I always had a theory that Metal Sonic’s perception was warped, like when he captured Amy I imagined he viewed it as her being saved from Sonic, who he would likely perceive as a sort of Metal Sonic, and he genuinely believed he was the real Sonic and went mad because he didn’t know why all his friends were so scared of him edit: looking back this shit was so obvious I didn’t deserve 800 likes on this
It's an interesting idea, I think, but isn't Amy tied up in CD? If she was able to convince Gamma, then she probably would have tried to talk some sense into Metal Sonic, too. But of course, that's certainly not what supposedly happened.
I thought the Metal Virus was simply water. I'd only seen snippets, and I thought Metal was simply being curious. That's really sad now that I know the truth.
@@LilyCult What do you mean by that? When I was reading the metal virus part of the comics, I wasn't really paying attention to the details so I'm not sure what you mean
@@aquarify7188 He's referring to one of the anniversary mini-stories that came out during the metal virus arc I think, so you might not have seen it. Basically it follows Metal as he silently contemplates his robot body, and it heavily implies that he is sad or jealous of Sonic being the, well, real Sonic. When the guy said they thought the liquid was water, it was because Metal dipped his finger into the metal virus fluid and watched as it had no effect on him, since he's a robot.
The crucial thing that made Metal Sonic so memorable in CD was that he was a perfect *thematic* foil, rather than just narrative. The whole game was about exploring the dichotomy of nature and technology and how they can manifest in positive and negative ways for the planet. Metal Sonic is sort of a bizarro reflection of the real thing; a “bad future” Sonic, if you will. Sonic is a champion of nature and has to fight Metal’s influence in every stage. Even tho his appearances are limited, his presence is felt throughout the title because the core themes are always at the forefront of the player’s mind. Even the marketing was careful to frame them in perfect opposition to each other; you could draw a line down the Japanese and European boxart and they’re pretty much a perfect mirror image of each other. Equal and opposite in terms of power, but with Sonic being fundamentally *good* and Metal being fundamentally *bad.* They’re not just fighting each other but also fighting for the future of the planet and it’s aesthetic ideology. There’s a effortless genius to Metal Sonic’s sleek, sharp, heartless design, compared to the softer, rounded and personable look of Sonic. In that sense, Metal Sonic was *made* for Sonic CD, in the same way that Knuckles was made for Sonic 3 and Shadow was made for SA2. When ripped away from his original context, SEGA is forced to actually create a new motive or emotional hook, which they did with Heroes but couldn’t be bothered to do ever again. If you can’t justify the prolonged use of a character that’s already served his purpose, it comes off as cloying and unsatisfying.
@@leritykay8911 *cough cough* chaos *cough cough* then again they didn't really forget about chaos but they saw potential and decided hey kill the water making chaos a perfect way to show how a villain should be used but forces didn't care and I'd rather have a boss against a copy of chaos with the phantom ruby than metal sonic since it would work but metal should be a character that shows up way less frequently sure I'd still like to see him but he is a character that works will only some stories so I wish they fix up everything and continue on to fix metal and all the other characters
I think metal sonic had various forms because he wanted to surpass sonic’s super form. Sort of like a “ anything you can do, I can do better “ type of mindset that he has.
A question I have for Metal Sonic’s character is that one of Metal Overlord’s voice lines, he says “he is no longer afraid of anything.” The question is what was he afraid of? I personally think he was afraid of facing that fact that he is not the real Sonic.
I agree, I think his delusions are so intense that he cant handle not being sonic, and in that moment he sees himself as more, a god, he WAS god in that moment, as it took 3 supers to take him down
i think anyone who tries to give layers to these deliberately unidimensional characters has an offset of peterpan syndrome... I love sonic, for the gameplay...But story and characters? please xd... None of these characters should have ever learned to talk...Sonic was defined by his motion, and gameplay, not for stoping and having lengthy cutscenes where the controller is resting for minutes on end on your lap. This is a videogame. Case in point, Mario and Luigi are still unable to string a FULL sentence together, and their games have ALWAYS been far betterthan anything sonic has been able to accomplish since the genesis era. Metal Sonic was ALL we needed in terms of an edgy sonic, because he is exactly that, he didnt have to tell you, or speak in a badboy voice. Shadow ruined it all.
Metal Sonic's characterization in one of the Sonic Mania animated shorts where he is rescued by Amy is pretty darn adorable and one of the best things they did with him sinced Heroes and the IDW series.
Just re watched that video and it's very understandable now. Seeing that Metal Sonic has been losing and losing over and over again to a point where he's given up on trying. He no longer sees himself as the real Sonic, and he can't beat Sonic, so he sees himself as a shameless copy. RIP metal sonic
Hot take - Neo Metal Sonic should have been the default design from Heroes onwards. Maybe the leather cape is a bit tacky, but the design is badass as hell
One thing I wish they had done that might have prevented Metal Sonic from becoming stale was after Sonic Heroes, make his defection permanent and have him be a villain on his own. I think that idea has potential for new and interesting stories for Metal Sonic, like him trying to create an army of his own or something.
Both Sonic Heroes, The OVA, and the comics fully fleshed out his character and personality, anything after those games he became a nostalgia object with no purpose, nice analysis PJ
I'd love to see a Metal-centric story where Metal tries to find a purpose beyond defeating Sonic. Maybe after defeating him- even convincing himself that Sonic is dead- his mission fulfilled, he is free at last to forge a destiny he chooses. Then, at the end, Sonic is revealed to not be dead (big surprise) and Metal has a bittersweet ending where he cannot override his programming (or maybe he can in a true ending) and everything he experienced beforehand is cruelly wiped away.
My vision of Metal Sonic is Robotnik's greatest invention. Sonic's first actual perfect doppelganger, matching his speed and agility. Being an actual challenge for Sonic. Okay, maybe Mecha was more of a challenge but he is more of a upgrade than an invention. Shadow was just Sonic's...well shadow, he really didn't have a purpose, only SA2, Sonic Heroes and Shadow The Hedgehog gave Shadow an actual backstory than just a side story. Out of all the inventions Robotnik's made I'd say Metal is the best machine he has ever built. Once was a challenger, proving to Sonic that he was the true Sonic, now being just a mini-boss, no meaning or use for him at all.
Mecha wasn't more of a challange? He was never a big point in neither Sonic 2 and 3. At best 2 but even that is forcing it. And in 3 at best he is better for Knuckles. Metal was the main deal for CD after he was done story literally had nothing more to do.
What traits? I can see Shadow being a point of contention because at least he’s also artificial and kinda sorta looks like him but Knuckles and the others? Knuckles himself is a character who got scavenged hard for future characters like Blaze (lonesome serious Emerald guardian who learns about the meaning of friendship) and Silver (naive good-hearted rival who gets tricked by the villain into thinking Sonic is responsible for his home being a mess) and arguably even Sticks (grew up in the wilderness and is driven by instincts) after these traits stopped being used for him. There are better examples, like Johnny from Rush Adventure who is also an Eggman robot who primarily battles Sonic through racing.
@@rainpooper7088 I personally see as 2 main traits their desire at least for while to beat sonic or just seeing sonic as a threat to the things they do. Metal Sonic- Was programmed to beat/destroy sonic and kept doing till the end of heroes. Knuckles- Was tricked but saw sonic as threat to his island and the master emerald. Shadow is pretty easy to explain. I wasn't thinking about sliver till you brought it up thanks. Sliver- Was trying to save the future but amused sonic was the one making the future bad. I haven't seen or played much Sonic rush so I plan on getting more information on that game. In my opinion, before sonic changed most of their minds expectation (I think Johnny and metal sonic). They saw as a threat and later on after making it was mainly because a friendly rivalry.
The IDW comic also explained why Metal wasn't actually present in Forces. Eggman was basically running updates on Metal so he could become Neo Metal Sonic without rebelling against Eggman, which worked. The updates didn't finish until Forces was over and in the beginning of the IDW comic Metal's goal was now to take over the world so that he could hand it over to his master on a silver platter.
Metal sonic was my favorite character for the longest time. But over time, I've realized that I don't want him in the games anymore. If he's just there to be there for sales, and have metal sonic fans have hope he'll do something, I don't want him there. Either do something with him, and treat him like a character, or don't have him in the game in the first place. It sucks for me to say that, but it needs to be said I want metal sonic the character, not metal sonic the jobber
@@rickyrackey7930 I can just imagine Metal stalking the main characters wherever they go (maybe camouflaged since we're going by sci-fi tech?) and now I just want that so badly.
Remember how Metal Sonic was absent from Sonic X? Personally I was fine with him being a race rival & cameoing the way he did in Sonic Adventure. The 2010s for Sonic were just crap in general as far as the games were concerned.
I’d like to mention that the rings in the walls in cd are actually tied to the time travel mechanic, in other time periods those walls aren’t there, meaning you can grab the rings.
cause it incentivises you to go to the other time periods if you think about it for a bit. best you could do other than that is make decorations or fossilized rings where theyd be in the future or past@@Echoline77
I can imagine Eggman being scared or paranoid to include Metal Sonic into his plans in Forces after what he was capable of in the events of Heroes. Opting for a mindless duplicate than the unstable original, although he could have attempted to build a new metal sonic to aid infinite or maybe he was finished with Metal Sonics in general
The IDW (more specifically, Neo Metal Sonic) comics state that Eggman was actually converting Metal into a Neo form from Heroes, and I guess using the phantom copies to still have Metal Sonics out there. Neo was finished after the world was saved tho.
There's a theory metal sonic is a roboticized sonic from the future. Since if Eggman could create something like metal sonic, why wouldn't he make all of his armies like him?
@@dappleofthedualies Oh yeah that makes sense to use the phantom copies while upgrading and reworking any bit of Metal Sonic so he wouldn't go rogue again. Guess he wasn't completely turn off from the idea of Neo Metal Sonic
@@NintendoMeister2260 Eggman sees Metal Sonic as a work of art in the IDW comics, so he probably sees it as something that can't be replicated like the average egg bot but only refined. I guess the closest we got are the previous versions of Metal such as Mecha Sonic or the phantom copies, or maybe Eggman just has too much pride
Honestly, the Forces inclusion makes some sense to me, since Metal is already Eggman's strongest creation, and the Phantom Ruby can mass-produce that and upgrade said copies endlessly with no real effort. It beats having only one Metal with no upgrades. That said I admit I don't know why Metal wasn't there, aside from Eggman maybe considering him obsolete at the time.
only excuse I can think off is Robotnik didn't want to risk Metal going rogue again and stealing the ruby for his own ends, we've seen what Metal can do when he decides not to follow orders, would you risk that happening with the Phantom Ruby? I know I wouldn't.
I remember growing up on Metal Sonic. All the drawings, all the badass moments, just for Sega to overuse him for “Marketing Values”. I truly love what IDW did with “Reflections”. It shows that Metal is self-aware in this scenario. Him realizing that he’s copy. The fact that there aren’t any moments of dialogue, and just the imagery can set up a good example for telling an awesome story. It made me feel bad for him, I think he dipped his finger into the Metal Virus, hoping it might’ve transformed him into something…different, but to no avail. Him walking away so solemnly is a reminder of that.
At the first time when I saw Metal Sonic I fought,"This is gonna be a 2D character without personalitty" and was shocked when they were able to make a robot with actual personalitty
Metal Sonic is a character I prefer to be mostly silent, I feel his actions show his character the most Most of his actions alone show how much he despises and wants to surpass Sonic, especially in the Metal Virus arc in the IDW comics in where he touches the Metal Virus and it simply slips off of him while he on looks at Sonic trying to speed of the Metal Virus, he’s just a copy and he’s coming to terms with that. Yet he still wants to overcome Sonic I guess me and you have some similar views on Metal Sonic
I always viewed Metal Sonic having a voice as a representation of his free will, mainly because in the games where he doesn't have a voice, or when his dialogue is more robotic, he seems to not have that much free will. While I do agree that Metal Sonic being as chattery as Sonic would completely ruin the character, I do think that he should be allowed to talk sometimes.
Nah metal Sonic having a voice in his transformed form shows the scariness of his evolution because the robot suddenly has become sentient and has its own free will. I agree his original form shouldnt talk cuz its just a robot but the talking adds to his transformation and serves as such a good contrast from normal programmed robot to an actual living thing with emotions. Thats scary which is why it works
I’m gonna give the sonic mania episodes some credit for metal sonic. While they didn’t really use that whole rival thing for sonic, I really like how they made him actually threatening and pretty cool.
The Amy Christmas special was also pretty good for Metals characterization at least to me, in that he gets essentially depressed because he failed to beat sonic yet again and Amy has to pick him back up again
It's sad that characters like Metal Sonic and Shadow were ruined by lazy writing, although I do have hope that the newer games can improve that. Also hoping we get Metal Sonic in the Sonic movies, maybe as a rival built by Eggman to beat Sonic. Just a thought but nevertheless, good video.
I think metal sonic in the idw comics is pretty good.... In the first arc that is and certain scenes littered around but i think some of the moments were he's underutilized is do to mandates to keep him in a comfortable plave which in a character arc driven comic is bad
I was REALLY hoping for that instead of Shadow...they really screwed up there. Since they gave up Shadow instead of Metal Sonic, and Jim Carrey is retiring before Metal Sonic was designed, we can't get him in the movies anymore.
I think I know why Metal Sonic was created as an illusion by Infinite. Maybe Eggman thought since the original failed to beat Sonic so many times, and since Infinite had the power to create illusions, and he COULD defeat Sonic, that maybe he could create a better and stronger Metal Sonic, but as an illusion. Or maybe because Eggman doesn't want everything that happened in Sonic Heroes to happen again.
I think the best thing about Metal Sonic is always that you might know everything that he's going to do, but that won't help you because he knows everything that you're going to do. Strange, isn't it?
Metal Sonic's flanderization reminds me of Shadow's. Both were once good characters early on, but as the years went by, they had no fuckin' clue what to do with them. And then resorted to simplifying them to certain traits that make them shadows of themselves.
Honestly I agree. Metal Sonic has always been my favorite and while I didn't mind his Sonic 4 appearances, Sonic Forces is where it really it the fan for me. I remember going through that boss fight on the bridge and thinking "Where is the real Metal Sonic?". However I have high hopes for Metal. If Frontiers goes well maybe Sega will keep Ian Flynn writing for future Sonic games. If there is one thing Archie and IDW have taught me about Ian Flynn it's that he can write Metal Sonic like no other.
Since you mentioned the comics, I like how they explained why Metal Sonic, despite being willing to betray Eggman in the past for his own ends, has become more loyal to him since Heroes because Eggman stopped treating him like a mere robot and more like a son. That makes the dynamic between IDW Metal and Eggman interesting because they might be the only beings that the other truly cares about… if only the games could explore that to make game Metal as fleshed out as IDW Metal.
I hope that he becomes a as good as idw metal and I have good felling because flin (don't know how to write his name sorry) writes the new games so yeah good day
I know he *very* rarely gets any voiced dialogue, but it's always felt like a missed opportunity to me to not give Metal Sonic the same voice actor as the real Sonic but filtered, to further emphasize the metallic copy aspect. Also, I saw that Morbius edit you bastard.
16:05 I’m betting Metal Sonic (the real one) is on some sort of training arc, doing his best to get stronger so that he can defeat Sonic to prove he’s the real one. Infinite saw him as just another villain, and Eggman probably overlooked Metal’s reasons for what he did entirely. Infinite just summoned Sonic’s past enemies, and to him, Metal was just another antagonist. That’s why I think he showed up the way he did in Forces. I also want to thank you. I started with the newer Sonic games, and didn’t know of Metal’s crazy backstory, so thank you for rectifying that
I love Metal Sonic, I recently replayed Sonic Heroes, and I consider this was the peak for Metal, but after 2003 there was no idea for him. Notice how in Dark Age he wasn't in games, and then in 2010's was just put in there for no reason with no purpose. After Heroes there's so much potential, like for example, they could have made story arc about Metal based on Amazo from Justice League/Justice League Unlimited, a artificial metal being that was created by super-villain for copying heroes abilities, and then he grows sentient and even starts to becomes more human and a good guy. I'm sad that we will never got this kind of story. Emerl from Sonic Battle is the closest we got for after-Heroes Metal.
I don’t really see Metal becoming a good guy that’s not in his character, he’s made to destroy Sonic plus he’s personality is too cold to become good that would be way out of character for him, but it would be nice to see Metal have plans more smarter and intelligent than Robotnik as in Heroes if you think about it he’s plan was actually pretty smart he steals the characters abilities and got them all together to destroy them.
You just keep surprising me with how accurately you hit the nail on the head with these character essay videos. Sonic Team has neglected and forgotten to actually write these characters for far too long now, and it's a damn shame. I never would have become a Sonic fan as a kid if these characters were as empty back then as they are now. I really hope that Frontiers will be the end of this dark age at least story-wise, and we can start to look forward to these characters being actual characters again.
I feel like free riders originally was going to be more focused on Metal sonic.With how simple the story is and how a lot of character dialogues feel out of character, Metal's sudden reveal at the end and the fact that he can still shape shift,collect data and how he keeps the collected data for himself(disobeying eggman) I feel like they changed the story last minute to fit the new voice cast and the tone of the meta era. I also think the theme song fits metal sonic especially the crush 40 and the beta version with lyrics like "felt so refrained, felt so constrained-but now I'm breaking out " and "Wants to be free, wants to be me, want to be everything that you see, wants to be heard, wants to be known, wants to be high". What do you think? I found this out from a comment on the beta version of free and can't stop speculating lol
0:02 before I start this video could you imagine metal sonic having the reverse dark souls treatment where he’s weak at first but with every rematch he gets tougher forcing players to adapt
16:01, yeah you are right. Why make an illusion of a weaker version of Metal Sonic when you already had the original? Even sonic points this out, as if SEGA knew what they did with Metal was stupid.
I mean at least the comics seem to be trying to do something interesting with him, such as the IDW version truly believing it IS the one true Sonic, to the point where it purposefully tries to infect itself with the Metal Virus which is only capable of infecting living organic beings. When he dips his finger into the virus pool….nothing happens….and he just stand there….looking at his hand
Metallic madness did get us a reveal of metal sonic's voice, the JP bad future version you hear a voice saying to US: "You can't do anything so don't even try it get some help" "Don't do what sonic does" "Sonic, Dead or alive, is mine" those words actually gave me chills
really good analysis as always, I really agree with the sentiment that metal shouldn’t be in the sonic media unless they actually need him there (this goes for knuckles too) because metal being overused makes him less cool, which is definitely not (at least i hope not) what sonic team wants
I definitely agree with you with metal sonic needing to be more of a character rather than a lackey. Heck, why not even have an entire game deticated to him.
When Eggman is out of character for Metal Sonic to copy Chaos during Sonic Adventure and all of Sonic Adventure 2 and this game, it is deadly serious. Even Eggman cannot stop his creation from bringing more destruction than he ever could.
What the next game should be: -Eggmans robots evolve and terrorise -Sonic hunts down Eggman -Eggman boss -Shadow showed to be mind-controlled -Few more areas -Shadow 'final' boss -METAL SONIC PLOT TWIST WITH EVEN MORE LORE
I would have loved it if metal sonic had a boss fight where he is tough as balls, testing everything in your moveset by matching it blow for blow, along with a few extra moves just to be evil.
I'd be interested to see how the films handle him. I'd tease him as a Thanos-level villain. It actually would be pretty easy (in theory) since he has so many forms.
Movie 1: Sonic Movie 2: Team Hero Movie 3: Team Dark + a few hints of Black Doom Movie 4: Amy and Tikal's planet (mystic ruins?) needs help from a shapeshifting metal menace, team hero are teenagers (except for "I'm 5 what is this?" Tails) and go help out. SA1 with proto-Metal Sonic instead of Chaos. Black doom revives metal sonic at the end. Movie 5: Metal sonic comes to Green hills. Sonic CD. Introduce Blaze and Silver in Dark Future? (possible Team Future- Blaze (speed), Silver (flying), and abducted-and-rescued Amy (power) ) Movie 6: Sonic Heroes. (Team Future replacing Team Rose) Movie 7: Metal sonic teams with Black Doom to be the villian of Sonic 06.
It’d be cool. At this rate because shadows been confirmed, I really hope we don’t see the bio lizard because it’s kind of lame. Metal is a way cooler villain
I agree with most of this video, Metal Sonic's potential has been absolutely wasted in the series more recent games... but I have to say I actually liked Metal Sonic in Sonic 4 and *kinda* liked him in Sonic Rivals. (But not really.) (I have a lot to say about Sonic 4, but not so much Rivals. Regardless there's a decent amount of text below, so it's a bit of a read.) In Sonic 4, him destroying badniks in his stages and constantly showing up to challenge Sonic on various fronts in the game and not just races made him feel less like a lackey or throwaway boss fight to me and more like a vengeful rival who was acting on his own. One who was more desperate and more determined than ever to beat Sonic after failing to in Sonic CD. Metal Sonic is fought 5 times in Sonic 4, and each time he tries something different. The first time he tries to overpower Sonic with his newfound power gained from the artifact he uncovered on his own in Lost Labyrinth. (which has the same glowing effect as Super Sonic in the game. Even Super Sonic can't damage Metal Sonic in this state) The second time he tries to shoot down the Tornado from a distance with his own all new aircraft. (with Sonic mostly focusing on avoiding Eggman's aerial fleet to chase down the flying fortress) The third time he challenges Sonic and Tails to a aerial showdown. The fourth time he tries to team up with Eggman and perform similar tag team attacks that Sonic and Tails use during the game. The final time, after all else fails, he finally challenges Sonic to another race, a rematch essentially, only to fail once again. *Essentially in Sonic 4, Metal Sonic tries to outdo Sonic on every front, not just raw speed, but combat, aerial skill and Tag team attacks* This is exactly what I wish the series had done more with Metal Sonic, it's just a shame it's in Sonic 4, as Sonic 4 absolutely sucks at conveying any story without dialogue unlike the Classic games. To me, Metal Sonic in Sonic 4 actually perfectly sets up the villain he becomes in Sonic Heroes, in Sonic 4 Metal Sonic pushes his normal body to the very limit, trying countless different approaches to best Sonic, and fails every single time. I can easily see this furthering his obsession with defeating Sonic, to the point he alters his own body beyond recognition and is willing to overthrow Eggman and create his own plans in Sonic Heroes. *Every Sonic game after that though, screws up Metal Sonic and uses him as a throwaway boss in the exact same setup every single time. It's so stale.* Now Sonic Rivals, the only reason I like what they did to Metal Sonic there, is because I like to think Eggman would have put stricter restrictions on Metal Sonic after Heroes, which prevent him from acting as independently as before. Can't have your most powerful robot turning on you on a whim after all, but at the same time he's too powerful to simply never use again. But this is admittedly just my own take on Metal Sonics lack of personality or purpose in that game. To close off, I think Metal Sonic has just been used the same way in too many games now, and he's never used in creative ways. Perhaps if they gave him an actual story again, he'd be better, but I'd honestly rather see someone else get a random throwaway boss fight for a change if that's all these old villains are worth. (But oh well, I'll take Metal Sonic over a Zavok Boss any day of the week, no matter how disappointing it is.)
@@ドラゴンリュー-f1x Free Riders actually does alot of great things with him, he is disquised as a lesser Eggman robot to race for Team Dark as a member and intentionally acts pathetic so the data can be gathered by the racers for his Extreme Gear Metal Star and when its algorithm is complete, he reveals himself and is the Final Boss, the way they have Sonic defeat him isn't good but still in general, Metal Sonic got a better treatment in the game compared to others.
@@thepjshow I do to I hate how metals been used hes literally just like the other double gangers like robo sonic, mecha sonic, and metal sonic 3.0 how about we bring them back for once and give metal a break I would not mind fighting metal 3.0 it’s a cool robot double ganger I. (Speaking off which why isn’t there a metal 2.0 I’d like to see that)
I wish you talked about other versions of Metal Sonic like Archie or Fleetway. Fleetway my opinion may be the best interpretation of the character. This is still great video
I think the problem is that Metal Sonic doesn’t really serve the purpose as a rival. Considering he has a mental life crisis now. Idk what they’re planning. Maybe they’ll start making him nihilistic like Mephiles or The End? Who knows.
Before video: I hope he makes an appearance in the third movie, not as the main villain but as a side villain. Half way thru the video: Forget the movie, He should be the main villain of the Knuckles series so he has more screen time and development.
It would be really interesting to see Metal in the Knuckles Series. I don't know if I want to see Metal as a side villain in the third film. In my opinion, he should be the main villain of a film, following something similar to Heroes.
@@thepjshow Agreed. I first thought side character (or the final revealed boss) for the third movie due to the hype and build up of Shadow but after your video, he would be a great main villain. Edit: Maybe he can be either the side villain or a non main villain in the third one and then have the end credit or final scene be him repairing himself and hinting at him starting to analyze the team to take them down. Or...maybe he would be in both where, after finally being defeated by knuckles (in the series), he seeks out Shadow to help him analyze the team to find weaknesses.
@@thepjshow I don't know if it would work or not, but I've imagined a Godzilla vs. Kong thing in Sonic 3 where Sonic and Shadow team up to beat Metal Sonic, maybe made with both Sonic and Shadow's data as a way to replace Shadow with a stronger and more controllable counterpart. Although there is a chance that Metal being there might conflict too much with the SA2 story, in which case probably better if he's not there. I'd say maybe he'd fuse with the Biolizard into a version of Metal Overlord but at that point it just sounds like a fanfiction lmao
I actually wish Metal sonic was in Shadow. It could have been awesome to see metal sonic duke it out with another rival of sonic or even be a partner as “the enemy of my enemy is my friend.”
I think that metal sonic would be a lot more interesting if he left Eggman entirely and became a villain himself kinda like in heroes. This way he could be able to focus entirely on becoming superior to sonic. He could even perhaps have his own versions of the badniks like the silver sonics from the metal sonic bossfight in Sonic Mania. Perhaps he would rival Eggman as well as Sonic.
The best thing for Metal Sonic would be if we got a game where we learn that Metal Sonic is Sonic, from a bad timeline future that Eggman was able to rebuild. Metal Sonic is so driven by the idea that Sonic is the copy because in a way, Sonic is a copy. From a timeline where Sonic hasn't become Metal Sonic (and won't ever become Metal Sonic). I wish the Metal Virus story showed us a Sonic that got transformed by it and he looks like Metal Sonic. In the future Eggman was able to beat Sonic, but he couldn't stand this version of Sonic, because it wasn't "his sonic", so he threw him in a time stream. Past Eggman finds this half destroyed Metal Sonic and fixes him up. They've been loving to mess with timelines and stuff since CD so a "bad timeline" Sonic would work wonders.
I had an idea for bringing him back as his own character... I saw there was a line during the Metal Madness fight where he says something like "A robot overlord for a robot empire, how fitting." Older Sonic games had the badniks, animal-styled robots with animals inside. Modern games have replaced them with more generic-looking Egg Pawns. Add to that the whole Metal Virus and Sega CD's bad future... Concept : While Eggman has gone completly self-absorbed and is following his ego, Metal Sonic can return with the goal of turning everything metal. Sonic of course will try to stop this, garunteeing Metal a chance for a rematch, while also establishing that Metal is already making plans for after his victory. Delivery : We start with a generic-seeming VS Eggman story, only Eggman seems impatient and reacts to Sonic's appearance with "Go away I'll deal with you later." Sonic fights anyway, and we soon learn that was according to Metal's plan - Eggman and Metal were fighting for control, and Sonic's arrival just tipped the scales. Metal Sonic then becomes the chief antagonist for the remainder of the game.
He basically got the same treatment as Ultron, started out small, became a rival, then writers started making him a real apocalyptic threat, but then despite the hype their image would be downplayed carelessly.
the comics also gives an excuse as to why the real one was not utilised, he was being upgraded to neo. this was not extended to the duplicates either because eggman wanted him to at least have a semblance of individuality or because the devs forgot about him (pick what you will).
I feel like there's a story of east vs west with Metal last year, with the Japanese Sonic Channel story, a Rival's Challenge and the Ian Flynn penned Rise of the Wisps A Rival's Challenge saw Metal challenging Sonic to a race across Speed Highway for Chaos Emeralds, and Sonic actually treats Metal as a legit threat, not cracking unfunny jokes every two seconds. And Metal in an attempt to try and win, looks to use the Chaos Emerald he has to power himself up to overtake Sonic and win the race. Rise of Wisps however sees him babysitting those two talking pieces of geometric junk as they blether relentlessly in the background, saying very little in the process. Then in the fight against Sonic, they prove to be nothing but deadweight to him with their transformation. Also Sonic Heroes saw Metal transforming into the Metal Overlord, where not even Super Sonic alone could defeat him, needing the help of Knux and Miles. Rise of the Wisps saw him being beaten by a Wisp... Words cannot describe how much I hate that short. It was just as well Sonic and Tails R episode 9 came out the following day and it blew it out of the water with its finale where it felt like things actually mattered and there was stakes when Eggman had the Chaos Emeralds to power his Egg Ghidorah. I also seriously hope Ian Flynn does a lot better in Frontiers.
I didn't hear about rival's challenge, but I strongly disagree about Rise of the wisps. First of it wasn't written by Ian Flynn it was written by Tyson Hesse and some named GGDG. So hope for better writing in Frontiers for different reasons. Second I think this short does a good job introducing him to newer fans. You learn how major of a character he is through other character interactions. Orbot calling him a big brother is not a simple joke, it shows us how much older he is, but also how much Orbot respects him. And don't get me started with his interactions with Sonic, the first time they slam into one another his eyes become much brighter showing us how much he hates sonic. He is only annoyed with, Cubot and Orbot, but when he sees Sonic he straight up despises him. Then, there's my favorite line in this short, that really makes me excited to hear Roger in Frontiers. Which is "He is not looking for a fight ... are you? You are looking for a race." We gone from Sonic trying to calm Tails to angrily call out Metal in one sentence. You can pretty much understand the history between these two from that line alone. The delivery making it even better. Also Cubot and Orbot wasn't completely useless in these one, considering they made the wisp core for Metal. Metal could have lost Sonic without that core. The transformation seemed like a mini parody of the heroes transformation for me. Also in heroes he was Neo metal sonic not regular metal, so him being beaten by wisps and sonic is understandable. Also that wisp that removed his core wasn't just a wisp, but a jade wisp. It kinda had a character, when it made it's story interesting for Sonic and also a character arc throughout this short, considering it was his fault why Sonic needed to save his friends in the first place. Where would be the pay off if it didn't do anything at all in the second part. Also it was a new wisp for Ultimate, the same way Metal was a new addition, so they needed to highlight it. I think this short was the best part of Colors Ultimate, and really does wonders with the characters compared to Colors the game.
@@pond0479 did Flynn not write that, I felt sure I can remember seeing his name attached to it on the Sonic reddit, but I'll keep that in mind for future thanks. But I really did not care for Rise at all. It felt more of the Meta Era rubbish I can't stand. For the other story I mentioned you can find in a radio drama format by searching youtube for "Sonic Channel A Rival's Challenge." Plus Sonic seems alot more in character than Rise, but the Japanese do seem to write him a lot better compared to the English writers, especially in the Meta Era where he's presented more like a bully. Especially with his interaction with Silver in Team Sonic Racing, where he doesn't know when to shut up with the trash talking to actually listen to what his friend is trying to say. And Roger's obnoxious tone only further exacerbates the bully like tone, while Jun'ichi sounds a lot kinder.
@@DemonDethchase Roger didn't bully him he was being playful with him and wanted some excitement. He wanted him to talk back to him harsh as well like how he does with other foes he deals with What was wrong is Silver not knowing how to trash talk when he did in Rivals 2. Also everyone was being playful to each other acting like rivals in the race for fun it wasn't literally. Sonic got serious when Doponda was captured by Eggman and I was done with the jokes and took on seriously demanding him to give back everytime. Even planed to Save everyone and Doponda proving he truly cares for his friends despite that attitude. But yes Jap is better caus they care about their characters.
I'm hoping to see him in the movies. They've did a great job with Knuckles and looks to knock it out of the park with Shadow so it can be the same for Metal Sonic.
Honestly What I feel like Metal Sonic needs is a "the only one who can kill you is me" moment, where he's forced to be the hero because Sonic is completely out of commission by some third party that Eggman has zero control over. Would be a nice way to force self-reflection and some actual characterization since he'd have to stand by his belief of being the "real Sonic" for a while since the original is completely missing.
I never took much interest in metal sonic as much as the others. Maybe because of all the inclusions he had I just thought he was another robot that is a generic boss fight. I haven’t played all the games and my first was unleashed after sonic rush and the original sonic platformers. Metal sonic has just been there as a side character so this analysis is like super different to my own experience
To me, Metal Sonic deserves to be more of an arch-nemesis than a rival. His role in Sonic Heroes proves both his power and intelligence. If writers wanted to, they could have him battle and capture other characters just so he could steal their powers. Just wanna add that.
When it comes to rivals for Sonic, I usually think of 3: Knuckles, Shadow, and Metal Sonic. I also feel like they reflect Sonic in different ways. Look at Pjshow' analysis on Shadow and Knuckles. You will understand. Rather than being a rival who is also a friend like Knuckles or a darker and more serious, but still good hearted reflection like Shadow, Metal Sonic is essentially Sonic without the emotions. Unlike Knuckles and Shadow, I don't think Metal Sonic has a moral code or limits. He doesn't care what he has to do as long as it proves that he's better than Sonic. He is no doubt a villainous, but understandable, evil rival to Sonic. He is the perfect reflection of Sonic. That's just my opinion.
Didn't see this mentioned anywhere in the comments, so... Maligned as Episode Metal is, it does portray the possible reason as to how Metal Sonic went power-hungry in Heroes. He got revived, rebuilt, and found that odd dark power in the Lost Labyrinth, yet Sonic beat him again, not only in several battles, but in another race. Fast forward a few years, and out comes Shadow, the Ultimate Life Form whom gave Sonic a much closer fight than Metal ever could. Robotnik / Eggman might be a frighteningly good engineer, but his programming knowledge is shoddy at best, and Metal's programming combined with the corrupting influence of that (as of yet) unknown power would've pushed Metal over the edge.
I'm going to be Honest,the First Time I Learned of Metal Sonic's existence was in the Olympic Winter Games similar to Silver the Hedgehog,however I made me Interesting to the Character More and More,in my Point of View Metal Sonic is a Combination of the Blue Blur's Speed and Power and the Mad Doctor's Unstable Mental and Superior Complexity but more Amplified while Surpassing the 2 of Them,While Knuckles is the "First" Rival that was Misguided of a Battle of a Unstable Force and a Unmovable Object,and Shadow is the Third Rival of a Battle between a Complexity and a Challenge Someone with Godlike Power and a Literal Demigod that might loook like Opposites but they are More of the Same than they Realize,Metal is the Simple Example other that Robo and Mecha Sonic "If I can't defeat this Freak with Limitless Power,then I will make My Own Freak that Surpass All Limitations" and I Will Admit Sonic Heroes is His Best Appearance with Coping Data from all 12 Characters and Chaos from Froggy and Chocola Chao,however other than making a Cameo in Adventure,being Playable in the Adventure Games,and Many More Metal was Wasted and Overused Too Many Times that the Character deserves Better,also since you are Focusing on Classic Characters and I Wanted Amy Rose and Metal Sonic appearing in Sonic 3,how About Amy Rose be Next.
Hot Take: What if Agient Stone (Robinik's assistant) from the Sonic movies allows Robotnik to upload his consciousness into the body of Metal Sonic, and it is only then he comes to grips with how he devoted his life (even giving up his humanity) for a man who cares nothing for him?
In my opinion, Metal Sonic was one of the best characters in the entire series. I've been a Metal Sonic fan since I first played the full version of Sonic 4 EP 2. I enjoyed his backstory so much that I actually made my OWN metal character. Metal Orion. Unstoppable and chaotic. Much like Metal Sonic, he was a metallic copy, but Metal Orion didn't see himself or Orion as a copy. He saw Orion as a destructive enemy. Metal Sonic was only made to surpass Sonic, but Metal Orion was meant to KILL Orion or anybody standing in his path. He was merciless, and unstoppable. Sonic could defeat his copy, but Orion never even made a dent on his copy.
I think he hit his peak as a character in Sonic Heroes. Back then I didn't expect them to have much else for the character to do after that, and I was proven correct. Cool seeing him around in Sonic CD and other callbacks, but his arc as a villain was largely completed in Sonic Heroes.
Metal Sonic is kind of a twisted version of Pinochio. He wants to be the real Sonic and please his creator. There is a slight difference in Gerald and Shadow's relationship. Before the raid by GUN Gerald cared for Shadow and saw him as a member of his family. Eggman doesn't have the same attachment to Metal and sees him as replaceable. In my head what lead to Metal turning against his creator was Eggman's interest in Shadow. Eggman rescued Shadow and made android copies. Maybe Metal believed Eggman was replacing him with these android copies and wanted to prove himself superior.
IDW does Metal so much justice. In addition to all the great points you bring up, I love that the *ONE THING* that made Mr. Tinker remember that he's Eggman was Metal fucking Sonic. Absolutely nothing else had any effect on him, but the moment Metal shows up he's instantly back as Eggman. It shows that Metal is the one creation he holds most near & dear to his heart, and that the bond between two goes far beyond that of creator and lackey. It's almost like they have a father-son dynamic, which is absolutely FASCINATING. Borderline disturbing for Sonic to think about, but that's what makes it so good. I'm surprised you didn't mention the Mania Adventures holiday special! It's short, but it does a few interesting things with Metal. I like Amy's sympathy towards Metal there and it's something I'd love seeing in the mainline games, especially if they ever try to have a redemptive Metal storyline. It'd probably echo the Gamma storyline, but (hopefully) in a more storied way that late 2000's Sonic games had. Also, the several months long depressive episode Metal has also stands out because it's something *Sonic would never do.* Failure clearly affects Metal a lot (maybe since he failed to prove himself over Sonic?) and it's something I would love to see explored in more detail! Great vid btw, I love all your Sonic character analysis vids, you always bring up excellent points about why the characters *were* so beloved and interesting, and usually pinpoint exactly why they're so empty now (in both our opinions, at least.)
heres an idea: sonic heroes gets a remake. this time with a bonus episode after beating the true ending where you are metal sonic. this is framed like a prequel. it opens with eggman writing a letter (the same letter shown in team sonics story, showing he was indeed going to do everything as intended) and metal sonic is a three-in-one, able to shapeshift into the forms of tails doll and metal knuckles to act as flight and power. the first mission has metal sonic carry out a routine mission in stage 1 for eggman. only... he stumbles upon something that gives him sentience by the end. then he singlehandedly takes eggmans entire fleet down, fighting many of the same battles as in the vanilla game, but with the real eggman furiously trying to get metal back in line. as the game goes on, metal gets more and more unique sections which are much harder than the vanilla ones. along the way he sets up the conflict, disguising himself as sonic to take cheese and froggy, tipping rouge off about a secret weapon that would fetch a high price (being shadow and omega). finally, once metal destroys egg emperor, eggman begins to laugh. one final trump card: he explodes, revealing to have been a copy all this time. while the true eggman was piloting the egg overlord - which looks similar to metal sonic. metal sonic screams that he is the true sonic, having lost his mind due to the new power source driving him mad, revealed to have been a shard of the master emerald. he transforms into neo metal sonic, and once eggman is finally defeated, metal sonic takes complete control of his armies, unable to bring himself to kill his creator, he locks him up. but eggman was able to come up with components to send communications to the chaotix. and thus, sonic heroes begins.
Great video as always. Though I did want to mention something. In generations’ story (as lazy as it was) did have justification for metal Sonic’s appearance. Remember that eggman was encapsulating isolated points in time where he lost. Each level/boss fight exists within its own time bubble of sorts within that white world, which is why sonic fights perfect chaos in a ruined station square. Because that was what happened at that point in time. Aside from that, yeah I agree with everything else. I miss when metal sonic had that level of importance where him just being there was a massive game changer. Nowadays, they just toss him in there for a quick boss fight, which is really lame. I want him to only appear whenever he’s gonna take a larger role in the story. Also, I really hope they give him a voice again. Metal sonic with a voice is so bad ass, I don’t know why they gave him a voice in ONE game, then got rid of it forever.
Fun fact: Metal Sonic in Sonic Heroes was also voiced by Ryan Drummond, much like the real Sonic.
Metal Sonic trying to sound like Sonic to become more real is kinda spooky and cool to think about
Oh really, now that interesting.
*I AM THE REAL SONIC*
Much like the real sonic?
Gosh I wonder who the fake sonic is?
@@juicebox7372 *_I'll make you eat those words!_*
I always had a theory that Metal Sonic’s perception was warped, like when he captured Amy I imagined he viewed it as her being saved from Sonic, who he would likely perceive as a sort of Metal Sonic, and he genuinely believed he was the real Sonic and went mad because he didn’t know why all his friends were so scared of him
edit: looking back this shit was so obvious I didn’t deserve 800 likes on this
It's an interesting idea, I think, but isn't Amy tied up in CD? If she was able to convince Gamma, then she probably would have tried to talk some sense into Metal Sonic, too. But of course, that's certainly not what supposedly happened.
@@artey6671 To be fair maybe Robotnik was the one to tie her up
He probably sees Eggman as his father
Insanely good theory dude, fr
I mean, he pretty much explicitly admits this with his deranged rambling and ranting during the Metal Overlord fight.
If we could look at this metaphorically, he went from a robot Sonic to just a robot.
Basically yeah
I don’t see him doing any commentary in the games
Fun fact:in the lego sonic game,eggman mention that theres a metal sonic that was be able to kill sonic showing the strength of metal sonic
Yeah but metal sonic to him is who thinks he’s the real sonic is why heroes he did so good
metal-phorically
I honestly love the IDW comics so much. They truly preserve that great Sonic storytelling and the writers actually understand these characters well.
Agreed!
I thought the Metal Virus was simply water. I'd only seen snippets, and I thought Metal was simply being curious. That's really sad now that I know the truth.
@@LilyCult What do you mean by that? When I was reading the metal virus part of the comics, I wasn't really paying attention to the details so I'm not sure what you mean
@@aquarify7188 I'd only seen bits of the comic and not all of it. I don't really read the comics, so this was a bit of a revalation for me.
@@aquarify7188 He's referring to one of the anniversary mini-stories that came out during the metal virus arc I think, so you might not have seen it. Basically it follows Metal as he silently contemplates his robot body, and it heavily implies that he is sad or jealous of Sonic being the, well, real Sonic.
When the guy said they thought the liquid was water, it was because Metal dipped his finger into the metal virus fluid and watched as it had no effect on him, since he's a robot.
The crucial thing that made Metal Sonic so memorable in CD was that he was a perfect *thematic* foil, rather than just narrative. The whole game was about exploring the dichotomy of nature and technology and how they can manifest in positive and negative ways for the planet. Metal Sonic is sort of a bizarro reflection of the real thing; a “bad future” Sonic, if you will. Sonic is a champion of nature and has to fight Metal’s influence in every stage. Even tho his appearances are limited, his presence is felt throughout the title because the core themes are always at the forefront of the player’s mind. Even the marketing was careful to frame them in perfect opposition to each other; you could draw a line down the Japanese and European boxart and they’re pretty much a perfect mirror image of each other. Equal and opposite in terms of power, but with Sonic being fundamentally *good* and Metal being fundamentally *bad.* They’re not just fighting each other but also fighting for the future of the planet and it’s aesthetic ideology. There’s a effortless genius to Metal Sonic’s sleek, sharp, heartless design, compared to the softer, rounded and personable look of Sonic. In that sense, Metal Sonic was *made* for Sonic CD, in the same way that Knuckles was made for Sonic 3 and Shadow was made for SA2.
When ripped away from his original context, SEGA is forced to actually create a new motive or emotional hook, which they did with Heroes but couldn’t be bothered to do ever again. If you can’t justify the prolonged use of a character that’s already served his purpose, it comes off as cloying and unsatisfying.
Well, honestly... In my opinion it's sometimes better to use a character SOMEHOW rather than forget about him
@@leritykay8911 *cough cough* chaos *cough cough* then again they didn't really forget about chaos but they saw potential and decided hey kill the water making chaos a perfect way to show how a villain should be used but forces didn't care and I'd rather have a boss against a copy of chaos with the phantom ruby than metal sonic since it would work but metal should be a character that shows up way less frequently sure I'd still like to see him but he is a character that works will only some stories so I wish they fix up everything and continue on to fix metal and all the other characters
E
Jesus christ 2 whole screens of text.
@@DesrhonfromHelio Trouble reading? :(
I think metal sonic had various forms because he wanted to surpass sonic’s super form. Sort of like a “ anything you can do, I can do better “ type of mindset that he has.
A question I have for Metal Sonic’s character is that one of Metal Overlord’s voice lines, he says “he is no longer afraid of anything.” The question is what was he afraid of? I personally think he was afraid of facing that fact that he is not the real Sonic.
I’d say he’s no longer afraid of losing to sonic/being inferior to him, because at that point he’d thought he’d finally surpassed him
I agree, I think his delusions are so intense that he cant handle not being sonic, and in that moment he sees himself as more, a god, he WAS god in that moment, as it took 3 supers to take him down
The fear of being nothing more than a robotic copy of your master's worst enemy.
i think anyone who tries to give layers to these deliberately unidimensional characters has an offset of peterpan syndrome... I love sonic, for the gameplay...But story and characters? please xd... None of these characters should have ever learned to talk...Sonic was defined by his motion, and gameplay, not for stoping and having lengthy cutscenes where the controller is resting for minutes on end on your lap. This is a videogame.
Case in point, Mario and Luigi are still unable to string a FULL sentence together, and their games have ALWAYS been far betterthan anything sonic has been able to accomplish since the genesis era.
Metal Sonic was ALL we needed in terms of an edgy sonic, because he is exactly that, he didnt have to tell you, or speak in a badboy voice. Shadow ruined it all.
@@mailusphoenix8894 You had a point until you got to the second half.
Metal Sonic's characterization in one of the Sonic Mania animated shorts where he is rescued by Amy is pretty darn adorable and one of the best things they did with him sinced Heroes and the IDW series.
Just re watched that video and it's very understandable now. Seeing that Metal Sonic has been losing and losing over and over again to a point where he's given up on trying. He no longer sees himself as the real Sonic, and he can't beat Sonic, so he sees himself as a shameless copy.
RIP metal sonic
Hot take - Neo Metal Sonic should have been the default design from Heroes onwards. Maybe the leather cape is a bit tacky, but the design is badass as hell
Agreed. Especially since his neo version has more going on. It would also be cool to give metal sonic a modern design like everyone else.
Yes, Neo Metal Sonic is GODLIKE
Agreed or at least an empowered form/last resort when all the chips are down similar to inhibitor rings off Shadow or ESP state Silver.
Neo Metal Sonic can actually talk, that would be nice.
Chaos should be Chaos 6 from now on
One thing I wish they had done that might have prevented Metal Sonic from becoming stale was after Sonic Heroes, make his defection permanent and have him be a villain on his own. I think that idea has potential for new and interesting stories for Metal Sonic, like him trying to create an army of his own or something.
That is a cool Idea. Have Metal stop trying to please Robotnik by becoming a better version of Sonic and just have him become his own version of Evil.
Both Sonic Heroes, The OVA, and the comics fully fleshed out his character and personality, anything after those games he became a nostalgia object with no purpose, nice analysis PJ
So, like Shadow?
@@motherfuckingenterprises7436 like pretty much all the characters at this point. It is baffling as to how this happened.
I'd love to see a Metal-centric story where Metal tries to find a purpose beyond defeating Sonic. Maybe after defeating him- even convincing himself that Sonic is dead- his mission fulfilled, he is free at last to forge a destiny he chooses. Then, at the end, Sonic is revealed to not be dead (big surprise) and Metal has a bittersweet ending where he cannot override his programming (or maybe he can in a true ending) and everything he experienced beforehand is cruelly wiped away.
My vision of Metal Sonic is Robotnik's greatest invention. Sonic's first actual perfect doppelganger, matching his speed and agility. Being an actual challenge for Sonic.
Okay, maybe Mecha was more of a challenge but he is more of a upgrade than an invention.
Shadow was just Sonic's...well shadow, he really didn't have a purpose, only SA2, Sonic Heroes and Shadow The Hedgehog gave Shadow an actual backstory than just a side story.
Out of all the inventions Robotnik's made I'd say Metal is the best machine he has ever built. Once was a challenger, proving to Sonic that he was the true Sonic, now being just a mini-boss, no meaning or use for him at all.
Mecha wasn't more of a challange? He was never a big point in neither Sonic 2 and 3. At best 2 but even that is forcing it. And in 3 at best he is better for Knuckles. Metal was the main deal for CD after he was done story literally had nothing more to do.
Metal Sonic was definitely a great rival that unfortunately had his similar traits create more rivals being Knuckles, Shadow and more.
but that knuckles is not bad rival knuckles and metal is better rival
What traits? I can see Shadow being a point of contention because at least he’s also artificial and kinda sorta looks like him but Knuckles and the others? Knuckles himself is a character who got scavenged hard for future characters like Blaze (lonesome serious Emerald guardian who learns about the meaning of friendship) and Silver (naive good-hearted rival who gets tricked by the villain into thinking Sonic is responsible for his home being a mess) and arguably even Sticks (grew up in the wilderness and is driven by instincts) after these traits stopped being used for him. There are better examples, like Johnny from Rush Adventure who is also an Eggman robot who primarily battles Sonic through racing.
@@rainpooper7088 I personally see as 2 main traits their desire at least for while to beat sonic or just seeing sonic as a threat to the things they do.
Metal Sonic- Was programmed to beat/destroy sonic and kept doing till the end of heroes.
Knuckles- Was tricked but saw sonic as threat to his island and the master emerald.
Shadow is pretty easy to explain.
I wasn't thinking about sliver till you brought it up thanks.
Sliver- Was trying to save the future but amused sonic was the one making the future bad.
I haven't seen or played much Sonic rush so I plan on getting more information on that game.
In my opinion, before sonic changed most of their minds expectation (I think Johnny and metal sonic). They saw as a threat and later on after making it was mainly because a friendly rivalry.
The IDW comic also explained why Metal wasn't actually present in Forces. Eggman was basically running updates on Metal so he could become Neo Metal Sonic without rebelling against Eggman, which worked. The updates didn't finish until Forces was over and in the beginning of the IDW comic Metal's goal was now to take over the world so that he could hand it over to his master on a silver platter.
Sounds like a DLC that would've went well...
Metal sonic was my favorite character for the longest time. But over time, I've realized that I don't want him in the games anymore. If he's just there to be there for sales, and have metal sonic fans have hope he'll do something, I don't want him there. Either do something with him, and treat him like a character, or don't have him in the game in the first place. It sucks for me to say that, but it needs to be said
I want metal sonic the character, not metal sonic the jobber
The movies might make him like the prowler from Spiderverse
@@rickyrackey7930 I can just imagine Metal stalking the main characters wherever they go (maybe camouflaged since we're going by sci-fi tech?) and now I just want that so badly.
@@lukasruston8618 Also, make him a bit like Sabertooth from the X-Men movies in which he has no dialogue and just actions.
Remember how Metal Sonic was absent from Sonic X? Personally I was fine with him being a race rival & cameoing the way he did in Sonic Adventure. The 2010s for Sonic were just crap in general as far as the games were concerned.
idw got you there
I’d like to mention that the rings in the walls in cd are actually tied to the time travel mechanic, in other time periods those walls aren’t there, meaning you can grab the rings.
I KNEW IT! but like, why would they do it like that?
They probably didn't have enough time to make the rings invisible or the sonic team thought it was funny. @@Echoline77
cause it incentivises you to go to the other time periods if you think about it for a bit. best you could do other than that is make decorations or fossilized rings where theyd be in the future or past@@Echoline77
@@BlackbeltHitoshi Yeah
The text on the thumbnail should've been
"From overpowered to overused"
That is actually a really good one.
I can imagine Eggman being scared or paranoid to include Metal Sonic into his plans in Forces after what he was capable of in the events of Heroes. Opting for a mindless duplicate than the unstable original, although he could have attempted to build a new metal sonic to aid infinite or maybe he was finished with Metal Sonics in general
The IDW (more specifically, Neo Metal Sonic) comics state that Eggman was actually converting Metal into a Neo form from Heroes, and I guess using the phantom copies to still have Metal Sonics out there. Neo was finished after the world was saved tho.
There's a theory metal sonic is a roboticized sonic from the future. Since if Eggman could create something like metal sonic, why wouldn't he make all of his armies like him?
@@dappleofthedualies Oh yeah that makes sense to use the phantom copies while upgrading and reworking any bit of Metal Sonic so he wouldn't go rogue again. Guess he wasn't completely turn off from the idea of Neo Metal Sonic
@@NintendoMeister2260 Eggman sees Metal Sonic as a work of art in the IDW comics, so he probably sees it as something that can't be replicated like the average egg bot but only refined. I guess the closest we got are the previous versions of Metal such as Mecha Sonic or the phantom copies, or maybe Eggman just has too much pride
19:32 Ngl this image is cute, it makes Eggman look like a dad and I find that both funny and adorable
Honestly, the Forces inclusion makes some sense to me, since Metal is already Eggman's strongest creation, and the Phantom Ruby can mass-produce that and upgrade said copies endlessly with no real effort. It beats having only one Metal with no upgrades. That said I admit I don't know why Metal wasn't there, aside from Eggman maybe considering him obsolete at the time.
Agreed
only excuse I can think off is Robotnik didn't want to risk Metal going rogue again and stealing the ruby for his own ends, we've seen what Metal can do when he decides not to follow orders, would you risk that happening with the Phantom Ruby? I know I wouldn't.
But they might be dumber
@@TheAuron32 could also explain why he's weaker post-Heroes, I'm willing to bet Robotnik limited his power levels to keep him obedient.
@@ryanchua6520 I mean eggman already got betrayed so many times, of course he wouldn't pass the opportunity to limit one of his best lackeys's power
My favorite journey for him was Shard. He works shockingly well as a redemption villian to hero.
I remember growing up on Metal Sonic. All the drawings, all the badass moments, just for Sega to overuse him for “Marketing Values”. I truly love what IDW did with “Reflections”. It shows that Metal is self-aware in this scenario. Him realizing that he’s copy. The fact that there aren’t any moments of dialogue, and just the imagery can set up a good example for telling an awesome story. It made me feel bad for him, I think he dipped his finger into the Metal Virus, hoping it might’ve transformed him into something…different, but to no avail. Him walking away so solemnly is a reminder of that.
...also the fact he can't talk outside of the Neo form. (If we consider IDW canon.)
At the first time when I saw Metal Sonic I fought,"This is gonna be a 2D character without personalitty" and was shocked when they were able to make a robot with actual personalitty
You did however predict the future except for the 2D part
0:11 the disrespect
Metal Sonic is a character I prefer to be mostly silent, I feel his actions show his character the most
Most of his actions alone show how much he despises and wants to surpass Sonic, especially in the Metal Virus arc in the IDW comics in where he touches the Metal Virus and it simply slips off of him while he on looks at Sonic trying to speed of the Metal Virus, he’s just a copy and he’s coming to terms with that. Yet he still wants to overcome Sonic
I guess me and you have some similar views on Metal Sonic
I always viewed Metal Sonic having a voice as a representation of his free will, mainly because in the games where he doesn't have a voice, or when his dialogue is more robotic, he seems to not have that much free will. While I do agree that Metal Sonic being as chattery as Sonic would completely ruin the character, I do think that he should be allowed to talk sometimes.
Nah metal Sonic having a voice in his transformed form shows the scariness of his evolution because the robot suddenly has become sentient and has its own free will.
I agree his original form shouldnt talk cuz its just a robot but the talking adds to his transformation and serves as such a good contrast from normal programmed robot to an actual living thing with emotions. Thats scary which is why it works
I’m gonna give the sonic mania episodes some credit for metal sonic. While they didn’t really use that whole rival thing for sonic, I really like how they made him actually threatening and pretty cool.
The Amy Christmas special was also pretty good for Metals characterization at least to me, in that he gets essentially depressed because he failed to beat sonic yet again and Amy has to pick him back up again
It's sad that characters like Metal Sonic and Shadow were ruined by lazy writing, although I do have hope that the newer games can improve that.
Also hoping we get Metal Sonic in the Sonic movies, maybe as a rival built by Eggman to beat Sonic. Just a thought but nevertheless, good video.
I think metal sonic in the idw comics is pretty good.... In the first arc that is and certain scenes littered around but i think some of the moments were he's underutilized is do to mandates to keep him in a comfortable plave which in a character arc driven comic is bad
@@nolanlong1979 Yeah the idw comics are pretty good. They usually get the characters pretty well.
I was REALLY hoping for that instead of Shadow...they really screwed up there. Since they gave up Shadow instead of Metal Sonic, and Jim Carrey is retiring before Metal Sonic was designed, we can't get him in the movies anymore.
??
@@Turtle22312 I imagine the movie verse of Metal Sonic taking cues from Sabertooth from the X-Men movies and the Prowler from Spiderverse.
I think I know why Metal Sonic was created as an illusion by Infinite.
Maybe Eggman thought since the original failed to beat Sonic so many times, and since Infinite had the power to create illusions, and he COULD defeat Sonic, that maybe he could create a better and stronger Metal Sonic, but as an illusion.
Or maybe because Eggman doesn't want everything that happened in Sonic Heroes to happen again.
I always thought Metal was being repaired/upgraded in Eggman’s workshop.
Metal was being rebuilt and turned back into neo metal
Sonic: *tries to save Metal Sonic from being melted down in a magma pit*
Metal Sonic: *slaps Sonic's hand away* "THERE... IS ONLY ONE SONIC."
Yo I remember that 😄
Can we just have metal be a real threat like in Heroes and ill even say IDW.
Or like the mania cartoons
Or the archie comics
Yep
I think the best thing about Metal Sonic is always that you might know everything that he's going to do, but that won't help you because he knows everything that you're going to do. Strange, isn't it?
Metal Sonic's flanderization reminds me of Shadow's. Both were once good characters early on, but as the years went by, they had no fuckin' clue what to do with them. And then resorted to simplifying them to certain traits that make them shadows of themselves.
That's the Sonic franchise for you
Honestly I agree. Metal Sonic has always been my favorite and while I didn't mind his Sonic 4 appearances, Sonic Forces is where it really it the fan for me. I remember going through that boss fight on the bridge and thinking "Where is the real Metal Sonic?". However I have high hopes for Metal. If Frontiers goes well maybe Sega will keep Ian Flynn writing for future Sonic games. If there is one thing Archie and IDW have taught me about Ian Flynn it's that he can write Metal Sonic like no other.
In conclusion, Metal Sonic wasn't just another robot, it was something more
So basically the takeaway here is that as the years go by, Sonic Team forgets what characterization was written for their characters.
Since you mentioned the comics, I like how they explained why Metal Sonic, despite being willing to betray Eggman in the past for his own ends, has become more loyal to him since Heroes because Eggman stopped treating him like a mere robot and more like a son. That makes the dynamic between IDW Metal and Eggman interesting because they might be the only beings that the other truly cares about… if only the games could explore that to make game Metal as fleshed out as IDW Metal.
I hope that he becomes a as good as idw metal and I have good felling because flin (don't know how to write his name sorry) writes the new games so yeah good day
Metal sonic is one of my favorite characters. I still like Metal sonic, a perfect enemy, he is able to keep up and fight! Thanks for the video!
I'm glad you like it
Oh nice. Appreciate the shout out.
We're completely agreed on Metal. Here's hoping Ian Flynn fixes him and/or he's the main big bad for Sonic 3.
I know he *very* rarely gets any voiced dialogue, but it's always felt like a missed opportunity to me to not give Metal Sonic the same voice actor as the real Sonic but filtered, to further emphasize the metallic copy aspect.
Also, I saw that Morbius edit you bastard.
Great analysis as always, PJ! Metal Overlord is one of the most epic and badass final bosses in the whole series.
16:05 I’m betting Metal Sonic (the real one) is on some sort of training arc, doing his best to get stronger so that he can defeat Sonic to prove he’s the real one. Infinite saw him as just another villain, and Eggman probably overlooked Metal’s reasons for what he did entirely. Infinite just summoned Sonic’s past enemies, and to him, Metal was just another antagonist. That’s why I think he showed up the way he did in Forces. I also want to thank you. I started with the newer Sonic games, and didn’t know of Metal’s crazy backstory, so thank you for rectifying that
I love Metal Sonic, I recently replayed Sonic Heroes, and I consider this was the peak for Metal, but after 2003 there was no idea for him. Notice how in Dark Age he wasn't in games, and then in 2010's was just put in there for no reason with no purpose. After Heroes there's so much potential, like for example, they could have made story arc about Metal based on Amazo from Justice League/Justice League Unlimited, a artificial metal being that was created by super-villain for copying heroes abilities, and then he grows sentient and even starts to becomes more human and a good guy. I'm sad that we will never got this kind of story. Emerl from Sonic Battle is the closest we got for after-Heroes Metal.
I don’t really see Metal becoming a good guy that’s not in his character, he’s made to destroy Sonic plus he’s personality is too cold to become good that would be way out of character for him,
but it would be nice to see Metal have plans more smarter and intelligent than Robotnik as in Heroes if you think about it he’s plan was actually pretty smart he steals the characters abilities and got them all together to destroy them.
@@Skye2993 Well that's also a good way to go. No matter which path Metal could have choose, he was wasted unfortunately.
@@thehedgehognerd Yup unfortunately
Metal Sonic sees Sonic as the fake. Where have I seen that before? Oh, that’s right! Dark Pit sees Pit as the clone
I’ve loved Metal Sonic since Adventures but it’s sad to see him reduced to a generic boss
I loved this video! Thanks a lot for making it!
Glad you enjoyed it!
@@thepjshow I hope Jeff Fowler can do the Blue Butcher some justice. Yeah, that’s his nickname that I came up with.
12:02 ah yes sonic morbius
You just keep surprising me with how accurately you hit the nail on the head with these character essay videos. Sonic Team has neglected and forgotten to actually write these characters for far too long now, and it's a damn shame. I never would have become a Sonic fan as a kid if these characters were as empty back then as they are now. I really hope that Frontiers will be the end of this dark age at least story-wise, and we can start to look forward to these characters being actual characters again.
The thing about Metal Sonic post heroes is that Eggman made some serious adjustments to make sure he would not go haywire in such a manner again.
I feel like free riders originally was going to be more focused on Metal sonic.With how simple the story is and how a lot of character dialogues feel out of character, Metal's sudden reveal at the end and the fact that he can still shape shift,collect data and how he keeps the collected data for himself(disobeying eggman) I feel like they changed the story last minute to fit the new voice cast and the tone of the meta era. I also think the theme song fits metal sonic especially the crush 40 and the beta version with lyrics like "felt so refrained, felt so constrained-but now I'm breaking out " and "Wants to be free, wants to be me, want to be everything that you see, wants to be heard, wants to be known, wants to be high". What do you think? I found this out from a comment on the beta version of free and can't stop speculating lol
Cool
Yeah, that is what I think too. They probably rewrote the lyrics when the story turned out to barely have Metal in it.
0:02 before I start this video could you imagine metal sonic having the reverse dark souls treatment where he’s weak at first but with every rematch he gets tougher forcing players to adapt
16:01, yeah you are right. Why make an illusion of a weaker version of Metal Sonic when you already had the original? Even sonic points this out, as if SEGA knew what they did with Metal was stupid.
Probably cause the original would take time to rebuilt after being defeated.
Not only that, but if infinite can make illusions, why didn't he make perfect Chaos or metal overlord?
I mean at least the comics seem to be trying to do something interesting with him, such as the IDW version truly believing it IS the one true Sonic, to the point where it purposefully tries to infect itself with the Metal Virus which is only capable of infecting living organic beings. When he dips his finger into the virus pool….nothing happens….and he just stand there….looking at his hand
Metal Sonic from 1993 to 2009: Copy robot with a desire to be the real Sonic.
Metal Sonic in 2010: Sonic robot
Only time he was like that in 2010 was Free Riders similiar plot to Heroes
Metallic madness did get us a reveal of metal sonic's voice, the JP bad future version
you hear a voice saying to US:
"You can't do anything so don't even try it get some help"
"Don't do what sonic does"
"Sonic, Dead or alive, is mine"
those words actually gave me chills
really good analysis as always, I really agree with the sentiment that metal shouldn’t be in the sonic media unless they actually need him there (this goes for knuckles too) because metal being overused makes him less cool, which is definitely not (at least i hope not) what sonic team wants
I definitely agree with you with metal sonic needing to be more of a character rather than a lackey. Heck, why not even have an entire game deticated to him.
When Eggman is out of character for Metal Sonic to copy Chaos during Sonic Adventure and all of Sonic Adventure 2 and this game, it is deadly serious. Even Eggman cannot stop his creation from bringing more destruction than he ever could.
What the next game should be:
-Eggmans robots evolve and terrorise
-Sonic hunts down Eggman
-Eggman boss
-Shadow showed to be mind-controlled
-Few more areas
-Shadow 'final' boss
-METAL SONIC PLOT TWIST WITH EVEN MORE LORE
I would have loved it if metal sonic had a boss fight where he is tough as balls, testing everything in your moveset by matching it blow for blow, along with a few extra moves just to be evil.
I'd be interested to see how the films handle him. I'd tease him as a Thanos-level villain. It actually would be pretty easy (in theory) since he has so many forms.
Movie 1: Sonic
Movie 2: Team Hero
Movie 3: Team Dark + a few hints of Black Doom
Movie 4: Amy and Tikal's planet (mystic ruins?) needs help from a shapeshifting metal menace, team hero are teenagers (except for "I'm 5 what is this?" Tails) and go help out. SA1 with proto-Metal Sonic instead of Chaos. Black doom revives metal sonic at the end.
Movie 5: Metal sonic comes to Green hills. Sonic CD. Introduce Blaze and Silver in Dark Future? (possible Team Future- Blaze (speed), Silver (flying), and abducted-and-rescued Amy (power) )
Movie 6: Sonic Heroes. (Team Future replacing Team Rose)
Movie 7: Metal sonic teams with Black Doom to be the villian of Sonic 06.
It’d be cool. At this rate because shadows been confirmed, I really hope we don’t see the bio lizard because it’s kind of lame. Metal is a way cooler villain
You know with the quills Eggman has been given in the movies, he might use it as a power source to create metal sonic eventually.
I agree with most of this video, Metal Sonic's potential has been absolutely wasted in the series more recent games...
but I have to say I actually liked Metal Sonic in Sonic 4 and *kinda* liked him in Sonic Rivals. (But not really.)
(I have a lot to say about Sonic 4, but not so much Rivals. Regardless there's a decent amount of text below, so it's a bit of a read.)
In Sonic 4, him destroying badniks in his stages and constantly showing up to challenge Sonic on various fronts in the game and not just races made him feel less like a lackey or throwaway boss fight to me and more like a vengeful rival who was acting on his own. One who was more desperate and more determined than ever to beat Sonic after failing to in Sonic CD.
Metal Sonic is fought 5 times in Sonic 4, and each time he tries something different. The first time he tries to overpower Sonic with his newfound power gained from the artifact he uncovered on his own in Lost Labyrinth. (which has the same glowing effect as Super Sonic in the game. Even Super Sonic can't damage Metal Sonic in this state)
The second time he tries to shoot down the Tornado from a distance with his own all new aircraft. (with Sonic mostly focusing on avoiding Eggman's aerial fleet to chase down the flying fortress)
The third time he challenges Sonic and Tails to a aerial showdown.
The fourth time he tries to team up with Eggman and perform similar tag team attacks that Sonic and Tails use during the game.
The final time, after all else fails, he finally challenges Sonic to another race, a rematch essentially, only to fail once again.
*Essentially in Sonic 4, Metal Sonic tries to outdo Sonic on every front, not just raw speed, but combat, aerial skill and Tag team attacks*
This is exactly what I wish the series had done more with Metal Sonic, it's just a shame it's in Sonic 4, as Sonic 4 absolutely sucks at conveying any story without dialogue unlike the Classic games.
To me, Metal Sonic in Sonic 4 actually perfectly sets up the villain he becomes in Sonic Heroes, in Sonic 4 Metal Sonic pushes his normal body to the very limit, trying countless different approaches to best Sonic, and fails every single time. I can easily see this furthering his obsession with defeating Sonic, to the point he alters his own body beyond recognition and is willing to overthrow Eggman and create his own plans in Sonic Heroes.
*Every Sonic game after that though, screws up Metal Sonic and uses him as a throwaway boss in the exact same setup every single time. It's so stale.*
Now Sonic Rivals, the only reason I like what they did to Metal Sonic there, is because I like to think Eggman would have put stricter restrictions on Metal Sonic after Heroes, which prevent him from acting as independently as before. Can't have your most powerful robot turning on you on a whim after all, but at the same time he's too powerful to simply never use again. But this is admittedly just my own take on Metal Sonics lack of personality or purpose in that game.
To close off, I think Metal Sonic has just been used the same way in too many games now, and he's never used in creative ways. Perhaps if they gave him an actual story again, he'd be better, but I'd honestly rather see someone else get a random throwaway boss fight for a change if that's all these old villains are worth. (But oh well, I'll take Metal Sonic over a Zavok Boss any day of the week, no matter how disappointing it is.)
The mobius joke is too good
i miss when metal sonic was an actual threat
Yeah, me too
he now eggman easy henchman character sap
@@ドラゴンリュー-f1x Tbh it's been awhile since any of the robotic characters go any major shine in a Sonic game outside of a one off bossfight.
@@ドラゴンリュー-f1x Free Riders actually does alot of great things with him, he is disquised as a lesser Eggman robot to race for Team Dark as a member and intentionally acts pathetic so the data can be gathered by the racers for his Extreme Gear Metal Star and when its algorithm is complete, he reveals himself and is the Final Boss, the way they have Sonic defeat him isn't good but still in general, Metal Sonic got a better treatment in the game compared to others.
@@thepjshow I do to I hate how metals been used hes literally just like the other double gangers like robo sonic, mecha sonic, and metal sonic 3.0 how about we bring them back for once and give metal a break I would not mind fighting metal 3.0 it’s a cool robot double ganger I. (Speaking off which why isn’t there a metal 2.0 I’d like to see that)
I know the fan comics are just that, but i would honestly love if sega actually decided to have metal be a big brother to sage.
I wish you talked about other versions of Metal Sonic like Archie or Fleetway. Fleetway my opinion may be the best interpretation of the character. This is still great video
I think the problem is that Metal Sonic doesn’t really serve the purpose as a rival. Considering he has a mental life crisis now. Idk what they’re planning. Maybe they’ll start making him nihilistic like Mephiles or The End? Who knows.
Before video: I hope he makes an appearance in the third movie, not as the main villain but as a side villain.
Half way thru the video: Forget the movie, He should be the main villain of the Knuckles series so he has more screen time and development.
It would be really interesting to see Metal in the Knuckles Series. I don't know if I want to see Metal as a side villain in the third film. In my opinion, he should be the main villain of a film, following something similar to Heroes.
@@thepjshow Agreed. I first thought side character (or the final revealed boss) for the third movie due to the hype and build up of Shadow but after your video, he would be a great main villain.
Edit: Maybe he can be either the side villain or a non main villain in the third one and then have the end credit or final scene be him repairing himself and hinting at him starting to analyze the team to take them down.
Or...maybe he would be in both where, after finally being defeated by knuckles (in the series), he seeks out Shadow to help him analyze the team to find weaknesses.
@@thepjshow I don't know if it would work or not, but I've imagined a Godzilla vs. Kong thing in Sonic 3 where Sonic and Shadow team up to beat Metal Sonic, maybe made with both Sonic and Shadow's data as a way to replace Shadow with a stronger and more controllable counterpart. Although there is a chance that Metal being there might conflict too much with the SA2 story, in which case probably better if he's not there. I'd say maybe he'd fuse with the Biolizard into a version of Metal Overlord but at that point it just sounds like a fanfiction lmao
i always loved that part at 6:08, when vector rescues eggman, eggman gives him the "sup" nod
Metal Sonic definitely peaked in Heroes. Heroes was what made me love Metal Sonic, and i will always love Heroes for that reason.
I actually wish Metal sonic was in Shadow.
It could have been awesome to see metal sonic duke it out with another rival of sonic or even be a partner as “the enemy of my enemy is my friend.”
I think that metal sonic would be a lot more interesting if he left Eggman entirely and became a villain himself kinda like in heroes. This way he could be able to focus entirely on becoming superior to sonic. He could even perhaps have his own versions of the badniks like the silver sonics from the metal sonic bossfight in Sonic Mania. Perhaps he would rival Eggman as well as Sonic.
but iizuka thinking "shadow is rival metal is eggman son" moment here
he don't betrayal again never .....never
The best thing for Metal Sonic would be if we got a game where we learn that Metal Sonic is Sonic, from a bad timeline future that Eggman was able to rebuild. Metal Sonic is so driven by the idea that Sonic is the copy because in a way, Sonic is a copy. From a timeline where Sonic hasn't become Metal Sonic (and won't ever become Metal Sonic). I wish the Metal Virus story showed us a Sonic that got transformed by it and he looks like Metal Sonic.
In the future Eggman was able to beat Sonic, but he couldn't stand this version of Sonic, because it wasn't "his sonic", so he threw him in a time stream. Past Eggman finds this half destroyed Metal Sonic and fixes him up.
They've been loving to mess with timelines and stuff since CD so a "bad timeline" Sonic would work wonders.
I had an idea for bringing him back as his own character...
I saw there was a line during the Metal Madness fight where he says something like "A robot overlord for a robot empire, how fitting."
Older Sonic games had the badniks, animal-styled robots with animals inside. Modern games have replaced them with more generic-looking Egg Pawns.
Add to that the whole Metal Virus and Sega CD's bad future...
Concept : While Eggman has gone completly self-absorbed and is following his ego, Metal Sonic can return with the goal of turning everything metal. Sonic of course will try to stop this, garunteeing Metal a chance for a rematch, while also establishing that Metal is already making plans for after his victory.
Delivery : We start with a generic-seeming VS Eggman story, only Eggman seems impatient and reacts to Sonic's appearance with "Go away I'll deal with you later." Sonic fights anyway, and we soon learn that was according to Metal's plan - Eggman and Metal were fighting for control, and Sonic's arrival just tipped the scales. Metal Sonic then becomes the chief antagonist for the remainder of the game.
He basically got the same treatment as Ultron, started out small, became a rival, then writers started making him a real apocalyptic threat, but then despite the hype their image would be downplayed carelessly.
the comics also gives an excuse as to why the real one was not utilised, he was being upgraded to neo. this was not extended to the duplicates either because eggman wanted him to at least have a semblance of individuality or because the devs forgot about him (pick what you will).
I feel like there's a story of east vs west with Metal last year, with the Japanese Sonic Channel story, a Rival's Challenge and the Ian Flynn penned Rise of the Wisps
A Rival's Challenge saw Metal challenging Sonic to a race across Speed Highway for Chaos Emeralds, and Sonic actually treats Metal as a legit threat, not cracking unfunny jokes every two seconds. And Metal in an attempt to try and win, looks to use the Chaos Emerald he has to power himself up to overtake Sonic and win the race.
Rise of Wisps however sees him babysitting those two talking pieces of geometric junk as they blether relentlessly in the background, saying very little in the process. Then in the fight against Sonic, they prove to be nothing but deadweight to him with their transformation. Also Sonic Heroes saw Metal transforming into the Metal Overlord, where not even Super Sonic alone could defeat him, needing the help of Knux and Miles. Rise of the Wisps saw him being beaten by a Wisp... Words cannot describe how much I hate that short. It was just as well Sonic and Tails R episode 9 came out the following day and it blew it out of the water with its finale where it felt like things actually mattered and there was stakes when Eggman had the Chaos Emeralds to power his Egg Ghidorah. I also seriously hope Ian Flynn does a lot better in Frontiers.
I didn't hear about rival's challenge, but I strongly disagree about Rise of the wisps. First of it wasn't written by Ian Flynn it was written by Tyson Hesse and some named GGDG. So hope for better writing in Frontiers for different reasons. Second I think this short does a good job introducing him to newer fans. You learn how major of a character he is through other character interactions. Orbot calling him a big brother is not a simple joke, it shows us how much older he is, but also how much Orbot respects him. And don't get me started with his interactions with Sonic, the first time they slam into one another his eyes become much brighter showing us how much he hates sonic. He is only annoyed with, Cubot and Orbot, but when he sees Sonic he straight up despises him. Then, there's my favorite line in this short, that really makes me excited to hear Roger in Frontiers. Which is "He is not looking for a fight ... are you? You are looking for a race." We gone from Sonic trying to calm Tails to angrily call out Metal in one sentence. You can pretty much understand the history between these two from that line alone. The delivery making it even better. Also Cubot and Orbot wasn't completely useless in these one, considering they made the wisp core for Metal. Metal could have lost Sonic without that core. The transformation seemed like a mini parody of the heroes transformation for me. Also in heroes he was Neo metal sonic not regular metal, so him being beaten by wisps and sonic is understandable. Also that wisp that removed his core wasn't just a wisp, but a jade wisp. It kinda had a character, when it made it's story interesting for Sonic and also a character arc throughout this short, considering it was his fault why Sonic needed to save his friends in the first place. Where would be the pay off if it didn't do anything at all in the second part. Also it was a new wisp for Ultimate, the same way Metal was a new addition, so they needed to highlight it. I think this short was the best part of Colors Ultimate, and really does wonders with the characters compared to Colors the game.
@@pond0479 did Flynn not write that, I felt sure I can remember seeing his name attached to it on the Sonic reddit, but I'll keep that in mind for future thanks. But I really did not care for Rise at all. It felt more of the Meta Era rubbish I can't stand.
For the other story I mentioned you can find in a radio drama format by searching youtube for "Sonic Channel A Rival's Challenge." Plus Sonic seems alot more in character than Rise, but the Japanese do seem to write him a lot better compared to the English writers, especially in the Meta Era where he's presented more like a bully. Especially with his interaction with Silver in Team Sonic Racing, where he doesn't know when to shut up with the trash talking to actually listen to what his friend is trying to say. And Roger's obnoxious tone only further exacerbates the bully like tone, while Jun'ichi sounds a lot kinder.
@@DemonDethchase Roger didn't bully him he was being playful with him and wanted some excitement. He wanted him to talk back to him harsh as well like how he does with other foes he deals with What was wrong is Silver not knowing how to trash talk when he did in Rivals 2.
Also everyone was being playful to each other acting like rivals in the race for fun it wasn't literally. Sonic got serious when Doponda was captured by Eggman and I was done with the jokes and took on seriously demanding him to give back everytime. Even planed to Save everyone and Doponda proving he truly cares for his friends despite that attitude.
But yes Jap is better caus they care about their characters.
I'm hoping to see him in the movies. They've did a great job with Knuckles and looks to knock it out of the park with Shadow so it can be the same for Metal Sonic.
Finally I’ve been waiting so long for this video definitely my fav character.
Honestly
What I feel like Metal Sonic needs is a "the only one who can kill you is me" moment, where he's forced to be the hero because Sonic is completely out of commission by some third party that Eggman has zero control over. Would be a nice way to force self-reflection and some actual characterization since he'd have to stand by his belief of being the "real Sonic" for a while since the original is completely missing.
I never took much interest in metal sonic as much as the others. Maybe because of all the inclusions he had I just thought he was another robot that is a generic boss fight. I haven’t played all the games and my first was unleashed after sonic rush and the original sonic platformers. Metal sonic has just been there as a side character so this analysis is like super different to my own experience
I like the times when the characters drop the “Sonic” and just call him “Metal”, giving him his own name and marking him as an individual.
Poor Metal.
To me, Metal Sonic deserves to be more of an arch-nemesis than a rival. His role in Sonic Heroes proves both his power and intelligence. If writers wanted to, they could have him battle and capture other characters just so he could steal their powers. Just wanna add that.
The best way to improve Metal's character would be "experimenting" with a voice chip?
When it comes to rivals for Sonic, I usually think of 3: Knuckles, Shadow, and Metal Sonic. I also feel like they reflect Sonic in different ways. Look at Pjshow' analysis on Shadow and Knuckles. You will understand.
Rather than being a rival who is also a friend like Knuckles or a darker and more serious, but still good hearted reflection like Shadow, Metal Sonic is essentially Sonic without the emotions. Unlike Knuckles and Shadow, I don't think Metal Sonic has a moral code or limits. He doesn't care what he has to do as long as it proves that he's better than Sonic. He is no doubt a villainous, but understandable, evil rival to Sonic.
He is the perfect reflection of Sonic.
That's just my opinion.
If he ends up in the next sonic movie I hope he actually has a meaningful role
Post credit scene, we got tickets full for Edgy the Hedgy
Didn't see this mentioned anywhere in the comments, so...
Maligned as Episode Metal is, it does portray the possible reason as to how Metal Sonic went power-hungry in Heroes.
He got revived, rebuilt, and found that odd dark power in the Lost Labyrinth, yet Sonic beat him again, not only in several battles, but in another race. Fast forward a few years, and out comes Shadow, the Ultimate Life Form whom gave Sonic a much closer fight than Metal ever could.
Robotnik / Eggman might be a frighteningly good engineer, but his programming knowledge is shoddy at best, and Metal's programming combined with the corrupting influence of that (as of yet) unknown power would've pushed Metal over the edge.
I'm going to be Honest,the First Time I Learned of Metal Sonic's existence was in the Olympic Winter Games similar to Silver the Hedgehog,however I made me Interesting to the Character More and More,in my Point of View Metal Sonic is a Combination of the Blue Blur's Speed and Power and the Mad Doctor's Unstable Mental and Superior Complexity but more Amplified while Surpassing the 2 of Them,While Knuckles is the "First" Rival that was Misguided of a Battle of a Unstable Force and a Unmovable Object,and Shadow is the Third Rival of a Battle between a Complexity and a Challenge Someone with Godlike Power and a Literal Demigod that might loook like Opposites but they are More of the Same than they Realize,Metal is the Simple Example other that Robo and Mecha Sonic "If I can't defeat this Freak with Limitless Power,then I will make My Own Freak that Surpass All Limitations" and I Will Admit Sonic Heroes is His Best Appearance with Coping Data from all 12 Characters and Chaos from Froggy and Chocola Chao,however other than making a Cameo in Adventure,being Playable in the Adventure Games,and Many More Metal was Wasted and Overused Too Many Times that the Character deserves Better,also since you are Focusing on Classic Characters and I Wanted Amy Rose and Metal Sonic appearing in Sonic 3,how About Amy Rose be Next.
8:02 that might be a bit of an ego thing like: nobody can defeat my creation not even me that’s how amazing it is
Hot Take:
What if Agient Stone (Robinik's assistant) from the Sonic movies allows Robotnik to upload his consciousness into the body of Metal Sonic, and it is only then he comes to grips with how he devoted his life (even giving up his humanity) for a man who cares nothing for him?
How is that a hot take
That would be incredible, have him brainwashed so he thinks he WAS sonic forced into this, and now wants to conquer his copy, growing spiteful and mad
@@TheGhostOf87 And eventually he could become Metal Overlord!
In my opinion, Metal Sonic was one of the best characters in the entire series. I've been a Metal Sonic fan since I first played the full version of Sonic 4 EP 2. I enjoyed his backstory so much that I actually made my OWN metal character. Metal Orion. Unstoppable and chaotic. Much like Metal Sonic, he was a metallic copy, but Metal Orion didn't see himself or Orion as a copy. He saw Orion as a destructive enemy. Metal Sonic was only made to surpass Sonic, but Metal Orion was meant to KILL Orion or anybody standing in his path. He was merciless, and unstoppable. Sonic could defeat his copy, but Orion never even made a dent on his copy.
I think he hit his peak as a character in Sonic Heroes. Back then I didn't expect them to have much else for the character to do after that, and I was proven correct. Cool seeing him around in Sonic CD and other callbacks, but his arc as a villain was largely completed in Sonic Heroes.
Metal Sonic is kind of a twisted version of Pinochio. He wants to be the real Sonic and please his creator.
There is a slight difference in Gerald and Shadow's relationship. Before the raid by GUN Gerald cared for Shadow and saw him as a member of his family. Eggman doesn't have the same attachment to Metal and sees him as replaceable.
In my head what lead to Metal turning against his creator was Eggman's interest in Shadow. Eggman rescued Shadow and made android copies. Maybe Metal believed Eggman was replacing him with these android copies and wanted to prove himself superior.
Never in my life did I think to compare Metal Sonic to Pinocchio. That is actually really interesting!
12:01 ah yes my favorite sonic game morbius with my favorite catchphrase "its morbin time."
"how the fuck can i play as THIS GUY" fr that was the same words when i first played the game
7:13 killed me!😂
Sonic: how long is this going to go on!
What I would say when something is taking forever
1:32 you actually meet Amy first in Palmtree panic in the end of act 1
IDW does Metal so much justice. In addition to all the great points you bring up, I love that the *ONE THING* that made Mr. Tinker remember that he's Eggman was Metal fucking Sonic.
Absolutely nothing else had any effect on him, but the moment Metal shows up he's instantly back as Eggman. It shows that Metal is the one creation he holds most near & dear to his heart, and that the bond between two goes far beyond that of creator and lackey.
It's almost like they have a father-son dynamic, which is absolutely FASCINATING. Borderline disturbing for Sonic to think about, but that's what makes it so good.
I'm surprised you didn't mention the Mania Adventures holiday special! It's short, but it does a few interesting things with Metal. I like Amy's sympathy towards Metal there and it's something I'd love seeing in the mainline games, especially if they ever try to have a redemptive Metal storyline. It'd probably echo the Gamma storyline, but (hopefully) in a more storied way that late 2000's Sonic games had.
Also, the several months long depressive episode Metal has also stands out because it's something *Sonic would never do.* Failure clearly affects Metal a lot (maybe since he failed to prove himself over Sonic?) and it's something I would love to see explored in more detail!
Great vid btw, I love all your Sonic character analysis vids, you always bring up excellent points about why the characters *were* so beloved and interesting, and usually pinpoint exactly why they're so empty now (in both our opinions, at least.)
heres an idea:
sonic heroes gets a remake. this time with a bonus episode after beating the true ending where you are metal sonic.
this is framed like a prequel. it opens with eggman writing a letter (the same letter shown in team sonics story, showing he was indeed going to do everything as intended) and metal sonic is a three-in-one, able to shapeshift into the forms of tails doll and metal knuckles to act as flight and power.
the first mission has metal sonic carry out a routine mission in stage 1 for eggman. only... he stumbles upon something that gives him sentience by the end. then he singlehandedly takes eggmans entire fleet down, fighting many of the same battles as in the vanilla game, but with the real eggman furiously trying to get metal back in line. as the game goes on, metal gets more and more unique sections which are much harder than the vanilla ones. along the way he sets up the conflict, disguising himself as sonic to take cheese and froggy, tipping rouge off about a secret weapon that would fetch a high price (being shadow and omega).
finally, once metal destroys egg emperor, eggman begins to laugh. one final trump card: he explodes, revealing to have been a copy all this time. while the true eggman was piloting the egg overlord - which looks similar to metal sonic. metal sonic screams that he is the true sonic, having lost his mind due to the new power source driving him mad, revealed to have been a shard of the master emerald. he transforms into neo metal sonic, and once eggman is finally defeated, metal sonic takes complete control of his armies, unable to bring himself to kill his creator, he locks him up. but eggman was able to come up with components to send communications to the chaotix. and thus, sonic heroes begins.
Great video as always. Though I did want to mention something. In generations’ story (as lazy as it was) did have justification for metal Sonic’s appearance. Remember that eggman was encapsulating isolated points in time where he lost. Each level/boss fight exists within its own time bubble of sorts within that white world, which is why sonic fights perfect chaos in a ruined station square. Because that was what happened at that point in time.
Aside from that, yeah I agree with everything else. I miss when metal sonic had that level of importance where him just being there was a massive game changer. Nowadays, they just toss him in there for a quick boss fight, which is really lame. I want him to only appear whenever he’s gonna take a larger role in the story. Also, I really hope they give him a voice again. Metal sonic with a voice is so bad ass, I don’t know why they gave him a voice in ONE game, then got rid of it forever.
I honestly like them mute, not that I dislike their voice, I just find when they’re quiet, they are somehow more expressive