I love the quick mention that Trazyn misses Orikan since ”dropping that mountain on him” It really helps us put the Infinite and the Divine on a timeline since this is between the last two visits to that planet. He also compares Cawl to Orikan which works amazing as a compliment to Cawl AND a massive insult to Orikan
The funny thing is, while reading their scenes, I couldn't help but think "Orikan would have figured this out already" Cadia got the wrong half of that duo. I don't think Trazyn or even most Necrons really get just how smart Orikan actually is. His utter lack of chill and people skills are basically the only things stopping him from taking over the Galaxy.
Can't believe no one mentiones how when anyone shouts in the audiobook, it sounds like theyre severely constipated! Also great to have Eric and Jenny back!
@thepoorhammerpodcast don't do my Boi like that Legit one of my favorite lines in dark imperium " 6 thousand years, 6 thousand years" as he just loses it Also he has the best tattoo
There's a Space Marine Heraldry artbook that has a page titled "Rocks are not free, citizen!" It did a cost breakdown of accelerating a rock from a local asteroid belt to the planet, versus the standard kinetic strike missile. It mostly showed that you'd lose money consuming the fuel required versus the manufacturing cost of a single missile.
Interesting but you could also say the cost of the missile's fuel is equal to or greater than the RKM(relativistic kill missile) would be, to perform the same level of damage. It honestly would have been better to say that most asteroids are a loose conglomerate of sand and tiny rocks than a single large item. Which is to the best of my knowledge proven to be true thus far. Hence you couldn't use it as an RKM.
@@8-7-styx94 ffinding an asteroid that is mission suitable is listed as one of the costs. Its several months of fuel and food for a ship to scout one out.
IIRC, the "cost" was because of how long it took to find a suitable space rock, push it towards the planet, and wait for it to make contact. They couldn't just leave without confirming the kill, and the cost of keeping the ship (fleet?) active in the field for a few extra days was more than they saved on bombs/missiles/etc. Part of this is also because 40k has FTL travel- a warship can just FTL into bombing range, while a space rock needs to slug it over in realspace.
I thought the whole Black Templar thing was hilarious and demonstrates why the Imperium is so dysfunctional. You have one of the strongest individual military forces in the galaxy, the Black Templars, and they are next to useless in one of the most important (if not THE most important) battles in the history of the Imperium because they are too proud to accept that they made a mistake and take their medieval style code of honor too seriously. See also the Dark Angels. To me that’s a great example of the blend of fantasy and sci fi that is 40K. It’s actually something a reflection of real life: in WW2 one of the biggest challenges Eisenhower faced as being supreme commander of the Allied forces were all the prima donna generals that were constantly pulling at the leash to go off and do their own thing. It’s also ironic that Chaos was a much more united military force than the Imperium which, I’m sure, was 100% intentional.
It's very much in keeping with the intended, Rogue Trader era satire the Imperium was designed to reflect. It's a huge, ponderous, fascist regime, whose own failings are slowly killing it. The Black Templars exist to demonstrate the folly of this kind of reckless hate and pride. Problem being, this satire exists, both in general and in this book, in stark contrast with the more standard "Heroes vs Villains" narrative that 40K is perpetually stuck in. In a story where the Imperials are the sympathetic party and their enemies unambiguously bad, having a bunch of huge dorks LARPing crusaders and acting irrationally seems out of place. The Cadians are trying to play this all straight, as a serious war story. And then over here, the Black Templars are the only ones who understood the original assignment. That they stand out so much is more an indictment of the state of 40K than an indictment on how they're written.
@@Bluecho4 Yeah the problem with all autocracies (and fascism sure counts for that) is that the smart people who see flaws with the system tend to get killed. It's one of the main reasons they don't last that long compared to democracies and constitutional monarchies.
Except the imperium isn't an autocracy it's an odd mix theocracy, oligarchy, and feudalism that pays lip service to being an autocracy. And aside from that democracies and constitutional monarchies, while I'd argue more just, are not in fact, more stable than many forms of authoritarianism. They also have a tendency to devolve (into oligarchy for example) and be riven by social strife. The imperium's issues stem far more from ignorance, ideological zealotry, and the tyranny of distance than it's government which is, in large part, a product of those flaws, not the cause.
Listening to you all say "car-skin" over and over is giving me an ulcer. Ka-sir-kin. Ka like cat. Sir like yes sir. Kin like we's kin! Unless I'm just missing something because you said it right later.
I think he knew the correct pronunciation the whole time, he just likes making fun of stuff he doesn't like by intentionally mispronouncing them, see "T-Glottal stop-Au"
Eric, if you want like, horrors of war stuff in 40k, I cannot recommend 15 Hours highly enough. It's guard versus orks and it does that mentality so well!
The Black Templar chapters were comic relief interludes, I swear. We jump all around the planet hearing from all the different sides in a massive bloody war... and then cut to the Black Templars, defending a rock. It MUST have been intentional. It MUST.
Because every other chapter is limited to a thousand dudes You can't just start killing off ultramarine squads without actually killing established characters, but you can throw in some black Templars because they have extra unnamed divisions
this might sound a little cursed, but for some insane reason I thought the way the Creed voice is done sounded almost exactly like if Robin Williams was doing an irish accent. it made me picture Creed being played by him in my head and it definitely made the more dramatic scenes a little more goofy for me lol
If anyone let this book down it was the production team not giving enough resources to the story. Author, narrator, editor all I'm sure did their best, but if this was going to be such a big event in 40k it would have been better to give it more time/money/etc. Thanks for the book club episodes! love them.
I think it was a problem specifically because of how it's a big event. Its been around for years but no book, so they just wanted to just get it out since it's overdue imo
The thing that made me initially think "Oh no" about the narration was the first time he narrated shouting. I feel like he was told not to yell into the microphone and got overly cautious. When I listened to Flight of the Eisenstein, I felt like the narrator was full-on bellowing "Count the seven!" every time. "Twenty-four! In the war!", by contrast, sounded like the squad was being collectively strangled.
Wait, are the Cadian voices seriously geordies? I'm having way too much fun thinking of a planet full of geordies. If the emperor has a football club we're fucked. Cadian geordie ultras.
@@BEEFBEEFBEEFIFY To be fair, most Orks are essentially depicted as being something akin to space Yorkshiremen. I'd be entirely unsurprised if that's just Nottingham's idea of "we need gruff folk for this".
As someone who read the book in one week and did so with the ebook, here are my thoughts. I am terrible with names. I also wanted them to be allowed to say Fuck. I thought the guy who wanted to bayonet Abbadon was great. I also love the guardswoman who went after Abbadon with a shotgun. This book made me go from "black templars are meh" to "fuck those guys, they're the worst". They were so annoying. The main thing that stood out to me was how seamless the inclusion was. Women just existed. They were important for their actions.
The most entertaining scene by far for me was the early general staff meeting with Creed trying to get all these fucking weirdos he doesn't have actual authority over to participate in a cohesive defense plan. The crazy gun nuns refuse to do anything but guard their churches, the derp edgy dark angels refuse to do anything but guard their ship and precious secrets, the admech refuse to do anything but guard techno secrets they don't understand, and the space wolf decides to do a suicide run and takes a full regiment of guardsmen to do so because they might help for 2 minutes before dying horribly. Great showcase of how dysfunctional the imperium is and how out of his depth Creed was as a theater-level commander as opposed to a tactical one. Conversly, for me the worst moment by far was in the climax when Abaddon is just slowly walking toward a whole platoon of cadians and they're all shooting him so fast with a hundred guns and you can't even see Abaddon behind all the lasers and his armor is glowing red hot and there's so much ionising of the air that dudes stop being able to breath and then he just kills them all. I had conversations with my friends at the elementary school playground about how 'no my guy is so cool and awesome a hundred tanks could all line up and shoot him and he'd be fine'. Everyone has a personal line of when dumb 40k stuff is cool and when it's just stupid, and boy was that way on the wrong end of it for me.
Jen isn't THAT bad on 1.5x speed. Though I definitely laughed when you brought up people listening to the podcast at high speed ("hey, they're talking about me!")
Loved this episode. The book clubs are amazing to listen too. I got back in to this hobby three months ago, and listen to all your guys podcasts while painting. Your podcast was honestly a primary source of happiness and enjoying the hobby while being abroad for 5 months. If I ever felt homesick, the podcast was just there.
Not gonna lie, Player of Games would make for a good Culture story for a book club. Main character obsessed with game playing, particularly strategy games? Seductive appeal of a horrific imperial system? Triumph of a much better philosophical system within the empire's own rule set? I think there’s some threads to tug on.
I think this is the first time I've ever wholeheartedly disagreed with you guys to the point where it felt personal. I should also say this was my first 40k book, and I realized how stupid it was to take *your* criticisms of the book personally, so I ended up enjoying this episode. *HOWEVER, I HAVE SERIOUS BONES TO PICK!* The narrator was very good. His initial shouts of "24 IN THE WAR" were super cringe to me, but his voice acting for the rest of the book was stellar. For context: I am a die-hard Marc Thompson purist. And I loved this narrator. Trayzn's voice? Exactly how I imagined it. It was amazing. Urkanthos? Fucking awesome. All he does is be a whiney little bitch, spill blood, and beg for Daddy Khorne to notice him and I fucking loved every minute of it. Blood for the Blood God. The Kasrkin (pronounced KASS-er-kin) was great. Dude took out literal Chaos Raptors, which are full on Space Marines. I always loved seeing them work, and I greatly enjoyed how he got so high on his britches, only for him to crash and burn. Serious badass with a savior complex. Abaddon's daughter? Favorite character, hands down. Loved her constant struggle and inevitable failure. The whole "This is my Foxhole" speech? Fucking hated it. Something a high school English class would churn out on a bad Monday. Meant nothing at all. The Chaos Cultist? Worst character. Cut him completely. Entirely forgettable. Every time he showed up, I had to manually pause to recall who he even was. I disagreed with almost every opinion you guys had to the point that I got mad about it. Keep up the amazing work! Love this show!
I can see most of these points and I think we all agree on the fortress child being one of the best parts of the book. I would nitpick the poem part of your critique though. It's not about the poem itself, it's about passing the torch to Hellsker. Barrathus even jokes about how bad of a poet he is when he gives the speech. It's not supposed to be good, it's supposed to show a heartfelt attempt at poetry by a man who clearly still kept his humanity through war times. Hellsker giving it at the end shows her follow her mentor's journey and now has to deal with the emotional after effects of being on an active front.
@@thepoorhammerpodcast Thank you so much for a direct reply! I, in turn, can see how it was meant to be. I felt more emotional about them scooping dirt into their empty magazines as they realize the planet is doomed just so they can take part of their home with them. Hellsker was one of the best parts of the book as well. Loved every detail of the Guard holding that pass.
Oh god good I'm not the only one here. I absolutely loved this book. It's my favorite of the Rath "trilogy". I also loved the narrator, having Cadians speak in Geordie accent made them so fun to listen to - you could feel the voice actor was having fun while reading the book. Loved him.
Tip to make the narration better: Play it at 2x speed, honestly you're so focused trying to keep track of what's going on you stop noticing the voices.
I always have my audiobooks set to 1.15x speed. that way it's just fast enough to trim down some audio pauses but all the speaking lines still sounds natural. I didn't really have a problem with the fall of cadia audiobook, but maybe that's just because I also enjoy the Gaunt's Ghosts audiobooks too.
I really, really enjoyed this book. A couple of points. I listen to about 30 books a year (get your library card!) and I have to say the narration is above average. My only gripe is that the early book was difficult to follow as there was no audio cue to know when the scene changed. Once I had the characters nailed down this wasn’t a problem. I used audible and the sound quality was perfect. If you heard pops in your headphones, that might be something related to poor Bluetooth connection.
Listening to the talk of the quality of the audibook itself makes me real glad to he a star wars audio book fan. We get sound effects, music, mark Thompson and his excellent voices and narration, voice effect overlays when needed (ie no awkward Droid voice attempt)
@@thepoorhammerpodcast that was the exact one I was gonna recommend if anyone wanted a good example. And honestly it's not even an outlier. His Thrawn voice is the definitive one in my mind
21:00 The middle ground I think would be changing the wording to describe the noise (instead of imitating it) and playing a sound effect in the background. Example: Text: The radio activated with a chyoooom. Audiobook: The radio activated with a dull hum. [chyoooom sound effect] The fact of the matter is that any adaptation where the media being used is significantly different shouldn't be done 1 to 1. Make changes where necessary to fit the medium. Don't force using the original like it was ordained by God.
I loved this book actually, all those plot threads were really working for me in emphasizing the precariousness of the Cadians and their situation, and the idea that they kept fighting even though they knew they couldn't win. This is a super stretch, but it reminded me of my own battles with mental health. You're fighting to preserve what's worth protecting, even if it seems fruitless, because it's what matters to you. To steal from Rise Against, how we survive is what makes us who we are.
I'd like to introduce you to Daniel Pennac's 'Right's of the reader' You can search it easily enough, but specifically number 6 "The right to mistake a book for real life" I think applies
This was the first audiobook I have ever listened to. I thought the narrator was annoying, but I figured it was me not being used to audiobooks. I got used to him around hour 10.
I would watch an episode on the culture series, and I agree the audio books are very good. Maybe an “influenced on or by 40k episode”? Can talk about all the cool sci-fi / fantasy that went into and came out of 40k
The crime lord plot line was a bit weird until the very end where it clicks that he is actually a blank and therefore has no soul and his whole character and motivations fall into place
RUclips pleasantries! Big thanks to all involved and especially to Berilio for all the editing. Love the book club specifically because I’ve found that it makes good background noise for sleepless nights where I’ve seen it awake and alert already so I can half listen to keep the brain from spinning too fast.
My wife had to endure some of the audio. I'm trying to get her into Sisters (she has a Sylvaneth army) and if she had read the living saint parts she might have been sold on the army. Instead I don't think she will pick up a Sisters model without hearing those voices.
Except that the Fall of Cadia led to the resurrection of Rouboute Gulliman which led to the Indomitus Crusade, the Devastation of Baal, the Plague Wars and the Fourth Tyranic War. It is the single event that led to the progression of the setting with galaxy wide consequences. Now, if what you mean is that Cadians still exist throughout the Imperium, then that is a question of satisfying faction player base. Nobody wants to have their favorite faction exterminated (sorry Harlequins) so they needed them to still exist
The Cadians are doomed. What was special about them came from their home world’s location. They had to be the best or anything that came out of the Eye of Terror would have free rein. Cadia wasn’t a death world, but its location demanded the best from its inhabitants. And the Administration knew this and made sure they were never under equipped. Cadia was one of the best cared for planets outside of Ultramar. For a time the Cadian survivors will be cared for and heralded as heroes to boost morale, but logistical demands will see their resources allocated to a hundred different fronts and whatever new planet they have been relocated to will in time breed weakness. Cadia fell and its legacy is left to either go out in several small flash fires of glory or fade into the darkness of time. The Fall of Cadia changed everything.
Phenomenal episode. Having the third person’s perspective is INCREDIBLY valuable. I think it adds so much to the podcast. I wish you could do it for the other episodes too! Completely agree about the Karsikins. QQ though, did you listen to the bonus content at the end of the book? I think it’s a shame you didn’t mention it. The author ads som perspective to influences for the book, and I think it reframes some of the Imperial Guard parts, most notably the (forgery traitor guy)’s parts.
Null shields are a complete cop out even though they're mostly worth it. Though one has to ask if there's a shield that prevents high velocity impacts basically no landing craft ever conceivable could land on it. If it's a size thing instead than consider this... Chef Boy R Dee moving at mach 10 is essentially a nuclear powered can of pasta. That could wipe out a small city or at least destroy most of the ground emplacements for next to no cost. Now there's food for thought!
I really loved the scene where Hellsker is reporting to Creed and the desk Colonel (who outranks her) is giving her shit about her uniform being a mess, then asks for her name. As soon as she tells him, he's like "oh shit, I'm so sorry, you're legendary, also please don't tell Creed that I was being a dick to you."
I really liked the book, though I read it so didn't have any of the audiobook problems. I'm a slow mental narrator like Brad and Eric, and I'll also look up characters, units, sometimes even datasheets wherever they're relavent, so I can flesh out the scenario in my head. I spent a lot of time on this book. That said, I actually loved the Urkanthos bits, his POVs were some of my favoirite chapters. I especially liked the relationship between him and goremouth, and interactions with other chaos characters. The big problem was the lack of chapters dedicated to the other chaos characters. They introduced them all, Krom Gat being an Iron warriors leader in charge of the most crucial part of abbadons plan... and the space wolves killed him off screen, with him having no dialogue. Zeraphiston was awesome... except the only real interaction he had with anyone was the Rovestke bits. All Korda did was fire on urkanthos (though I quite liked their interaction), and slaughterborn wasn't even killed off screen. You were thinking of Gat, slaughterborn was given a badass description, told to release plagues to devestate the cadian forces, and then never mentioned again. There were no plagues, aside from the daemon released at the behest of Zeraphiston, and we are never told what happened to any nurgle forces that may or may not have been present DESPITE THE TERMINUS *FREKKING* EST BEING NAME DROPPED. I did love Siron though, he stole every scene he was in. Morkath was fantastic of course. Loved Rovetske, although his final scene with ghent was kind of dumb. Up til that point he never seemed like a one trick pony, he always had runes or something up his sleeve, but in his final moments he just kept trying to use his force mind trick, and it didn't work because... i guess ghent had a stronger will? It's not entirely clear.
Oh also the climax was slightly underwhelming. From reading the old spark notes and lore tidbits, I had this image in my head of Celestine and Abbadon having an epic duel as the planet tears apart around them, but it was kinda just... a couple of blows in a smokey cave? Also Greyfax SEEMED to mention there were a number of Greater Daemons in that same room, but they didn't really come up? ALSO in Creed's last stand they said the killed a two headed bird daemon with a rocket launcher, was... was that KAIROS?? Showed up at the last possible second to weave some vestigial fates, got poked with a rocket and peaced out back to the warp.
I also narrate the book in my head when I read it, good to see I am not alone in that. Also maaaan, the narration really is rough in the audiobook, not gonna finish this episode until I finish the book but I may pull an Eric here (God help me) and drop the Audio book for the actual book, so it may be a while before I finish this one, but thanks for doing these book clubs! They always help me pick which book to read next.
This was by first introduction to Warhammer 40k lore proper. I know some of it, but it was all new. I think it's fun if you are new to it. I think it's more entry level then super crunchy. Didn't expect the throwing rocks at it strat.
As an ordained representative of the black templars, we thought this was cringe. To some degree the "we have sworn an oath to defend this thing even if it makes no sense." Is a fun part. But then they ruin it by not acting like black templars in other ways. Like they just happened to have a black blade and artificer armor and then they declared an Emperor's champion without having a chaplain. This just isn't stuff the black templars would do. Also, the whole point of helsreach was grimaldus learning that to be a black templar didn't just mean mindlessly holding ground, it meant selling your life as dearly as possible. The black templars in this book were cringe.
Counterpoint: they were hilarious. They‘re kinda randomly disconnected from the main story, but I loved every second of them. The black templar chapters are what 40k was created to be (aside from a miniature franchise)
Please keep doing book club, while I wasnt a huge fan of this book (mostly due to audiobook narration) I still love listening to you guys talk about it. Also as another book recommendation that I'm sure other people will point out, The Twice Dead King series is fantastic, especially if you like necrons.
This was my first 40k book. Listened to the audio all the way through. Narration was rough, but Cawl and Trazin were enough to make me want to check out Great Works and Infinite and Divine, so there's that. Enjoyed hearing your take on this one.
Love you guys, not in a 100% agreement but that's OK. Thebonly part of the audiobook I struggled with was the femme voices but I really enjoyed the vastly different perspectives on war and Cadia. I think the idea of showing how even a crime boss loved his planet and its people in a different way added a lot to the the big picture collage of what it meant to be there. I really liked this book and I'm glad you inspired me to read it by ding this video!
I really enjoyed the audio book I don't find anything wrong with any of the voices (the women were not great because men trying to do women usually sucks and i came into it knowing that so it was ignorable for me)
I thought the book was also sorta rough, but I appreciate the goal of it was to describe a desperate attempt to thwart a planetary invasion that was first vaguely described in a neat campaign book 20 years ago. Through that lens a lot of the rough edges are smoothed for me as it gives highly detailed first person perspectives of one the biggest lore development of the setting that we only had the general outlines of for 20 years.
Never read a 40K book, but still listened because I appreciate that you don't speak as a unified voice, and everything was kept nicely in perspectives. It really shows how subjective tastes matter, and illuminates you all as people more clearly. It's equally important, if not more important, to understand the people who review something versus the thing itself, and i love getting some of that understanding.
I liked this book club thing a lot. Picked up the book to listen just for this (mistake). He was very good at narration, but i agree with the points you all made about him. Hopefully we get another of these book club things soonish. Thanks poorhammer crew! ❤❤❤
Really enjoyed the episode. Some good thoughts on the book. I’m reading the infinite and the divine from the last book club and have enjoyed it. So thanks for the tips.
I want to say the Black Templar character did the same thing in the Fall of Cadia lore section of the campaign book. Same with the Dark Angles and Space Wolves. Gave me a lot of weird Deja Vu with some of the things in the book due to reading the campaign lore years ago.
It was wild listening to this because they redid the narration just a couple months later, I didn't recognise the cold open at all. I think David Seddon's narration is really good
Honestly, to give Elstob some genuine props, I think his Urkanthos performance was the highlight of the audiobook. Listening to him snarl “BLOOD!” every other word actually made me think, ‘Y’know, I actually kinda vibe with the demon prince now’.” Hanna Keztral was definitely a high point of the story. I’ve always loved pilot characters, and her marking off kill counts as she escorts the transports to safety really drove the “This is not a foxhole” emotional spike home for me. I was also kinda disappointed with the Sisters’ showing. I liked Geneveive, and kept expecting her to have a moment where she genuinely got to surpass Ellynore in some regard. I suppose being the moral catalyst, the martyred example that inspires Ellynore to action is a very sisters-y payoff, but I did feel a little underwhelmed in that moment. On the other hand, I *did* enjoy the eldritch horror of all the dead and mangled sisters heralding the arrival of Celestine. That was very daemony of it in its own right. As for book recommendations, First and Only definitely would suit Eric, I think. It does have that Vietnam, War-Is-Hell tone to it, and is probably my most unreserved Dan Abnett recommendation. I’ve enjoyed plenty of Abnett novels, but First and Only benefits from not having many female characters, and so you are spared too many lingering descriptions of “magnificent cleavage” or “form-fitting bodygloves.” That said, I cannot recommend Ciaphas Caine enough. As a former academic, I have a soft spot for snarky footnotes and having to work with references texts with clear biases.
As a tip on how to get some actual reading done....just put the book on the toilet and read 2-5 pages every time you sit down instead of browsing your phone....or alternatively read on your kindle app while sitting down ;-) i have finished about 20 books in a year that way ^^
This echoed a lot of what I thought when I was listening to it. I only listened while driving, and when the drone of the highway was more entertaining then hearing Eleanor talking about how she's better, or the Kasrkin were the "elite of the elite", you know something was up. I actually completely missed a few of the plot points you had mentioned. Jenny nailed it right towards the end though: There were SO many Point of Views from characters that died super early on that it was frustrating to keep track of them. Does anyone remember that sergeant that was loaded up into a ship and shot at the Blackstone fortress who died one chapter later? It was almost unnecessary filler. (Good filler, I did like that character quite a bit.) Though, overall, it was...enjoyable, I guess? It was good enough that I did like it, but enough flaws throughout that there were times where I just flipped on RUclips or played some music while driving instead. It did confirm one thing for me, and nobody can change my mind on it: Abbadon is the best Primarch. Yes, you read that right. Yes, I meant every word of that. Everytime he was on screen, I liked how deep of a character he actually became. Brad was 100% correct in that the Chaos parts (minus one blood ragey guy...) were amongst the best parts of it. I kinda wanna read more on Abaddon himself, to be quite honest. Sure, he had to fail 12 times to get it right, but the character himself seems much more interesting then the memes give him credit for.
I really appreciate the recommendations because idk where to start and my first audio book was the talon of Horus so I almost need the recommendations so I'm not wasting my audible credits.
For those that had a problem with the narrator for the audiobook, it has been re-released with David Seddon as the new narrator. It's way better and I would suggest a re-listen as this is a Great Novel.
Thats Crazy that this got a new audiobook in basically a year and gaunts ghosts fans are still waiting on a re-do for salvations reach with Toby Longworth
To me, all the voices were like when someone is trying to sound like they're yelling without actually yelling. It creates this weird, strained effect that almost sounds like a constipated grandpa. I eventually got used to it, but there was a period in the first couple hours where I didn't know if I was going to make it...
Peter Kenny's work on the Culture series is fantastic and I'd love it if he did a WH40K novel. Yes to anything Culture related, more people need to discover that series Personally I think Jonathan Keeble does a great job on 40K. It's unfortunate that he clearly hasn't been briefed on how to pronounce some names and his chosen voices/accents for characters don't always stay consistent between books, but when he's voicing a daemon, my god, that guy COMMITS
You mentioned speeding up the playback on the podcast. I accidently slowed it down by one notch and was seriously questioning if you both just toked up before you started.
Poorhammer podcast power rankings:
1.Burellio
2. Brad's wife
3. the other guys
Burellio get off your alt account
Mood
I love the quick mention that Trazyn misses Orikan since ”dropping that mountain on him” It really helps us put the Infinite and the Divine on a timeline since this is between the last two visits to that planet. He also compares Cawl to Orikan which works amazing as a compliment to Cawl AND a massive insult to Orikan
I really wish Richard Reed had done the narration for this book.
The funny thing is, while reading their scenes, I couldn't help but think "Orikan would have figured this out already" Cadia got the wrong half of that duo. I don't think Trazyn or even most Necrons really get just how smart Orikan actually is. His utter lack of chill and people skills are basically the only things stopping him from taking over the Galaxy.
The audio book broke before the guard did!
The audiobook broke Eric before Cadia.
Funny, the Audiobook I had was voiced by David Seddon and was excellent!
If only Cadia had dinosaurs, it would still stand.
Make the Exodites a faction GW
GW: “Noted. Next edition deletes Admech”
I hear you I hear you. I counter with just dropping the Seraphon in 40k
@@morgansheepman2403 god imagine Seraphon with energy guns
@@theotv5522 finally
@@theotv5522 as an admech player, I think that might be better than what we're getting now.
I like Jenny episodes.
please have her on more .
I mainly like looking at the Hive Tyrant
Agreed. More Berilio too!
@@7hird3yeBerilio cut his life span short by 2 years trying to get 2 vids out this week
@@theotv5522And now we want to force him to spend time on the podcast as well!
PLEASE!
Can't believe no one mentiones how when anyone shouts in the audiobook, it sounds like theyre severely constipated!
Also great to have Eric and Jenny back!
Ok yeah I can hear the constipation still in my mental scar: "24 IN THE WAHHHHHHHHHHHRRRRRRGGGGGGGGGGGGG"
@@thepoorhammerpodcast the bowels broke before the guard did
“I don’t like how they voice the female characters and sounded 85” - Brad’s wife, who’s currently voicing a Hive Tyrant
Can Tyranids that aren't Genestealers speak???
@sambrown9475 yes, the hive tyrant spoke all episode
@@Speeds_Gaming_Corner😂
@@Speeds_Gaming_Cornericon
@@Speeds_Gaming_Corner this both does and doesn't answer my question
The Novamarines are Ultramarines successors. They show up in the Dark Imperium series.
My brother JUST lectured me on this. I rebut with: Justinian's whole storyline in my head is "Waaaah! I'm not a real ultramarine."
@thepoorhammerpodcast don't do my Boi like that
Legit one of my favorite lines in dark imperium " 6 thousand years, 6 thousand years" as he just loses it
Also he has the best tattoo
They're in the nightlords omnibus aswell
There's a Space Marine Heraldry artbook that has a page titled "Rocks are not free, citizen!" It did a cost breakdown of accelerating a rock from a local asteroid belt to the planet, versus the standard kinetic strike missile. It mostly showed that you'd lose money consuming the fuel required versus the manufacturing cost of a single missile.
Interesting but you could also say the cost of the missile's fuel is equal to or greater than the RKM(relativistic kill missile) would be, to perform the same level of damage. It honestly would have been better to say that most asteroids are a loose conglomerate of sand and tiny rocks than a single large item. Which is to the best of my knowledge proven to be true thus far. Hence you couldn't use it as an RKM.
@@8-7-styx94 ffinding an asteroid that is mission suitable is listed as one of the costs. Its several months of fuel and food for a ship to scout one out.
@@8-7-styx94 Part of the cost assessment includes the effort of finding a suitably solid asteroid.
IIRC, the "cost" was because of how long it took to find a suitable space rock, push it towards the planet, and wait for it to make contact.
They couldn't just leave without confirming the kill, and the cost of keeping the ship (fleet?) active in the field for a few extra days was more than they saved on bombs/missiles/etc.
Part of this is also because 40k has FTL travel- a warship can just FTL into bombing range, while a space rock needs to slug it over in realspace.
I thought the whole Black Templar thing was hilarious and demonstrates why the Imperium is so dysfunctional.
You have one of the strongest individual military forces in the galaxy, the Black Templars, and they are next to useless in one of the most important (if not THE most important) battles in the history of the Imperium because they are too proud to accept that they made a mistake and take their medieval style code of honor too seriously. See also the Dark Angels.
To me that’s a great example of the blend of fantasy and sci fi that is 40K.
It’s actually something a reflection of real life: in WW2 one of the biggest challenges Eisenhower faced as being supreme commander of the Allied forces were all the prima donna generals that were constantly pulling at the leash to go off and do their own thing.
It’s also ironic that Chaos was a much more united military force than the Imperium which, I’m sure, was 100% intentional.
It's very much in keeping with the intended, Rogue Trader era satire the Imperium was designed to reflect. It's a huge, ponderous, fascist regime, whose own failings are slowly killing it. The Black Templars exist to demonstrate the folly of this kind of reckless hate and pride.
Problem being, this satire exists, both in general and in this book, in stark contrast with the more standard "Heroes vs Villains" narrative that 40K is perpetually stuck in. In a story where the Imperials are the sympathetic party and their enemies unambiguously bad, having a bunch of huge dorks LARPing crusaders and acting irrationally seems out of place.
The Cadians are trying to play this all straight, as a serious war story. And then over here, the Black Templars are the only ones who understood the original assignment. That they stand out so much is more an indictment of the state of 40K than an indictment on how they're written.
@@Bluecho4 Yeah the problem with all autocracies (and fascism sure counts for that) is that the smart people who see flaws with the system tend to get killed. It's one of the main reasons they don't last that long compared to democracies and constitutional monarchies.
Except the imperium isn't an autocracy it's an odd mix theocracy, oligarchy, and feudalism that pays lip service to being an autocracy.
And aside from that democracies and constitutional monarchies, while I'd argue more just, are not in fact, more stable than many forms of authoritarianism. They also have a tendency to devolve (into oligarchy for example) and be riven by social strife.
The imperium's issues stem far more from ignorance, ideological zealotry, and the tyranny of distance than it's government which is, in large part, a product of those flaws, not the cause.
@@Bluecho4 Robert Rath plays with the evil of the Imperium by hinting at how oppressive Cadia is to its citizens. But it’s not enough.
Listening to you all say "car-skin" over and over is giving me an ulcer.
Ka-sir-kin.
Ka like cat.
Sir like yes sir.
Kin like we's kin!
Unless I'm just missing something because you said it right later.
*utterly sarcastic midwestern* Carskin, got it, thanks boss!
I laughed at your comment so hard I woke up my cat, please do not hate my joke lol
@@radopposums2829he has no excuse I'm literially from michigan. He just can't read. 😅
The weirdest part to me is that I feel like they usually get it right when they talk about models?
I think he knew the correct pronunciation the whole time, he just likes making fun of stuff he doesn't like by intentionally mispronouncing them, see "T-Glottal stop-Au"
He says it correctly at the start of the chaos section
Eric, if you want like, horrors of war stuff in 40k, I cannot recommend 15 Hours highly enough. It's guard versus orks and it does that mentality so well!
Cosign 15 Hours. It's Murphy's Law on a guy's first day.
Black Templars, when you need Space Marines to die on a hill, accept no substitutes.
A hill, in the middle of nowhere, with no tactical significance lol
The Black Templar chapters were comic relief interludes, I swear. We jump all around the planet hearing from all the different sides in a massive bloody war... and then cut to the Black Templars, defending a rock.
It MUST have been intentional. It MUST.
Because every other chapter is limited to a thousand dudes You can't just start killing off ultramarine squads without actually killing established characters, but you can throw in some black Templars because they have extra unnamed divisions
@@klaykid117 that's a really good point lol
Aw man, you guys we're reading the fall of Cadia? I wish you told us!
this might sound a little cursed, but for some insane reason I thought the way the Creed voice is done sounded almost exactly like if Robin Williams was doing an irish accent. it made me picture Creed being played by him in my head and it definitely made the more dramatic scenes a little more goofy for me lol
😊😊😊😊😊😊😊 21:26 😊
They should have gotten the Darktide VAs for the troops.
"FOR CREED!"
If anyone let this book down it was the production team not giving enough resources to the story. Author, narrator, editor all I'm sure did their best, but if this was going to be such a big event in 40k it would have been better to give it more time/money/etc.
Thanks for the book club episodes! love them.
I think it was a problem specifically because of how it's a big event. Its been around for years but no book, so they just wanted to just get it out since it's overdue imo
@@gammothdraws Time is always the enemy
56:55 "Sir Isaac Newton is the deadliest sonovabitch in space!"
The thing that made me initially think "Oh no" about the narration was the first time he narrated shouting. I feel like he was told not to yell into the microphone and got overly cautious. When I listened to Flight of the Eisenstein, I felt like the narrator was full-on bellowing "Count the seven!" every time. "Twenty-four! In the war!", by contrast, sounded like the squad was being collectively strangled.
The Cadian voices were neither Scottish nor Irish but were in fact the kind of accent you get around NewCastle and County Durham
Wait, are the Cadian voices seriously geordies? I'm having way too much fun thinking of a planet full of geordies. If the emperor has a football club we're fucked. Cadian geordie ultras.
@@BEEFBEEFBEEFIFY To be fair, most Orks are essentially depicted as being something akin to space Yorkshiremen. I'd be entirely unsurprised if that's just Nottingham's idea of "we need gruff folk for this".
@@DiggingForFacts Orks are space cockneys, i.e. Londoners
It was an attempt at that accent. The attempt failed.
@@georgeforster8310 Oh noooooooo!!!
I wasn't expecting a Yu-Gi-Oh The Abridged Series reference but I'm giving here for it!
As someone who read the book in one week and did so with the ebook, here are my thoughts. I am terrible with names. I also wanted them to be allowed to say Fuck.
I thought the guy who wanted to bayonet Abbadon was great. I also love the guardswoman who went after Abbadon with a shotgun.
This book made me go from "black templars are meh" to "fuck those guys, they're the worst". They were so annoying.
The main thing that stood out to me was how seamless the inclusion was. Women just existed. They were important for their actions.
The most entertaining scene by far for me was the early general staff meeting with Creed trying to get all these fucking weirdos he doesn't have actual authority over to participate in a cohesive defense plan. The crazy gun nuns refuse to do anything but guard their churches, the derp edgy dark angels refuse to do anything but guard their ship and precious secrets, the admech refuse to do anything but guard techno secrets they don't understand, and the space wolf decides to do a suicide run and takes a full regiment of guardsmen to do so because they might help for 2 minutes before dying horribly. Great showcase of how dysfunctional the imperium is and how out of his depth Creed was as a theater-level commander as opposed to a tactical one.
Conversly, for me the worst moment by far was in the climax when Abaddon is just slowly walking toward a whole platoon of cadians and they're all shooting him so fast with a hundred guns and you can't even see Abaddon behind all the lasers and his armor is glowing red hot and there's so much ionising of the air that dudes stop being able to breath and then he just kills them all. I had conversations with my friends at the elementary school playground about how 'no my guy is so cool and awesome a hundred tanks could all line up and shoot him and he'd be fine'. Everyone has a personal line of when dumb 40k stuff is cool and when it's just stupid, and boy was that way on the wrong end of it for me.
Jen isn't THAT bad on 1.5x speed. Though I definitely laughed when you brought up people listening to the podcast at high speed ("hey, they're talking about me!")
1.25x is perfect for me
I've hit the point of 2x on the regular and Jen is fine. Loud laughter is a bit hard but I've come to accept it at 2x speed.
I listen to almost everything at 2x speed these days. Jen seemed fine to me too.
Loved this episode. The book clubs are amazing to listen too. I got back in to this hobby three months ago, and listen to all your guys podcasts while painting. Your podcast was honestly a primary source of happiness and enjoying the hobby while being abroad for 5 months. If I ever felt homesick, the podcast was just there.
14:35 the one piece in the background hahahahah. Little details like this that are missed in audio only are great
Not gonna lie, Player of Games would make for a good Culture story for a book club. Main character obsessed with game playing, particularly strategy games? Seductive appeal of a horrific imperial system? Triumph of a much better philosophical system within the empire's own rule set? I think there’s some threads to tug on.
I think this is the first time I've ever wholeheartedly disagreed with you guys to the point where it felt personal. I should also say this was my first 40k book, and I realized how stupid it was to take *your* criticisms of the book personally, so I ended up enjoying this episode.
*HOWEVER, I HAVE SERIOUS BONES TO PICK!*
The narrator was very good. His initial shouts of "24 IN THE WAR" were super cringe to me, but his voice acting for the rest of the book was stellar. For context: I am a die-hard Marc Thompson purist. And I loved this narrator.
Trayzn's voice? Exactly how I imagined it. It was amazing.
Urkanthos? Fucking awesome. All he does is be a whiney little bitch, spill blood, and beg for Daddy Khorne to notice him and I fucking loved every minute of it. Blood for the Blood God.
The Kasrkin (pronounced KASS-er-kin) was great. Dude took out literal Chaos Raptors, which are full on Space Marines. I always loved seeing them work, and I greatly enjoyed how he got so high on his britches, only for him to crash and burn. Serious badass with a savior complex.
Abaddon's daughter? Favorite character, hands down. Loved her constant struggle and inevitable failure.
The whole "This is my Foxhole" speech? Fucking hated it. Something a high school English class would churn out on a bad Monday. Meant nothing at all.
The Chaos Cultist? Worst character. Cut him completely. Entirely forgettable. Every time he showed up, I had to manually pause to recall who he even was.
I disagreed with almost every opinion you guys had to the point that I got mad about it.
Keep up the amazing work! Love this show!
I can see most of these points and I think we all agree on the fortress child being one of the best parts of the book. I would nitpick the poem part of your critique though. It's not about the poem itself, it's about passing the torch to Hellsker. Barrathus even jokes about how bad of a poet he is when he gives the speech. It's not supposed to be good, it's supposed to show a heartfelt attempt at poetry by a man who clearly still kept his humanity through war times. Hellsker giving it at the end shows her follow her mentor's journey and now has to deal with the emotional after effects of being on an active front.
@@thepoorhammerpodcast
Thank you so much for a direct reply!
I, in turn, can see how it was meant to be. I felt more emotional about them scooping dirt into their empty magazines as they realize the planet is doomed just so they can take part of their home with them.
Hellsker was one of the best parts of the book as well. Loved every detail of the Guard holding that pass.
Here I am, enjoying and loving both scenes dearly
Oh god good I'm not the only one here. I absolutely loved this book. It's my favorite of the Rath "trilogy".
I also loved the narrator, having Cadians speak in Geordie accent made them so fun to listen to - you could feel the voice actor was having fun while reading the book. Loved him.
I can't disagree more about the voice, it was jarring at the beginning but I think he did a great job
Tip to make the narration better: Play it at 2x speed, honestly you're so focused trying to keep track of what's going on you stop noticing the voices.
I always have my audiobooks set to 1.15x speed. that way it's just fast enough to trim down some audio pauses but all the speaking lines still sounds natural. I didn't really have a problem with the fall of cadia audiobook, but maybe that's just because I also enjoy the Gaunt's Ghosts audiobooks too.
I like that Keztral saw the space wolf dog form and was like "I ain't seen shit".
In 40K, "I didn't see nothin' ", is the safest stance you can take.
I really, really enjoyed this book. A couple of points.
I listen to about 30 books a year (get your library card!) and I have to say the narration is above average. My only gripe is that the early book was difficult to follow as there was no audio cue to know when the scene changed. Once I had the characters nailed down this wasn’t a problem.
I used audible and the sound quality was perfect. If you heard pops in your headphones, that might be something related to poor Bluetooth connection.
So i am not alone in narrating in my head and doing voices for characters. AMAZING!
RUclips did not notify me about this despite having all notifications turned on. You could say RUclips broke before the guard did.
Listening to the talk of the quality of the audibook itself makes me real glad to he a star wars audio book fan. We get sound effects, music, mark Thompson and his excellent voices and narration, voice effect overlays when needed (ie no awkward Droid voice attempt)
I am not a SW fan, but Thrawn's book I listened to was so top tier in production it was wild.
@@thepoorhammerpodcast that was the exact one I was gonna recommend if anyone wanted a good example. And honestly it's not even an outlier. His Thrawn voice is the definitive one in my mind
Death Trooper is the only SW book I've listened to. And yeah, really high production value
Please do an episode on the Culture series
Use of Weapons is so damn good. Maybe Ill have to check out the audiobook even though I've read it a few times now.
21:00 The middle ground I think would be changing the wording to describe the noise (instead of imitating it) and playing a sound effect in the background. Example:
Text: The radio activated with a chyoooom.
Audiobook: The radio activated with a dull hum. [chyoooom sound effect]
The fact of the matter is that any adaptation where the media being used is significantly different shouldn't be done 1 to 1. Make changes where necessary to fit the medium. Don't force using the original like it was ordained by God.
2 videos back to back?! What did we do to deserve this?
Feel like we're down a guy
I want proof of Berileo being alive
I thought a lot of goat sacrifices were involved. Maybe a couple sheep...
I loved this book actually, all those plot threads were really working for me in emphasizing the precariousness of the Cadians and their situation, and the idea that they kept fighting even though they knew they couldn't win. This is a super stretch, but it reminded me of my own battles with mental health. You're fighting to preserve what's worth protecting, even if it seems fruitless, because it's what matters to you. To steal from Rise Against, how we survive is what makes us who we are.
I'd like to introduce you to Daniel Pennac's 'Right's of the reader' You can search it easily enough, but specifically number 6 "The right to mistake a book for real life" I think applies
This was the first audiobook I have ever listened to. I thought the narrator was annoying, but I figured it was me not being used to audiobooks. I got used to him around hour 10.
Almost the exact same experience for me! except it only took about 5 hours for me.
I would watch an episode on the culture series, and I agree the audio books are very good.
Maybe an “influenced on or by 40k episode”? Can talk about all the cool sci-fi / fantasy that went into and came out of 40k
The crime lord plot line was a bit weird until the very end where it clicks that he is actually a blank and therefore has no soul and his whole character and motivations fall into place
Wait he is a blank? I always thought Rovetsky tried to tell him the wrong lie.
RUclips pleasantries! Big thanks to all involved and especially to Berilio for all the editing. Love the book club specifically because I’ve found that it makes good background noise for sleepless nights where I’ve seen it awake and alert already so I can half listen to keep the brain from spinning too fast.
My wife had to endure some of the audio. I'm trying to get her into Sisters (she has a Sylvaneth army) and if she had read the living saint parts she might have been sold on the army. Instead I don't think she will pick up a Sisters model without hearing those voices.
Now I’m going to have to cry listening this on my commute today
Look, it’s the thing that never meant anything in the long term!
Except that the Fall of Cadia led to the resurrection of Rouboute Gulliman which led to the Indomitus Crusade, the Devastation of Baal, the Plague Wars and the Fourth Tyranic War. It is the single event that led to the progression of the setting with galaxy wide consequences.
Now, if what you mean is that Cadians still exist throughout the Imperium, then that is a question of satisfying faction player base. Nobody wants to have their favorite faction exterminated (sorry Harlequins) so they needed them to still exist
@@ElricTheWhiteWolf they should have killed off the ultramarines of guard.
The Cadians are doomed. What was special about them came from their home world’s location. They had to be the best or anything that came out of the Eye of Terror would have free rein. Cadia wasn’t a death world, but its location demanded the best from its inhabitants. And the Administration knew this and made sure they were never under equipped. Cadia was one of the best cared for planets outside of Ultramar. For a time the Cadian survivors will be cared for and heralded as heroes to boost morale, but logistical demands will see their resources allocated to a hundred different fronts and whatever new planet they have been relocated to will in time breed weakness.
Cadia fell and its legacy is left to either go out in several small flash fires of glory or fade into the darkness of time.
The Fall of Cadia changed everything.
Except justifying imperial guard being mainly just cadian everything.
No it didn't it's just how cadian the guard is that's the issue it literally caused the great rift and the galaxy to split in half pretty big deal
Phenomenal episode. Having the third person’s perspective is INCREDIBLY valuable. I think it adds so much to the podcast. I wish you could do it for the other episodes too!
Completely agree about the Karsikins. QQ though, did you listen to the bonus content at the end of the book? I think it’s a shame you didn’t mention it. The author ads som perspective to influences for the book, and I think it reframes some of the Imperial Guard parts, most notably the (forgery traitor guy)’s parts.
How could you not prepare us for this bookclub thing?!
It might be my tism and/or favoritism for the guard, but damn I'm glad you guys didn't make the book😂. It was by far one of my favorite books.
I can’t believe yall didn’t talk about the private climbing the mountain to get the supply drop part. One of the best moments in the book for me.
Ah, the episode released after the previous one that came before this one. Perfect!
Dropping my RUclips pleasantries early as I haven’t finished the book yet but i trust these guys to deliver a great episode anyway.
Null shields are a complete cop out even though they're mostly worth it. Though one has to ask if there's a shield that prevents high velocity impacts basically no landing craft ever conceivable could land on it. If it's a size thing instead than consider this... Chef Boy R Dee moving at mach 10 is essentially a nuclear powered can of pasta. That could wipe out a small city or at least destroy most of the ground emplacements for next to no cost. Now there's food for thought!
I really loved the scene where Hellsker is reporting to Creed and the desk Colonel (who outranks her) is giving her shit about her uniform being a mess, then asks for her name. As soon as she tells him, he's like "oh shit, I'm so sorry, you're legendary, also please don't tell Creed that I was being a dick to you."
I really liked the book, though I read it so didn't have any of the audiobook problems. I'm a slow mental narrator like Brad and Eric, and I'll also look up characters, units, sometimes even datasheets wherever they're relavent, so I can flesh out the scenario in my head. I spent a lot of time on this book.
That said, I actually loved the Urkanthos bits, his POVs were some of my favoirite chapters. I especially liked the relationship between him and goremouth, and interactions with other chaos characters.
The big problem was the lack of chapters dedicated to the other chaos characters. They introduced them all, Krom Gat being an Iron warriors leader in charge of the most crucial part of abbadons plan... and the space wolves killed him off screen, with him having no dialogue. Zeraphiston was awesome... except the only real interaction he had with anyone was the Rovestke bits. All Korda did was fire on urkanthos (though I quite liked their interaction), and slaughterborn wasn't even killed off screen. You were thinking of Gat, slaughterborn was given a badass description, told to release plagues to devestate the cadian forces, and then never mentioned again. There were no plagues, aside from the daemon released at the behest of Zeraphiston, and we are never told what happened to any nurgle forces that may or may not have been present DESPITE THE TERMINUS *FREKKING* EST BEING NAME DROPPED.
I did love Siron though, he stole every scene he was in. Morkath was fantastic of course. Loved Rovetske, although his final scene with ghent was kind of dumb. Up til that point he never seemed like a one trick pony, he always had runes or something up his sleeve, but in his final moments he just kept trying to use his force mind trick, and it didn't work because... i guess ghent had a stronger will? It's not entirely clear.
Oh also the climax was slightly underwhelming. From reading the old spark notes and lore tidbits, I had this image in my head of Celestine and Abbadon having an epic duel as the planet tears apart around them, but it was kinda just... a couple of blows in a smokey cave? Also Greyfax SEEMED to mention there were a number of Greater Daemons in that same room, but they didn't really come up? ALSO in Creed's last stand they said the killed a two headed bird daemon with a rocket launcher, was... was that KAIROS?? Showed up at the last possible second to weave some vestigial fates, got poked with a rocket and peaced out back to the warp.
I also narrate the book in my head when I read it, good to see I am not alone in that.
Also maaaan, the narration really is rough in the audiobook, not gonna finish this episode until I finish the book but I may pull an Eric here (God help me) and drop the Audio book for the actual book, so it may be a while before I finish this one, but thanks for doing these book clubs! They always help me pick which book to read next.
This was by first introduction to Warhammer 40k lore proper. I know some of it, but it was all new. I think it's fun if you are new to it. I think it's more entry level then super crunchy. Didn't expect the throwing rocks at it strat.
It will forever be hilarious that they released a new recording right after this video.
Yeah! Eric is back!
As an ordained representative of the black templars, we thought this was cringe. To some degree the "we have sworn an oath to defend this thing even if it makes no sense." Is a fun part. But then they ruin it by not acting like black templars in other ways. Like they just happened to have a black blade and artificer armor and then they declared an Emperor's champion without having a chaplain. This just isn't stuff the black templars would do. Also, the whole point of helsreach was grimaldus learning that to be a black templar didn't just mean mindlessly holding ground, it meant selling your life as dearly as possible. The black templars in this book were cringe.
Counterpoint: they were hilarious. They‘re kinda randomly disconnected from the main story, but I loved every second of them.
The black templar chapters are what 40k was created to be (aside from a miniature franchise)
Please keep doing book club, while I wasnt a huge fan of this book (mostly due to audiobook narration) I still love listening to you guys talk about it. Also as another book recommendation that I'm sure other people will point out, The Twice Dead King series is fantastic, especially if you like necrons.
Top tier editing Berilio
First time listening to a book club episode. I enjoyed y'alls takes, and can't wait for the next one
This book was perfect to listen to while painting Cadians(Kill me if I have to paint more).
Ah, a fellow Midwest self narrator. A man of culture, I see.
45:39 congratulations, you have described the Black Templars.
This was my first 40k book. Listened to the audio all the way through. Narration was rough, but Cawl and Trazin were enough to make me want to check out Great Works and Infinite and Divine, so there's that. Enjoyed hearing your take on this one.
Love you guys, not in a 100% agreement but that's OK. Thebonly part of the audiobook I struggled with was the femme voices but I really enjoyed the vastly different perspectives on war and Cadia. I think the idea of showing how even a crime boss loved his planet and its people in a different way added a lot to the the big picture collage of what it meant to be there. I really liked this book and I'm glad you inspired me to read it by ding this video!
I listen to every single podcast at 1.25 at LEAST lol. Solid review, keep up the book club!
I really enjoyed the audio book I don't find anything wrong with any of the voices (the women were not great because men trying to do women usually sucks and i came into it knowing that so it was ignorable for me)
I was very confused why there was YGO Abridged in my Poorhammer thinking I clicked the wrong video. Having now watched the Video I get why its there.
I thought the book was also sorta rough, but I appreciate the goal of it was to describe a desperate attempt to thwart a planetary invasion that was first vaguely described in a neat campaign book 20 years ago. Through that lens a lot of the rough edges are smoothed for me as it gives highly detailed first person perspectives of one the biggest lore development of the setting that we only had the general outlines of for 20 years.
Never read a 40K book, but still listened because I appreciate that you don't speak as a unified voice, and everything was kept nicely in perspectives. It really shows how subjective tastes matter, and illuminates you all as people more clearly. It's equally important, if not more important, to understand the people who review something versus the thing itself, and i love getting some of that understanding.
I’d be more then happy to lend you my Night Lords omnibus! Incredible read and insight to Legion in the 41st Millennium!
I liked this book club thing a lot. Picked up the book to listen just for this (mistake). He was very good at narration, but i agree with the points you all made about him. Hopefully we get another of these book club things soonish. Thanks poorhammer crew! ❤❤❤
I honestly didn't realize listening to podcasts sped up was a thing. I often find myself having to rewind and repeat segments.
Really enjoyed the episode. Some good thoughts on the book. I’m reading the infinite and the divine from the last book club and have enjoyed it. So thanks for the tips.
I want to say the Black Templar character did the same thing in the Fall of Cadia lore section of the campaign book. Same with the Dark Angles and Space Wolves. Gave me a lot of weird Deja Vu with some of the things in the book due to reading the campaign lore years ago.
Poorhammer broke before cadia did, good chat and thanks to berellio for his editing!
It was wild listening to this because they redid the narration just a couple months later, I didn't recognise the cold open at all. I think David Seddon's narration is really good
Honestly, to give Elstob some genuine props, I think his Urkanthos performance was the highlight of the audiobook. Listening to him snarl “BLOOD!” every other word actually made me think, ‘Y’know, I actually kinda vibe with the demon prince now’.”
Hanna Keztral was definitely a high point of the story. I’ve always loved pilot characters, and her marking off kill counts as she escorts the transports to safety really drove the “This is not a foxhole” emotional spike home for me.
I was also kinda disappointed with the Sisters’ showing. I liked Geneveive, and kept expecting her to have a moment where she genuinely got to surpass Ellynore in some regard. I suppose being the moral catalyst, the martyred example that inspires Ellynore to action is a very sisters-y payoff, but I did feel a little underwhelmed in that moment.
On the other hand, I *did* enjoy the eldritch horror of all the dead and mangled sisters heralding the arrival of Celestine. That was very daemony of it in its own right.
As for book recommendations, First and Only definitely would suit Eric, I think. It does have that Vietnam, War-Is-Hell tone to it, and is probably my most unreserved Dan Abnett recommendation. I’ve enjoyed plenty of Abnett novels, but First and Only benefits from not having many female characters, and so you are spared too many lingering descriptions of “magnificent cleavage” or “form-fitting bodygloves.”
That said, I cannot recommend Ciaphas Caine enough. As a former academic, I have a soft spot for snarky footnotes and having to work with references texts with clear biases.
Y’all are a joy. Thanks for making these.
As a tip on how to get some actual reading done....just put the book on the toilet and read 2-5 pages every time you sit down instead of browsing your phone....or alternatively read on your kindle app while sitting down ;-) i have finished about 20 books in a year that way ^^
This echoed a lot of what I thought when I was listening to it. I only listened while driving, and when the drone of the highway was more entertaining then hearing Eleanor talking about how she's better, or the Kasrkin were the "elite of the elite", you know something was up. I actually completely missed a few of the plot points you had mentioned. Jenny nailed it right towards the end though: There were SO many Point of Views from characters that died super early on that it was frustrating to keep track of them. Does anyone remember that sergeant that was loaded up into a ship and shot at the Blackstone fortress who died one chapter later? It was almost unnecessary filler. (Good filler, I did like that character quite a bit.)
Though, overall, it was...enjoyable, I guess? It was good enough that I did like it, but enough flaws throughout that there were times where I just flipped on RUclips or played some music while driving instead. It did confirm one thing for me, and nobody can change my mind on it: Abbadon is the best Primarch. Yes, you read that right. Yes, I meant every word of that. Everytime he was on screen, I liked how deep of a character he actually became. Brad was 100% correct in that the Chaos parts (minus one blood ragey guy...) were amongst the best parts of it. I kinda wanna read more on Abaddon himself, to be quite honest. Sure, he had to fail 12 times to get it right, but the character himself seems much more interesting then the memes give him credit for.
Guys I wonder if Cadia is gonna fall
I really appreciate the recommendations because idk where to start and my first audio book was the talon of Horus so I almost need the recommendations so I'm not wasting my audible credits.
As always, I appreciate your unabashed stanning of Chaos. They really do have the best moments.
For those that had a problem with the narrator for the audiobook, it has been re-released with David Seddon as the new narrator. It's way better and I would suggest a re-listen as this is a Great Novel.
Thats Crazy that this got a new audiobook in basically a year and gaunts ghosts fans are still waiting on a re-do for salvations reach with Toby Longworth
Whaaaaat I tought it was about the Cadian autumn
So I will say thank you for saving me time and money. From what you said I'm not really interested in the book but great episode thanks again
To me, all the voices were like when someone is trying to sound like they're yelling without actually yelling. It creates this weird, strained effect that almost sounds like a constipated grandpa. I eventually got used to it, but there was a period in the first couple hours where I didn't know if I was going to make it...
I personally love the book club episodes, please never stop doing them! 🙂
it’s Cass-er-kin oml i love this show but i am gonna scream
I thought so, but then Brad kept saying it different and he listened to audio. Nope just the midwestern 'accent' and brain damage. lmao
Huh, I always read that as Ka-sar-kin, because going from s straight to r just sounds bad for me
Very thankful there’s more self-narrators out there
I can't believe even a different book discussion pushes me further to really want to read Infinite and the Divine
_Fell off, did she? What a blow for her._
Gonna watch this after i finish the long af book, but want to do the pleasantries
Peter Kenny's work on the Culture series is fantastic and I'd love it if he did a WH40K novel. Yes to anything Culture related, more people need to discover that series
Personally I think Jonathan Keeble does a great job on 40K. It's unfortunate that he clearly hasn't been briefed on how to pronounce some names and his chosen voices/accents for characters don't always stay consistent between books, but when he's voicing a daemon, my god, that guy COMMITS
You mentioned speeding up the playback on the podcast. I accidently slowed it down by one notch and was seriously questioning if you both just toked up before you started.
Please talk about the culture series.