Spain and England got mogged by Germany. I wanna see Henderson model x 3 its polands turn. Mojaxx can you lend him one or contact the lads to send one to him ?
It’s the vca fader that make my nuo 2.0 sound warm. Wow I dunno how I feel about that but I know it’s good for a dj to know why he likes or dislikes some mixers
this is awesome! honest, real and backed up by real measurements. we need this is a world where there are a lot of BS opinions flying around. THANKS!!!
Nice comparison. I hear a lot of people saying Warm 2 was a cash grab and they just threw knobs on a Nuo but it seems there is a bit more to it than that. I’m not surprised they kept much of the Nuo design. For future content have you considered crowdfunding? Maybe this could also prioritize which mixers go under the microscope first. As a bonus if the mixers are in working order they could be raffled off to fund more mixers. Love your content so far.
Crowdfunding could enable me to purchase, let's say, one high quality mixer? Only a substantial amount of money would truly make a difference in this situation. I also don't believe that companies would cooperate with me because they likely have no interest in revealing the internal components of their mixers (unless they truly believe in the quality of what they have created). I need to borrow the mixers from people! I already do, but my friends don't own every mixer. If you want to support the channel there is a link in the video description to do this. It could allow me to invest in better recording gear or lighting to enhance the quality of the videos. However, the mixers itself are simply too expensive. I hope this makes sense to you.
Excellent work! Subscribed after watching every video. The work you put in to this is great. Easily accessible to the non electrical engineers like me. I have the Ecler 3.0 and appreciate the mixer more and more over time. Looking forward to your upcoming work. Thank you!
Hope you will keep this channel up and running for a long time! This is what we needed and nobody was doing it. Hopefully you will be able to do more rotary mixers in the future because it would help a lot of people decide if spending 2000 usd+ on a mixer is worth it or not! Cheers❤
Long term future of this channel lays in the hands of followers/community. Going on alone without your support will be impossible. Thank you for the kind words, cheers!
Exceptional work, thank you! I was just wondering last week whether anyone would compare these two, and here we are. Really enjoying these detailed breakdowns on your channel.
Love this channel. Every time I see a new upload I drop everything and watch it! Keep it up. Someone get this man a xone 96 to open up and look inside asap!! ;-)
Brilliant comparison here! I like that you've gone for this one as Ecler is a great brand delivering bang-for-buck across the board: sound quality, ergonomics, design, features, durability.. just solid products. It's at that perfect mid-tier price point that a lot of people can get in to. They're reliable and have a good enough sound quality that you can happily record a mix on them, stream with or set up 'em at a small party or bar and be quite satisfied. I've had A&H Xone:32, :42 & :62 and after selling the last one (the :42) i got a B-stock Nuo 3.0 as i was saving up for a :92. I ended up keeping the Nuo 3.0 as it's just a great mixer with excellent sound, feels good and those fader + xfader shape controls.. ooh.. love it!
@@mixersinside Actually, i've got to say you're right looking at the price of mixers currently. Nuo 2.0 is a deal at around 400 euro, though Warm2 in comparison is a real pricey. Omnitronic, even Allen & Heath seem to do better.. 777 euro for a Xone:43 on Thomann compared to 666 for the Warm2 makes me wonder.. I suppose Ecler looked at the rotary market and figured the rotary loving cats may skip Omni' and need a step between those and the MasterSounds Radius 2.
Thank you so much for the videos, you popped the Ballon of HQ analog gear. Especially the phono stage and headphone amp (the last one I knew). It’s not nice to see all these standard op-amp chips. But it makes me wonder regarding other brands. Like Play differently and Master sounds.
I think something interesting you didn't mention was the trimpots just next to the XLR output. I guess they balance the output for each unit at EOL testing to make sure all component uncertainties are evened out. And as warm 2 also has it, it seems to important
Please can you do a comparison video of the A&H Xone 23C and the Pioneer DJM 250Mk2? As you probably know, these are the affordable, entry level mixers from these two big names. Similar price, similar features. People often talk about Pioneer supposedly having bad implementation of the RIAA curve in their phono preamps, whilst A&H are said have a good preamps. I'd love to see a video that digs into this and really shows the difference between the two
Very good idea thanks. But i have the same problem as always: i don't have access to this gear. Maybe i will figure something out, should be quite easy to get them.
@@mixersinside How can we support you? Do you have a patreon or something? I bet that with @Mojaxx plugging you, getting some funds to get mixers in should be an easier barrier to overcome. KEEP THEM VIDEOS COMING, MY DUDE!!!
@@meninoxico Best support would be you borrowing me the mixers. Other form of support can be found in the video description. Likes, shares and subs won't do any harm too.
I would love to hear A/Bs of the mixers effect on a song in lossless files or the comparison to an original song before and after it has gone through the mixer.
I'm another new subscribe referred by Mojaxx and I must say this content is fascinating. Keep it up and Mojaxx is right, companies NEED to support you and send you their stuff. Brilliant, brilliant, brilliant!
Another great video, I knew the warm2 could be a source for the blown NUO2.0 PSUs I have to replace... I think it is worth mentioning WHY manufacturers decide on VCA or passive volumne control. With high/intensive use of fader by a wide variety of DJs (eg turntablist/scratch djs), the faders tend to suffer signal-quality wise, so by not routing the audio through the fader but instead using the fader just to control the chip, the audio signal iteself does not get diminished by any crackles in the fader. In contrast, a mixer like the warm2 with its target audience seldomly moving the potentiometer(=fader) very fast (=rough usage), less wear on the component means good sound for longer. Additionally, and this is specualtion but I think there is truth to it, linear potentiometers are mechanically less sturdy than high quality rk27 potentiometers not just because of the materials but also because of the dimensions and geometric properties. Less momentary/lateral force on rotary potentiometer compared to linear potentiometers. Are you interested in battle mixers like an ecler hak360?
Thank you for this comment! Increased resistance to wear is undoubtedly the main reason of using VCA faders. There are also a few others, such as faithful reproduction of the logarithmic curve and much better symmetry of stereo channel attenuation in every slider position. Regarding your HAK question - so far i want to focus more on popular mixers like Xone96, MasterSounds, Condesa etc. but in the future for sure there might be space for HAK. The question is: is it really worth to do EVERY mixer, since they don't differ that much and also HAK model is also from Ecler so i think that there are a lot of simmilar sollutions to those used in Nuo.
@@mixersinside Yes I agree, it might not be worth it as usually manufactures re-use their circuit designs from mixer to mixer. I was just asking as you called for more mixers but the only ones I have currently are Ecler Nuo2, Hak360 and TRM 402 by Omnitronic and you already covered 66% of those.
a very welcomed comparison, thanks! the power supply on my NUO just fried and with Ecler not responding on how to replace it, I am actually looking at a replacement. The external resemblance of the two caught my eye and it's evident, I wanted a look at the actual inner differences. It seems that even if the price difference is not justified at all, thecleaner specs of the warm 2 might be appealing, especially if not driven too much! I was wondering if the S/N ratio which looks better on the chart for the warm 2 is true: why don't you test that too?
@@RiccardoCastaldi i don't measure the full spectrum of parameters cause I only use measurements as a tool to determine the sound coloration of the mixers here. I could measure IMD, SNR, crosstalk etc. but this channel is not about measurements. I focus here more on how things work and what sollutions were used.
Thanks for this video. am looking to get an ecler for my dj set up. based on your test, which mixer will you say is the better one ? i see also that the cross fader on the nuo can be use as an isolator technically.
@@QRS365 thanks for watching. All the information provided can help you with making your own choice. Also don't forget to use your ears when choosing a mixer!
The same topology, the same op amp, the same passive component quality - very very simmilar design. The same cost for sure. Doesn't mean it's bad tho, but yes - it indicates that it's the same league.
@@lcaise I don't know why you drew such conclusions. First of all the times when Chinese products were considered poor quality are long gone. Secondly, if the Nuo 2.0 mixer was surrounded by legend, I see no reason why the Warm 2 couldn't continue that legacy.
@@mixersinside A friend in London bought a Sub Zero model - a twin to the Omnitronic. After a few days the mixer started to break down and he sent it back to the shop. If you check RUclips you will find that the SubZero is an oem as is the rotary Omnitronic. That's why I have concerns. Personally I'm not against cheap hear, quite the opposite - I own several Omnitronic turntables, Gemini and others. I focus on the price - if it is the same design, why 2x more expensive:-)
I was almost going to buy the Warm 2. I test it on a vinyl store and I did not like the plastiky knobs and internally they are also plastic. Maybe that is why the feeling of the knobs was not very solid
fyi the warm 4 seems to have been overhauled and sports bolted metal shafts - at a much higher price point tho. From my personal experience, you stop thinking about it as soon as you get used to the flex. However, I am talking about the nuo 3, which uses completely different (oversized) plastic caps. Combining those flexing shafts with sturdy looking metal (?) knobs, like the did on the warm 2, seems like an odd choice indeed.
I focus solely on measuring Total Harmonic Distortion (THD) here. This measurement helps determine whether the mixer tends more towards a warm/colored sound or a transparent one. However, relying solely on THD isn't enough to evaluate the overall sound quality comprehensively. I avoid using charts of this kind because they oversimplify the complex nature of audio quality. To elaborate, some people, if not the majority, prefer higher THD in DJ mixers as it enhances the "richness" of the sound. Consequently, creating a "sound quality" chart based solely on THD wouldn't just be oversimplified - it would also be challenging to determine what should be on the top of the chart. Sound perception is highly subjective, and the decision ultimately rests with the consumer. If you feel that this topic is interesting for you have a look here: www.passdiy.com/project/articles/audio-distortion-and-feedback In the audio world, an ongoing debate centers around subjectivism versus objectivism, essentially comparing gear evaluation based on measurements versus auditory experience. I position myself somewhere in the middle, but with huge respect to measurements. I avoid labeling mixers as "good" or "bad" based on the measurements alone, but I also laugh out loud when someone call some mixers "hi end" when they simply distort the sound like crazy (very often thanks to cheap components!). This channel provides an excellent platform for evaluating whether high-priced "boutique" mixers differ significantly from those in lower price ranges. It can also help you choose a product that aligns with your preferences, especially if you already have a preferred sound signature. Based on your expectations, you can select a mixer that accurately reproduces the sound or one that adds some warmth or whatever you call it. DJ mixer users often confuse the term "hi-end audio" and apply it to devices that process audio in an unfaithful manner. And to make things even more funny - the preffered "warm sound" is most often cheaper to achieve than a truly transparent, undistorted sound!
Cool review, I was wondering about a possible hack. Are the connects after the phono stage in the Nuo 2.0 at line level? I want to integrate a dvs interface, and that would mean I could use the superior Ecler preamps for DVS and vinyl playback. I think I could do the same with the line feed and the FX loop
Why do you consider Ecler preamps superior? Signal amplitude after the phono preamp is of course at line level, that's the main purpose of a phono preamp.
@@mixersinside In an A/B Test with the NI Audio 8 interface I found the Ecler phono preamps to be superior, that being said the size of the interface is to big to fit in the Nuo 2.0. I will try integrating it when I get my hands on a A6 or even A4
I connected a hand-sized synth (monotron delay) to the mic input of my ecler warm2 for a few minutes and then noticed that the right input was a line input... and it worked fine. Could I have already damaged my mic input or preamp during the few minutes I used the synth in there?
Yes, for sure phono preamp will contribute its own distortion. I precisely described the difference between the phono preamps in the video, can i clarify something for you?
hi, in terms of overall quality between the omnitronic trm 202 and this warm 2... Is it worth double the price for the warm 2? i'll be very grateful if you answer that. Very good videos you make. Keep it up!
@@gero7822 making your decision based on THD @ 1kHz measurement alone is very incomplete. It's just one measurement that gives you a brief information about mixers sound coloration. High THD mixers sound can be perceived as amazing as well as lower THD mixers sound can be perceived as unpleasant and vice versa. I've discussed this topic in the Bozak video. I strongly suggest listening to the audio devices, not just looking at the numbers alone. The numbers can tell you a lot but don't give you the complete image. But first you've asked about overall quality - on the video you can see detailed shots of the parts used. Based on that you can judge if doubling the price means getting better quality components.
@@mixersinside I really dont think the overall parts and design chosing of the expensive one, makes it worth that much. so i did chose the less expensive one. if i had the chance to try them all, first, before making a decision, would be the perfect world, so i would not need to make decision out of videos and measurments, but this is not possible. i guess ill just have to stick to my decision for now :) thank you again.
Thank you for this opportunity, will gladly reach out in the future! For now i have some mixers to film and even more materials to release soon on this channel :)
@@mixersinside yes thats right I was looking at a pair years ago, Im also a fan of reasonably priced vintage speakers. What did you mod on the crossovers?
@@s_9878 i've changed electrolytic caps to film ones and damped the signal that goes to the tweeter cause the original response was very non-linear (the original sound was way too bright).
As i said in my first video i will not speak about the sound quality, because it's a highly subjective thing and opinions may vary because everyone has they own preferences.
I didn't check this because I didn't think its worth mentioning in this case - no standout here. Maybe it's visible on some shots or maybe someone will let us know.
@@mixersinsideYes I already recognised some larger Rubycon caps by the vent cutout patterns on the top. The rest I wasn't able to read, but my guess would be Aishi? Still decent and better than the crap found in the E&S DJR-400 ;)
Hi Kamil, I was wondering, haven´t you think about evaluating the RIAA circuit performance of the Phono pre amp stage by measuring its trasfer function? By sweeping the input sinusoid frequency and measuring the output amplitude you should be able to obtain the bode function and compare it with the standard RIAA curve. REW should allow to do that pretty easy.
Measuring the transfer function will only show you the RIAA curve accuracy, and this doesn't tell you everything about the phono stage performance. If I focused on detailed measurements that would be material for another long video. Also this phono stage is so simple and basic that i was even not curious about its performance.
@@mixersinside usually the term performance refers to accuracy when speaking about phono pre-amp. Despite the word conventions, I think that measure would allow you to evaluate the impact of capacitor selection in the RIAA circuit. Accuracy of the curve will be highly dependent on the type of capacitor used. Cheers
@@iacacch i must disagree with all the things you wrote. The term performance refers to all the significant parameters that have impact on performance: noise floor, THD, THD+N, frequency response - i named some most basic ones. Secondly, changing the TYPE, not the value of capacitor can affect distortion figures, not frequency response and RIAA accuracy.
@@mixersinside Dear Kamil, I truly appreciate the work you do on this channel, and you're a very nice guy. As evident from my comments on your previous video, I'm fully supportive of your efforts. However, I'm sorry to notice that you seem quite convinced about your ideas. Allow me to provide you with some free information derived from years of experience in the field. Whether you refer to it as accuracy or performance, the frequency response you mentioned is essentially the equivalent Bode transfer function of the RIAA network. Hence, the term "performance" is not inaccurate. The accuracy of this frequency response depends not only on the component value but also on tolerance. It's essential to recognize that the component value is rarely exact. This is where the capacitor type becomes crucial. Cheers.
@@iacacch You admitted that you're not speaking about the type of capacitor, but about its tollerance. Type of capacitor (film, ceramic, mica) doesn't affect the frequency response, because it has a fixed value. Some types of capacitors (X5R/X7R ceramic) change their value depending on the voltage applied - it's called derating. But those fluctuations mainly affect linearity in terrms of distortion, not in terms of frequency response. Both popular types of capacitors - ceramic and film can have 1% tollerance. So what's the point of your observation? I'm open to discussion, but to change my mind i need proofs. If you provide me one i will agree with you.
Apropo tych plastikowych potencjometrów alpsa - tam podobno chodzi o jakieś przebicia prądu, szumy etc (jeżeli jest metalowy) itp - dlatego specialnie dają plastikowe, wiadomix że są mniej trwałe
Which out of the Warm2 and trm 202mk3 do you think have better sound quality through lineout? They look to have similar specs according to your measurements
I genuinely think this might be my favourite channel on RUclips! Another fantastic video.
Thank you, appreciate!
Spain and England got mogged by Germany. I wanna see Henderson model x 3 its polands turn. Mojaxx can you lend him one or contact the lads to send one to him ?
It’s the vca fader that make my nuo 2.0 sound warm. Wow I dunno how I feel about that but I know it’s good for a dj to know why he likes or dislikes some mixers
It's my nuo 2.0 used here... This youtuber returned it in even better shape!
Cheers!
This channel did more for the DJ community than hör!
this is awesome! honest, real and backed up by real measurements. we need this is a world where there are a lot of BS opinions flying around.
THANKS!!!
You basically wrote the reason why this channel was opened. Thank you! More mixers are coming :)
Mojaxx recommended this channel and I am glad he did. This is my new favorite channel. I can’t wait for you to take apart a Rane MP2015.
What an amazing channel! No fluff, all substance. I’m sure we’ll see you grow a lot.
Nice comparison. I hear a lot of people saying Warm 2 was a cash grab and they just threw knobs on a Nuo but it seems there is a bit more to it than that. I’m not surprised they kept much of the Nuo design.
For future content have you considered crowdfunding? Maybe this could also prioritize which mixers go under the microscope first. As a bonus if the mixers are in working order they could be raffled off to fund more mixers.
Love your content so far.
Crowdfunding could enable me to purchase, let's say, one high quality mixer? Only a substantial amount of money would truly make a difference in this situation. I also don't believe that companies would cooperate with me because they likely have no interest in revealing the internal components of their mixers (unless they truly believe in the quality of what they have created). I need to borrow the mixers from people! I already do, but my friends don't own every mixer.
If you want to support the channel there is a link in the video description to do this. It could allow me to invest in better recording gear or lighting to enhance the quality of the videos. However, the mixers itself are simply too expensive. I hope this makes sense to you.
Excellent work! Subscribed after watching every video. The work you put in to this is great. Easily accessible to the non electrical engineers like me. I have the Ecler 3.0 and appreciate the mixer more and more over time. Looking forward to your upcoming work. Thank you!
Great breakdown. keep up the good work!....The isolator with it's up front position on the Warm 2 is fantastic to mix with! Love it.
Hope you will keep this channel up and running for a long time! This is what we needed and nobody was doing it. Hopefully you will be able to do more rotary mixers in the future because it would help a lot of people decide if spending 2000 usd+ on a mixer is worth it or not! Cheers❤
Long term future of this channel lays in the hands of followers/community. Going on alone without your support will be impossible. Thank you for the kind words, cheers!
Exceptional work, thank you! I was just wondering last week whether anyone would compare these two, and here we are. Really enjoying these detailed breakdowns on your channel.
Good Video. I use Ecler NUO 2.0 for 15 years now. Excellent mixer
very happy I found your channel. Keep up the good work! 😃
Nobel peace prize to you sir!🎉
Love this channel. Every time I see a new upload I drop everything and watch it! Keep it up. Someone get this man a xone 96 to open up and look inside asap!! ;-)
Glad I found this Channel......Honest to goodness review about the Quality.
Guys like you make RUclips high quality
Wow i always wonder about how warm2 sounds compared to other ecler mixer : thank you!
Brilliant comparison here! I like that you've gone for this one as Ecler is a great brand delivering bang-for-buck across the board: sound quality, ergonomics, design, features, durability.. just solid products. It's at that perfect mid-tier price point that a lot of people can get in to. They're reliable and have a good enough sound quality that you can happily record a mix on them, stream with or set up 'em at a small party or bar and be quite satisfied. I've had A&H Xone:32, :42 & :62 and after selling the last one (the :42) i got a B-stock Nuo 3.0 as i was saving up for a :92. I ended up keeping the Nuo 3.0 as it's just a great mixer with excellent sound, feels good and those fader + xfader shape controls.. ooh.. love it!
For sure I wouldn't call those mixers a bang for buck. But they are nice.
@@mixersinside Actually, i've got to say you're right looking at the price of mixers currently. Nuo 2.0 is a deal at around 400 euro, though Warm2 in comparison is a real pricey. Omnitronic, even Allen & Heath seem to do better.. 777 euro for a Xone:43 on Thomann compared to 666 for the Warm2 makes me wonder.. I suppose Ecler looked at the rotary market and figured the rotary loving cats may skip Omni' and need a step between those and the MasterSounds Radius 2.
@@havaac right - considering the prices of other mixers NUO 2.0 is a deal indeed.
Thank you so much for the videos, you popped the Ballon of HQ analog gear. Especially the phono stage and headphone amp (the last one I knew). It’s not nice to see all these standard op-amp chips. But it makes me wonder regarding other brands. Like Play differently and Master sounds.
@@gwsound thanks for your comment! Mastersound Radius 4 video is coming soon :)
Very useful info, well crafted, keep going
I think something interesting you didn't mention was the trimpots just next to the XLR output. I guess they balance the output for each unit at EOL testing to make sure all component uncertainties are evened out. And as warm 2 also has it, it seems to important
Love this channel! Perfect nerd level!
Please can you do a comparison video of the A&H Xone 23C and the Pioneer DJM 250Mk2? As you probably know, these are the affordable, entry level mixers from these two big names. Similar price, similar features. People often talk about Pioneer supposedly having bad implementation of the RIAA curve in their phono preamps, whilst A&H are said have a good preamps. I'd love to see a video that digs into this and really shows the difference between the two
Very good idea thanks. But i have the same problem as always: i don't have access to this gear. Maybe i will figure something out, should be quite easy to get them.
Keep on the great work and awesome videos 🔥
Very informative. Great job.
Dude… this is public service. Fantastic video.
Love
@@mixersinside How can we support you? Do you have a patreon or something? I bet that with @Mojaxx plugging you, getting some funds to get mixers in should be an easier barrier to overcome. KEEP THEM VIDEOS COMING, MY DUDE!!!
@@meninoxico Best support would be you borrowing me the mixers. Other form of support can be found in the video description. Likes, shares and subs won't do any harm too.
@@mixersinsideInterested in a Vestax PMC 46 MKII rotary mixer from the 2000's?
@@meninoxico for sure! Please get in touch with me by channels i provided. Thank you
Thanks for the videos! I just ordered a Warm 2, my first rotary mixer, and I really hope the pots won’t ring it for me!
Really nice video. Thanks!🎉
Henderson audio are polish maybe they would be glad to take part they are pretty confident in their mixers transparency
very good - thanks
9:35 every dj should see this graph hahaha
Wonderful channel! Keep it up!
Good job friend, +1 new subscriber, greetings from spain! 😎
I would love to hear A/Bs of the mixers effect on a song in lossless files or the comparison to an original song before and after it has gone through the mixer.
I'm another new subscribe referred by Mojaxx and I must say this content is fascinating. Keep it up and Mojaxx is right, companies NEED to support you and send you their stuff. Brilliant, brilliant, brilliant!
That was witty at the the end “from the outside”
Awesome content
good review
thanks
Another great video, I knew the warm2 could be a source for the blown NUO2.0 PSUs I have to replace...
I think it is worth mentioning WHY manufacturers decide on VCA or passive volumne control. With high/intensive use of fader by a wide variety of DJs (eg turntablist/scratch djs), the faders tend to suffer signal-quality wise, so by not routing the audio through the fader but instead using the fader just to control the chip, the audio signal iteself does not get diminished by any crackles in the fader. In contrast, a mixer like the warm2 with its target audience seldomly moving the potentiometer(=fader) very fast (=rough usage), less wear on the component means good sound for longer.
Additionally, and this is specualtion but I think there is truth to it, linear potentiometers are mechanically less sturdy than high quality rk27 potentiometers not just because of the materials but also because of the dimensions and geometric properties. Less momentary/lateral force on rotary potentiometer compared to linear potentiometers.
Are you interested in battle mixers like an ecler hak360?
Thank you for this comment!
Increased resistance to wear is undoubtedly the main reason of using VCA faders. There are also a few others, such as faithful reproduction of the logarithmic curve and much better symmetry of stereo channel attenuation in every slider position.
Regarding your HAK question - so far i want to focus more on popular mixers like Xone96, MasterSounds, Condesa etc. but in the future for sure there might be space for HAK. The question is: is it really worth to do EVERY mixer, since they don't differ that much and also HAK model is also from Ecler so i think that there are a lot of simmilar sollutions to those used in Nuo.
@@mixersinside Yes I agree, it might not be worth it as usually manufactures re-use their circuit designs from mixer to mixer. I was just asking as you called for more mixers but the only ones I have currently are Ecler Nuo2, Hak360 and TRM 402 by Omnitronic and you already covered 66% of those.
@@ohnoezitsroger i see - that's a very kind proposition, thank you!
a very welcomed comparison, thanks! the power supply on my NUO just fried and with Ecler not responding on how to replace it, I am actually looking at a replacement. The external resemblance of the two caught my eye and it's evident, I wanted a look at the actual inner differences. It seems that even if the price difference is not justified at all, thecleaner specs of the warm 2 might be appealing, especially if not driven too much! I was wondering if the S/N ratio which looks better on the chart for the warm 2 is true: why don't you test that too?
@@RiccardoCastaldi i don't measure the full spectrum of parameters cause I only use measurements as a tool to determine the sound coloration of the mixers here. I could measure IMD, SNR, crosstalk etc. but this channel is not about measurements. I focus here more on how things work and what sollutions were used.
nice video! i was wondering, for the THD, wouldnt a music signal measure or behave differently than a sine wave ?
@@deejaytracksuit88 please watch my Bozak AR-4 video to find out more about what THD is and why sinewave is used to measure it.
Perfect!
I wish I could send you my Formula Sound FF6.2L :(
There is no problem with that as long as you are willing to do it.
Thanks for this video. am looking to get an ecler for my dj set up. based on your test, which mixer will you say is the better one ? i see also that the cross fader on the nuo can be use as an isolator technically.
@@QRS365 thanks for watching. All the information provided can help you with making your own choice. Also don't forget to use your ears when choosing a mixer!
Thank God you appeared in the video
😅
@@mixersinside 😂😇
Nuo 2.0 is the best quality 2 channel mixer.
interesting conclusion
@@mixersinside well, for me. I have tried so many. Maybe the technics sh1200 is up there too.
Awesome video. Question - could you hypothetically change the VCA chip in the Nuo to a different one to improve the sound?
yes
Did I hear correctly that the phono pre-amp is the same as on the Omnitronic ?
Well done.
The same topology, the same op amp, the same passive component quality - very very simmilar design. The same cost for sure. Doesn't mean it's bad tho, but yes - it indicates that it's the same league.
@@mixersinside thanx for explaining!
@@mixersinside Shieet, I'm a bit surprised. Everyone says Omnitronic is a Chinese oem. Could it be that the legend of the Spanish Ecler has fallen?
@@lcaise I don't know why you drew such conclusions. First of all the times when Chinese products were considered poor quality are long gone. Secondly, if the Nuo 2.0 mixer was surrounded by legend, I see no reason why the Warm 2 couldn't continue that legacy.
@@mixersinside A friend in London bought a Sub Zero model - a twin to the Omnitronic. After a few days the mixer started to break down and he sent it back to the shop. If you check RUclips you will find that the SubZero is an oem as is the rotary Omnitronic. That's why I have concerns. Personally I'm not against cheap hear, quite the opposite - I own several Omnitronic turntables, Gemini and others. I focus on the price - if it is the same design, why 2x more expensive:-)
Buen video amigo
Could you make a vídeo about the original Bozak cma DL and original Urei 1620 mixer please?
Yes if someone provides me the mixers.
I was almost going to buy the Warm 2. I test it on a vinyl store and I did not like the plastiky knobs and internally they are also plastic. Maybe that is why the feeling of the knobs was not very solid
fyi the warm 4 seems to have been overhauled and sports bolted metal shafts - at a much higher price point tho.
From my personal experience, you stop thinking about it as soon as you get used to the flex. However, I am talking about the nuo 3, which uses completely different (oversized) plastic caps. Combining those flexing shafts with sturdy looking metal (?) knobs, like the did on the warm 2, seems like an odd choice indeed.
Like for review! How about arranging some top chart of the mixers you tried already considering sound quality
I focus solely on measuring Total Harmonic Distortion (THD) here. This measurement helps determine whether the mixer tends more towards a warm/colored sound or a transparent one. However, relying solely on THD isn't enough to evaluate the overall sound quality comprehensively. I avoid using charts of this kind because they oversimplify the complex nature of audio quality. To elaborate, some people, if not the majority, prefer higher THD in DJ mixers as it enhances the "richness" of the sound. Consequently, creating a "sound quality" chart based solely on THD wouldn't just be oversimplified - it would also be challenging to determine what should be on the top of the chart. Sound perception is highly subjective, and the decision ultimately rests with the consumer.
If you feel that this topic is interesting for you have a look here: www.passdiy.com/project/articles/audio-distortion-and-feedback
In the audio world, an ongoing debate centers around subjectivism versus objectivism, essentially comparing gear evaluation based on measurements versus auditory experience. I position myself somewhere in the middle, but with huge respect to measurements. I avoid labeling mixers as "good" or "bad" based on the measurements alone, but I also laugh out loud when someone call some mixers "hi end" when they simply distort the sound like crazy (very often thanks to cheap components!).
This channel provides an excellent platform for evaluating whether high-priced "boutique" mixers differ significantly from those in lower price ranges. It can also help you choose a product that aligns with your preferences, especially if you already have a preferred sound signature.
Based on your expectations, you can select a mixer that accurately reproduces the sound or one that adds some warmth or whatever you call it. DJ mixer users often confuse the term "hi-end audio" and apply it to devices that process audio in an unfaithful manner. And to make things even more funny - the preffered "warm sound" is most often cheaper to achieve than a truly transparent, undistorted sound!
@@mixersinside thanks a lot for your answer! I will definitely check out that resource you recommended!
Cool review, I was wondering about a possible hack. Are the connects after the phono stage in the Nuo 2.0 at line level? I want to integrate a dvs interface, and that would mean I could use the superior Ecler preamps for DVS and vinyl playback. I think I could do the same with the line feed and the FX loop
Why do you consider Ecler preamps superior?
Signal amplitude after the phono preamp is of course at line level, that's the main purpose of a phono preamp.
@@mixersinside In an A/B Test with the NI Audio 8 interface I found the Ecler phono preamps to be superior, that being said the size of the interface is to big to fit in the Nuo 2.0. I will try integrating it when I get my hands on a A6 or even A4
I connected a hand-sized synth (monotron delay) to the mic input of my ecler warm2 for a few minutes and then noticed that the right input was a line input... and it worked fine. Could I have already damaged my mic input or preamp during the few minutes I used the synth in there?
This is a question for Ecler customer service.
I’d like to know why people say the play differently models sound phat
What mods would you do on the warm 2 to make it better?
Would there be any difference in THD expected when routing the signal through phono in? Are phono pre-amps the same?
Yes, for sure phono preamp will contribute its own distortion. I precisely described the difference between the phono preamps in the video, can i clarify something for you?
@@mixersinside Oh sorry, missed it! Thanks for the video as always!
hi, in terms of overall quality between the omnitronic trm 202 and this warm 2... Is it worth double the price for the warm 2? i'll be very grateful if you answer that. Very good videos you make. Keep it up!
You must answer this question on your own, i provided a lot of information.
You are correct, based on the measurments i made my decision. Thank you for bringing light on the topic :) @@mixersinside
@@gero7822 making your decision based on THD @ 1kHz measurement alone is very incomplete. It's just one measurement that gives you a brief information about mixers sound coloration. High THD mixers sound can be perceived as amazing as well as lower THD mixers sound can be perceived as unpleasant and vice versa. I've discussed this topic in the Bozak video. I strongly suggest listening to the audio devices, not just looking at the numbers alone. The numbers can tell you a lot but don't give you the complete image.
But first you've asked about overall quality - on the video you can see detailed shots of the parts used. Based on that you can judge if doubling the price means getting better quality components.
@@mixersinside I really dont think the overall parts and design chosing of the expensive one, makes it worth that much. so i did chose the less expensive one. if i had the chance to try them all, first, before making a decision, would be the perfect world, so i would not need to make decision out of videos and measurments, but this is not possible. i guess ill just have to stick to my decision for now :) thank you again.
@@gero7822 enjoy your new mixer!
Want to take my DJM A9 appart? I'm located in vienna.
Thank you for this opportunity, will gladly reach out in the future! For now i have some mixers to film and even more materials to release soon on this channel :)
Can you tell please if the Ecler sounds better than TRM-202 MK3
@@TheDjed19 please define better first.
I guess I’m asking which mixer sounds cleaner, and warmer and which has better quality parts. Thank you.
@@TheDjed19 cleaner and warmer is a paradox. If by clean you mean transparent then you must say bye to warmth.
Understood thx
So in the Warm2, the master isolator is basically the same thing of the channel eq ?
No, I've pointed out the difference in the video. Master isolator is 24dB/oct and channel EQ isolator is 12dB/oct.
@@mixersinsideThanks, I love this mixer but really can’t hear much difference between both and I should hear as it’s a big difference
@@danield_sounds please watch my Omnitronic video, where i exactly explain the difference between isolator slope steepness.
What speaker is that in the video? Thanks for the great content.
Can you give me time id? Cause i don't remember any speaker.
@@mixersinside Whoops maybe its not a speaker but behind you at 6:56 with the cool looking waveguide at the top
@@s_9878 Grundig Box 506a. I've modded the crossovers and love them!
@@mixersinside yes thats right I was looking at a pair years ago, Im also a fan of reasonably priced vintage speakers. What did you mod on the crossovers?
@@s_9878 i've changed electrolytic caps to film ones and damped the signal that goes to the tweeter cause the original response was very non-linear (the original sound was way too bright).
Warm 4 or xone 92/96 better sound quality?
As i said in my first video i will not speak about the sound quality, because it's a highly subjective thing and opinions may vary because everyone has they own preferences.
What brand(s) of electrolytic capacitors are used in the Warm 2? :)
I didn't check this because I didn't think its worth mentioning in this case - no standout here. Maybe it's visible on some shots or maybe someone will let us know.
I watched the shots, with a little effort you can spot the brand names on the capacitors.
@@mixersinsideYes I already recognised some larger Rubycon caps by the vent cutout patterns on the top. The rest I wasn't able to read, but my guess would be Aishi? Still decent and better than the crap found in the E&S DJR-400 ;)
Hi Kamil, I was wondering, haven´t you think about evaluating the RIAA circuit performance of the Phono pre amp stage by measuring its trasfer function? By sweeping the input sinusoid frequency and measuring the output amplitude you should be able to obtain the bode function and compare it with the standard RIAA curve. REW should allow to do that pretty easy.
Measuring the transfer function will only show you the RIAA curve accuracy, and this doesn't tell you everything about the phono stage performance. If I focused on detailed measurements that would be material for another long video. Also this phono stage is so simple and basic that i was even not curious about its performance.
@@mixersinside usually the term performance refers to accuracy when speaking about phono pre-amp. Despite the word conventions, I think that measure would allow you to evaluate the impact of capacitor selection in the RIAA circuit. Accuracy of the curve will be highly dependent on the type of capacitor used. Cheers
@@iacacch i must disagree with all the things you wrote. The term performance refers to all the significant parameters that have impact on performance: noise floor, THD, THD+N, frequency response - i named some most basic ones. Secondly, changing the TYPE, not the value of capacitor can affect distortion figures, not frequency response and RIAA accuracy.
@@mixersinside Dear Kamil,
I truly appreciate the work you do on this channel, and you're a very nice guy. As evident from my comments on your previous video, I'm fully supportive of your efforts. However, I'm sorry to notice that you seem quite convinced about your ideas. Allow me to provide you with some free information derived from years of experience in the field. Whether you refer to it as accuracy or performance, the frequency response you mentioned is essentially the equivalent Bode transfer function of the RIAA network. Hence, the term "performance" is not inaccurate. The accuracy of this frequency response depends not only on the component value but also on tolerance. It's essential to recognize that the component value is rarely exact. This is where the capacitor type becomes crucial.
Cheers.
@@iacacch You admitted that you're not speaking about the type of capacitor, but about its tollerance. Type of capacitor (film, ceramic, mica) doesn't affect the frequency response, because it has a fixed value. Some types of capacitors (X5R/X7R ceramic) change their value depending on the voltage applied - it's called derating. But those fluctuations mainly affect linearity in terrms of distortion, not in terms of frequency response. Both popular types of capacitors - ceramic and film can have 1% tollerance. So what's the point of your observation?
I'm open to discussion, but to change my mind i need proofs. If you provide me one i will agree with you.
What ADC are you using?
E1DA Cosmos ADC
@@mixersinside Thanks; impressive!
@@nweibull yes, this product is simply amazing.
Apropo tych plastikowych potencjometrów alpsa - tam podobno chodzi o jakieś przebicia prądu, szumy etc (jeżeli jest metalowy) itp - dlatego specialnie dają plastikowe, wiadomix że są mniej trwałe
Which out of the Warm2 and trm 202mk3 do you think have better sound quality through lineout? They look to have similar specs according to your measurements
Please watch my first video "Welcome to my cave!". It will answer your question. Cheers!