I've had 2 guitar instructors that could play the strings off anything that I would never come close to. Both of them were starving on the road, and started doing lessons so they could starve at home. I got over my desire to be a great guitar player and settled for being an "advanced beginner" and had a great career in the shoe biz. Now I'm retired very comfortably and play bass and acoustic guitar with my buddies in my home studio I bought with my shoe money. Lesson I learned was the that music business is like buying lottery tickets; only the lucky win. Unless you're lucky, playing music is for fun.
Our society is running on fumes. Doesn't matter what you do, nothing is sustainable. Music is a free commodity to most people. We have to live with these facts, and play the music that is in our hearts anyway. Good luck everyone.
We have given the keys to the castle to the speculators and to the greedy corporations and to the tech barons and they are sucking the life out of what used to be a good society. Musicians today are donating their services to billionaires.
@scrambaba I wouldn't put the blame so much on the billionaires. The Government and the mainstream media decide the winners and losers. The very wealthy are the ones that are well connected and make the most of their opportunity. We need to whittle the Government down to a size that doesn't drag the economy down. Also, labor wages are getting compressed because of technology and illegal aliens able to make less. It's never one thing!
UK based semi-pro drummer here. The economics of running small to medium sized venues is also an issue, the fees paid to acts has also declined and has become almost impossible to make a professional living doing it. (Exceptions obviously are the big acts who will power on regardless as the ticket prices will rise accordingly). Luckily I don't have to rely on it to make a living, but I know a few pro players and it can be hard even for them, so they go back to teaching and drum clinics etc. One said to me "The happiest drummers I know are the ones who don't do it professionally" Thanks for the honest post.
Used to play rhythm guitar in a pub group in the late 70's-early 80's Often made more on the weekend than I did in my main job. At the time providing a group at the weekend filled large pubs, an extra 2p on a pint would leave the landlord in profit. Beer was cheap no drink driving laws, people consumed more. Then came the portable disco, doing for £50, what we were doing for £160.
@@andrewfrancis3591 Foreigner musician living in Germany since 2003. The music scene if you want to write and play your own material is DEAD. Everything is cover bands (99% with the same lame repertoire), pubs and small locations are out since the plandemie, and because the neighbors find them "too loud". Second point are the hobby musicians, who are mostly architects, doctors or good paid pros who play for free or 100 euros (most of them play very good to be true), but you can easily guess who will hire a pub for a night of live music. We are screwed.
We opened for Napalm Death at a small club in Columbus, OH almost 20 years ago. Barney (their vocalist) and I were sitting in a booth chatting while he was enjoying a sandwich. He said that the RV that they rented for this tour was $1000/wk. Gas was cheaper back then but was still a significant chunk of change. He told me that they were only averaging around $3k week for the entire band. I couldn't believe it. He said he owned a pizza joint back home (overseas) and he works there when not touring. It really opened my eyes at how tough the band life can be.
@JohnDoe-xr5is Billiard Club (right up the street from the Villa). Mitch, who worked the door at the Villa sometimes, was friends with the guys in Napalm Death. He's the one who called me like 3 days before the show to ask if we'd open cuz we usually had a good crowd turnout. Even though the show was on a Tuesday, we agreed. Ended up being an ok gig.
In my teens, my guitar teacher warned me to not pursue a career in music. He was a guitar maestro and was known all over my native town of Montreal, Canada. At the time, it was tough medicine. But now, I'm very grateful that he said what he did, as I see that people who play far better than I ever did are struggling to earn a living.
I majored in music in an alternative program and taught be working professionals. The teaching was their side gig. They taught us the real ins and outs. The more I learned, the less that I wanted anything to do with the music business. I could have been behind the scenes but chose not to. My friends and classmates who "made it" ie support themselves via music almost exclusively had trust funds. Plus, there was a literal 20 year struggle prior to success. I did not have that inclination to be dirt poor for twenty years.But some did make it and are very well known.
The main problem is that nobody count on with the damn Internet that changed the rules of everything forever. And as long as the AI grows, the things will always worse.
@@badbrad And with overpopulation in the whole planet, it leads to a World War in search of resources, like it is beginning to happening right now (Ucraine, lithium in South America, land to cultivate in Africa, palm plantations in Asia etc)
I was the touring bassist for the Motown group The Miracles for several years. We got $500 a show. All sold out shows. We played a lot of shows. In the 80s I’d be making $900 a day doing 3 studio sessions a day in LA. It’s not like that anymore. There’s just no money for sidemen or touring musicians in the music business anymore. Musicians need multiple income streams these days to survive. Lucky I still get calls to play basically every day but at 64 I have no interest in touring. Nowadays I work on projects for clients who hire me remotely to send them tracks from my home studio in Thailand where I live now. I was also an entertainment lawyer so made my money doing that later in life which afforded me options.
Wow very cool. Thanks so much for chiming in. That Motown stuff has so many killer bass lines so I know you can play the heck out of the bass. You’re absolutely right about the multiple income streams.
I’m retired in Thailand as well. Left commercial sound reinforcement for IA695 Hollywood feature film work. IA pension and SS, happy days. I started in 1979 ABC Dunhill. Now retired Hyperbaric Chamber Systems Engineer, Phuket.
I did music to age 35, then went into tech and made a good living, retired early age 57. Had I stayed in music, I would be in the poor house right now most likely... or gigging my butt off to make ends meet. I know so many musicians from my old days that stayed in the game, and still playing gigs that would bore the socks off me.
Howdy neighbor! I moved to nearby Old Hickory back in March after 12 years in NYC. As a multi-instrumentalist and composer, it's comforting to hear your perspective on the Nashville scene and making a living in Music City. I subbed to your channel probably a month ago after watching some of your amp sim pedal reviews. Keep the videos coming!
Nice to meet you! Welcome to Tn. There is a lot of good to be had here for sure but the reality is a bit sobering. Wish you much luck in your endeavors here. Thanks so much!
Howdy, just subscribed~!!! ty. I'm a truck driver from Canada, and used to do a lot of Nashville drops. Used to park my rig across the Opry, and hang out at the Music City Bar and Grill & catch a few shows. Got to know the owner... John IF I recall. Oak Ridge Boys, are my thing. Use to love your city, so sorry that things are going south, as most of this world. Soon it will be only misery left.... tks for sharing with us.
Young musicians need to hear this BEFORE they load up their vans and head to Nashville. If nothing else - this video should allow them to reset their expectations and better prepare (and budget) for the realities of the game. Nicely done! Thanks for sharing that
I don't think it's even occuring to them... they're trolling facebook at their parents house. pick up an instrument? And PRACTICE? That's almost like having a job.
$300 bucks for a gig is simply not worth it. Truth is that bars, clubs, and venues pay the same money we made in the 70's and 80's. I'm glad I became an engineer and kept up guitar playing and singing as a side gig.
CMIIW, but I don’t thinks that is the situation the video is about. It’s about the ‘backing band’ supporting the big name. A bass player playing for whoever making $3-500/night. That is what the artist is paying them. It sounds like it’s a job for people with discipline. You could theoretically live on the road for free, eat with per diem, drink from the venue rider concessions contract at shows and pocket $40k+. I couldn’t because I am about that life, but some people could.
Exactly! I'm not a musician but I've been around many. I know those guys show up way early to setup and do sound check and they're there at 3AM packing it up! I used to see musicians at 10AM at a local diner looking like they were half dead already getting ready to get back on the bus to drive to the next gig. They couldn't have slept more than 5 hours or so.
The music industry is over. Honestly, I think for 99.9999% of us watching this video, our best option is to just go to church whether or not we make it in the band 😂. When the people who get played on the radio or play on stage in support of the artist on the radio, can’t make an honest living anymore… it’s time to shovel some dirt on this horse cuz it’s dead… even the artists who actually make some money usually get screwed out of it anyways… thanks for the insight and best of luck.
Yup. I do church gigs as well. They pay better than any club, (but not why I do them...), 4-5 songs with a short rehearsal mid-week, and ampless. Plug in play, pray, go home.
99 percent of musicians work a day job five days a week and play mostly on Friday and Saturday nights. We're usually happy to make a hundred dollars a man, sometimes less, but a three hundred dollar night is really rare. When we open a show for someone the fee goes down. Only way to make good money opening a show for someone is if the promoter wants to rent your gear for the backline. We once made decent money providing the back line for an Edgar Winter show. When we make a CD we have to finance the thing ourselves and usually we only make enough money off of it to finance some of the next one. The music is usually better than the stuff that is coming out of Nashville though, so that's worth something. Most of us have spent some time playing six nights a week and living in a motel, when we were much younger. If you play for a living and don't have to work a day job it's your choice. My advise though, get a day job. Time flies. When time catches up with you, and it will, you will be sorry unless your mom and dad have provided for your old age. Btw, hardly noboby in any market buys a house if they make 30K a year.
We sold shirts, caps, weed, took odd jobs from the stage in cities...whatever we could do to simply buy nice gear for a tour we had planned. We got the gear we needed piece by piece and it sounded crystal clear out front. We got a bus lined up, and were ready to start booking shows up toward Montana from Louisiana, up across the north, down the east coast to Florida and back through the South (we were crazy enough to pull it off)...then a bar burned to the ground after a Saturday show when they talked us into playing the next Wednesday. The owner "accidentally" burned the place for insurance and took pictures of our gear as contents. We got nothing. We tried. That was the best microphones, drums, monitors, cymbals, mixer etc I`ve ever owned. James Burton sold a lot of it to me (by chance) and I was proud of it and he said the rust on a mic stand was from Elvis` sweaty hand. I finally quit playing as a singing drummer just to be able to avoid the next phone call and started fishing instead. Hey, it was fun for a long time and I learned a lot and met some cool folks. What an adventure!
What's worked for me, assuming music is your ultimate goal/dream job - doing adjacent or complimentary work. This could be teaching lessons, repairing/flipping musical equipment, working at a music store, having a youtube channel, or even just working a part time job that has daytime hours as not to interfere with gigs on nights and weekends. I've dabbled in all of these and that's what it takes.
I played in a garage band once and we were nothing to brag about. We played a very small handful of gigs and I had made a comment to them that if I could make enough money to buy dinner and some gtr strings I would be happy. One of them came back with I don't want to turn this into a business. But when have have everything together when you get to the show by default it becomes a business. So if you don't want to deal with the business side stay at home and play in you garage you will be better off. Whatever you do don't be the one to play for beer you are being taken for a ride. With fuel being over five dollars a gallon in some places your lucky to make it there much less get back when it's all said and done. After my very short experience with it I just don't see how anyone could even remotely make living at it. Good luck to those who try your going to need it.
I decided not to be a professional guitar player when I was young because I didn't want my favorite thing to do, play guitar, become a job. Im glad I didn't for several reasons but number 1 I didn't want to lose that love that I still have for music.
Wow. I have been pushing my 22 year old singer/guitarist niece to move to Nashville. She is making it in North Carolina by gigging and teaching but I know her rent is around 1k monthly. Watching this maybe she should just stay put.
Moving here was the best decision I have ever made. She will have to do more than just play. She should learn how to mix so that she can do sound between playing. Have her learn to do lights too.
Hey Brad. Paul here from Jacksonville, Florida. This is actually the first video I saw of yours. I'm glad I found your channel! Thanks much for all you do, and welcome to Florida!
I am not a musician, but I love music. I really appreciate this content. Some of it deeply saddens me, though. You all deserve more. Music is the marrow of life. Marrow providers should never be hungry. I’m glad you made out ok, Brad. And, I’m equally glad you’re telling the young up and comers what to expect and how going to Nashville is not what it used to be. Perhaps getting the word out about how terrible things have become may be the best way to turn it around. I hope so.
this is why I stopped playing the bass guitar in my early 20s. I could not see any consistent income and have a family. I had enough to be out on weekends. This is short term as a young musician to just have fun. I have now two bass guitars, I enjoy them once in a while in my free time, but not for living anymore. I love the sound of any music and the energy it comes from. It is addictive
In Nashville, a bassist has to be a jack of all trades most of the time. You can’t be just a bass player, you also need to be pretty darn good at keyboard, rhythm guitar, singing BGV’s, and playing trumpet/harmonica/melotron/accordian, etc. The bass player has to be a utility musician most of the time.
Played the Jersey Shore /Philly/NYC area in the 60's. Went back to college and worked as an engineer for a few decades. Got back into music in Atlantic City - I could make 400-500 a day busking on the Boardwalk in the early 2000's. Plus, I got a lot of free show tickets from the artists playing the casinos. great times.
At 25, I went back to school. Pro musicians, all better than me, were struggling. Thirty years later, I’ve got a home, a wife, a daughter and a career. Oh, I’ve got a local gig this weekend.
When playing music is about getting laid, musicians get paid...when it's about getting paid musicians are F#$%@'d. Music income is more related to branding, T-shirt and merch sales than music sales these days so the economics are bound to get wonky. Good stuff Brad!
Great insight on the reality of life in Nashville as a working musician. I’ve been in town since 2015. I have a college degree from MTSU where I studied in the Recording Industry Management department. I have a bachelors of science in Commercial Songwriting. For those unfamiliar, MTSU and Belmont are the universities that more or less feed into the entire Nashville music industry. After a couple years of job hopping post-graduation (wasn’t able to find a job with my degree because I worked through college, rather than being an unpaid intern - thus not having the “required experience” for industry jobs come time to enter the workforce), I went full time with music in 2022. The only reason it’s been a possibility is because of consistent Broadway gigs. Not ideal as someone who aspires to be a recording artist to be playing covers full time, but it feeds my family. I’m a songwriter so my experience is different than the sidemen in town because I now make money through publishing, but even with a publishing deal I have to play cover gigs just to make enough money. Luckily I married a local - my family of 4 is currently living at my mother-in-law’s house because rent is too expensive everywhere else in town. If it weren’t for that, I’d have to choose between going back to work full time or forcing my family into homelessness because I have this silly dream that I can’t stop chasing. For shits and giggles - I played a standard 4 hour shift today on Broadway and I made $175 to sing my ass off and front a band on the hottest day of the year (nonetheless, Father’s Day), and get this: I was excited about making *that much*. Would love to hear more about your experience. Awesome video.
Thank you! Wow $175 is decent but not if you had to pay today’s rent prices. I get some publishing mailbox money but not anything I can count on. Keep at it brother. Don’t give up and glad you got a roof over your head. Be nice to mother in law!
@@gingervytis nothing funny about it. There are a lot of songwriting success stories from MTSU and Belmont alike. Hardy has the same degree lol. You’ll know my songs soon, don’t worry
Very informative video for a consumer of music, not a performer. I’ve been in plenty of crowds that I feel embarrassed to be in for their attitude/behavior toward the performers. These bad apples should watch a few videos like this. Subscribed!
Brad I just discovered you videos and I'm an instant fan. Your observation are very measured and thoughtful. I'm an X-NYer (in Durham NC one year now) and have been playing and performing a very long time. I've had lots of great experiences and put out some records, but I could not put up with the bars and hassles. For the past 25 years I've worked exclusively with pre-schoolers, sharing music and dance with them. It is so rewarding and interesting, I'd much rather give the gift of music to these little ones, and I get to play and sing a few hours every day!I'm enjoying all your takes and insights. Carry on, brother.
I’m a singer songwriter I haven’t played any live gigs since the Pandemic ! From what I’m hearing there are hardly any paying gigs !? People are saying you’re better off playing on the street for tips !
Boy oh boy, do I feel good about my life now. I toil away in obscurity 3 times a week, 300 per night, 15 minutes from home, play whatever I want, come home to my sweetie every night . Life’s good.
@richard - You don't get paid that kind of money when you "toil away in obscurity" and "play whatever you want" unless you, or a relative, owns the venue. ?
In 1980, my 5-piece band signed a $975,000 3 album front load deal with a major label. As a lead guitarist, I made $1,000 a week to practice, and $1,500 on the road, with a $50 per diem. None of our 3 albums were released, and we were sold to A & M before the third album. We were dropped in Redding, Ca. after opening for the Tubes. Being from Huntington Beach, we copped a ride home on PSA with the Tubes, since they were dropped by A & M also years earlier. I had 3-4 glorious years on the road, playing 275 nights a year opening for REO, Foghat, Derringer, Blackfoot, and many more…Our attorney told us we’d never get anything released, as we were a tax write-off for the label. (WB). Our checks had Looney Tunes cartoon characters on them! 😆😆 Times were different back then I guess, Brad…
High School bands, 4 years active duty Air Force and into my late 50’s playing in bar bands. It’s been a lot of fun, great nights and bad nights but the mantra for me was “ya gotta love it!” On some level it was selfish that I was doin it for me, no aspirations of being famous, grounded in the reality of it, I never considered giving up my day job. Early on I had the thought that on any Saturday night all across the country there were bands playin right then and I took some pride in being part of that. The pleasure of those nights when all the equipment is right, the bands feelin good and the crowd likes what your doing is pretty awesome and making that happen regularly is work. Over the years there were a few times we were approached by someone offering studio time or a few dates out of state but we never picked up on any of that. It was a professional hobby and I wouldn’t trade the experiences for anything. Just last night I looked at my wife and said “I’m ready for bed”, she smiled and said “it’s 8:30, ya know, just five years ago I’d be puttin on makeup” lol, I guess we both kinda miss it but dang, I turn 63 this year, I don’t wanna stay up till 2am. Apologies for rambling, I have a lot of respect for the pros, determined, hard working folks that also get a bit of luck but I know there are great performers entertaining the crowd all across the country in almost every little town every weekend and the odds of making a good living and having a family doing it are slim at best but Ah,,,The Dream!
@@badbrad- thanks for the video! Some harsh truth. All the practice, equipment, set-ups and tear downs, travel, late nights and skipping other things you might want to do are all hard work and are worth something but the income side just isn’t there for the common band even if they are really good. Butts in the seats, drinks, and maybe food income minus the building lease, electric bill, supplies, servers, insurance…. And oh yea, a little something for the band, how’s $1,300 and a bar tab sound for two nights? Best I can do (and we played for a lot less plenty of times). Five band members, $260 each for two nights, we usually chipped in $20-30 each to give to a couple buddies who helped unload and set up. $240 for roughly 10hrs work. Not terrible but that’s it for the week, 10 hours. Not a living really, gonna need that day job 🫤. The rest of the story is the rush of doin it, it’s amazing when vocals blend just right or you nail that guitar lick you’ve been practicing, the whole band movin through time in perfect sync, everybody getting their part perfect all at the same click in time. Sometime you could feel the crowd just kinda stop what they were doin and ride along for a minute or two. I’m sure you understand but it’s hard to describe and to me that was the real pay back for the time spent to get it right.
Your channel somehow found me this morning with this video. In the late-70's a friend moved from our small town in Ohio to Nashville to be a song writer. Fame actually brushed his elbow in the 80's. He continued to write, branching into producing and promoting. Anyway, after my divorce 20 years ago he said he had all kinds of session work for a deep bass singer such as myself and asked me to move down. I told him it sounded like fun but I would still need to drive a truck around Nashville during the day to support that hobby.😄
Unfortunately this is the sad reality of post Covid economics. I retired seven years ago. When I stopped working I could live, albeit very modestly, on my retirement income. Since Covid, grocery prices have doubled in my area and rental prices have quadrupled. As far as buying a house, there is nothing livable under $450k. A tiny wood frame house across the street from me just listed at $550k. The 94 yo woman who lived in it had been there since the 50s and had done zero upgrades since moving in. It is almost inevitable that I will have to rejoin the workforce.
@@edtaylor7816 The goal of capitalism is to reduce all human interactionf to the cash nexus. Big conglomerates own all the apts. COW= concentrations of wealth
Great stuff. I mostly quit the live/touring/gig 25 years ago for teaching music at university, studio sessions, writing, and producing. I can comfortable make $100,000 plus per year, live in a great home, have great gear and enjoy a good family lifestyle.
I’ve been playing professionally since the mid 90s - I remember when I started, the older cats said they were making the same money then that they were making in the 1970s. How do you make a living or I dare say, get ahead as a working artist when the average person believes that what you do should be free by definition? Gigs paid better when I was a kid starting out than they do nowadays. I feel Ike I was among the last generation of working musicians that could actually make a living playing an instrument. A real drag.
It is. Some do better than others, we all work way harder than we are compensated ...that is for sure. Kids here make way more than we did when I first got to town, so there's that.
That video you ran on your intro is Jamboree In The Hills. That show started in 1977 and at that time it was biggest country music festival in the country. I worked at every one of those events. I managed that stage for about 25 years.
Very interesting video. Thanks. I'm glad I enjoy playing the guitar and other instruments for the pleasure of it and not have to depend it on it for a living, especially aged 67! Good luck
Great video. It's hard for sure man. I'm 31 and got here six years ago. Came to town recording for the first two years (mostly online) then an occasional bus gig. Bought my first house in 2020 (out towards Dickson) with overdub money. Then went on the road for two years and got away from it for all the reasons you mentioned. Now rent that house out and moved into Nashville which was a major investment in 2023 and not easy to make happen. No recording full-time at the house with some tracking sessions mixed in a few times a week. The price of Nashville definitely stacks the cards against cats that are trying to make a living on the road. I think it's crazy hard but doable for the cats with the skills, organization, and personality...definitely takes all three.
@@NickyV No bout a doubt it my friend. It takes having all 3 of those traits & then some. Another big thing every musician needs who really want to be successful in the music industry is a relentless mindset with a never ending work ethic striving to make it. Even when a musician has everything it takes on their resume to make a career in music. It still takes a lot of luck to set you apart from the rest to be in the click with the big boys & girls. Just keeping it a buck here ya dig? 🤔🧐 So giddy up, you're on the clock. Tick-Tock! ++Peace & Rock n' Roll 4 Your Soul My Friend++ 🤘😜🤘
I seriously considered a career in music in the mid 1980s. Friends of mine in national touring bands were going through the same things then, though the economics were less at that time. I realized that the decision to do music was either for the pure love of music or for a shot at stardom, which was one in a million. The math simply didn’t add up do I pursued a career in banking with a credit union and now I pull in a great income, have a nice home and a wonderful wife. Now I know people in Nashville just scraping out a living with no insurance, no retirement and their family and relationships are in the past and broken. Their children are estranged and their health is poor and they live a life of regret. While I have admired their choices and secretly wish I was doing what they do, I’m incredibly grateful that I had the foresight to look at the choices without stars in my eyes. I have really nice gear and play out locally when I want to with people I enjoy. No regrets.
I hear you brother and I feel what you're saying. It's been tough but I have my family and the love of my kid, so I am wealthy beyond what I ever thought I would be. I'm glad you're still playing! Best to you.
You are telling the truth brother! I've been in the music industry now 40 years. I was an artist through the 80s up to 1997. I got to Nashville by doing an audition for Opryland USA in 1990. When TNN Network was over and the Park closed, I decided to start a recording studio. Playing downtown I've been there done that not for me anymore. I built a studio and that was the best thing I ever did. To this day that has help me survive the crazy Nashville dream. I tell a lot of young writers/ Artist if you come to town you'll have to get a second job other than playing music. That's a fact! I bought my house in North Nashville 20 years ago on 4 acres. My house if I had to buy it today would over 400,000 today! Great video everything you've said is the hard truth.
I bought my house 20 years ago on 3 acres in North Nashville. If I had to buy it today I couldn't afford it @ 400,000 today! Thanks for the cold hard truth about living & working in Nashville.
Thank you for dropping in. It’s so good to hear from so many like minded souls. I think your underestimating your property value 4 acres and a house would probably get you much more.
I left Nashville for THIS reason. Moved back to Colorado and started playing corporate/wedding gigs. Colorado is extremely expensive, but the wedding work was $450-$1200 a show averaging $600. I did that for 8 years. But, still no health insurance and my wife and I struggled. I was never home on the weekend and she still had to work weekdays. Additionally, that gig beat me up physically, every gig was 4 hours of dance music, 2-3 hours of jazz standards and typically an hour of solo guitar for the cocktail hour. Plus often to save money there were no accommodations, we’d finish at 1am and drive home sometime 3 hours thru mountain passes all in your own car. Talk about wear and tear. I found my happy place now playing in an original band in the red dirt scene. I’ve switched to pedal steel for three reasons. One, it’s a blast and I love the texture. 2: I get to sit down saving my back and legs, 3: it’s not an essential instrument. If I can’t make a gig, the band can still play without me. Obviously this is a rare gig and the guys in the band are the coolest dudes I’ve ever worked with to allow me that kind of flexibility. That gig doesn’t pay, we do make money but it all goes back into the pot for studio time and travel expenses. Everyone has a day job.
Brother your message resonates with me big time. Through all the bumps in the road in this business it has been the Wedding and Corporate work that has literally kept me alive. It's only more recently the pay for that has increased. That is a booming business now and younger bands are taking alot of the bookings as their is money to be made. I just did a 4 hour straight this Saturday in a venue with no AC. 1-2 hours of Jazz then cranking out the Dance tunes. It does beat you up.
Yup. Corporate/wedding gigs here still pay the best, $4500-$6000 for the band. Serious work as you need to have a very large catalogue at your fingertips...
Yep pedal steel player here....I'm the only steel player in the Virgin Islands so I get called out fairly regularly...standard 3 hr gig here pays $150..certainly not in it for the money..I had to laugh at the sitting down part of your post!
I’m not a professional musician but I thoroughly enjoyed your insight. My wife and I had a small restaurant (1998-2002) where we did a few small Jazz festivals and booked in Jazz musicians on the weekends so I am somewhat familiar with the fact that making a living as a musician can be very difficult. Much respect to you! Cheers from California 🍻Subscribed
@@badbradthose were some golden days for my wife and I! We were able to have professional musicians perform and also gave many musicians at the University of Wisconsin, Eau Claire a venue to hone their craft in their early days. Thanks for your time and have a great weekend Brother!
Great channel and video! A friend of mine turned me onto Colt Ford's "There ain't no trash in my trailer..." Funny tune. My dad was a classical musician. He was full-time in a medium market orchestra plus a full-time (in terms of pay/benefits) music college professor. He had to do both jobs to allow our family of four a middle-class life. He also would teach privately on occasion. Back in the 1980s he encouraged my brother and I to go into business or anything but music. The business has been declining forever. Back in the 1940s you had bands everywhere. The advent of recorded music put an end to a lot of that. Wedding bands disappeared in the late-1980s/90s with all of the DJs. It's just spiraled down from there. I was lost as someone who was musical but started too late. Became a fishing guide and have been full-time now for 20 years. I play guitar everyday. Doing fishing professionally made me lose some zest for it - I can see how it happens in music. I know I won't lose my love of music as an amateur.
I enjoyed watching this and hearing your stories from the road. Sad that actual talented musicians are paid so little playing for big acts. As a lousy drummer for a service club act (VFW etc) in the 1980's I made $100 - $150 a gig. They almost always threw in free hamburgers and fries too.
Man that’s pretty good dough and free food! My experience in the late eighties and early nineties playing the big name clubs. Sometimes we got two pizzas and some beer and no $$.
I was the lead singer in a band. We were pretty good (pretty good ain’t perfect) we were invited to be on a Dick Clark TV show back in 1969. Long story short we broke up before we were scheduled to fly to California and appear. Lots of people often said over the years that I should’ve stuck with it. (They were sure I was destined to make it!) I wasn’t that interested in show business because my gut told me it wasn’t a good life. I instead used my natural talent and became a salesman, manager, director etc in a long successful career that allowed me to perform in a manner that was much more valuable to society, my family and myself. I never regretted my decision to take a different path and the more I hear, read and see, the more I’m sure I was right! For every Taylor Swift, Elvis, George Strait, etc there are 10 million stranded, lonely, depressed wannabes or never beens out there! No thanks!
I hear ya brother. Still would have been cool if you guys had done Dick Clark show. Imagine how cool when RUclips showed up and you see yourself and your old buddies on that show.
I’m glad you’re having a good life. Do you know many things go into having the amount of ambition It takes to succeed in the music business. If you have no regrets, you’re doing fine. When someone needs it so much I want it so much the adulation are they really want to be famous… I don’t know… I suppose some will make it. There are more important things than being famous. I mean it would be nice. I think to be able to just be famous enough to make a living. I think that was possible or more possible up until till… I’m not sure when, Maybe 20 years ago. When you could be in a band that travels around kind of a regional circuit and actually have people show up for gigs and stuff anyway, it’s kind of cool that you got as far as you did. It would’ve been cool to do the Dick Clark show.
spot on. Myself I was lucky... I was able to work as a full time musician from 17 to now... 65. It was tough sometimes, but end up fine. I was able to support my family and raise my children. Nowadays it will be even tougher. I played a couple of times in the Nashville area in 1993 in some small venues. Most difficult times for me was when I had a band and had to split gig money for 3-4 folks.. But most of my life I worked just alone and I guess it was more beneficial that way. Nowadays I can't really play as before because my right hand fingers stop working on the guitar, though I still do a lot of recording - it is just by 2 fingers :) which is not sufficient to play a gig alone anymore really. Good luck with Nashville gigs - completely out of my reach now - and life there is too expensive, too much of the trouble for me :)
So glad I found this video and your channel! Finally someone that has lived and felt my pain as a pro musician! Everything in your video is correct and similar to the scene in Toronto Canada. Except average shitty little 1 bedroom apt is $2500 average a month. Look forward to watching more of your videos and you’ve inspired me to do some videos on my channel on the Toronto scene which I’m very familiar with!
I'm glad I could inspire you and I welcome you to my channel. Always loved playing in Canada. Great people in that country. Best to you and keep hitting those skins.
@@badbrad I’ll keep hitting them! Trying to grow my channel as another viable income stream! as you know to make a living as a musician you need many streams coming in!
First let me say that I really enjoyed this video; it is eye opening. I always thought that touring musicians made very good money. I played guitar at my church for a lot of years, none of the musicians got paid. But, I just enjoyed being able to play every Sunday with a great group of musicians. Thanks again for posting this video.
Excellent episode Brad... dishing out a raw slice of T. The music industry is exploitive, preying on the dreams of young folks with stars in their eyes; maybe you can get by in your 20s sleeping on a couch without health insurance, but what does it look like for guys in their 40s, 50s, and beyond? Not a sustainable lifestyle to say nothing of the high probability of alcoholism or other substance abuse issues. Thanks for keeping it real!
Man you hit the nail on the head with that one. That was me beating up the road at 40 with no health insurance and surrounded by alcohol. I got out alive and I am very thankful for that. In a much better place now and I don’t miss the road one bit. Thanks so much for chiming in and keeping it real.
The music industry sadly lost it`s "shine" when humans stopped going to a store to buy a physical piece of plastic that had music on it once you put it on a music player of sorts. The good ol days as they say, the money was there because of records, tapes, cds selling and selling. After th year 2000 so many things changed for the worst in music in my humble opinion...cheers
@@jody8526937 I can see that. There are a lot of musical rabbit holes that I have gone down lately where I have learned something new. There seems to be a lot of things done by design.
The reality is pay rates are determined by supply and demand. As long as qualified musicians are willing to take gigs at that rate, the rate will be the normal. If they can't find a willing musician at $300-500, they will pay more and raise ticket prices or not tour. Sadly the live music scene at local clubs died in the early 2000s. Used to play clubs in the middle of nowhere in Maine in the late 90's and get $300 plus the $5 a person at the door. We'd load in Thursday afternoon, play Thursday, Friday and Saturday at the same club, then load out Saturday night or early Sunday. Then host a Sunday Jam night at our local club. We'd pull $4k in 3 days for us plus $500 for the jam night (no door) which we donated to the bank to pay for the truck, gas and new pa and lighting equipment. $4000 divided by 4 people was good money for a part time job in the late 90's. Could never make it on that today. Even back then we all had day jobs at Daddy's Junky Music or Guitar Center.
@@badbrad It was, especially with low cost of living in Maine. Played clubs in Maine, NH and Mass. had an original band that played in Boston a good bit but we would make $150 for the set to dive 4 ways, lol.
I’m am/was a gigging solo musician. …nowhere near the caliber of musician as you..Here in my town people expect me to play four hour gigs for $150. On top of that they expect me to know just about every genre of music. Omg a four hour gig with drive time is an eight hour day including setup/teardown time. Then they get mad when I don’t know any Taylor Swift or children’s music for their five year old snot Nosed brat.
I moved to Nashville in 2017, my 1br Apt was $800/month. It’s around $1100 now. I moved w the intention of having fun as opposed to getting financial success. Mission accomplished
In 1969, right after high school graduation in Upper East Tennessee at age 18, I completely lost the ability to play my bass guitar due to auto accident injuries, after playing in a band for over 4 years. We started in grammar school. I have been stressed for 50+ years over it, but I went and graduated from college and law school and have been a practicing attorney for over 40 years with a good income. Your video was a very good assessment of what I avoided long ago. Thank you.
I think this is really good advice. There is a harsh reality to music. Most people want to gloss over the negatives because it’s no fun to think about the those things when you’re in dream mode.
On my first road trip, I ate nothing but oatmeal and blueberry yogurt for about a month. Then I figured out that I needed food more than Jack Daniel's.
"And Harry doesn't mind if he doesn't make the scene. He's got a daytime job - he's doing alright. He can play the honk-tonk like anything, saving it up for Friday night." {Mark Knopfler}.
I was playing in a cover band in the 80s-90s to 2012, 5 - 6 nights a week. I bought a house in a fairly good neighbour hood in Sydney , Australia paid $126 thousand in 92, now its worth 2.1 million (insaine). I got out of the music business at the right time. a musician would be lucky to play 2 night a week today.
@@badbrad no normal wage earner here in Australia will ever qualify to buy a house ..let alone rent one ..now ordinary houses are 1 million plus .. Australia is stuffed .
@@leighsayers2628 I am so sorry to hear that. I've been really watching what is happening down there and it not good. I hope the people can bring some change.
When I toured, it was my second job. A pal whom I worked with at my primary job tagged along once on weekend run and said doing both was insane and wondered how I was pulling it all off. Youthfulness helped. I was making a bit more than the road crew per gig. Was fun sometimes, but financially ridiculous.
One of the many reasons Nashville is soon to be a ghost town. When no service industry people, not just musicians, from servers to retail workers can afford to live in a city, those businesses go away and the business owners go Brooke and the town/City dies
On the other hand, it won't die. As if that was the logic San Fran, Seattle, L.A., NYC would be dead. I lived in all but L.A. and it was seemingly impossible to survive. Being poor was normal, yet somehow folks still live in these places.
@@RockAndDoubleBassWithAaronJoy and each city you mentioned went through just what I described for a time until corrected. It won't due but it will become comatose for a time
It’s like being a writer, poet, painter, journalist, historian, archeologist. You need to have outside/family income to even pursue those type fields, or a patronage like the ancient musicians had from Kings.
I've played guitar through my teens. I never thought it was a good idea to be a musician. Not a smart move. A guitar buddy of mine did go on the road. After two years he came home. I love music but i will not sacrifice my living for it. Good video from Sacramento
Just discovered your channel , I live south of Nashville in Columbia, used to love going downtown for live music , now the crowds of tourist and parking problems hve made it a total nightmare, rarely go to live concerts at Bridgestone or The Ryman because honestly the ticket prices are too much after including parking. Im going to go back and check out all your videos, best of luck enjoy Florida.
I’ve been in Nashville for 27 years, back then John Michael Montgomery was paying $400 per gig in season, and $600 per week off season … Nashville has never been place to make money gigin , it was always a recording and publishing where the money was , for corporations of course , not musicians….as for touring , like Merle Haggard once said , it is a “glamorized bus driving “
me n my brother been in the music business since 1978, playing gigs, never could make a living, we worked construction during the week, giged on fri n sat, now were retired, still playing, but still not much money, you gota love it to stick with it
I quit being a full time musician at age 22. Went back to school and paid my way through 3 degrees with a job AND playing weekends (and some private parties and teaching) locally. That was in the 80s/90s. The guys I played with are all still out there. I don’t know how they stuck with it. The music business made me miserable. Playing was always joy. But, the business was mostly misery for me. I’m happier in bed watching RUclips videos about the music business, than I would ever be in the music business. I have a million great memories of the road. But, I never regretted getting out.
Wow! I left music when I was 30. Never got out of the clubs but it was a decent run. Post music, I got super lucky and found my destiny. I wish the same for you and everyone else out there.
Have a friend who makes a living playing covers in bands, solo, duos, and a Beatles/classic rock tribute. Basically, the whole spectrum outside of touring. He is fortunate that he is married to woman with a well paying corporate job with the steady paycheck and benefits. Sadly, it seems that’s what it takes to survive in the business as you get older.
Same here. I work giving tuition (guitar and bass) since 2008 in Germany. The things after the lockdown went down and down, many musicians came into the teaching area (most of them are good players but don´t have not a clue how to teach), the music schools hire personal on independent basis: You must pay your medical insurance and retirement from your own wallet. To raise 2.000 euros monthly you must take 4 music schools, driving each day to a different city, and with 50 - 60 uninterested students pro week the risk of ending with a burnout is knocking your door. My wife had a good salary, but it´s frustrating anyway.
@@badbrad I gave lessons in Argentina, Italy, Austria and Germany. In three different languages, and with three different notation systems (in the end everyone stays with tablature 😁 ). It´s simply brain draining, but I started in 1995 more or less and 100% pro since 2008. But I hate when new students come to me telling me that they had lessons with another teacher for 4 or 5 years and they still cannot put the hands properly on the instruments....... "What for a swindler gave you lessons, dude?" I think. And the worst nightmare is giving online lessons.
Here’s a question for these struggling musicians in Nashville: If you’re faced with a serious health issue, or perhaps dental work or major car repairs or housing HOW THE HELL DO YOU GUYS MANAGE? I’m sorry but I’d rather have a good paying day job and plenty of money in the bank knowing that when (for example) my water heater takes a dump I can easily pay for a new one in full installed, or perhaps a new heat pump. Living on a few hundred bucks here and there is toooooo stressful. Which is why most players are single with no wife perhaps and definitely no kids.
A friend of mine is in his band. They do not make $300 a show lol. It varies from artist to artist, but, if you’re playing for arena headlining and above that: stadium headlining artists, you’re making pretty fantastic money in most cases. As you should! The issue is that if you’re not in either of those two categories, you’re getting absolutely crushed with destitution. I guess it’s “are you willing to fight it out until you get a chance to be in those bands?” Also, I have several friends in the pop world in LA. The pop music world pays substantially more than the country world. It’s interesting
Hey Brad really enjoying the videos man. I am a Nashville native actually Hendersonville funny enough. Been a musician all my life. I almost went down your path but ended up becoming disillusioned about the dream of becoming a professional musician here in Nashville. I played in all kinds of bands and in all sorts of environments and figured out by the time i was in my late 20's that this town does not care one lick about musicians. Your stories have only made me more glad i did not go all in on my dream. I Still play music but for me and me alone. If i did get into another band it would be for pure fun. Keep up the stories man really good that your spreading the truth and honesty of this town.
My sons band is on the road( tour) for second time this year, playing 6 nights a week for the month, 4 piece, make 125-150$ each a gig, bus broke down in upstate New York two days ago, and stranded them, they still have the rest of the gig dates to fill this month, it’s a heat wave on the east coast, they started a go fund me and got over 5k, first day, enough to get finished and get ready to go back out in July for 20 days on a festival tour across Midwest. Ahhhh, to be young, bottom line, you got to love it, it’s a passion not a job, Blessup
Music died in the late 90’s. The engineered this!!! No more monsters of rock tours no more Superbands only soft porn bands (For the Most Part playing engineered songs and lyrics) to keep everyone in line!!!! So glad I grew up in the mid 80’s, And lived to tell the tale!!!!
I remember going out to bar shows in the 90s to see rock bands and being shocked by how little they had. Bands that who i thought were already rich celebrities. I saw the band Korn in a bar, to me they were on MTV and all the cool kids at my school liked them so obviously they were rich. I watched the show then waited after to see if i could meet them and the guitarist immediately started asking me for cigarettes lol. Later they got even more famous and popular, hopefully they saw some good money.
I think Korn did ok. I worked security in the pit at an Ozzy show and Korn was the opener. This was the beginning of their career. At that point in time the Nashville audience was not that accepting of their hybrid sound. But they worked hard and broke through.
Figured out early on that I was unwilling to make the sacrifices necessary to become a professional musician. Went into Tech in the early 80s and did that for 40 years. Now I'm retired and practicing many hours a day, holed up in a home studio, and occasionally playing jazz gigs for fun. Respect to this channel owner and others with the talent and drive necessary to become professional musicians!
@@badbrad … I was a formal classical and jazz guitar student for roughly half my tech career and even had a small basement studio in a prior home. That to say that I didn’t let it go completely, but my musical growth was a snail’s pace due to the intensity of a high-level tech career.
The problem is gigs in 2024 paying same as 1987
You are correct!
Well, the "nostalgia factor" is alive!
@@SidAlienTV It's always the good old days...
Recording engineer in Austin told me rates are the same here as in the 90s.
@@emeraldox wow!
I've had 2 guitar instructors that could play the strings off anything that I would never come close to. Both of them were starving on the road, and started doing lessons so they could starve at home. I got over my desire to be a great guitar player and settled for being an "advanced beginner" and had a great career in the shoe biz. Now I'm retired very comfortably and play bass and acoustic guitar with my buddies in my home studio I bought with my shoe money. Lesson I learned was the that music business is like buying lottery tickets; only the lucky win. Unless you're lucky, playing music is for fun.
I hear ya.
Same for me. Good for you, enjoy your music.
For decades 5% of the recording acts support the entire industry. The only profit of tours is merch. Many musicians live off wedding gigs.
Al Bundy makes good 😅
Only the well connected win. Luck isn’t part of it.
Our society is running on fumes. Doesn't matter what you do, nothing is sustainable. Music is a free commodity to most people.
We have to live with these facts, and play the music that is in our hearts anyway. Good luck everyone.
Yes best to all!
We have given the keys to the castle to the speculators and to the greedy corporations and to the tech barons and they are sucking the life out of what used to be a good society. Musicians today are donating their services to billionaires.
@scrambaba I wouldn't put the blame so much on the billionaires. The Government and the mainstream media decide the winners and losers. The very wealthy are the ones that are well connected and make the most of their opportunity. We need to whittle the Government down to a size that doesn't drag the economy down. Also, labor wages are getting compressed because of technology and illegal aliens able to make less. It's never one thing!
It's only free until you need it to fill a bar.
@@alfsmith4936 'Aint that the truth Alf!!
UK based semi-pro drummer here. The economics of running small to medium sized venues is also an issue, the fees paid to acts has also declined and has become almost impossible to make a professional living doing it. (Exceptions obviously are the big acts who will power on regardless as the ticket prices will rise accordingly). Luckily I don't have to rely on it to make a living, but I know a few pro players and it can be hard even for them, so they go back to teaching and drum clinics etc. One said to me "The happiest drummers I know are the ones who don't do it professionally" Thanks for the honest post.
Thanks for letting me know what it’s like in the UK. I always wanted to play some shows over there. It so tough everywhere. Best to you and thank you.
GINGER BAKER!!!
Same here in Germoney, dude.
Used to play rhythm guitar in a pub group in the late 70's-early 80's
Often made more on the weekend than I did in my main job.
At the time providing a group at the weekend filled large pubs, an extra 2p on a pint would leave the landlord in profit. Beer was cheap no drink driving laws, people consumed more.
Then came the portable disco, doing for £50, what we were doing for £160.
@@andrewfrancis3591 Foreigner musician living in Germany since 2003. The music scene if you want to write and play your own material is DEAD. Everything is cover bands (99% with the same lame repertoire), pubs and small locations are out since the plandemie, and because the neighbors find them "too loud". Second point are the hobby musicians, who are mostly architects, doctors or good paid pros who play for free or 100 euros (most of them play very good to be true), but you can easily guess who will hire a pub for a night of live music. We are screwed.
During the California gold rush, many people became miners in search of fortune... The only ones that got rich sold the shovels.
Man you ain't lying...
Gibson and Fender 😂
That would be Trump's grandfather. He sold shovels to miners. 😅
@@thomasleblanc4228 Smart guy then,
We opened for Napalm Death at a small club in Columbus, OH almost 20 years ago. Barney (their vocalist) and I were sitting in a booth chatting while he was enjoying a sandwich. He said that the RV that they rented for this tour was $1000/wk. Gas was cheaper back then but was still a significant chunk of change. He told me that they were only averaging around $3k week for the entire band. I couldn't believe it. He said he owned a pizza joint back home (overseas) and he works there when not touring. It really opened my eyes at how tough the band life can be.
Wow! People don’t know until they find out.
Alrosa Villa?
@JohnDoe-xr5is Billiard Club (right up the street from the Villa). Mitch, who worked the door at the Villa sometimes, was friends with the guys in Napalm Death. He's the one who called me like 3 days before the show to ask if we'd open cuz we usually had a good crowd turnout. Even though the show was on a Tuesday, we agreed. Ended up being an ok gig.
Man that is cool!
And Napalm are legends! Wow!
You speak the truth man. I stop playing guitar to become a harmonica player, that way I can still play on stage and also be the bartender.
Now that’s a good one.
Great video. Should be an eye-opener for the young, starry-eyed musicians.
Thank you! 🙏
how bout it brad !!
Big fan of your channel. Thanks!
In my teens, my guitar teacher warned me to not pursue a career in music. He was a guitar maestro and was known all over my native town of Montreal, Canada. At the time, it was tough medicine. But now, I'm very grateful that he said what he did, as I see that people who play far better than I ever did are struggling to earn a living.
He wanted the best for you. Good guy.
I majored in music in an alternative program and taught be working professionals. The teaching was their side gig. They taught us the real ins and outs. The more I learned, the less that I wanted anything to do with the music business. I could have been behind the scenes but chose not to. My friends and classmates who "made it" ie support themselves via music almost exclusively had trust funds. Plus, there was a literal 20 year struggle prior to success. I did not have that inclination to be dirt poor for twenty years.But some did make it and are very well known.
So long as people like Live Nation are still sucking all the money out of the music industry, this will NEVER change.
The pay issue stems from the fact that there are too many guitarists in Nashville. There is too much “supply”, not enough “demand”.
All players are splitting the same $
And the irony is, there ain't much variety.
Yep, the law of Demand and Supply. The Q point gets lower when Demand is low and Supply is high. Unlimited players vying for limited venues.
Good advice. Respect. My Dad was a musician and he always lectured me that ‘ being a musician is the best SECOND job you can have’.
Sage advice!
The main problem is that nobody count on with the damn Internet that changed the rules of everything forever. And as long as the AI grows, the things will always worse.
@@SidAlienTV Yeah AI is going to cost alot of people their jobs in all industries.
@@badbrad And with overpopulation in the whole planet, it leads to a World War in search of resources, like it is beginning to happening right now (Ucraine, lithium in South America, land to cultivate in Africa, palm plantations in Asia etc)
Not since the early 2000s
the "economics of nashville just don't work"
Uncle Larry is one of the all-time greats in this town. Thank you sir.
They don’t work anywhere my friend. Sadly.
Unless you're Uncle Larry, or you got in early.
The economy in any decent sized town in the US is pretty screwed.
@@getenlightened your last comment is spot on
I was the touring bassist for the Motown group The Miracles for several years. We got $500 a show. All sold out shows. We played a lot of shows. In the 80s I’d be making $900 a day doing 3 studio sessions a day in LA. It’s not like that anymore. There’s just no money for sidemen or touring musicians in the music business anymore. Musicians need multiple income streams these days to survive. Lucky I still get calls to play basically every day but at 64 I have no interest in touring. Nowadays I work on projects for clients who hire me remotely to send them tracks from my home studio in Thailand where I live now. I was also an entertainment lawyer so made my money doing that later in life which afforded me options.
Wow very cool. Thanks so much for chiming in. That Motown stuff has so many killer bass lines so I know you can play the heck out of the bass. You’re absolutely right about the multiple income streams.
consider writing a memoir , you have a great story to tell
I’m retired in Thailand as well.
Left commercial sound reinforcement for IA695 Hollywood feature film work.
IA pension and SS, happy days.
I started in 1979 ABC Dunhill.
Now retired Hyperbaric Chamber Systems Engineer, Phuket.
I did music to age 35, then went into tech and made a good living, retired early age 57. Had I stayed in music, I would be in the poor house right now most likely... or gigging my butt off to make ends meet. I know so many musicians from my old days that stayed in the game, and still playing gigs that would bore the socks off me.
You made the right move.
@@badbrad No regrets. Had fun though while it lasted.
Howdy neighbor! I moved to nearby Old Hickory back in March after 12 years in NYC. As a multi-instrumentalist and composer, it's comforting to hear your perspective on the Nashville scene and making a living in Music City. I subbed to your channel probably a month ago after watching some of your amp sim pedal reviews. Keep the videos coming!
Nice to meet you! Welcome to Tn. There is a lot of good to be had here for sure but the reality is a bit sobering. Wish you much luck in your endeavors here. Thanks so much!
Sure hope you left the liberal woke idiology back in NY!!!
@@Goodboy0953 👍🏾
Howdy, just subscribed~!!! ty. I'm a truck driver from Canada, and used to do a lot of Nashville drops. Used to park my rig across the Opry, and hang out at the Music City Bar and Grill & catch a few shows. Got to know the owner... John IF I recall. Oak Ridge Boys, are my thing.
Use to love your city, so sorry that things are going south, as most of this world. Soon it will be only misery left.... tks for sharing with us.
Thank you for doing what you do and yes Music city bar and grill is a cool
Spot!
Young musicians need to hear this BEFORE they load up their vans and head to Nashville.
If nothing else - this video should allow them
to reset their expectations and better prepare (and budget) for the realities of the game. Nicely done! Thanks for sharing that
Thanks so much! Let’s hope they hear it.
I don't think it's even occuring to them... they're trolling facebook at their parents house. pick up an instrument? And PRACTICE? That's almost like having a job.
$300 bucks for a gig is simply not worth it. Truth is that bars, clubs, and venues pay the same money we made in the 70's and 80's. I'm glad I became an engineer and kept up guitar playing and singing as a side gig.
I hear you!
CMIIW, but I don’t thinks that is the situation the video is about. It’s about the ‘backing band’ supporting the big name. A bass player playing for whoever making $3-500/night. That is what the artist is paying them. It sounds like it’s a job for people with discipline. You could theoretically live on the road for free, eat with per diem, drink from the venue rider concessions contract at shows and pocket $40k+. I couldn’t because I am about that life, but some people could.
Exactly! I'm not a musician but I've been around many. I know those guys show up way early to setup and do sound check and they're there at 3AM packing it up! I used to see musicians at 10AM at a local diner looking like they were half dead already getting ready to get back on the bus to drive to the next gig. They couldn't have slept more than 5 hours or so.
The music industry is over. Honestly, I think for 99.9999% of us watching this video, our best option is to just go to church whether or not we make it in the band 😂. When the people who get played on the radio or play on stage in support of the artist on the radio, can’t make an honest living anymore… it’s time to shovel some dirt on this horse cuz it’s dead… even the artists who actually make some money usually get screwed out of it anyways… thanks for the insight and best of luck.
Sad but true.
Yup. I do church gigs as well. They pay better than any club, (but not why I do them...), 4-5 songs with a short rehearsal mid-week, and ampless. Plug in play, pray, go home.
@@edtaylor7816 I know alot of church players here....some it's their only gig.
Correct. As soon as fast internet connection became available for the public, the performing industry died right there.
@@paistefever You may be right...I may be crazy
99 percent of musicians work a day job five days a week and play mostly on Friday and Saturday nights. We're usually happy to make a hundred dollars a man, sometimes less, but a three hundred dollar night is really rare. When we open a show for someone the fee goes down. Only way to make good money opening a show for someone is if the promoter wants to rent your gear for the backline. We once made decent money providing the back line for an Edgar Winter show. When we make a CD we have to finance the thing ourselves and usually we only make enough money off of it to finance some of the next one. The music is usually better than the stuff that is coming out of Nashville though, so that's worth something. Most of us have spent some time playing six nights a week and living in a motel, when we were much younger. If you play for a living and don't have to work a day job it's your choice. My advise though, get a day job. Time flies. When time catches up with you, and it will, you will be sorry unless your mom and dad have provided for your old age. Btw, hardly noboby in any market buys a house if they make 30K a year.
I've worked day jobs in the past. Been there done that. Playing music is a full time job.
We sold shirts, caps, weed, took odd jobs from the stage in cities...whatever we could do to simply buy nice gear for a tour we had planned. We got the gear we needed piece by piece and it sounded crystal clear out front. We got a bus lined up, and were ready to start booking shows up toward Montana from Louisiana, up across the north, down the east coast to Florida and back through the South (we were crazy enough to pull it off)...then a bar burned to the ground after a Saturday show when they talked us into playing the next Wednesday.
The owner "accidentally" burned the place for insurance and took pictures of our gear as contents. We got nothing. We tried. That was the best microphones, drums, monitors, cymbals, mixer etc I`ve ever owned. James Burton sold a lot of it to me (by chance) and I was proud of it and he said the rust on a mic stand was from Elvis` sweaty hand. I finally quit playing as a singing drummer just to be able to avoid the next phone call and started fishing instead. Hey, it was fun for a long time and I learned a lot and met some cool folks. What an adventure!
@@baneverything5580 Wow man what a story! Love James Burton and Elvis. Best to you!
What's worked for me, assuming music is your ultimate goal/dream job - doing adjacent or complimentary work. This could be teaching lessons, repairing/flipping musical equipment, working at a music store, having a youtube channel, or even just working a part time job that has daytime hours as not to interfere with gigs on nights and weekends. I've dabbled in all of these and that's what it takes.
I played in a garage band once and we were nothing to brag about. We played a very small handful of gigs and I had made a comment to them that if I could make enough money to buy dinner and some gtr strings I would be happy. One of them came back with I don't want to turn this into a business. But when have have everything together when you get to the show by default it becomes a business. So if you don't want to deal with the business side stay at home and play in you garage you will be better off. Whatever you do don't be the one to play for beer you are being taken for a ride. With fuel being over five dollars a gallon in some places your lucky to make it there much less get back when it's all said and done. After my very short experience with it I just don't see how anyone could even remotely make living at it. Good luck to those who try your going to need it.
I decided not to be a professional guitar player when I was young because I didn't want my favorite thing to do, play guitar, become a job. Im glad I didn't for several reasons but number 1 I didn't want to lose that love that I still have for music.
I’ve lost it a few times and regained it. It is tough.
You Sound Like my SON👍!
I feel the same way. I'd like to set up a weekend local band for local gigs once and a while. But I'll keep my day job.
@@brostoevsky22 That is wise. But never lose the joy of making music.
you were smart
Wow. I have been pushing my 22 year old singer/guitarist niece to move to Nashville. She is making it in North Carolina by gigging and teaching but I know her rent is around 1k monthly. Watching this maybe she should just stay put.
At least think really hard…..
Moving here was the best decision I have ever made. She will have to do more than just play. She should learn how to mix so that she can do sound between playing. Have her learn to do lights too.
Hey Brad. Paul here from Jacksonville, Florida. This is actually the first video I saw of yours. I'm glad I found your channel! Thanks much for all you do, and welcome to Florida!
Much appreciated
I am not a musician, but I love music. I really appreciate this content. Some of it deeply saddens me, though. You all deserve more. Music is the marrow of life. Marrow providers should never be hungry. I’m glad you made out ok, Brad. And, I’m equally glad you’re telling the young up and comers what to expect and how going to Nashville is not what it used to be. Perhaps getting the word out about how terrible things have become may be the best way to turn it around. I hope so.
I hope so to. Thank you for tuning in it helps get the message out.
this is why I stopped playing the bass guitar in my early 20s. I could not see any consistent income and have a family. I had enough to be out on weekends. This is short term as a young musician to just have fun. I have now two bass guitars, I enjoy them once in a while in my free time, but not for living anymore. I love the sound of any music and the energy it comes from. It is addictive
Understandable. Best to you!
In Nashville, a bassist has to be a jack of all trades most of the time. You can’t be just a bass player, you also need to be pretty darn good at keyboard, rhythm guitar, singing BGV’s, and playing trumpet/harmonica/melotron/accordian, etc.
The bass player has to be a utility musician most of the time.
@@williamandmiriamflowe1705 It helps , all bassists should be able to do lead and backing vocals.
@@williamandmiriamflowe1705 +1 to that. Reason why I learned "functional keyboards (read Mellotron chords), in the 70s.
Played the Jersey Shore /Philly/NYC area in the 60's. Went back to college and worked as an engineer for a few decades. Got back into music in Atlantic City - I could make 400-500 a day busking on the Boardwalk in the early 2000's. Plus, I got a lot of free show tickets from the artists playing the casinos. great times.
Wow very cool...what an interesting life story.
I put music on the back burner in the late eighties, and started my own finish carpentry business. less than 2k was a bad week, home every night!
That is great, best to you!
At 25, I went back to school. Pro musicians, all better than me, were struggling. Thirty years later, I’ve got a home, a wife, a daughter and a career. Oh, I’ve got a local gig this weekend.
Glad to hear your still
Playing.
@@badbrad I’m bathing in my mediocracy.
@@darrylday30 Brother we all are.
@@badbradha! Thanks for that laugh, it made my morning. I’ll be stealing that line.
@@mrufino1 Great title for an album...
When playing music is about getting laid, musicians get paid...when it's about getting paid musicians are F#$%@'d. Music income is more related to branding, T-shirt and merch sales than music sales these days so the economics are bound to get wonky. Good stuff Brad!
Hilarious! Hurts but true. Thank you!
Today even get laid has become difficult. Between traps trans and "MeToos" we are acrobats.
Great insight on the reality of life in Nashville as a working musician.
I’ve been in town since 2015. I have a college degree from MTSU where I studied in the Recording Industry Management department. I have a bachelors of science in Commercial Songwriting.
For those unfamiliar, MTSU and Belmont are the universities that more or less feed into the entire Nashville music industry. After a couple years of job hopping post-graduation (wasn’t able to find a job with my degree because I worked through college, rather than being an unpaid intern - thus not having the “required experience” for industry jobs come time to enter the workforce), I went full time with music in 2022. The only reason it’s been a possibility is because of consistent Broadway gigs. Not ideal as someone who aspires to be a recording artist to be playing covers full time, but it feeds my family.
I’m a songwriter so my experience is different than the sidemen in town because I now make money through publishing, but even with a publishing deal I have to play cover gigs just to make enough money.
Luckily I married a local - my family of 4 is currently living at my mother-in-law’s house because rent is too expensive everywhere else in town. If it weren’t for that, I’d have to choose between going back to work full time or forcing my family into homelessness because I have this silly dream that I can’t stop chasing.
For shits and giggles - I played a standard 4 hour shift today on Broadway and I made $175 to sing my ass off and front a band on the hottest day of the year (nonetheless, Father’s Day), and get this: I was excited about making *that much*.
Would love to hear more about your experience. Awesome video.
Thank you! Wow $175 is decent but not if you had to pay today’s rent prices. I get some publishing mailbox money but not anything I can count on. Keep at it brother. Don’t give up and glad you got a roof over your head. Be nice to mother in law!
right on brother !!
>I have a bachelors of science in Commercial Songwriting.
LOL. 🙄
@@gingervytis nothing funny about it. There are a lot of songwriting success stories from MTSU and Belmont alike. Hardy has the same degree lol. You’ll know my songs soon, don’t worry
Very informative video for a consumer of music, not a performer. I’ve been in plenty of crowds that I feel embarrassed to be in for their attitude/behavior toward the performers. These bad apples should watch a few videos like this. Subscribed!
This x's 1000....you rock. Thank you!
Finally someone being honest about this stuff.
Somebody’s gotta be
Think I will keep my day job as a master toilet mechanic [plumber].
@@jamesrecknor6752 It's guaranteed work.
Brad I just discovered you videos and I'm an instant fan. Your observation are very measured and thoughtful. I'm an X-NYer (in Durham NC one year now) and have been playing and performing a very long time. I've had lots of great experiences and put out some records, but I could not put up with the bars and hassles. For the past 25 years I've worked exclusively with pre-schoolers, sharing music and dance with them. It is so rewarding and interesting, I'd much rather give the gift of music to these little ones, and I get to play and sing a few hours every day!I'm enjoying all your takes and insights. Carry on, brother.
Man that is super cool you are sharing the joy of music with the young. Kudos to you and thank you!
Bro I’ve been talking about this for a while. Thank you for your wisdom and transparency.
Thanks so much!
This is straight to the point advice of the reality of what it takes to make it in this town and music business.
🙏
I’m a singer songwriter I haven’t played any live gigs since the Pandemic ! From what I’m hearing there are hardly any paying gigs !? People are saying you’re better off playing on the street for tips !
Wow.
gotta get out there and see for yourself! Gigs are everywhere if youre playing what they want!
@@TonyToledo22 Get back out there bro!
street pays £12 an hour in uk
Boy oh boy, do I feel good about my life now. I toil away in obscurity 3 times a week, 300 per night, 15 minutes from home, play whatever I want, come home to my sweetie every night . Life’s good.
That’s great!
@richard - You don't get paid that kind of money when you "toil away in obscurity" and "play whatever you want" unless you, or a relative, owns the venue. ?
Nobody cares!
No you don't.
In 1980, my 5-piece band signed a $975,000 3 album front load deal with a major label. As a lead guitarist, I made $1,000 a week to practice, and $1,500 on the road, with a $50 per diem. None of our 3 albums were released, and we were sold to A & M before the third album. We were dropped in Redding, Ca. after opening for the Tubes. Being from Huntington Beach, we copped a ride home on PSA with the Tubes, since they were dropped by A & M also years earlier. I had 3-4 glorious years on the road, playing 275 nights a year opening for REO, Foghat, Derringer, Blackfoot, and many more…Our attorney told us we’d never get anything released, as we were a tax write-off for the label. (WB). Our checks had Looney Tunes cartoon characters on them! 😆😆 Times were different back then I guess, Brad…
Wow yeah quite different but what an amazing story!
High School bands, 4 years active duty Air Force and into my late 50’s playing in bar bands. It’s been a lot of fun, great nights and bad nights but the mantra for me was “ya gotta love it!” On some level it was selfish that I was doin it for me, no aspirations of being famous, grounded in the reality of it, I never considered giving up my day job. Early on I had the thought that on any Saturday night all across the country there were bands playin right then and I took some pride in being part of that. The pleasure of those nights when all the equipment is right, the bands feelin good and the crowd likes what your doing is pretty awesome and making that happen regularly is work. Over the years there were a few times we were approached by someone offering studio time or a few dates out of state but we never picked up on any of that. It was a professional hobby and I wouldn’t trade the experiences for anything. Just last night I looked at my wife and said “I’m ready for bed”, she smiled and said “it’s 8:30, ya know, just five years ago I’d be puttin on makeup” lol, I guess we both kinda miss it but dang, I turn 63 this year, I don’t wanna stay up till 2am.
Apologies for rambling, I have a lot of respect for the pros, determined, hard working folks that also get a bit of luck but I know there are great performers entertaining the crowd all across the country in almost every little town every weekend and the odds of making a good living and having a family doing it are slim at best but Ah,,,The Dream!
Man what a great comment. Some nights I'm in bed now by 8pm. Use to go to bed at 8am. I feel your words brother. Thank you.
@@badbrad- thanks for the video! Some harsh truth. All the practice, equipment, set-ups and tear downs, travel, late nights and skipping other things you might want to do are all hard work and are worth something but the income side just isn’t there for the common band even if they are really good. Butts in the seats, drinks, and maybe food income minus the building lease, electric bill, supplies, servers, insurance…. And oh yea, a little something for the band, how’s $1,300 and a bar tab sound for two nights? Best I can do (and we played for a lot less plenty of times). Five band members, $260 each for two nights, we usually chipped in $20-30 each to give to a couple buddies who helped unload and set up. $240 for roughly 10hrs work. Not terrible but that’s it for the week, 10 hours. Not a living really, gonna need that day job 🫤. The rest of the story is the rush of doin it, it’s amazing when vocals blend just right or you nail that guitar lick you’ve been practicing, the whole band movin through time in perfect sync, everybody getting their part perfect all at the same click in time. Sometime you could feel the crowd just kinda stop what they were doin and ride along for a minute or two. I’m sure you understand but it’s hard to describe and to me that was the real pay back for the time spent to get it right.
@@rustyaxelrod Yes those nights when everything clicks. Makes it all worthwhile.
Respect...you are the REAL deal!
Your channel somehow found me this morning with this video. In the late-70's a friend moved from our small town in Ohio to Nashville to be a song writer. Fame actually brushed his elbow in the 80's. He continued to write, branching into producing and promoting. Anyway, after my divorce 20 years ago he said he had all kinds of session work for a deep bass singer such as myself and asked me to move down. I told him it sounded like fun but I would still need to drive a truck around Nashville during the day to support that hobby.😄
Probably right!
@@badbrad You may have heard of the late Dan Mitchell.
Unfortunately this is the sad reality of post Covid economics. I retired seven years ago. When I stopped working I could live, albeit very modestly, on my retirement income. Since Covid, grocery prices have doubled in my area and rental prices have quadrupled. As far as buying a house, there is nothing livable under $450k. A tiny wood frame house across the street from me just listed at $550k. The 94 yo woman who lived in it had been there since the 50s and had done zero upgrades since moving in. It is almost inevitable that I will have to rejoin the workforce.
Wow!
Yup. One bedroom apartments here in SoCal run about 3K a month. Nuts...
@@edtaylor7816 that is nuts!
The economy wasn't that good pre-Covid either. Strange how people forget that.
@@edtaylor7816 The goal of capitalism is to reduce all human interactionf to the cash nexus. Big conglomerates own all the apts. COW= concentrations of wealth
Great stuff. I mostly quit the live/touring/gig 25 years ago for teaching music at university, studio sessions, writing, and producing. I can comfortable make $100,000 plus per year, live in a great home, have great gear and enjoy a good family lifestyle.
Man I hear you there!!!
I really enjoyed listening to you on this Vid. All the best to you BB !
Thank you!🙏
Thanks for this amazing reality check and doing the math.
Any time!
I’ve been playing professionally since the mid 90s - I remember when I started, the older cats said they were making the same money then that they were making in the 1970s. How do you make a living or I dare say, get ahead as a working artist when the average person believes that what you do should be free by definition? Gigs paid better when I was a kid starting out than they do nowadays. I feel Ike I was among the last generation of working musicians that could actually make a living playing an instrument. A real drag.
It is. Some do better than others, we all work way harder than we are compensated ...that is for sure. Kids here make way more than we did when I first got to town, so there's that.
That video you ran on your intro is Jamboree In The Hills. That show started in 1977 and at that time it was biggest country music festival in the country. I worked at every one of those events. I managed that stage for about 25 years.
Yes that was an incredible day for me. Just an amazing experience.
If musicians and techs keep signing on for low day rates, they will never change. And travel days should always be paid, as well as per diem
I don’t think travel days will ever be paid. $35 per diem.
there are always people who are willing to do things for less money, which is a problem for everyone trying to make a living at this...
That's what I told the bands I worked with. They call you, say it's $250 a day, then while on the road they say yeah $250 per show. 😮
Thinking this might be my future soon.Great info thanks!
No problem.
You seem like a cool down to earth dude. Glad I found your channel. Love your stories.
Thanks and welcome
Very interesting video. Thanks. I'm glad I enjoy playing the guitar and other instruments for the pleasure of it and not have to depend it on it for a living, especially aged 67! Good luck
Thank you Peter. It's a tough business for sure. I appreciate it.
Great video. It's hard for sure man. I'm 31 and got here six years ago. Came to town recording for the first two years (mostly online) then an occasional bus gig. Bought my first house in 2020 (out towards Dickson) with overdub money. Then went on the road for two years and got away from it for all the reasons you mentioned. Now rent that house out and moved into Nashville which was a major investment in 2023 and not easy to make happen. No recording full-time at the house with some tracking sessions mixed in a few times a week. The price of Nashville definitely stacks the cards against cats that are trying to make a living on the road.
I think it's crazy hard but doable for the cats with the skills, organization, and personality...definitely takes all three.
It's tough for sure but sounds like you got a good head on your shoulders. Best to you bro!
I think at 31 I was still playing in a very dead Nashville doing $50 dollar gigs during the week and $100 on the weekends.
@@badbradfiguring it out as we go. Love the channel man.
Thanks bro and subscribed to you as well!
@@NickyV No bout a doubt it my friend. It takes having all 3 of those traits & then some. Another big thing every musician needs who really want to be successful in the music industry is a relentless mindset with a never ending work ethic striving to make it. Even when a musician has everything it takes on their resume to make a career in music. It still takes a lot of luck to set you apart from the rest to be in the click with the big boys & girls. Just keeping it a buck here ya dig? 🤔🧐 So giddy up, you're on the clock. Tick-Tock! ++Peace & Rock n' Roll 4 Your Soul My Friend++ 🤘😜🤘
I seriously considered a career in music in the mid 1980s. Friends of mine in national touring bands were going through the same things then, though the economics were less at that time. I realized that the decision to do music was either for the pure love of music or for a shot at stardom, which was one in a million. The math simply didn’t add up do I pursued a career in banking with a credit union and now I pull in a great income, have a nice home and a wonderful wife. Now I know people in Nashville just scraping out a living with no insurance, no retirement and their family and relationships are in the past and broken. Their children are estranged and their health is poor and they live a life of regret. While I have admired their choices and secretly wish I was doing what they do, I’m incredibly grateful that I had the foresight to look at the choices without stars in my eyes. I have really nice gear and play out locally when I want to with people I enjoy. No regrets.
I hear you brother and I feel what you're saying. It's been tough but I have my family and the love of my kid, so I am wealthy beyond what I ever thought I would be. I'm glad you're still playing! Best to you.
How could I NOT subscribe when so much truth is being spoken?
Nice one dude
Thank you!🙏
You are telling the truth brother! I've been in the music industry now 40 years. I was an artist through the 80s up to 1997. I got to Nashville by doing an audition for Opryland USA in 1990.
When TNN Network was over and the Park closed, I decided to start a recording studio.
Playing downtown I've been there done that not for me anymore.
I built a studio and that was the best thing I ever did. To this day that has help me survive the crazy Nashville dream.
I tell a lot of young writers/ Artist if you come to town you'll have to get a second job other than playing music. That's a fact!
I bought my house in North Nashville 20 years ago on 4 acres. My house if I had to buy it today would over 400,000 today!
Great video everything you've said is the hard truth.
I bought my house 20 years ago on 3 acres in North Nashville.
If I had to buy it today I couldn't afford it @ 400,000 today!
Thanks for the cold hard truth about living & working in Nashville.
Thank you for dropping in. It’s so good to hear from so many like minded souls. I think your underestimating your property value 4 acres and a house would probably get you much more.
I left Nashville for THIS reason. Moved back to Colorado and started playing corporate/wedding gigs. Colorado is extremely expensive, but the wedding work was $450-$1200 a show averaging $600. I did that for 8 years. But, still no health insurance and my wife and I struggled. I was never home on the weekend and she still had to work weekdays. Additionally, that gig beat me up physically, every gig was 4 hours of dance music, 2-3 hours of jazz standards and typically an hour of solo guitar for the cocktail hour. Plus often to save money there were no accommodations, we’d finish at 1am and drive home sometime 3 hours thru mountain passes all in your own car. Talk about wear and tear.
I found my happy place now playing in an original band in the red dirt scene. I’ve switched to pedal steel for three reasons. One, it’s a blast and I love the texture. 2: I get to sit down saving my back and legs, 3: it’s not an essential instrument. If I can’t make a gig, the band can still play without me. Obviously this is a rare gig and the guys in the band are the coolest dudes I’ve ever worked with to allow me that kind of flexibility. That gig doesn’t pay, we do make money but it all goes back into the pot for studio time and travel expenses. Everyone has a day job.
Brother your message resonates with me big time. Through all the bumps in the road in this business it has been the Wedding and Corporate work that has literally kept me alive. It's only more recently the pay for that has increased. That is a booming business now and younger bands are taking alot of the bookings as their is money to be made. I just did a 4 hour straight this Saturday in a venue with no AC. 1-2 hours of Jazz then cranking out the Dance tunes. It does beat you up.
Yup. Corporate/wedding gigs here still pay the best, $4500-$6000 for the band. Serious work as you need to have a very large catalogue at your fingertips...
@@edtaylor7816 That's good bread for sure. I like playing those gigs, it's a joyous occasion and everybody has a good time.
great post, TX musicians don't have the club scene that once existed, hard to even find a place to play
Yep pedal steel player here....I'm the only steel player in the Virgin Islands so I get called out fairly regularly...standard 3 hr gig here pays $150..certainly not in it for the money..I had to laugh at the sitting down part of your post!
I’m not a professional musician but I thoroughly enjoyed your insight. My wife and I had a small restaurant (1998-2002) where we did a few small Jazz festivals and booked in Jazz musicians on the weekends so I am somewhat familiar with the fact that making a living as a musician can be very difficult. Much respect to you! Cheers from California 🍻Subscribed
Hey thank you for providing a venue to create art! You are a blessing. Cheers to you. I appreciate it.
@@badbradthose were some golden days for my wife and I! We were able to have professional musicians perform and also gave many musicians at the University of Wisconsin, Eau Claire a venue to hone their craft in their early days. Thanks for your time and have a great weekend Brother!
@@dfromcool Thank you so much!
this is a great post the real deal, wealth inequality in the USA the greatest it has been in over 100 years, thank you for honesty
Thank you!
Great channel and video! A friend of mine turned me onto Colt Ford's "There ain't no trash in my trailer..." Funny tune. My dad was a classical musician. He was full-time in a medium market orchestra plus a full-time (in terms of pay/benefits) music college professor. He had to do both jobs to allow our family of four a middle-class life. He also would teach privately on occasion.
Back in the 1980s he encouraged my brother and I to go into business or anything but music. The business has been declining forever. Back in the 1940s you had bands everywhere. The advent of recorded music put an end to a lot of that. Wedding bands disappeared in the late-1980s/90s with all of the DJs. It's just spiraled down from there. I was lost as someone who was musical but started too late. Became a fishing guide and have been full-time now for 20 years. I play guitar everyday. Doing fishing professionally made me lose some zest for it - I can see how it happens in music. I know I won't lose my love of music as an amateur.
I salute you!
I enjoyed watching this and hearing your stories from the road. Sad that actual talented musicians are paid so little playing for big acts. As a lousy drummer for a service club act (VFW etc) in the 1980's I made $100 - $150 a gig. They almost always threw in free hamburgers and fries too.
Man that’s pretty good dough and free food! My experience in the late eighties and early nineties playing the big name clubs. Sometimes we got two pizzas and some beer and no $$.
I was the lead singer in a band. We were pretty good (pretty good ain’t perfect) we were invited to be on a Dick Clark TV show back in 1969.
Long story short we broke up before we were scheduled to fly to California and appear.
Lots of people often said over the years that I should’ve stuck with it. (They were sure I was destined to make it!)
I wasn’t that interested in show business because my gut told me it wasn’t a good life.
I instead used my natural talent and became a salesman, manager, director etc in a long successful career that allowed me to perform in a manner that was much more valuable to society, my family and myself.
I never regretted my decision to take a different path and the more I hear, read and see, the more I’m sure I was right!
For every Taylor Swift, Elvis, George Strait, etc there are 10 million stranded, lonely, depressed wannabes or never beens out there!
No thanks!
I hear ya brother. Still would have been cool if you guys had done Dick Clark show. Imagine how cool when RUclips showed up and you see yourself and your old buddies on that show.
I’m glad you’re having a good life. Do you know many things go into having the amount of ambition It takes to succeed in the music business. If you have no regrets, you’re doing fine. When someone needs it so much I want it so much the adulation are they really want to be famous… I don’t know… I suppose some will make it. There are more important things than being famous. I mean it would be nice. I think to be able to just be famous enough to make a living. I think that was possible or more possible up until till… I’m not sure when, Maybe 20 years ago. When you could be in a band that travels around kind of a regional circuit and actually have people show up for gigs and stuff anyway, it’s kind of cool that you got as far as you did. It would’ve been cool to do the Dick Clark show.
That was the true heyday ! You wish you would have tried ! Come on 😂
I am 70, played private parties and clubs for years. Glad it over for me.
It’s not easy. That’s what I’m doing these days and it keeps me off the road.
This should be taught in music schools as requirement. Reality is also important for artists
Absolutely
spot on. Myself I was lucky... I was able to work as a full time musician from 17 to now... 65. It was tough sometimes, but end up fine. I was able to support my family and raise my children. Nowadays it will be even tougher. I played a couple of times in the Nashville area in 1993 in some small venues. Most difficult times for me was when I had a band and had to split gig money for 3-4 folks.. But most of my life I worked just alone and I guess it was more beneficial that way. Nowadays I can't really play as before because my right hand fingers stop working on the guitar, though I still do a lot of recording - it is just by 2 fingers :) which is not sufficient to play a gig alone anymore really. Good luck with Nashville gigs - completely out of my reach now - and life there is too expensive, too much of the trouble for me :)
Brother I commend you on your hard work and raising a family. Best to you.
So glad I found this video and your channel! Finally someone that has lived and felt my pain as a pro musician! Everything in your video is correct and similar to the scene in Toronto Canada. Except average shitty little 1 bedroom apt is $2500 average a month. Look forward to watching more of your videos and you’ve inspired me to do some videos on my channel on the Toronto scene which I’m very familiar with!
I'm glad I could inspire you and I welcome you to my channel. Always loved playing in Canada. Great people in that country. Best to you and keep hitting those skins.
@@badbrad I’ll keep hitting them! Trying to grow my channel as another viable income stream! as you know to make a living as a musician you need many streams coming in!
@@drumteacher43 Absolutely and best of luck to you!
First let me say that I really enjoyed this video; it is eye opening. I always thought that touring musicians made very good money. I played guitar at my church for a lot of years, none of the musicians got paid. But, I just enjoyed being able to play every Sunday with a great group of musicians. Thanks again for posting this video.
🙏
Excellent episode Brad... dishing out a raw slice of T. The music industry is exploitive, preying on the dreams of young folks with stars in their eyes; maybe you can get by in your 20s sleeping on a couch without health insurance, but what does it look like for guys in their 40s, 50s, and beyond? Not a sustainable lifestyle to say nothing of the high probability of alcoholism or other substance abuse issues. Thanks for keeping it real!
Man you hit the nail on the head with that one. That was me beating up the road at 40 with no health insurance and surrounded by alcohol. I got out alive and I am very thankful for that. In a much better place now and I don’t miss the road one bit. Thanks so much for chiming in and keeping it real.
Yes - there are plenty of people making money on the corporate side of things. Musicians are always exploited.
@@alfgwahigain5544 It's a tough business.
I was thinking about health insurance also. Go bankrupt if you get sick
@@CHOCKO895 Was lucky to not have any issues.
We made a lot more money in 1987 then they’re paying now. The advent of DJs ruined it for musicians.
Very true!
The music industry sadly lost it`s "shine" when humans stopped going to a store to buy a physical piece of plastic that had music on it once you put it on a music player of sorts. The good ol days as they say, the money was there because of records, tapes, cds selling and selling. After th year 2000 so many things changed for the worst in music in my humble opinion...cheers
Bingo
I met a trumpet player in 1987 who said “Elvis and the electric guitar killed it for horn players. What Elvis didn’t kill The Beatles finished off.”
@@jody8526937 I can see that. There are a lot of musical rabbit holes that I have gone down lately where I have learned something new. There seems to be a lot of things done by design.
I've liked and subbed to help your YT income kick in. Your knowledge is now your commodity brother!
Man I thank you 🙏. The journey continues.
Thanks Buddy! So well spoken/delivered. Word Brother. 🙏
Thank you so much!
The reality is pay rates are determined by supply and demand. As long as qualified musicians are willing to take gigs at that rate, the rate will be the normal. If they can't find a willing musician at $300-500, they will pay more and raise ticket prices or not tour. Sadly the live music scene at local clubs died in the early 2000s. Used to play clubs in the middle of nowhere in Maine in the late 90's and get $300 plus the $5 a person at the door. We'd load in Thursday afternoon, play Thursday, Friday and Saturday at the same club, then load out Saturday night or early Sunday. Then host a Sunday Jam night at our local club. We'd pull $4k in 3 days for us plus $500 for the jam night (no door) which we donated to the bank to pay for the truck, gas and new pa and lighting equipment. $4000 divided by 4 people was good money for a part time job in the late 90's. Could never make it on that today. Even back then we all had day jobs at Daddy's Junky Music or Guitar Center.
Man I loved Daddy's Junky Music spent a Summer at Berklee.... That was great dough back in the day. Man you guys were doing good.
@@badbrad It was, especially with low cost of living in Maine. Played clubs in Maine, NH and Mass. had an original band that played in Boston a good bit but we would make $150 for the set to dive 4 ways, lol.
@@DiscoVette81 Now that's rough!
I’m am/was a gigging solo musician. …nowhere near the caliber of musician as you..Here in my town people expect me to play four hour gigs for $150. On top of that they expect me to know just about every genre of music. Omg a four hour gig with drive time is an eight hour day including setup/teardown time. Then they get mad when I don’t know any Taylor Swift or children’s music for their five year old snot
Nosed brat.
Yeah that is tough brother.
I moved to Nashville in 2017, my 1br Apt was $800/month. It’s around $1100 now. I moved w the intention of having fun as opposed to getting financial success. Mission accomplished
That’s the right attitude.
In 1969, right after high school graduation in Upper East Tennessee at age 18, I completely lost the ability to play my bass guitar due to auto accident injuries, after playing in a band for over 4 years. We started in grammar school. I have been stressed for 50+ years over it, but I went and graduated from college and law school and have been a practicing attorney for over 40 years with a good income. Your video was a very good assessment of what I avoided long ago. Thank you.
I think this is really good advice. There is a harsh reality to music. Most people want to gloss over the negatives because it’s no fun to think about the those things when you’re in dream mode.
Thank you! 🙏
On my first road trip, I ate nothing but oatmeal and blueberry yogurt for about a month. Then I figured out that I needed food more than Jack Daniel's.
Man.....
Lessons learned. @@badbrad
I see I'm not the only one who noticed this. Only way to play music is to have a good job, and play music on the weekends
Your not wrong.
Exactly Keeps it Fun !
"And Harry doesn't mind if he doesn't make the scene. He's got a daytime job - he's doing alright. He can play the honk-tonk like anything, saving it up for Friday night." {Mark Knopfler}.
@@andymcnish Yep!!!!
Yup, I did nothing but music for 3 years. You have to love it. Now I use my art talent to make a living, and music to make fun:)
Whatever works right! Best to you
Faring better than did Rembrandt, Van Gough, and Adolph; but not Hunter.
@@davidcouch6514 LOL
I was playing in a cover band in the 80s-90s to 2012, 5 - 6 nights a week. I bought a house in a fairly good neighbour hood in Sydney , Australia paid $126 thousand in 92, now its worth 2.1 million (insaine). I got out of the music business at the right time. a musician would be lucky to play 2 night a week today.
Wow bro! Glad you made out ok 👍🏻
@@badbrad no normal wage earner here in Australia will ever qualify to buy a house ..let alone rent one ..now ordinary houses are 1 million plus ..
Australia is stuffed .
@@leighsayers2628 I am so sorry to hear that. I've been really watching what is happening down there and it not good. I hope the people can bring some change.
@@badbrad watch battle ground Melbourne ..you will see what they did to us ..
Cool stuff Brad. 1st video I saw was about when you 1st got to Hollywood. Then caught a bit of a live from Tampa. I'm still in awe of GIT grads!
Thanks so much Rob!!!
When I toured, it was my second job. A pal whom I worked with at my primary job tagged along once on weekend run and said doing both was insane and wondered how I was pulling it all off. Youthfulness helped. I was making a bit more than the road crew per gig. Was fun sometimes, but financially ridiculous.
Financially ridiculous......love that.
One of the many reasons Nashville is soon to be a ghost town. When no service industry people, not just musicians, from servers to retail workers can afford to live in a city, those businesses go away and the business owners go Brooke and the town/City dies
I don't know how they will survive that is for sure.
Pure Greed.
On the other hand, it won't die. As if that was the logic San Fran, Seattle, L.A., NYC would be dead. I lived in all but L.A. and it was seemingly impossible to survive. Being poor was normal, yet somehow folks still live in these places.
@@RockAndDoubleBassWithAaronJoy and each city you mentioned went through just what I described for a time until corrected. It won't due but it will become comatose for a time
It’s like being a writer, poet, painter, journalist, historian, archeologist. You need to have outside/family income to even pursue those type fields, or a patronage like the ancient musicians had from Kings.
That would help.
don´t you think the advancement of technology is/has killed the artistry of wanting to be an artist as you mention on your comment?
I've played guitar through my teens. I never thought it was a good idea to be a musician. Not a smart move. A guitar buddy of mine did go on the road. After two years he came home. I love music but i will not sacrifice my living for it. Good video from Sacramento
Thank you. 🙏
Just discovered your channel , I live south of Nashville in Columbia, used to love going downtown for live music , now the crowds of tourist and parking problems hve made it a total nightmare, rarely go to live concerts at Bridgestone or The Ryman because honestly the ticket prices are too much after including parking. Im going to go back and check out all your videos, best of luck enjoy Florida.
Thanks so much. I feel the same way. Ticket prices for the same show in other city’s are much cheaper. Downtown is a cluster!
honestly good memoirs and advice/observations on the industry. Good content badbrad!
Thank you! Much appreciated.
I’ve been in Nashville for 27 years, back then John Michael Montgomery was paying $400 per gig in season, and $600 per week off season … Nashville has never been place to make money gigin , it was always a recording and publishing where the money was , for corporations of course , not musicians….as for touring , like Merle Haggard once said , it is a “glamorized bus driving “
Ha ha yes glamorized bus riding and driving
me n my brother been in the music business since 1978, playing gigs, never could make a living, we worked construction during the week, giged on fri n sat, now were retired, still playing, but still not much money, you gota love it to stick with it
Yes you do.
I quit being a full time musician at age 22. Went back to school and paid my way through 3 degrees with a job AND playing weekends (and some private parties and teaching) locally. That was in the 80s/90s.
The guys I played with are all still out there. I don’t know how they stuck with it.
The music business made me miserable. Playing was always joy. But, the business was mostly misery for me.
I’m happier in bed watching RUclips videos about the music business, than I would ever be in the music business.
I have a million great memories of the road. But, I never regretted getting out.
Man I hear you!!!
Wow! I left music when I was 30. Never got out of the clubs but it was a decent run. Post music, I got super lucky and found my destiny. I wish the same for you and everyone else out there.
Thank you!🙏
Some good an real info in here! Thanks man enjoyed it!
Fan of your channel. Enjoy watching your journey. Thanks so much! Best of luck to you.
Have a friend who makes a living playing covers in bands, solo, duos, and a Beatles/classic rock tribute. Basically, the whole spectrum outside of touring. He is fortunate that he is married to woman with a well paying corporate job with the steady paycheck and benefits.
Sadly, it seems that’s what it takes to survive in the business as you get older.
Man that is so true.
Same here. I work giving tuition (guitar and bass) since 2008 in Germany. The things after the lockdown went down and down, many musicians came into the teaching area (most of them are good players but don´t have not a clue how to teach), the music schools hire personal on independent basis: You must pay your medical insurance and retirement from your own wallet. To raise 2.000 euros monthly you must take 4 music schools, driving each day to a different city, and with 50 - 60 uninterested students pro week the risk of ending with a burnout is knocking your door. My wife had a good salary, but it´s frustrating anyway.
@@SidAlienTV Man that is rough. Teaching requires alot of patience. Some players have none lol.
@@badbrad I gave lessons in Argentina, Italy, Austria and Germany. In three different languages, and with three different notation systems (in the end everyone stays with tablature 😁 ). It´s simply brain draining, but I started in 1995 more or less and 100% pro since 2008. But I hate when new students come to me telling me that they had lessons with another teacher for 4 or 5 years and they still cannot put the hands properly on the instruments....... "What for a swindler gave you lessons, dude?" I think. And the worst nightmare is giving online lessons.
@@SidAlienTV Wow! I've wondered how the online lesson thing works.
Here’s a question for these struggling musicians in Nashville:
If you’re faced with a serious health issue, or perhaps dental work or major car repairs or housing HOW THE HELL DO YOU GUYS MANAGE?
I’m sorry but I’d rather have a good paying day job and plenty of money in the bank knowing that when (for example) my water heater takes a dump I can easily pay for a new one in full installed, or perhaps a new heat pump. Living on a few hundred bucks here and there is toooooo stressful. Which is why most players are single with no wife perhaps and definitely no kids.
It ain't for the faint of heart for sure.
@muzikman74 Their girlfriends keep them up! 😉😂
I recently saw Luke Combs play a sold-out stadium. To think his band is making $300 each sickens me. Spread the wealth.
I don’t know what Luke pays could be different
A friend of mine is in his band. They do not make $300 a show lol. It varies from artist to artist, but, if you’re playing for arena headlining and above that: stadium headlining artists, you’re making pretty fantastic money in most cases. As you should! The issue is that if you’re not in either of those two categories, you’re getting absolutely crushed with destitution. I guess it’s “are you willing to fight it out until you get a chance to be in those bands?” Also, I have several friends in the pop world in LA. The pop music world pays substantially more than the country world. It’s interesting
Hey Brad really enjoying the videos man. I am a Nashville native actually Hendersonville funny enough. Been a musician all my life. I almost went down your path but ended up becoming disillusioned about the dream of becoming a professional musician here in Nashville. I played in all kinds of bands and in all sorts of environments and figured out by the time i was in my late 20's that this town does not care one lick about musicians. Your stories have only made me more glad i did not go all in on my dream. I Still play music but for me and me alone. If i did get into another band it would be for pure fun. Keep up the stories man really good that your spreading the truth and honesty of this town.
Thank you so much. I will keep going!
My sons band is on the road( tour) for second time this year, playing 6 nights a week for the month, 4 piece, make 125-150$ each a gig, bus broke down in upstate New York two days ago, and stranded them, they still have the rest of the gig dates to fill this month, it’s a heat wave on the east coast, they started a go fund me and got over 5k, first day, enough to get finished and get ready to go back out in July for 20 days on a festival tour across Midwest. Ahhhh, to be young, bottom line, you got to love it, it’s a passion not a job, Blessup
Yes so true!
Music died in the late 90’s. The engineered this!!! No more monsters of rock tours no more Superbands only soft porn bands (For the Most Part playing engineered songs and lyrics) to keep everyone in line!!!! So glad I grew up in the mid 80’s, And lived to tell the tale!!!!
I hear you loud and clear.
I sense an awakening.
@@readmore4178 One can only hope.
Great video. Very informative.👍
Thank you!
I remember going out to bar shows in the 90s to see rock bands and being shocked by how little they had. Bands that who i thought were already rich celebrities. I saw the band Korn in a bar, to me they were on MTV and all the cool kids at my school liked them so obviously they were rich. I watched the show then waited after to see if i could meet them and the guitarist immediately started asking me for cigarettes lol. Later they got even more famous and popular, hopefully they saw some good money.
I think Korn did ok. I worked security in the pit at an Ozzy show and Korn was the opener. This was the beginning of their career. At that point in time the Nashville audience was not that accepting of their hybrid sound. But they worked hard and broke through.
Figured out early on that I was unwilling to make the sacrifices necessary to become a professional musician. Went into Tech in the early 80s and did that for 40 years.
Now I'm retired and practicing many hours a day, holed up in a home studio, and occasionally playing jazz gigs for fun.
Respect to this channel owner and others with the talent and drive necessary to become professional musicians!
Thank you and much respect to you as well. Glad to hear you have come back to your music and hope you enjoy that journey for many years to come.
@@badbrad … I was a formal classical and jazz guitar student for roughly half my tech career and even had a small basement studio in a prior home. That to say that I didn’t let it go completely, but my musical growth was a snail’s pace due to the intensity of a high-level tech career.
@@bbowjazz Man I hear ya there but now your set and can play all day and that is an awesome thing.
Merch and taxes have never been cheaper.
The problem is the promoters. They have no competition and can take what they want.
That can be a problem.