I'm 25 now. The skills and knowledge in horology always fascinate me along the journey. Kalle speaks the truth, in modern days the knowledge is more then abundant and skiils never catch up. I really dream to get invloved in the life style mentioned. Kalle's streams help a lot and make me more determined. I'm quitting the job right now and wanting to start the advanture in watchmaking real soon. Wish me luck😁
Have a fantastic career, jealous as I am way to old now. Time has passed me by and this was one career I never thought of until the past few years. You go for it
As a hobbyist I find amazing online resources like yours Kalle and it makes it fun but I’d hate to need to make a living because it’s so in-depth to get it right on every aspect for repair. Parts are hard to find and tools are vast.. so good luck to all of you who want to make a career of this amazingly interesting and inspiring field.
yes seiko dont have parts, we have to pick it up from china, and you cant find all aprts.. for me its enought,, i think I will start to make aprts,, but a spring coil we cant make,, however we can find springs in europe,, the problem is we have to cut them so they can vibrate the correct time, all its a lot of time consuming,, so a watch repair can not be cheap, and not everybody is avaiable to do pay for it. I think many watches will go to garbage can,, or dissaamble for some aprt and thrown away..
I understand your concern and i echo it. I spent 17 years as a gunsmith ( making screws both SAE and metric) as well as repair. My restorations were almost non existent however my repairs and enhancements were plentiful. All things end so for the last 10 years ive learned horology the same way i learned firearms. Read, study, observe, listen and do. I am not a watch restorer by any means but i can repair to my satisfaction and that of my limited client base. My point is that like any other profession there are levels of expertise and finding the correct craftsperson who is competent is more of a task today than ever before. Just because you can buy the screwdrivers dosent mean you know how to use them are words of wisdom i choose to live by. Thank you Kalle for sharing your expertise and passion for horology with us as you are truly an inspiring master !
parts are disapearing from market and people interest for watches too..some bitches like seiko dont produce parts... they could hask some parts to orient factory and then sell it.. they behave like usa industryidiots.
Currently in the U.S. watch schools are now turning out “watch technicians” and no longer watch makers. In my humble opinion, this is an attempt by the big brands to create a stream of indentured employees as opposed to individuals who can go out and hang their own shingle. I am a self taught watchmaker with 40 years experience. I grew up extremely poor and have wanted for nothing since entering this profession. You can do this until either you or circumstances determine your end date and you can go into business anywhere in the world. Tell me another industry aside from the “oldest profession” that you can do this. Not to mention that watchmaking doesn’t come with the hazards of the aforementioned! Great video. Thank you.
market work in other way, you amke stupid prices for "garbage" or old stuff p+eople will not buy it,, thast how market work. you take 30 to fix my watch i want it, you take 300, i pass, throw it away keep it in a box or jsut sell for cheap.--
I think you are right Kalle. I study at the national danish watchmaking school, spent about 10 hours a day doing that, and then another 4 hours when i get home. Becourse watchmaking is craftmansship, and like all other craftmansship it take millions of hours to be good at it. I have been a carpender for 25 years and I´m stil not a master at that craft. I as a person learn by doing, it seems to be the best way of doing it. So i just keep going. Love your channel, and keep going champ..
there is no restauration for dials so after a while peopel send it to the garbage can,, watchmakers forget about this..unless someone near you do it well and affordable..
What a very interesting and encouraging video. I say encouraging because it’s constructive criticism. I pray that you will be heard by those that need to hear you.
Sorry I missed the live stream. It's all very true. I left it too late and only started after I retired. At 73, I enjoy the small set of skills I have but should have started sooner! Thanks for the offer Kalle, but I think your courses are now beyond me. My suggestion is if you can, commit and enjoy. Success to all who can achieve it. Best of luck to all Chronoglide Streamers...
I work with my dad in a watch shop, where we repair quite a few watches daily. My dad isn't formally trained, and as much as i wish i could attend the watchmaking courses, most of them are far too expensive, especially when you add in lodging and livelihood when moving to another country to study. Im sure there are many others that have attended watchmaking schools, and though i agree with Kalle, money still runs the world. Perhaps someone might be able to give their experience on how they funded their watchmaking courses/careers to help struggling people such as myself move in the right direction? Cheers!
I'm a 40 year old software engineer attempting to self train, would love to go to night-school, or even do online(I can afford to buy whatever), but it just doesn't exist. I can't even find a self-learning syllabus of things to work on and what order.
@@joemaniaciMarshall from @WristwatchRevival sometimes mentions the course he took. I believe it was online videos, but I don’t quite remember off the top of my head.
I'm 57 and as a watchmaker hobbyist, as corny as it sounds, I reminisce about what it was like in the 1950's when someone brought in a Rolex submariner for their two year service. At the time in many towns, you could find any watchmaker in any big city or even small town. Not so today of course. I'm in Illinois and Most are in or near Chicago today. Have an old mechanical you found and want it serviced but live in say Pontiac, IL? You are either making a long drive north or shipping it. When my father passed away in 2011, I came across a few old phone books from the early 70's and was shocked at how many watch repair shops were listed even in the small town I grew up in that are long gone. The Quarts revolution had much to do with that. Today, because of brands like Rolex's policy towards small independents, if a small town watch repair does exists, they will not take a Rolex in for service. interestingly, since social media helped mechanical watches become a cool collectable thing again against the grain of the trow away electronic apple watch age around 2015, I've actually seen a few independents popping up. Just wonder how long this will all last.
Not long, I’m afraid. All the major watch brands have clubbed together and are restricting before wholly suppressing the availability of replacement parts to their own accredited repairers who charge premium prices. My watchmaker (in the UK) has retired early for that reason. I fear for the future of watch collecting, only the wealthy will be able to join.
Independent is not allowed to purchase spares for certains swiss makes which is ruining their business and of courae $100 watch what needa $200 repair will be abandoned
I can understand the sentiment. I have always been fascinated with horology as a whole, but never had the means until now. I just had my 50th birthday, and I am finally diving into watchmaking. I truly wish that I could have done it 25 years ago!
Love the videos! I started tinkering with watches last year after trying to find someone to service my 10 year old Invicta and put a new battery in it. After talking to several people that said just throw it out and buy a new one they are cheap. I started my higher education as an engineer so I thought OK lets watch some videos and learn how to do it. Well after A LOT of videos and learning I did it with some cheap tools. I loved it so much I am now in debt to the hobby several thousand dollars. Looks like the next purchase will be a lathe as soon as i can find a good deal on ebay. After that I am looking hard at the British Horological distance learning course. I am currently 43 and have 8 more years as a Paramedic until I can take my retirement. Plan is to take the next 8 years perfecting my skill and learning everything i can absorb before attempting it as an after retirement profession. I would love to see the assembly and lubrication along with your thoughts on the correct lubrication for different movements and theory behind it.
You have to admit you have a beautiful shop and the attitude and perspective to create a quality restoration workshop. You have the old craftsman mindset. Something I find dig\fficult to find in America.
This s a great video and so full of truth. It's not only watchmaking. We live in an impatient, quick fix society. We need to invest in the next generation and pass on these decades of specialist skills and teach the current generation an alternative to instant results. They're so used to the immediate access of information and facts, and of course the instantaneous shopping for new, rather than repairing the old. Hopefully this video will inspire some people to apply for apprentiships
I have a cart of tools from Esslinger and e bay locked and loaded. I have been following you and have started another course and have learned Sooo much. I hope to one day make a living in this hobby. My biggest worry is the parts embargo honestly. It’s tough at my age with bills and responsibilities to start an apprenticeship but it’s not impossible. I live in Upstate Newyork, not exactly a whatch making Mecca but I know that this is what I want do with my life. I’m sick of spending my days doing something I hate. I hope I’m not being foolish or dreamy but either way I’m giving it a shot
As a watch collector I more than understand what you mean! Just to be able to find the proper watch smith for certain jobs is crazily hard. Recently had to have a 8 day power reserve airplane watch, after a lengthy search which gave perfect results. The broken part was due to: when setting time & pushing back the crown in, one has to fiddle a bit for parts to mesh properly, if not you break parts, now this was common knowledge back then (1950-1980) but just knowing the mesh part has been forgotten. We can easily imagine the complexity of certain chronographs (ex.: eta 7750) with quick day/date fonction being forgotten etc. Your watchsmiths are your allies in this crazy complex puzzle 👍❤️👌
What an experience it's been so far. Having a history in a wide variety of mechanical skills, going from motorsports to machineshops over welding, forging and what not. Watchmaking is a different game all together. Nothing is new but the way to handle and controle familiar procedures on a microscopic level puts you back on your feet. 4 years in I realise the learning zone is never ending. Kalle is right, if you are willing and able, dive into watchmaking. every little achievement in new skills will be a reward. Nobody said it's easy, but it's not impossible. Keep motivating yourself. become part of the watchmakers community.
I have been teaching myself watch making the last two years built up, Lorch schmidt lathe with new base dividing head milling head , gear cutting tool , also made my own cutting tools for the lathe work, sticking to the 1700th and 1800th watch movements as for me the craftsmanship from them dates and the limited tools- light they is unreal, have brought a few pieces , have made balance staff with the pivot ends 0.11 mm. I have just finished making a verge pallet staff for a 1710 movement, been to the area where they made the fusee chains managed to find and meet a contact at a museum and view and handle all original tooling for making the fusee chains, I said has anyone requested to look at this stuff, he said "no one since the last person that used it back in 1950", have all photos of the tooling... the reason I do this ........because it's a wonderful journey, being able to keep these pieces going, from these masters mentally and physically, it's a joy 😊
Great talk 🙂 this adds to the magic of watches for me. You make sure you restore an old watch just the way it was made originally and I, the wearer wont ever see that part under the microscope. But both me and you know it matters. I am currently reading G. Daniels book and it is facinating.
So very true, but also for many professions. For me it's a hobby, where I always can improve my skills and kowledge. That makes the craft so long term challanging, and for me so fascinatig. There is always something deeper to learn. I'm so glad that AI will not be able to fix a watch, even in the farest future. There will be always the balance of skill, knowledge and heart needed! And the ones who love the theme will always find satisfaction aut of the work.
I can appreciate a good rant. So, I could not agree more. That said RUclips is a knife that cuts both ways. for those who seek information and then apply it with their fingers it is an asset. However RUclips is also a magic trick that lets you think you know how to do something as long as you are not confronted with the inconvenience of heaving to do it. craft can not be learned by watching, it can only be accomplished by doing. Ironicly watching is the first step. Hats off to you for trying to thread the needle.
So I'm a computer programmer, I've been a gunsmith hobbiest, pistol instructor, lock Picker and many other hobbies that are quite technical around repair and understanding how things work. I've wanted to get into hobby watch repair and restoration for a while. I've bought quite a few watches and I'm now investing in the materials. I think that there are more people getting into this but I really wish I could take the time to learn through an apprenticeship. Information is at our fingertips through they Internet and RUclips but i think you make a great point that they old way of leaning by immersion, dripping knowledge and apprenticeship is not as common.
A comment from England. This vid puts the watchmakers' side of the story, and Kalle is obviously correct. There is also the other side of the story - that of the watch owners. I recently had occasion to have two watches serviced. The first was/is a 2001 Explorer 2. It is worth about £9/10,000 for which I paid £1,400 in new condition in 2002. I paid £560 to a top-rated watchmaking company for the service (about 50% less than servicing at Rolex). The watch now appears to be new, and is running beautifully, seemingly to the second. That expenditure was logical in relationship to the value. The second watch I've had from new in 1973, a Seiko Jumbo chronograph. Its value is about £150. The (more local) quote for servicing was £250 plus parts, so with a much-needed new crystal probably £300. I didn't bother, and just put the watch back in the cabinet. Millions of good but inexpensive mechanical watches are now being sold. The soon-to-come reality is that servicing costs will far outweigh the residual value of many of those lower-end watches, and they will be relegated to dusty drawers. It will be cheaper to buy new than service. For many, it will be cheaper to swap-out the stock (ETA, Selita?) movement than to repair. This reality doesn't seem to dawn on the buyers of Chinese clones that will cost more to service than their original price. In-between will fall better-end but non-prestige watches from the likes of Longines, but there will come a time, even for those pieces, when hourly skilled labour rates exceed what is sensible expenditure on watches with marginal residual value. Buyers and the trade must think in the longer term.
I'm also in the UK, and it's about getting a bit creative with it. I have an Orient Esteem I brought new in 2018 I've just had serviced, which uses a very basic Orient/Epsom calibre. I had it serviced in China for £14 for the service and £9 for a crystal replacement and upgrade to sapphire crystal. I didn't need to post it as I had someone out there, but postage would be around £10 each way, so its still very very cheap. Similarly, some guy in Moldova offered to do the service for £50.
The reality of a cheap chinese clones being cheaper to replace than to service absolutely does occur to buyers. In many cases, the build quality of the rest of the watch is so good that, for me, having a good, reliable movement I can replace myself is a selling point. But nobody is fooling themselves that a $200 San Martin is an investment. I'd rather have a good quality, decent looking, running watch than to hunt for someone at whom to throw gobs of cash because he has the skills to oil my investment.
Your comment is somehow blurred. From the beginning, you have to know this. If you buy or get a watch from heart, money doesn't matter. Really don't! If you buy like many of Brit watch investors, you just put the watch in the safe and wait for better times to make a profit. The egoistic way to buy watches and take away a good watch from a potential watch enthusiast. I have a Seiko 5 which I wore 17 years all my childhood . Now if it comes to service I ask how much and get goin' no problem the price . It is an emotional thing. If you don't understand this then you are in the wrong league, my friend.
Thanks Kalle, a fascinating opinion of the future of the craft. Some very good points made and noted. It's reassuring to hear, what I thought was actually a positive outlook. We're with you all the way Kalle!
I think there are a few issues, mostly caused by the Swiss watch companies. They want watchmakers to just repair by replacing. The watchmaker schools have pandered to that. Restrictions on parts to independent watchmakers. The profession of watchmaking has been dumbed down deliberately by the industry itself, I.e. the manufacturers. The future of watchmaking is as much the hobbyist as the independent, the independent will not be able to compete long term.
The addition to that is they are wanting to do it in-house, only so many watchmakers in Switzerland. That’s why the service/repair times are so high now, no independent to take up the slack.
@@tylerfukuda Excluding something like a Grand Seiko, anything from Orient or Seiko will normally have an off the shelf version parts can be stripped from
bedankt kalle en je hebt een punt ik ga een schroefje maken en probeer dit op de oude manier te doen grote schroeven lukte me altijd al wel maar zo klein ik ga het proberen ik zie wel waar ik strand .... ik ben gek op deze uitdagingen
There is good and there is bad with this. The amount of information is there and yes, the difference in quality of that information is huge. Still I feel that the interest for watches and watchmaking is still on the up, so many people will now try to repair a watch, probably many more than was the case just two decades ago. Myself I took a watch apart for the first time about ten years ago. Now I am confident enough to service a movement, well unless it’s a complicated one. Of course to repair something is completely different, I have successfully repaired a couple of hairsprings, again I have destroyed many more! The amount of tools I have accumulated is quit overwhelming. My intention is to keep going to learn more and more, but to get to the point that I can replace a jewel, to make any kind of parts well that is something I will never do. I am 57 and I do this as a hobby. My son is 14 and he has already started to work on watches too, if he wants to and there can be found opportunities I will encourage him to make a profession of it, of course again that depends on what other things he might get interested in.
Must say I can’t agree more, I’m just 37 and obvious equally grumpy... Even if enthusiasts are willing to spend the time and effort training on skill the huge economic investment in quality tools make it hard. The screw example is good, a swiss precision lathe, quality Swiss tap/die set, polishing equipment and so one will easily set you back a few 1000 euros. So that will be an expensive screw if not using the same tools regularly in a business. Thanks again for this channel it’s very interesting to follow 👍🏻
I did the first stem removal of my life. Isn't it awesome? I really like your videos, they are very inspiring. Thank you! I also want to repair watches.
Kalle, I think this is a very important message, but not only for watchmaking. It's for every skill and trade. These days a person watches a youtube video and thinks they're an expert without ever having touched the thing. Just look at automotive repair. Most professional mechanics mostly know how to scan computer codes and replace parts the computer tells them to. If a car engine breaks internally, they either replace the whole engine or scrap the car, when every component inside that engine could be fabricated. Even in my primary field of media production, most "professionals" don't understand how to accurately calibrate colors in their camera because of the same problem - no more apprenticeships. However, I do believe it will turn around, and there will always be people with the interest in doing things properly. If each serious watchmaker would commit as you have to always having an apprentice, I believe the craft and skills could successfully be passed on.
Thanks Karl, its right to be concerned with the future. Its up to the current generation to to invest in the future in terms of providing apprenticeships and training to ensure the craft is not lost to the sales and marketing department.
For myself, as a hobbyist, the difficult bit is affording everything useful or necessary. Fortunately, hand-eye coordination is my thing, though doing new stuff can be nerve-racking.. It actually seems like loads of people are starting off trying to do some repairs, and certain equipment seems quite a bit more prominent and valuable now than it did when I first started, some years ago.. one problem is that some specialist repair tools are no longer made - like tool manufacturers presumably expect repairers to use a specific cutter rather than one of the topping tools. Stuff like currently continued sizes of jewels tells you what you're expected to be repairing, short of making them from scratch. I don't think many of the swiss are concerned much, as long as the cheapest high profits are obtained.
I make high end tobacco pipes for a living and we face a bit of the same issue, but myself and a handful of other skilled carvers have dedicated a portion of our time to freely train new pipe carves. It could easily be a dying art but I am hopeful. One of the last real watch makers in the state of Montana was in my town and he passed away a few months ago. So bummed for his family but I’m selfishly thinking what about all that lost knowledge!
Hi Kalle, I found your video fascinating and very informative. Experienced Watchmakers are as rare as hens teeth. I was fortunate to find a Master Watchmaker ( apparently only about 10 of them in the UK), specialising in vintage watches to service my rare Omega Seamaster. As you intemated, some big brands and also, some 'Watchmakers' / Jewellers, would rather take the easy option by selling or servicing/ repair modern watches and steer away from vitage watches that may require more skill, experience and effort. While trying to find a skilled Watchmaker, I came across a number of them that were on the brink of retirement. Very concerning for the vintage watch owner, who is just trying to get his/her watched serviced or rerepaired. Best wishes and keep up the good work.
One question that always stumped myself and my wife over the years. How do you start an apprenticeship when everyone is only looking for skilled workers? For me it was machinist, her electrical work.
This is the case in many professions. People are not prepared to put in the time it takes to become good at something. Going to school makes you an apprentice and nothing else. Then comes the process of learning the trade. I myself am a happy amateur.... and completely happy with it. (Too old to do anything about it with anyway!) 😀
It's pretty much the same in most trades. I used to be a refrigeration technician, recently changed to building automation. In both there's serious shortages all over the developed and even in some of the developing world. The only positive is that this means secure employment and decent salary for the like of us, as you mention.
Modern economics dictates one repair the watches that cost a lot… you replace parts, or even replace a movement, rather than making screws to fix a Rolex (or Invicta.) It’s got to be worth a watchmaker’s time, and nobody is paying hundreds of dollars an hour to fix grandpas pocket watch or even the cool old Omega you found on eBay. The only way repairs are cost effective is if the watch only needs a cleaning which can be done in a few hours to acceptable standards… or the watch needs repairs but you have inexpensive parts in stock to get that done with a minimum of difficulty and time. When a watch no longer has to be expensive, people are not going to pay hundreds for basic maintenance and thousands for restoration.
The root of the problem you discussed in this video is a lack of schools who can educate and produce future watchmakers. I wanted to do this as my 2nd career, but unwilling to move either out of state or out of the U.S. to gain the education which would be too costly.
Great video, new subscriber here. Your comments make a lot of sense. I have a brother that did fine woodworking, apprenticed for many years and also studied under the late James Krenov. Perhaps you covered this in the live stream, but it seems that access to apprenticeship for many is difficult to find, specifically in repair and restoration. Could you further describe how the next generation will learn and hone skills, taking into account that your generation will be retiring soon. Ty, and I quite enjoyed your video.
From one watchmaker to another, this was very refreshing video! Thank you for taking the time to share your knowledge and thoughts on the current state of watchmaking. From your own personal experience, what would be best way to recruit/entice apprentices into the trade?
I see that either Russuia or Netherlands and I sure all other countries have the same basic problem of loosing high qulity specialists in differenr branches, and it is very pity!
I'm an amateur. Though I have a fair amount of technical knowledge, I do lack skill. I love vintage watches. I have a few that need repairs. I haven't attempted any repairs on my Vintage Swiss and American watches. Instead, I have chosen to develop my Demonstrated Skills by servicing and repairing inexpensive Chinese movements.
Now this is just me I had all the tools do watches like you do. You would be in my will and everything would go to a colleague or student on the condition that is passed down to another colleague or students and never sold. Onto a group of people never to be sold say three or four people one dies off someone will be wrong in something along those lines to think about
Yes many now think since they have watched a video they know how to do something. Knowledge and applied skill are very different things. Nothing against all the videos out there as they can spark interest but that must be followed by real hands on practice and skills development.
I would love to get into watchmaking but when I was really interested it seemed WOSTEP was too pricey for me. Now it’s a bit better as I’m earning more and can find the course but I’m close to 40 and it feels late. Between WOSTEP and BHI in the UK, are there suggestions for good schools?
Please could you give me some advice. I have twisted the arm of a very good clock maker to show me how to use the lathe as I inherited a metal working lathe. My question is, are the skills interchangeable but on a smaller scale? In the video you were talking about screws, if I learn to make a good screw, can I transfer that skill to a watch screw? I am self learning clock and watch making, same excuse I have no money.....I have a wife🤭. But I would like to make this into something I can use to make a living.
All I hear is: we charge too little for our services which makes the profession uninteresting. If there’s money in a profession, there will be people who want to specialize, learn about it and hone their skills. When a certain market has a large shortage of personnel, you can simply wait until people start running toward that profession. Sure there will be cowboys and “prutsers”, but there will also be craftsmen and women.
I really appreciate the craft of watchmaking, and endangered crafts in general. I love how in Japan learning a craft for 10 years, like brewing sake or woodworking, are still practiced (although also dying out). I love to go into watchmaking myself, as it's been a lifelong desire of mine. However, I'm a full-time professional programmer working in the electronics industry, and between my many hobbies I barely even find time to watch your videos. It's still on the top of my list of trades to learn, if I ever find the time for it.
you will craft if people buy it,, if they increase prices people will forget horology...they turn themselves for another things.. you need to show solutions..
Last year I made calls, sent out emails, showed up at places that deal in watches in search of an apprenticeship. I got virtually no where. The only place that might have hired me was an hour away and seemed like the jiffy lube of watch shops. My only other option is to move 4 hours away to one of the few schools in the county.
Soviet educational system was exactly like you describe it now. A lot of theory and no such thing as apprenticeship. The soviet science and skills skyrocketed and surpassed the western at some moment. The reason why the russians have now so advanced weapons which are not present in the West lays in the soviets past. A russian science doctor in biology who emigrated to the West in the 90s told us that his colleagues hated him because his level of knowledge was on professor level and he made them look stupid. I suppose the USSR watchmaking went through the same process and as much as I know soviet watches were quite good (mechanically. Soviets never cared about the final finish :) ) and there are still a lot of soviet watch specialists who never went through such thing as apprenticeship. So don't worry. I think there is a proof that this way works too :)
Interesting time for sure and I bet it’s the same with almost any niche hobby that requires a high level of skill for whoever is working on the item. As for me I’ll stick with relatively affordable watches and hope that in 30 years someone can still service my SW500 Chronograph movement.
Fully understand the big problems of today’s horology there is two categories maker and technician I was in the profession for twelve yrs moved out when the quartz came out this was the coffin in the nail
Are you starting with apprenticeships to give 'youngsters' a change Kalle? There are no real watchmakerschools in the netherlands anymore as far as i know. The one in Hoorn was closed in the 70ties. The transistion from one skill/profession to another takes years. You are right that it could be a lost art/profession.
I think it is pretty much valid for every "craft" and art. All those guitar/violin/bass/drums/sax virtuosos, spend literally YEARS on improving their skills and implementing them on daily play. Same goes for a watchmaker and a surgeon and hairdresser. Practice makes a master. The issue with watchmaking however is that there is less and less people interested in developing such skill, though it can be very profitable. But when the big producers simply decide that their watch models have short "life span" (because they have to produce and sell new ones in order to satisfy THE INVESTORS) it becomes less and less desired skill. Of course it won't die in 10 years, but in 100? Who knows?
This might sound harsh but watches are consumer goods to which 2 year warranty (EU) is applicable. In other regions it's just 1 year. Some brands might give 5 or even 10 year warranty but that's it. Why would they not want to buy you a new watch after a while? I get the economics. Also ppl don't buy a Rolex because they want a watch, they buy it because it's a status symbol (also applies to some Omega and AP etc. models). Watches are obsolete luxury products (I own 20 watches lol).
For me, im more concerned about parts that cannot be made, such as new mainspring or jewels, will those be dried up too? As far as i know Generale Ressort the mainspring maker is not part of Swatch is it?
Oh Kalle if I was 17 again I would have moved he’s an and earth to apprentice to you for 7 years easily. My father directed films and it was what I wanted to do. So I apprenticed for 6 years in production before I was allowed a union card to operate as the lowest grade on a film. That was also restricted for two years. The idea that you can learn a craft of any sort without doing this is a pipe dream. I know plenty of university graduates who have fumed at having to start as an apprentice regardless. The union lost its authority but nonetheless you’ll find all great film makers did the same apprenticeships
Interesting, if a restoration is done the right way, it will increase the value. Make sure you discuss your wishes and expectations with your watchmaker.
While not necessarily perfectly equivalent to having it made on the original machinery, I’m hopeful (possibly very naively) that -at least regarding the availability of spare parts- 3D scanning, AI and 3D printing will help fill in some of the gaps!
I am 75 and the only watch person in 5 counties and now except for a few friends is any mechanical repair done as all I got was whining over prices so I said the hell with it and do batteries
Yes whining about prices is always going to happen. It’s usually people that does not understand how long time it takes to service a watch, let alone if something needed to be repaired! My watchmaker actually typed up an A4 paper where he explains some of the reasons, can’t be longer than an A4 as most people are barely capable of reading more than a few sentences before their eyes glacé over, for the same reasons it’s often useless to explain it orally, specially women just refuse to even try…
I really want to learn, I've watch amazing stuff like people making .9mm balance staff I want to do it myself, but to learn that, or to learn any skill you need access to tools, to sources even to teachers, and even the last two can somewhat be replaced with online resources access to tools is still pretty hard, like how much a lathe would cost? So yeah, and in a country where national coin it's like 2¢ of a dollar it gets more expensive, more difficult to learn.
Here in the States it should be pitched like other trade schools are. How many young people are veen aware of mechanical (especially) watches these days? Perhaps the schools that do exist are to some extent or other to blame for this. Also women with their ability to handle small parts and their patience should be made aware of it. And it can be a good living, especially if you combine it within a retail shop such as a gift store, watch seller, jewelry business, etc. If I were twenty+ years younger. . . . . .
I would love to make a career out of watchmaking - and I have an incredible watchmaker ( S Michlmayr & Co ) only a 2 minute drive from home. But to get a job there or almost anywhere I would need to give up my job move 6 hour drive away for a 3 year course to get my wostep and somehow support a family on no income. Its impossible for people to start watching after they are about 20 years old because theres no actual ways into the business.
I'm 25 now. The skills and knowledge in horology always fascinate me along the journey. Kalle speaks the truth, in modern days the knowledge is more then abundant and skiils never catch up.
I really dream to get invloved in the life style mentioned. Kalle's streams help a lot and make me more determined. I'm quitting the job right now and wanting to start the advanture in watchmaking real soon.
Wish me luck😁
Have a fantastic career, jealous as I am way to old now. Time has passed me by and this was one career I never thought of until the past few years. You go for it
Good Luck Mate.....You won't have a shortage of work.
Good for you and good luck! I started Too late!
@@davidcrandall4958what age did you start at
As a hobbyist I find amazing online resources like yours Kalle and it makes it fun but I’d hate to need to make a living because it’s so in-depth to get it right on every aspect for repair. Parts are hard to find and tools are vast.. so good luck to all of you who want to make a career of this amazingly interesting and inspiring field.
yes seiko dont have parts, we have to pick it up from china, and you cant find all aprts.. for me its enought,, i think I will start to make aprts,, but a spring coil we cant make,, however we can find springs in europe,, the problem is we have to cut them so they can vibrate the correct time, all its a lot of time consuming,, so a watch repair can not be cheap,
and not everybody is avaiable to do pay for it. I think many watches will go to garbage can,, or dissaamble for some aprt and thrown away..
Making a career out of it means ceasing to be a hobbyist and actually going to school/apprenticeship.
I understand your concern and i echo it.
I spent 17 years as a gunsmith ( making screws both SAE and metric) as well as repair. My restorations were almost non existent however my repairs and enhancements were plentiful. All things end so for the last 10 years ive learned horology the same way i learned firearms. Read, study, observe, listen and do.
I am not a watch restorer by any means but i can repair to my satisfaction and that of my limited client base.
My point is that like any other profession there are levels of expertise and finding the correct craftsperson who is competent is more of a task today than ever before.
Just because you can buy the screwdrivers dosent mean you know how to use them are words of wisdom i choose to live by.
Thank you Kalle for sharing your expertise and passion for horology with us as you are truly an inspiring master !
parts are disapearing from market and people interest for watches too..some bitches like seiko dont produce parts... they could hask some parts to orient factory and then sell it.. they behave like usa industryidiots.
Currently in the U.S. watch schools are now turning out “watch technicians” and no longer watch makers. In my humble opinion, this is an attempt by the big brands to create a stream of indentured employees as opposed to individuals who can go out and hang their own shingle. I am a self taught watchmaker with 40 years experience. I grew up extremely poor and have wanted for nothing since entering this profession. You can do this until either you or circumstances determine your end date and you can go into business anywhere in the world. Tell me another industry aside from the “oldest profession” that you can do this. Not to mention that watchmaking doesn’t come with the hazards of the aforementioned! Great video. Thank you.
I came in here expecting discouragement. I ended up very much encouraged. Thanks for your wisdom!
market work in other way, you amke stupid prices for "garbage" or old stuff p+eople will not buy it,, thast how market work.
you take 30 to fix my watch i want it, you take 300, i pass, throw it away keep it in a box or jsut sell for cheap.--
@@anteneupitratrue!
I'm brand new to the profession. I appreciate your input. The world of horology is changing quickly. Love your videos. Learning a lot!❤❤
I think you are right Kalle. I study at the national danish watchmaking school, spent about 10 hours a day doing that, and then another 4 hours when i get home. Becourse watchmaking is craftmansship, and like all other craftmansship it take millions of hours to be good at it.
I have been a carpender for 25 years and I´m stil not a master at that craft. I as a person learn by doing, it seems to be the best way of doing it. So i just keep going.
Love your channel, and keep going champ..
there is no restauration for dials so after a while peopel send it to the garbage can,, watchmakers forget about this..unless someone near you do it well and affordable..
What a very interesting and encouraging video. I say encouraging because it’s constructive criticism. I pray that you will be heard by those that need to hear you.
Sorry I missed the live stream. It's all very true. I left it too late and only started after I retired. At 73, I enjoy the small set of skills I have but should have started sooner! Thanks for the offer Kalle, but I think your courses are now beyond me. My suggestion is if you can, commit and enjoy. Success to all who can achieve it. Best of luck to all Chronoglide Streamers...
I work with my dad in a watch shop, where we repair quite a few watches daily. My dad isn't formally trained, and as much as i wish i could attend the watchmaking courses, most of them are far too expensive, especially when you add in lodging and livelihood when moving to another country to study.
Im sure there are many others that have attended watchmaking schools, and though i agree with Kalle, money still runs the world. Perhaps someone might be able to give their experience on how they funded their watchmaking courses/careers to help struggling people such as myself move in the right direction? Cheers!
I'm a 40 year old software engineer attempting to self train, would love to go to night-school, or even do online(I can afford to buy whatever), but it just doesn't exist. I can't even find a self-learning syllabus of things to work on and what order.
Interestingly enough, this video strengthens an idea I've had in taking community college metal lathe courses at night.
@@joemaniaciMarshall from @WristwatchRevival sometimes mentions the course he took. I believe it was online videos, but I don’t quite remember off the top of my head.
@@joemaniaci Where are you?
BHI is very affordable (british horological institute)
you can do it remotely (maybe have to do a few exams in uk though)
I'm 57 and as a watchmaker hobbyist, as corny as it sounds, I reminisce about what it was like in the 1950's when someone brought in a Rolex submariner for their two year service. At the time in many towns, you could find any watchmaker in any big city or even small town. Not so today of course. I'm in Illinois and Most are in or near Chicago today. Have an old mechanical you found and want it serviced but live in say Pontiac, IL? You are either making a long drive north or shipping it. When my father passed away in 2011, I came across a few old phone books from the early 70's and was shocked at how many watch repair shops were listed even in the small town I grew up in that are long gone. The Quarts revolution had much to do with that. Today, because of brands like Rolex's policy towards small independents, if a small town watch repair does exists, they will not take a Rolex in for service. interestingly, since social media helped mechanical watches become a cool collectable thing again against the grain of the trow away electronic apple watch age around 2015, I've actually seen a few independents popping up. Just wonder how long this will all last.
Not long, I’m afraid. All the major watch brands have clubbed together and are restricting before wholly suppressing the availability of replacement parts to their own accredited repairers who charge premium prices. My watchmaker (in the UK) has retired early for that reason. I fear for the future of watch collecting, only the wealthy will be able to join.
Independent is not allowed to purchase spares for certains swiss makes which is ruining their business and of courae $100 watch what needa $200 repair will be abandoned
I recall up until the 1980s most watch dealers / jewellers had a watchmaker on site. By the late 80s most had disappeared.
I have been studying watch repair for 6 months and have learned a lot online. Thank you for your useful shares. I hope one day to meet you in person
Maximum respect for a great professional watchmaker. I hope one day to reach your level. Greetings from Germany!!!
I can understand the sentiment. I have always been fascinated with horology as a whole, but never had the means until now. I just had my 50th birthday, and I am finally diving into watchmaking. I truly wish that I could have done it 25 years ago!
A good watchmaker is hard to find. It sounds like your shop is top tier. Thank you & good job.
Love the videos! I started tinkering with watches last year after trying to find someone to service my 10 year old Invicta and put a new battery in it. After talking to several people that said just throw it out and buy a new one they are cheap. I started my higher education as an engineer so I thought OK lets watch some videos and learn how to do it. Well after A LOT of videos and learning I did it with some cheap tools. I loved it so much I am now in debt to the hobby several thousand dollars. Looks like the next purchase will be a lathe as soon as i can find a good deal on ebay. After that I am looking hard at the British Horological distance learning course. I am currently 43 and have 8 more years as a Paramedic until I can take my retirement. Plan is to take the next 8 years perfecting my skill and learning everything i can absorb before attempting it as an after retirement profession. I would love to see the assembly and lubrication along with your thoughts on the correct lubrication for different movements and theory behind it.
You have to admit you have a beautiful shop and the attitude and perspective to create a quality restoration workshop. You have the old craftsman mindset. Something I find dig\fficult to find in America.
Thank you for mentioning seven year Apprenticeship and Ten to fifteen years training!
This s a great video and so full of truth. It's not only watchmaking. We live in an impatient, quick fix society. We need to invest in the next generation and pass on these decades of specialist skills and teach the current generation an alternative to instant results. They're so used to the immediate access of information and facts, and of course the instantaneous shopping for new, rather than repairing the old. Hopefully this video will inspire some people to apply for apprentiships
I have a cart of tools from Esslinger and e bay locked and loaded. I have been following you and have started another course and have learned Sooo much. I hope to one day make a living in this hobby. My biggest worry is the parts embargo honestly. It’s tough at my age with bills and responsibilities to start an apprenticeship but it’s not impossible. I live in Upstate Newyork, not exactly a whatch making Mecca but I know that this is what I want do with my life. I’m sick of spending my days doing something I hate. I hope I’m not being foolish or dreamy but either way I’m giving it a shot
Possibly diversify your skills too with adding gemology , jeweler skills.
Excellent best wishes and dreams for your new dreams.
The best motivation! The best of luck, hang in there and you'll have a bright future for sure!
Let’s look at the glass half full. The fewer who can, the rarer the skills, the greater value. The future is looking excellent. 😊
That's not a positive scenario for the hobby.
As a watch collector I more than understand what you mean! Just to be able to find the proper watch smith for certain jobs is crazily hard. Recently had to have a 8 day power reserve airplane watch, after a lengthy search which gave perfect results. The broken part was due to: when setting time & pushing back the crown in, one has to fiddle a bit for parts to mesh properly, if not you break parts, now this was common knowledge back then (1950-1980) but just knowing the mesh part has been forgotten. We can easily imagine the complexity of certain chronographs (ex.: eta 7750) with quick day/date fonction being forgotten etc. Your watchsmiths are your allies in this crazy complex puzzle 👍❤️👌
if prices are reaseobable other wise people wills ell the daamged "garbage" and will forget horoly.
What an experience it's been so far. Having a history in a wide variety of mechanical skills, going from motorsports to machineshops over welding, forging and what not. Watchmaking is a different game all together. Nothing is new but the way to handle and controle familiar procedures on a microscopic level puts you back on your feet. 4 years in I realise the learning zone is never ending. Kalle is right, if you are willing and able, dive into watchmaking. every little achievement in new skills will be a reward. Nobody said it's easy, but it's not impossible. Keep motivating yourself. become part of the watchmakers community.
I have been teaching myself watch making the last two years built up, Lorch schmidt lathe with new base dividing head milling head , gear cutting tool , also made my own cutting tools for the lathe work, sticking to the 1700th and 1800th watch movements as for me the craftsmanship from them dates and the limited tools- light they is unreal, have brought a few pieces , have made balance staff with the pivot ends 0.11 mm. I have just finished making a verge pallet staff for a 1710 movement, been to the area where they made the fusee chains managed to find and meet a contact at a museum and view and handle all original tooling for making the fusee chains, I said has anyone requested to look at this stuff, he said "no one since the last person that used it back in 1950", have all photos of the tooling... the reason I do this ........because it's a wonderful journey, being able to keep these pieces going, from these masters mentally and physically, it's a joy 😊
Watchmaker shouts at cloud! Respect brother it’s a bleak future with lack of good watchmakers
Thank you, sir for this fascinating and engaging presentation. I wish you and your colleagues great success. Greetings from Chile 🇨🇱.
In school you learn theory, a lot of theory but there's only a form to do excellence in a work, years of hard work. I agree with you Kalle
Helemaal mee eens. Helaas. En dit geldt voor zoveel vakken
Thanks for this vid.
Great talk 🙂 this adds to the magic of watches for me. You make sure you restore an old watch just the way it was made originally and I, the wearer wont ever see that part under the microscope. But both me and you know it matters. I am currently reading G. Daniels book and it is facinating.
So very true, but also for many professions. For me it's a hobby, where I always can improve my skills and kowledge. That makes the craft so long term challanging, and for me so fascinatig. There is always something deeper to learn. I'm so glad that AI will not be able to fix a watch, even in the farest future. There will be always the balance of skill, knowledge and heart needed! And the ones who love the theme will always find satisfaction aut of the work.
Thanks for sharing!
Well said!
I can appreciate a good rant. So, I could not agree more. That said RUclips is a knife that cuts both ways. for those who seek information and then apply it with their fingers it is an asset. However RUclips is also a magic trick that lets you think you know how to do something as long as you are not confronted with the inconvenience of heaving to do it.
craft can not be learned by watching, it can only be accomplished by doing. Ironicly watching is the first step. Hats off to you for trying to thread the needle.
Grazie per questa lezione.
Inspirational. All the best
So I'm a computer programmer, I've been a gunsmith hobbiest, pistol instructor, lock Picker and many other hobbies that are quite technical around repair and understanding how things work.
I've wanted to get into hobby watch repair and restoration for a while. I've bought quite a few watches and I'm now investing in the materials.
I think that there are more people getting into this but I really wish I could take the time to learn through an apprenticeship.
Information is at our fingertips through they Internet and RUclips but i think you make a great point that they old way of leaning by immersion, dripping knowledge and apprenticeship is not as common.
A comment from England. This vid puts the watchmakers' side of the story, and Kalle is obviously correct. There is also the other side of the story - that of the watch owners.
I recently had occasion to have two watches serviced. The first was/is a 2001 Explorer 2. It is worth about £9/10,000 for which I paid £1,400 in new condition in 2002. I paid £560 to a top-rated watchmaking company for the service (about 50% less than servicing at Rolex). The watch now appears to be new, and is running beautifully, seemingly to the second. That expenditure was logical in relationship to the value.
The second watch I've had from new in 1973, a Seiko Jumbo chronograph. Its value is about £150. The (more local) quote for servicing was £250 plus parts, so with a much-needed new crystal probably £300. I didn't bother, and just put the watch back in the cabinet.
Millions of good but inexpensive mechanical watches are now being sold. The soon-to-come reality is that servicing costs will far outweigh the residual value of many of those lower-end watches, and they will be relegated to dusty drawers. It will be cheaper to buy new than service. For many, it will be cheaper to swap-out the stock (ETA, Selita?) movement than to repair. This reality doesn't seem to dawn on the buyers of Chinese clones that will cost more to service than their original price.
In-between will fall better-end but non-prestige watches from the likes of Longines, but there will come a time, even for those pieces, when hourly skilled labour rates exceed what is sensible expenditure on watches with marginal residual value.
Buyers and the trade must think in the longer term.
I'm also in the UK, and it's about getting a bit creative with it. I have an Orient Esteem I brought new in 2018 I've just had serviced, which uses a very basic Orient/Epsom calibre. I had it serviced in China for £14 for the service and £9 for a crystal replacement and upgrade to sapphire crystal. I didn't need to post it as I had someone out there, but postage would be around £10 each way, so its still very very cheap. Similarly, some guy in Moldova offered to do the service for £50.
The reality of a cheap chinese clones being cheaper to replace than to service absolutely does occur to buyers. In many cases, the build quality of the rest of the watch is so good that, for me, having a good, reliable movement I can replace myself is a selling point. But nobody is fooling themselves that a $200 San Martin is an investment.
I'd rather have a good quality, decent looking, running watch than to hunt for someone at whom to throw gobs of cash because he has the skills to oil my investment.
@@marcustulliuscicero9140 Serviced in China? If ever a statement sent shivers down my spine it's that one.
Your comment is somehow blurred. From the beginning, you have to know this. If you buy or get a watch from heart, money doesn't matter. Really don't! If you buy like many of Brit watch investors, you just put the watch in the safe and wait for better times to make a profit. The egoistic way to buy watches and take away a good watch from a potential watch enthusiast. I have a Seiko 5 which I wore 17 years all my childhood . Now if it comes to service I ask how much and get goin' no problem the price . It is an emotional thing. If you don't understand this then you are in the wrong league, my friend.
Thanks Kalle, a fascinating opinion of the future of the craft. Some very good points made and noted. It's reassuring to hear, what I thought was actually a positive outlook. We're with you all the way Kalle!
dont see future,, as everything agiots are trying to rise the pries of everyuthing so,, people will leave horology.
I think there are a few issues, mostly caused by the Swiss watch companies. They want watchmakers to just repair by replacing. The watchmaker schools have pandered to that. Restrictions on parts to independent watchmakers. The profession of watchmaking has been dumbed down deliberately by the industry itself, I.e. the manufacturers. The future of watchmaking is as much the hobbyist as the independent, the independent will not be able to compete long term.
The addition to that is they are wanting to do it in-house, only so many watchmakers in Switzerland. That’s why the service/repair times are so high now, no independent to take up the slack.
Is it the same for Japanese and US companies? How might that look for those who service only these types?
@@tylerfukuda Excluding something like a Grand Seiko, anything from Orient or Seiko will normally have an off the shelf version parts can be stripped from
I Agree but I don't think Internet trained non professionals are the answer!
It's same with nearly every technical stuff, no repairs just replace
bedankt kalle en je hebt een punt ik ga een schroefje maken en probeer dit op de oude manier te doen grote schroeven lukte me altijd al wel maar zo klein ik ga het proberen ik zie wel waar ik strand .... ik ben gek op deze uitdagingen
That is very sad. And. True. Thank you so much for sharing this with us.
There is good and there is bad with this. The amount of information is there and yes, the difference in quality of that information is huge. Still I feel that the interest for watches and watchmaking is still on the up, so many people will now try to repair a watch, probably many more than was the case just two decades ago. Myself I took a watch apart for the first time about ten years ago. Now I am confident enough to service a movement, well unless it’s a complicated one. Of course to repair something is completely different, I have successfully repaired a couple of hairsprings, again I have destroyed many more! The amount of tools I have accumulated is quit overwhelming. My intention is to keep going to learn more and more, but to get to the point that I can replace a jewel, to make any kind of parts well that is something I will never do. I am 57 and I do this as a hobby. My son is 14 and he has already started to work on watches too, if he wants to and there can be found opportunities I will encourage him to make a profession of it, of course again that depends on what other things he might get interested in.
Spot on Kalle 👏
Interesting and recognizable insight.
Interesting video. Thanks for sharing your thoughts. M
Must say I can’t agree more, I’m just 37 and obvious equally grumpy... Even if enthusiasts are willing to spend the time and effort training on skill the huge economic investment in quality tools make it hard. The screw example is good, a swiss precision lathe, quality Swiss tap/die set, polishing equipment and so one will easily set you back a few 1000 euros. So that will be an expensive screw if not using the same tools regularly in a business. Thanks again for this channel it’s very interesting to follow 👍🏻
I did the first stem removal of my life. Isn't it awesome? I really like your videos, they are very inspiring. Thank you! I also want to repair watches.
Nobody is born a watchmaker, you took the first step, how cool is that!! 👏👏🥳
Kudos for the thoughtful insight.
Brilliant 16 minutes horology is a dying art howsoever class is class
Kalle, I think this is a very important message, but not only for watchmaking. It's for every skill and trade. These days a person watches a youtube video and thinks they're an expert without ever having touched the thing. Just look at automotive repair. Most professional mechanics mostly know how to scan computer codes and replace parts the computer tells them to. If a car engine breaks internally, they either replace the whole engine or scrap the car, when every component inside that engine could be fabricated. Even in my primary field of media production, most "professionals" don't understand how to accurately calibrate colors in their camera because of the same problem - no more apprenticeships. However, I do believe it will turn around, and there will always be people with the interest in doing things properly. If each serious watchmaker would commit as you have to always having an apprentice, I believe the craft and skills could successfully be passed on.
Hope you can continue to attract young talent into your field.
Thanks Karl, its right to be concerned with the future. Its up to the current generation to to invest in the future in terms of providing apprenticeships and training to ensure the craft is not lost to the sales and marketing department.
For myself, as a hobbyist, the difficult bit is affording everything useful or necessary. Fortunately, hand-eye coordination is my thing, though doing new stuff can be nerve-racking..
It actually seems like loads of people are starting off trying to do some repairs, and certain equipment seems quite a bit more prominent and valuable now than it did when I first started, some years ago.. one problem is that some specialist repair tools are no longer made - like tool manufacturers presumably expect repairers to use a specific cutter rather than one of the topping tools. Stuff like currently continued sizes of jewels tells you what you're expected to be repairing, short of making them from scratch.
I don't think many of the swiss are concerned much, as long as the cheapest high profits are obtained.
Thanks Kalle, good relevant rant! It needs to be heard by the 20-30 year olds.
Greetings from Hamburg Lohbrügge. Impressive fact indeed!
I make high end tobacco pipes for a living and we face a bit of the same issue, but myself and a handful of other skilled carvers have dedicated a portion of our time to freely train new pipe carves. It could easily be a dying art but I am hopeful. One of the last real watch makers in the state of Montana was in my town and he passed away a few months ago. So bummed for his family but I’m selfishly thinking what about all that lost knowledge!
Hi Kalle,
I found your video fascinating and very informative. Experienced Watchmakers are as rare as hens teeth. I was fortunate to find a Master Watchmaker ( apparently only about 10 of them in the UK), specialising in vintage watches to service my rare Omega Seamaster. As you intemated, some big brands and also, some 'Watchmakers' / Jewellers, would rather take the easy option by selling or servicing/ repair modern watches and steer away from vitage watches that may require more skill, experience and effort. While trying to find a skilled Watchmaker, I came across a number of them that were on the brink of retirement. Very concerning for the vintage watch owner, who is just trying to get his/her watched serviced or rerepaired.
Best wishes and keep up the good work.
One question that always stumped myself and my wife over the years. How do you start an apprenticeship when everyone is only looking for skilled workers? For me it was machinist, her electrical work.
This is the case in many professions. People are not prepared to put in the time it takes to become good at something. Going to school makes you an apprentice and nothing else. Then comes the process of learning the trade. I myself am a happy amateur.... and completely happy with it. (Too old to do anything about it with anyway!) 😀
It's pretty much the same in most trades. I used to be a refrigeration technician, recently changed to building automation. In both there's serious shortages all over the developed and even in some of the developing world. The only positive is that this means secure employment and decent salary for the like of us, as you mention.
Well said Kalle!
Modern economics dictates one repair the watches that cost a lot… you replace parts, or even replace a movement, rather than making screws to fix a Rolex (or Invicta.) It’s got to be worth a watchmaker’s time, and nobody is paying hundreds of dollars an hour to fix grandpas pocket watch or even the cool old Omega you found on eBay. The only way repairs are cost effective is if the watch only needs a cleaning which can be done in a few hours to acceptable standards… or the watch needs repairs but you have inexpensive parts in stock to get that done with a minimum of difficulty and time.
When a watch no longer has to be expensive, people are not going to pay hundreds for basic maintenance and thousands for restoration.
The root of the problem you discussed in this video is a lack of schools who can educate and produce future watchmakers. I wanted to do this as my 2nd career, but unwilling to move either out of state or out of the U.S. to gain the education which would be too costly.
The machinery and tool floor and ceiling is so elevated, if the costs were more achievable it would very beneficial.
I’d love to one day be skilled at this. Time, effort, and coins are needed 😅
Great video, new subscriber here. Your comments make a lot of sense. I have a brother that did fine woodworking, apprenticed for many years and also studied under the late James Krenov. Perhaps you covered this in the live stream, but it seems that access to apprenticeship for many is difficult to find, specifically in repair and restoration. Could you further describe how the next generation will learn and hone skills, taking into account that your generation will be retiring soon. Ty, and I quite enjoyed your video.
As a retired service engineer for large companies service and repairs were a necessary evil and not where the money is. Sales are what counts.
From one watchmaker to another, this was very refreshing video! Thank you for taking the time to share your knowledge and thoughts on the current state of watchmaking. From your own personal experience, what would be best way to recruit/entice apprentices into the trade?
you know things are getting wortst and worst many people dont spend more money on it cause aprts are stupidily expensive
Excellent content love it ❤
I see that either Russuia or Netherlands and I sure all other countries have the same basic problem of loosing high qulity specialists in differenr branches, and it is very pity!
I'm an amateur. Though I have a fair amount of technical knowledge, I do lack skill. I love vintage watches. I have a few that need repairs. I haven't attempted any repairs on my Vintage Swiss and American watches. Instead, I have chosen to develop my Demonstrated Skills by servicing and repairing inexpensive Chinese movements.
Now this is just me I had all the tools do watches like you do. You would be in my will and everything would go to a colleague or student on the condition that is passed down to another colleague or students and never sold. Onto a group of people never to be sold say three or four people one dies off someone will be wrong in something along those lines to think about
Yogi Berra said it best. "The future ain't what it used to be".
I'm curious. Where did you work/apprentice before starting your workshop?
Yes many now think since they have watched a video they know how to do something. Knowledge and applied skill are very different things. Nothing against all the videos out there as they can spark interest but that must be followed by real hands on practice and skills development.
I would love to get into watchmaking but when I was really interested it seemed WOSTEP was too pricey for me. Now it’s a bit better as I’m earning more and can find the course but I’m close to 40 and it feels late.
Between WOSTEP and BHI in the UK, are there suggestions for good schools?
It's not too late! I didn't get serious about watchmaking until my late 30's and I believe it's the same for Kalle 😁
Every skilled trade/craft has this issue.
Kalle, do yo offer presencial classes for watch restoring?
ik wil het graag leren. horloges zijn fascinerend.
Please could you give me some advice. I have twisted the arm of a very good clock maker to show me how to use the lathe as I inherited a metal working lathe. My question is, are the skills interchangeable but on a smaller scale?
In the video you were talking about screws, if I learn to make a good screw, can I transfer that skill to a watch screw?
I am self learning clock and watch making, same excuse I have no money.....I have a wife🤭. But I would like to make this into something I can use to make a living.
All I hear is: we charge too little for our services which makes the profession uninteresting.
If there’s money in a profession, there will be people who want to specialize, learn about it and hone their skills.
When a certain market has a large shortage of personnel, you can simply wait until people start running toward that profession. Sure there will be cowboys and “prutsers”, but there will also be craftsmen and women.
I really appreciate the craft of watchmaking, and endangered crafts in general. I love how in Japan learning a craft for 10 years, like brewing sake or woodworking, are still practiced (although also dying out).
I love to go into watchmaking myself, as it's been a lifelong desire of mine. However, I'm a full-time professional programmer working in the electronics industry, and between my many hobbies I barely even find time to watch your videos. It's still on the top of my list of trades to learn, if I ever find the time for it.
you will craft if people buy it,, if they increase prices people will forget horology...they turn themselves for another things.. you need to show solutions..
Do you have apprentices in your workshop?
Last year I made calls, sent out emails, showed up at places that deal in watches in search of an apprenticeship. I got virtually no where. The only place that might have hired me was an hour away and seemed like the jiffy lube of watch shops. My only other option is to move 4 hours away to one of the few schools in the county.
Move man, move.
Soviet educational system was exactly like you describe it now. A lot of theory and no such thing as apprenticeship. The soviet science and skills skyrocketed and surpassed the western at some moment. The reason why the russians have now so advanced weapons which are not present in the West lays in the soviets past. A russian science doctor in biology who emigrated to the West in the 90s told us that his colleagues hated him because his level of knowledge was on professor level and he made them look stupid. I suppose the USSR watchmaking went through the same process and as much as I know soviet watches were quite good (mechanically. Soviets never cared about the final finish :) ) and there are still a lot of soviet watch specialists who never went through such thing as apprenticeship. So don't worry. I think there is a proof that this way works too :)
Message received!
Interesting time for sure and I bet it’s the same with almost any niche hobby that requires a high level of skill for whoever is working on the item. As for me I’ll stick with relatively affordable watches and hope that in 30 years someone can still service my SW500 Chronograph movement.
Fully understand the big problems of today’s horology there is two categories maker and technician I was in the profession for twelve yrs moved out when the quartz came out this was the coffin in the nail
Are you starting with apprenticeships to give 'youngsters' a change Kalle? There are no real watchmakerschools in the netherlands anymore as far as i know. The one in Hoorn was closed in the 70ties. The transistion from one skill/profession to another takes years. You are right that it could be a lost art/profession.
Nice rant..
I just got my first two books to start with. Any recommendations for fixing mins +\- loss or fast?
Hope this is helpful: Timing and Adjustment mechanical watch movement - Running fast or slow
ruclips.net/video/CJxS-gJCcuE/видео.html
I think it is pretty much valid for every "craft" and art. All those guitar/violin/bass/drums/sax virtuosos, spend literally YEARS on improving their skills and implementing them on daily play. Same goes for a watchmaker and a surgeon and hairdresser. Practice makes a master. The issue with watchmaking however is that there is less and less people interested in developing such skill, though it can be very profitable. But when the big producers simply decide that their watch models have short "life span" (because they have to produce and sell new ones in order to satisfy THE INVESTORS) it becomes less and less desired skill. Of course it won't die in 10 years, but in 100? Who knows?
This might sound harsh but watches are consumer goods to which 2 year warranty (EU) is applicable. In other regions it's just 1 year. Some brands might give 5 or even 10 year warranty but that's it. Why would they not want to buy you a new watch after a while? I get the economics. Also ppl don't buy a Rolex because they want a watch, they buy it because it's a status symbol (also applies to some Omega and AP etc. models). Watches are obsolete luxury products (I own 20 watches lol).
For me, im more concerned about parts that cannot be made, such as new mainspring or jewels, will those be dried up too? As far as i know Generale Ressort the mainspring maker is not part of Swatch is it?
Oh Kalle if I was 17 again I would have moved he’s an and earth to apprentice to you for 7 years easily. My father directed films and it was what I wanted to do. So I apprenticed for 6 years in production before I was allowed a union card to operate as the lowest grade on a film. That was also restricted for two years. The idea that you can learn a craft of any sort without doing this is a pipe dream. I know plenty of university graduates who have fumed at having to start as an apprentice regardless. The union lost its authority but nonetheless you’ll find all great film makers did the same apprenticeships
I just bought a Zodiac Triple date moon phase and thinking of having it restored but told the value will be cut in half.
What do you recommend ?
Interesting, if a restoration is done the right way, it will increase the value. Make sure you discuss your wishes and expectations with your watchmaker.
While not necessarily perfectly equivalent to having it made on the original machinery, I’m hopeful (possibly very naively) that -at least regarding the availability of spare parts- 3D scanning, AI and 3D printing will help fill in some of the gaps!
I am 75 and the only watch person in 5 counties and now except for a few friends is any mechanical repair done as all I got was whining over prices so I said the hell with it and do batteries
Yes whining about prices is always going to happen. It’s usually people that does not understand how long time it takes to service a watch, let alone if something needed to be repaired! My watchmaker actually typed up an A4 paper where he explains some of the reasons, can’t be longer than an A4 as most people are barely capable of reading more than a few sentences before their eyes glacé over, for the same reasons it’s often useless to explain it orally, specially women just refuse to even try…
I really want to learn, I've watch amazing stuff like people making .9mm balance staff I want to do it myself, but to learn that, or to learn any skill you need access to tools, to sources even to teachers, and even the last two can somewhat be replaced with online resources access to tools is still pretty hard, like how much a lathe would cost?
So yeah, and in a country where national coin it's like 2¢ of a dollar it gets more expensive, more difficult to learn.
Craftsmanship is a legitimate word by the way.
Here in the States it should be pitched like other trade schools are. How many young people are veen aware of mechanical (especially) watches these days? Perhaps the schools that do exist are to some extent or other to blame for this. Also women with their ability to handle small parts and their patience should be made aware of it. And it can be a good living, especially if you combine it within a retail shop such as a gift store, watch seller, jewelry business, etc. If I were twenty+ years younger. . . . . .
I would love to make a career out of watchmaking - and I have an incredible watchmaker ( S Michlmayr & Co ) only a 2 minute drive from home. But to get a job there or almost anywhere I would need to give up my job move 6 hour drive away for a 3 year course to get my wostep and somehow support a family on no income. Its impossible for people to start watching after they are about 20 years old because theres no actual ways into the business.