Great video, I appreciate the information you're providing. What are your thoughts on back pressure and electric wastegates? The turbo I'm using for my set-up, 9280efr, has a "smaller" than ideal turbine size for a 3 rotor. The few that have used the turbo on 20bs report boost tapering off in upper rpm. My thoughts are with a 4" downpipe and electric wastegate, it should hold the desired boost pressure while also allowing slightly lower back pressure due to the larger downpipe. My main focus is an extremely responsive set-up with great mid-range and decent top end.
I've come to a conclusion with 20B stuff so far that larger turbine wheel is almost always the answer. For Neal's car he did 805whp on 27psi for a super responsive custom 7485, your 9280 would be registered as a 7473 in the same nomenclature. At minimum, you'll want the 1.45 A/R turbine housing and you'll start to choke the turbo easily at low boost. EGate won't help this at all, it's just a different way of controlling the exhaust flow. This setup will have pretty high EGTs due to the turbine wheel design and matching of the 20B, which I hope is not much more than a streetport.
Lambda EMAP Correction? so that means its those widebands located before the turbo at the Turbo Manifold?, for individual Rotor Lambda Compensation i guess?
Yes, if you add more timing, you increase cylinder pressure and lower exhaust gas temperature. If you decrease timing your decrease cylinder pressure and raise the exhaust gas temperature.
@@RGHTBrainDesignDrive With my crappy VQ37vhr I have to be careful not to make the block dance with too much cylinder pressure to low in the rpm range to keep it alive. I am on an Emtron also.
There is some great information in there but I think you've misinterpreted the pressure offset data for the wideband. It isn't to factor in "boost", it's to allow for pressure acting on the sensor itself, which on most tuner cars with a free flowing exhaust is minimal. If mounted in the exhaust manifold it can be huge as you pointed out, but in the downpipe where most people put them, it's small enough not to matter in most instances.
This is for Backpressure (EMAP), which in most systems besides drag racing, is significantly higher than Boost Pressure. I have documents of this all over the RGHTBrainDesign Facebook page with examples of car to car.
When you show Emtron EBP lambda compensation tables, does they count for EBP and WBO2 placements? Because i think EBP pre-turbo (where EBP normally measured) and EBP somewhere in downpipe or lower downstream, where WBO2 most probably installed in most cases, are very different.
I am struggling to find how this would effect the compensation table unless either the manifold, downpipe, or exhaust are a restriction and mis-sized for each other. Realistically this is a numerical plot of the Bosch Motorsports LSU ADV Pre-Turbo Sensor and the datasheet on there has this in table form. The idea being that with pressure differences, our lambda control strategy should change as accuracy fades with more pressure.
@@RGHTBrainDesignDrive Thanks for answer. I understand the idea that with pressure raise (and temp actually too afaik) LSU will not be accurate. My question is how normal user / tuner should tune these 2 tables in realistic situation, where EBP is pre-turbo and LSU after. Or is it not necessary in this situation as EBP quite low downstream and not much compensation needed in real life? I've never had a chance to tune ecu that have such a compensation or used pre-turbo LSU sensors. Most ecus i tune have on-board LSU, but i also keep my dyno WBO2 at tailpipe for reference too. Yes, i sometimes see quite a deviation between (maybe not bc of this phenomenon we are discussing, but rather different controllers accuracy etc) and making my lambda "decision" by spark plug reading and experience.
Great video, I appreciate the information you're providing. What are your thoughts on back pressure and electric wastegates? The turbo I'm using for my set-up, 9280efr, has a "smaller" than ideal turbine size for a 3 rotor. The few that have used the turbo on 20bs report boost tapering off in upper rpm. My thoughts are with a 4" downpipe and electric wastegate, it should hold the desired boost pressure while also allowing slightly lower back pressure due to the larger downpipe. My main focus is an extremely responsive set-up with great mid-range and decent top end.
I've come to a conclusion with 20B stuff so far that larger turbine wheel is almost always the answer. For Neal's car he did 805whp on 27psi for a super responsive custom 7485, your 9280 would be registered as a 7473 in the same nomenclature. At minimum, you'll want the 1.45 A/R turbine housing and you'll start to choke the turbo easily at low boost.
EGate won't help this at all, it's just a different way of controlling the exhaust flow.
This setup will have pretty high EGTs due to the turbine wheel design and matching of the 20B, which I hope is not much more than a streetport.
What I want you to do is reach out for one on one time and tuning and I can explain this to you better.
Lambda EMAP Correction? so that means its those widebands located before the turbo at the Turbo Manifold?, for individual Rotor Lambda Compensation i guess?
Yes, if you add more timing, you increase cylinder pressure and lower exhaust gas temperature. If you decrease timing your decrease cylinder pressure and raise the exhaust gas temperature.
@@spooler7828 That is all relative and not to any indefinite points.
@@RGHTBrainDesignDrive With my crappy VQ37vhr I have to be careful not to make the block dance with too much cylinder pressure to low in the rpm range to keep it alive. I am on an Emtron also.
There is some great information in there but I think you've misinterpreted the pressure offset data for the wideband. It isn't to factor in "boost", it's to allow for pressure acting on the sensor itself, which on most tuner cars with a free flowing exhaust is minimal. If mounted in the exhaust manifold it can be huge as you pointed out, but in the downpipe where most people put them, it's small enough not to matter in most instances.
This is for Backpressure (EMAP), which in most systems besides drag racing, is significantly higher than Boost Pressure. I have documents of this all over the RGHTBrainDesign Facebook page with examples of car to car.
When you show Emtron EBP lambda compensation tables, does they count for EBP and WBO2 placements? Because i think EBP pre-turbo (where EBP normally measured) and EBP somewhere in downpipe or lower downstream, where WBO2 most probably installed in most cases, are very different.
I am struggling to find how this would effect the compensation table unless either the manifold, downpipe, or exhaust are a restriction and mis-sized for each other. Realistically this is a numerical plot of the Bosch Motorsports LSU ADV Pre-Turbo Sensor and the datasheet on there has this in table form. The idea being that with pressure differences, our lambda control strategy should change as accuracy fades with more pressure.
@@RGHTBrainDesignDrive Thanks for answer. I understand the idea that with pressure raise (and temp actually too afaik) LSU will not be accurate. My question is how normal user / tuner should tune these 2 tables in realistic situation, where EBP is pre-turbo and LSU after. Or is it not necessary in this situation as EBP quite low downstream and not much compensation needed in real life?
I've never had a chance to tune ecu that have such a compensation or used pre-turbo LSU sensors. Most ecus i tune have on-board LSU, but i also keep my dyno WBO2 at tailpipe for reference too. Yes, i sometimes see quite a deviation between (maybe not bc of this phenomenon we are discussing, but rather different controllers accuracy etc) and making my lambda "decision" by spark plug reading and experience.
plz edit your smacks out cant watch no more