Great review! I appreciate the fact that you didn't pull any punches. I was looking at Qnap vs Synology, My main purpose for a NAS was just to replace My Drobo 5D3, (I cried when they went out of business) I started out with a Synology 220j and immediately realized that I needed a bigger one as this was a viable replacement. I ended up with a DS1522+ with 32RAM, 2x1TB NVMe cache drives and 4x 18G Ultrastore and 10GB NIC I originally got it as just a dumb storage but now I am using it as a VPN, SFTP, & Media Server (sorry Not plex fan...mainly because you cannot uninstall it cleanly) But you are right. Synology software seems to be better developed than Qnap. Thanks for the review
I have been using an older QNAP TS=453 Pro for almost 6 years. It is used primarily for PLEX (works great). Other uses are mainly for a file/FTP/Telnet/SSH or server. Great thing about it is, I am at this moment upgrading the NAS from it's 4 each 6TB drives to 4 each 12TB drives on the fly and will also resize them on the fly. It's nice to do that. One more thing I like is (not sure about synology), if I change QNAP boxes when mine goes out, I just have to make sure the Firmware is updated and insert my drives (in order), to continue to operate. I did this when I upgraded to the one I have. There are other things that are good, (i.e.HBS Backup, QVPN, QuFirewall, Music Station and the Qfile, or Qmanager, Qmusic from my phone). Yeah I'm stuck, and it wasn't easy in the beginning. My 6 year old machine has a Celeron J1900 CUP (4 cores 4 threads) and maxed out at 8GB RAM. Not to mention the 4 ethernet ports. Not bad. I want to upgrade, but my other half says it has to break first.
"... but my other half says it has to break first." Which it very well might relatively soon, as the CPUs are known to be afflicted by the infamous LPC bug. Ask me how I know. Keep a 100 ohm resistor and a soldering iron at hand for when it happens (alongside instructions on which pins on connector LPC-CN1 you need, you can just place a traditional resistor with leads on the back and perhaps use some tape for insulation - it's not a super hard fix if I can do it). First symptoms may include failing to perform a warm reboot, and once you get a fan failure warning you know that it's toast. On the upside, it seems my fix has been holding up for 14 months now already, and another guy's TS-251 has made it over 2.5 years. Which is a good thing because that NAS is kind of important for our backup workflow. The unit was originally bought at the end of 2015. I'm hoping to nurse it along long enough to be replaced by something more modern, maybe even SSD-only, possibly DIY (stuff inside the QNAP is pretty off-the-shelf all things considered).
Software that is intuitive is sometimes the exception not the rule. I think Synology is the home NAS leader and most competing products are gunning for them. I would love to rebuild my NAS with a NAS case and leave it at that. Great video and good review
QNAP - Flip on SSH, SSH in as 'admin'. If you are like me it is possible to setup a script to run at boot that adds your normal user id into the sudoers file. With that said QNAP is clunky to me and I've debated on replacing the OS with something else. Running on Unraid on a different machine and it has been doing a bunch of things better than the QNAP ever did.
I have sold my actual Synology and returned the ordered DS923+ because of hardware compatibility limitations. I did built a custom NAS, going this way is better for me, the power consumption is higher with 30% but the processing power and the limitations are no longer an issue. Until now there was no issues what type of ram or hard drives are used, now they want to milk the users for some more funds, in this case no thank you.
i went the route of using a Terramaster 4f-423. it’s pretty much the same thing as this QNap but has 2 2.5g network connections. the usb’s are 3.2 iirc. i run UnRaid instead as the TerraMaster OS sucks. i was about to go Qnap but got the TM for less at the time. i have 32gb for the memory too and that works fine.
You can use one of the PCIe NVMe SSD to load the operating system. You just have to (I was told) load the OS when preparing the NAS with the Hard Drives out. Then you can use it to boot up on. Again I was told this by QNAP while I was looking to upgrade my system. It's slower than most but hasn't failed me yet (although I failed it a few times).
Good luck with QNAP! i reverted back to Synology last year because of security. Qnap is one big security issue ending up in ransomeware infection. Even it is not open to the internet and only using their cloud-backup software.
The security issue you're referring to was fixed over 6 years ago. So you're saying you never bothered to install the automatic updates QNAP sent out as they were released? Even synology has had some very public security issues.
@@MrRobarino Nope, some wrong assumptions; the nas was up to date, behind a firewall with no ports open and it was early 2021; Qlocker. After that there some other ransomware attacks with a lot of victims. For me no more Qnap. Everybody needs to decide for themself but I only want to mention that to my opinion Synology is better than QNAP concerning security.
@@MrRobarino there have been multiple QNAP security issues over the years. Including a hardcoded back door, which is an absolute dealbreaker for me to ever trust them. Check GRC‘s “security now“ for details.
Synology is still way behind on some hardware. They are still putting 1gb ports on semi-pro models instead of multi-gig ("2.5gb" is just a deliberately hobbled multi-gig port marketed to "consumers"), and still no ECC-ram on many DS models. I know people aren't running down-time critical database servers with a 2bay nas, but ECC is appropriate for any system that has long continuous periods of uptime because errors accumulate and an error in the OS/application instructions can cause ongoining data corruption even though the data its self didn't reside in memory long enough to get a stand alone bitflip error.
I feel that Synology has the advantage when it comes to consumer level experience. Things are changing though for Synology and it feels as though they are abandoning the prosumer market and regulating their consumer level products to their upcoming Beestation products which at first glance seems to be more locked down than their budget DSM Nases. The depreciation of certain apps lately is notably concerning.
I have run one for a while (QGD-3014-16PT) I can say it has been solid as a NAS and a 16 port switch. However....the network setup is not straight forward and all their software is as described in this video, Mostly ok, but just a bit....sith. Nothing is intuitive and you do tend to spend some time scratching your head about what needs to be done. Support is somewhat poor and if you are out of warranty, forget it. I had one update pushed to the device with just a two weeks of warranty cover left to me. The update killed the unit dead and it took 6 weeks to get an RMA even after they had a remote connection to the unit to diagnose/test it. Then came the "its out of warranty" problem even though it started within warranty. But....all sorted after 6 weeks. I would say if all you want is a basic file share NAS, these are a good choice. But when you are spending the money these cost, almost any older PC with two drives and truenas or Unraid will be cheaper and easier to support. If you are spending QNAP money on a NAS device, go synology. I have no experience of synology on a day to day basis, but what I have seen of it says to me that I made a bad choice when I bought into my unit.
Honestly I'm overwhelmed with the options. I'm using Samba with Ubuntu currently just for storing files. I did the next cloud thing for a while. Unraid, Trunas, Proxmox w/ vm, CasaOS, Synology, QNAP. I have no idea what I should go with. I'm mostly worried about family photos and videos.
Synology is almost completely cloud replacement. Email, documents, photos.... Most of what you'd do with Apple, Dropbox, or Google; you can do with Synology. That said, you also want everything backed up. So maybe that's a Synology or other NAS at a remote site backed up over the Internet. Maybe it's a storage service like Google Drive, Backblaze, or Crashplan. RAID is not backup. For me, Xpenology has been good for about 7 years. I can't afford a true Synology yet, but that's my goal. The flexible storage options are a big selling point - I've got 3x 3TB drives and 2x 8 TB drives in a single array for about 16TB of usable storage. UNRAID has that option, but most other DIY or off-the-shelf NAS's don't.
@@BenReese it's what I'm looking for. I was hoping to merge some of these servers together because I have a Pi with Home Assistant, NGINX. I will probably end up with two separate servers so I don't screw the important files up.
What I've learned is that if you use SSD caching, it's better to have a backup battery in case of power failure. Anything in cache when power fails is either gone forever, files get corrupt, the entire array won't work correctly, or all of that in combination until you wipe and redo the entire array. At least that's what happened to me on my Asustor NAS where I lost a small chunk of files, files corrupted (most video/audio files only had partial working portions), and the array kept crashing. I eventually used the SSDs as the main array for the OS and apps, which Asustor allows (Synology doesn't allow this, at least non-Synology branded NVMe), and the HDDs as the storage array which had worked great with no issues since. This actually allows the HDDs to sleep when not in use so you won't hear the drives and/or save on power. It worked great when I was using it but it was a pain with Plex when playing because it'll need to spinup all drives (2 by 2 sequence HDD spinup). I tried Synology later but as I mentioned earlier, the HDDs all need a copy of DSM on each drive in case of failure so no disk can sleep unless you turn off all the automatic updates and background processes which was a no go for me. If I could keep the NAS in a different room, noise wouldn't really matter but space is pretty limited for me. It's generally cold storage anyways so putting drives to sleep is a must for me for noise and power savings. I ended up going TrueNAS again which meets all my needs with the hardware I already have laying around. It's also a bit more flexible for me, too.
It's one of the reasons why I don't use disk for caching. Yes I know with ZFS I can setup mirrored SSDs for caching but it adds a risk of my entire 20TB array getting corrupted. So I traded speed for protection of my files. I did the same thing with my ProxMox host servers.
Yea, SSD caching is a nice to have and I wanted to make use of it but it ended up being a nightmare when I had a power outage. For my use case, I didn't really need all that fast transfer speed at all from SSD caching. At least I learned from what happened and learning by actually doing it myself has always been beneficial for me in the long run.
Thank you for this review. I was going to buy a QNAP TS-464-8G (very similar to the model you reviewed), primarily as a plex server but also for security cameras. I like that TrueNAS runs on it well, but I think i'll wait for synology to come up with a better NAS for my needs worth the upgrade from my DS218+.
Quite happy with my QNAP TS-464. Its a tad beefier than the version you tested, but it does everything I needed it to do in a NAS and its rock solid stable. Bumped the memory to 64GB, trunked the 2.5GB NICs, running a 2TB cache array, and 4x18TB for the storage. Agree with you that some of the software should be more intuitive or provide some better documentation to understand this version from that variant. But those things are minor to me.
"don't worry, I'm going to install TrueNAS" 😂 side note: do you think the value proposition for these with putting SATA SSDs into the drive bays is ever worth it? do you get a real performance boost? certainly data durability is going to be better.
Random reads would benefit alot, but just make sure that you use good ssd's and setup monitoring so you know when the drives liftime writes match its tbw rating so you can replace them proactively as they will degrade once they get close to their tbw rating.
Qnap and asustor don't place any limitations in the way to prevent it (Synology main one is generally no video out and slightly hard to get to bootloader, arm one is actually far simpler bootloader, as in boot this and it says OK, but it's an arm CPU so Synology don't care really to lock that down) One note with qnap when buying 2g 4g 8g models some of them soldered ram for slot A, but a normal second empty slot B Also Didn't need to unscrew/remove the case to install The ram/nvme (for this model anyway) sometimes the first ram slot is under the motherboard requiring the case to be removed to install 2x8 or 2x16gb, or a nice 2x32gb if ddr4 (should speed up system response) on the note of slow nas very likely due to background bad block scan or parity building on first setup of the array For others about security that means, myqnapcloud {qnap} /ez-connect{asustor} /quickconnect{Synology} is disabled (dsm7.2 has added global ip blocking if using quickconnect relay now) and don't setup upnp (under myqnapcloud qnap) ez-router {asustor} believe same place as ez-connect or external access or external access {Synology} > don't setup router under that page as that enables upnp Synology hadn't been hit yet (only due to weak passwords and photo been directly open to the Internet in the past) but doesn't mean it won't get hit
Sorry, but Synology lost me forever as son they started to charge 800 EURs for 32GB of memory, this memory upgrade that you made here is forbidden impossible to do it in Synology, add to that a 10GB Synology card and you are looking for a Synology NAS well above 1400 EURs mark, I'm done with them.
It’s not “impossible” to do it just means it will give you a warning and they might not give you support if you use one. I added an 8GB stick just fine on my brand new DS423+ which gave me 10GB RAM, even though the CPU is 8GB max.
QNAP does give you shell access, just not from the web interface. You need to enable SSH access from the control center, then once you SSH, press Q to exit the menu and you'd get a shell. Use sudo if you need root access.
Thanks for video! You can login to command line with SSH connection. Also, I can recommend to use Docker with command line because there you can add your volumes into container
You can SSH into it, which is what I do. I primarily use mine as a docker host and haven't had any issue with storage binding. The QNAP was my introduction to Docker. To update a docker compose app, it requires me to SSH into the unit and I'm dissapointed there isn't a button in the GUI. I completly agree with you that the User Experiance needs some work. There are enough quirks that as an IT professional I might as well role my own. QNAP doesn't do a good job of keeping their client software up to date.
Not having root access is a blocker for me. Especially given previous example (years ago) where I identified a security issue and had to wait way too long for a fix. Truenas or proxmox would be where I would go indeed
Awesome video! Near the end of the video, you mention setting up a VPN to have access to a NAS from outside of the home network safely. Could you make a video on this? I understand the general idea and what you're are trying to accompli, h but a video tutorial showing how to set up it up safely would be really cool! I have been thinking about doing something like this with my unraid server however I haven't yet attempted it yet cause I am not sure how to properly set it up so that no unwanted person can get access to it.
I have set up a VPN on a Synology NAS and the process is straightforward, though can be a little tricky without knowing how all the pieces fit. Has worked well. When I set up mine, I only knew about OpenVPN and that was shown in the Synology add-in list. Now, I would probably choose Wireguard and there are videos about that.
I got a used Synology NAS back in 2017. Currently I am saving for a new one plus 4 x 12 TB HDD. Initially I was planning on a QNAP, but then I read about Synology's SHR. That would allow me the purchase a new, more expensive NAS with better hardware and buy the higher capacity HDDs over time. Instead of all upfront.
I have this qnap NAS. It basically just runs plex...and does hw acc. Transcoding just fine. Running 3 streams is about 20-40% cpu usage. It's been a good device but I'd like it to do more.
I had a look on both NAS's what you have here, but, I needed more space so I had got this one; Asustor AS6508T. This one here is an 8, front load, hard drive bays, of which is all full of 8 gb 3.5 hard drives with two nvme drives and laptop memory of which I put to the max of which is 64 gb. The speed is fast enough for me. The setup is good as well.
I've been Synology customer both personally and professionally for many, many years.... my biggest gripe with my latest purchase is their very short list of approved drives that basically pushes the user to purchase Synology branded drives at a premium to avoid nag messages... and my older 8-bay has the somewhat well documented issue of not turning on after a move....
Hey, I currently have a home server with 3x4tb hd in raid z + some ssd for cache/log on proxmox - Do you see any advange moving those disks to a dedicated nas? I feel like It uses a lot of power for whats it doing (r7 5700g system) so was thinking going with a nas + moving my services to a mini PC with n100, much more efficient energy wise.
Nah. No vendor lock-in for me. Better have at least a spare for when it goes bad. I only use open source software so I can always get my data back immediately or simply move the drives and copy the config to another device/install.
Any casa os update soon? Its been a couple of months but my usb raid is still working without any issues exept some casa os issues with the config files
Just in general or with CasaOS+OpenMediaVault? I was planning to do a bigger revisit once the zima cube launches, as I think their new OS is supposed to be able to handle RAID finally
@HardwareHaven why did you decide not to run truenas? Please explain and how much testing did you do on truenas? If your family wasn’t an issue, what would you have done? Thank you
I do run TrueNAS on a different server. That’s where all my footage and such lives. My primary need for this NAS is as an NVR, so TrueNAS doesn’t do me any good lol
Hot take: I don't mind the bad software for the simple reason that I wouldn't use it even if it was good. Personally, I just want my NAS to be a NAS and nothing else. I'll run something like a SFF PC for all my software needs. Obviously this won't be the same for everyone, but for me, it's all about storage stability and nothing more.
A few years ago I bought the absolute cheapest, bare-bones 2-drive Synology just to try out. It has been up and running 24/7 with no problems. 2 WD Reds mirrored. I later installed VPN host software on it (OpenVPN) and that has worked reliably. Software was generally straightforward to use. Being the cheapest it does have limitations that, had I thought it through, I would have gone higher end. Soldered in RAM, not upgradable. Have to open the cabinet to install the drives. If I ever wanted to expand, I think I would just stick with Synology.
before the review part even started I felt i could trust it because of your disclosure and the presence of a manscaped ad read affirming that this wasnt not sponsored content.
These things are getting good enough and powerful enough to stand up as a soho server all by themselves. I was thrilled to be able to set up and provision my Asustor AS5402t in less than an hour, including SMB, Plex, Omada SDN and some other services. For once I didn't have to download, install, configure and tweak everything from the OS on up. And yet it still "smells" like a server and I can still access it like one if I want to.
I have the TS-653, and unfortunately selected IronWolf 8TB drives. This combination thrashes the drives constantly, no mater what settings I select, and can be heard throughout the entire house. I find the software subpar, and rarely even have the thing powered up.
Does QNAP support something along the lines of Synology Hibrid Raid? Back when I bought a DS418 that was a dealbreaker for me and it still is now (toghether with the ability to do data scrubbing).
Thanks for this! For now, I still love my 4-bay Synology. I have three drives running RAID5. The reliability of the OS and apps can't be beat, at least for me.
😂 bro went Synology forever But, if a nas has nvme ports for cache drive we can use those as additional drive slots right Don't worry family comes first we can wait a few weeks extra for this king of quality stuff
QNAP QuTS Hero may allow for an SSD OS install option but not sure about the standard QTS OS. Redundancy is the objective though, so you don’t want the NAS OS to run off of just a single SSD (or whatever). So having the OS run off of The installed HDDs with resilience is in the best interest of the user.
In my opinion low level nas is more about what you first learned, change to another is hard. I have worked with most of them to help friends, personally I only use truenas on way stronger hardware
I primarily need a NAS for 4k media storage to stream to an Nvidia Shield Pro. My concerns are getting consistent streams over CAT5e/6, although I am not certain exactly which is in use. Currently, I an just using external hard drives plugged into the Nvidia via USB but I am running into storage capacity issues. I am looking at getting a QNAP TR-004 4 bay direct connect USB with RAID. Is this the best solution sticking to USB or can 4k streams run fine without causing issues over the network for other users or losing packets with video?
Hi, I’m curious about your experience with synology, how is the hard drive hold up? Does it ever failed since its been ten years according to your current video.
Ya... I'm not even kidding when I say RUclips takes up so much of my time that I haven't made it to the point in my list of tasks to make a switch. lol
1. nvme ssds and RAM modules can be installed without taking the case cover off, just by removing the front cover and HDDs 2. I guess the best way to use nvme ssds is to run the os and apps/containers on it and not for cache. Why didn’t you go for this option?
Ive had the same problem with bind mounts on proxmox using a lxc with docker. Instead individual containers seems to work like fine. I'm just a beginner user in linux so im guessing its just a limitation somewhere but I could be doing something wrong.
I had several QNAP NAS over the years, they almost always fail during updating and have too many bugs in the QTS. Synology devices never failed so far🤞
My QNAP has one major problem which Synology doesn't have: When storage it 90% full, QNAP's read and write speed will drop. The more you store, the less speed you will get. Then I think if it's 97% full it's unusable, like copy one big file will get 3 MB/s for a few seconds then for half a minute it just idle. My Synology doesn't have this problem even the free space is 0B. I think this is a really old bug since I recall I searched on the QNAP forum, many people encountered the same problem dated back to 2012 or 2008(?).
My friend had a QNAP NAS. He moved and when he setup his network back up he plugged a 19 VDC transformer into his QNAP NAS instead of the 12 VDC transformer and fried the QNAP and both drives in it. Had to send the hard drives out to a dat recovery service to get the data back. It is hard to believe there are NO FUSES in there. I wouldn't buy a QNAP anything.
Getting my first NAS and based on everything I've heard, Synology seems like the way to go just because of the software. Hardware isn't as good, but it's solid and secure compared to QNAP. I'm getting it for the storage protection and that's something Synology does well.
Synology used to be really good for software, but of late other competing software is equal if not better. So the actual value of synology is now questionable. Their under stellar hardware makes their value proposition really questionable. Turnkey solution people who do not understand computing hardware is probably where these solution are aimed at, anyone who understands computing hardware will soon realise that their value prop is not there.
It's so annoying, I just want a halfway decent NAS with hardware transcoding and the ability to run Docker containers. I want Portainer, Gitlab+runner, paperless ngx, Ansible Semaphore and Jellyfin to run on it. I got the DS218+, which is fine for Gitlab and Portainer but for more it just isn't enough, even with a RAM upgrade to 6GB. I need to use a VM on my PC and this kind of hampers automation. Kinda wanted to get a DS920 but that's no longer available (at least at reasonable prices) and the newer versions don't support Hardware transcoding. What the hell is wrong with Synology? On the other hand, I just can't deal with QNAP, for the reasons mentioned here.
You may want 4 bay synology if you plan on storage upgrades for video editing. Unless it is only for family photos. My friend has 423+ and it is like better version of 224+. Same CPU similar price and more drives😊. If you want 2 bay, i have good experience with 220+, snappy for basic stuf, and it is still solid option for home use at reasonable investment.
I have the predecessor 453D which, hardware wise is fine (other than the gen2 x1 PCIe slot), but the linux os is so crippled and hard to use that for my next NAS I rather take the time to configure TrueNAS or Unraid
Is there any truth in persistent rumours and complaints that Synology enforces drive hardware lock in? Their compatibility test page shows a disturbing lack of (cheaper and/or better performing) 3rd party HDD and SSD drives. I've just checked the QNAP TS-464 drive compatibility page and it's mindblowing. And another well-respected reviewer praises his TS-464 as an excellent Plex server, easy to set up.
I've come across a few QNAP NAS's at work, and they always show up with a lot vulnerabilities on our scans. I hope the newer software and models address these issues.
Great review. I have always been curious about the functionality of the QNAP units. I am a long-time DS414 NAS user, but don't use the extra software. I loved that you could so easily upgrade the ram and other components, but I hate the color scheme. Why they went with a 'white' case versus a 'black' one, sigh. Similar to QNAP, Synology creates a Raid-10 OS partition, on-disk. If you are upgrading to a 4-bay from a 2-bay Synology device, you can transfer the old-drives to the new device.
System and swap usually md0 and md1 arrays uses a Raid1 wide array (every initialised drive installed in the main unit is a mirror, nvme ssd and external dx expander is excluded) it doesn't use Raid10 because if it did 2 wrong drives failed it would destroy dsm OS
the only thing i wish my synology had is intel quick sync and hardware transcoding. a big shame the amd chips they're using don't have that. otherwise a fantastic nas. I think i'm going to use a zimaboard or some other N100 mini pc to run plex and continue storing the media on the synology. Fully switching to QNAP does not sound worth it given their crappy software experience in comparison to Synology.
I am having a TS 453B for some jears and I never washappy about the QNAP Software. Some time ago I learnd its no Problem to run Unraid on it. Hardware is to expensive, But now I can use it. Ne er would by QNAP again because of the unintuitive usage of that Systems.
I saw on a a video that someone did about Synology, that you absolutely have to install the NVMEs first, and make a volume on them first, and then install the operating system, if you want the operating system installed on the NVMEs. So, maybe your problem with the operating system being installed across the spinning disc hard drives, was because you installed them first and installed the operating system before you had NVMEs.
An Optane M.2 SSD instead of the regular non-Optane M.2 SSD I think may improve performance even more that's pretty much the entire purpose of Optane, which is now discontinued.
Folks, if you are weighing up a Synology vs QNAP, the first thing you need consider is how secure is your data - Do some research on 1) The number of high-profile attacks have taken place against even vendor 2) How each vendor ensures applications are kept secure (i.e. controlling what user they run under, and what each can access) 3) Check how frequently each vendor is forced to issue critical full firmware updates (which require the NAS to be rebooted, which can be a problem in business critical environments) Only then should you consider hardware... its not worth having the best hardware, if you've got no certainty surrounding your data.
FreeBSD great with servers? Even iXsystems (the developers of TrueNAS) are migrating to Linux with TrueNAS Scale because they recognized the FreeBSD ecosystem is dying
@@marcogenovesi8570Yeah it's dying slowly, but that is a shame because BSD really is a better fit for this kind of thing than Linux. Its focus is on stability and correctness rather than features, which is really what you need for an unattended headless device. Not that Linux is bad - my own homebrew NAS is running Debian - but my choice was based on familiarity, not on what was objectively the best fit.
@@cooperised that's not true either way. The only difference is speed of feature development is slower on FreeBSD because of smaller teams. FBSD has equivalents of Linux features too like the Jails (containers) and the Bhyve kernel-level hypervisor (KVM on Linux). Both FBSD and Linux have active development on their networking subsystem and trade punches. A recent example of bad code that got in FreeBSD is the in-kernel Wireguard VPN implementation, that was written by a Netgate contractor (pfsense's parent company). Nobody noticed it and nobody did nothing until the Wireguard VPN developer stepped in and recruited a FreeBSD and an OpenBSD developer to help him rewrite it. Linux core team also cares about stability and correctness, they don't merge random untested trash and have code quality standards that have made them reject or "send back with notes" plenty of contributions. Also they support some LTS versions of the kernel for users (and distros) that need to stay on the same kernel for a long time. Debian uses LTS linux kernels for example, they don't track latest kernels like say Arch. A lot of the reason FreeBSD is dying out is just critical mass, neither OS is inherently better. As you said yourself you went with Debian because you are familiar with it, and I assume it's stable enough for your purposes. That's just how it goes.
You got a synology which is old. Just replace it with a newer one and let it run survalliance, drive and all those things it does better than any other nas. Its not worth bothering with qnap or anything else. Then in addition build your own Truenas or unraid server with good hardware 10GBE and lots of storage space. Thats best solution! -You cant replace synology´s software with any other nas software.
faster read speeds and redundancy, like all mirrors. Stuff written in the cache is not written to the HDDs immediately (the disks are slower) so if the cache disk fails you lose data that was not synced to the HDDs
Personally I'd use one for cache and the other for boot. Keeping boot and logs on an SSD reduces the need to spin up the rust drives for anything other than actually serving files, and keeps the power down.
@@cooperised non-redundant boot isn't a great idea. It's better to just not log to disk, or limit logs to actual issues and not be chatty as most stuff on Linux seems to be
@@marcogenovesi8570 Eh, non-redundant boot is fine. I'm not running a commercial datacentre. SSDs have a pretty low failure rate, and I send ZFS snapshots from my boot SSD onto the rust array on a schedule, so rebuilding from scratch wouldn't be too hard anyway.
@@cooperised that's a lot of hassle for a turnkey NAS, and if you are running ZFS on it so you don't care about the stock OS you are hella overpaying very low end hardware here. For the same price you could have gotten a N100 or better processor. Personally, I'm never going to waste a NVME for a boot disk in a NAS/hypervisor. I'd rather leave it empty lol. I've often just put redundant cheap SSDs on USB ports. Even a USB 2.0 is fine but you often have more USB 3.0 than you need (an internal header for example)
Since it's cache, using RAID 0 will give better performance. If one fails you end up with 1TB cache...but until then you'll get the performance increase of RAID 0 over RAID 1.
Yeah but most still come with only gigabit Ethernet and still cost substantially more IMO. That’s not to say it doesn’t make sense, but you’re paying for the software.
Yeaps & a lot of better bang for the bucks NASes are on the way next year. So both Synology & QNAP better learn to compete more or lose low-end market share.
The summary was quite predictable coming from a Synology user. An experienced QNAP user wouldn't come up with the same result and just keep using it without too many worries.
I work in the tech industry and personally I wouldn't trust Qnap, at least one connected to the internet. Had a client get attacked by a ransomware attack but it was direct from Qnap, possibly a disgruntled employee or something but the page that linked to the ransomeware attack had a page detailing why it happened and it explained it was not due to my client but due to Qnap themselves. Obviously ransomeware attacks can happen anywhere to anyone but since seems like it was possibly downloaded via an update direct from Qnap I would be very wary doing business with them until they clean up their act.
If anyone hasn't mentioned so far, QNAP and Synology have a ticking time bomb literally with a faulty LPC CLOCK which will kill all your devices and cause loss of data. This is a known issue with the chipset used and users need to research, backup move their data and consider a class lawsuit against QNAp Synology or just bin the hardware and build your own NAS. (Saying this after soldering a 230 ohm resistor to save 10 years of data on a RAID array..it has just booted and I'm backing up to then get risld of this junk)
I might have it wrong, but I believe the eMMC is what it boots from and is also what's used to reinstall the OS, but the OS is still installed across the drives. I might be off though lol Regardless, it wasn't easy to find a super clear answer, which is a problem in and of itself IMO
Nope, just like Synology (and most other modern NAS systems) it has a "initial boot" tiny embedded drive (USB or EMMC) that runs a basic firmware that can format the drives and connect to the internet to download and install the "real" firmware, also show a webpage to allow the user to load manually a firmware image. On reboot, the NAS starts the OS from the drive array
Great review! I appreciate the fact that you didn't pull any punches.
I was looking at Qnap vs Synology, My main purpose for a NAS was just to replace My Drobo 5D3, (I cried when they went out of business)
I started out with a Synology 220j and immediately realized that I needed a bigger one as this was a viable replacement.
I ended up with a DS1522+ with 32RAM, 2x1TB NVMe cache drives and 4x 18G Ultrastore and 10GB NIC
I originally got it as just a dumb storage but now I am using it as a VPN, SFTP, & Media Server
(sorry Not plex fan...mainly because you cannot uninstall it cleanly)
But you are right. Synology software seems to be better developed than Qnap.
Thanks for the review
I have been using an older QNAP TS=453 Pro for almost 6 years. It is used primarily for PLEX (works great). Other uses are mainly for a file/FTP/Telnet/SSH or server. Great thing about it is, I am at this moment upgrading the NAS from it's 4 each 6TB drives to 4 each 12TB drives on the fly and will also resize them on the fly. It's nice to do that. One more thing I like is (not sure about synology), if I change QNAP boxes when mine goes out, I just have to make sure the Firmware is updated and insert my drives (in order), to continue to operate. I did this when I upgraded to the one I have. There are other things that are good, (i.e.HBS Backup, QVPN, QuFirewall, Music Station and the Qfile, or Qmanager, Qmusic from my phone). Yeah I'm stuck, and it wasn't easy in the beginning. My 6 year old machine has a Celeron J1900 CUP (4 cores 4 threads) and maxed out at 8GB RAM. Not to mention the 4 ethernet ports. Not bad. I want to upgrade, but my other half says it has to break first.
"... but my other half says it has to break first." Which it very well might relatively soon, as the CPUs are known to be afflicted by the infamous LPC bug. Ask me how I know. Keep a 100 ohm resistor and a soldering iron at hand for when it happens (alongside instructions on which pins on connector LPC-CN1 you need, you can just place a traditional resistor with leads on the back and perhaps use some tape for insulation - it's not a super hard fix if I can do it). First symptoms may include failing to perform a warm reboot, and once you get a fan failure warning you know that it's toast.
On the upside, it seems my fix has been holding up for 14 months now already, and another guy's TS-251 has made it over 2.5 years. Which is a good thing because that NAS is kind of important for our backup workflow. The unit was originally bought at the end of 2015. I'm hoping to nurse it along long enough to be replaced by something more modern, maybe even SSD-only, possibly DIY (stuff inside the QNAP is pretty off-the-shelf all things considered).
Software that is intuitive is sometimes the exception not the rule. I think Synology is the home NAS leader and most competing products are gunning for them. I would love to rebuild my NAS with a NAS case and leave it at that. Great video and good review
QNAP - Flip on SSH, SSH in as 'admin'. If you are like me it is possible to setup a script to run at boot that adds your normal user id into the sudoers file. With that said QNAP is clunky to me and I've debated on replacing the OS with something else. Running on Unraid on a different machine and it has been doing a bunch of things better than the QNAP ever did.
Given the past security issues with qnap devices and the companies lackluster response to them is a hard pass
I agree. I am now running unraid on all my QNAP boxes I deployed for the last few years.
who responsible would expose NAS to internet? ;)
I have sold my actual Synology and returned the ordered DS923+ because of hardware compatibility limitations.
I did built a custom NAS, going this way is better for me,
the power consumption is higher with 30% but the processing power and the limitations are no longer an issue.
Until now there was no issues what type of ram or hard drives are used,
now they want to milk the users for some more funds, in this case no thank you.
i went the route of using a Terramaster 4f-423. it’s pretty much the same thing as this QNap but has 2 2.5g network connections. the usb’s are 3.2 iirc. i run UnRaid instead as the TerraMaster OS sucks. i was about to go Qnap but got the TM for less at the time. i have 32gb for the memory too and that works fine.
Yep, not a bad route if you’re looking for that form factor/look
You can use one of the PCIe NVMe SSD to load the operating system. You just have to (I was told) load the OS when preparing the NAS with the Hard Drives out. Then you can use it to boot up on. Again I was told this by QNAP while I was looking to upgrade my system. It's slower than most but hasn't failed me yet (although I failed it a few times).
Good luck with QNAP! i reverted back to Synology last year because of security. Qnap is one big security issue ending up in ransomeware infection. Even it is not open to the internet and only using their cloud-backup software.
The security issue you're referring to was fixed over 6 years ago. So you're saying you never bothered to install the automatic updates QNAP sent out as they were released? Even synology has had some very public security issues.
@@MrRobarino Nope, some wrong assumptions; the nas was up to date, behind a firewall with no ports open and it was early 2021; Qlocker. After that there some other ransomware attacks with a lot of victims. For me no more Qnap. Everybody needs to decide for themself but I only want to mention that to my opinion Synology is better than QNAP concerning security.
@@MrRobarino there have been multiple QNAP security issues over the years. Including a hardcoded back door, which is an absolute dealbreaker for me to ever trust them. Check GRC‘s “security now“ for details.
Did you hear about something like snapshots?
I have old two bay Synology NAS, I'd like to stay with them, but the lack of 2.5 Gbit NIC is a bummer.
Synology is still way behind on some hardware. They are still putting 1gb ports on semi-pro models instead of multi-gig ("2.5gb" is just a deliberately hobbled multi-gig port marketed to "consumers"), and still no ECC-ram on many DS models.
I know people aren't running down-time critical database servers with a 2bay nas, but ECC is appropriate for any system that has long continuous periods of uptime because errors accumulate and an error in the OS/application instructions can cause ongoining data corruption even though the data its self didn't reside in memory long enough to get a stand alone bitflip error.
I feel that Synology has the advantage when it comes to consumer level experience. Things are changing though for Synology and it feels as though they are abandoning the prosumer market and regulating their consumer level products to their upcoming Beestation products which at first glance seems to be more locked down than their budget DSM Nases. The depreciation of certain apps lately is notably concerning.
Which apps were depreciated?
I have run one for a while (QGD-3014-16PT) I can say it has been solid as a NAS and a 16 port switch. However....the network setup is not straight forward and all their software is as described in this video, Mostly ok, but just a bit....sith. Nothing is intuitive and you do tend to spend some time scratching your head about what needs to be done. Support is somewhat poor and if you are out of warranty, forget it. I had one update pushed to the device with just a two weeks of warranty cover left to me. The update killed the unit dead and it took 6 weeks to get an RMA even after they had a remote connection to the unit to diagnose/test it. Then came the "its out of warranty" problem even though it started within warranty. But....all sorted after 6 weeks. I would say if all you want is a basic file share NAS, these are a good choice. But when you are spending the money these cost, almost any older PC with two drives and truenas or Unraid will be cheaper and easier to support. If you are spending QNAP money on a NAS device, go synology. I have no experience of synology on a day to day basis, but what I have seen of it says to me that I made a bad choice when I bought into my unit.
Honestly I'm overwhelmed with the options. I'm using Samba with Ubuntu currently just for storing files. I did the next cloud thing for a while. Unraid, Trunas, Proxmox w/ vm, CasaOS, Synology, QNAP. I have no idea what I should go with. I'm mostly worried about family photos and videos.
Synology is almost completely cloud replacement. Email, documents, photos.... Most of what you'd do with Apple, Dropbox, or Google; you can do with Synology.
That said, you also want everything backed up. So maybe that's a Synology or other NAS at a remote site backed up over the Internet. Maybe it's a storage service like Google Drive, Backblaze, or Crashplan. RAID is not backup.
For me, Xpenology has been good for about 7 years. I can't afford a true Synology yet, but that's my goal. The flexible storage options are a big selling point - I've got 3x 3TB drives and 2x 8 TB drives in a single array for about 16TB of usable storage. UNRAID has that option, but most other DIY or off-the-shelf NAS's don't.
@@BenReese it's what I'm looking for. I was hoping to merge some of these servers together because I have a Pi with Home Assistant, NGINX. I will probably end up with two separate servers so I don't screw the important files up.
What I've learned is that if you use SSD caching, it's better to have a backup battery in case of power failure. Anything in cache when power fails is either gone forever, files get corrupt, the entire array won't work correctly, or all of that in combination until you wipe and redo the entire array. At least that's what happened to me on my Asustor NAS where I lost a small chunk of files, files corrupted (most video/audio files only had partial working portions), and the array kept crashing. I eventually used the SSDs as the main array for the OS and apps, which Asustor allows (Synology doesn't allow this, at least non-Synology branded NVMe), and the HDDs as the storage array which had worked great with no issues since. This actually allows the HDDs to sleep when not in use so you won't hear the drives and/or save on power. It worked great when I was using it but it was a pain with Plex when playing because it'll need to spinup all drives (2 by 2 sequence HDD spinup). I tried Synology later but as I mentioned earlier, the HDDs all need a copy of DSM on each drive in case of failure so no disk can sleep unless you turn off all the automatic updates and background processes which was a no go for me. If I could keep the NAS in a different room, noise wouldn't really matter but space is pretty limited for me. It's generally cold storage anyways so putting drives to sleep is a must for me for noise and power savings. I ended up going TrueNAS again which meets all my needs with the hardware I already have laying around. It's also a bit more flexible for me, too.
It's one of the reasons why I don't use disk for caching. Yes I know with ZFS I can setup mirrored SSDs for caching but it adds a risk of my entire 20TB array getting corrupted. So I traded speed for protection of my files. I did the same thing with my ProxMox host servers.
Yea, SSD caching is a nice to have and I wanted to make use of it but it ended up being a nightmare when I had a power outage. For my use case, I didn't really need all that fast transfer speed at all from SSD caching. At least I learned from what happened and learning by actually doing it myself has always been beneficial for me in the long run.
Use SSD caching for read, not write.
Thank you for this review. I was going to buy a QNAP TS-464-8G (very similar to the model you reviewed), primarily as a plex server but also for security cameras. I like that TrueNAS runs on it well, but I think i'll wait for synology to come up with a better NAS for my needs worth the upgrade from my DS218+.
Quite happy with my QNAP TS-464. Its a tad beefier than the version you tested, but it does everything I needed it to do in a NAS and its rock solid stable. Bumped the memory to 64GB, trunked the 2.5GB NICs, running a 2TB cache array, and 4x18TB for the storage. Agree with you that some of the software should be more intuitive or provide some better documentation to understand this version from that variant. But those things are minor to me.
Which drives did you use? Are you still happy sith the system?
"don't worry, I'm going to install TrueNAS" 😂 side note: do you think the value proposition for these with putting SATA SSDs into the drive bays is ever worth it? do you get a real performance boost? certainly data durability is going to be better.
Just gotta make sure people stick around, you know? Haha
Random reads would benefit alot, but just make sure that you use good ssd's and setup monitoring so you know when the drives liftime writes match its tbw rating so you can replace them proactively as they will degrade once they get close to their tbw rating.
@HardwareHaven - I am betting QNAP just *loved* your installing TrueNAS when they saw your video. 😆
Qnap and asustor don't place any limitations in the way to prevent it (Synology main one is generally no video out and slightly hard to get to bootloader, arm one is actually far simpler bootloader, as in boot this and it says OK, but it's an arm CPU so Synology don't care really to lock that down)
One note with qnap when buying 2g 4g 8g models some of them soldered ram for slot A, but a normal second empty slot B
Also Didn't need to unscrew/remove the case to install The ram/nvme (for this model anyway) sometimes the first ram slot is under the motherboard requiring the case to be removed to install 2x8 or 2x16gb, or a nice 2x32gb if ddr4 (should speed up system response) on the note of slow nas very likely due to background bad block scan or parity building on first setup of the array
For others about security that means, myqnapcloud {qnap} /ez-connect{asustor} /quickconnect{Synology} is disabled (dsm7.2 has added global ip blocking if using quickconnect relay now)
and don't setup upnp (under myqnapcloud qnap) ez-router {asustor} believe same place as ez-connect or external access or external access {Synology} > don't setup router under that page as that enables upnp
Synology hadn't been hit yet (only due to weak passwords and photo been directly open to the Internet in the past) but doesn't mean it won't get hit
Sorry, but Synology lost me forever as son they started to charge 800 EURs for 32GB of memory, this memory upgrade that you made here is forbidden impossible to do it in Synology, add to that a 10GB Synology card and you are looking for a Synology NAS well above 1400 EURs mark, I'm done with them.
I got a ds920 from synology with 20gb memory since i just added another 16gb ram stick so idk what you are talking about
@@Zedris, yeah those 16GB are probably not Synology memory, but the DS920 is probably out of warrant anyway, so who cares.
It’s not “impossible” to do it just means it will give you a warning and they might not give you support if you use one. I added an 8GB stick just fine on my brand new DS423+ which gave me 10GB RAM, even though the CPU is 8GB max.
QNAP does give you shell access, just not from the web interface. You need to enable SSH access from the control center, then once you SSH, press Q to exit the menu and you'd get a shell. Use sudo if you need root access.
Thanks for video! You can login to command line with SSH connection. Also, I can recommend to use Docker with command line because there you can add your volumes into container
You can SSH into it, which is what I do. I primarily use mine as a docker host and haven't had any issue with storage binding. The QNAP was my introduction to Docker. To update a docker compose app, it requires me to SSH into the unit and I'm dissapointed there isn't a button in the GUI.
I completly agree with you that the User Experiance needs some work. There are enough quirks that as an IT professional I might as well role my own.
QNAP doesn't do a good job of keeping their client software up to date.
Not having root access is a blocker for me. Especially given previous example (years ago) where I identified a security issue and had to wait way too long for a fix. Truenas or proxmox would be where I would go indeed
Awesome video!
Near the end of the video, you mention setting up a VPN to have access to a NAS from outside of the home network safely. Could you make a video on this? I understand the general idea and what you're are trying to accompli, h but a video tutorial showing how to set up it up safely would be really cool! I have been thinking about doing something like this with my unraid server however I haven't yet attempted it yet cause I am not sure how to properly set it up so that no unwanted person can get access to it.
I have set up a VPN on a Synology NAS and the process is straightforward, though can be a little tricky without knowing how all the pieces fit. Has worked well. When I set up mine, I only knew about OpenVPN and that was shown in the Synology add-in list. Now, I would probably choose Wireguard and there are videos about that.
I got a used Synology NAS back in 2017. Currently I am saving for a new one plus 4 x 12 TB HDD. Initially I was planning on a QNAP, but then I read about Synology's SHR. That would allow me the purchase a new, more expensive NAS with better hardware and buy the higher capacity HDDs over time. Instead of all upfront.
I have this qnap NAS. It basically just runs plex...and does hw acc. Transcoding just fine. Running 3 streams is about 20-40% cpu usage. It's been a good device but I'd like it to do more.
I had a look on both NAS's what you have here, but, I needed more space so I had got this one; Asustor AS6508T. This one here is an 8, front load, hard drive bays, of which is all full of 8 gb 3.5 hard drives with two nvme drives and laptop memory of which I put to the max of which is 64 gb. The speed is fast enough for me. The setup is good as well.
Asustor is good
I've been Synology customer both personally and professionally for many, many years.... my biggest gripe with my latest purchase is their very short list of approved drives that basically pushes the user to purchase Synology branded drives at a premium to avoid nag messages... and my older 8-bay has the somewhat well documented issue of not turning on after a move....
Hey, I currently have a home server with 3x4tb hd in raid z + some ssd for cache/log on proxmox - Do you see any advange moving those disks to a dedicated nas? I feel like It uses a lot of power for whats it doing (r7 5700g system) so was thinking going with a nas + moving my services to a mini PC with n100, much more efficient energy wise.
Nah. No vendor lock-in for me.
Better have at least a spare for when it goes bad.
I only use open source software so I can always get my data back immediately or simply move the drives and copy the config to another device/install.
Any casa os update soon? Its been a couple of months but my usb raid is still working without any issues exept some casa os issues with the config files
Just in general or with CasaOS+OpenMediaVault?
I was planning to do a bigger revisit once the zima cube launches, as I think their new OS is supposed to be able to handle RAID finally
@@HardwareHaven currently just casa with webmin (i know it is outdated a bit) for RAID
@HardwareHaven why did you decide not to run truenas? Please explain and how much testing did you do on truenas? If your family wasn’t an issue, what would you have done? Thank you
I do run TrueNAS on a different server. That’s where all my footage and such lives. My primary need for this NAS is as an NVR, so TrueNAS doesn’t do me any good lol
Isn't there a decent nvr for Truenas?
Hot take: I don't mind the bad software for the simple reason that I wouldn't use it even if it was good. Personally, I just want my NAS to be a NAS and nothing else. I'll run something like a SFF PC for all my software needs.
Obviously this won't be the same for everyone, but for me, it's all about storage stability and nothing more.
A few years ago I bought the absolute cheapest, bare-bones 2-drive Synology just to try out. It has been up and running 24/7 with no problems. 2 WD Reds mirrored. I later installed VPN host software on it (OpenVPN) and that has worked reliably. Software was generally straightforward to use. Being the cheapest it does have limitations that, had I thought it through, I would have gone higher end. Soldered in RAM, not upgradable. Have to open the cabinet to install the drives. If I ever wanted to expand, I think I would just stick with Synology.
before the review part even started I felt i could trust it because of your disclosure and the presence of a manscaped ad read affirming that this wasnt not sponsored content.
Well I guess sometimes ad reads can be beneficial, lol
These things are getting good enough and powerful enough to stand up as a soho server all by themselves. I was thrilled to be able to set up and provision my Asustor AS5402t in less than an hour, including SMB, Plex, Omada SDN and some other services. For once I didn't have to download, install, configure and tweak everything from the OS on up. And yet it still "smells" like a server and I can still access it like one if I want to.
I have the TS-653, and unfortunately selected IronWolf 8TB drives. This combination thrashes the drives constantly, no mater what settings I select, and can be heard throughout the entire house. I find the software subpar, and rarely even have the thing powered up.
awesome video as always, keep up the awesome work :)
Does QNAP support something along the lines of Synology Hibrid Raid? Back when I bought a DS418 that was a dealbreaker for me and it still is now (toghether with the ability to do data scrubbing).
Not sure if that is the answer you were looking for, but you can either expand the pool with a newly added drive or replace drives one-by-one
Thanks for this! For now, I still love my 4-bay Synology. I have three drives running RAID5. The reliability of the OS and apps can't be beat, at least for me.
😂 bro went Synology forever
But, if a nas has nvme ports for cache drive we can use those as additional drive slots right
Don't worry family comes first we can wait a few weeks extra for this king of quality stuff
When using a different OS, absolutely. I actually didn’t think to check with QOS if you can set them up in volumes, lol
@@HardwareHavenI’m pretty sure you can, I don’t own one of these myself but I remember nascompares mentioning it in his review of this system.
QNAP QuTS Hero may allow for an SSD OS install option but not sure about the standard QTS OS. Redundancy is the objective though, so you don’t want the NAS OS to run off of just a single SSD (or whatever). So having the OS run off of The installed HDDs with resilience is in the best interest of the user.
Yeah, I didn't understand that comment. Redundancy is preferred over anything.
In my opinion low level nas is more about what you first learned, change to another is hard. I have worked with most of them to help friends, personally I only use truenas on way stronger hardware
I primarily need a NAS for 4k media storage to stream to an Nvidia Shield Pro. My concerns are getting consistent streams over CAT5e/6, although I am not certain exactly which is in use. Currently, I an just using external hard drives plugged into the Nvidia via USB but I am running into storage capacity issues. I am looking at getting a QNAP TR-004 4 bay direct connect USB with RAID. Is this the best solution sticking to USB or can 4k streams run fine without causing issues over the network for other users or losing packets with video?
Thanks for the review. What camera do you use to film your videos? I find it very high quality.
Hi, I’m curious about your experience with synology, how is the hard drive hold up? Does it ever failed since its been ten years according to your current video.
If you want access to the cli, just ssh into the device. Easy as that. I do it all the time.
I can't believe you are still using Lastpass.
Ya... I'm not even kidding when I say RUclips takes up so much of my time that I haven't made it to the point in my list of tasks to make a switch. lol
@@HardwareHaven Just self host bitwarden and be done with it man. Staying on lastpass is like begging to have all your accounts compromised.
1. nvme ssds and RAM modules can be installed without taking the case cover off, just by removing the front cover and HDDs
2. I guess the best way to use nvme ssds is to run the os and apps/containers on it and not for cache. Why didn’t you go for this option?
Qnap has a quite bad security record, late to patch, lack of transparency in providing information.
either that is old news or recent info...
Yeah, which is why I brought it up towards the end
@@genbu3834has happened as recently as 2022
@@HardwareHavena real shame though... as they do other things right such as 2.5gb and hdmi video output on some of their models
Only if you use their OS lol. If I bought one of these it would get TrueNAS or Unraid on it straight away.
Why did you go for a mirrored striped array in truenas instead of zraid6? Same performance and slightly better redundancy when using four drives.
Performance isn't the same, as parity calculations have to be made when doing writes. It probably wouldn't have made a massive difference though.
Ive had the same problem with bind mounts on proxmox using a lxc with docker. Instead individual containers seems to work like fine. I'm just a beginner user in linux so im guessing its just a limitation somewhere but I could be doing something wrong.
I had several QNAP NAS over the years, they almost always fail during updating and have too many bugs in the QTS. Synology devices never failed so far🤞
What Synology would you get? ds1522+ and run plex on another intel based pc?
If you use terramaster don't use the pre install OS as it's even worse about security than qnal, but thankfully their pretty easy to swap the OS on.
Power consumption? File system(s)? ZFS?
My QNAP has one major problem which Synology doesn't have: When storage it 90% full, QNAP's read and write speed will drop. The more you store, the less speed you will get. Then I think if it's 97% full it's unusable, like copy one big file will get 3 MB/s for a few seconds then for half a minute it just idle. My Synology doesn't have this problem even the free space is 0B. I think this is a really old bug since I recall I searched on the QNAP forum, many people encountered the same problem dated back to 2012 or 2008(?).
Do you know how many memory slots is in this unit?
My friend had a QNAP NAS. He moved and when he setup his network back up he plugged a 19 VDC transformer into his QNAP NAS instead of the 12 VDC transformer and fried the QNAP and both drives in it. Had to send the hard drives out to a dat recovery service to get the data back. It is hard to believe there are NO FUSES in there. I wouldn't buy a QNAP anything.
I have the same nas. Only regret was not getting the TS-464 for the two additional cores.
TerraMaster F4-212 review soon?
Getting my first NAS and based on everything I've heard, Synology seems like the way to go just because of the software. Hardware isn't as good, but it's solid and secure compared to QNAP. I'm getting it for the storage protection and that's something Synology does well.
Synology used to be really good for software, but of late other competing software is equal if not better. So the actual value of synology is now questionable. Their under stellar hardware makes their value proposition really questionable. Turnkey solution people who do not understand computing hardware is probably where these solution are aimed at, anyone who understands computing hardware will soon realise that their value prop is not there.
It's so annoying, I just want a halfway decent NAS with hardware transcoding and the ability to run Docker containers.
I want Portainer, Gitlab+runner, paperless ngx, Ansible Semaphore and Jellyfin to run on it. I got the DS218+, which is fine for Gitlab and Portainer but for more it just isn't enough, even with a RAM upgrade to 6GB. I need to use a VM on my PC and this kind of hampers automation. Kinda wanted to get a DS920 but that's no longer available (at least at reasonable prices) and the newer versions don't support Hardware transcoding. What the hell is wrong with Synology?
On the other hand, I just can't deal with QNAP, for the reasons mentioned here.
Can you work Lightroom Catalogs directly in the NAS if you're connect directly with ethernet ?
Yep! I edit 4K video directly off of my NAS
Well as I know videos is possible, Lightroom catalogs are different than videos.
Oh gotcha. I would imagine it would work though, but maybe not 🤷🏻♂️
Google might help more than me haha
I'm sticking with Synology. Also give blueiris a try, much better than any off-the-shelf NAS
You may want 4 bay synology if you plan on storage upgrades for video editing. Unless it is only for family photos. My friend has 423+ and it is like better version of 224+. Same CPU similar price and more drives😊. If you want 2 bay, i have good experience with 220+, snappy for basic stuf, and it is still solid option for home use at reasonable investment.
I have the predecessor 453D which, hardware wise is fine (other than the gen2 x1 PCIe slot), but the linux os is so crippled and hard to use that for my next NAS I rather take the time to configure TrueNAS or Unraid
Is there any truth in persistent rumours and complaints that Synology enforces drive hardware lock in? Their compatibility test page shows a disturbing lack of (cheaper and/or better performing) 3rd party HDD and SSD drives. I've just checked the QNAP TS-464 drive compatibility page and it's mindblowing. And another well-respected reviewer praises his TS-464 as an excellent Plex server, easy to set up.
I've come across a few QNAP NAS's at work, and they always show up with a lot vulnerabilities on our scans. I hope the newer software and models address these issues.
Great review. I have always been curious about the functionality of the QNAP units. I am a long-time DS414 NAS user, but don't use the extra software. I loved that you could so easily upgrade the ram and other components, but I hate the color scheme. Why they went with a 'white' case versus a 'black' one, sigh. Similar to QNAP, Synology creates a Raid-10 OS partition, on-disk. If you are upgrading to a 4-bay from a 2-bay Synology device, you can transfer the old-drives to the new device.
System and swap usually md0 and md1 arrays uses a Raid1 wide array (every initialised drive installed in the main unit is a mirror, nvme ssd and external dx expander is excluded) it doesn't use Raid10 because if it did 2 wrong drives failed it would destroy dsm OS
the only thing i wish my synology had is intel quick sync and hardware transcoding. a big shame the amd chips they're using don't have that. otherwise a fantastic nas. I think i'm going to use a zimaboard or some other N100 mini pc to run plex and continue storing the media on the synology. Fully switching to QNAP does not sound worth it given their crappy software experience in comparison to Synology.
I got the ds423+ for this very reason, but yeah a shame they don't offer Intel on their newest towers
I am having a TS 453B for some jears and I never washappy about the QNAP Software. Some time ago I learnd its no Problem to run Unraid on it. Hardware is to expensive, But now I can use it. Ne er would by QNAP again because of the unintuitive usage of that Systems.
How is the power consumption at idel ?
I saw on a a video that someone did about Synology, that you absolutely have to install the NVMEs first, and make a volume on them first, and then install the operating system, if you want the operating system installed on the NVMEs. So, maybe your problem with the operating system being installed across the spinning disc hard drives, was because you installed them first and installed the operating system before you had NVMEs.
An Optane M.2 SSD instead of the regular non-Optane M.2 SSD I think may improve performance even more that's pretty much the entire purpose of Optane, which is now discontinued.
Really helpful!
Folks, if you are weighing up a Synology vs QNAP, the first thing you need consider is how secure is your data - Do some research on
1) The number of high-profile attacks have taken place against even vendor
2) How each vendor ensures applications are kept secure (i.e. controlling what user they run under, and what each can access)
3) Check how frequently each vendor is forced to issue critical full firmware updates (which require the NAS to be rebooted, which can be a problem in business critical environments)
Only then should you consider hardware... its not worth having the best hardware, if you've got no certainty surrounding your data.
I did it the opposite way around and did not regret it a single time.
can someone explain to me why ram is important on a external storage NAS?
I would love to use unraid. I prefer linux over free bsd, but I know it's great with servers.
FreeBSD great with servers? Even iXsystems (the developers of TrueNAS) are migrating to Linux with TrueNAS Scale because they recognized the FreeBSD ecosystem is dying
@@marcogenovesi8570Yeah it's dying slowly, but that is a shame because BSD really is a better fit for this kind of thing than Linux. Its focus is on stability and correctness rather than features, which is really what you need for an unattended headless device. Not that Linux is bad - my own homebrew NAS is running Debian - but my choice was based on familiarity, not on what was objectively the best fit.
@@cooperised that's not true either way. The only difference is speed of feature development is slower on FreeBSD because of smaller teams. FBSD has equivalents of Linux features too like the Jails (containers) and the Bhyve kernel-level hypervisor (KVM on Linux). Both FBSD and Linux have active development on their networking subsystem and trade punches.
A recent example of bad code that got in FreeBSD is the in-kernel Wireguard VPN implementation, that was written by a Netgate contractor (pfsense's parent company). Nobody noticed it and nobody did nothing until the Wireguard VPN developer stepped in and recruited a FreeBSD and an OpenBSD developer to help him rewrite it.
Linux core team also cares about stability and correctness, they don't merge random untested trash and have code quality standards that have made them reject or "send back with notes" plenty of contributions.
Also they support some LTS versions of the kernel for users (and distros) that need to stay on the same kernel for a long time. Debian uses LTS linux kernels for example, they don't track latest kernels like say Arch.
A lot of the reason FreeBSD is dying out is just critical mass, neither OS is inherently better. As you said yourself you went with Debian because you are familiar with it, and I assume it's stable enough for your purposes. That's just how it goes.
Oh wow, I have that same Antec case that you use for your main NAS.
To get a terminal, just ssh in with the username you setup at the start.
Not sure if you tested it. QNAP is good for iscsi. You could use another machine as the processor.
You got a synology which is old. Just replace it with a newer one and let it run survalliance, drive and all those things it does better than any other nas. Its not worth bothering with qnap or anything else. Then in addition build your own Truenas or unraid server with good hardware 10GBE and lots of storage space. Thats best solution! -You cant replace synology´s software with any other nas software.
You forgot to put a space in this timestamp: 2:59TS-462 Specs
THANK YOU!
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What is the advantage of having 2 nvme cache drives mirrored over just one?
faster read speeds and redundancy, like all mirrors. Stuff written in the cache is not written to the HDDs immediately (the disks are slower) so if the cache disk fails you lose data that was not synced to the HDDs
Personally I'd use one for cache and the other for boot. Keeping boot and logs on an SSD reduces the need to spin up the rust drives for anything other than actually serving files, and keeps the power down.
@@cooperised non-redundant boot isn't a great idea. It's better to just not log to disk, or limit logs to actual issues and not be chatty as most stuff on Linux seems to be
@@marcogenovesi8570 Eh, non-redundant boot is fine. I'm not running a commercial datacentre. SSDs have a pretty low failure rate, and I send ZFS snapshots from my boot SSD onto the rust array on a schedule, so rebuilding from scratch wouldn't be too hard anyway.
@@cooperised that's a lot of hassle for a turnkey NAS, and if you are running ZFS on it so you don't care about the stock OS you are hella overpaying very low end hardware here. For the same price you could have gotten a N100 or better processor.
Personally, I'm never going to waste a NVME for a boot disk in a NAS/hypervisor. I'd rather leave it empty lol. I've often just put redundant cheap SSDs on USB ports. Even a USB 2.0 is fine but you often have more USB 3.0 than you need (an internal header for example)
You want SSDS in your Nas First you want the OS on the System pool then add the harddrives Qnap even states this in their most recent videos as well
qnap NAS come with non ECC ram ?
Since it's cache, using RAID 0 will give better performance. If one fails you end up with 1TB cache...but until then you'll get the performance increase of RAID 0 over RAID 1.
newer Synology models do support NVME and 10Gbe stuff for not much extra $$
Yeah but most still come with only gigabit Ethernet and still cost substantially more IMO. That’s not to say it doesn’t make sense, but you’re paying for the software.
This with a more modern 4x CPU with Iris Xe graphics would be a good jellyfin server.
Yeaps & a lot of better bang for the bucks NASes are on the way next year.
So both Synology & QNAP better learn to compete more or lose low-end market share.
Really? What are those
The summary was quite predictable coming from a Synology user. An experienced QNAP user wouldn't come up with the same result and just keep using it without too many worries.
I work in the tech industry and personally I wouldn't trust Qnap, at least one connected to the internet. Had a client get attacked by a ransomware attack but it was direct from Qnap, possibly a disgruntled employee or something but the page that linked to the ransomeware attack had a page detailing why it happened and it explained it was not due to my client but due to Qnap themselves. Obviously ransomeware attacks can happen anywhere to anyone but since seems like it was possibly downloaded via an update direct from Qnap I would be very wary doing business with them until they clean up their act.
If anyone hasn't mentioned so far, QNAP and Synology have a ticking time bomb literally with a faulty LPC CLOCK which will kill all your devices and cause loss of data.
This is a known issue with the chipset used and users need to research, backup move their data and consider a class lawsuit against QNAp Synology or just bin the hardware and build your own NAS.
(Saying this after soldering a 230 ohm resistor to save 10 years of data on a RAID array..it has just booted and I'm backing up to then get risld of this junk)
Important thing. QNAP TS-462-4G have soldered RAM. Cannot expanse.
That mf is a trap lol better get the 2G
Looks like QOS is installed on an eMMC not stripped across the drives There's your bottle neck
I might have it wrong, but I believe the eMMC is what it boots from and is also what's used to reinstall the OS, but the OS is still installed across the drives. I might be off though lol
Regardless, it wasn't easy to find a super clear answer, which is a problem in and of itself IMO
Nope, just like Synology (and most other modern NAS systems) it has a "initial boot" tiny embedded drive (USB or EMMC) that runs a basic firmware that can format the drives and connect to the internet to download and install the "real" firmware, also show a webpage to allow the user to load manually a firmware image.
On reboot, the NAS starts the OS from the drive array
@@HardwareHaven That makes sense
Isn't qnap the one that had several security breaches? Or at least one big one?
I'll BUY YOUR synology