item keep entering the game and it gives that social inconvenience that helps players bond socially in what is otherwise more of a single player game. I love it in the currency exchange as that doesn't impact the loot progression, but if they ever implement an auction house for rares and even uniques I fear the game might move past me.
On an unrelated note; this is where GGG decides if they take everybody down to a nerfed version of what warrior is now but with functional armour and adjust mobs to where that feels good, or if they try to readjust everything towards where Poison Concoction is basically at with decent clear and bossing dps but without the instakilling that the herald chain or spark do.
Howa nerfed Archmage nerfed, None of these streamers are original...They literally follow whatever the strongest builds are..."Bloodmage"...He's really off the meta....You cant say in one breath "Youre a hipster for builds" and then talk about the tech you saw for playing your next build...I love how everyone says "Monk was my first build" Like they didn't employ the broken tech as soon as it was found....My first build was a sorc and I was using Cast on freeze Comet...Big brain right...GG How bout you buff some shit?!
Great discussion, I love this series man, keep it rolling.
How many left?
And congratulations on reaching your 50K subs, you deserve it!
my two biggest things - remove on death effects - and change maps layouts to have like 90% less deadends/or - give indicators where to go from the beggining of the map
I think monk is fine, but herald of ice with pork rind is kinda busted and bell is bugged because it clearly isn't intended you being able to drop multiple. The herald loop takes a decent chunk of investment in dual damage typing and 60 spirit.
Was a super good podcast, Thanks Tri
So yall want Stormweaver to get nerfed but just adjust monk??
33:24 +Max Mana scales your Mana Regen, add more Mana to gear (it REALLY is cheap) and your Mana Regen automatically goes up. Increase Mana Regen too.
0:57 GGG trying to reinvent the wheel by turning an ARPG into Turn Based ARPG, good luck w/ that...
Absolutely love this video guys! Just found out about you Tri and you are the man, keep it up love the interviews.
Extend the range of the precursor in each tower and make them harder to obtain. For example towers are fewer and further between with a Unique boss and layout in each tower. Simple
Holiday season updates are always small, I will be quite pleasantly surprised if we get such big changes as mentioned here, but I can hope for it.
On the topic of towers, my biggest issue with them so far (at level 84) is how rough the map layout feels - the walls hiding the enemies inside each room until the last second (often too late)
Also, there are too many. Maybe it would be cooler if they were rarer but gave a much bigger vision range?
I don't know if the speed at the end game is that much of a concern honestly. +0 Simulacrum is VERY difficult even for builds that can do other pinnacle bosses, and it requires really good clear to stay alive. The fact they put it in that way it is suggests that the end game is supposed to be faster-paced. It's not like the mechanic is new, Delirium has been play-tested in PoE1 for years at this point; they knew what they were doing.
I wish huntress come asap to the game. Can't wait
you know, the thing i know for sure is.. ACT 6 or 5 boss is ATZIRI. If she's in act 5, then beast is in 6. If she's in 6 then it's probably some form of 'beast enters into atziri, morphs her and woohooo'
Looking at armor damage mitigation chart, simply increasing the amount prevented by 2 classes (1000 armor mitigates 16% damage from 1000 damage hit to 50% damage) is a step for right direction. I also prefer boosting less viable layers to same viability as ES, Mind Over Matter. If life bonuses of str were to be increased, then it forces every life build into str stacking, so there needs to have life synergestic nodes on tree. Maybe more life regen, life on block or life recouped based on damage mitigated?
During the exact moment you said "on death effect" I just died to cold on death effect after shattering a rare and istantly dodge rolling after the kill from one effect to the other which I totally did not see.... lvl 93, ice strike monk 50% in on the bar
50k subs congrats and great podcast
I think minion builds have a lot of diversity too. Titan, Storm Mages, Frost Mages, Gemling, Reavers.
At lvl 96 1% xp took me a full map with 10 breaches spawning at lvl 80 , it was crazy
For maces they could make beefy hits without having reduced attackspeed on every passive and attackspeed penalty to all mace skills.
They need to fix the game breaking crashes before anything else. Their hot fixes have created new bugs that didn't exist prior
Sounds isolated to specific conditions. 250 hours in and I've never crashed once.
@nintandao64 Ps5 has tons of crash situations. Mostly co-op, but us peasants suffer everyday.
Never crashed in 200 hours
GGG could change both the towers mechanics and the 1-portal system at the same time, making that each tower influence on a map gives you +1 portal to use if you die
There are some outliers, but i feel like the game is built to go fast. So i hope changes are met with some care, and they dont overtune.
58:52 I don’t personally believe that fear of economic problems should stop ggg from moving forward. Economy is already in shambles. Idk how they could make it worse.
Great Podcast again, it’s getting better and better, keep it up
A lot of Human enemies use Playerskills, so in regards to Daggers, Claws, Swords we’ve have already some impression of what they will be able todo
can‘t wait to Ninja
Are we both thinking about the cloud that makes you invisible? ;) ;)
@ hell yea and the drill dash forward through enemies
I think if they left towers how they are, but made tablets refresh maps within their radius that'd be great. It's a bummer to exhaust maps in a section that has a lot of layouts you like.
The fake news on armour being bad is out of hand. It's supposed to protect you from lots of little hits, not 1 shots. and it does that pretty good. it is BROKEN like ES? No. People keep referencing kripp's video on armour, but they didn't look at his second video where he said he was wrong? :/
Yeah he said he was wrong and it was even worse than he first thought.
The only thing i wanna they to address are those Rare with 7 affixes in a cocaine trip running at 200 KM/H at you, and you cant do anything about it because the Rare is untangeable or whatever is call when you cant hit them far from you.
It's proximal tangibility. And that combined with mana drain is just wild stuff. I keep my basic skill on my bar solely for when I run into a mana drain. Because they almost always are fast af and there's no escaping the drain.
Energy shield, damage numbers, and armor are things that come to mind.
i dont think there is anything wrong with es. es has no recovery in poe2. no leech, no on kill and you have to invest much more skillpoints into it then in poe1.
a buff to armor would not be bad, yes.
@@RoeDeerMusic If ES doesnt get any direct changes grim feast will be gutted completely.
@@RoeDeerMusic I think the main problem is the imbalance between ES/AR/EV, the mechanics need a bit of tweaking. Comparing it to poe1 is not really a way to go about it
@@Chris3s comparing es to armor and evasion is kinda wrong cause u cant. you can only compare es to health cause thats the same function, a buffer or better the choice of your buffer. if we talk about armor/evasion/block we talk about your choice of reducing damage. comparing es with evasion is like.... comparing dmg to magic find.
@@RoeDeerMusic the itemization works that way though, so it makes sense to compare them this way
A wholesome 50k, you earned it mate 😊
They definitely need to tune the Ice Wraiths down as well. Got chain frozen in a map last night by a pack of them and RIP.
i hope and pray they remove poe 2 crafting and bless us with poe crafting instead. Convocation also seems like need to come for summoners.
"Now that I have a wife, kids, and a fulltime job. Im ready to blast arpgs." dont think ive heard that before lol
One more thing to mention monsters in on going telegraph animation should not teleport with ghost walker mod, Imagine some big rare preparing big slam you know you have to dodge and you surely stand miles away from that monster and you think you are safe, guess what that rare can just teleport on you directly miliseconds away from executing the slam and kill you in a blink with no way to avoid
Well, it is early access after all. The whole point being that by launch things like campaign, endgame and balance will have been tuned.
i shall try the "righteous flatulence" build before it gets nerfed into the ground.
love the talks btw,perfect for farming ❤
I hope for zoomy nerfs!! And I even play monk
I hope demon form witch doesn’t get nerfed. I switched from ice strike monk to the infernalist and it’s been pretty nutty.
It would be so interesting if towers instead of taking a waystone instead required you to put the tablet in to start the area.
Breach would cause you to do a massive timed breach similar to the boss area and reward you with the tablet effect plus breach stuff at the end
Expedition could start with a detonation charge at the beginning and make you follow along and kill the mobs along the way (Don't really know how to make this interesting without making it too hard)
Ritual could literally be a massive ritual area with ritual affects going on and you get rewarded favour as well as the tablet effect at the end
Delirium could be a race against the fog to the end of a linear map and maybe you need to kill enough mobs to get the reward, so players don't just book it to the end
Regular tablets could just be the regular tower map I guess...
you mentioned mechanics for towers - I could get behind this idea. Like a crafting mechanics to help with some deterministic crafting. Like a harvest bench type affair. That is available when you click the end of tower. I could see a nice link with betrayal mechanics. Like a mini game within the map system.
towers are fine, it's not meant to be meanigful or rewarding, it's doing exactly what GGG want it to do. So sick of you retards trying to create the game, let the people we know can make good games do the thinking you smooth brained fuck
Mapping will be very limited with 1 Dead attempt, either fixing the drop to match the risk or bring back 6 Portals or tweak it around every Mod = 1 more extra attempt while Citadel or Boss map will automatically let you go with 6 portals attempts.
And I agree, Quater staff as a whole don't need a nerf but adjust is require.
PS : The Inquisitor look really cute on your thumbnail lol
The one portal system is so bad, I just want to retry what I failed.
Also making maps extremely stressfull. Even if you manage to beat it, the stress of losing the map should you die makes it extremely unfun, atleast for me
Make one portal that can be used infinitely, but also make the death penalty be a stacking map rarity and quantity decrease. Make it like 25%, so after 4 deaths you get pretty much nothing, but you could learn boss fights or complete a map to go further. And obviously prevent getting atlas points or achievements when you die in that location. Just let us practice.
@@Kuzka_ First time hearing about this idea, would be fun to test that out at least :D
There's technically less on screen than in PoE1, but the visibility feels so much worse, especially with Delirium or Strongboxes. The maps have a lot of visual noise already, then you add different flavors of fog and hide circles underneath it all, it's maddening. It's like they forgot what game they were designing when they started making the endgame mechanics.
After reaching endgame I had to reroll a new character because my mercenary using crossbows feels really bad and gets me killed because of a reloading bug that prevents me from attacking for up to 10 seconds at times. I was losing a lot of currency on my maps because I'd die while my character couldn't do anything.
If you have a bow on secondary and use auto-swap for the ice bow skill that jumps back, it blocks your crossbow and forces slow movement until you dodgeroll. Other than that I noticed some delay in reload that's tied to FPS. Sometimes adds like 1-2 seconds extra to reload.
In general crossbows are strong, but have no available builds for phys damage. I tried playing with armour break + high velocity rounds that apply bleed, but it's awful and aggreviated bleed doesn't even work. I added poison and just that doubled the dot damage... But also, on a different character I apply much stronger dot with just corrupting cry...
@Kuzka_ no, I'm talking about if you dodge roll while reloading or get stunned while reloading, it stops the reload animation and takes anywhere from 5-10 seconds for the game to realize it needs to reload. Clicking reload manually doesn't work, but the skill gem emergency reload fixes it.
Evasion needs a higher level penalty, Bell needs a cooldown and a damage nerf(perhaps an ICD on the proc), with the new gem system you're able to stack so many support gems ontop of eachother there is no way thats ever going to be balanced without hurting the inidividual abilities
I feel like the fundamental problem is that PoE 2 endgame doesn't feel like PoE 2, it feels like PoE 1 and the classes that could be dropped into that game without issue (Monk / Archmage Sorc) are doing well.
'they really succeeded with quarterstaff'? I'm sorry? There are like 5 skills everyone is using on quarterstaff while the rest are very bad: very conditional, bad AoE, bad damage, unnecessary movement, fixed animation time, and etc. They did not succeed at all.
you kill enemies so fast that they don't get a chance to attack you so the only thing they can do is run at you at maximum speed then have a death effect trigger otherwise nothing will hit you :P
Personally, I don't think Archmage should receive much of a nerf. Maybe a little, but what's really needed is better alternatives to Archmage. Why don't we have a Spirit Skill that scales Ignite or various elemental Magnitudes? I would love a Spirit skill that scales Ignite magnitude based on total mana, as an example.
Calls himself the Executioner: Pronounces it "Gill-o-teen"
With Archmage, the scaling isn't even when the problem begins. For me, when starting mapping, in a non-MoM build, just a measily 1200 mana, it was providing 96% extra lighting damage, or, if my build has no extra damage from anywhere, that doubles my damage. Meanwhile, the alternative, provides less than 60% more damage (and keep in mind your main damage dealing ability will very likely have some more damage support gems)... for one element... picked at random. As to how to nerf it, the very first place to start is with quality. 20% = 2% more per 100 damage. This means, when you first get it, that quality is probably a 50% increase in the ability's effectiveness, and that'll drop to like a 33% increase later. It defies belief that anyone thought this aspect, let alone the rest of archmage, is remotely balanced. And then you'd have to nerf the base % bonus per 100 mana as well.
The scaling just takes an ability that is already stupidly overpowered before it and turns it up past 11, to something like 9001.