My top 5 or more 1. Joe Louis 2. Muhammad Ali 3. Rocky Marciano 4. Jack Johnson 5. George Foreman 6. Jack Dempsey 7. Lennox Lewis 8. Sonny Liston 9. Joe Frazier 10. 3 way tie Evander Holyfield/Mike Tyson/ Larry Holmes.
interesting list but are you going on the basis of their career and what they achieved during their time or man vs man? like ali vs louis? ali vs marciano? cos i think ali beats all in that list and has done actually with likes of foreman, liston, frazier.
I kind of Blended the list based on the criteria of what they accomplished in their time versus who they accomplished it against. Also a little bit of man versus man specifically in his prime if I were to do it just Prime vs Prime Ali would likely be one and Tyson would be much much higher. I do have to say I am favoring those who I generally like a little more as well. Louis and Evander Holyfield being two of my favorites.
I’ve always been an Ali fan listening to the radio in the middle of the night in the 70s.Totally respect and accept Teddys analysis the only true world boxing analyst .. the greatest 😀👍
Sam Langfords most notable stat isn’t the 210 wins 126 by knockout. It’s the fact that he fought successfully as a heavyweight against boxers as large as 6’6 , 260lbs. He was only 5’6 1/2” tall and 185lbs.
45 rounds, this is why conditioning was a much more significant part of training and why the fighters were smaller. Today Jack Johnson would be fighting at 225 and Jim Jeffries would be 235lbs.
Then again you had Jim Jeffries and Primo Canera, who is number 1 in KOs for Heavyweight champ at 72 even over Foreman's 68. These were big 6'6, 6'7 guys back then.
@@renzopeterson153 Aye Archie Moore had over 130. Knockouts but a lot of them were at light heavyweight.He,s also the only man to have fought Rocky Marciano and Ali.
Lennox Lewis, needs a mention, he had elite speed and power and along with Holmes had the greatest jab ever. He had a great career, and made all his wins look easy so he doesn't get the credit for being in tough great fights I think Lennox is the most skilled Heavyweight ever, his footwork, his ring IQ, his power, and speed are all elite. I don't think any Heavyweight ever could beat Lennox at his best!
Lewis would have most likely lost to Vitali Klitchscoe if they didnt stop the fight. Lewis lucked out bigtime. He was standing on wobbly legs and saved by the ring doc. Right after the Klitchscoe fight Lewis retired, depriving boxing fans of the rematch. Its no coincidence he retired right then. Klitchschoe had damaged him badly and Lewis felt it for a long time after I'm sure. Lewis is very hard for me to decide where he belongs on best ever lists. A fabulous fighter no doubt. His right hand was death. I disagree about him having elite speed. He was fast, but nothing special. But there are so many greats. I think if Lewis wanted to be remembered as one of the best ever he should have fought another 5 years or so. This is my main problem with him. Many boxers only have losses because they fought into middle age well past their prime. Lewis basically quit while he was ahead. He could have came out of retirement. He didn't have the drive. In my view there are lots of fighters who could have beaten Lewis. Here are a few. George Foreman, Rocky Marciano, Sonny Liston, Cassius Clay, Joe Frazier, Vladiomir Klitchscoe, Jack Dempsey, Larry Holmes, Max Baer, Clevland Williams and Joe Wolcott.
@@worstcaseofcrabsever5510 no chance, Vitali was out on his feet at end of round 6 with blood everywhere, he admits that uppercut in round 6 caused the worse cut which was inside his mouth.
I asked Lennox personally which heavyweight in history did he feel would have given him the most trouble and his answer was short and sweet ..... "Holmes".
Love this video. Teddy Atlas has so much heart. He has such a broad range of respect for history and understanding of what these boxers went through. Love your program guys.
Great to hear your list, Teddy. It carries a bit more weight knowing that you had access to Jimmy Jacob’s library of vintage fights and have seen a few more fights than the average person. If you provided some education on more pioneering boxers from history for us younger guys, I think some of us would appreciate an episode or two of that too. Thanks!
I also rank Jack Johnson #3 heavyweight of all time. Many modern sportswriters and analysts neglect to rank Jack Johnson within the top 10 best heavyweights ever. Very nice and accurate inclusion of Johnson, Teddy...
Let us not forget that Max Shmelling when Joe Louis died sent £10,000 to his widow with an apology that he was not at the funeral, that was respect. Please excuse my spelling of Shmelling.
Max Schmelling stated he "loved Joe Louis". Schmelling was a great human being and the only fighter to defeat the great Joe Louis when he was at his peak.
It was great how after Joe Louis beat James J Braddock and one of the reporters refered to him as "champ" and Joe told the reporter not to call him that ...not yet ." Not until I beat that man."Louis wouldn't even say his name . "that man." Classic!
No of them not joie Louis none of them are not number one top two none of that they din't fight many elite fighters in they era that they fought against like in the Ali, Lewis, and bowe era, they are still great tho because they were the fight runner up to represent, help create the sports of boxing that has expanded, profited, and became bigger than any event ever since, and louis, Marciano, and them are still in the top ten but not the number one spot or two or three or four..
As much as I respect Teddy's opinion, I have to go with Ali for #1, because, I don't see Joe Louis beating Ali. As for pressure, there's Liston in '64 and Foreman in '74, neither of these fights anyone picked Ali to win, and Ali won both emphatically. To say nothing of his ability to reinvent himself after his forced retirement. In a career that began in 1960, Ali was only stopped in 1980
Why you saying 'I don't see Joe Louis beating Ali' first of all it is not about who beats who. it is about what champion did when he was a champion. Joe Louis beat 3 heavyweight champions before became champ himself . was champion for 12 years ( Joe lost his prime years 42,43,44,45. ) but still managed and was champion for next 3 years. and i want to say one more thing. Joe was beaten up by Schmeling. this lost was not by lucky shot or something . Max just kick his ass. but imagine . how you would feel when you know that you got to fight a guy who . who was just better than you. and Joe just killed him in first round .with all respect to Ali . he never did that against someone . Frazier beat him and what you see in there last two fights is illegal holding by Ali . and Ken Norton . for me ken won every fight against Ali . if not, still you can not say that Ali figured out Frazier or Norton . so I would say Louis is better than Ali. and one more thing Joe Louis was far better than sonny and George .
@@dankemo3169 Nobody was far better than Sonny Liston and George Foreman. They are easily up there with the greatest of all time. Foreman is self-explanatory if you just look at his career. Liston you have to look deeper to understand. He was never given a fair shake in his life and only got a chance at the title because Patterson was a real gentleman and thought he deserved it. Liston was probably years older than it was reported and already out of his prime when he fought the greatest and he could have even beaten Ali in the rematch if he wasn't forced to throw the fight. The RUclips video Sonny Liston way down we go does a great job of quickly summarising his greatness.
@@sakketin Sonny greatest of all time? . i mean what are saying man ? guy beat 182 lb champion and than retain title against him and that is all what he did . was champion for 1 year . and you call greatest ? 50s were one of the worsets years for heavyweight boxing . Joe Louis was a man in one of the greatest years of heavyweight boxing . but about George you are right . George beat man who was unbeaten my favorite boxer Joe Frazier. 215 lb full of muscle man . and Ken Norton . buy Joe Louis is another level. Joe is better than George and far far far better than sonny.
Love this list and it's hard to disagree with anyone on there. I had 4 out of 5, with Lewis over Tunney. I don't think Lewis gets enough credit for what he accomplished. His resume is one of the greatest in history - which is amazing considering how many belts there are, which allowed a lot of ducking. He beat everyone he faced in the ring and didn't duck anyone.
Teddy will hardly ever mention Lewis if he can avoid it. I like Teddy in many respects but he definately has an issue with Lewis that makes me suspect it's personal to a degree.
Teddy is praising Louis and his trainers relationship as the greatest bond in boxing history, when he himself saw cus damato transform mike Tyson from a scared and broken child into the most viscous boxer to lace up the gloves.
Tyson was cool but he himself will say he shouldn’t be talked of in the same breath of these boxers. Tyson never showed his heart, he never had big fights that push you all the way , he never beat anyone great and he wasn’t at the top for long. He was no where near the most vicious lol
@@dondamon4669 Tyson was the most feared heavyweight since Sonny Liston. He showed his heart enough, he just went downhill after he was on the top of the world (unified heavyweight champion knocking out lineal champion Mike Spinks in one round).
@@dondamon4669 it’s easy ti say all this now. Context is a big thing like one of the other dingbats said. Mike was nothing and became the most feared man on the planet, at the time. Whether or not he’s stuck to that is neither here nor there. But cus brought something out of mike no one else could. Greatest trainer fighter duo ever.
My top 5 Heavyweights of All-Time: 1. Ali 2. Tyson 3. Foreman 4. Louis 5. Holyfield This is in no particular order but these 5 HW champs had it all in every way!! Some had power, others had speed, others great defense!! These are the great arc to strap on gloves and enter the squared circle imo.
@@ohiovalleyminiaturefootbal8100 considering Tyson never beat anyone of note, the only two HOF boxers he beat were a 38 year old,almost two years retired Larry Holmes and a pumped up Light Heavyweight who only had 5 Heavyweight fights in his whole career Michael Spinks.
Top 5 heavyweights Ali all day long Joe Louis Rocky Marciano Jack Johnson. Mike Tyson You would have to put Joe Frazier Jack Dempsey Jean Tony Jersey Joe Henry Armstrong Max Baer Evander Holyfield George Foreman. hard to pick a top 5 but it has to be Ali all day long has Mike Tyson said Ali was willing to die in The Ring that left hook he got off Joe Frazier would have knocked anybody clean out especially after going 14 rounds but Ali got up in 3 seconds that's why he is the greatest any fighter would have taken the 8 count
not only was Jeffries retired for 6 years, but I believe he had to lose 100 lbs for the fight. Probably a few tune up fights would have helped as well. Pretty amazing effort IMO
Jack johnson was a pretty trash fighter. He just pushed around guys who were smaller than him, once he faced a big guy (jess willard) he got flattened.
@@louis-i5f And what is your evidence for this? Jim jeffries was also nearly forty and coming out of retirement when johnson beat him but people bring it up like its a great win for johnson somehow.
@@3ncore706 Jeffries was 35. Johnson challenged Jeffries in 1903-1904. Jeffries stated he would not be fighting a Negro fighter. He drew color line . He was forced to fight Johnson . Johnson made him pay for drawing color line. It was all Jeffries fault . He denied Johnson and Johnson made him pay for its Stoop trying to rewrite history. You're talking to the wrong person.
Gene Tunney also got knocked down by Dempsey in their 2nd fight but the ref's " the long count" gave him time to recover. Otherwise Dempsey would've won back the title, even though he was well out of his prime
Tunney won 19 out of 20 against Dempsey, that alone shows he deserves to be up there. And yeah Dempsey knocked Tunney down in the 7th in the second fight but Tunney knocked Dempsey down in the next round! I think for me Tunney is definitely one of the greatest pound for pound but his achievements isolated at heavyweight were perhaps limited. I'd have him in the top 10 or 15 strictly at heavyweight.
@@patrickryce1225 Agreed . Tunney was ahead of his time . He fought in a controlled , disciplined fashion and would adapt and adjust his style and strategy in accordance to whomever he was fighting . Great boxer .
I may be wrong about this but there was a very old heavyweight boxer named John L. Sullivan, who in the 1880s fought an 84 round fight against an opponnent (the name i dont remember)and won. 8 4 R O U N D S
I don't think his reputation as an innovator is deserved. He was just had very good reflexes. Guys like Tom Sayers, or Jem Mace were doing similar stuff years before. Check out Billy Edwards, the earliest we have on film. An old bareknuckle Lightweight.
@UdaM30Bitch Haha don't deflect just cause you were called out on the truth. Its pretty rare Tyson not being on anyone's top HW's list and its usually hate for him that skews their opinion of him.
Thank you Teddy! Glad to see a guy with teddy's credentials saying the brown bomber is the goat. You don't reign over a division for 12 years without being someone special. Plus he fought some good competition and ex champions in his career. He avenged 2 of his 3 losses and probably wouldn't have lost to Marciano if he was younger. The only reason he took the fight is because he needed money because he was screwed out of his money by so many people including the irs. My list: 1. Joe Louis 2. Rocky Marciano 3. Muhammad Ali 4. George Foreman 5. Gene Tunney Honorable mention for Jack Johnson and Larry Holmes
I've ALWAYS respected Teddy as a knowledgeable man in boxing, but after hearing him talk about Louis, Ali AND Jack Johnson, I have to consider him one of the best boxing minds and historians of the sweet science, period!👍✊
Teddy’s list; 1. Joe Louis 2. Muhammad Ali 3. Jack Johnson 4. Rocky Marciano 5. Gene Tunney (Bonus - 6. Jack Dempsey, 7. Jim Jeffereis) My list; 1. Jack Johnson 2. Muhammad Ali 3. Joe Louis 4. Rocky Marciano 5. Sam Langford (Imo if Mike Tyson had Cus D. around for another ten years he would be the goat. Also think that Tyson Fury will be top 5 after career is over. 6ft9, 270 lbs with God level Boxing IQ would be too much for even the greats.)
Teddy. I really think, and a physicist could confirm this, that part of Marciano’s power came from his perceived deficit, his short arms. I think it increased his torque. I think this might explain how he tore people up inside. I also think his physical engine was greater than others, like Secretariat had a bigger heart. That can’t b confirmed though. However his fighter’s heart was gigantic! Sooo underrated. Can be settled only in Boxer’s Heaven.
If I remember correctly I believe Sam Langford told Joe Louis' trainer and former fighter Jack Blackburn (who Teddy mentions) to "pack a lunch" before their rematch and got in his head before the fight. Based on the Joe Louis movie, The Joe Louis Story.
TEDDY'S CHOICES 1st - Joe Louis 2nd - Muhammad Ali 3rd - Jack Johnson 4th - Rocky Marciano 5th - Gene Tunney MY CHOICES 1st - Joe Louis 2nd - Muhammad Ali 3rd - Larry Holmes 4th - Lennox Lewis 5th - Jack Johnson
@@dsrfc2565 Are you saying by your list that Ali beats everyone below him? Because even if Liston beats Tyson which is a big maybe there's no way Liston's accomplishments put him above Tyson. He never defended the title when he won it from Patterson.
@@Priceluked Absolutely Ali beats everyone below him. Wins over Liston, Frazier and Foreman is the greatest résumé in HW history. My list is not just based on résumé, but eye test. Tyson’s best win was against a shot to bits Larry Holmes. Holyfield stood up to the bully and wasn’t intimidated by him, Liston was cut from the same cloth.
@@dsrfc2565 Nah well then that's just your list of personal favorites nowhere near an accurate list. Also no way in hell Ali beats prime Holmes or Lewis. The rest are debatable about whether prime Ali wins.
How about doing a top 5 trainers of all time? Some great characters and innovators down the years.... it would be interesting to hear teddy's take on that side of boxing.
@@Ivan-rl9mk for sure. But rocky was the hardest hitter he ever fought, by his own words. Louis is my favorite fighter, but I would never count marciano out
S Day Joe was way past his prime and needed the money for his tax bill and Rocky was the best conditioned heavyweight possibly of all time he would of been 200lbs + if he didn’t do as much cardio but his style needed him to be able to throw bombs for 15 rounds
I've replayed this with relish at least 5 times now. It'd be nice to see Teddy do a best of Trainers. I'd include him personally. Perhaps the best. Certainly the GOAT commentator on sports and boxing historian.
Actually, I would put Louis and Ali one, two just like Teddy. I put Dempsey and Tyson (very similar fighters) 3 and 4. Dempsey did not defend his title often enough through no fault of his own. Jack was a relentless puncher with devastating power. Lastly, George Foreman.
@@darealmacpower5702 He'd be in my top 20,but the mere fact he has no notable wins,faced only the two of the best of his era,lost to them and avoided the rest,he definitely isn't in my top 10.
It's really hard for me to rate a fighter in the top-5 unless they were able to demonstrate some level of dominance after their prime -- when their skills started to fade. Some of the most impressive heavyweights during their prime (e.g., Tyson, Liston, Patterson, Marciano) never did this. My list: 1) Ali, 2) Louis, 3) Holmes, 4) Foreman, 5) Lewis.
@boxing fan uk yet you dont mention tyson who was beaten by a soup can at age 23 and couldnt beat anyone of note after that . bowe at least BEAT evander, tyson couldnt
@boxing fan uk he lost to tucker he got beat by jesse ferguson and ate himself out of contention he was a mixed bag who had a good fight against tyson but some awful fights as well
Top ten in no particular order Muhammad Ali Joe Louis Larry Holmes Wladimir Klitchko George foreman Evander Holyfield Rocky Marciano Sonny Liston Lennox Lewis Mike Tyson
Me personally, in order, Joe Louis Cassius clay/m. Ali Rocky Marc Gene Tunney Lennox Lewis George foreman Jack Johnson Evander holyfield Mike Tyson Larry Holmes, I personally think people over exaggerate Holmes being past his prime against jinks spinks and Tyson, after his Tyson loss he went on a win streak against top competition ending with a close competitive fight against holyfield. Michael spinx was a PHENOMINAL FIGHTER Tyson was not necessarily a bad style matchup for him but too big for spinx's style. He's basically a smaller version of lennox and therefore not strong or long enough to hold Tyson at Bay. And "PRIME LARRY HOLMES" robbed Ken Norton twice. As well as should've been tko'd after literally running for ten rounds to recover from shavers knockdown. Being technical is one thing, he RAN from earlier for ten rounds till he got his marbles back
When you said Joe Louis it brought tears to my eyes....You nailed it! He held the title for 12 years! He defended his title 25 times! His record would be even greater if WW 2 had not derailed his reign...Thank you Mr. Atlas. No one is on your level when it comes to boxing.
My top 5 with regards to most accomplished careers: 1. Ali 2. Louis 3. Holyfield 4. Dempsey 5. Marciano My top 5 with regards to dominance in their prime: 1. Tyson 2. Ali 3. Foreman 4. Louis 5. Liston
Well set out. I believe a top 10 should come down to did they beat the best of their era and did they overcome adversity. Everything else is subjective and hypothetical with regards to who beats who.
No Marciano in your dominance list who actually dominated his era with a undefeated rec of 49-0, taking out all top contenders/contestants available at the time? Jack Johnson? Wow..
I just found this on the net about Max Schmelling “ In later years it was revealed that Schmeling had sheltered two Jewish boys in his Berlin apartment during the Kristallnacht pogrom of November 9-10, 1938. Schmeling served as a paratrooper in the German army during World War II and was injured during the invasion of Crete in 1941. “
How Tunney can be in Top 5 if he only had few fights as a Heavyweight? The only good Heavyweight he beat was Dempsey who didnt fight for 3 years. He was so out of shape he couldnt go more than 10 rounds. It shouldnt even be considered a title fight.
@John Bistis.... Tyson was, at best, the third best boxer of his era. The only way he makes it into a top 5 all time list is if it is judged on excitement or cultural impact.
Many decades ago, a book came out about the greatest track and field athletes of all time, and the author applied a particular criteria when choosing who to put in the book. 1) Win an Olympic title 2 ) Break world records 3 ) Have an aura of invincibility about them. Well, applying/adapting that to heavyweight boxers, Joe Louis comes out on top. 1) Win the world title 2) Youngest champion ( at the time), longest reign and huge unbeaten period 3 ) Invincibility. Well, Joe, for most of his career, entered the ring as a huge favourite. Now, if we apply the criteria to Ali, he comes up short on the " aura of invincibility" criteria 1) He was a huge underdog when he challenged Liston for the title, and he was also an big underdog when he challenged Big George for the title, and in many fights the odds were 50/50. Longevity is another criteria that Joe Louis had, unlike Iron Mike who does tick a lot of boxes. 1 ) Youngest champ and, in the early years, a huge aura of invincibility, but his career at the top was too brief to list him towards the top of any "greatest" list. What, about Rocky? Well, again he fails with the " aura of invincibility" criteria as he was the underdog in a number of his big fights. No, Joe ticks all the boxes and then some.
@@dondamon4669 Jack Dempsey, Joe Louis and Rocky Marciano never beat any "greats" although, like Tyson with Holmes, Rocky did beat a washed up Joe Louis, but this doesn't stop Jack, Joe and Rocky being rated as true greats
Teddy Atlas misspoke there when he said "The Rock, The Manassa Mauler". Of course, the "Mauler" was Jack Dempsey. Great list though. I would not have ranked Johnson top five, but hey ... it's fun to compare these legends. Always had a soft spot for Ezzard Charles and would have rated him, together with Big George Foreman.
What cements Ali as the greatest of all time was his win over a prime shavers, and his comeback win against spinks. In thoae fights he already had severe Parkinson's disease.
Tyson Fury and Mike Tyson in a top 5 is ridiculous. Tyson had a short prime and lost most of the big fights in the later half of his career. He was a bolt of lightning to the sport, but that doesn't make him a top 5. You can make a case for top 10. Tyson Fury has one win vs an all time great in Klitschko and one win vs the other best guy of his generation, Deontay Wilder. If he beats Joshua and dominates the division we can maybe make a case for top 10 in a few years but he's in his 30's and likely just doesn't have enough career left over to put together a top 5 resume. Great fighters but there's just not enough there to put them above other guys who deserve it more.
@@esunsalmista i would place fury in top 5 heavyweights if he beats joshua ( which i think he will ) considering all he´ve been through getting fat almost taking suicide etc and then come back better than ever on top of that if he beats joshua he will probably go down as the only undefeated heavyweight ever alongside marciano ( but with better resume )
I think that when doing top fighters of all-time in any weight class, it must be split into two, if not three different eras b/c boxing was so different on so many levels. Gene Tunney, for example - the man never fought a Black fighter. Whether b/c of racism, ducking/dodging, snobbery, etc. he avoided George Godfrey and Harry Wills. And how can one compare Jack Johnson with Evander Holyfield? Or Joe Louis with Tyson Fury, a guy who the eye test says he could maybe beat any guy in history, but whose resume is very thin and Louis fought more times in a couple months than Fury does in 3-4 years.
*Are we scoring popularity and hype, because if that's the case then Tyson and Ali win easily. Everyone knows that athletes eventually improve over time. But let's instead judge them by how good they were FOR THEIR ERA - rather than who would win a fantasy fight:* *1.* Lennox *2.* Ali After that I get stuck.. and it's easily debatable. lol
The correct order would be....... 1. Ali 2. Louis* 3. Tyson 4. Holmes 5. Marciano 6. Johnson or (Sam Langford) 7. Forman 8. Lewis 9. Holyfield 10. Frazier or (Jack Dempsey) and the * means they arguably could be number 1.
I find it interesting that the latest Heavyweight to be on Teddy's list is Ali. He clearly has a thing for the old fighters (which isn't necessarily a bad thing). But no one in the last 40 years? If there was to be any in the last 40 years to be in the top 5, for me Larry Holmes, Lennox Lewis, Mike Tyson, Evander Holyfield and Wladimir Klitschko would be the only ones people could consider. Vitali, Bowe just missing out on the consideration list. Personally the only ones I'd seriously consider though is Holmes & Lennox. Of today's 3 Fury, Wilder, Joshua. I'd want to judge them further down the line, although I think Tyson Fury in the next 10 years has the potential to be an all time great. Time will tell.
Legend of Awww Sheeet that’s why I said Fury over the next 10 years is the only one of today who may stand a chance. His legacy is not complete. I’ll reserve judgement.
Chess is a great example of recorded history of matches. Every single move is recorded in a competitive match. Imagine being able to know every punch and slip and footwork in a boxing match. That'll really put perspective on the skill
@@therumbleinthejunglee Based off of their skill set and who they fought. Louis fought a bunch of bums. Ali fought the greatest group of heavyweights ever.
I'd rather listen to Teddy commentating ANY sport than the ex pros and network lackies. He understands the essence of sports and he describes things so beautifully, brings it all to life and relates it to life. He'd be incredible commentating on skiing.. literally any sport. Terrific human being and professional working the golden seam he understands so well.
Who did he beat from the top 25 ? Help me out. Tyson and Holyfield right ? So 2 and 0 ? Ali was 9 and 3 vs top 25 for perspective. Foreman 3 and 1, Tyson 1 and 3. Lewis is top 6 to 12 not 5.
Joe Louis beat heavyweight champions: Jack Sharkey, Max Schmeling, Primo Carnera, Max Baer, Jimmy Braddock, and Joe Walcott (once by controversial decision & once by knockout); lightheavyweight great Billy Conn; and all the top contenders of his day. Although few would be considered all time greats, his record reign of 12 years and 25 consecutive defenses are records that will probably never be broken. He would have had many more title defenses if WW2 didn't happen. It's also hard to find a better puncher than Louis. He has the best highlight reel knockouts with people doing 360s on the way down, bouncing off the canvas, and going completely stiff and falling. They were given a 10 count, no TKOs. Every now and then you see that type of knockout, but most of his opponents went out that way. The only fighter I can think of who has those type of great knockouts is Julian Jackson at middleweight. Joe Louis was awesome! :)
Gene Tunney?? Dempsey deserves that spot. My reasons why Tunney shouldn't be on that list of Heavyweights... He fought the vast majority of his fights against middleweights or light heavyweights. Tunney was at his best at light heavyweight, where, if he was ranked in that class, he would rank in the top 5 all time; indeed, Mike Spinks had almost twice the title fights at heavyweight than Tunney! There is conflicting information on his willingness to fight Number One contender Harry Wills because he was Black, but additionally because Tunney feared losing a Dempsey title shot, with differing accounts, the truth may never be known; His fame as a heavyweight lies solely in defeating the Great Jack Dempsey, when, in fact, Dempsey had not fought in 3 years, and had gone 5 of the 7 years of his reign without fighting; Dempsey was shot; He had only two defenses, one against Dempsey, and the other,instead of fighting then #1 contender Jack Sharkey, he instead fought Tom Heeney, a limited fighter who he knew he could beat, then he retired.
Neither of the two deserves to be in the top 5 imo Dempsey barely fought as champion and refused to fight black fighters (some of the best at that time) Tunney barely fought at heavyweight...
@@husain4718 Tunney was far from shot shot. He TKOed Heeney after Dempsey. Tunney was passing his peak but still in the game so to speak. In fact, he could've continued fighting after Dempsey/Heeney but he chose to retire before he could establish his own legacy at Heavyweight beyond Dempsey, and the result left the heavyweight title vacant for two years. Had Tunney continued fighting, even for another year, taking on Sharkey and possibly Schmeling, there might have been an actual Tunney-era to reflect on.
Well, Ali is always my favorite. He was flawed, yes. He didn’t go to the body. He left his hands down, He pulled back... etc But still The greatest, look at what he did in the history of boxing, And he had an amazing chin, and mind.
Ali made wrong right until he lost his speed and since he did not have traditional boxing skill and he became a punching bag and wrecked his brain. Did anyone ever see Ali throw a body punch? Teddy Brenner said it best. Ali couldn’t box and he couldn’t punch but he sure could fight.
Top 5 heavyweights 1. Muhammad Ali 2. Joe Louis 3. George Foreman 4. Jack Johnson 5. Rocky Marciano Muhammad Ali is the greatest because he's the only 3 time lineal heavyweight champion ever. His will to win is unmatched. He was also idolized by many because of his bravery to stand up for what he believes in. He could will himself against any opponent in and out of the ring. Joe Louis was America's hero. He defended the heavyweight title a record of 25 times. He won against champions like Jack Sharkey, Primo Carnera, Max Baer, and Jim Braddock. He was also a part of the greatest sporting event ever when he won against Max Schmeling in their second bout. George Foreman became the oldest heavyweight champion ever at the age of 45. He made the greatest comeback in sports history when he regained back the title 20 years after he lost it. He also never got knocked down during his comeback. Jack Johnson is the greatest heavyweight of his era. He won against champions like Bob Fitzsimmons, Tommy Burns, and James J Jeffries. He influenced people like Muhammad Ali to stand up for oneself. Rocky Marciano has an undefeated record. He fought the likes of the great Archie Moore, Ezzard Charles, and Jersey Joe Walcott. He would've been great in any era.
I don't get all the hype around Johnson, Tommy burns was 5'7 168lb and Johnson was 6'0 196lb, he beat a 44 year old bob fitzsimmons, james j jefferies had to lose 110lb to fight jack johnson which took a toll on him
In the old days men were tougher. Life was tougher. Modern fighters might look bigger and stronger but that’s it. They don’t hit harder nor take same punishment. Endurance is out of the question. Teddy knows what he’s talking about and his ranking is accurate.
In his time. But I can't see him beating Ali, Holmes, Foreman, Frazier Young, Liston, a prime Marcianno. Or other fighters in other eras. I do believe he was the greatest puncher in terms of combinations, finishing them off.
Teddy rlly right when talkin bout how it’s horrible keepin boxing records in history cuz I gotta look deep in the internet to find jus articles bout fighters before 1970 so it’s always good to hear him speak bout fighters id never have been able to learn bout (2003 born)
![Felix "Unfair" | [Stray Kids : SKZ-PLAYER]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/Oswujxm2Ag0/mqdefault.jpg)
This one should kick off some debate. Let's hear your Top 5. Put 'em in the comments.
My 5..... Dempsey, Joe Louis, Ali, Foreman and larry Holmes. I could argue, for any of those guys. Away to start podcast 👍🏻😁👍🏻
1: Lennox Lewis. 2: Tyson Fury. 3: Muhammad Ali. 4: Joe Louis. 5: Jack Johnson. 1 & 2 might swap places by the time Fury retires...
@@pauljamessquibbs.3945 I feel like its way too early for Tyson Fury to be ranked this high. He might get knocked out in his next fight. We never know
@@pauljamessquibbs.3945 Tyson Fury?? 😂😂😂😂😂😂 how many titles defences has he made/won?? All time great?? Rocky Marciano just outside my 5.
@@pauljamessquibbs.3945 id put Iron Mike* Tyson ahead of Tyson Fury.
The feeling of being a kid and listening to a great story teller telling a great story.
Yes. I like hearing from guys who spent their whole life around the fight game.
SMOKIN’ Joe Frazier & Muhammad Ali are the Greatest heavyweights OF ALL TIIIMES!
ruclips.net/video/vxs72M2P1tk/видео.html
Yes!!! 😁😁😁😊😊
@@THEDONSTR8Fightah76 Muhammad Ali is the best
Joe Frazier is top 10-15
The feeling of your grandpa falling to sleep while he talks….
My top 5 or more
1. Joe Louis
2. Muhammad Ali
3. Rocky Marciano
4. Jack Johnson
5. George Foreman
6. Jack Dempsey
7. Lennox Lewis
8. Sonny Liston
9. Joe Frazier
10. 3 way tie Evander Holyfield/Mike Tyson/ Larry Holmes.
Good list. Pleased to see Liston in there. Also no doubt that the Steward trained Lewis would have been a nightmare for any HW in history.
interesting list but are you going on the basis of their career and what they achieved during their time or man vs man? like ali vs louis? ali vs marciano? cos i think ali beats all in that list and has done actually with likes of foreman, liston, frazier.
Smokin’ Joe Frazier is the Greatest Fighter Ever.
Yes but just a few changes Lewis could have beat anybody and could have been ranked a little higher.
I kind of Blended the list based on the criteria of what they accomplished in their time versus who they accomplished it against. Also a little bit of man versus man specifically in his prime if I were to do it just Prime vs Prime Ali would likely be one and Tyson would be much much higher. I do have to say I am favoring those who I generally like a little more as well. Louis and Evander Holyfield being two of my favorites.
Teddy's Top 5 in case you don't have an hour spare:
1. Joe Louis
2. Ali
3. Jack Johnson
4. Rocky Marciano
5. Gene Tunny
E. Lmao!! This guy can pop those chops.
tnx
I've heard him say Henry Armstrong is the greatest as well
@@LUKERs1196 he is not a lone voice .
Time stamps?
Teddy is so enjoyable to listen to. Pure gold.
I’ve always been an Ali fan listening to the radio in the middle of the night in the 70s.Totally respect and accept Teddys analysis the only true world boxing analyst .. the greatest 😀👍
Sam Langfords most notable stat isn’t the 210 wins 126 by knockout.
It’s the fact that he fought successfully as a heavyweight against boxers as large as 6’6 , 260lbs.
He was only 5’6 1/2” tall and 185lbs.
Sam Langford is like the Cleveland Williams of his era.
You also have to mention he started at lightweight fought ATG at every weight up till heavyweights imagine Duran doing that
@@lloydcrooks712 I love Sam Langford a noted uncrowned Heavyweight Champion. A tremendous fighter and skill he had was unmatched for his era.
@@eaglefan941 awesome
Also Sam’s toughness , the man continued fighting with lost of sight to see 👁️
45 rounds, this is why conditioning was a much more significant part of training and why the fighters were smaller. Today Jack Johnson would be fighting at 225 and Jim Jeffries would be 235lbs.
EXACTLY.......I ONCE SPARED 25 ROUNDS......ALMOST DIED.......45 ROUNDS????? I CANNOT IMAGINE!!!
@Ianoodin Jim Jeffries fought at 225 in his prime he was a big strong farm boy.
Then again you had Jim Jeffries and Primo Canera, who is number 1 in KOs for Heavyweight champ at 72 even over Foreman's 68. These were big 6'6, 6'7 guys back then.
@@michaelmohrle1773 Moore had more knockouts
@@renzopeterson153 Aye Archie Moore had over 130. Knockouts but a lot of them were at light heavyweight.He,s also the only man to have fought Rocky Marciano and Ali.
Sometimes, listening to a person who loves a topic so much can be so enjoyable.
Lennox Lewis, needs a mention, he had elite speed and power and along with Holmes had the greatest jab ever. He had a great career, and made all his wins look easy so he doesn't get the credit for being in tough great fights I think Lennox is the most skilled Heavyweight ever, his footwork, his ring IQ, his power, and speed are all elite. I don't think any Heavyweight ever could beat Lennox at his best!
Lewis would have most likely lost to Vitali Klitchscoe if they didnt stop the fight. Lewis lucked out bigtime. He was standing on wobbly legs and saved by the ring doc. Right after the Klitchscoe fight Lewis retired, depriving boxing fans of the rematch. Its no coincidence he retired right then. Klitchschoe had damaged him badly and Lewis felt it for a long time after I'm sure. Lewis is very hard for me to decide where he belongs on best ever lists. A fabulous fighter no doubt. His right hand was death. I disagree about him having elite speed. He was fast, but nothing special. But there are so many greats. I think if Lewis wanted to be remembered as one of the best ever he should have fought another 5 years or so. This is my main problem with him. Many boxers only have losses because they fought into middle age well past their prime. Lewis basically quit while he was ahead. He could have came out of retirement. He didn't have the drive. In my view there are lots of fighters who could have beaten Lewis. Here are a few. George Foreman, Rocky Marciano, Sonny Liston, Cassius Clay, Joe Frazier, Vladiomir Klitchscoe, Jack Dempsey, Larry Holmes, Max Baer, Clevland Williams and Joe Wolcott.
Top 10. Who are his biggest victories ? How many y victories does he have vs top 25 all time fighters ? Lennox had a huge ape index.
@@worstcaseofcrabsever5510 no chance, Vitali was out on his feet at end of round 6 with blood everywhere, he admits that uppercut in round 6 caused the worse cut which was inside his mouth.
I asked Lennox personally which heavyweight in history did he feel would have given him the most trouble and his answer was short and sweet ..... "Holmes".
This old man doesn't like English boxers if Lewis was fighting today this old yank would give him as much discredit as he does Joshua
Love this video. Teddy Atlas has so much heart. He has such a broad range of respect for history and understanding of what these boxers went through. Love your program guys.
You shouldn’t, he called Rocky Marciano the Manasseh mauler 🤦🏼♂️ get the F out!
Great to hear your list, Teddy. It carries a bit more weight knowing that you had access to Jimmy Jacob’s library of vintage fights and have seen a few more fights than the average person. If you provided some education on more pioneering boxers from history for us younger guys, I think some of us would appreciate an episode or two of that too. Thanks!
Just starting video really interested in teddy take I got
1. Joe Louis
2. Muhammad ali
3. Rocky Marciano
4. Lennox Lewis
5. Evander holyfield
Very similar to my list
1. Ali
2. Louis
3. Lewis
4. Johnson
5. Holyfield
I also rank Jack Johnson #3 heavyweight of all time. Many modern sportswriters and analysts neglect to rank Jack Johnson within the top 10 best heavyweights ever. Very nice and accurate inclusion of Johnson, Teddy...
I would rank Sonny Liston as 3rd or 4th & in the same position as Jack Johnson. It will be between those two.
Let us not forget that Max Shmelling when Joe Louis died sent £10,000 to his widow with an apology that he was not at the funeral, that was respect.
Please excuse my spelling of Shmelling.
great posts
Max Schmelling stated he "loved Joe Louis". Schmelling was a great human being and the only fighter to defeat the great Joe Louis when he was at his peak.
It was great how after Joe Louis beat James J Braddock and one of the reporters refered to him as "champ" and Joe told the reporter not to call him that ...not yet ." Not until I beat that man."Louis wouldn't even say his name . "that man." Classic!
No of them not joie Louis none of them are not number one top two none of that they din't fight many elite fighters in they era that they fought against like in the Ali, Lewis, and bowe era, they are still great tho because they were the fight runner up to represent, help create the sports of boxing that has expanded, profited, and became bigger than any event ever since, and louis, Marciano, and them are still in the top ten but not the number one spot or two or three or four..
As much as I respect Teddy's opinion, I have to go with Ali for #1, because, I don't see Joe Louis beating Ali. As for pressure, there's Liston in '64 and Foreman in '74, neither of these fights anyone picked Ali to win, and Ali won both emphatically. To say nothing of his ability to reinvent himself after his forced retirement. In a career that began in 1960, Ali was only stopped in 1980
Why you saying 'I don't see Joe Louis beating Ali' first of all it is not about who beats who. it is about what champion did when he was a champion. Joe Louis beat 3 heavyweight champions before became champ himself . was champion for 12 years ( Joe lost his prime years 42,43,44,45. ) but still managed and was champion for next 3 years.
and i want to say one more thing. Joe was beaten up by Schmeling. this lost was not by lucky shot or something . Max just kick his ass. but imagine . how you would feel when you know that you got to fight a guy who . who was just better than you. and Joe just killed him in first round .with all respect to Ali . he never did that against someone . Frazier beat him and what you see in there last two fights is illegal holding by Ali . and Ken Norton . for me ken won every fight against Ali . if not, still you can not say that Ali figured out Frazier or Norton . so I would say Louis is better than Ali.
and one more thing Joe Louis was far better than sonny and George .
@@dankemo3169 Nobody was far better than Sonny Liston and George Foreman. They are easily up there with the greatest of all time. Foreman is self-explanatory if you just look at his career.
Liston you have to look deeper to understand. He was never given a fair shake in his life and only got a chance at the title because Patterson was a real gentleman and thought he deserved it. Liston was probably years older than it was reported and already out of his prime when he fought the greatest and he could have even beaten Ali in the rematch if he wasn't forced to throw the fight.
The RUclips video Sonny Liston way down we go does a great job of quickly summarising his greatness.
@@sakketin Sonny greatest of all time? . i mean what are saying man ? guy beat 182 lb champion and than retain title against him and that is all what he did . was champion for 1 year . and you call greatest ? 50s were one of the worsets years for heavyweight boxing . Joe Louis was a man in one of the greatest years of heavyweight boxing . but about George you are right . George beat man who was unbeaten my favorite boxer Joe Frazier. 215 lb full of muscle man . and Ken Norton . buy Joe Louis is another level. Joe is better than George and far far far better than sonny.
Ali beat the best heavyweights of All times...
He is the greatest
@@alover466, You have more medication than you should.
Love this list and it's hard to disagree with anyone on there. I had 4 out of 5, with Lewis over Tunney.
I don't think Lewis gets enough credit for what he accomplished. His resume is one of the greatest in history - which is amazing considering how many belts there are, which allowed a lot of ducking. He beat everyone he faced in the ring and didn't duck anyone.
Got Lewis at 2 possibly even 1 behind Ali due to his size , I see him beating everyone on teddy list ,if he had his aggressive head on like wha
When he fought ruddock and golota
Think forman stops most of these guys as well ,teddy needs to stop looking through those rose tinted spectacles
Teddy will hardly ever mention Lewis if he can avoid it. I like Teddy in many respects but he definately has an issue with Lewis that makes me suspect it's personal to a degree.
Good call on Lewis. One of the best ever.
Teddy is praising Louis and his trainers relationship as the greatest bond in boxing history, when he himself saw cus damato transform mike Tyson from a scared and broken child into the most viscous boxer to lace up the gloves.
But Louis did it in the 1930’s dominated so long he was so ahead of his time... The context can make you’re legacy greater
Tyson was not the most vicious boxer, not by a long way.
Tyson was cool but he himself will say he shouldn’t be talked of in the same breath of these boxers. Tyson never showed his heart, he never had big fights that push you all the way , he never beat anyone great and he wasn’t at the top for long. He was no where near the most vicious lol
@@dondamon4669
Tyson was the most feared heavyweight since Sonny Liston.
He showed his heart enough, he just went downhill after he was on the top of the world (unified heavyweight champion knocking out lineal champion Mike Spinks in one round).
@@dondamon4669 it’s easy ti say all this now. Context is a big thing like one of the other dingbats said. Mike was nothing and became the most feared man on the planet, at the time. Whether or not he’s stuck to that is neither here nor there. But cus brought something out of mike no one else could. Greatest trainer fighter duo ever.
We Love you Teddy, you have a legion of Boxing fans that respect you as the Godfather of Boxing. The realest left.
Teddy paints pictures with his words. And he is so passionate about boxing it's beautiful
Amen
I Love this Intro, Teddy. It's the kind of Prelude and Disclaimer that I favor giving. Explanations are beautiful.
My top 5 Heavyweights of All-Time:
1. Ali
2. Tyson
3. Foreman
4. Louis
5. Holyfield
This is in no particular order but these 5 HW champs had it all in every way!! Some had power, others had speed, others great defense!! These are the great arc to strap on gloves and enter the squared circle imo.
Good names but find it hard to see Tyson being that high he was pretty poor most of his career and lost all of his big fights by wide margins.
Tyson? Clown
DAREALMAC POWER so if Tyson is a clown what is every other boxer who he would dominate be called a “Loser” lol 😂
@@ohiovalleyminiaturefootbal8100 considering Tyson never beat anyone of note, the only two HOF boxers he beat were a 38 year old,almost two years retired Larry Holmes and a pumped up Light Heavyweight who only had 5 Heavyweight fights in his whole career Michael Spinks.
@@AllUAreIsHistory you talk some bollox
Top 5 heavyweights
Ali all day long
Joe Louis
Rocky Marciano
Jack Johnson.
Mike Tyson
You would have to put Joe Frazier Jack Dempsey Jean Tony Jersey Joe Henry Armstrong Max Baer Evander Holyfield George Foreman. hard to pick a top 5 but it has to be Ali all day long has Mike Tyson said Ali was willing to die in The Ring that left hook he got off Joe Frazier would have knocked anybody clean out especially after going 14 rounds but Ali got up in 3 seconds that's why he is the greatest any fighter would have taken the 8 count
Jim Jeffries was stopped in the 15th round against Jack Johnson. The fight was scheduled for 45 rounds. Great video Teddy !!!
not only was Jeffries retired for 6 years, but I believe he had to lose 100 lbs for the fight. Probably a few tune up fights would have helped as well. Pretty amazing effort IMO
Jack johnson was a pretty trash fighter. He just pushed around guys who were smaller than him, once he faced a big guy (jess willard) he got flattened.
@@3ncore706 Johnson was pushing 40 and had a beer gut by the time he fought Willard. Still went 25 rounds. Peak Johnson wins easy.
@@louis-i5f
And what is your evidence for this? Jim jeffries was also nearly forty and coming out of retirement when johnson beat him but people bring it up like its a great win for johnson somehow.
@@3ncore706 Jeffries was 35. Johnson challenged Jeffries in 1903-1904. Jeffries stated he would not be fighting a Negro fighter. He drew color line . He was forced to fight Johnson . Johnson made him pay for drawing color line. It was all Jeffries fault . He denied Johnson and Johnson made him pay for its Stoop trying to rewrite history. You're talking to the wrong person.
I love Teddy but Gene Tunney as the 5th best Heavyweight of all time is ridiculous. The guy was a Light Heavyweight most of his career.
Gene Tunney also got knocked down by Dempsey in their 2nd fight but the ref's " the long count" gave him time to recover. Otherwise Dempsey would've won back the title, even though he was well out of his prime
What was his actual top 5
Tunney won 19 out of 20 against Dempsey, that alone shows he deserves to be up there. And yeah Dempsey knocked Tunney down in the 7th in the second fight but Tunney knocked Dempsey down in the next round! I think for me Tunney is definitely one of the greatest pound for pound but his achievements isolated at heavyweight were perhaps limited. I'd have him in the top 10 or 15 strictly at heavyweight.
@@patrickryce1225 Agreed . Tunney was ahead of his time . He fought in a controlled , disciplined fashion and would adapt and adjust his style and strategy in accordance to whomever he was fighting . Great boxer .
Big boy. Tunney was a pioneer.
That Marciano VS Wallcott 1 KO was frightening and beautiful at the same time
SMOKIN’ Joe Frazier & Muhammad Ali are the Greatest heavyweights OF ALL TIIIMES!
ruclips.net/video/vxs72M2P1tk/видео.html
That picture of Walcott's face after Marciano hit him is some site
@The One Marciano would hit you with anything he could.
Wallcott left hook against Charles was chilling.
He couldn't do nothing with ted lowery
I may be wrong about this but there was a very old heavyweight boxer named John L. Sullivan, who in the 1880s fought an 84 round fight against an opponnent (the name i dont remember)and won.
8 4 R O U N D S
Sullivan was the first ever World Heavyweight Champion!
Ali has to be 1 . Lennox Lewis is 2. Larry Holmes is 3. Joe Louis is 4. George Foreman is 5. That's it that's the list !!!
Not a terrible list.
I think a prime Lennox Lewis beats them all
Glad to hear Gentleman Jim Corbett get some love. He was the earliest prototype (based on any footage I've seen) of the modern, mobile boxer.
I don't think his reputation as an innovator is deserved. He was just had very good reflexes.
Guys like Tom Sayers, or Jem Mace were doing similar stuff years before. Check out Billy Edwards, the earliest we have on film. An old bareknuckle Lightweight.
Just off the top of my head before even watching any of this: Ali, Frazer, Rocky Marciano, Joe Lewis, Tyson.
@The One Off the top of my head means who ever comes to mind at the time. Foremen is up there too for sure.
have to put Foreman, Holmes, Lewis ahead if Frazier
@@mgoogleuser8011 Not for me.
@UdaM30Bitch Haha yeah right, you gotta take your hate for his personal life and separate it from his boxing skills. He was one of the best period.
@UdaM30Bitch Haha don't deflect just cause you were called out on the truth. Its pretty rare Tyson not being on anyone's top HW's list and its usually hate for him that skews their opinion of him.
Teddy Atlas is truly a genius
No he's not, Isaac Newton is a genius.
Thank you Teddy! Glad to see a guy with teddy's credentials saying the brown bomber is the goat. You don't reign over a division for 12 years without being someone special. Plus he fought some good competition and ex champions in his career. He avenged 2 of his 3 losses and probably wouldn't have lost to Marciano if he was younger. The only reason he took the fight is because he needed money because he was screwed out of his money by so many people including the irs.
My list:
1. Joe Louis
2. Rocky Marciano
3. Muhammad Ali
4. George Foreman
5. Gene Tunney
Honorable mention for Jack Johnson and Larry Holmes
I've ALWAYS respected Teddy as a knowledgeable man in boxing, but after hearing him talk about Louis, Ali AND Jack Johnson, I have to consider him one of the best boxing minds and historians of the sweet science, period!👍✊
Amen.
Teddy’s list;
1. Joe Louis
2. Muhammad Ali
3. Jack Johnson
4. Rocky Marciano
5. Gene Tunney
(Bonus - 6. Jack Dempsey, 7. Jim Jeffereis)
My list;
1. Jack Johnson
2. Muhammad Ali
3. Joe Louis
4. Rocky Marciano
5. Sam Langford
(Imo if Mike Tyson had Cus D. around for another ten years he would be the goat. Also think that Tyson Fury will be top 5 after career is over. 6ft9, 270 lbs with God level Boxing IQ would be too much for even the greats.)
WHERE’S SMOKIN’ JOE?
I DON’T SEE SMOKIN’ JOE
I don't always agree with Teddy, but I respect his knowledge as a historian in boxing.
1: Joe Louis
2: Muhammad Ali
3: George Foreman
4: Lennox Lewis
5: Rocky Marciano or Tyson Fury (if he beats Wilder and Joshua)
1. Andrew Golota
Teddy. I really think, and a physicist could confirm this, that part of Marciano’s power came from his perceived deficit, his short arms. I think it increased his torque. I think this might explain how he tore people up inside.
I also think his physical engine was greater than others, like Secretariat had a bigger heart. That can’t b confirmed though.
However his fighter’s heart was gigantic! Sooo underrated. Can be settled only in Boxer’s Heaven.
Noone gives Rocky his due because he's white let's be honest, teddy put Louis at number 1 and Rocky beat him, he's to into the virtue signaling for me
@@marsicogodofwar9280 He did, but Louis was well past it by then. I think Rocky’s better, but that fight doesn’t tell us much.
@@marsicogodofwar9280 that win is irrelevant though
@@marsicogodofwar9280 definitely not virtue signaling
i would put rocky as second or third but not above joe louis. prime joe louis wouldve smoked him
is short arms. I think it increased his torque - BRO science for life !!!
If I remember correctly I believe Sam Langford told Joe Louis' trainer and former fighter Jack Blackburn (who Teddy mentions) to "pack a lunch" before their rematch and got in his head before the fight. Based on the Joe Louis movie, The Joe Louis Story.
Not all but a good amount of the top 20 best heavyweights could beat each other on any given day that's what intrigues us about heavyweight boxing 🥊
#1- Lennox Lewis
#2- Rocky Maricano
#3 Muhammed Ali
#4 Jack Dempsey
#5 tie. Smokin joe fraizer and big george foreman
TEDDY'S CHOICES
1st - Joe Louis
2nd - Muhammad Ali
3rd - Jack Johnson
4th - Rocky Marciano
5th - Gene Tunney
MY CHOICES
1st - Joe Louis
2nd - Muhammad Ali
3rd - Larry Holmes
4th - Lennox Lewis
5th - Jack Johnson
I could listen to Teddy talk boxing all day long, so knowledgeable, his autobiography is a great read! 😁
1) Ali
2) Louis
3) Foreman
4) Holmes
5) Lewis
6) Holyfield
7) Frazier
8) Liston
9) Tyson
10) Wlad
I have Johnson and Marciano in the 12-15th bracket.
Having Liston above Tyson is a little weird.
@@Priceluked Based on what? Liston runs a train wreck on Tyson.
@@dsrfc2565 Are you saying by your list that Ali beats everyone below him? Because even if Liston beats Tyson which is a big maybe there's no way Liston's accomplishments put him above Tyson. He never defended the title when he won it from Patterson.
@@Priceluked Absolutely Ali beats everyone below him. Wins over Liston, Frazier and Foreman is the greatest résumé in HW history. My list is not just based on résumé, but eye test. Tyson’s best win was against a shot to bits Larry Holmes. Holyfield stood up to the bully and wasn’t intimidated by him, Liston was cut from the same cloth.
@@dsrfc2565 Nah well then that's just your list of personal favorites nowhere near an accurate list. Also no way in hell Ali beats prime Holmes or Lewis. The rest are debatable about whether prime Ali wins.
How about doing a top 5 trainers of all time? Some great characters and innovators down the years.... it would be interesting to hear teddy's take on that side of boxing.
Emauel the kronk
Did this happen? Would love to hear Teddy talk about the best 5 trainers!
Loved this! Would love to hear teddy’s favorite middleweights
Sugar RAY ROBINSON all day long.
@@ciarahall5402 yep
Awesome!!! Thanks Teddy for ur great comments, your lists, and your stories.
1. Ali
2. Louis
3.J Johnson
4.Marciano
5.Dempsey
ruclips.net/video/vxs72M2P1tk/видео.html
@S Day Joe was way past his prime
@S Day Prime Joe Louis picks him apart.
@@Ivan-rl9mk for sure. But rocky was the hardest hitter he ever fought, by his own words. Louis is my favorite fighter, but I would never count marciano out
S Day Joe was way past his prime and needed the money for his tax bill and Rocky was the best conditioned heavyweight possibly of all time he would of been 200lbs + if he didn’t do as much cardio but his style needed him to be able to throw bombs for 15 rounds
I've replayed this with relish at least 5 times now. It'd be nice to see Teddy do a best of Trainers. I'd include him personally. Perhaps the best. Certainly the GOAT commentator on sports and boxing historian.
1.joe Louis
2.joe Louis
3.joe Louis
4.joe Louis
5.joe Louis
6. Smokin’ Joe Frazier
7. Smokin’ Joe Frazier
8. Smokin’ Joe Frazier
9. Ali
10. Ali
1)Charlie Zelenoff
2)Charlie Zelenoff
3)Charlie Zelenoff
4)Charlie Zelenoff
5)Charlie Zelenoff
He was #2 or #2 at best
A love Letter to Ali👍 i Like how he praises all aspects of Ali as a human being not only as a boxer
Actually, I would put Louis and Ali one, two just like Teddy. I put Dempsey and Tyson (very similar fighters) 3 and 4. Dempsey did not defend his title often enough through no fault of his own. Jack was a relentless puncher with devastating power. Lastly, George Foreman.
My Top 5:
Ali - Joe Louis - Tyson - Marciano - Jack Johnson
Tyson is not top 20
@@darealmacpower5702 He'd be in my top 20,but the mere fact he has no notable wins,faced only the two of the best of his era,lost to them and avoided the rest,he definitely isn't in my top 10.
It's a good One bro. Mine, Ali 1, Louis 2, Foreman 3, Lewis 4, Marciano 5
@@darealmacpower5702 wtf do people get so upset about other people's opinions on Mike Tyson? Get real. He's easily top ten even if you don't like it.
@@AllUAreIsHistory talking absolute poop
It's really hard for me to rate a fighter in the top-5 unless they were able to demonstrate some level of dominance after their prime -- when their skills started to fade. Some of the most impressive heavyweights during their prime (e.g., Tyson, Liston, Patterson, Marciano) never did this. My list: 1) Ali, 2) Louis, 3) Holmes, 4) Foreman, 5) Lewis.
Good list, I'd have Lewis 1 or 2, maybe I'm bias as he was my generation.
I absolutely agree about fighters being able to last and win outside of their prime. This shows true ring mastery.
Good list.
@ kafkaOTS, excellent list, hard to disagree with it!
Good list...but if you rate them on dominance AFTER their prime then Big George Foreman would have to be number one.
This is only if they fought in their peak.
1. Ali
2. Foreman
3. Iron Mike
4. Joe Louis
5. Riddick Bowe
Ruddick fuckin Bowe
@boxing fan uk yet you dont mention tyson who was beaten by a soup can at age 23 and couldnt beat anyone of note after that . bowe at least BEAT evander, tyson couldnt
@boxing fan uk he lost to tucker he got beat by jesse ferguson and ate himself out of contention he was a mixed bag who had a good fight against tyson but some awful fights as well
@boxing fan uk He beat Holyfield twice.
@boxing fan uk Yeah but when he fought Vitali he's lucky that the fight got stopped for blood because it didn't look like he was winning that.
Teddy Atlas always has interesting things to say. He seems to respect and love what does.
Top ten in no particular order
Muhammad Ali
Joe Louis
Larry Holmes
Wladimir Klitchko
George foreman
Evander Holyfield
Rocky Marciano
Sonny Liston
Lennox Lewis
Mike Tyson
Lol...
Liston? Top 10?
Me personally, in order,
Joe Louis
Cassius clay/m. Ali
Rocky Marc
Gene Tunney
Lennox Lewis
George foreman
Jack Johnson
Evander holyfield
Mike Tyson
Larry Holmes,
I personally think people over exaggerate Holmes being past his prime against jinks spinks and Tyson, after his Tyson loss he went on a win streak against top competition ending with a close competitive fight against holyfield. Michael spinx was a PHENOMINAL FIGHTER Tyson was not necessarily a bad style matchup for him but too big for spinx's style. He's basically a smaller version of lennox and therefore not strong or long enough to hold Tyson at Bay. And "PRIME LARRY HOLMES" robbed Ken Norton twice. As well as should've been tko'd after literally running for ten rounds to recover from shavers knockdown. Being technical is one thing, he RAN from earlier for ten rounds till he got his marbles back
When you said Joe Louis it brought tears to my eyes....You nailed it! He held the title for 12 years! He defended his title 25 times! His record would be even greater if WW 2 had not derailed his reign...Thank you Mr. Atlas. No one is on your level when it comes to boxing.
1- Joe Louis
2- Rocky Marciano
3- Mohammed Ali
4- Jack Johnson
5- George Foreman
Liston has to go somewhere in there
And also jack Dempsey
My top 5 with regards to most accomplished careers: 1. Ali 2. Louis 3. Holyfield 4. Dempsey 5. Marciano My top 5 with regards to dominance in their prime: 1. Tyson 2. Ali 3. Foreman 4. Louis 5. Liston
You raise the interesting point that depending on your criteria depends who you chose.
Well set out. I believe a top 10 should come down to did they beat the best of their era and did they overcome adversity. Everything else is subjective and hypothetical with regards to who beats who.
No Marciano in your dominance list who actually dominated his era with a undefeated rec of 49-0, taking out all top contenders/contestants available at the time?
Jack Johnson? Wow..
@S Day yes, Joe was 126 years old. Your point?
Liston never fought in his physical prime, think on that
I just found this on the net about Max Schmelling “ In later years it was revealed that Schmeling had sheltered two Jewish boys in his Berlin apartment during the Kristallnacht pogrom of November 9-10, 1938. Schmeling served as a paratrooper in the German army during World War II and was injured during the invasion of Crete in 1941. “
You Gentlemen hit the dead center every time! Keep the Great Stuff coming!🥊NOLA❤️
0:00 louis
11:20 Ali
24:54 Johnson
28:20 Rocky M
33:52 gene tunney
How Tunney can be in Top 5 if he only had few fights as a Heavyweight? The only good Heavyweight he beat was Dempsey who didnt fight for 3 years. He was so out of shape he couldnt go more than 10 rounds. It shouldnt even be considered a title fight.
SMOKIN’ Joe Frazier & Muhammad Ali are the Greatest heavyweights OF ALL TIIIMES!
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@John Bistis.... Tyson was, at best, the third best boxer of his era. The only way he makes it into a top 5 all time list is if it is judged on excitement or cultural impact.
@Alvalanker Buster Douglas. Tyson also ducked Holyfield between 1988 and 1991. Top 5? No way.
Many decades ago, a book came out about the greatest track and field athletes of all time, and the author applied a particular criteria when choosing who to put in the book. 1) Win an Olympic title 2 ) Break world records 3 ) Have an aura of invincibility about them. Well, applying/adapting that to heavyweight boxers, Joe Louis comes out on top. 1) Win the world title 2) Youngest champion ( at the time), longest reign and huge unbeaten period 3 ) Invincibility. Well, Joe, for most of his career, entered the ring as a huge favourite. Now, if we apply the criteria to Ali, he comes up short on the " aura of invincibility" criteria 1) He was a huge underdog when he challenged Liston for the title, and he was also an big underdog when he challenged Big George for the title, and in many fights the odds were 50/50. Longevity is another criteria that Joe Louis had, unlike Iron Mike who does tick a lot of boxes. 1 ) Youngest champ and, in the early years, a huge aura of invincibility, but his career at the top was too brief to list him towards the top of any "greatest" list. What, about Rocky? Well, again he fails with the " aura of invincibility" criteria as he was the underdog in a number of his big fights. No, Joe ticks all the boxes and then some.
Tyson never beat anyone great though he always lost and he never had a great fight and went through any wars. Was to weak minded
@@dondamon4669 Jack Dempsey, Joe Louis and Rocky Marciano never beat any "greats" although, like Tyson with Holmes, Rocky did beat a washed up Joe Louis, but this doesn't stop Jack, Joe and Rocky being rated as true greats
Teddy Atlas misspoke there when he said "The Rock, The Manassa Mauler". Of course, the "Mauler" was Jack Dempsey. Great list though. I would not have ranked Johnson top five, but hey ... it's fun to compare these legends. Always had a soft spot for Ezzard Charles and would have rated him, together with Big George Foreman.
He corrected himself towards the end when he was talking about Tunney vs Dempsey 2
Johnson had the whole world against him. I don't know about you, but I was nervous as hell, and about to piss my pants when I got Married!!!
There is not any other actual boxing voice I would want to hear annunciate the best heavy weights in the perfect regional accent. Perfect!
My top five. #5 Exum Speight #4 TRex Corey Sanders. #3 Waxxem Fikes #2 Tommy Morrison #1 Tim Tomashek.
What cements Ali as the greatest of all time was his win over a prime shavers, and his comeback win against spinks. In thoae fights he already had severe Parkinson's disease.
Exactly. He was so experienced and game in those days
SO GLAD YOU GUYS MENTIONED THE 45 ROUNDSSSSSSSSSS! THAT ALONE SHOWS THE TOUGHNESS AND TRUE POTENTIAL OF MAN!
ali, dempsey, lewis, fury, tyson. - wrote those at the start of the pod and think i can still justify it.
Tyson Fury and Mike Tyson in a top 5 is ridiculous. Tyson had a short prime and lost most of the big fights in the later half of his career. He was a bolt of lightning to the sport, but that doesn't make him a top 5. You can make a case for top 10. Tyson Fury has one win vs an all time great in Klitschko and one win vs the other best guy of his generation, Deontay Wilder. If he beats Joshua and dominates the division we can maybe make a case for top 10 in a few years but he's in his 30's and likely just doesn't have enough career left over to put together a top 5 resume. Great fighters but there's just not enough there to put them above other guys who deserve it more.
@@esunsalmista i would place fury in top 5 heavyweights if he beats joshua ( which i think he will ) considering all he´ve been through getting fat almost taking suicide etc and then come back better than ever on top of that if he beats joshua he will probably go down as the only undefeated heavyweight ever alongside marciano ( but with better resume )
Lmao fury top 5 😂
Thanks for the Tunney discussion!
Jack Blackburn fought both Sam Langford and Harry Greb. He was a great fighter and trainer.
Fought Langford and Greb, trained Joe Louis. I struggle to think of a resume in the fight game to beat that.
I think that when doing top fighters of all-time in any weight class, it must be split into two, if not three different eras b/c boxing was so different on so many levels. Gene Tunney, for example - the man never fought a Black fighter. Whether b/c of racism, ducking/dodging, snobbery, etc. he avoided George Godfrey and Harry Wills. And how can one compare Jack Johnson with Evander Holyfield? Or Joe Louis with Tyson Fury, a guy who the eye test says he could maybe beat any guy in history, but whose resume is very thin and Louis fought more times in a couple months than Fury does in 3-4 years.
1.ROCKY
2.ROCKY 2
3.ROCKY 3
4.ROCKY 4
5.ROCKY BALBOA
The irony is it was Jack Dempsey that brought in those rules
Love me some Teddy Atlas. Don't watch much boxing these days, but love to check out old school fights.
*Are we scoring popularity and hype, because if that's the case then Tyson and Ali win easily. Everyone knows that athletes eventually improve over time. But let's instead judge them by how good they were FOR THEIR ERA - rather than who would win a fantasy fight:*
*1.* Lennox
*2.* Ali
After that I get stuck.. and it's easily debatable. lol
Lennox copped Ali dummy
The correct order would be.......
1. Ali
2. Louis*
3. Tyson
4. Holmes
5. Marciano
6. Johnson or (Sam Langford)
7. Forman
8. Lewis
9. Holyfield
10. Frazier or (Jack Dempsey)
and the * means they arguably could be number 1.
I find it interesting that the latest Heavyweight to be on Teddy's list is Ali. He clearly has a thing for the old fighters (which isn't necessarily a bad thing). But no one in the last 40 years? If there was to be any in the last 40 years to be in the top 5, for me Larry Holmes, Lennox Lewis, Mike Tyson, Evander Holyfield and Wladimir Klitschko would be the only ones people could consider. Vitali, Bowe just missing out on the consideration list. Personally the only ones I'd seriously consider though is Holmes & Lennox.
Of today's 3 Fury, Wilder, Joshua. I'd want to judge them further down the line, although I think Tyson Fury in the next 10 years has the potential to be an all time great. Time will tell.
leenox lewis is definitely top 5. he was an amazing innovator in an age of innovation!
SMOKIN’ Joe Frazier & Muhammad Ali are the Greatest heavyweights OF ALL TIIIMES!
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Legend of Awww Sheeet that’s why I said Fury over the next 10 years is the only one of today who may stand a chance. His legacy is not complete. I’ll reserve judgement.
Chess is a great example of recorded history of matches. Every single move is recorded in a competitive match. Imagine being able to know every punch and slip and footwork in a boxing match. That'll really put perspective on the skill
Always love listening to Teddy’s lists. I’d have to throw Holyfield in my top 5. I like his top 4, just switch 1&2 around.
Na 1&2 fine how it is
Alistair henshall Holyfield used PEDs
@@therumbleinthejunglee Ali was clearly better than Louis
@@christiansoldier77 based off what your imagination lmao
@@therumbleinthejunglee Based off of their skill set and who they fought. Louis fought a bunch of bums. Ali fought the greatest group of heavyweights ever.
I'd rather listen to Teddy commentating ANY sport than the ex pros and network lackies. He understands the essence of sports and he describes things so beautifully, brings it all to life and relates it to life. He'd be incredible commentating on skiing.. literally any sport. Terrific human being and professional working the golden seam he understands so well.
Why nobody is mentioning lennox Lewis in this debate is beyond me!
Who did he beat from the top 25 ? Help me out. Tyson and Holyfield right ? So 2 and 0 ? Ali was 9 and 3 vs top 25 for perspective. Foreman 3 and 1, Tyson 1 and 3. Lewis is top 6 to 12 not 5.
@@DoggieNYCYeah well sugar ray rob was even better. He’s the goat
@@DoggieNYCPound for pound
He got lazy sometimes and didnt beat a lot of famers
Genuine question. Which great fighters did Joe Louis and Jack Johnson beat?
Joe Louis beat heavyweight champions: Jack Sharkey, Max Schmeling, Primo Carnera, Max Baer, Jimmy Braddock, and Joe Walcott (once by controversial decision & once by knockout); lightheavyweight great Billy Conn; and all the top contenders of his day. Although few would be considered all time greats, his record reign of 12 years and 25 consecutive defenses are records that will probably never be broken. He would have had many more title defenses if WW2 didn't happen.
It's also hard to find a better puncher than Louis. He has the best highlight reel knockouts with people doing 360s on the way down, bouncing off the canvas, and going completely stiff and falling. They were given a 10 count, no TKOs. Every now and then you see that type of knockout, but most of his opponents went out that way. The only fighter I can think of who has those type of great knockouts is Julian Jackson at middleweight.
Joe Louis was awesome! :)
@@Cisco_Budge Yes he was & the best puncher of all time!!!!!!!!! All angles. Holyfield must have watched Joe's films often.
Ali had Tunney on his top heavyweight list he also spoke highly of Marciano.
Larry Holmes should be in the conversation, that jab was something else
Gene Tunney?? Dempsey deserves that spot. My reasons why Tunney shouldn't be on that list of Heavyweights...
He fought the vast majority of his fights against middleweights or light heavyweights.
Tunney was at his best at light heavyweight, where, if he was ranked in that class, he would rank in the top 5 all time; indeed, Mike Spinks had almost twice the title fights at heavyweight than Tunney!
There is conflicting information on his willingness to fight Number One contender Harry Wills because he was Black, but additionally because Tunney feared losing a Dempsey title shot, with differing accounts, the truth may never be known;
His fame as a heavyweight lies solely in defeating the Great Jack Dempsey, when, in fact, Dempsey had not fought in 3 years, and had gone 5 of the 7 years of his reign without fighting; Dempsey was shot;
He had only two defenses, one against Dempsey, and the other,instead of fighting then #1 contender Jack Sharkey, he instead fought Tom Heeney, a limited fighter who he knew he could beat, then he retired.
Tunney was also a shot fighter when he fought Dempsey. Tom Heeney had just beaten the great Jack Delaney.
Neither of the two deserves to be in the top 5 imo
Dempsey barely fought as champion and refused to fight black fighters (some of the best at that time)
Tunney barely fought at heavyweight...
@@husain4718 Tunney was far from shot shot. He TKOed Heeney after Dempsey.
Tunney was passing his peak but still in the game so to speak. In fact, he could've continued fighting after Dempsey/Heeney but he chose to retire before he could establish his own legacy at Heavyweight beyond Dempsey, and the result left the heavyweight title vacant for two years.
Had Tunney continued fighting, even for another year, taking on Sharkey and possibly Schmeling, there might have been an actual Tunney-era to reflect on.
Interesting Pick... Important to include fighters from different eras.
Well, Ali is always my favorite.
He was flawed, yes.
He didn’t go to the body.
He left his hands down,
He pulled back... etc
But still
The greatest, look at what he did in the history of boxing,
And he had an amazing chin, and mind.
Until his Frazier fights. Those three left him brain damafed
Damaged
Exactly
Joe louis better
@@drowna1584 There are plenty of hws that would beat Joe Luis with ease, but Joe is the 2nd greatest hw after Ali
Brilliant pod cast increadiblly insightful.educational and informative
I like Teddy's list. Maybe George Foreman was as good a finisher as Joe Louis.
Ali made wrong right until he lost his speed and since he did not have traditional boxing skill and he became a punching bag and wrecked his brain. Did anyone ever see Ali throw a body punch? Teddy Brenner said it best. Ali couldn’t box and he couldn’t punch but he sure could fight.
Wow 45 rounds amazing 👊
Top 5 heavyweights
1. Muhammad Ali
2. Joe Louis
3. George Foreman
4. Jack Johnson
5. Rocky Marciano
Muhammad Ali is the greatest because he's the only 3 time lineal heavyweight champion ever. His will to win is unmatched. He was also idolized by many because of his bravery to stand up for what he believes in. He could will himself against any opponent in and out of the ring.
Joe Louis was America's hero. He defended the heavyweight title a record of 25 times. He won against champions like Jack Sharkey, Primo Carnera, Max Baer, and Jim Braddock. He was also a part of the greatest sporting event ever when he won against Max Schmeling in their second bout.
George Foreman became the oldest heavyweight champion ever at the age of 45. He made the greatest comeback in sports history when he regained back the title 20 years after he lost it. He also never got knocked down during his comeback.
Jack Johnson is the greatest heavyweight of his era. He won against champions like Bob Fitzsimmons, Tommy Burns, and James J Jeffries. He influenced people like Muhammad Ali to stand up for oneself.
Rocky Marciano has an undefeated record. He fought the likes of the great Archie Moore, Ezzard Charles, and Jersey Joe Walcott. He would've been great in any era.
I don't get all the hype around Johnson, Tommy burns was 5'7 168lb and Johnson was 6'0 196lb, he beat a 44 year old bob fitzsimmons, james j jefferies had to lose 110lb to fight jack johnson which took a toll on him
In the old days men were tougher. Life was tougher. Modern fighters might look bigger and stronger but that’s it. They don’t hit harder nor take same punishment. Endurance is out of the question. Teddy knows what he’s talking about and his ranking is accurate.
Rocky Marciano, Muhammad Ali, Mike Tyson, Lennox Lewis and Tyson Fury
Joe Louis is hands-down the greatest boxer of all time 💯
In his time. But I can't see him beating Ali, Holmes, Foreman, Frazier Young, Liston, a prime Marcianno. Or other fighters in other eras.
I do believe he was the greatest puncher in terms of combinations, finishing them off.
Teddy rlly right when talkin bout how it’s horrible keepin boxing records in history cuz I gotta look deep in the internet to find jus articles bout fighters before 1970 so it’s always good to hear him speak bout fighters id never have been able to learn bout (2003 born)
Louis knocked out more than one big HW
Top 5
Ali
Louis
Lewis
Holmes
Liston
Langford Marciano foreman all deserve a mention
Homes is a rat
Top 10
1.Muhammed Ali
2.George Foreman
3.Sonny Liston
4.Lennox Lewis
5.Mike Tyson
6.Joe Louis
7.Joe Frazier
8.Larry Holmes
9.Riddick Bowe
10.Evander Holyfield