The one thing that seems to stand out is that the engine sounds like it's labouring hard, right from the very first start - That hard "thrappy" sound tells me that the engine isn't happy about something and I'm wondering if that's what the previous owner picked up on, and thought perhaps the spark arrestor was clogged, and removed it on that basis. The nearest I can relate it to is an old Briggs powered bale elevator that we had on the farm which sounded just the same. Now, there were two possibilities suggested to us, one being that there would be a flattened cam lobe, limiting valve lift, and the other being that the flywheel key would be partially sheared, thus shifting the firing point. In our case, it was the latter, and a new key fixed the problem. The glow in the exhaust is indicative of the exhaust valve opening early, thus releasing the flame too soon, and whilst the combustion is still in progress - Thuswise, the energy from combustion is not being maximised in the cylinder, but is still burning at the moment it is being released into the exhaust muffler, and causing it to overheat and glow. That would also indicate that the cylinder block at that point is also overheating, and liable to be lacking lubrication, and greatly accelerated wear - which could also be a cause of glittering in the oil. I'll be interested to see part two, and see what you find, and what the real causes are.
I have been binge watching all your videos. This video gave me not so fond memories of screw/bolt extraction while I was a Machinist in the Navy. You would not believe how many dim-witted sailors are allowed to perform maintenance on the fighter jets.
You just gotta love this older equipment.They were built like tanks. Given the proper care, they will work forever and if there was a problem, they were built to be repaired. I have some small engine powered equipment that are at least 50 years old and still perform quite well. So glad you saved this one from the scrap yard.
This is not meant to be disrespectful in any manner. You do a much better job than I am capable of. This comment won't solve the problem, I simply believe you induce numerous variables sometimes. Such as lapping the intake valve then also changing back to the old carb. Then return to the clone carb but also adding fuel, returning to the original spark plug, and also removing the air filter. This is just my opinion, but I would do those one at a time, testing each one individually. Thank you for all the informative videos.
Thanks. I ended up cutting a lot of footage to make this a little shorter. But agree, do not want to change many things in between tests. There is another video on this generator where I finally figured out the issue.
Great video! Briggs & Stratton made that engine for many years. As a kid in the late '50's early '60's my family had an old Toro "Park Special" reel cut lawn mower with that very engine. 8 horse power with an oil bath air cleaner. You sat on a sulky behind the unit. It was a beast! Thanks for the very informative, diagnostic videos. A joy to watch!
When I was working in the sixty’s we had a similar type generator it to only put out five or six amps that was enough for a drill we were using to bore holes in wood beams ! We left it alone ! Good enough for our purpose !
Weird, I have the same unit and it runs a 1500watts heater and simultaneously start up my 20 gallon compressor effortlessly, the engine pitch barely changes.
The guy that I was helping had it sitting in back of his truck with no protection from the weather when we was setting up affordable homes he did not like keeping up with his tools
Very good! I’m fairly experienced with repairing generators, both mechanical and the electrical end as well. I had never seen this “leak down” testing method done before. This is why I really like RUclips...for the learning aspect. Well done. Thank you.
Thanks. I actually broke down and ordered a real leak down tester today. Going to hook it up to that engine and see what it says. Compression still seems a little low to me. Usually just pressurizing the cylinder like i did with ~60 psi lets you find the obvious leaks.
I have a feeling part 2 might involve that. I just ordered a leak down tester. Thought I would start there and see where it leads me. I am very suspicious of the piston drag and am thinking maybe a ring problem? 80psi still seems low to me. L-head Briggs lawn mower engines higher compression numbers.
I give you a lot of respect, I like the way you work. I am a retired gen guy. The electrical end and governors and parallel switchgear for a Cat dealer for 42 years.
@@jcondon1 I am not sure what you are using in your ultrasonic cleaner. Have you heard of simple green crystal? I used to use it for cleaning scuba regulators. It is unseated and dye free. I also sacrificed a couple of battery operated tooth brushes to help scrub away crusted on debris. You can get different brushes of hardness depending on the fragility of the surface you are trying to clean. Someone in another video suggested dental picks, but we banded them from working on regulators as you risk scraping or scratching the mating surfaces. Check out a scuba tool parts distributor for brass picks. You can get pointed ones and also flat surfaces. They are ideal for removing o rings. Great videos.
I had an old altenator design power unit given to me once. A 7hp briggs of the same design as yours. It had set in a barn for several years, carb, tank were in bad shape. I cleaned tge crud from in&out the carb with a soft bristle mini brush and some sandpaper, use all the old parts. Put bb's in the tank with some water and shook it clean, several rinses and one with gas. I had a newer coil from a junk rider, converted to electronic ign. Stole a sparkplug out of an old weed eater. The machine starts on the first pull every time. Its a 3000 Watt unit. I gave it to my pa-in-law, he used it when Hurricane Katrina hit us. He had 3 freexmzers, told him run 1 freezer and freeze it down, then run another, do the same same. Just rotate the units and don't open the doir unless nessecery. He ran some lighting with it also. He's been gone now about 7 yrs, I don't know whar happened to the old machine, it had an 81 yr model motor. Guess when the family started cleaning out his stuff the generator got sold. He was a great guy. Used to sit outside at night and talk for hours, best friend I ever had....
Great video, this is really enjoyable to watch. No annoying "action" or clueless operation, un- or overmotivated talking or anything of that kind. One rarely finds that! The valves immediately came to my mind when I saw flames coming out of the exhaust at the first carb adjustment, and then again when the muffler started glowing. I would have suspected the exhaust valve though which might start beeing to tight when the engine is warm. Excellent job of testing the valves with liquid, because often you lap them and the seats look perfect but they till leak. Had that multiple times and learned my lesson to always do a leak test with brakecleaner or an equivalent. I was very much surprised that the repaired valves didn´t seem to improve the problem.
check the ignition timing with the head off check the valve timing, valves on the rock as piston passes TDC. set the carb at full load wear you want full power not off load
I think you got urself a pretty good hobby. I'd rather bust my ass for hours working on getting an old engine going, cleaning out the carb adjusting valve lash, lapping the valves. I'm more into gener8ors, just pickt up a cast iron 23 Briggs 9HP and got her running. Thinking of getting 2 24 v 100 amp alternators and run them into an inverter. gen has a delco remy starter gener8or.
I had one of these long ago but it was a 12 HP. It had a very poor governor as I remember. But it worked for many many years with nothing but fuel and, and the occasional oil changes. I loaded it up heavily with a welder and it had plenty of power, but the power occurred down at about 50 Hz. The engine had a painful sounding knock at about 62 Hz so I was afraid to adjust it to have higher speeds unloaded. Once I started working "in the road" I lost track of it. The exhaust note during your testing at the beginning of the video sounds like it has ignition timing problems. (I say this at the time you just tested the new carb.) The glowing red exhaust also supports this theory. They had plenty of power when new. The acceleration when started up would bring the engine up to speed a lot quicker than yours is ramping up. Looking forward to seeing your next video on it.
I am not a mechanic, but maybe the even though you are getting spark when you hand crank and at no load the spark plug wire looks good. Maybe even the 110 v outlets? I really thought you had it on the last attempt. Good luck.
kind of relaxin to pull a carb apart, taking ur time and cleaning all the holes in the emulsion tube or is a jet? either way nothing clogged. I have seen tiny tiny holes in the barrel end of carb close to the engine and throttle plate. having soaked carb in cleaner and some shop air works out pretty good.
In part 2 I took the engine apart and found the glitter was coming from the piston. Installed new piston and rings, honed the cylinder. Runs well now, but still more resistance then normal when the piston is traveling up or down regardless of the cycle.
This was a great video to watch. Lots of helpful troubleshooting techniques. When you do torquing of some of the bolts, could you mention what torque spec you are setting them to? About to watch part 2!
As much as I like James work and as much as I respect his skill. This always has been the one aspect, that I didnt like: He seems to guess torque values a lot and then uses a torque wrench to tighten bolts to "his spec". Imho this doesnt make a lot of sense. If you dont have any torque values from the manufacturer, then youre better off doing it by feel.
I would start with making sure that where the fuel comes out of the tank that the fitting doesn’t have something blocking it. I assume that the power head has bearings of some sort. I would make sure that the engine isn’t fighting against them using up all its power.
It runs just like my old Sears and Roebuck Geni It's a 1500 watt made in the 60's, great to get rid of skitters "needs and overhaul " though doubt i can find a set of kits for it now. Has a Tecumseh engine around 5 horses. Love the older engines they generally just run and run and are cast iron blocks. and yep no fancy smancy pull start you have to wind the rope. and you have to do points at least every few runs no. need to pull it outa mothballs and clean it up and see if i can get her to run for me again. Love your vids, keeps and old bird like me piddling in the barn. Hope to see more vintage engines and genies
I do actually believe that is the max cause i have a old generator like that ! And if im not mistaken u took out little over the max power on that generator so that is impressive
Just a side note on the leak down test. The breather cover must be in place and the hose plugged when checking for crankcase pressure. Nothing will show on the dipstick tube as all the pressure will blow out the breather area.
Since you already know you have sparkles in the oil I would mike the cam journals and check the bearings. I am a bit surprised that that unit is rated for that kind of wattage. I have a Montgomery Ward one from the mid to late fifties which is rated for 1200 watts as I recall. The engine is similar in size and looks to yours. Can't walk away with the question mark hanging. While you are down there I would pull the piston and mike the cylinder bore for 'hour glass wear'. This would explain your rising friction midstroke perhaps.
I suggest that the generator was a fire dept issue because its painted red with number 4 and it was used for lighting which it is perfect for no great load
Interesting case. I would check the muffler for restriction. The cam timing should be checked for split overlap and lift. Anything that would stop it from pumping air would restrict power.
Another great video James. I'm a long time lurker and recent subscriber. I have watched lots of other video from various sources and I really prefer yours. First, you have a voice for radio which makes it easier to listen to and the way you structure the progression of the teardown and reassembly. Your camera work is very good, thank you for using a tripod, I get seasick on some of the videos out there, dude pick something to focus on already! I appreciate your attention to detail and the data you provide as you go along. Every time you include stuff like the B&S check sheet I run out to the web an get it. Just can't have to much documentation! Really like the style of carb used on these older engines. Updraft is ancient technology but, fuel cannot pool in the intake. BTW, did you clean out the tank on this one? Did I look away for that step? I saw you replaced the fuel line. The crap in the bottom of the bowl had to come from somewhere. Maybe past that damaged bowl gasket? Thanks again.
Thanks for the great feedback. Been working to improve as I go. My earlier videos were a bit rough. Do not remember taking the intake off. After my luck with the exhaust, probably did not want to risk it. Just picked up another red generator with the same carb from 1987.
I have a 16hp Briggs generator just like that and i can't seem to find any parts for the generator part. Actually this is one of the only videos i can find on fixing one
You might find investing in a Colourtune to be worthwhile for diagnosing and especially tuning. It's a spark plug with a clear top that lets you see how the fuel is burning, and by that can tell you if it's lean, rich, right, burning oil or other contaminants in small amounts and so on. I was given a very old one many years ago and though I use it rarely, it has helped me considerably with those times I've pulled it out.
Without having seen P2, one thing I would be suspicious of are the bearings around the power head. Perhaps when it's under load the pressure on the bearings is increasing, and something is binding up? Perhaps end play is letting the armature shift towards one end or the other, and again binding or causing pressure on engine components? Off to part 2... :) (Thanks again for posting BTW, interesting material and very well presented without annoying music or other background nuisances!)
Just coming on to you channel. Not sure you will get this but can still hole out hope. 😬 On those old carbs, it has two separate adjustments. One for idle, one for full throttle. The low, idle. Should be adjusted to be just above stall. The top will have to be adjusted by ear. Didnt see anything in the video about that. Love the older stuff! The new stuff is interesting and informative. Thank you!
You sir definitely could benefit from a nice big 42'" belt sander if your doing small amount grinding< I built one and absolutely love it and get great work out of it. Thank you for all the great informative vids!, Just waiting on complete cylinder head clone for a 4000 watt gen that has next to no hours and was given to me. It'll do great to keep my furnace going when the power konks out up here in Canada in middle of winter lol
I have one very similar. Never liked the updraft carb. Mine quit making power and I never looked at why. Probably a diode. Been sitting for 4 years now.
Im pretty sure that engine was used for pumping water back in the 70's. I used to have 2 of those engines, one specificly made for a generator and one for pumping water. The water pump one never had enough power to do high rev like say on a go kart. The generator one worked perfect on a go kart and had plenty of power at higher rev.
them gen set's we ues on road work's in the UK manly ruing traffic light's i often sore them doing that but never sore then driving big loads often i would boil an electric kettle on one their were never meant to drive. heavy loads, good gens reliable kit . les England
Hate to criticize the adjustment. The main jet is adjusted with the throttle open. With the governor, this means under load. The idle jet is adjusted unloaded and the throttle manually held closed. It has no accelerator pump, so releasing the closed throttle will cause a slight hesitation, which is normal when adjusted properly. The generator when loaded should have the main jet adjusted for the governor to close the throttle as much as possible, then slightly open from there so it does not run too lean. This will provide good load pick up response.
I like your diagnostic trail. Had a shop myself in the 80s. STILL learning after watching you fix some of these engines. I also have a valve removal tool(didthe last time I checked) that I wouldnt mind getting rid of. Have you tried adjusting the carb under load?
I had a woman once that looked much younger than she was and her output was similar to what you’re experiencing. All the makeup and fancy clothing didn’t work too, like the new carb and paint. Oh well live and learn you’re still young. However I do enjoy your videos..
hi james you are working hard on this old girl ,cant be a lot of money in it for you ,i think a rebuild if you have got the time and keep the spending down if you can mate
From Mike watched your winco generator video. Good info. I was going to mention I purchased a winco hp 4500 generator few years ago $40 1988 model year on 8 hp ic engine They are built lecenter mn 6 miles from me. Anyway went through carburetor last person in there boy o boy. Got it running runs good changed oil. Mouse nest debris coming out. So next day pulled end cover off of generator huge mouse nest. Vacuum it out. Blew it out. Only seen 1 wire chewed on white ground wire about 2 inches. Put cover on makes 124 volts both outlets. Will find something to put load on it. A concern of mine is there are no circuit breakers on unit. I was going to use for home use if needed. I was thinking of feeding into a 30 amp 220 breaker. The generator has a 50 amp outlet on it. The breaker should provide some protection? Hopefully works ok. Otherwise I have another in my storage shed similar size. Another 8 hp B&S got that going 10 plus years ago. (No gas when stored) that one had carburetor story too. Great videos keep it up
How is the crank caseventilation. If its obstructed it can cause back pressure in the crank case under the piston causing to run slow know it's a stretch but it has to be on the air side of things or mechanical but realistically sound like you may have a bad main bearing
The one thing that seems to stand out is that the engine sounds like it's labouring hard, right from the very first start - That hard "thrappy" sound tells me that the engine isn't happy about something and I'm wondering if that's what the previous owner picked up on, and thought perhaps the spark arrestor was clogged, and removed it on that basis. The nearest I can relate it to is an old Briggs powered bale elevator that we had on the farm which sounded just the same.
Now, there were two possibilities suggested to us, one being that there would be a flattened cam lobe, limiting valve lift, and the other being that the flywheel key would be partially sheared, thus shifting the firing point. In our case, it was the latter, and a new key fixed the problem.
The glow in the exhaust is indicative of the exhaust valve opening early, thus releasing the flame too soon, and whilst the combustion is still in progress - Thuswise, the energy from combustion is not being maximised in the cylinder, but is still burning at the moment it is being released into the exhaust muffler, and causing it to overheat and glow. That would also indicate that the cylinder block at that point is also overheating, and liable to be lacking lubrication, and greatly accelerated wear - which could also be a cause of glittering in the oil.
I'll be interested to see part two, and see what you find, and what the real causes are.
I don’t know what it is but I can’t stop watching your shows over and over love it ! Keep them going !
I love these older open style generators. No covers or fancy electrics. Motor, generator, that's it.
I love the old generators. No cheap plastic parts on that generator.
I have been binge watching all your videos. This video gave me not so fond memories of screw/bolt extraction while I was a Machinist in the Navy. You would not believe how many dim-witted sailors are allowed to perform maintenance on the fighter jets.
You just gotta love this older equipment.They were built like tanks. Given the proper care, they will work forever and if there was a problem, they were built to be repaired. I have some small engine powered equipment that are at least 50 years old and still perform quite well. So glad you saved this one from the scrap yard.
This is not meant to be disrespectful in any manner. You do a much better job than I am capable of. This comment won't solve the problem, I simply believe you induce numerous variables sometimes. Such as lapping the intake valve then also changing back to the old carb. Then return to the clone carb but also adding fuel, returning to the original spark plug, and also removing the air filter. This is just my opinion, but I would do those one at a time, testing each one individually. Thank you for all the informative videos.
Thanks. I ended up cutting a lot of footage to make this a little shorter. But agree, do not want to change many things in between tests. There is another video on this generator where I finally figured out the issue.
A lot of people would have just given up at the point where the new carb didn’t work. Thank you for going all the way, made a great video.
Thanks. There is also a part 2 on this one where I find and fix the issue.
I watched it after this one, it was great. A rare channel, keep it up. Subscribed till the end.
Great systematic diagnostic. It will be interesting to see any final outcome of you decide to that follow further. Thanks for sharing!!
That's one of the cleanest intake valves i've seen in the last few years especially on an engine that is less than 3 months older than me
Great video! Briggs & Stratton made that engine for many years. As a kid in the late '50's early '60's my family had an old Toro "Park Special" reel cut lawn mower with that very engine. 8 horse power with an oil bath air cleaner. You sat on a sulky behind the unit. It was a beast! Thanks for the very informative, diagnostic videos. A joy to watch!
When I was working in the sixty’s we had a similar type generator it to only put out five or six amps that was enough for a drill we were using to bore holes in wood beams ! We left it alone ! Good enough for our purpose !
I think this generator needs to go into your own personal museum of genies.
Man O Man James, this is a real head thinker, but i know you will get it on part 2. see you there.
When we used one of those generators for construction we were lucky to run a compressor and a skill saw off of it
Weird, I have the same unit and it runs a 1500watts heater and simultaneously start up my 20 gallon compressor effortlessly, the engine pitch barely changes.
The guy that I was helping had it sitting in back of his truck with no protection from the weather when we was setting up affordable homes he did not like keeping up with his tools
@@markmullins4222 Gotcha lol
Very good! I’m fairly experienced with repairing generators, both mechanical and the electrical end as well. I had never seen this “leak down” testing method done before. This is why I really like RUclips...for the learning aspect. Well done. Thank you.
Thanks. I actually broke down and ordered a real leak down tester today. Going to hook it up to that engine and see what it says. Compression still seems a little low to me. Usually just pressurizing the cylinder like i did with ~60 psi lets you find the obvious leaks.
Couldn't hurt to crack open the Dyna and see if the bearings need to be replaced as they might be dragging under heavy load?
I have a feeling part 2 might involve that. I just ordered a leak down tester. Thought I would start there and see where it leads me. I am very suspicious of the piston drag and am thinking maybe a ring problem? 80psi still seems low to me. L-head Briggs lawn mower engines higher compression numbers.
I give you a lot of respect, I like the way you work. I am a retired gen guy. The electrical end and governors and parallel switchgear for a Cat dealer for 42 years.
@@PabloDiablo682 there is a part two on this. I ended up installing new rings and a piston. But the real issue was the timing.
@@jcondon1 That's what I was thinking when I saw the plug, and the glowing exhaust.
@@jcondon1 I am not sure what you are using in your ultrasonic cleaner. Have you heard of simple green crystal? I used to use it for cleaning scuba regulators. It is unseated and dye free. I also sacrificed a couple of battery operated tooth brushes to help scrub away crusted on debris. You can get different brushes of hardness depending on the fragility of the surface you are trying to clean. Someone in another video suggested dental picks, but we banded them from working on regulators as you risk scraping or scratching the mating surfaces. Check out a scuba tool parts distributor for brass picks. You can get pointed ones and also flat surfaces. They are ideal for removing o rings.
Great videos.
Just found this video and for some reason I really like that old-style air filter assembly.
I had an old altenator design power unit given to me once. A 7hp briggs of the same design as yours. It had set in a barn for several years, carb, tank were in bad shape. I cleaned tge crud from in&out the carb with a soft bristle mini brush and some sandpaper, use all the old parts. Put bb's in the tank with some water and shook it clean, several rinses and one with gas. I had a newer coil from a junk rider, converted to electronic ign. Stole a sparkplug out of an old weed eater. The machine starts on the first pull every time. Its a 3000 Watt unit. I gave it to my pa-in-law, he used it when Hurricane Katrina hit us. He had 3 freexmzers, told him run 1 freezer and freeze it down, then run another, do the same same. Just rotate the units and don't open the doir unless nessecery. He ran some lighting with it also. He's been gone now about 7 yrs, I don't know whar happened to the old machine, it had an 81 yr model motor. Guess when the family started cleaning out his stuff the generator got sold. He was a great guy. Used to sit outside at night and talk for hours, best friend I ever had....
I like that you will put your time and energy into an old engine that is simply not economical but for the sake of eve👌👍ryone.
Great video, this is really enjoyable to watch. No annoying "action" or clueless operation, un- or overmotivated talking or anything of that kind. One rarely finds that! The valves immediately came to my mind when I saw flames coming out of the exhaust at the first carb adjustment, and then again when the muffler started glowing. I would have suspected the exhaust valve though which might start beeing to tight when the engine is warm. Excellent job of testing the valves with liquid, because often you lap them and the seats look perfect but they till leak. Had that multiple times and learned my lesson to always do a leak test with brakecleaner or an equivalent. I was very much surprised that the repaired valves didn´t seem to improve the problem.
re: "I saw flames coming out of the exhaust at the first carb adjustment,"
As John found out, it was apparently the timing that was off.
@@uploadJ I honestly don´t see a connection between your comment and mine...
@@v-g-z3689 re: "I honestly don´t see a connection between your comment and mine..."
Unexpected ... MAYBE the others reading this comment stream will?
@@uploadJ Possibly they do, yes.
They used to add those springs to take up the slack in the governor. Makes it just a tad smoother.
check the ignition timing with the head off check the valve timing, valves on the rock as piston passes TDC. set the carb at full load wear you want full power not off load
Yes, I did another video on this and took it apart. The cam timing was off by a tooth.
Those are some of the best carbs still. Gets great fuel mileage when the engine is on a go-kart. Also they can idle the engine at a super low idle.
I've been working on small engines since the mid to late 70's... and still to this date work on them.
I think you got urself a pretty good hobby. I'd rather bust my ass for hours working
on getting an old engine going, cleaning out the carb adjusting valve lash, lapping
the valves. I'm more into gener8ors, just pickt up a cast iron 23 Briggs 9HP and got
her running. Thinking of getting 2 24 v 100 amp alternators and run them into an
inverter. gen has a delco remy starter gener8or.
got a winco and it works great after i converted it to propane. 11hp briggs is loud but powers the house fine
OK James I'm liking this old motor let's see what happens bro.Rob from California.
I had one of these long ago but it was a 12 HP. It had a very poor governor as I remember. But it worked for many many years with nothing but fuel and, and the occasional oil changes. I loaded it up heavily with a welder and it had plenty of power, but the power occurred down at about 50 Hz. The engine had a painful sounding knock at about 62 Hz so I was afraid to adjust it to have higher speeds unloaded. Once I started working "in the road" I lost track of it.
The exhaust note during your testing at the beginning of the video sounds like it has ignition timing problems. (I say this at the time you just tested the new carb.) The glowing red exhaust also supports this theory.
They had plenty of power when new. The acceleration when started up would bring the engine up to speed a lot quicker than yours is ramping up.
Looking forward to seeing your next video on it.
You have very good troubleshooting methods. Keep up the good work..........Jay
I have one similar to this one, bought it cheap, had to clean the carb replace a outlet. Need to fire mine up as I haven't ran it in years.
Gonna say it was from a firetruck or other EMS.To me that engine is older the the installed cooling shroud. Great video through.
That thing sounds so freaking loud! Def one benefit of new gensets, regardless of inverter.
I would want to investigate the reason for friction on piston travel. Surely that would affect the engine's ability to deliver full power.
I did have one of those, u have to adjust the gas with the load to get it to work
Throttle control and spring from governor arm to carburettor, remove the spring from the carburettor and start it
I like the check the armature bearings under load if there going that would drag motor down
There is a part 2 on this. Figured out the issue.
I've got that exact same generator except it has electric start and its badged by pincor
I am not a mechanic, but maybe the even though you are getting spark when you hand crank and at no load the spark plug wire looks good. Maybe even the 110 v outlets? I really thought you had it on the last attempt. Good luck.
kind of relaxin to pull a carb apart, taking ur time and cleaning all the holes in the emulsion
tube or is a jet? either way nothing clogged. I have seen tiny tiny holes in the barrel end of
carb close to the engine and throttle plate. having soaked carb in cleaner and some shop air
works out pretty good.
Great attention to detail….on the exhaust bolts reassembly I’d use some copper grease.
Did you verify the valve lift? Glitter could be a damaged cam. That could explain the additional force to turn the flywheel in mid stroke.
In part 2 I took the engine apart and found the glitter was coming from the piston. Installed new piston and rings, honed the cylinder. Runs well now, but still more resistance then normal when the piston is traveling up or down regardless of the cycle.
This was a great video to watch. Lots of helpful troubleshooting techniques. When you do torquing of some of the bolts, could you mention what torque spec you are setting them to? About to watch part 2!
As much as I like James work and as much as I respect his skill. This always has been the one aspect, that I didnt like: He seems to guess torque values a lot and then uses a torque wrench to tighten bolts to "his spec". Imho this doesnt make a lot of sense. If you dont have any torque values from the manufacturer, then youre better off doing it by feel.
I would start with making sure that where the fuel comes out of the tank that the fitting doesn’t have something blocking it. I assume that the power head has bearings of some sort. I would make sure that the engine isn’t fighting against them using up all its power.
It runs just like my old Sears and Roebuck Geni It's a 1500 watt made in the 60's, great to get rid of skitters "needs and overhaul " though doubt i can find a set of kits for it now. Has a Tecumseh engine around 5 horses. Love the older engines they generally just run and run and are cast iron blocks. and yep no fancy smancy pull start you have to wind the rope. and you have to do points at least every few runs no. need to pull it outa mothballs and clean it up and see if i can get her to run for me again. Love your vids, keeps and old bird like me piddling in the barn. Hope to see more vintage engines and genies
Wonder if that sludge was stabil? Think I’ve heard mustie1 say that can happen.
It could definitely be! I've seen it gum up injectors.
Great detailed video. Thanks.
That thing sounds amazing!
It sounds even better after the work I did in part 2.
I do actually believe that is the max cause i have a old generator like that ! And if im not mistaken u took out little over the max power on that generator so that is impressive
By the way if u ever want to sale that old generator? I would love to buy it from u
try taking out the fuel filter? maybe restricting the flow?
Just a side note on the leak down test. The breather cover must be in place and the hose plugged when checking for crankcase pressure. Nothing will show on the dipstick tube as all the pressure will blow out the breather area.
Since you already know you have sparkles in the oil I would mike the cam journals and check the bearings. I am a bit surprised that that unit is rated for that kind of wattage. I have a Montgomery Ward one from the mid to late fifties which is rated for 1200 watts as I recall. The engine is similar in size and looks to yours. Can't walk away with the question mark hanging. While you are down there I would pull the piston and mike the cylinder bore for 'hour glass wear'. This would explain your rising friction midstroke perhaps.
great job James!
Thanks
Nice video on the genset. Try adjusting your main jet with your 3000 watt load applied. That may help.
somehow I remember the early 90's being a bit more advanced than this thing shows.
Yes. This one could have been made in the 50s if it was not for the electronic ignition.
Start of though still have 80s hairstyles
If been laid up check bore and rings sometimes they stick in groove with old funky fuel and oil.
I wish our medical doctors diagnose and treat patient the way James to generator.
I suggest that the generator was a fire dept issue because its painted red with number 4 and it was used for lighting which it is perfect for no great load
Interesting case. I would check the muffler for restriction. The cam timing should be checked for split overlap and lift. Anything that would stop it from pumping air would restrict power.
I did a part two on this. Search my channel for Winco and you will find it. But you are right, valve overlap was off by a tooth.
TF tg
Very satisfying nosie when ya heat the jet brake free lol
Another great video James. I'm a long time lurker and recent subscriber. I have watched lots of other video from various sources and I really prefer yours. First, you have a voice for radio which makes it easier to listen to and the way you structure the progression of the teardown and reassembly. Your camera work is very good, thank you for using a tripod, I get seasick on some of the videos out there, dude pick something to focus on already! I appreciate your attention to detail and the data you provide as you go along. Every time you include stuff like the B&S check sheet I run out to the web an get it. Just can't have to much documentation!
Really like the style of carb used on these older engines. Updraft is ancient technology but, fuel cannot pool in the intake. BTW, did you clean out the tank on this one? Did I look away for that step? I saw you replaced the fuel line. The crap in the bottom of the bowl had to come from somewhere. Maybe past that damaged bowl gasket? Thanks again.
Thanks for the great feedback. Been working to improve as I go. My earlier videos were a bit rough. Do not remember taking the intake off. After my luck with the exhaust, probably did not want to risk it. Just picked up another red generator with the same carb from 1987.
There’s gold in that pan! Also looked like you was starting a friction fire while lapping that valve. Just observations.
The old flat head motors were so darn hard to kill........ if you didn't run them out of oil, they just kept on ticking.
I have a 16hp Briggs generator just like that and i can't seem to find any parts for the generator part. Actually this is one of the only videos i can find on fixing one
What is the flash at 50:10? Spray a little carb cleaner in the intake while under load to see if it needs more fuel.
Try bypassing the fuel system to the carb.im thinking fuel filter or tank outlet restriction. BTW verry informative and entertaining
Bob Bor thanks
Yes, this would be my next guess.
You might find investing in a Colourtune to be worthwhile for diagnosing and especially tuning. It's a spark plug with a clear top that lets you see how the fuel is burning, and by that can tell you if it's lean, rich, right, burning oil or other contaminants in small amounts and so on.
I was given a very old one many years ago and though I use it rarely, it has helped me considerably with those times I've pulled it out.
Without having seen P2, one thing I would be suspicious of are the bearings around the power head. Perhaps when it's under load the pressure on the bearings is increasing, and something is binding up? Perhaps end play is letting the armature shift towards one end or the other, and again binding or causing pressure on engine components?
Off to part 2... :)
(Thanks again for posting BTW, interesting material and very well presented without annoying music or other background nuisances!)
You're dusting off my memory of using a color-tune on the dual side draft carbs on old British MG's
James keep the videos coming. I’ve been waiting for new ones.
Working on a few more. Unfortunately the generator market has not been too good since the virus hit. Hopefully things pick up.
Robert Boulware there is a part 2 coming on this one. Also picked a few more things so will have plenty more to come.
@@jcondon1 has part 2 came out yet? I haven't seen it
Yes
wow how long will that run between refueling with that tiny tank
Just coming on to you channel. Not sure you will get this but can still hole out hope. 😬
On those old carbs, it has two separate adjustments. One for idle, one for full throttle. The low, idle. Should be adjusted to be just above stall. The top will have to be adjusted by ear. Didnt see anything in the video about that. Love the older stuff! The new stuff is interesting and informative. Thank you!
I have a part 2 on this one. Figured out the issue.
What do you use in your ultrasonic cleaner for the cleaning liquid ?
I have a post on the solution I use ruclips.net/user/postUgybGXqT5ugMPg8eN7l4AaABCQ
You sir definitely could benefit from a nice big 42'" belt sander if your doing small amount grinding< I built one and absolutely love it and get great work out of it. Thank you for all the great informative vids!, Just waiting on complete cylinder head clone for a 4000 watt gen that has next to no hours and was given to me. It'll do great to keep my furnace going when the power konks out up here in Canada in middle of winter lol
Looks like a FD unit, but not overhauled in years
I have one very similar. Never liked the updraft carb. Mine quit making power and I never looked at why. Probably a diode. Been sitting for 4 years now.
Im pretty sure that engine was used for pumping water back in the 70's. I used to have 2 of those engines, one specificly made for a generator and one for pumping water. The water pump one never had enough power to do high rev like say on a go kart. The generator one worked perfect on a go kart and had plenty of power at higher rev.
Check the points (if it has them) and adjust the main jet while under load.
Also red glowing muffler could also be a leaking exhaust valve.
If that’s a points condenser ignition, change both especially condenser if points are ok.
The main jet setting on the 2500 Craftsman generator that I once had was about 3/4 of a turn out, otherwise it ran real rich.
I have found that if the bottom fuel adjustment screw is adjusted to far in it can and will damage the seat and needle. (at video point 1435)
Sounds like a Cessna!
them gen set's we ues on road work's in the UK manly ruing traffic light's i often sore them doing that but never sore then driving big loads often i would boil an electric kettle on one their were never meant to drive. heavy loads, good gens reliable kit . les England
Hate to criticize the adjustment. The main jet is adjusted with the throttle open. With the governor, this means under load. The idle jet is adjusted unloaded and the throttle manually held closed. It has no accelerator pump, so releasing the closed throttle will cause a slight hesitation, which is normal when adjusted properly. The generator when loaded should have the main jet adjusted for the governor to close the throttle as much as possible, then slightly open from there so it does not run too lean. This will provide good load pick up response.
Those older flat head eights are very reliable!
Yes they are.
I like your diagnostic trail. Had a shop myself in the 80s. STILL learning after watching you fix some of these engines. I also have a valve removal tool(didthe last time I checked) that I wouldnt mind getting rid of. Have you tried adjusting the carb under load?
I had same problem maybe camshaft valve timing ?
Spark arrester missing, not a bad thing. Engine will run better with a little more power
I had a woman once that looked much younger than she was and her output was similar to what you’re experiencing. All the makeup and fancy clothing didn’t work too, like the new carb and paint. Oh well live and learn you’re still young. However I do enjoy your videos..
All that sediments from the carb, I guess thats what damaged the inlet valve seat.
What if the copper windings has one or couple of turn short circuited? Can we compare this with another power head ?
When I go to the farm sales if I see 1 I try to buy it or them, u can't go wrong with old school gen's.
I wonder what would happen if you use premium fuel
I don't think it would change anything but I could be wrong.
Great video, your step-by-step diagnosis is really great. Should have a Patreon link, I'll drop you some money. Hell it's free school lol
That used to be a generator on a fire engine, probably engine #4 from what Insaw on the generator. That’s why it is painted red.
hi james you are working hard on this old girl ,cant be a lot of money in it for you
,i think a rebuild if you have got the time and keep the spending down if you can mate
Not always about making money. Never rebuilt a flat head, wanted to give it a go.
From Mike watched your winco generator video. Good info. I was going to mention I purchased a winco hp 4500 generator few years ago $40 1988 model year on 8 hp ic engine They are built lecenter mn 6 miles from me. Anyway went through carburetor last person in there boy o boy. Got it running runs good changed oil. Mouse nest debris coming out. So next day pulled end cover off of generator huge mouse nest. Vacuum it out. Blew it out. Only seen 1 wire chewed on white ground wire about 2 inches. Put cover on makes 124 volts both outlets. Will find something to put load on it. A concern of mine is there are no circuit breakers on unit. I was going to use for home use if needed. I was thinking of feeding into a 30 amp 220 breaker. The generator has a 50 amp outlet on it. The breaker should provide some protection? Hopefully works ok. Otherwise I have another in my storage shed similar size. Another 8 hp B&S got that going 10 plus years ago. (No gas when stored) that one had carburetor story too. Great videos keep it up
Pickup tube on the gas tank plugged? After cleaning all that garbage out of the bowl I’m thinking the pickup is restricted
Is our overloading the generator
How is the crank caseventilation. If its obstructed it can cause back pressure in the crank case under the piston causing to run slow know it's a stretch but it has to be on the air side of things or mechanical but realistically sound like you may have a bad main bearing
There is a part 2 on this generator. Ended up solving the issue.
Could the muffler being close to your intake manifold be evaporating your fuel mixt ut re. Vapir lock?
There is a part 2 on this.ruclips.net/video/SR8tQJ9NFvo/видео.html
Whats the compression release for & why?..Thnx in advance