The Rise and Fall of Trollhunters⎮A Tales of Arcadia Discussion
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- Опубликовано: 1 окт 2024
- The Tales of Arcadia series was a stand out animated show that had a similar spark of ingenuity similar to Avatar: The Last Airbender. Following three connected TV shows, books, comics, and a final movie, you’d think that the lore and execution of the ending would be of the same calibre that the rest of the story upheld. Well… you’d be an idiot for thinking that apparently, because that is far from what happened. At least, that’s what I thought when I watched the Rise of the Titans for the first time. But since having time to breathe and look back on the series as a whole, maybe it wasn’t as perfect as we originally thought?
Hear our thoughts and let us know yours in the comments down below!
We LITTERALLY had a "what if" episode SPECIFICALLY showing Jim that if he ISNT the trollhunter, the world would end. Period.
So what does he do?
Hands the Amulet to Toby. That guy might as well be roadkill because there is no way he could keep pace with what Jim had done first. [Im not against fat guys becoming the hero, but we r talking marshmallows and apples here.] So much for "you were chosen by the amulet" if Jim can just NOPE on out 😐
Duke would have been a better trollhunter. Or Steve 😐
“Roadkill” 🤣🤣💀💀
A year latter Del Toro makes a 2 hour sequel film on where big suprise turns out Jim's dad is secretly the Fourth Arcan member if not the creator of the Arcane and Jim gets both the Amulet and Excalibur back as well...
Firstly, the episode you mentioned is NOT saying the world would wnd if he isn't the troll hunter, it was saying it would end if there was nobody besides Draal, seeing as Draal took the amulet after Jim left it. But in the movie they play it out like Jim won't hear the amulet call at all, Toby will.
In other words, the amulet will choose Toby instead of Jim, meaning the correct trollhunter is chosen so the world doesn't "die". And plus, I feel like Toby seeing the bad guys he has to fight like Bular and Gunmar will make him want to quit faster than Jim did, which would make for an interesting play out where Jim knows if Toby wants to quit being the trollhunter then things go to shit and that Toby would never have the heart to let that happen. Where Jim failed, Toby would notice too quickly that the world needs him and all that.
And on the comment on Toby's weight, he would probably find some way to balance out his thickness with his fighting style, so yeah, for a while he would be all sloppy and bad at fighting, but he would figure out how to work with his body which will not only slim him down or whatever, but it'll also mean he would probably be more of a heavy hitter than Jim. Because Jim wasn't always strong enough to continuously strike, but I feel like after Toby trains his body not to get tired after like, 5 minutes of biking, he'll be really dangerous in battle.
That's all. Anyways, that was all coming from a Toby fanboy so like, do with those facts what you will-
OH, forgot to add this! The reason Douxie wouldn't be allowed is because he has magic that forces him to be long range and the amulet would recognize him basically, because of the paradox where Douxie helped with the making of the amulet, and knowing there are lots of other choices.
As for Steve, he was a douche for so long in the beginning, it's only fanfiction hope you hold that he won't just use that to his advantage in that fight he and Jim were going to have. He would use it for the wrong things or not care about certain things and make for a terrible hero to start. Sure, you can mold him into something great, but that doesn't stop him from knocking out Jim's teeth on sight with the armor-
@@Izaac_Artist i need this
im gonna be honest, toby dying and the story just continuing with everyone having to grieve over his death and eventually trying to get happier, would have been MUCH better. also? what a friend jim is! jim has so many times stated how hard it was for him to be the trollhunter. the incredible ammount of stress and pressure put on him was devastating, and he decided to pass that ammount of stress and pressure on toby? :/
This is exactly why we say, shows nowadays for this generation can never be better than the shows that used to come in the early 2000s or at least and the early 2010s.
YES, Toby is a likeable character but I can't see anyone but Jim as the human trollhunter
Right also the show stated that Jim was the only one who could be troll hunter, also if you knew what was going to happen and how everything falls into place and you're trying to save everyone why would you give up your only chance of a secured future
@@wingedgirl7035 NO YEA ITS WEIRD like??? how ….?? if EVERYONE dies when Drax becomes the troll hunter why wouldn’t that happen if Toby became it? We had an entire episode EXPLAIN why Jim was the only one who could do it 😨
what where the thinking with that ending
The real problem is that Rise of the Titans should t have been made.
Instead of a movie, there was going to be a second season of Wizards, and you can tell that as certain elements like that magic tech support, and that pink haired girl were going to be set up for bigger things. It’s kind of why Wizards felt crammed and rushed.
Yes i love wizards and that movie should've been it had good element for a show and it would've added on to wizard and made it better than already my love wizards and 3 below more than trollhunters , the whole pregnant steve was a very very bad move i still question why aja even like steve and wanted to see much more krel and douxie and see how they interact
Yeah, I felt like Wizards actually started with its second season. Trollhunters had a nice build-up where Jim grew stronger before it really started to put the pressure on the heroes. Wizards was just constant pressure, which made it impossible to put away, but was exhausting to watch. But my bigger issue with Wizards is that they unmade every bit of history Trollhunters ever shared, and then it didn't even affect the present day they came back to. It would have made far more sense to me if they came back to discover a new war with the Arcane Order that they had inadvertently triggered by their actions in the past.
And I've decided to pretend the movie never was made. They had an opportunity to wrap up so many satisfying character arcs but they failed on every count; even Jim decides to back out of everything he's learned by not being the trollhunter anymore. I found Steve's arc particularly interesting to watch, and I really wanted it to end with him actually forming the Knights of Arcadia and becoming a hero on a similar level to the trollhunter. I guess they just couldn't let go of him as comic relief and mpreg was the only way they could think of to try and get him that role back.
Yes, and we definitely didn't needed to see them shoving a FETISH inside a kids movie and excuse it as "comedy".
You know what... I have to agree. It really did look like Wizards had a lot going for it, and I would've been down for a second season.
@@user-un1uo9mt9q 😭🤣
what saddens me the most with the whole “restart ending”, is the loss of blinky’s and Jim’s relationship. He was the father Jim never had and offered guidance in the hardest battles, but now since Toby is Trollhunter, blinky’s attention is obviously going to be on Toby not Jim
I’m replying late, but what saddens me the most is.. everything. The loss of relationships with the Akiridions, (varvatos, Aja, krel, zadra,) Eli and Steve’s friendship, Jim and Claire, Toby and AAARRRGGHH!!!, Toby and Darci, what I’m gonna miss most is probably varvatos and Nancy, of course like you said Jim and blinky, and there’s a lot more. I just hate the restart ending. He could’ve restarted to the start of the movie to prevent the deaths, but no, they had to restart to the start of the whole franchise
Does anybody have or wan make a discord server of Tales of Arcadia?
I watched this show when I was younger, so, the nostalgia is probably the worst part, but there were a lot of forgotten friendships 😢
There’s a lot of crap I could say about Rise of the Titans, but if I start I’ll never stop. Basically the big problem with the restart ending is that they already explained Jim HAD to be the Trollhunter in Unbecoming, then basically said, “NVM guys forget about that,” it ruins the impact of Trollhunters being that Jim was the only one who could be the Trollhunter, he had to make the sacrifices he did to save the world.
@@invertedLOLit explains Jim has to become the troll hunter without him Gunmar wins and shows how much the worlds needs him they just threw that out the window so possibly the timeline the movie left off in possibly ended up like in unbecoming who knows I just think they could’ve ended it better
I still can't believe they thought ignoring "Unbecoming" just to make ROTT's ending was the best thing to do.
I guess, the world will end in tale's of arcadia universe. As we saw in unbecoming.
Truly
@@Oreo_Editz Yep
Most of the time I pretend Wizards and Titans didn't happen but when I do I prefer to believe that Jim kept his hybrid amulet. It was a different amulet with different armor and bound to his soul and that he will remember his responsibility when Toby dies just as Draal did. The horribleness of Titans can be made to work by having it result in more horribleness, there is no saving Wizards it fucked up the lore and history way to much to ever be made to work.
If I'm remembering correctly, Unbecoming is the episode where Jim wants to quit and is sent on a small trip to see what would happen that way, right? Correct me if i'm wrong. Does the episode explicitly state that it has to be Jim or just state that Draal is destined to die a failed heroes death if he doesn't become the trollhunter? Becausenif that's the case, changing trollhunters doesn't change the fact that Jim is still in the equation, like up in Toby's business so he can help Toby become better, even if he has to hide some stuff for it to happen. Like, preexisting knowledge looks bad on you if it's something like "Trolls exist and they're going to come looking for you", like Toby woild be the first to try and call out his bs as his friend. Anyways-- if the episode says it HAS to be Jim, then yeah, ignoring Unbecoming was stupid, but if it just meant Draal would be a failed hero if he used the amulet instead of Jim and not that it NEEDS to be Jim then making it Toby is fine in my book.
Then again i'm a toby fan grasping at straws coz it feels like a moderate amount of ppl r hating on toby or like,, trying to excuse hatred or whtvr you call it when ppl r like ew fat person with "the ending was bad" 💀
@@creepslayingsteve6058 I really like tobey as well, but tobey just won't survive as the trollhunter. Tobey is a great character, but not a really good trollhunter in canon wise, unless the writers make him really good. The ending is bad not because tobey was trollhunter, its because it completely ignored the entire point of us watching the series, 6 seasons for 6 years, they completely destroyed every character development of every character. It feels like a wasted amount of time for us to be investing our time in the series. Literally, every great franchise has been ruined now.
Let me mention:
1. Trollhunters
2. Cars
3. Toy Story
4. Jurassic World
5. Star Wars
5. Pirates of the caribbean (ending was bitter sweet)
6. Hotel Transylvania.
7. Ice Age.
......etc
I still love this series a lot despite the ending of ROTT because of how much it meant to me when I was in those low places...I really hope Guillermo's shorts get greenlit so there's at least some redemption for that disappointing ending...
Fun fact: The original ending for ROTT had a time skip and the main characters heading off to college but some executive somewhere said it was anticlimactic 🙃
Edit: Also Wizards deserved two seasons. Douxie deserved that room to shine properly-
I agree completely, Douxie deserved better; that thorrible ending in the movie doesn't take away any of the things there are to love in Trollhunters and the other shows.
Honestly I think the only reason it ended up terribly was because of dreamworks' desire to make more money throught rebooting it
@mynameisnoname Dude, Miraculous is trash, no one cares, We are talking about tales of arcadia franchise, not some toxic girlish kids show. How is that even related?
@@Oreo_Editz ikr
@@puffersaur6422 yup 😂. And i do agree with you douxie deserved better. Technically, douxie is the strongest one out of all of them. But what did he do? He watched from a distance jim and bellrock fighting. He could have easily destroyed arcane order like he did in wizards.
That exec is Marc Guggenheim, AKA the hack that ruined Arrow after season 2.
I think Del Toro is still going to continue it because in articles I’ve read someone on the tales of Arcadia team said that Del Toro still has something up his sleeve for tales of Arcadia
Hopefully there’s a new villain and we get to see tons of creatures that we never seen . Plus they should probably show the origin of the arcane order maybe their backstory on why they became the villain in the series.
Ofc there gonna do something big because the movie at the last moments Jim wished that Toby was the troll hunter
Second movie maybe where we see Jim and Toby clash since they both are the troll hunters now since we have no idea if the new Amulet traveled back with Jim or not so as far as we know Jim could still have it
Ok everyone, Redoing all 3 series and the movie, but with Toby! All animators and story writers stand up and leave the room.😅😆
I hope so if we’re are getting a rebuild Tales of Arcadia 1.0 you are (not) the Trollhunter they better make sure we get the good ending this time.
Toby getting the amulet implies that it didn’t originally choose Jim because it thought he was the right one but because he was the closest person to it
It chose Tobey instead but Jim had changed so much since it first chose him, he was no longer worthy
Blinky said the amulet chooses a specific person but he never said it depends on who is near the amulet
Anyone can touch the amulet but did it choose Toby
@@yoshigirl5760 considering the amulet was calling for tobys name, yes it did choose toby
I’ve never seen a franchise throw away six years worth worldbuilding and character development so easily. It’s truly troubling that the writers took this route, and with no sequel announcements a year later the series is truly tainted with this ending
I agree it's very sad
How about we pretend the movie is non-canon and have a new story ending for the series.
Well game of thrones did basically the same thing
@@hanacinnabun How so?
@@YangTheAce they goofed their finale, and essentially erased all the character development they had been doing for like a decade ://
The ending of trollhunters is truly depressing. It makes me sad every time I see something about the franchise, and I can't believe that's the feeling I am left with of a once very much loved and hyped series.
I hate what they did to Jim's character arc, and I agree that it wasn't only the movie's fault. The whole trollhunters story became overshadowed by the world expansion they tried to make, and it's sad because as you say it wasn't bad, but it was too much and they didn't know how to handle that many characters and storylines.
But in the end, the movie is still what killed it for me, the horrible humor, beloved characters like Strickler dying out of nowhere, all the characters telling Jim that he should stay aside because he's weak without the amulet, wait what? Really? After all the seasons and Jim showing off that he's more than capable with or without the amulet?
And the ending is just trash, I still don't get what they were going for with all that nonsense, the time traveling thing makes everything pointless, I get they wanted to give Toby more relevance but that wasn't the way of doing it. Jim was the chosen one and the show made sure to make it really clear, why changing that at the last moment? It just erased all the character and story developments they made within the whole series.
And the worst part is that I don't think there's something they can do to revive the franchise at this point, I used to rewatch the seasons many times waiting for the next one to come, and I can't do it anymore, I don't wanna watch it again because of the terrible ending and knowing nothing will matter at the end. I don't think I ever experienced such a huge disappointment with a show before, it just makes me sad.
I know right. I just pretend that nothing exists except the Trollhunters series which was sooo good. Merlin was so clear on his choice with jim and then now toby is the Trollhunter its just tragic.
yeah like the show was sooo good but because of the ending i just feel soooo empty inside
I agree, you completely conveyed all my feelings and thoughts after watching this unnecessary movie and wasted potential
Exactly how I felt after watching ROTT. I was disappointed with the ending, and now anytime I see anything related to the franchise, I feel sad. Because everything that happened up until ROTT was erased. Character development and relationships that have grown since the first series, just gone. Some people have said that Guillermo del Toro will continue the franchise in some way, but I just don’t see how it could be redeemed after ROTT.
same :(
but I still hope for a miracle, maybe something or someone triggers something to make timelines change back and everyone remembers because i feel so damn empty inside this show kept the fire in me alive but now it’s dull
Personally, I think the downfall of this frenchise wasn't a slow one. 3below sure felt a bit alien to the pre established trollhunters show, but it included characters and concept in a way that felt fresh while still tying up to the original.
For example, we actually do meet the taco seller we have all been slowly introduced to throught Toby's love for them and them coming up usually. I agree the Trolls were allied with Aliens felt weird and they didn't have a major motivation in the movie, but they still fit in, they even did have a motivation, just one taht wasn't properly introduced in the movie, but it was in 3below.
Aja and Krell found out that their parents could have saved millions if they just helped a planet save itself, which emphatizes their responsability and duty on preventing something like that to happen again. And yes wizards was very rushed, but it was still something fresh and exciting and I think Douxie's perspective was only a benefit to the show seeing how Jim spent most of the time with the trolls. After all the title of the show was litterally wizards, it made sense for it to be his story. Furthermore, Jim being attacked and knocked out was something foreshadowed in the end of 3below, so it only gave further context, it wasn't something out of nowhere.
Im not saying this frenchise was perfect, in fact, I do agree Jim becoming a beast and then a human was out of nowhere along with the fact that the characters in rise of the titans could have all used more time and character development. But while Jim's entire arc taking most of the time in the movie was off, especially since he already learnt he was a champion even before the amulet, which is why Merlin chose him, it did make sense. He was back to square one and Merlin himself died, all his achievements having been thanks to his friends and the amulet and now the only wizard left that can help him, leaves and everyone has still powers while he feels like nothing, he helped everyone and tried to save everyone but in doing so he lost what made him come this far, he projected his security on the amulet for so long due to him having become bound to it, for what may have very well been forever if he wasnt cursed, that his sense of selfworth crumbled.
But yeah we didn't find out what happened to the trolls, Chumpski and Claire's changeling brother or any of the other babies that were left to Strickler and Barbara, the pregnancy side plot and the sidelining of most of the characters and Douxie not getting his moment to shine after loosing all his best friends were bad. But the deaths of Strickler and Nomura were done right, they were supposed to leave us feel uncertain of who else would die. Imo the movie was great apart from a few things and the horrible ending that ruined everything and undermined Douxie's lesson on not to mess with time and Aja and Steve's babies future, it all just felt off.
The frenchise's fall didn't come down to the show having too many characters, but not respecting their consistency in what was meant to be the end, you can tell they were running out of time in wizards, heck Guillelmo even went in and said they wanted to have a second season of wizards instead of a movie. But they didn't and it's most likely because of dreamworks, this is not the first time they completely reset a show like they did to puss in boots.
I think the crew behind the shows did its best to do all it could, but because of dreamworks' desire of shortening its run and leave off a chance to reboot it to get richer, ultimately killed it.
The crew was clearly passionate in these characters, they would have never brushed of their development, unless someone forced their hand, which the industry of entartainment does a lot.
I think this masterpiece's death wasn't caused by its change of paste or characters but by the industry's desire for money.
Luckily tho, the episodes are still good to watch and here on youtube, some people are trying to give it a satisfying ending with Trollhunters:A story reborn. So im pretty optimistic, despite what the executives have done to this absolute masterpiece
Also if you're into fanfic I recommend Trollhunters Becoming by Yeeter_Parker, it does have the return of troll Jim but I like how it's written :)
But definitely agree with you 💯
@@heebiejeebiesofthehighestorder Ty :), also I'll totally check that out
@@heebiejeebiesofthehighestorder I'm working through that one! I think it does a lot of things right, so I've enjoyed what I've read so far. :)
@@heebiejeebiesofthehighestorder
I vouch for that one. Super good read.
There's also another one: "Trollhunters: Returning" (i don't remember who wrote it tho)
@@heebiejeebiesofthehighestorder another great one is "Your Future Hasn't Been Written Yet" by Sakon76
Anyone else think That Jim should've stayed a half troll? I feel his form was super underused. I mean he was in a coma for a majority of it and in wizards he made so much progress connecting to both sides of himself.i really liked it, and then it just got reversed...
yeah fr, It gives me the same feeling as when shows just remove a characters disability from nowhere,,
I loved half troll Jim 😭 I wish the amulet had made it a part of him. As in, if he were to call on the amulet of eclipse “For the doom of Gunmar, Eclipse is mine to command!" That way, he can go from human Jim (Daylight amulet) to Half troll Jim (Eclipse amulet.) Half troll Jim was short lived and wasn’t given enough screen time.
The troll form represented something special in Jim's heroic path: sacrifice. It was supposed to be a permanent change for Jim, willingness to sacrifice everything in his human life, including his future, to be the true hero we all know him to be. Some say it was controversial, I saw it as cool. It took the hero and changed him in a supposedly permanent way at the 11th hour, reflecting the very virtue he represented. Then, Wizards just undid it willy nilly. So disappointing, and sad.
I’m a straight ass dude and the whole time half-troll Jim was there, I was just thinking about squidward going "OH NO HE’S HOT!" I’m talking about the version with the armor, not the crazy one.
I wish his half troll form looked like the thing he fought in I forgot what it was called…The queen threw him in there and you had to fight your worst fear that thing
I really hated how dirty they did Steve with the alien pregnancy instead of finishing his arc by actually shredding his scaredy cat personality whenever he's confronted by a foe, if anything Aja should have gotten pregnant since she already finished her character arc and this could have lead into us actually getting to know steve and also the fact that she's female. If this movie was made into a season or a few seasons we could have gotten to actually see Steve's mom and actually discover why his home life is broken like I would have loved to see an Akaridian knight Steven and his mom talk about all this danger and maybe Steven's parents could have been teen parents and they just weren't in a good relationship and maybe his mom can talk to him about not being like his father and give him good advice and Aja could meet his mom. I'm trying to sum up the whole story idea like I've been thinking about how they could have finished the series and had a continuation of the Staja kids. Like if we were given pregnant Aja instead of the weird male preg steve we could have had an mix of Akaridian, knight, and creepslayer outfit for steve and had him fight and maybe loose an arm like Sr Lancelot like they had so much stuff to work with from the two previous series to build up Steve. I also would have loved to see how Akaridian 5 treats hybrid children and maybe a Staja kids continuation could include the kids finding their place and exploring the galaxy or maybe Claire x Jim's kid or Claire x jim kid and the staja kids become the next gen heros to stop new foes like the movie waisted so much potential and cramped in too much stuff in that made the movie bad also and side characters and some main characters just weren't like themselves in the previous series. Like Doxxie outsmarted the 3 elemental guys (I forgot their names) by himself yet in the movie he couldn't think of a smart plan to actually work same with Krel he's super smart and we know not much of a fighter but the movie didn't have them work together to come up with a plan and Aja she didn't seem like herself at all maybe because she's been Queen for a year but Aja once said Earth was her home I agree with her having an evacuation plan but she didn't even want to try and protect earth from being destroyed she just said theirs other planets like it. Aja should have still stuck with the excavation plan but still focus on protecting the Earth. Now if They had Earth be reborn instead that could have been interesting to and lead to another different continuation. I just think instead of the movie we got we should have gotten a few more seasons or another series or two. (Maybe I'll make my own vid about it that's organized instead of this long over the place rant )
I read only a sentence and your god dam right I also wanted angor rot to have something
Yeah, the whole pregnancy thing was weird to begin with.
you misspelled akiridian
@likeaboss5574 Angor Rot was a character I wanted to be featured more especially after him changing his bad side to good, but he got killed 10 minutes after changing which was just a waste.
I don't wanna see pregnant minors in this animated film to begin with.
3below is my favorite out of all the shows in the franchise but I really didn’t like how in the movie they basically just ignored aja and krel the whole time but tried to make up for that with Steve getting pregnant and all that just didn’t work
I loved 3Below the most too!
Yes, I also love how they use "I'm an alien from another world and I came to Earth" as a metaphorical excuse for illegal immigration, believing themselves to be the first to do it when there have been thousands of previous series and movies that have done the same. Only with them the directors forgot to say "By the way, that's a metaphor for illegal immigration."
i really thought Steve's arc was gonna end with him getting Excalibur, not him getting pregnant and becoming a massive joke :L
@@TurbopropPuppy I HATED THAT, I thought that would be all the show was, so i just stopped watching the show altogether, it was SAD to say the least.
@@TurbopropPuppyRight hopes were dashed
toby dying and the story just continuing with everyone having to grieve over his death would have been a better ending, then they could have showed a monologue with claire and jim, grown up, with a son named Toby and a statue of toby in the town square.
The truth is, i think this was something miraculous ladybug would have pulled to be honest...
Ouch, I see that coming
good damn as bad as the writing is for ladybug they are not that stupid. they did it for a few episodes and ended it there. never for the entire franchise
OOPSS
@@user-km4lo8zz6z disagree miraculous is 100% more worse than this ending, you give them to much credit
@@Keith_Norman no i don't. miraculous is far better than the last 5 mins of this garbage
father figure,troll friend and others die
Jim: it is sad
Tobey:dies
Jim: YOU HAVE CROSSED THE LINE
exactly but i do get becuase toby has been there since the beginning of everything
Honestly, I think the downfall is because of the episode constraints. Wizards should've had more episodes and RotT should've been a miniseries instead.
(To me, this franchise was perfect in its three series until the retcon ending of Rise of the Titans, I was so distraught about it that made this rewrite to give people some closure who were freaking out over the ending. For anyone who wonders, I wrote this back when the movie came out and posted in under different review channels, which is why is sounds like I'm treating the movie like its a new thing. Hope you enjoy it.)
I admit the movie to me was great until the reboot in time. there were a few plot points they could've changed to make it better, but i can live without them. Hopefully this isn't the end of the series since it leaves things open for the future, however I would've at least loved an Avengers Endgame moment with not only the main characters, but all the other characters and armies involved with the Trollhunters like the Trolls, Akiridians, Foo Foos, the Tech Wizards, Charlemagne, Zadra, Trolldragons, NotEnrique, Soldiers of 49B, and Eli with his Parking Drones, maybe even along with the people of Arcadia in fact Jim could've used the Time Stone to pull a doctor strange and bring back characters from the past before they died such as Nomura, Strickler, Vendel, Kanjigar, Deya, Former Trollhunters, Nari with her Titan, Mother, Kubritz, Buster, Tronos Madu, Aja and Krel’s parents, Merlin, Morgana, Nimue, Arthur, Lancelot, Galahad, and the knights of Camelot till the end of the war as their presence would be temporary in order to keep the weight of their previous sacrifice and the I would have the Time Stone break after usage due to the amount of power needed to bring everyone back temporarily.
Also I would've kept the ninth configuration prophecy, but I honestly think Steve should've gotten Excalibur since he worked so hard to be a knight in Wizards, Excalibur would help in completing his character arc and leading the Trollhunters because hyping up Jim to be the big hero, but to in the end have Steve be the savior of the world would have been an ironic and incredible twist, but in the end together they would succeed and then I would've killed off Steve by having him use Excalibur to destroy the Primordial Heartstone before it's too late completing his character arc. I would've also changed the whole pregnancy arc making it more serious and replacing it with Steve and Aja thinking about being parents one day after Aja explains the seventh kiss to Steve giving them a small character arc making Steve's passing more heartbreaking as to allow Steve's legacy to live on as I would've had Aja kiss Steve moments before he dies, but it would be Aja who gets pregnant.
I'd even put in a small romance arc between Douxie and Nari already established and filling in the gap between Wizards and Rise of the Titans explaining their time together on the run because I found that the person with the least character arc was Douxie so adding the romance between him and Nari at least gives him more of a character arc in the movie since his more major arc ended in Wizards and it would also make Nari's death all the more heartbreaking.
Finally to make the battle fair and make more sense I would've had Bellroc make it to the Primordial Heartstone, but they still had time before the rebirth was done, however the Primordial Heartstone would amplify Bellroc's Magic allowing her to create an army of Fire Golems from the Fire Titan's body creating the reason for everyone to appear both living and dead for the war. I would've also emphasized on Jim and Aja's disagreement in leadership leading Aja to go behind Jim's back and call for the evacuation fleet lead by Zadra, which is the reason she's on earth and makes it to the final battle.
I then would've had Jim confront and at the end of the confrontation decide to agree with Aja's plan since the Gun Robot didn't work and so this would lead into Krel sending a message out to the entire planet Earth to evacuate and I would've used Area 39B to be the ones to convince the government that the threat is real and so agree to evacuate all of humanity and bring them to Akiridion-5 for shelter until further notice, however I would've also used the message scene to show characters in Arcadia that were not in the movie earlier and it would be the message that convinces the people of Arcadia to fight in the final battle.
After all of that I also would've ended it with a timeskip showing Jim and Claire married along with Darcy and Toby married and show how all the other characters moved on with their lives such as a grown Aja ruling Akiridion-5 in peace, while raising her seven children, as well as an older Nana and Varvatos watching her from the streets of Akiridion-5 while holding hands and then I would've revealed that the opening scene was Blinky telling the Tales of Arcadia to Jim and Claire's unnamed child then at the end a grown Jim and Claire would arrive to pick up their child and then it would end with the hero speech voiced by Anton Yelchin from episode 1 of Trollhunters, while panning out the camera to reveal a newly rebuilt Trollmarket under Arcadia. I only hope they continue from here because this does not really feel like the definitive ending Guillermo Del Toro promised and since Time Travel has been used a lot more I can definitely picture the next saga revolving around the multiverse.
(Plus I also think the pregnancy plot was not needed because it really didn't have anything to do with the main story and had no lasting effects on the plot I'm sorry, but it's true. Also I feel like Darcy and Toby's Nana should've been present at Toby's death since his Nana is his only parent whose been there for him since his parents died and Darcy is his girlfriend so her scene saying goodbye to Toby would prove that Darcy fell in love with Toby showing that he finally earned the love that Jim and Claire have)
I absolutely LOVE the changes you made to the storyline and would totally watch this movie! I also think that Steve should have been the one who died (I even made a comment on it you can find under Smarty Pants’ “who will die in rise of the titans” video!
THIS IS AMAZING I would have loved to see Steve have his own character arc and then dying off in the end rather than Toby. I wish the writers did this instead.
This is amazing, I love this finale. I want this to be the canon ending
I officially have this story in my head now as the true ending. 😭😭 You shoulda been on the writers list 😭😭❤️❤️
Yeah I agree with everything but I think nana would be dead by the time everyone grows to have kids 🤣🤣🤣(jk btw)
I feel like the drop wasn’t obvious until Wizards. It’s still a great show, but it felt rushed. It only got a season while the other 2 before it got more time to flesh out their story.
For the movie, I think it should’ve been divided into 2 parts. The first would focus on the trolls & wizards side, with the titans and such. However it would also be hinted that their power was more than it seemed. With part 2 the focus could be on the universal consequence, revealing that these titans could go to other planets to do the same to them as the arcane order wanted to do to earth. This would up the stakes, yet better flesh out the characters and not make them feel rushed or shoe-horned in.
That would've been awesome-sauce!
I agree the drop wasn't obvious till Wizards, rewatch 3below I see signs now. Wizards wasn't just rushed it didn't fit with the lore and histories laid out in TH, they crammed what should have been decades or centuries of events into a few days, events we didn't need to see, they should have picked one or none at all just had it happen at some point during the war.
it’s real fuzzbuckets wizards only has 1 season
I expected too much from this movie. I thought that Jim & Douxie are going to most likely be the leaders of the team. And am I the only one annoyed at how Jim is always doubtful about being the Trollhunter? He has to bring it up every 15 minutes. The 3 series we watched was all just a farce?
But the ending.. Man, I was pissed. As a huge fan who have watched since the very beginning, its like all the things that Jim has done, everything that has happened, it all went down the drain, especially after watching the episode "Unbecoming" It was a huge disappointment. Plus i know Dreamworks have a nasty habit of killing off father Figures But Strickler's death really pissed me off. I mean he died for nothing! Man, he was my favourite character.
Anyway, I really hoped the ending would be like what people hoped for. Toby dying and everyone mourning over his death. and to think that they wont be making more of this show. Its sad.
R.I.P Anton Yelchin. You will be missed. Our One and only trollhunter
Yes, Strickler's death was awful( He was my favourite too, and it's too dark for him and Barbara. They deserved to be a happy family... It looked like a fleeting death, as if Strickler still wasn't part of their family.
As Spider Ham says: “The hardest thing of the job is… you can’t always save everybody.”
That would’ve been the ending that Jim and the heroes decided to move on and of course give Toby, Walter, Nari, Nomura and all heroes who fell a proper burial. Imagine the surviving heroes giving their fallen friends a shrine or memorial and even built statues of them as to honor their deaths. Then Arcadia ends with Jim and his allies being declared as Heroes of Arcadia. A bittersweet ending but with great future.
I like your take. however, I personally think the movie ruined the franchise as all the shows were AMAZING. I was truly upset by the movie and extremely disappointed, the show has a wonderful archetypal edge that made it great.
I think the movie is great (expect the ending) because the end of wizards was such a cliffhanger cause you have so many questions left like : what’s happening with the arcane order? or, will Mari be fine or what happened to the main cast? So I think the movie is good to finish off the story. (Expect the ending. They could’ve just let us cry that Toby died and move on with our lives)
Honestly, I saw Wizards first, then found Trollhunters and 3 Below.
And I loved each one in its own way.
But ROTT is where they lost me.
The unnecessary killing off of "minor characters" I had come to like and the HUGE death at the ending.
Then Jim just arbitrarily deciding "I'll create a new timeline where only I remember everything" that killed it for me.
Mind you, there's tons of speculation that the main timeline continues, just without Jim.
But he undid every trial and sacrifice they all had to make to get to where they were.
x.x
I personally didn’t mind the killing off of some minor characters in the movie, it added stakes, (which could’ve been better by making the arcane order separate than the titans) and showed how all the characters have evolved to be able to sacrifice themselves. That could’ve been a really good ending to a movie, but they somehow messed it all up in 5 minutes.
I got so upset when they killed off the minor characters. Like what’s the point of having the characters being featured in a few episodes but then they get killed of immediately?
I disagree with your take on Wizards. Specifically, you saying Jim should've been a bigger character. I feel like Jim's story is done after Trollhunters. Wizards should've been Douxie's story first and foremost. Jim (and the TH cast minus Merlin)'s presence was distracting and took away from actually fleshing out Douxie and Archie and the rest of the story. I would've greatly preferred exploring Douxie's relationship with Zoe over undoing Jim's sacrifice, too.
Yeah, I'm also feel Douxie's character is underdeveloped in Wizards or even *rushed* . We only touch the surface of his characterization, but we already thrown with this world-ending conflict.
*There is no build up to him!*
If only Wizards got the same treatment like 3Below; 2 season, slower pace, getting to know the (new) character better, their backstory, motivation, want, need, and disbelief. Then it would be perfect, than watching unfamiliar focus-character trying to save their ass while we don't even know who the fuck he is.
Seriously, Wizards with Douxie as the main focus is feel like a long road walking with a stranger on another stranger place.
I agree with you.
Jim’s Toby’s Claire’s and all the other ones character arcs have been there
So that means they don’t have to show up that
Personally I think wizards should have just focused on douxie archie Merlin and the arcane order (with references to 3below and trollhunters)
What makes me sad is that they not only killed the momentum they’ve been building for the past few years but they destroyed any chance of the show being brought back
they literally wrote themselves into a tight space
When Jim was a troll and talking to everyone I kept saying in my head “ask Blinky about the stone that lets you walk in daylight” and it drove me crazy cause when they were testing gemstones there was a stone that lets a troll walk in daylight and I was so annoyed
Omg yeah. The trolls have a stone that is literally OVERPOWERED for them and they.. didn't use it? and pretty much forgot about it??
I maneged to get a friend that is really picky in media to see the trhee series just when wizards came out and he got really invested, and we were so exited for rott
And well rott very much sucked
And that really tinted the rest of the franchise
I think one of the reasons that I don't like Jim as much as I did in seasons 1, 2 and half of 3 is the tragic death of Anton Yelchin. I struggle to relate Emile Hirsch and his voice to the character, so then I struggle to think of troll Jim even being the Jim that I grew to love. While I personally did like the troll Jim storyline, it's just incredibly sad that Anton didn't get to finish the project and I get sad every time I think about it.
I agree. I loved Anton Helchin since he was in Star Trek.
right. emile hirsch's voice for Jim sounds like hes trying too hard to be what anton yelchin did for Jim, and its just . not working. im almost done with part 3 but the way emile's voice is just sounds like he's trying to force it to have that sort of raspiness?? that anton did. it stinks that he's gone :(
When I watched the movie i practically screamed, cried, cursed the great name of Merlin himself, then moved on with my life. Needless to say, I went through the five stages of grief in five minutes😅
I literally flipped off my phone screen when they pulled another fake-out death on Jim in Wizards, only for him to revert back to human. (I rlly liked troll Jim man🖕)
I really don’t understand what the writing team were going in the ending of the movie, or just the entire script in general.
In my opinions the problems started in Wizards, when Jim just got shoved to the side and had little plot relevance, and then he got corrupted, died, then turned back into a human. It felt so unnatural to just reverse that entire ordeal since we were told the transformation was permanent, like the writers knew Jim had to be a human again for the movie- he’s basically the mascot of the franchise so they couldn’t just “get rid” of him- but couldn’t find a way to smoothly introduce the reversion into the plot. And yeah Wizards in general was kinda meh, I personally don’t like time travel plots so I’d automatically like it less, but there were a couple things i liked. This show definitely deserved another 10 episodes at least.
Then we get to the movie, and everything goes off the rails. I was super exited initially but then the writers completely RUINED Jim’s entire character arc and he goes all depresso espresso for the entire time. Like, in the episode “Unbecoming” in the hypothetical future where the amulet gets destroyed Jim says “Amulet or not, I’m still the Trollhunter” or something. What happened to that??
Aside from that, the Aja and Steve sideplot was just plain gross, I really don’t like what they did to Elie and how so many characters were killed. Like, Strickler and Barbara were going to get married and then he just dies?? :(
The ending was complete trash, I really wish they gave us ANYTHING else, like even Toby just dying and everyone learning to move on wouldn’t been better. It SUCKS this is how this amazing franchise ends but I guess we just have to deal with it.
Sorry for the rant lmao
Edit: spelling mistake, mean “would’ve”
I was saddened by the romance of Jim and Claire has "finished", like he's started over, and Jim has already experienced this romance once, he's going to have to suffer all over again .
It so sad Rise of the titans ended the way it did it really shot tales of Arcadia in the foot. I still can’t believe they pulled a 1993 Mighty Max finale “Armageddon outta here” but somehow worse, because at least Mighty Max’s ending was excusable the creators couldn’t get a 3 season and did not want to end the show abruptly so they went with the time travel end.
I pretend the movie didn't like that. Even though certain characters died, it's a lot better that way. I felt like my emotional investment was made fun of. Like why should I even care on another watch of the whole franchise at all? It removed the tension from the series as a whole.
Destiny vs being in right place at the right time.
Basically the ending felt like they are trying to get rid of the destiny and chosen one trope. Jim whole storyline
Feels like him learning to accept that he was chosen, this is what he was destined to do, that he is important and there is something special about him.
Rewinding time and having jim set things up, so that Toby can be the hero, kind of implies anyone can be the troll hunter as long as they aren’t one of the shows villains.
Also it was super annoying to see jim shake his responsibility and just kind of play a puppet master role where he kind of maneuver all the characters into positions he thought would create a happy ending. It was very unsatisfying and kind of wasted all of jim’s work and growth from the previous timeline.
From a writing stand point, I kind of feel like the only way to go would be that stuff starts going really wrong. Like something happens to Toby and jim has to get more Involved, things don’t work out with Claire and jim has to work with Douxie and explain to him what happened
I agree! That story arc would be interesting, and in addition, I would like for Jim and Douxie to have to also restore the old timeline.
@@ceciliafaith4132 yes, exactly!
Also it should end up with Jim trying to change the timeline, failing, going back in time again and then going to Douxie to fix the timeline.
Also things shouldn’t go back to the original timeline, instead events should change if even slightly to keep jim on his toes.
The ending while being open ended, anything could happen in that timeline, kinda wish we got a spinoff like maybe "Tobyhunters". But... Unbecoming showed us what would happen if Jim was never the trollhunter so Jim could have doomed everyone, maybe Jim could've done almost everything the same but with his knowledge, he would know alot of what would happen. I personally liked ROTT but the ending contradicts Unbecoming and we'll never know what will happen with Toby being the Trollhunter.
I personally like to remember the Shadow Dimension exists as a mysterious realm and imagine the many possibilities that could be used to fix the series using it. Claire lost character development? Boom fixed with the Shadow realm forcing a connection with her. Want Jim to be the trollhunter? The Trollhunter amulet in general was the catalyst for the time travel spell and even if Toby was connected to it, Jim would have to have one since the time travel has to be sustained. Add destiny to the mix, and you could get that Jim can override Toby's connection to the amulet. So fanfiction to the rescue.
"Out of all the creatures in this world, I chose you."- Merlin
Alright, he chose Jim for a REASON. The episode "Unbecoming" was literally meant to say that if Jim wasn't the Trollhunter, the world would be DOOMED. Now let's just give it to Toby, he's definetely not gonna be a Human Unkar! Hm.. how about Tobias the Terrible?
the main issue i have with ROTT is that they essentially under-powered the characters and ruined all of the character development that happened throughout the three series.
the writers had their villains so poorly written that they therefore had to under-power and reverse character development to make the villains seem more powerful.
especially with douxie. he really deserved better. even though wizards was (sadly) only one season, we did see quite a lot of character development with douxie and we saw how powerful he is, and he clearly had potential to be so much more powerful. i honestly thought he would become the new main character for the movie.
jim has had his time in the series and i thought that they would have handed it over to douxie to be the main character to fight the arcane order (as they were more fitting villains for douxie than jim. as they used magic like douxie, and we got a glimpse of them fighting in wizards and saw that they met their match with douxie)
BUT they completely disregarded all of that and made douxie so weak and made him look like a waste of space tbh… we SAW that he could hold off two of the arcane order on his own in wizards, but in ROTT he was knocked out with one hit? lazy writing. absolutely lazy.
MY ending (if they really wanted to go with time travel) would have been to send douxie back in time and have him observing from the sidelines and making sure everything goes as planned. this is because we literally see him in the background and interact with the main characters throughout the series as a minor character.
honestly i could rant for hours about that movie it’s SO bad :(
yeah I agree and I think your alternate ending is pretty good and yeah makes sense cause when you first watch the show your like who is this guy and why is he always around and then later he gets introduces into the main story so having him go back in time could have worked better like still not an amazing ending that I would’ve gone for overall but in terms of having to fix the time travel stuff it’s better than what we got
My friends and I were very invested in the ToA series, it's how we all met. And we created a bunch of fun characters to insert into the story like a changeling wizard raised by one of Merlin's old apprentices, a human who got sucked up into everything and came out of it with dimension-breaking angelic powers, and a mother figure to the Arcane Order who was a passive creator of the universe and friend to all the other characters. The ending of Rise of the Titan's killed our interest beyond that au we made, so we've done a lot to separate them out. And yeah, one of the main things we did to make the story more cohesive was remove the aliens, and we made it so that time travel isn't something you can do willy-nilly. We actually changed up the Rise of the Titans arc so that the timeskip was clear and that the Arcane Order aren't the villains, and it flows much better that way. Honestly, our story changes so much that it really isn't the same thing anymore, and I love it. We can't get away from the roots that is ToA and we're never gonna forget the good times we had with the series, but RoTT really killed the franchise right where it stood. It'll only be something I look back on fondly despite the ending, and that means that's a series I'm not likely to rewatch anytime soon.
So you saved the show by killing aspects that made it great, and ruining the show?? I swear to God, you can enjoy it however you like, but with the sound of what you just spoke it seems like poorly thought-out fanfiction
I agree with the second guy here, this sounds like _very, VERY POORLY MADE, BAD FANFICTION._ Plus, that angelic OC that one of you guys created sounds just like a Mary Sue/Gary Stu.
I remember that I literally needed to rewatch the ending, because I couldn't believe that they did that.
If Del Toro still has an idea up his sleeve I hope it could be something like Jim seeing that making Toby the troll hunter was a bad idea and see what Jim goes through seeing his friend die again with the first major fight of the show.
It could be a plot line of Jim pointlessly trying to fix the timeline or him realizing that he could only be the troll hunter.
I refuse to believe that the movie goes after Toby's death. THAT IS THE END.
Let's all be honest the biggest tragedy in this franchise is what they did to Steve in the movie!! Steve is my favorite character and reducing him to nothing more than a joke that was the opposite of funny makes me wish I wrote the script to the movie.
Tbh, I just want like a 3 below stand alone series, would love to see more of that honestly!👽👍
It felt like a Spiritual successor to Genndy’s Sym-bionic titan in places I really enjoyed it.
I really, really loved Trollhunters. This was my fav show, I've ever seen and I watched the series a lot of times. In my opinion 3 below wasn't that good like the Trollhunters, but also was great. Wizards also. But when the movie came up- I really was dissapointed and now I can't watch the series again, even if I would pretend that behind Trollhunters (series) is nothing. That's really frustrainting, cause I really loved the series and that has been taken from me
P. S. This isn't my national language and I'm still learning, but I hope that I wrote it understandable
I never really liked this franchise, I watched sixteen episodes of trollhunters, got bored, and didn’t want to watch it again however I’m still happy that others can enjoy this show and I’m so sorry that you guys witnessed the show have such a downfall and a crappy ending
Trollhunters is slow to start. Id say watch 3Below first and then watch trollhunters. Youll be much more invested and plus 3below is awesome from start to finish
@@The053199 Yep 3below was my favorite trollhunters good but Barbara was the WORST!!
@@The053199 I 50% agree with you yes 3below is better to start with but trollhunters is the beginning of the tales of Arcadia series.
in 3below you get spoiled that Jim becomes a troll and defeats Morgana with his friends (and that she even exists)
so I would say start with trollhunters
After that ending it something Voltron legendary defender would've done Or Miraculous after all that great character development i felt is if the writers of the movie were spitting in everyone's face at that point.
Wizards should have been extended
Absolutely loved Trollhunters and 3-Below, these shows were what really got me into animation, it's just sad that they didn't get the ending they deserved.
My biggest issue with the movie is how they tried to get rid of the destiny concept. I understand that the idea of "destiny" is cliched somewhat, but in Trollhunters, I felt like they did a really good job of showing that Jim was destined for the role because of his character and hard work, not just cause the plot needed him to be; him being destined to be the Trollhunter never felt forced, it just felt like he was always the right pick for the job because of his personality. Ditching that idea in the ending felt terrible and made him finally earning and showing how worthy he was of the role in Trollhunters feel like it was all for nothing.
Another problem was trying to merge the stories a bit too much. I was watching these shows for Jim's individual story and the alien's individual story, and I didn't really need them put together. I think it would have been neat if there was a merging of the two in a meaningful way, but it just never really happened, and that frustrated me when it was so hyped up.
It sucks because I absolutely loved this series. Especially 3 Below.
I totally agree with the 3 Below statement. 3 Below was an amazing show, I LOVED it, but it was a flaw to the trilogy. It's story was completely ignored in wizards and played no significant difference in the plot. Krel was in only 2 or 3 episodes and just as a minor character. In RotT, Aja was portrayed as more of a jerk. She was a fearless warrior and now the Queen of Akiridion, but made the suggestion to run, flee earth, flee from battle, and not fight the titans instead. So much wasted power this show held. After 2 seasons of so much character development, it was thrown out of the window. The Creepslayerz were also ignored. Steve went from a bully to a friend with a good heart, he changed for the better. We watched Eli literally grow right before our eyes. 3 Below played a huge role in further developing Arcadia and its citizens, like Nanny Domzalski. We saw Aja and Krel become new people (Akiridions), make new friendships, and learn what it means to grow up. True, it doesn't work well with the TrollHunters theme, but it works well on its own. It is a such a unique spin with so much potential.
Overall, I think the movie and Wizards was rushed and forced. They felt forced to include so many characters, all with some screen time. All needing a part to contribute to the plot. Jim was more of a side character. He was given so little time to deal with the pressure of being a human hero, with or without his amulet. All of this time used to build up to this makor conclusion was just burned into ashes because of the time plot twist.
I can't believe how Jim gave Tobi the huge and painful burden of being the Trollhunter :(
My only major issue with 3Below was that we only spent a single episode on Akiridion-5 before the escape to Earth when it should've been two - Episode 1 ending with Morando starting the coup and Episode 2 being the escape. It just feels too rushed for a single episode.
Toby is my favorite character, I cried at his death. but in the movie we went back as if it had never happened. While watching the movie, I said how brave they killed so many characters. But when I got to the end of the movie, I realized how cowardly the filmmaker was and that they were trying to earn money by making some more episodes. They trashed my favorite franchise in my life.
I honestly think it was a great franchise but with a TERRIBLE ending 😠, I know about time travel plot to an extent that every case it involves a paradox . The ending pretty much destroyed the entire series that we watched and loved, all the characters developments are literally not going going to happen. Toby is a good character he especially played an important role in the 3 Below series but since he’s the troll hunter he’ll need to leave the area when he becomes a troll. Everything that happens needs to happen even though Jim knows what will it will just alter the timeline and make things more complicated or even worse, the ending could have been better 😔
Okay, I've gotta say that I wouldn't have wanted Jim to be the protagonist of Wizards, I mean...why should he be? He wasn't in 3Below, he's also a side character there. I just think we should have gotten another season or two of Wizards instead of the movie.
I feel like if we get Morgana and Toby moments it would be a great comedic experience as they are the funniest in the show
The end of the film kinda ruined the message of the series for me. Like, the 'what if' episode showed what would happen if Jim weren't the trollhunter. He HELPED whenever he could, before he got the amulet. Toby didn't. He changed during the show, his death was the perfect (but absolutely sad tho. I cried :/) ending of his arc because he didn't look away, he died for the world and he died for Jim without thinking about it. In the first season, he was sometimes much more egoistic (let me remind me of the Steven-Scenes. he always cared more about him and about not getting into danger and not about the others). But after a few seasons, he became a hero.
But there is one more thing: When Jim traveled back in time and stopped helping others, that is not Jim for me, it ruins the whole message. Jim learned to help and to be a hero, but instead of BEING a hero and going through the grief and sadness, he stopped being one even WITHOUT the amulet. He didn't help Eli when Steven mobbed him. Why? Instead, Toby becomes the trollhunter but without proving that he's worth it at this point of the story. We, the community, know he's worthy later. But at this point? Like, really?
I think, the franchise could stand above so many problems, like the jokes about Steven and Eli, too many characters, too many deaths and too much action without real drama and character development in ROTT. But that Jim after learning to carry his burden LAYS THAT BURDEN DOWN AND JUST GIVES IT TO SB ELSE, that's something I just cant forgive. It's like giving up and that is not what the show stood for.
Well, sorry for the long text. Got kinda aggressive tho
They couldn't have Douxie and Jim work side by side in Wizards because they'd be to powerful of a duo.
I mean, they totally should have gone that route because Douxie and Jim would have been besties (and as some who ships Jimxie... well, I'm not opposed to them having more screen time.) And just... THEY WOULD HAVE BEEN SO POWERFUL
i think they could have worked with it tho.
like having them clash because they’re both so powerful and leader archetypes in a high stress situation.
like they’re powerful on their own but they cancel each other out in a group situation. idk
Honestly, yeah the aliens should have been it's own show...
And that Marlin part....
Gods...
The whole trollhunter was about the magical device that been powered by stones...
So when wizards came i thought it will be a wizards learning the powers of other stones making the gumgum the enemy and thus starting the whole need for trollhunter... But nope time travel so jim can meet everyone
The show just became too much after season one of Trollhunters. Things started changing at an incredibly fast pace, and it was impossible to mentally keep up and be satisfied with. I did not like the ending of the first series in general, but both 3 Below and Wizards were a telltale sign for me that things were not going to get better in the franchise. 3 Below was oblique, and Wizards just felt so... stuffed, I guess. This video covered everything that I was so upset with. None of this ever occurred to me when I first watched it years ago, but ten-year-old mean didn't know what was good for her.
I want to make a petition for Guillermo del Toro to do this again and do it _right._
The movie was even worse for me because it came out on my 17th birthday. My mom and my family wanted to do something with me, but when I told them I wanted to watch a movie coming out on my birthday on Netflix they respected that and I was granted my brothers house to watch it uninterrupted. I am so upset with this movie, it was basically a birthday gift from the creators of my favorite series, but it was so terrible. It simutaneously became something I could never watch again because of the cringe and the sadness and ruined the whole show for me. The worst birthday I had, it even tops the one where no one showed up to my birthday party.
I saw all of this last year in August or September it was a really good watch and I got to the movie and I just didn't like it even three below was good despite me not liking much of it but that movie was a real let
down and I think if maybe they had done a wizard season 2 instead and then maybe later on I did a movie with a different thing to it it would have worked better and the
Arcadia series is a whole would be better remember by fans and more people would have got into it I only watched it because I kept seeing people complain about the movie and wondered what the show was about but I'll be real this ended better than Voltron did
THANK YOU
I HATED THE ENDING
WHY WOULD THEY SHOW US STEVE HAVING KIDS IF THEY'RE NOT EVEN GOING TO BE REAL ANYMORE
WHY WOULD THEY COMPLETELY DISCREDIT "UNBECOMING"
AHH
Gosh there was _so much_ I hated about this ending. First off, gotta get this off my chest, the whole thing with the alien pregnancy was just MESSED UP. The implications of that are icky in so many ways (like, if that's how the aliens reproduce that means that every time we saw them kiss on screen was the equivalent of them having underage sex, which ended up leading to a teen pregnancy) and it was treated as a very juvenile _joke._ Like... GROSS what the heck! Who greenlit that!?
Secondly, I HATE how not only did they erase everything that happened throughout multiple series, they worst of all RUINED Jim's character. Seriously!? After all that pain, all that turmoil, all that _trauma_ throughout the series with Jim struggling to come to terms with being the Trollhunter, Jim is just gotta throw all that onto TOBY and let him deal with that instead!? They had an entire episode in Trollhunters that showed what would have happened if Jim didn't get the amulet, and they _really_ hammered home the whole plot point of "the amulet chose you" and how Jim was chosen because of his quality of character and goodwill... But NOPE apparently they threw that out the window! It means NOTHING! And Jim is just content with that... It really makes him feel like coward for backing out, even though he now _knows_ everything that will end up happening.
He basically had access to New Game + but instead of playing through it himself he decided to start a new file and let his pal Toby have a turn playing through the game. Its such an awful way to end it!
My personal headcanon is that Toby finds the amulet, picks it up because it looks cool, and then brings it back to Jim to show him leading to Jim getting chosen again. There's no reason why the amulet would choose Toby instead, and just pick whatever human just happens to be walking by. :/
Just cause one knows the events to come dosnt mean they'll be so easily changed.
Merlin himself is a prime example of that.
It also feels like Toby lost all his character and became a self insert.
I was cheated out of a satisfying ending
3:02 I think, realistically, there is something wrong with 3Below, and that would be how they showed the overlap of the Troll Hunters plot. Just about all they had to do for those overlap scenes was render them with altered camera angles to focus on the different characters and make some minor adjustments to the dialog when the alien characters were out of range of the Troll Hunters. Instead, the creators completely and unnecessarily reanimated and re-dialoged those scenes. That 100% took me out of the story because it no longer synced with Troll Hunters.
my biggest problem with the ending of rise of the titans is how wildly out of character it was for jim
for one, a massive and i mean *massive* part of his entire character arc and frankly the show as a whole was the fact that *jim* is the trollhunter. there was even an entire episode specifically dedicated to why having anyone aside from jim be the trollhunter is a Bad Idea!!
for two, a highly important part of being a trollhunter is the emotional weight of the title. a lot is placed on the trollhunter, and they have to make many sacrifices while still being able to move forward and make the best moves to save the most amount of people. tobey cant do that. jim knows tobey cant handle that weight, those decisions, and frankly why would he want to put his best friend in the world through all that trauma and hardship? he looked at all the pain, suffering, and loss he went through, and decided to shove that onto someone else without any choice of the other party. that was incredibly selfish of jim, and so far beyomd who his character is
Hard hard agree here. I couldn't believe they had him spend three seasons coming to terms with his sacrifice and duty only to have him not only just give it up, but pass it on to his best friend
A better theme for the movie would've been learning to share the burden with others. Let him lose his amulet, sure, but make it more about his unwillingness to let his friends lift up the mantle. It would've revolved around his reluctance to let more capable people to complete these tasks, with the ending being about letting his friends make the final blow. All else could've been the same, but the self doubt as a trollhunter didn't make a lot of sense
Maybe this is just me, but I hate that Steve was just played off for laughs, in the earlier seasons, it didn't bother me that much, but as he started to become more of a main character and even started learning how to fight, i just thought it was annoying how he did absolutely nothing in the end.
They undid three whole shows of character arcs and development. That´s probably the worst ending a show/movie can have. Everything gets undone either because it was a dream, a game, or just time travel.
The film ruined everything bruh
I genuinely had to pretend Rise of the Titans didn't exist. That didn't happen to me. Toby, Nomura, Strickler, and Nari aren't dead to me. They managed to defeat the titans in such a way that no one had to die and Jim didn't have to restart everything. Walter and Barbara got married. That ending just did NOT happen for me, I don't care if it's canon
Edit: And Steve getting pregnant. What the fuck. Why did they make that happen
I agree with you. Just because Strickler is one of my favourite character in this series. And Strickler and Barbara is my favourite couple. Destroying their happy relationship in that movie we do not be named is a crime.
@@Yavanna79 So true! They were so happy together, and Jim really looked up to Strickler like a father
same
its not cannon
Im a big ToA fan. And I consider half of the movie canon but when nari and skrael die, it’s just feeling weird and rushed
This is why shows/ movies should to stay away from time traveling unless it's integral to the plot. Cause it's always used as a cop out method and cheapens a work if use incorrectly. Look at avengers: endgame, great movie but we can all agree the time traveling stuff
was a mess.
To be honest, I absolutely loved Wizards. There were a few things that seemed rushed or out of place, but I did really enjoy it. I do agree it would have been neat to have Jim work alongside Douxie more, but he still handled things on the Troll side. He helped inspire the first Trollhunter, which I thought was really interesting! Considering he never thought he could be a good one.
The thing that killed the third movie for me, was that any development, any characters, any story arcs from the other series were completely disregarded and everyone was reset to how they were at the end of Trollhunters. Like, Claire went through so much cool character development in Wizards. But then in the movie she was reset to just being support for Jim's character. Same thing with Toby and Steve. Every other character in that movie felt...flat. They were there to be there, and they were delegated to pure support. Details that were established in other shows, like Douxie using his wizard staff over his rune bracelet, weren't consistent in the movie. A lot of the character deaths felt empty. Like they happened for pure shock value or drama, and how they died made no sense or added to the story minus Toby's. Jim himself was completely reset to how he was during Trollhunters, and I agree it felt like his development took up waaaay too much of the movie when we had already seen this character arc before.
It would have been so cool to see him trying to do things like he normally would have with full confidence, and then be consistently knocked down a peg. The others trying to protect him, but he gets angry and does the thing anyways which causes problems. So then you see that development of him going back to how he was, but then finding a new strength instead, as a true leader. Not just, oop, the amulet's broken, I guess I'm useless now ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ And the other characters still relying on him, and constantly encouraging him, when it didn't make sense to. It was like, even without the time travel, none of the other series mattered. None of their development, the stories, anything that was built up for the movie, mattered. The characters felt weird, and off. And, if you look at who the writers were, it all starts to make sense why.
The people who wrote a majority of the episodes for Trollhunters, were the writers for the movie. Three Below and Wizards were both written by entirely different people, and my guess is they didn't have any say in the movie. I could be wrong, but it appears the ROTT writers decided to include the characters because they had to, but also tried to completely write them out of it. They didn't feel like part of the story, because they weren't meant to be. The story was focused on Jim, the character they knew. Ignoring or undoing all the development for him, and other characters' development outside of the stories they had written. It's why it felt like a lot of the characters regressed instead of progressed. Many arcs felt incomplete, characters felt weird, abilities they had weren't utilized, and why the aliens were left to be used as a gag instead of actually adding to the story. Not to mention, what happened with Steve was just...terrible.
The movie was beautiful. I loved the designs of the Titans, and the animation was absolutely gorgeous! But the writing was so terrible, and I think that's what happened. I feel like they could have easily included all of the characters, and had an equally meaningful impact on the story without constantly being delegated to Jim's support. Like, we'll do this so Jim can do that! This thing will happen to specifically affect Jim in this way. Let's do this so Jim can be the hero! It just felt like the other characters were only there to move Jim's story and his development along instead of being themselves, and I think that's what made the movie so terrible and disappointing. The time travel at the end was just the icing on the cake. Why go all the way back to give the amulet to Toby, when he could have just gone to the start of when the Titans showed up? It made no sense. Nothing in the movie did.
And that's why I'm going to continue to pretend it doesn't exist lol
Honestly, I would have given Wizards some length
Season One: It's similar to the first two seasons of 3Below, with some crossover to Trollhunters and we get to see some of Douxie’s backstory, which in my opinion should have been more interesting than what we did get to see.
Season Two: That's when we get to see the rest of the Trollhunter team, except Jim, who didn't get sharded in the amulet and won't turn into a big old hulk troll monster and instead stays the same cinnamon roll half-troll we all love and we also go back in time to Camalot which I think was an interesting storyline.
Season Three: That's when we go back to the future or the present and we're introduced to the Arcane order a bit more, I don't know how this will play out, but I'd like to see the Green Knight introduced and definitely Morgana returning, perhaps that's why they needed Jim for his amulet, except he won't turn back into a human and instead, will just basically be armourless.
Top Five Reasons Claire is the WORST in Wizrads:
1. She's selfish
2. She's annoying
3. She's a HORRIBLE girlfriend
4. She's self-centered
5. Her obsession with Jim
Explanation: I felt it was INCREDIBLY selfish of her to keep Jim alive while SHE KNEW he was suffering, and she only wanted him alive for HER own benefit. Cause it's all about HER and how sad SHE'LL be if Jim dies. I couldn't even enjoy the series because of her. That's my reasoning for why I hate her.
I wound up starting with 3Below and loved it. The big thing that initially bothered me was the amount of plot we didn't get in the actual show. I think there were so many elements introduced in the books and games that were lost on me when I watched. That combined with how rushed Wizards felt, and I went into the movie feeling uncertain. I liked it overall. But having gone back and watched everything...I'm glad I wasn't anticipating everything because I would have been disappointed.
The ending was extremely disappointing.
Trollhunters wasn't perfect but guillermo del toro couldn't give a good enough reason for it to end like that. i was ready for it to end with barbara and stricklers wedding and everyone would be invited and it'd be a celerbration of a series that meant alot to many people but the time travel ending is just awful because as was said in the video, it erases EVERYTHING it just makes no sense and will forever make me sad
I think the show had so much potential but the character design was incredibly boring and could have been so much better to com I ate their personalities and make them stand out. Clair could have been a sick warrior sorcerer, Toby could have been more than a fat joke and Jim could have been more than a white brunet boy. Jim’s armor could have been a cool forest armor with wood and moss on it. Rather than just silver armor. And Toby getting the watch at the end was the stupidest decision he could have made. He’s an idiot who will absolutely die immediately.
I hated the fucking ending. I'm actually mad the movie at the show for doing that shit. I never seen an ending so bad. I literally love the arcadia franchise but too build up so much love for that damn show just to have that stupid ass ending. When toby died I cried but know I think he should've stayed dead. Just like he said 9:19 through 9:57 there is no reason to watch a show that doesn't love it self basically. >:(
I really liked Tales of Arcadia really well, since 5 years ago, especially the ups and the downs for these characters, where Jim started as a generic high-school lad who became a hero, his bestest best fat friend Toby who's his neighbor and he's a moral support(until Jim travels in time to give the mantle to Toby, by suggesting him to take the canal to stumble upon something interesting, while he's making things right for all of them), a major flat-turned-main female high school sweetheart who became a shadowdancer Claire, and the trolls, a 4-eyed father-figure Blinky, and a gentle giant AaArRrGgHh!!!, which at first a 4-man-band(consisted of Jim, Toby, Blinky, and AaArRrGgHh!!!) in a Bular-Arc which Claire's too much flat character can be bothersome(even on Waka Chaka(aka Changelings Among Us: Part 1) and Win Lose or Draal(aka Changelings Among Us: Part 2), due to Win Lose or Draal, gets Claire her smallest episode role ever, due to that trope), to a 5-man-band(Same amount of characters from the Bular-Arc, but additionally Claire's added!) as of the Angor Rot-arc to onwards.
Despite those peeps hoping here's a Tales of Arcadia revival series, while others asked about Blinky who had his own series, am I the first one who asked you guys, what if Claire has her OWN series since all otherwise being part of the Tales of Arcadia franchise???
I never thought of Claire having her own show before, that’d be awesome!
@@Bea-xl9rb I hope it was so awesomesauce alright! I knew that I’m the first one who, what you peeps never thought of before, asked about what is Claire/Clara Nuñez having her own series. 😉👍
I feel like if they just kept the troll hunters series and made two more seasons with a better ending and left it at that that would have been amazing, I felt like 3 below was unneccasery same with Jim Turning into a troll
This sums it up perfectly. But especially the ending is trash. They did the same thing with the Puss in Boots show. Its actually a very fun quotable show, and in it Puss saves and changes many peoples lives. He helps villians become heroes. Helps people who have lost any hope in their lives find meaning again. And then he has to go back in time tot he beginning and make sure he never does any of that because reasons. So now everyone is screwed all so that the character could be available for another movie if necessary. Time Travel endings back to the beginning are trash. Troll Hunters was amazing. 3Below also amazing for pretty much the same reason, I don't quite agree that it was where the show went wrong, For me Wizards was where it went wrong because as he stated they basically focused on the Wizard magic storyline. That was the wrong choice, They should have focused on the Hearthstones. Why was there one in space. Why was Arcadia Oaks the center of the universe. We could have had space wizards coming down and douxie having to face off against them. We should have had a search into the source of magic and how it affected the universe. Taking Wizards down an old Arthurian legend idea was trash because they basically were watching BBC's Merlin and decided hey lets use this storyline where the king hates and despises magic. Maybe show that morgana was half alien wizard or something if y ou wanna tie her back in but leave the tired old Arthurian legends where they belong.
and remember they killed strickler just because why not 💀
For me the ending of Wizards was what began to build the coffin, tho the movie was the one to finish it and lie on it. But it's ending is such a coffin base that even before the movie was announced, I knew that whatever came next would be bad.
The thing about Trollhunters that made i so good is that it had consequences. Sure, the character arcs and storylines are awesome, but other shows have this two. However, it's hard to find animated shows that the actions of the characters and things that happen have permanent consequences. Even erasing Barabara's memory didn't make it go back to how it was before, it had made Jim's arc go forward and impacted their relationship, as well as changed Barbara's understanding of things around her (Strickler for example) and she had a moment of discovering her memories had been messed with.
Another example of permanent consequences is Jim's troll transformation, most shows would have him find a way to turn back after the fight so it can end in a way that everything goes back to how it was. In Trollhunters, however, this action has permanent consequences. He does not turn back and he cannot live the life he used to anymore, he has to go away with all the trolls.
3 Bellow and most of Wizards also follows the same permanent consequences logic, tho they focus a lot more in world building and character development (which is great), however, Wizards ended with Jim turning back to human. It set him back to "how things were", the typical Heroe's Journey ending. Jim turning back to human is not something that would have happened in the original series. Not being an evil monster controlled by the villain? Yes. Turning back human even tho you had already transformed yourself into a troll a long time ago? Never.
It immediatly made me think that whatever came next to this franchise had a high chance of destroying the franchise's legacy even more. Once the "everything went back to how it was" mentality sets it's ugly little eyes onto something, the problem only grows. One "oh the main character turned into X thing (evil, monster, etc.) But by the end of one ot two episodes they're complete back to normal with no permanent consequences to his" plot and you can be almost 100% certain that it's gonna be a "an everything went back to how it was" ending. It's like a desease.
I will be making a fan fic to fix the ending and continue on the franchise
I agree that 3Below was shoe-horned into the story for no real reason other than mix sci-fi with fantasy (which was fun, but it didn't work in the end). It felt really dumb how Nomura and Strickler died for no real reason and ho there were all of these terrible happenings like Steven getting pregnant and Archie being separated from Douxie, so they had no choice but use time-travel. They did the same thing with the Grimm finale, Ninjago: Skybound, and Jumanji, and it's always felt icky. It feels lazy and cheap, using time-travel as a plot-device to undo plot holes.
In a way, I like to imagine that the series is the same, but slightly different, with things going they way they went but with some more silent guide from Jim, Toby being the MC with Darcy as the LI --- not to mention Jim interacting with Douxie, Steve, Aja and Krel differently. I'd like to see a short version of how Rise of the Titans would turn out differently...but it would be hilarious if it turned out worse and everyone got mad at JIm for messing with the timeline!
Personally I’ve always hated reset endings where everything goes back to the way it was. It basically undoes everything that has happened over the course of the series. Not just TrollHunters, but 3Bellow, and Wizards. It undid all the bad, but also undid all the good. The threat of Bular, Gunmar, Angor, Morando, Morgana, AND the Arcane Order is now back. And it all now rests on… Toby… to stop it? Idk it just felt like a really weird ending overall.
The first three seasons of troll hunters are absolutely awesome. Seeing Jim grow from a normal teenage kid to a badass warrior was an amazing experience. When rise of the titans ended, I didn’t know how to feel about it. But I do agree with everyone’s thoughts that the ending could’ve been better. Still, the troll hunters show is still great on its own and Guillermo del toro should absolutely be proud of that.
the movie was grandiose and an amazing visual spectacle, but it spat on so much of the shows by abandoning previous plot points (strickler and barbara returning changeling babies, the connection between trolls and aliens, whats happening with jims body, finding a new hearthstone, aja and krell adjusting to new lives, claires shadowmancy) and instead brought new shitty and or unnecessary plot points (steve pregnancy (hes like 16 this is bad) and wizard apocalypse and a bunch of death) And overturned old lessons like f*cking with time travel and jim being the best chosen one (with the toby stuff)
one of the most prolific douxie artists on twitter worked on the show and said a lot of wizards story got cut, including a lot of stuff with zoe, douxies pink wizard gf. theyd clearly put so much work into douxie and wizards that never made it past the storyboards, and id bet it was the same for the whole show.
id say youre right and some things were going badly from partway through - i found some of the individual 3below episodes to be very confusing and oddly written. while wizards was good, parts of it also sucked major ass.
the movie was just a bad cherry on a sloppy sundae, nosedived much like star vs the forces of evil did, and i personally think everybody making attempts to rewrite it has the right idea. its tragic really
I try to be fair but as a part one fan of troll hunters I’m sorry del toro lost his head or we let a idiot who has a bad day say “Let most of the key characters die but cancel it”
i honestly think that the whole tales of arcadia franchise would have been a lot better if we had something like 5 seasons of trollhunters, 3 or 4 seasons of 3below, and then a movie in which somehow the akaridian space dudes team up with gunmar or morgana or arcane order or some other evil on earth and the squad, in unity must face them all for the same cause.
I honestly think that would've been 100x better
It all went wrong with the time travel if we just forget that happened then it ended pretty well
Troll Hunters: Perfect
3 bellow: Good
Wizards: OK
Rise of the Titans: PURE TRASH!!!!!!
I agree. Trollhunters and 3 Below were both excellent (albeit it very different from each other), but Wizards was a huge step down in storytelling and character work (the writing in general feels rushed and sloppy), and the movie... that movie did as much for the Trollhunters series as the Last Airbender live action film did for its animated series.
Trollhunters was The best But the Movie Ending was Something else Bruh like seriously Jim Has Some many Experience's Now Your Telling me He couldn't just stop somethings from happening somethings Should still happen alright but not everything... Instead of That The dude Give his Mattel to his friend Bruh like seriously He calls him self a best friend by Giving The trollhunter Title to Toby who has 0 Experience plus Do you how much Struggling,Breaking Points and Lies Jim went Through Now Toby is Gonna feel all of that IT pains me to say it but I will say it But Am kinda happy and sad That we didn't get a Sea4 okay My 1st Reason is If We did get a Sea4 It would be probably the samething that happen from Jim's Pov it's Now be Toby's POV it would be kinda boring in my Opinion Because we gonna see some samethings Play out Again They better say This is an Alternate Timeline or something bc I have no idea how it would have made much sense..
Me:This is How It should Ended in My Opinion Alrighty 1st Pick Back The Amulet okay 2nd Thing Tell Toby about it...Defeat The 1st Enemy B4 They Get the Chance to attack 1st
Convince Strictland and Namora To Join his side well the Claire will still play out the same plus here brother getting getting kidnap will still play out the same somethings will play out the same this Time you have plenty of Experience so you and Your friends Go in the darklands together,Kill Gunmar Then and their when you engaged in Combat with him recruit the rest of the Team Build up the Team by letting em interact with each other Well I Could go on and on find a Different way to kill The Order Preventing them from waking up the Titans and end at in Sea6 Let it end when everyone is Looking at the Camera Now that Is How I Picture How it Series should Ended Sea4 and 5 is about Building Up The Characters and Villians in My Btw in My version AnGorrot is a Good Guy Hunter and Drawl and The Old Elder is Still alive I can go on and on but this what I think all for now
But in Trollhunters it was shown that Merlin already knew Jim was a trollhunter in the future and that when they found Merlin in the tomb he was expecting them and he was expecting Jim and he knew he was a trollhunter. So how did the amulet choose Toby. Maybe if Toby would take the amulet and show it to Jim and then the amulet would be returned to him and what would happen when they find and wake Merlin from the tomb and Merlin knows that Jim is a trollhunter and yet Toby is a trollhunter. How would Merlin react. Or maybe Jim wants him to be a trollhunter because he knows that he should rule excalibur and he can have another amulet from the excalibur stone but how would excalibur come to the future it's complicated but write me what you think?
The ending was very bad. All that character development? GONE.
And the fact that after Nari died, it hit Douxie hard, and then they just POOF throw him to the side and not show anything about him grieving?
The ending really maddened me honestly.
80% I'd say I'd the movie being crap and I do agree with your points. But in the end isn't just going to do it all over again??
Fact is that the 3below won't change story wise because the end up crash landing on earth regardless of troll hunters.
Wizard could change yes but still.
The ending was just plain dumb. Also what was the point of Steve being pregnant just for Jim to reset the timeline? We really could've gotten something better. The writers wanted to take the lazy way out I guess.
i think the movie before the ending of it was ok just average but THE ENDING TO THE FILM RUINED IT FOR ME AND THE WHOLE FRACNCHISE ya sometimes i rewatch episodes i liked but still
I need to watch the rest of the franchise cause I think I only watched the first two seasons of trollhunters and loved it but remember a huge cliffhanger and never remember watching anything where it got resolved,