Killed by very friendly fire - WWII ID tags found in Egyptian desert reveal their tragic secrets
HTML-код
- Опубликовано: 3 окт 2024
- Two World War II identification tags recovered in the Egyptian desert and belonging to soldiers that were killed in action are researched, revealing their secrets and leading to the discovery of how both of their owners died during the war.
One was killed by an accidental discharge while the other died during the sinking of the Laconia.
The video explains how Italian WWII era identification tags can be researched without much difficulty, and shows numerous World War II examples of friendly fire or accidental deaths.
battlefieldarc...
findthemia.blog...
researchww2.blo...
I am trying to contact the family of the following soldier, if you are his relative, please send me an email:
-Johannes Neubert 22.6.1922 Dresden + 1.9.1942
Soto Tenente Chiarello Francesco, 26.2.1906 Salerno
A Crocodile Tear Productions documentary
How to research World War II Italian identification tags - El Alamein - Egypt - Divisione Trento - 1942 - 1941 - 1943 - Afrika Korps - Laconia incident - Laconia sinking - U Boat - U boot - identification disks - dog tags - piastrina - Western Desert - Desert Rats - Bersaglieri - 46° Reggimento Artiglieria Trento - 7° Reggimento Bersaglieri - Alexandria - Desert War - Genealogy research - Ancestry - Battle of the Atlantic - Battle of El Alamein - Lybia - Bir Hacheim - Tobruk - Ruweisat - Tel El Eisa - Suez Canal - Field Marshal Erwin Rommel - Fort Capuzzo - In the Blue - The wire - DAK - Deutsches Afrika Korps - friendly fire statistics - accidental death - caduti di guerra - One Common Ennemy - submarine - missing in action - killed in action - KIA - MIA - disperso - U-156 - Korvettenkapitän Werner Hartenstein - 12 September 1942 - RMS Laconia - accidental discharge - weapon safety - triton null - metal detecting - détection - militaria collecting - collection - Cairo - Quattara depression - Manco la fortuna non il valore - A Seemingly Ordinary Man: An Account of the Sinking of the Laconia in World War Two - Ruolo Matricolare - British 8th Army - Bernard Montgomery - torpedo - U-506 - Gloire - mysterious - secret story -
It’s amazing the stories you have dug up and showed to the world. These men were doomed to be forgotten by history but you just happened to find their tags and bring their lives to light. And not only them, but going through your channel and the respect you give to every soldier no matter their nation or rank, sharing their stories, it’s nice to hear Germans and Italians talked about like they’re humans and not glossing over American faults like most people do. God bless you for the forgotten men you have shown the world
I can assure you no one glosses over Americas fault. It’s shoved in our face daily. Regardless I agree with everything else you said!
I totally agree. x
Thank you for honoring all soldiers, sailors and airmen who served every Nation.
Thank you for understanding me.
Not 4 germans n their allies🖕🏻
Except Nazi pigs.
As an italian i have to thank you for the kindness and pity you used to tell this story about italian soldiers.
I did not know neither the technical details of italian tags back then nor the horrifying odissey of Laconia.
Many italians died in Africa fighting with bravery and honor but (as opposite of the epigraph you showed) they did not need more luck, they simply were on the wrong side of history.
The last detail (in my awful english): i served in the army in 1983 and they gave us 'normal' tags back then, meaning two separable metal pieces.
One more very last thing: in my expierence in the army (with 'fake' ammunutions assaults) the chaos, the noise, the fatigue is so high that i'm sure that in real fightings the rate of friendly fire casualties is way much higher tan 15 or 20%.
You may not know but many Italian prisoners of war were taken from North Africa and kept by the Australians, in Australia. There, they were allowed out on day release and they worked on local farms. There are many stories of the Italians being loved and appreciated by the local communities, where their joi de vivre was a breath of fresh air. I read of many having relationships with local women and of farmers that were in tears when the time came for the men to be repatriated. I think many of the POWs also wanted to stay when the war was over. These many stories of how popular the Italians were and how much licence they had (they could come and go from the POW camps without/with minimal supervision), are in stark contrast to the German and especially the Japanese POWs. The Germans were quite surly and many were hardened racists. The Japanese were deeply shamed by having been captured and in one famous incident, at Cowra, they escaped en mass as an act of communal suicide. Most of the men guarding the POWs were older men or those unfit to serve and as they never left Australia, they were typical laid back Australians with easy going mentality, probably this is why the Italians were so popular.
Another anecdote I can share relates to a psychiatric hospital. I used to work with the records and during the war I saw many Italian POWs claiming to hear 'radio waves in their heads'. As this is very strange, I wondered if it was a ruse to get a better outcome than being stuck in the camps. Only Italian POWs made this claim.
Finally, Australia was blessed with large scale Italian migration after WW2 and the country was both vastly improved and changed beyond all recognition as a result. Viva Italia.
@@montecarlo1651 First of all, i really appreciate so much the kind words you used. I did not know of italian pows in Australia but what you say is not a surprise at all for me: we are usually friendly, smiling and we are not fit for war, in particular for a war not to defend your soil but to conquer territory belonging (as in the case of Greece, France and others) to 'friend' nations. I am sure that motivation is the real engine in every aspect of human life (career, sport and of course even war), so there was no way with those conditions for italians to win that war (actually i am sure it was a maybe unconscious reason to lose it) and this is one of the worst guilt of Mussolini and his regime back then.
Talking of italian migration in Australia i can tell you that even to these days we are attracted by life in your country: my nephew went for her honeymoon in Australia and she and her husband were so impressed by australian people and way of life, that for some years they were seriously talking to 'migrate' in your country.
To conclude, it is really an honor for me when you say italian migration changed for better the way of life in your country and i am completely honest with you when i say that here in Italy we have all the same positive opinion about australians. My idea is that this is connected to the weather: when you are born and live in sunny countries you are use to go out, enjoy life, new places and new people, whereas in cold countries you must stay home, with the same people and you are not 'open' to life; so somehow, sunny peoples sympathize each other.
So, thanks again e viva Italia e Australia😊
This has got to be one of the most fascinating channels on you tube.
I immediately thought of the Laconia when you said his boat was sunk. He was one of the unlucky ones. Amazing story. Great video.
Then you are certainly well educated about that time frame!
@@CrocodileTear I'm kind of addicted to WWII history. So many epic stories and events. So many "what ifs" that still affect us today. Those dog tags make it tangible.
Thank you for doing a through research. As a veteran, I can attest that these things can you have shown in this video are still happening.
That U boat story is crazy
This is the best channel on RUclips
Thank you
Remarkable story to an amazing find. Thanks for your commitment to solve the gaps in history.
Great Video Pat Tillman is the current protégé of the unfortunate friendly fire deaths
These are so interesting! MORE videos please!
Thank you, I have a few more planned for the next months.
I read an account of a daughter trying to find out how her dad died during the Battle of Arnhem in Sept 1944, The daughter went to reunions and was told eventually what had happened to her dad.
he was defending a house under attack and his Bren gun jammed, he held it vertically, looked down, banged it on the floor and it fired.
That’s sad. Never look into the barrel of a loaded gun. Ever.
hang fire....
Someone is yanking your plank.. any rifle or machine gun, never mind a Bren gun, you’re taught to cycle the chamber. A Bren gun is really simple to clear; you just pull the bolt back and let it slide forward.. it takes around half a second between stoppage and clearing it, and you don’t have to move from your firing position. No way would a trained machine gunner, or even a rifleman using the Bren stand up (under fire) and bang it on the floor.. there is nothing that this would fix and it’s nothing like any rifle drill. WW2 Brits were the best at rifle drill.
I greatly appreciate your efforts. As a long-time amateur WWII historian, I could spend hours watching/listening to your videos.
Battlefield relics are interesting enough by themselves, but your impressive research makes them all the more fascinating- and moving. Great work. They're not happy stories, for the most part, but at least the stories are being told.
This is very interesting. It reminds me of a WW2 Japanese flag I have with writing on it. It has the soldier's name and a shrine stamp from his hometown. After a lot of research I discovered a memorial website for his unit and found out he was killed by shrapnel in Burma during the Battle of Irrawaddy River. After finding this out I was amazed and had much more respect for the flag as the soldier likely had it on him when he died. I live in the US and I often wonder how the hell it got here if the battle was fought between British Indian and Japanese soldiers.
Take it a step further and see if there are any of his family still around. Maybe once Japan opens back up for tourism, visit the shrine the flag was stamped at. I’ve seen a documentary where some guy actually did that with the flag and apparently their brother or sister was still alive.
@@shdwbro 🫡🇯🇵
How it got here you'll likely never be able to know for sure. As a hypothesis I can propose two ideas. First, there were Americans who flew tons of transport missions in "CBI", China Burma India. It's possible the British picked the thing up and traded it off for something extra or for some favor or something like that, who knows. Second, it's equally possible that it was taken back to England by the British soldier who picked it up and got sold on eBay as militaria.
@@larrythorn4715 That is very true. After so many years this Japanese flag has probably been passed through many different collectors and I ended up being the current caretaker. If only the flag could talk, it would be a crazy story for sure.
@@shdwbro That's is a great idea. Hopefully one day I get the chance to travel to Japan. If I were to find a family member I would be obligated to return the flag to the family where it belongs. It would be a great thing.
As always, thank you for your amazing research and telling these soldier's stories.
13:33 reminds me of the scene from Band of Brothers with the guy who goes on about wanting a German Luger as a trophy for most of the series, then during the battle of the bulge he finally gets one, and it goes off in his pocket, causing him to bleed to death from a wound to the leg. Since that series is based on actual events, he must've had a similar death report.
An ANZAC veteran of New Guinea once told me a story about a mate of his who was hungry for a Japanese gunto sword. Eventually, he found one near a dead Japanese officer who was killed by a mortar. He picked up the sword and detached the scabbard from the dead man .
The scabbard was damaged by a fragment resulting in the last few inches missing.
I can't remember how it happened, but the souvenir hunter accidentally stabbed himself in the calf with the filthy tip of his trophy.
The vet said that his mate's leg quickly became infected in the tropical heat and eventually required an amputation.
I have no idea how true that story was.
@@sharonrigs7999 It's certainly a believable account, if nothing else.
@@edwhatshisname3562 That's what I thought. Perfectly plausible.
I have spent a lot of time in the tropics and know that even a light scrape should be cleaned and treated with antibiotic ointment.
Have had several Lugers thru the years and I prefer a pistol with an external hammer
What an incredible video. It is heart breaking to see the pic of those young girls who were rescued only to know that they were killed by their own allies.
Such amazing research. It's very... incredible to see such an abstract object come to life with all the background information. Thank you for sharing!
Another great video!!! I hope you never stop doing these
A really well presented historical study. Thank you for your efforts. Good work.
Excellent video, we appreciate all the research that you do and share with us👍
Fabulous stories and presentation! Thank you.
I thought this channel died a silent death, I am very pleased you are still active. I love your attention for detail and explaining what happened.
The corona propaganda has not killed me, and channel monetization has revived me ;)
Stay tunned as they say.
Fascinating research, covering areas of military history that is overlooked. Thank you for tacking the time to share it with us.
Great commentary!
Thank you so much for bring back this amazing story.
Great work, as usual. If you created one story a week, I would be a happy camper. Your content is excellent, Thanks for the hard work.
Incredible research!
You even interviewed soldiers from that period??? Man you're good at this
Thanks. The interviews are all in the book I wrote: Autopsy of a Battle
@@CrocodileTearthe operation dragoon one?
@@wtice4632 Yes, exactly
This is amazing research, thanks! Military court records from WW2 are interesting too. Similar to accidents, there was a lot of solider on soldier crime.
Most interesting wwII content i have seen in quite some time. Thank you for doing this very important work.
Thanks, and I would suggest watching a few other of my videos.
I relative of mine was an RAF pilot of single engined ground attack fighters like the Hawker Tempest and Hawker Typhoon. He would often be doing low level strafing attacks in France and the Low Countries against targets like trains.
One day when returning to base, he had an engine failure over the English Channel. He successfully bailed out but was last seen struggling to get into his life raft and sadly drowned.
Well that is why we have not heard of it. It's not like the American's to go around and say "oh yeah those people survived and then we bombed them..." Fantastic video, went way off from where I thought it was going and I loved every minute of it. Would really enjoy more of these, just finding out what happened to soldiers who's dogs tags you have found.
It certainly went way off of where I expected as well.
Your vids are riveting interesting to me.
Please keep them coming, 5 star production.
Could not agree more with you about the construction on those beautiful beaches and the garbage.
I'm surprised that more countries didn't use the two in one approach to dog tags. It's clever.
You have an absolutely fascinating manner in which you present history. Your data analytical skills (46 to 461) also surprised me, seeing to what extent you will go to find relatives and history on a particular fallen soldier. I can understand that what you do is more like "treasure hunting", where the treasure lies in the history and events leading to the death of a soldier. I really enjoy your channel, thank you for sharing your knowledge and experiences with us.
Thanks for your interest and kind comments!
GREAT WORK AGAIN. I ALWAYS LOOKING FOR A NEW VIDEO FROM YOU. I love how you find out how they die where they were. KEEP IT ROLLING
At the national training center in California, Barstow, California- There was an average of one soldier killed per rotation, every month at the time, and this was peace time.
One of the axioms of gun safety is: "There is no such thing as an unloaded weapon." This means that whenever you pick up a firearm, you check to see if there is a round in the chamber, EVEN IF you saw the person who handed it to you clear it. I was in the USMC in a rifle unit, and on occasion was a range safety NCO. One responsibility of that position is to inspect the weapon of everyone coming off the firing line. In the case of a rifle, the bolt it to be locked to the rear, and the safety engaged. You never pointed an "empty" weapon at anyone; it was always pointed in a safe direction. While I was in the Marines a number f people were shot with service pistols, at the time Colt .45s. This resulted from improperly clearing their weapons and then playing "quick draw" with someone, or handing their weapon to someone else who failed to check it. In Vieques, a guard thought he cleared his .45 before handing it to a kid, who promptly shot himself in the head.
The Italian soldier "cleaning his weapon" clearly didn't try running a cleaning rod through it.
This was very interesting, thank you for all the time and effort put into the research
Absolutely amazing story, wow!
I hope you will do more videos like this🙏🏼 I know it’s morbid but it’s so interesting to hear what actually happened to individual people and a bit about their lives before they went to war. It makes me incredibly grateful that my own grand dads and great grandad survived that hell on earth.
You should watch some of my other videos then. Some show actual exhumations, others show investigations based on archives such as the video about Unknown body X-77, or the Deadly Typo video
3:47 “…he lived through the ultimate experience of war, which is: dying and not surviving.” wow. That’s profound. Imagine not living through that kind of experience. Or imagine, living through it, dying and somehow surviving. Or what if you didn’t live through it, but you didn’t die or survive. 🤯
What amazing interesting. Thx for sharing. Great research , very well researched. My wife grandpa was in the war against British and captured at Alamein. Fortunately he was not sent in the Laconia, and survived the war. Thx again, and what great channel
What an amazing job you do…bringing all this stories to a light and most of it the details and all the research you do… fantastic work… RIP out dear soldiers .
Thank you ! Such a great organized delivery of important information. I would love to research WW2. May these people forever be remembered. War is hell.
Thank you for your amazing in depth videos. So much detail and research giving us amazing historical stories.
Thanks for watching. This video deserves more views.
Fascinating. Thank you! I truly love this stuff.
Always an outstanding video and presentation. Thank you.
the bombing of the laconia survivors was truely shamefull. thanks for the info
What an incredible story...thanks!
Excellent. It's a shame about the El Alamein battlefield but things don't stand still. My old school in Winchester, Montgomery of Alamein, was also demolished for housing. In the foyer when I was there, 1978-1983, were lots of memorabilia and artefacts from Monty and Rommel. I've often wondered where they went.
There is a difference between not standing still, and constructing hundreds of identical low quality secondary residence buildings along an entire pristine coastline in a 10 year period.
This is extremely fascinating. Thank you.
Excellent work! Thank you for all your hard work!!
Great investigation & storytelling, thanks !
Thanks for the work you do, it’s amazing.
Histroy itself is much more dramatic than any movies, thank you！
You do amazing work. It would be interesting for you to give a little background on how you got into this position. Appreciate your work and objective nature leaving us with the impression of the fact that it doesn't matter the side rather that we are all mortals caught in the grasp of the insanity of a few, that propels us into conflict with others, who could well have been our friends in another scenario. Best to you my friend
Thanks for your kind words. I am actually not in any special position to talk about this stuff. I am just very interested in a few WWII topics, ans so have studied them carefully, enabling me to say interesting things in these videos.
totally agree about the construction. its a shame.
This channel has such interesting content and it’s so well done
I love your channel and the work you do. It's amazing a d I'm sure there's some extremely grateful people out there.
Thanks a lot.
I'm really impressed by your work, truly amazing piece of research in every video.
I often think about how it would be to find the mortal remains of my grandfather's brother who died in the Russian Campaign (today Ukraine) in 1942. I wonder where he could have been buried, if someone found his tag etc. So hard to discover. Maybe one day someone like you will give him his history back. Thanks brother!
What are his name and date of birth? Have you checked if he may have been found in recent years?
Thank you. Information is the most valuable resource.
Awesome content. My great uncle was captured by the Japanese at Bataan and survived the death March. He was shipped back to Japan and he was slave labor in the coal mines. He was working 700 ft below ground when the bomb was dropped on Hiroshima and he was 12 miles from ground zero. The guards were supposed to execute the prisoners but they were abandoned instead
Did he survive the mine? Thats an amazing story
I have always found your videos informative and interesting - keep them coming.
Fascinating, well researched. Very good video.
Hello Mr . Croccodille . I Just wanted to say , that i have great respect for you in what you do 👌🏻. I follow you now few weeks and find your video's great . I follow video's like yours with great intrest and thank you for that .Up to the next great video's 👊🏻. Regarts from Holland 🇳🇱.
Thanks mate.
Another cracking video thanks for sharing your research. The Italian dog tags are very interesting, I only own one ww2 Italian item, an m33 helmet, might have to get some more. I've been reading several books lately on bomber command, RAF, in ww2 and the amount if deaths by accidents is quite a revelation, so I agree with your research on that subject, the latest book states that so many accidental deaths and injuries were caused in the RAF by too many recruits being trained at once without the correct training period and/or lack of proper training facilities, or at least the rapid expansion of the wartime armed forces, so exactly what you stated in the video, also I agree that lack of education will if played a part. I had heard of the Laconia incident, I read that the german navy forbade anymore acts of kindness from their u boat crews, one has to wonder if those little girls in the photo survived....the attack by the American aircraft is a shocking thing, the air crew of that plane must of felt terrible about having that on their conscience.... , however I believe it was a bit more complicated than just an order to attack, there was a bit of a mis understanding as to what the situation was, 'on the ground' so to speak...either way it was something that should of been considered a war crime 🤔🤔🤔.The pictures of El Alemain and the area of the battle fields destruction and building upon is truly awful....why hasn't this been reported in the main stream media?...anyway great video again and thanks, all the best and hello from the UK 🙂🙂🙂
That was really good. Thank you.
amazing research skills, really interesting videos thank you. linking items to people and a history increases their human value and also monetary value, well done. The story of the Laconia reverses the typical stereotypes of ww2
Thank you for this noble job🙏🏻❤️
Thank you for a very interesting video. This is the type of everyday info that never reaches the mainline press.
amazing , well put together , thank you
Incredibly interesting. Thank you. In peacetime the idea that they would bomb the U-boats with survivors on them is horrific but, l suppose the justification was how many more people would die if they let them go. If anyone wants to know the writing on the memorial roughly translates as, they lacked luck, not courage.
Never any justification for committing a war crime, then brushing it all under the carpet.
@@geoffheard5768 Fair comment. I believe similar logic as theirs was also used for dropping two atomic bombs but, it's easy to judge history harshly. I'm grateful that my only exposure to war is via lost grandfathers and great uncles,
Uboat commanders stopped rescuing survivors when the RAF started using them as bait.
bombing the boats and not even sinking them in the process i might add.. what a waste of life
The U-boats wouldn’t even have been combat effective if they were essentially being used to save civilians.
Fascinating stuff. I had heard of the Laconia and was vaguely familiar with the story, now I want to read that book.
The book "One common enemy" is excellent and I highly recomment it, even for someone with no interest in WWII.
@@CrocodileTear Thank you.
Excellent segment.
The story of the Laconia and all the stupid ways soldiers die off the battlefield remind me of the novel Catch 22.
I unfortunately was present at the autopsy of one such death where a drunken soldier was struck by a speeding car as he and his comrades walked home from a bar on a poorly-lit country road. His body was tossed and his head impailed on the fence post for the base’s peripheral fence.
Another unfortunate young guy whose death I had to explain to family (and lawyers later in a dispute over death benefits between an ex wife and girlfriend) was due to his own recklessness on a powerful sport bike on an Italian road as he road over a narrow bridge. Unfortunately he was in a coma with cerebral edema which I could not treat as I knew it should be. All I could do is watch the local “neurosurgeons” tarry and dispute interventions. As he gradually progressed through decorticate, then decerebrate body positions.
Top stuff. Liked and subscribed
Thanks mate
Being Italian this is very interesting to me.thank you for your hard work
I think if I had a letter saying a loved one died in a car accident in the middle of a war I might be a little relieved. Depending on how bad ass they were.
My father was a WW2 US Navy Veteran, whose ship (USS Delta) was stationed off Oran,Algeria for a time. He often told me about the Axis POWs that came through the port- as he was detailed as SP to guard them. The Germans had neat uniforms, buttoned tunics, hats straight, etc- while the Italians wore sandals, no shirts, were drinking and singing.LOL.
Love your work…
Fascinating.
Amazing stories and videos! Keep the good work up, please!
Awesome video! I have a researched dog tag from a KIA from 3° Reggimento Bersaglieri, and he was killed in Russia just after 1 or 2 weeks after arriving. The body was brought back to Italy in the 90s, and the family decided to sell the half tag in the last year. So it ended up in my collection. If they didn't want it, it will be better in my collection.
In my experience most Italian families are not at all interested in their WWII heritage. It is their choice and I cant blame them. There are many exceptions of course.
@@CrocodileTear Sadly it's a political thing, after the war everything involved with the war was seen as fascist and is in some ways still seen as fascist, ignorance and strong political propaganda from left partyies caused this along with a schooling system that treats history like a class B subject. My grandfather was in Russia with the 5th Alpini and Luckyly came back, but he left there a lot of friends, he never spoke too much about russia and i totally understand why. Anyway keep up this work! Documenting researching and finding dogtags is like sending them home, all fallen deserve to be remembered.
Excellent video … so much information! Wonderful 😊Thank you!
It's a disgrace what they heave done in Egypt, like you I was there 1999 and cannot believe the "progress" of the area.
amazing detective work
Great job as usual!
Such a tragic way to die. Especially for his family. RIP Gerardino
Awesome story , amazing research ! ✔️
Thanks!
Very fascinating research, sad but interesting nevertheless. Thank you for sharing ✌️🇺🇸
Thank you. I appreciate the videos you make. I have grown to understand that it is difficult to judge individual soldiers based on their nationalities. Had I been born Italian, German, Russian or Chinese, statistics prove that I would most likely have fought and died for one of nations. It doesn’t make the individual soldier evil. So much of life is “timing and chance”.
Thank you for stating that. A lot of the commentators are convinved that all Germans were Nazis, etc. They dont realise that if they go along with the stereotyped idea today, they would probably have done exactly the same back then.
Fascinating. More like this, please.
Very detailed information, good research!
Great research and video
Oh dang, when the research showed the troop transport "Laconia", instant shivers went down my spine... 0.o
I appreciate your hard work for making such Wonderful vedio.
After the Laconia incident Grand Admiral Karl Dönitz gave the Laconia Order which forbade the Uboats from picking up or helping any survivors from any ship they sunk, and which sent the Uboats on the course of unrestricted warfare
Very interesting, yes. Thank you.