How (NOT) To Use Writing AI
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- Опубликовано: 8 июн 2024
- #ChatGPT #writingadvice
Write a terrible sentence, click “show don’t tell”, and great prose comes out -- is this CHEATING? Programs like ChatGPT and SudoWrite can enable you to produce work above your writing skill level. You can write whole novels with these engines. How should writers contend with this new technology? On the one hand, it’s a tool that produces great results -- why not use it? On the other hand, you’re not getting better at writing -- that’s a problem, right? In my opinion there’s a way to use this productively for writers in certain situations. But at the same time, it should be approached with caution.
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0:00 - the question
1:06 - argument for AI
1:40 - storytime + suggested method
3:19 - who should use this method?
4:41 - who should NOT use this method?
5:44 - who should embrace AI? 
Кино
What stands out to me about AI is that one of the imperatives in writing is to avoid cliche. You don't want your prose to be tedious or predictable, because then your reader tunes out. But since AI aggregates and learns from the majority of what it reads, you'd basically have a cliche-regurgitating robot.
And forget about writing dialogue - to write dialogue well, you've got to understand the individual characters, their motivations, and their emotions, and their personal idiosyncracies and verbal tics. How do you prime an AI to even do that? You'd have to teach the AI who your characters were first, and any effort going into that might as well go into writing the dialogue itself.
I wonder if AI can work for the reverse goal: spotting and calling out the cliches you've used?
I personally want to not use AI, but I can see myself running a draft through an analysis and have the machine put a spotlight on my cliches, like deer caught in headlights (wait, shit).
@@charles3840 I love this idea
I usually use AI for description, and I don't even bother with its suggestions for dialogue, because the dialogue is my baby. It is my precious baby and I have spent a long time putting thought into what each character would say, nagging over every single word to let their unique voice shine. So instead I just let the AI help me with describing the ACTIONS or DETAILS in a scene in a more concise way that flows better. It often phrases things in a way I wouldn't have thought of, or comes up with certain words that I couldn't remember at the moment but they were on the tip of my tongue. Sometimes it even adds some extra detail in a place that felt blank or empty and it helps a lot.
But I will say something that I NEVER do with AI: copy-paste its suggestion in without thinking. NEVER. EVER. I only use it to give me suggestions that I may or may not incorporate. Never word-for-word copy-pasting, I always sift through it, maybe grab half a sentence, change it up, steal a word or two that gives it a better feel or adds color to the scene, etc.
Actually, predictable is why all series sell so well. Nobody buys the next Jack Reacher novel because they'll get something new and unpredictable.
I think you make a great point schnee, using AI as a learning tool is totally valid imo. I think for me the big problem comes from the potential automation of creativity. Especially as an artist, the reason I feel threatened by AI is because creativity has become a commodity. Attaching monitory value to content means adding another barrier to reaching an audience and unnecessary competition. It doesn't necessarily matter if a machine makes your car or does your taxes. Efficiency and accuracy is really important in those areas. But if a machine painted all the art in the museum, wrote and performed all the songs on the radio, and wrote all the bestselling books, that would be very sad for humanity. I think that's the heart of why so many of us get the ick from AI.
why is it not a big deal that ai can do your taxes or build cars
what if doing taxes would be my dream job
or working in an assembly line
of course it isn't, but there isn't really a difference between art and what you mentioned other than the fact that most people enjoy creating art
this isn't anything special. it's just another step towards the technological singularity
@@dzemorek8457 screwing up driving a car can kill and screwing up your taxes can get you fined heavily
Screwing up art doesn't have stakes like that
@@dzemorek8457 I’ve heard that art reflects the culture. What kind of culture can have meaning if it is automated?
@@thepinkestpigglet7529 ok, but after we're done automating the high stakes stuff, what's to stop us from automating lower stakes things like art?
I hope we get to a time where, as a result of AI handling all jobs, there is an excess of wealth, so humans are free to focus purely on what they want to do. Artists will no longer be beholden to purchasers, they can just make art they think is great. Of course, we're not there yet, and the transition has the potential to be a bit rough.
I think there's a concerning amount of AI developers who are attempting to make art in general obsolete through AI.
When you picture the ideal future, you think of a world where AI takes care of the menial work, the labor, the rough parts of society that nobody wants to do. But today what are we seeing? AI isn't being used in that manner, its being used to attempt to supplement the arts. The part of humanity that indulges in creativity, that we were ideally meant to sink our time into in a fully-automated future, is in itself being automated.
Call me a conspiracy nut but it feels very targeted. Because for all the applications of AI they are really trying to push AI into supplementing every artistic genre and medium possible.
I agree. In the ideal future, art is still handmade, just perhaps without the boring parts of the process.
A really good example someone brought up is that of horse drawn buggy drivers and cars.
When cars came, the buggy drivers didn't lose their jobs, they just stopped using horses and used cars instead. They went from cart drivers to taxis, and now we have stuff like Uber drivers.
The point is, cars didn't replace the buggy drivers, they replaced the horses. With art, AI isn't out to replace the "horses", it's out to replace the artist.
@@henryhere better example. Trains and trolleys are more efficient, safer, and cleaner than cars but novelty bias convinced everyone to abandon rail infrastructure in favor of car infrastructure. Now we have a terrible public transportation system, massive levels of social isolation, and noise pollution.
Sometimes people want to solve a problem that doesn’t exist in order to make money.
Supplement is an optimistic way of putting it lol. AI, as it stands, is being used to *replace* the arts
I have about 3 sentences written by AI in my entire 430 page novel. The reason: I had a three day writer's block spell that I was determined to do away with. I slapped ChatGPT in the face with the last few pages and asked it to give me the next few sentences. It did, and it allowed me to move on.
I'm probably going to rewrite those three sentences too, once I polish up the rough draft.
The moral: use AI all over your rough draft if it can get that rough thing done. But then, when you polish it up, don't keep ANY of the AI sentences, because they were just a stepping stone to leap over writer's block. That's my idea of how AI should be used at least. And never more than a sentence or two.
I've never thought of it like that, it sounds like a great way of using it actually, I've definitely been stuck at times not knowing what to immediately come next, and being able to get over that and then come back to it in editing seems like a pretty healthy way of using AI
what exactly is a writer's block? is it when you can't think of new things to put on paper? or is it when you can't find the best way/words to articulate certain ideas? pr something else?
pls be specific because i'm just getting into writing and i keep seeing people get bummed over this writer's block thing.
@@newt2120 Writer's block is where... well, imagine this. Imagine you have trained for months on this specific track for a specific race, and you know the track by heart. Then, when you finally run the race, there's just... a giant hurdle, in the middle of the track. You know the track so well that you could run it with your eyes closed, but you have never practiced jumping, so that hurdle is just... there. That's writer's block wrapped in a blunt analogy. Basically it's when you know where your story is going, but whatever scene you're on, you just can't- seem- to get- past it.
@@HeroDestrin thats where drugs come in 😃
@@newt2120 Ah yes!! Just ask Stephen King how he used to write. Lots of cocaine involved indeed! I, however, do not recommend drug use for writing. Or anything for that matter.
In 3D art there's a particular use for AI art that I think it not only acceptable, but a good idea in many cases. This use case is using AI to generate textures for background assets.
Before AI art came about there was a method for making background assets that a 3D artist named Ian Hubert popularized. It was essentially just taking random photographs of real stuff, slapping the image on an object, and placing it way in the background where nobody would ever notice that it was low quality. By doing this he could create huge, realistic images without wasting time on the parts that nobody really cares about. By doing this he was able to make an entire half hour short film all by himself that looks like it could have been made by an entire professional filmmaking and vfx team.
The principle of his method is that you should spend as little time on things nobody cares about as possible. He sourced his images from random photographs because it was quick and easy. You can easily do the same thing with AI, and frankly I would encourage artists to use AI art generators in such a way. There's nothing wrong with meticulously perfecting every asset in your scene, but if you're just looking to have quick backgrounds that look good, use AI. It'll give you a lot more time to focus on the parts you and others care about.
Interesting, I wonder if this could apply to storytelling in some form
@@schnee1 I think an area where it could be directly applicable could be in games, particularly open-world games. When it comes to making a world feel immersive, NPCs are a huge aspect. Story-relevant dialogue deserves attention and care while villager #14's dialogue probably doesn't. Large studios like Nintendo can certainly afford to create large, immersive worlds all the way down to a random NPC's dialogue, but small studios can't. Currently these small studios have to decide between having fewer NPCs (less immersion), allocating a lot more time writing NPC dialogue (which may take away from time used to refine story dialogue), or having a small set of dialogue that every NPC uses (which makes each NPC less unique, again breaking immersion). With AI small studios could afford to make more immersive worlds while still letting their writers focus on the main story. Villager #14's dialogue doesn't need to be anything special, but if it can be different from villager 13's dialogue it adds a ton to the immersion.
@@simplyepic3258 I don't agree. As someone currently studying to become a game designer, I have developed a gripe with open world games.
If NPC#14's dialogue really is not worth engaging with, why is the option there. Shouldnt you want to make it engaging to reward the few players that bother with speaking to them? Linear games, like GoW can afford to spend so much more time on the things that matter and deliver a much more concise and curated experience. The only open world games I will ever accept as true to their genre, are those without a main story. namely Breath of the Wild.
You have an objective, sure, but you are in no way forced to go one way or another. Pretty much all other open world games are just story based or mission based with a way too big of a map.
it sells so it works.
I can agree on using AI for small things. But please only visually small things. Not the story, or the characters or the plot. Using Ai for those really is like giving up. Both on yourself and the crediblity of the story.
You changed my mind about Writing AI. My first reflex was to reject it, but now I see it for what it is: a tool that could help my writing. Like I could definitely have used the 'show don't tell' thing when I first started...
I would agree, if it wasnt for seeing the pattern. if its this good now, and its gotten this much better in this amount of time... Then in somewhere between 2 to 20 years, its gonna be good enough to where it can write believable novels. And from there the only place it can go is better. Eventually it will replace the writer.
Thats a pretty pessimistic outlook on the situation, but it is what im struggling with at the moment.
Not to mention the fact that public perception of writers is gonna worsen so much. if anyone can just "write me a novel" at an Ai, then what is the worth of typing it all out?
@@zuterwer1835it'll replace the author only when it starts reading minds.
Schnee, there isnt enough praise in the world to describe that entails for a writer, i have watched alot of your content. Including how Arcane writes men and so on. The facts remain the same. I enjoy your content and agree full heartly. Theres a great phrase my dad used to say to me when i was young. "The hardship creates the person, easy times are not the easy times." And i strive to do this as a writer starting out as a hobby to something akin to a career choice if what i want isnt what i truly want.
I'm someone who studied illustration, writing for film, and currently in yr 3 of 4 in animation, so you can imagine how passionate I am on this topic and feel, for lack of a better phrase, under attack from all angles with how rapidly AI is advancing.
I may be competent with math but I know nothing of computers. That said, my biggest grip is when people say that the AI learns just like a human because we all get inspired from external reference. Yes, while humans use reference, we can not just copy wholesale to get the same level of skill.
Even if an amateur spent 15 hours trying to recreate the mona lisa with multiple references, they still wouldn't have the skill to recreate something even 40% as good.
Being neurodivergent, one thing that has helped me slowly chip away at my perfectionism in regards to art is approaching art like engineering, and I'd like to thank my dad for that. Engineering, as far as my father says, is all about problem solving, and always accounting for error. You expect and look forward to the bumps in the road, and the things you need to know to scrap the whole project and build it from the ground up as solid and correct as you can possibly make it.
Most people, even artists, see art as instant gratification. We've all been there when we beat ourselves up or maybe even cry because we can't get something to look like, read like or sound like what it did in our heads. AI is the quick fix to that instant gratification. But it is giving up.
There are little quirks, tricks, and secrets in craft that you will only find from failing faster. From learning how those you admire did what they did, and infusing it with your own experience and limits. It's all about problem solving and learning.
If the creative arts are problem solving skills combined with self expression, AI is burning the question sheet altogether and pulling something from google to give as the answer.
Idk if that all made sense, lol.
I agree 1000%. AI copy what already exists and modify it. It's not the same as a human, they don't have the human condition of struggle and strife and suffering. What's the point of art if it's not human? Money and aesthetics? Sounds empty to me
I don't get the copying thing. I made midjourney draw a raccoon kissing kanye in the cheek under the moonlight and it looked fuckin spectacular. I don't think there's anything like it on the internet to copy
@@-Scrapper- it will copy the individual parts, there’s definitely some art of raccoon kissing something, and Kanye kissing someone. Then boom.
@@-Scrapper- It doesn't copy, however it learns how to draw stylistically from existing artwork, the way humans do as well. The reason people see it as copying is because A. it is derived entirely from existing artwork and images (but then again, humans work the same way, sight is basically just constant reference material) B. it can almost perfectly copy a specific style of artwork, or the style of an artist. and C. they are biased.
The above comment by CATDAD626 summarizes art well, however it doesn't matter if the AI is copying or original, it's not human, it doesn't have intent or reason for what it creates, and so it is nothing more than pretty pictures in my opinion. If that's all you create, then you should be afraid of AI.
If AI can do the menial aspects of art, the things that limit creation to big studios with lots of artists, than I'm all for it. I personally can't wait until AI can do some of my in-betweens for me :P
@@aweeladdie But it's not the big studios suffering, it's the artists barely making a living that they employ. And even worse off are the rest of us who are barely getting noticed and doing our passion projects at a net loss.
I love how you propose a balanced point of view on the topic as well as including your own experiences. I think AI should definitely be used to aid as a tool but never to over take your creativity and writing, and the method you proposed to learn from AI is fantastic. Just keep up the awesome work man, love the places you go to as they seem so interesting!!
GEEZ! 6:41 looks like an amazing view.
Also, Louis L'amour was wonderful! Wrote my favorite book, To the Far Blue Mountains. He was such a wise man, with so much of it scattered throughout his books!
I think a different way to look at this is that it won't necessarily make you "worse" at writing but can allow you to focus on other aspects of writing. We can only learn so much in our lifetimes. But even better than that, writing can now SCALE much better than ever before and it should be easier to demonstrate more direct ROI (meaning it's easier to justify larger writing budgets), especially as these tools get better and we get more use-cases. I'm talking in optimal hypotheticals though.
There was a study where they took a group of people who were good at something (in this case, speed reading) and a group of people who were bad at it. They took them through a same speed reading course to see how much they would improve. They had expected both groups to improve by the same amount, but what they found was that while the "bad" group did improve, the "good" improved tenfold. Which means that putting time and effort into something you're not good at just to be decent at it is a waste of time and effort. You should be investing into things you're good at so you can be brilliant at them. Don't work on your shortcomings, work on your strengths.
Most writers are either storytellers or wordsmiths, there are very few of us who are good at both. Storytellers will never be good at creating awesome prose no matter how hard they try. But they can and do create awesome characters and plots. So why waste time and effort on trying to create the perfect prose, if you can outsource it to the AI and focus on being even better at what you excel at, which is the story itself?
@@daina3628 I don't really think it's fair to take the results of this one study (or even many that agree with it) and apply it so broadly. You're free to link the study, but I don't think that's what the auhtor's would've concluded prescriptively. I can give examples where learning really basic small things and being okay or even just knowing a little about it pays back many dividends. For example, there's many business owners and such who only learned a little bit of finance, and a little bit of accounting, and that little bit of each (for which they weren't great at) allowed them be successful. If you look at MMA fighters, even learning a little bit of one thing you're bad at (a common one being learning just a little bit of ground work) has seen many champions and top fighters who suck at the ground succeed. I think you get the picture.
I don't agree with the second part of your statement at all though. I firmly belive people can become both, or even switch with enough work, practice, and study. I don't think we should put limits on what we can and can't do, because 1, we don't know and 2, it only pigeonholds us into limitations when I'm sure we can find examples of people who have done both. This isn't an argument against AI, outsourcing and so forth to be clear, I just think we fundamentally disagree on what a writer can and can't do.
It’s the same with art too, right? I doubt this is a revelation to most people, but the people that do AI art, hate art. They fuckin despise art and artists, which is why so many AI art users go off on hate tangents about how us artists are gunna be replaced. It’s stupid, it really is, because if you hate art that much, than you shouldn’t be doing it, AI art is just allowing people who hate art, the ability to do art.
Please make videos about Brandon Sanderson's books, I know it's not exactly your area but I'd love to hear your thoughts. Love your videos!
As someone who is working with AI in a big way, the best results come from your input. The AI has no imagination so it will give you something bland without your directions.
The more you input into the story the better, and it will take care of the busy work that slows you down and kills your creative drive. Making it easier to turn thoughts into reality.
There is no busy working in writing
If something feels boring you need to edit it to something intresting
@@thepinkestpigglet7529 In every art there is a busy, technical and repetitive work you have to do and can't just copy paste or mass produce. It isn't all extremely interesting and inspiration, otherwise any prodigy would make the best art right away. It's hard work to make beautiful art.
First time seeing Schnees face
Schnexy lookin man 😳
Lol he has a pfp
I am studying AI at university right now and I love your video. I think you captured the main idea of AI - a tool that assists you and can potentially help you learn. There is no shame in using AI tools as long as you do so attentively. You should never use it as a replacement for your own efforts.
Many people - who are not well-informed about AI - believe this technology is the great savior that will do every task for them in the future. This is not how AI is intended. Unfortunately, it is easy to misuse it - as we know from the AI art debate - and many mistakes are made in the data collection process.
At the moment, AI can only reproduce and combine data it has learned on but is not creative. It cannot express emotions and experiences like humans do and probably never will. Although it is unclear what the future might bring, human artists and writers will never be obsolete. Every piece of art has its story and contains a part of the artist itself and this is what makes (human) art so special.
I've done a bit of technical writing, and I think AI writing tools are probably going to catch on in a big way there. It's essentially the same as the example you gave with the submarine thrillers--the only thing the prose has to do is communicate clearly. I've put in a lot of work over the years learning to write clearly and directly about complex technical topics, but I didn't do that out of love of the craft. It's hard to see why I wouldn't have skipped that and gone straight for the results if the tools to do so had been available to me.
As someone who works with AI, pretty much everything you listed from around 3:50 *can* be done. AIs are at their heart pattern recognition (and reproduction) machines. Anything that can be abstracted as some kind of “pattern,” be it style, voice, foreshadowing and payoff… and AI *can* be trained to do that.
The one thing AI cannot do, and will *never* be able to do without a massive paradigm shift in the fundamental technology, is innovate. Everything it knows comes from data. It can learn the patterns we humans make, but it can’t yet meaningfully make anything truly original.
the amount of quality reference material required to train an ai to your own style and you might as well just write the novel yourself. :P
I know you could make a model to imitate you, but that's still going to be a shallow imitation.
This was a phenomenal take on the subject - as an artist, I'm still wrapping my head around even how to think about AI Art, and a lot of your mindset on this fits that as well. Using it as a learning tool makes sense, and doing as much of it 'manually' as possible is the best way to get your voice and your vision and everything that is 'you' in there - even the flaws are part of that. There's still worries about the mainstream perception of art, or how it'll affect the industry and jobs in the future, but at least I can do my stuff the way I feel is right. Thank you so much for sharing more of your unique background experiences and being funny and awesome!
I'm curious if you could elaborate on what my suggested method looks like when applied to art
@@schnee1 Honestly, I might not have thought that completely through - on second reflection, it'd be an inefficient learning tool for art, seeing as, if I wanted to do something like 'draw in someone's style', it'd be better to look up that someone's art and study it rather than study an AI's take on it. Or study an actual subject instead of creating an AI image and studying that. Maybe it can help create conceptual options that one didn't know was available, but that's not exactly using it as a learning tool, just as another tool in the process. I guess I still have to think harder on it.
hello, from Suriname . i hope you liked your stay and i really like your video essays about writing.
i'm trying to write a short story but was stuck on a point in the story and your tips really helped.
suriname was fantastic! i hope tourism grows more so that people can discover your beautiful country!
An interesting use case I just thought of is as a student who's assigned to reading really dry material. If you had access to an AI that could maintain three same meaning but make the writing far less boring, it could be super helpful to stay engaged
I agree with everything you said but my biggest issue with AI writing and AI art and other AI for creative things is that the companies need to feed the AI something to learn from, and so the people take anything they see that's free online and shove it into the database with disregard to the original artist's knowledge or will. It gets even worse when some companies and people made money off of it, especially when they don't add their own input. But that's more of a problem with how AI is currently approached and handled at its core, and I do think that it can be done better. But yeah, asides from how AI functions right now, I love the idea of using it as a learning to.ol. It reminds me of when artists use bases or Gacha games or pre-made color palettes or adoptables, etc. to start drawing or designing characters or even animating when they don't have that experience beforehand. It's a genuinely helpful to.ol that people aren't gonna rely on forever if they want to get better, and their own input for the final piece is still an important factor.
My reason for writing is that I want to share my ideas with others. And therefore I wouldnt use AI just because then its no longer really my idea, but something that is based of my idea. My wording and prose and whatnot are pretty sure amateur level, but they are mine and my tool to express my ideas. Changing the to be more eloquent or what not doesnt make the writing better but worse cause it fails to meet my goal in a way that my worse writing cant.
00:00 🤖 The video discusses using AI tools, like ChatGPT and SudoWrite, to improve writing efficiency and quality.
00:29 ⚖️ The main argument against using AI in writing is the concern that it may be considered cheating.
01:13 📚 The efficiency of using AI as a writing tool is compared to using a calculator for mathematical calculations.
02:36 📚 Using AI tools is encouraged, but it's important to also use them as a learning tool to improve writing skills.
03:19 ⚠️ Relying solely on AI without working on improving one's writing skills may indicate a lack of seriousness and discipline in writing.
05:26 🖊️ Using AI may besuitable for writers focused on specific genres or niches where prose quality is not a primary concern.
06:52 📖 Established writers with a dedicated audience may benefit from using AI to enhance their prose without a need for significant improvement.
08:18 👥 Engaging with the audience's perspectives on using AI in writing is encouraged, especially in the context of broader discussions on AI in various fields.
It is definitely useful for firsts drafts in my opinion, since starting to write is the hardest part. Ultimately you will have to make changes to adapt the text to what you wanted
I'll use Grammarly to help me where I lack like if I forget to put a word in a sentence, forget to put a comma or something else, and other little things like that. I don't use it to fix every little thing that I write. It's nice to have to fix minor mistakes, but I'm not going to redo the whole sentence like Grammarly will suggest sometimes. I might change a word or two because I'll see that the sentence could be better, but not change the whole thing. Maybe it would be better if I did what they suggested, but I want to know (and like) that I'm the one who wrote it myself.
I actually have no idea where you are for once, but it looks amazing out there!
I imagine this could be a great tool for students in school using the method you described (for example the line you showed of the person writing "x character was angry" and the A.I adding physical descriptions that SHOW anger is exactly how my teacher taught me about 'show don't tell')
Yeah, at the current point AI seems to be at, a lot of this stuff is basically a stand in writing tutor to model basics like that. (And I recorded this video in Suriname, and it was indeed amazing!)
@@schnee1 world's so huge, never know where you might end up truly
I am very young and inexperienced compared to many other people and I aspire to be a filmmaker of some kind. Recently I’ve been scared by nihilistic thoughts and the use of AI in art kinda brings those thoughts back.
I completely agree with your idea that this is for those with certain goals in mind, those who don’t want the hard work and only the results, but I find that idea terrifying: what’s the point of writing anything if nobody cares about your individual worth? What’s the point of doing anything if the results are all we care about?
I think that you need problems to live a meaningful life, and I think that’s why so many people dedicate themselves to specific goals; to give themselves a ‘problem’ to overcome.
However, it would be stupid not to use all the tools at your disposal to achieve your goals.
I think that it’s definitely not as black and white of a topic as I initially thought, and I think that the answer to this problem in my head is to be malleable with what goals you achieve and how strict you are on yourself but what’s the point of dedicating yourself to nothing? (Having no strong goals)
Then again, what’s the point of dedicating yourself to anything?
Damn this has been interesting to think about and I think I’m confusing myself by merging this problem with the problem of finding meaning in life.
I say above all else, feel good, no matter what.
Thanks for inviting me to write this paragraph it’s been fun :D
This is a good point. I believe this could of course be applied to art AI as well with how u could use the AI’s result as a reference & make your own version of the art.
Excellent video, weighting the pros and cons of using AI. I agree with you that tools while they are for making things easier it's also about learning how to improve yourself
Great video, didn't even know/realize that there was such an AI tool. I knew AI were writing mass-produced news articles, for example, but nothing about what you described. Definitely agreed with all your points, very well thought out and considered. Glad I don't have to break my head over ancient Aramaic though!
Love the comment you're making here. Saying such smart things that i really wanna take in and contemplate. But like the last bit i found myself repeatedly rewinding cuz i got so distracted by the cool scenery and appealing, though unrelated, footage. I'm just a sucker for visuals :P
Fascinating topic tho, got my brain juices flowing
Funny enough I worked on a “novel” (end goal is a manhwa) and with chatgpt, I got it to 5 chapters. But I use to ask it for feedback. And it’s surprisingly really good if you ask it to give you detailed feedback. It would give me pointers for pacing, characters, plot ect. It gave me a bit of pseudo-confidence since it is my very first one.
I wanted you to know… that your analysis (especially arcane) videos have been life changing. The way you point out character/world building… you can’t really get this at uni… 😭
Same for me. I usually just type an extract from my script for ChatGPT to review. And then I ask if the dialogue flows naturally, if the pacing is good, and the characters have distinct voices and they don't all sound the same. Usually the AI can identify the personalities of my characters as well, so it can also help you to make sure your character is acting consistently throughout the story.
Can you please tell me which mic and editing tool use for your videos? You are great
I did not read the true title, but rather only saw the thumbnail text; this was not what I expected the topic to be. Very interesting discussion to be had tho.
However, I’d personally say that if writing is to you an art then it would be a mistake of the utmost degree to use AI.
I personally don’t even use spell/grammar check, and I say this not to be braggadocios but as an anecdotal example of my point, when I write for fun/novels/stories as the point of it is to improve and iterate upon my skills. To use this tool would be to take away such an opportunity for meaningful struggle. At least in mine own eyes.
I use it to write my online TTRPG character descriptions, AI is perfect to supplement solo multimedia project. I use it as scaffolding for ideas and back and forth with the machine with my edits of it answers, to refine the writing and see if it's clear enough for it to understand. I write the plot solo, tough. And I don't use it much nowadays because I just got better at writing and adapted my technical writing background to this new style. The best use of AI is when you already have the skill to make something good, but sometimes you get stumped between half-formed ideas and the start of production.
Y'all we gotta share this video everywhere we can.
thx!! please do!
One more time, in case it was lost in my rant: ART REQUIRES A SOUL.
its the same for me when i submit a paper for school, honestly, without the human input. i submitted a paper to the school's review team and they returned it to me with a bunch of annotations about how to make it more concise, and it wasnt just removing words but *telling me* why it was removed. you might get the same results with ai but they cant tell u why to add words or why to use certain prose, i think the method you suggested is literally harder than peer review because u dont get any information you just have to reverse engineer it. believe me, as a socially anxious person, i understand why u would wanna dodge peer review but getting advice from ppl with the same passion hits different.
comment ended up bein kinda long but i like your videos they really do make me introspect like this.
Good take, I do think at this point a lot of the considerations boil down to: ai is useful because its comparable to this other method of improvement, but is there a compelling reason not to just do that tried and true other method?
Hi, I know this is off topic, but are you ever planning on making more of your comic 'Minor Champion' any time soon? I liked the premise of it and from what I read, it seemed like a promising comedy. It's been a while since the last pannel and I just want to know if you have plans to continue it.
Got anything in the works for Kaleidoscope? I think the way it starts everyone with a different episode order is brilliant with how it changes characterization and the plot
Using this technology as a writing tool is really what I want to do. I'm still unsure where to start in all of this and which app I'll be using. But I have a story in my head that I want to put on paper.
I make tabletop role play stories. (mostly Call of Cthulhu, mystery theme in 1920, or anything derived from it)
I find it great for finding starting ideas, or to QUICKLY make generic but believable lore texts and dialogues.
Especially when you know how to properly guide the AI (which is usually by asking it to imitate some precise known writers)
can you link the qna vid where you talk about your process and say which app you use to record and edit on your phone? can't find...thks!
agreed.
same argument about tracing for illustrators, you'll never get gud, if you trace.
you just lower the price market and help Hollywood make shovel-ware.
This is pretty much 100% exactly how I use AI to improve at drawing, great video.
Speaking of A.I, may I mention the genius writing of an actual A.I character in the book series, Scythe? I adore how Shusterman writes them out and a nice change of pace of the usual writing of A.I. I highly recommend reading Neal Shusterman’s works, if you haven’t read it yet.
Thanks for a very nuanced but also common sense take. I think I only came out of your videos moderately-to-strongly disagreeing once or twice. That must be not just due to you being always right, but also because you're an exceptionally competent writer. And that makes you a great person to talk about this "controversial" subject, and I'm glad you did.
One thing that i always remember when someone is talking about ai generated art is one moment were i talked with my sister about a place in Germany. In this place they have a cave with a lot of paintings from early humans but because of the carbon dioxide people exhale they would corrode quite fast if they are available for the general public. So they bild an exact copy of the cave for people to visit. The first reaction of my sister was that she didnt like it. The concept isnt bad but its not the same as the real art
i completely agree with you. i don’t think people need to worry about ai art/literature, (and i love the calculator comparison). there’s no merit, no community discussion/structure, and zero thought process behind ai art/writing. it’s completely useless and meaningless, (unless you want to cheat by boosting your word count on an essay lol). honestly, participation trophies have more value than ai art/writing lmao. people that are worried about it probably have very little understanding about how art, interpretation, analysis, literature, (basically humanities in general) actually work. i don’t think ai art/writing is inherently bad, but i do think that capitalism is going to do its thing and abuse it for commercial purposes; and i think that it will have a negative effect on STEM and business students that might decide to use it for required writing projects.
This is exactly what I am doing with my writing as well. I want to use the AI tools to help me with my story writing, but I am choosing not to use them in the current stage of my writing. I figured that I would finish my stories first and then revisit the story and use the AI's to improve certain things in my story to buff those sections. That way I hope to still keep my energy and flow of my story. Like Schnee said, I want to go through the entire process of writing the story and then only use the AI to improve once everything is done.
This is definitely the best argument I've seen for AI as a TOOL. The behind the scenes learning is very different to actually using this stuff, hand edited or not. Lots of visual artists (the discourse that I'm more involved in as an artist myself) see it as a tool to give you more ideas or to be more efficient, but I don't see losing the idea generation stage or skipping straight to refinement as anything other than bypassing something enriching and valuable.
Additionally, I don't think this world is ready for jobs to be diminished and markets flooded. First artists, now editors. I'd personally like to see people abandon AI too, in creative subjects especially, for the threat they pose, but that's not how it's looking. The best bet now is to stop throwing the word tool around as a buzzword and actually understand HOW this can be used reasonably.
I mostly use AI prompt results as a remedy for my writers block! It really help to get you into a good headspace
So, I used to work in AI and I was a fairly decent engineer before I pivoted towards hard science (biochemistry).
My perspective is that the AI isn't magic, which is what people make it out to be. It requires quite a lot of "prompting". The comparison I'd give is photography vs painting. AI is like photography. In photography, you have to compose your shots, pick the lighting etc. and photography itself is an art. AI is no different. Picking the exact prompts to throw into the AI system to give you the exact results you want is itself a bit of an alchemical art.
In this sense though, writing with AI isn't really writing anymore. It's a new form of art, much like how photography isn't painting. Photography and painting have overlaps and being skilled with one will help a little with the other, but they are no longer the same thing.
My take is that's the choice you have to make. Do you want to be a painter or a photographer? Do you want to write, or learn to use AI systems? Neither is better or worse than the other. Paintings are not necessarily better than photos. If you want to write, write. If you want to master the use of AI, then do that.
I totally agree! AI is a tool not only to create but more importantly learn. It streamlines the process of scouring infinite information. Using it to eliminate tedious tasks without robbing yourself of a learning opportunity is the ideal approach to using these tools. Like you said, eliminate dependency.
Something I found ChatGPT great for is breaking writers block. Kind of like using writing prompts.
Recently, I asked ChatGPT for some sample plot ideas given the two main characters and the genre. I even use the Pixar formula and asked it to fill in the blanks. What I got was 10 vague outlines.
Will I use them all? No. Will I even use them as written? No. But will they help me come up the plots I want to use for this mostly episodic set of stories about some characters (who originally were inspired by a writing prompt from Reddit).
Hey, nothing to do with this video but you mentioned that you would like to work for wizards of the coast in an old video of yours I just watched. Are you a fun of magic ? If so you could maby talk about the colors and if it's a good way to make characters based on a combination of them. I tried it once and it seemed quite fun
I've played magic since I was 7, LOVE the game! And yeah, I think the color wheel is a great method to brainstorm, not something I've used but seems like it would be useful for people who work that way
I'm really glad I watched this and heard your full opinion. The initial comments had me nervous this was a defense of ai.
I think using ai to glean new info is the textbook use case. Translate that Aramaic. Make sense of this pile of data. Etc. Perfect for saving time.
I think the worst use case for ai is to create content in lieu of a skilled, devoted human. If you take away the ai from someone who uses it, what will they be able to produce? That's the point i think the ai proponents don't care about, because money and acclaim mean more to some than being an expert in your craft, or honestly improving upon your skills. After all, if anabolic steroids have been a problem, i guess it's finally time for brainy people to worry about cheaters too.
I don't understand calling ai a tool tho. Every tool requires practice to utilize it effectively. You need to learn how to use a hammer, a firearm, a knife, a stethoscope, even a program like excel... The ai does the work for you and then you decide what to do with it, or get it to spit something else out... That to me is not a tool.
Kind of seems like AI writing would also be super useful in translating work specifically
Out of curiousity, what's the best way to start traveling?
LOVE this timing 🙏
Tomorrow I have to do a big writing session and I was considering getting an AI to help
It's helpful for me to get over writers block, but it should not be used for the end product. As an experiment, I was working on a social media post. Finished it up, then thought about AI and figured I'd try. My work just was superior--condensed and legible. The AI's version was comprehensive, but lacking. So, I could see using it as a tool to start with a rough idea, then take it and run with it.
At the very least, if you're going to use AI tools--try to edit it and not use fully completed sentences by the AI
If you haven't already I highly recommend you watch the last of us. I just watched episode 3 and it's the only show along with arcane that has made me cry
I also would love to see a breakdown of it, lol
i love your videos but, i just have add:
woOoaahHhh (wind)
commenting for engagement
off topic but WAS THAT LOONA OMG
I think the thing with AI art, writing, etc. Is that all of it is pretty much for highschool/college students who don't care about the creation of it, and just want the grade. I say this because I truly believe the point of writing and art is for a human to express themselves. So since art is an expression, saying AI art will eventually be better than a humans, so why bother getting good at art. Is like saying there's robot that can be sadder than you, so why ever be sad. A huge part of intaking art or writing for me is thinking about what the person creating it wanted to show with it. I think that transition from creator to interpreter is very important. So taking away that creation side of it, and just leaving the technically impressive parts is pretty much worthless. Like if I was messaging someone on Twitter, then it was revealed I was part of an experiment and actually talking to an AI this whole time. I wouldn't be like "OMG AI is gonna take over conversations, and I'll never want to talk to another human again!". I'd instead say "That's neat." then go on with my day.
What we're looking at now is more serious than any industrial advancement I think.
Imagine you're making a complex (but rewarding!) meal for your family. Someone could hand you a tool at the beginning that cuts prep time down from 3 hours to 2. Very helpful, right?
Now imagine instead you're cooking that meal, and in the last 20 minutes, someone walks in with fresh pizza, hot wings, and beer; now imagine that disruption happening everytime you set foot in the kitchen. After a while you'd forget about cooking, altogether.
I know that's extreme but with creative ai in particular were talking about our motivation to do anything that's unnecessary but *enriching*. The only thing left of creativity will be the beauty and consumption part.
And it's not quite as simple as opting for the old fashioned route "when you're in the mood." Social media alone had an effect on how people perceive their daily lives--from body image to a sense of existential banality; what will it be like for people to see that even their imaginations arent worth exerting?
I don't think we should underestimate what happens when you mess with the collective notion of possibility. It's as important as any conversations on free will or the scientific steps for falling in love.
On the other hand, to paraphrase Martha Graham 'if we can kill someone's passion for art, maybe we *should*'.
There are exceptions --just like there are people who are exceptionally active and disciplined with exercise regardless of their sedentary jobs. But for the average artist I think creativity--and entertainment/art--is about to lose some of it's intrinsic value.
NB: I'm NOT talking about gatekeeping--the more the merrier, for now. I'm really talking about the next phase of art, where one has no idea if a human or an ai curated what they're reading and looking at.
Another thing to consider is that AI writing tools often directly take the work of other published authors on the internet, including (or even especially) work that is published for fun and free, which is just wrong. Imagine if someone else stole your work to make money.
I definitely agree with using it as a TOOL, though. See the AI-generated text, learn from it, then go back and write something better using what you've learned/observed
What is the AI program used at 0:33?
Just one question that has nothing to do with writing or AI where was that camera placed when it was moving around.
honestly i was against ai art on concept but i really don't draw much and when ai writing came out i was furious XD
To bounce on the topic, and about the calculator example : ruclips.net/video/TGV9wJAd4xE/видео.html
As a "new generation" math teacher, I don't say to my pupils that they need to know how to calculate by themselves "in case you don't have a calculator". I tell that they need to understand how it works to be able to get when they make a mistake. The problem of using tools isn't the tool, nor the "cheating" part. It's the automatism that make us not question the results.
It works for all type of things, actually. An example of of mine is in video games. Looking at guides and learning why "it's meta". This way, I've been able to better undrstand how the game works and adapt to my playstyle.
i personally use AI as a jumping off point. rn im working on a film series set in Minecraft, and i've use AI on MANY occasions to help me nail down the design of characters and settings. it's really helpful, especially since a search of Google Images doesn't provide enough original material, so if I want, say, a giant 3D complex of floating buildings in the vague shape of a tree or mushroom, the only place i can really visualize what it's supposed to look like is with AI. i also use AI to come up with basic information about stuff, like a plot or a world, which i just extrapolate the heck out of. it's basically just free reference material, but better. i agree with your point, AI should not be a replacement, but it is good inspiration
Obviously this observation is coming from looking at the brief extracts you show in this video... I do see a problem with trying to write great STORIES with it.
I saw what it did to the sentence about the tuna on toast... sure, it generated all this beautiful, vivid prose, transforming the humble tuna on toast into a colourful and descriptive breakdown of all the components of that tuna on toast, making us REALLY PICTURE it, in glorious technicolour! We can see it, smell it... TASTE IT!
Except... who cares? I seriously doubt the tuna on toast is meant to be the focal point of that scene (unless it's some sort of stream-of-conscious literary fiction thing.) IT'S JUST FREAKIN' TUNA ON TOAST, get over it already and get on with the story! Imagine if someone decided to use the AI in that way to try and write their entire story for them - and that AI took that same approach to EVERY SINGLE THING that dared to exist in that story? Sweet jingle bells, you'd end up flinging the book at the wall in frustration - assuming you were actually strong enough, since it would also be the size of a garden shed.
And to make sure I wasn't just riffing off assumptions, I put a short extract from one of my own novels-in-progress into Sudowrite and picked 'Show, not Tell.' And yeah, what it pumped back at me was full of extra little details and subtle nuances that weren't there before - but it was at least three times longer, and a lot of those extra details weren't just unnecessary, they completely changed the context of the extract I put in. I think that's pretty dangerous in terms of trying to use it to 'transform' your novel into bestseller material. You could end up with something a world away from the original story you were trying to write, sacrificing your own creative vision for the lure of just pumping out some generic-template 'literary' stuff. As you said, you don't become a BETTER writer - you just use a tool to replicate 'marketable' on demand.
Hi I’m a student in high school right now and am not the best with English and have been thinking about using AI to help me write my essays but also I feel that I would be cheating myself by doing this. I don’t want a career in English I want to be a engineer so I feel like maybe cheating myself won’t hurt me to much as I don’t think I’ll need to do much writing in the future.
If you want to get better as a writer, then use AI carefully to avoid cheating yourself. but you don't want to be a writer, you want to be an engineer. If you don't really care about improving your writing skills, then there is no reason to worry about cheating yourself with AI. You want to be an engineer, not a writer, so focus on improving your engineering skills and get by with writing however you can.
If you want to use ai, write the best possible first draft you can, put it into the ai, read over it and see what improved and how it improved, and then re-write your first draft using that knowledge. Even if you just re-type everything the ai wrote, force yourself to understand what you're typing, and why. It's sorta like doing math and looking at the solutions: it's only bad if you don't understand what you're copying, or if you never try to work without them (once you understand what you're doing).
Keep in mind the type of basic writing you learn in high school is more about effective communicating (or it should be...) than it is about the craft of writing per se. You may not be writing 5 paragraph essays as an engineer (no one should be writing 5 paragraph essays imo, but thats another story), but I'm sure there will be many situations where you'll have to make a persuasive argument, or explain an idea or project, or write a delicate but important email, or be entertaining and personable when explaining something that might seem dry. All of these are (or should be) the focus of a high school writing class, and, whether or not you decide to use AI to learn from, this is what there is to be concerned about when it comes to cheating yourself or not cheating yourself. Good luck!
@@schnee1 thank you, I really love your content and it always makes me smile, I know I've watched your video about writing gray characters at least 4 to 5 times, and your reply really helped me sort out my head on this subject, so even though I don't plan on writing anything soon I will continue to watch to my hearts content.
are you into literary criticism and literary theory?
I think you can intuitively know what good writing is without being good at writing. And in that sense end up writing good writing through trial and error with chatgpt using your intuition as a quality check.
AI is very much like using autotune. Having a naturally good voice or singing skills is still extremely valuable within the industry, and there are many media such as theatre or operas that basically require it, however, autotune simply makes it more accessible to people who want to make music more casually or to those that simply lack the skills.
I am not a good writer, and I never intend on becoming one, however, the ability to more coherently tell stories is a very powerful tool.
That's an interesting comparison, because almost every single album released on a major label in the last ten years uses autotune at least a little. Even the best singers in the world use it because it allows them to get the same result while recording fewer takes, saving time and saving their voice. So will it someday be that even the world's best writers use AI to help speed up the editing process and let them produce the same result faster? I'm inclined to say no, but I don't feel confident in that assessment.
@@phtown That is absolutely true, however, there is a small problem with the comparison of these two tools. While writing is a skill that can be developed by virtually anyone, singing isn't.
I believe that AI will only become more prominent in professional writing, however, I don't believe it will become as necessary as autotune
Whoa, based on the insights of your previous videos I thought you were way older
I just think there is a lot of value in pouring the blood and sweat into a craft.
The exact same piece of art or writing from an AI and a person is different to me. For me, the effort gives these creative endeavors additional meaning, and in some cases, it’s the most important part.
Hebrew school was worth it. I really wish they had one in Indiana.
I’m a professional blog writer and work on a lot of stories in my free time. To me, the prose itself is such a vitally important part of fiction that I would rather die than outsource it to a machine. An author’s personality does not appear in their use of grammar, but it fills their prose-in a sense, prose IS personality. Why does Dickens use some words and not others? Why does Tolkien phrase his sentences as he does? Every word was chosen specifically by the author, even if only subconsciously, and to me, each choice speaks volumes. If you’re only a hobbyist, or you’re exclusively concerned about the surface-level end result, AI prose is fine. But as literature, it’s worth no more than kindling.
Absolutely agree. You can't recreate a human's spirit from AI. People will always be able to tell by writing style and the effort put into it.
Use A.I to learn and improve👍👍
If sturgeon's law: ninety percent of everything is crap.
Does this stay the same, improve or get worse? Everything I consume is either by recommendation or stumbling onto it by luck. And ideally completed series.
It seems to be surface level, improve the prose but the underlying work is still hollow. The short version may actually be better, there are times when you should tell instead of show.
I remember telling every math teacher I ever had that the “but what if you don’t have a calculator” argument was BS because in the future everyone would have calculators all the time. And they always scoffed. Now I’m a math teacher and when my students try to do division in their head I get to say, “USE YOUR CALCULATOR!” so that we can move on and get to the actually interesting stuff.
For me that’s where I hope AI lands. It will bridge the gap in my skills and allow me/anyone to engage with things like art and writing at a higher level.
When my grandpa taught calculus they didn’t get to half the content, including the most interesting parts in my opinion, that I get to teach today because doing things by hand or with a slide rule took so much longer. So I’m hoping Ai writing tools will help students and beginners get past the basics and spend time engaging with the more important aspects of the craft.
I think what AI does is that it produces quality but not flair. AI can't foreshadow a story. AI can't bread crumb the audience. They can't toy with the audience or give the audience catharsis. That's all written in by the author. And good writers can give a very particular tone.
I can tell the difference between the writing style of Rick Rirodan and JK Rowling, for example. They both have distinct ways of crafting their scenes for you.
I think the biggest potential pitfall of AI (in any context) is treating its output as absolute truth. To use something as a tool, you have to let it help you make your own decisions rather thank allow it to make decisions for you.
ChatGPT is just predicts the next word based on many factors, whichs makes it too complex to be able to do paralelisms, metaphores or forshadowing. so its not good for complex storytelling
I think this is a balanced take. Especially considering that what the AI suggests is still flawed. Take the example of George. Yes, the AI is showing that George is getting upset, but the sentences are too long. Depending on the pacing of your scene, this will be disruptive. The AI is also filtering in one of these sentences. Something you should try to avoid as much as possible, since filtering breaks immersion. (This depends somewhat on the POV style you're using but generally this is true.) Lastly, there is an obvious lack of character voice in these sentences. They are generic. This is obviously not surprising since the AI only had one sentence to work with and thus didn't know much about George.
i dont get using ai tools... i love to write and write the words, and an ai tool just seems complicated to set up when i can write it myself pretty quick
How you use AI for writing depends a lot on whether you are a panster or a plotter. I can see how using an AI being an ultimate pantser may be a little bit of cheating. You start to heavily rely on an AI to a point that the software may begin dictate the plot. I can see this, personally, as an issue. While I do appreciate great writing (in the sense of form) I am drawn to stories for their storytelling. And there is a moral problem in selling a story under your name when both the writing and the plot have actually been co-written by an AI.
I can imagine how future writers plot their ideas down to the detail and then load it into an AI to produce a text, though. It will favour the plotting approach over pantsing, because even though the words were put together by a computer, the gist - the story - is still entirely of human design.
It's a bit like screenplay writing. The writer provides the story, but then other people (technical team, director, actors) give it form (and sometimes introduce modifications). We still think that the screenplay author played a not insignificant role in the creation of the film.
I love these Seinfeld references!
lol im so glad someone noticed that
How do you know they arent becoming a better writer by using ai? What if they were learning what to do from what the ai came up with
Speaking as a fellow Jewish guy:
Because *of course* you're Jewish. Super-analytical, extremely competent with your verbal arguments and assertions...yeah, it...checks out for sure. Hahahaha. Fantastic. Great video, too.
*putting the conclusion first, because otherwise it's just too long*
I don't think using calculator or reading translation or using AI-writer just makes your job easier by sacrificing the process of learning; you actually lose minutiae or even the whole new meanings when doing so. Sure, you don't always need them, you're perfecly fine when you need to calculate 7*135 or just want to watch a new Marvel movie just to understand the context. But if you want to excel at what you do or get the best, fullest experience, you should at least be able to do long division without calculator or read a book in original language.
I'm a bit confused by calculator and translator comparisons
The fact that you have calculator on you all the time is not the reason not to learn long division, learning it so you wouldn't need the calculator was never the goal
The goal is to get better at math in general (if we're talking about your first steps in math in school years) or to understand how it works and why it works
Understanding why long division works is very helpful to understand the numerical systems in general; you might always have the simple calculator on you, but you wouldn't always have a tool to transform decimals into hexadecimals
*you can google such a tool, sure, but it's still helpful to understand why smth like A5FF01 codes a color and is the same as 165;255;001 RGB*
And translators or translations are even less useful. I'm not saying translations are never perfect, that would be outright wrong, translations can be perfect in terms of conveying the purpose of the text, such as manuals, rules, even law to an extent, sometimes math or physics, basically anything that explains something that doesn't require language: you would know equally well how to operate your microwave wether you read original manual or the translation. But. The fact that translations can theoretically be perfect doesn't mean they always are. And that's not always the problem of human error: many things cannot be translated perfectly. Say there's a language, where meanings slap/punch/hurt are all represented with one verb X and there is a law, that whoever X another person is punished. Any translation from that language would lose complexity and of possible readings of that law, and translation of that law into that language would create additional meanings. When reading the translation you are reading another text that was written in attempts to recreates the meanings of the original with tool that language has and sometimes even fails to create the best version of translated text, and oftentimes fails to recreate the meaning completely just because the languages have different sets of tools
This was a cool vid. (Not sarcastic)
Saying it's cheating is like saying using a forklift is cheating. Not everything needs to be hand done. Some things are just bulk copy for a bizdev site no one actually reads.
Ok do I mostly write for things like DND content. I use chat gpt like I would a friend.
Hey I have this fae who is in this position what would be some good motivations behind this character that would fit this theme. It’s like an anti writers block device.