Growing up I was incredible lucky to have lived through these times, I watched the Apollo 11 launch (and others) and various bits of the mission where possible, and having my dad and his brother both in the RAF at the time meant I had some amazing information to listen to, to see and to be aware of, but the lunex mission was waaaaay off my radar, thank you
Me too. I grew up in Philly in the late 60’s and 70’s and all of us not just Americans were following the Apollo program. The entire world was interested in this. I knew as a kid we were watching true history being made. I wish we had similar things that bring us together now. It’s badly needed. I’m hopeful.
I also grew up during those fascinating years. As vitally important as it was to keep ahead of the Soviets militarily, one of President Eisenhower’s most correct decisions was to make the Space Administration a civilian agency and not leave to the sole purview of the USAF. At around the same time period, Eisenhower, a Republican, in a visionary statement, also publicly warned of not allowing the “United States military/industrial complex” to accrue too much power and influence in Government and it decision making functions.
Whistle blowers from nasa who have given statements to organisations such as the disclosure project have stated many times that no information discovered can be revealed to the public without first being vetted by the military. As in the DOD, the DNI and the NSA. Information which should be available to everyone on this planet is instead hoarded away by the military for tactical advantages over other countries that it calls "allies". An invasion by an extraterrestrial race would be rather refreshing I think and allow people to be free of the yoke of the "empire" that the United State's military complex has become.
@@tomsmith8511 Do you seriously believe "an invasion from an extraterrestrial race to be refreshing"?? I seriously hope that was sarcasm, especially considering that some of the most powerful elites on earth who possess FAR too much influence and control are seriously counting on exactly that to happen- as in an interplanetary war: the ultimate war. The war to end all wars… And humanity. No joke.
@@jmchaser I think invasion was the wrong word, I meant more along the lines of the arrival of a friendly ET race in such force and numbers that the United States could not use its usual tactics to cover the fact up or try and ward the craft off. There is footage on line from a satellite which you have probably seen that shows a ET craft approaching the earth and then what looks like a laser weapon is fired from earth or somewhere in the atmosphere and the craft comes to dead stop and then takes off in reverse back into space. The beam or shot misses the target though thankfully. These kinds of tactics by the US government have again been reported by whistle blowers in the past. They have also spoken many times about the final false flag attack on a global scale which is as you hinted at a fake ET invasion attack using top secret craft designed to look like ET craft. All to try and keep the war machine turning and to create a new enemy for people to focus on. They don't want the rest of the world and normal civilians having contact with advanced intelligent being's who could give them knowledge of free clean energy and easy space travel. Oh no that's only reserved for the United States military and it's puppet government.
All of your channels are excellent. Compact, concise, and so well presented. Packed with information, and just enjoyable. Thank you for all the hard work.
My grandfather on his couple of months before he passed away was very adamant about telling the whole family that he was part of the installation team that set up the Moon Base on the moon and that Russians were building one as well, I remember hearing the story when I was a kid and my dad saying that it was probably the morphine that was making him say odd things but now watching this video has me thinking maybe he was telling the truth.
It most definitely is not, I used personally sourced data from a radio survey of the moon to look for moonquakes and develop a dynamic model of the resurfacing rate and interior selenography of our satellite. There’s very certainly no bases
@@chandrasekharlimit4547 can you elaborate? I'm more likely to believe this guys grandpa than your story of "personal data" or radar readings without further information. Who are you, how did you get that access to data etc? More importantly the moon is hollow and full of lava tubes hence the bell ringing. What did your data show on this?
@@BlacksburgEV We do have bases on the moon, there is no way the Pentagon would just leave the most Militarily and Scientifically strategic real estate unoccupied. There are videos of 24/7 footage of Mars and not on the moon?? Makes no sense. It's logic. If there was a catastrophic event on the earth, and we had not built a lunar base we would be idiots. It's the one of the biggest military secret we keep. How does the Pentagon keep losing trillions of dollars in audits? No one is keeping that money, it's going to our lunar bases. There are huge habitats built there now and on the dark side of the moon there are launch pads for deep solar system exploration and research, also drilling equipment to study the moons core. We've been at this for the last 60 years. Look at the space shuttle, that thing was made to land and take off from the moon. Our government tells us nothing.
Pretty sad that people jump in to dogpile and defend clickbait titles, but that's internet idiots for you. I love Dark5 channels but accuracy and information are why I watch. If that's missing, so is the motivation to return to anything documentary in nature.
I’m a lunar enthusiast, so it comes as both a genuine surprise & a massive treat to learn about this program for the first time tonight! Thank you for your thoroughgoing research and lean, fact-based presentation style. Too many of the space exploration videos on YT are sensationalized click-bait titles & maddening filler content. But yours are solid, informative, get what you see run-downs of trustworthy historical records. Your stuff is the best of what this platform can be and my life & the world is better because of that fact.
Ever read up on Project Horizon? There was a short story in a 1990's Asimov magazine about if they did this. Great story, I have the magazine here somewhere.
I think whenever they impact the moon with those kinetic scientific instruments they are getting rid of these old bases to keep the ruskies and Chinese and indians out.
Interesting indeed... however even IF the U.S. military had fully ran the space program, it almost doesn't change the fact that the N.A.S.A. program was still a sort of military like program in a way but just not explicitly labeled as such.
Most (if not all) of the NASA astronauts back then were still considered active military personnel in their respective branches, so in that sense, yes.
Majority of launches had at least one black ops cia, nsa, or dhs crew member purely there to supervise the secret payloads that nasa were delivering to space for them! Sometimes nasa and the astronauts didn't even know what was onboard!! 😉 A very interesting rabbit hole itself!
Supplying the PX at Fort Lunatic would be interesting. Base housing for families, schools... The 5 mile PT run for the troops... And where would they go on a 3 day pass?
The Greenland glacier base we did build shows how primitive it actually would have been. To their credit that base was pretty cool I mean it did have it's own nuclear generator but a Moon base is about 1000x harder. Yes we should still do it, and we should do it now, but if we had done it back then it would have been disastrous.
@@Ye4rZero Yes, it was a success in that we showed we could do it, we can stick a base under a glacier if we need to... In some ways the Moon would actually be easier as its topographic feature don't migrate by inches a day, especially if we put it in Lunar shadow. But yeah we are talking about lifting dozen of effectively pressurized tin foil huts and either putting them on the surface or digging a giant trench and burning them (for radiation shielding), but it's 1000x more work to lift heavy materials and the tech, while the glacier base could use standard wooden beams. It would have been a cluster**** if we had tried it on the Moon. It still would be, and we should still do it to gain whatever technical advances we can, but we should be under no illusion that it won't be hypercostly like ISS if we want to do it safely, or that we will have some major screw ups.
But what if some Romulan space witches who hate androids hacks those androids and causes them to go haywire and commit a genocide? They might do it on Mars too if we’re not careful. Better to just not create bases on the Moon or Mars. 😁
Great video . I had read about this project many years ago which is essentially an updated version of the Nazis lunar base . I'm glad Eisenhower went with the NASA program instead and that we didn't weaponize the moon. I truly hope it stays that way and that we as a species can collaborate with each other in the future to push forward and colonize space peacefully.
I wouldn't wish the "human race" on anyone. I hope we learn how to fix shit HERE before we go and pollute other worlds and solar systems... colonize... pffft... wake the hell up...
I love that Eisenhower spent his career studying war, then used the knowledge and wisdom he accumulated to caution his government against actions that would propagate military agendas.
Eisenhower was perhaps the wisest president since Lincoln, and certainly the wisest of any since his time. Then Senator Johnson was pushing for a "Department of Space" but Eisenhower countered the he didn't want to create a "permanent beuracracy" to address a temporary problem (keeping up with the Soviet space program). NASA was his compromise, and it was a great decision.
lol.. you people are ignorant, Eisenhower was the creator of the Industrial Military Complex, for a damn good reason, when it comes to Security of World, an Country, public Fred is not the person to have at the helm. Eisenhower Created 54/12 54 the yr 1954. 12/ 12 top secret Senators, to oversee the whole operation, most important of all bury the Fu Fighters out a sight, of joe public.
No, thank you! It makes us wonder just what secret projects are going on today, that remain in the dark? Maybe in twenty years or so you will inform us. You are spoiling us, and I don't mind. Keep it up!
The US Army ballistic missile team was kept in the Army after the USAAC spun off to USAF. The Germans got stashed at Redstone Huntsville. Likely this was US and British engineering, using techniques from Germany, who in turn had used US civilian (Goddard), USAAC high altitude manned medical tests and British aerospace breakthroughs in the 20s and 30s
The Air Force was looking beyond a few short expeditions to the lunar surface and back. They had a vision for an ongoing effort in space that NASA either lacked or abandoned. They wanted to go to the Moon to stay from the get go. They were likewise committed to using nuclear rocketry to fulfill the dream of regular space travel to Luna and beyond. The Air Force thought big! After Apollo, NASA essentially went out of the manned space exploration business.
NASA had no real working plans beyond Apollo. Having accomplished that, they fell into the usual obsession of any bureaucracy- self perpetuation. In doing so, they went for earth orbital missions. The manned exploration of the solar system went into indefinite hold.
@@stevenpilling5318 There is a video here on YT that shows NASA's original plans for the Apollo program. They included building a moon base. All that got cancelled because the government lost interest after beating the Russians to the moon.
That was certainly a factor. NASA, however, surrendered to political pressures and has remained surrendered to nearly the present day. They lost the spirit of adventure. That factor cannot be dismissed as a major impetus for something as monumental as interplanetary exploration.
@@stevenpilling5318 Don't blame NASA my friend, they can only do what they can get funding for. With unlimited money, they would be sending manned and robotic missions everywhere in the solar system and beyond. There's no lack of vision at NASA, just a lack of money.
Recuerdo tus primeros videos sin narración. Me alegra ver cómo tienes tanto para expandirte por tres canales (al menos los que yo conozco). Sigue así, amigo. Espero que disfrutes mucho de hacer estos videos
I don't understand the statement that the computer data storage requirements exceeded those which are even available now. We have billions of times as much capacity now as they did in the late 60s.
You mentioned that data storage and processing capabilities required still exceed what can be done now? Has there not been huge advancement in these areas? What is the basis of your statement please?
I talked to a older gentleman that worked on nuclear missiles specifically the minutemen 3 which he told me he heard enough talk in his classified work to suspect we are already on the moon militarily but not yet publicly. He heard about a few missions to the moon not public but that's all he could tell me as the rest was classified.
@@lostpony4885 maybe I misunderstood the context, but didn’t he say “even to this day,” as in now? I just have to question that in the age of 1TB fitting in a thumbnail clipping.
Clearly the specific manned lunar landing date was defined to beat an expected soviet manned lunar landing to mark the 50th anniversary (1967) of the formation of the Soviet Union. The conception date (1958) was also significant as the aerodynamics of blunt reentry vehicles was not completely understood, leading the mission designers to propose a complex and heavy lifting body vehicle. The mission would have been an Earth Orbit Rendezvous (EOR) requiring multiple launches to accommodate Additional mission mass over an LOR Apollo style mission. Subsequent evaluation would have shown the simpler and lighter Apollo architecture was superior for a simple manned landing in achieving an early possible US manned landing.
This video reminds me of the video game "Lunar Lander" I used to play at the game arcades back in the 80's. Very similar, with a landing that had two factors for success based on limits on fuel and slowing velocity to not crash the Lander. Then i think there was a phase for taking off from the moon and returning to the "Mother Ship". I never got that far, but I did land safely most of the time. Crashing had it's entertainment too !
Funny that you mentioned Lunar Lander(the arcade game)... they are very rare, as many were converted to Asteroids when it came out. I have one, and have had it since 1984. I've played it for more hours than I can count. As for the "lift off and return to the mother ship", I've never heard that rumour, and I can tell you it's not true. I literally played that game for 5-6 hours in "one game"(had to keep adding coins/tokens to put more fuel in the ship), and such a thing never happened. You are right about one thing, though.... it was fun finding new ways to crash that lander. lol!
Very much enjoy and, in general, think your research is spot on. Having said that, in this video you say "computer storage data capabilities NOT available to this day!". As the most advanced storage device in the early 60's was capable of only about 5 Megabytes of data and today for roughly the same cost and same space easily 10x10^10th as much data can readily be had, i must question your accuracy there.
Computer processing power, and memory storage capacity in 2021 are no longer the limiting factors for almost any operation imaginable. Any private individual can buy a flash memory card of 1 Terabyte capacity for £200. Or 1 Gigabyte hard drive in 1995. Or a 10 Megabyte hard drive in 1985. Or a mainframe 3 Megabyte Winchester in 1975, albeit it wasn't cheap as the 5¼ or 3½ inch drives of the PC era. Or, maybe, "that day" was that day, not today.
I read somewhere that when the United States first visited the moon, they discovered a military base of the Soviet Union there. This is so interesting, thank you 🙏
2:35 Imagine the result of a study that concludes further expenditures were wasteful. It would make me wonder if I should fund a new study to see what other ideas would qualify.🙄
Well fun fact we already had a moon base then, and we still have one now. Hardly anyone knows where we actually are in space technologically, but I served with the Navy’s space program to see enough with my own eyes. The whistleblowers coming forward describing American anti gravity spacecraft and the Lunar Operations Command, or the L.O.C., are 100% correct in what they describe. I’ve seen it myself, my own eyes don’t lie, believe me if you want but I’m not crazy and I’m no lier. The Truth is stranger than fiction, and the truth is we have a MASSIVE manned space program right now, and there’s not just one.
@@Streamcatcher Yeah Gary McKinnon saw the list, he just said that he was too high to remember the names lmao but that’s not important, he saw enough. We got an entire large part of the Navy in space where most is kept in its own black word while the conventional white world military goes about say to say unaware of what it now a breakaway civilization.
There has to be something wrong with that statement. Unless, they somehow hoped to track every human being on the planet, in intimate detail. Even then, we could probably hold the data, with quality compression techniques. Collection of the data in the first place would be the hard part. And the Moon would not be good enough to do that. You probably need about 4,000 low Earth orbit satellites to collect the data. Much of it would be retro-deducible rather than immediately known. If a bunch of people get on a bus, you may know who entered the bus, but you probably don't know which people got off where. You have to wait and see where they went to deduce who they are. You might not even know after several movements. Once it can be deduced, you can retroactively say who exited the bus and at what stop. It can be guessed at sooner of course: color of clothing, walking speed, who they are with, previous patterns of people... If it was just tracking and recording where everyone is minus people underground or underwater, say within 50 yards, an ordinary PC could probably hold a decade of that...maybe several...at this stage. Partly it depends on the update rate. Do you want to know second by second, minute by minute, or hour by hour? Minute by minute is probably sufficient for any rational surveillance for even the most intense national security...I would think. Maybe second by second could be kept for a week and then converted to minute by minute after most of the deductions are done. Really, though, this would be a sad thing. The only way it could be good was if it was actually reveled, and all the criminals then knew they would be caught. Crime rates should drop very fast, especially abductions, rapes, and murders. Collecting all this knowledge and keeping it secret, and letting all these crimes go un-prosecuted, would be sickening.
Maybe they meant radiation hardened computing power. Modern chips and memory gain their advantages through very small gate and trace sizes. This is unfortunately easily fried by radiation. Rad hardened chips must use bigger features that can stand having holes punched through them by cosmic rays.
I still don't understand why you could have ''the high ground'' from a distance of over a third of a million kilometers. Even science fiction from that time mentions the moon as a military base. Geostationary spy satellites and spy sats in whatever lower orbit are more efficient. Please keep producing more of these kind of videos!
It would be much mor flexible to have space ships on the moon due to the low gravity. Basically attacking enemies from space, then go back to the moon to refuel and re stock on ammunition.
This proposed military plan to the moon would make a great alternative history story plot on the Sci fi channel. Similar to that other alt- history show " For All Man Kind". Just a suggestion, but I think it would be cool to see. Thanks for sharing. Love all the Dark channels. 😁❤❤👍👍
I work at NASA as a systems engineer, it iterally takes too much resource and is too difficult to mantain a longterm presence or 'lunar base' on the moon. It's not going to happen anytime in the next 100+ years. Sure we could do extended stays of 14days approximately, but there are no actual plans for this and zero budget to make it a reality. Ps - Mars sounds nice but it's not happening for humans.
As a sceptic about manned space flight l watch with interest Mr. Musk's attempts at it. As far as Apollo goes, l wouldn't try to land in my local park in the Lander. Looks very Heath Robinson
I worked at NASA also, the U.S.an Canada built a Solartarium on the moon 1973 completed 1974, the purpose to study a planet that wandered, into our solar system 1960, the planet is still here. Would be a population of 10k plus today, just because you work at NASA, doesn't mean you know. Only those who need to know,/ Know.. ..
Lunex, like the early Apollo program, envisaged large lunar landing systems of the single-unit landing-and-return type as it was felt to be technically simpler and therefore less risky than a system that used multiple smaller spacecraft that required rendezvous and docking. However, this doctrine needed massive boosters for the Earth launch phase, that made the Saturn V system look puny...imagine trying to land the weight of an Apollo command module on the Moon and taking off again...so NASA's Nova system was barely sufficient for Apollo direct Earth-Moon, and an even bigger Earth booster would have been required for Lunex's large and robust aerospacecraft.
isn't this what Sea Dragon and NERVA (And all the derivatives of Nuclear Rockets that spawned from it) were for ultimately? Sea Dragon to get it into orbit with a somewhat reusable first stage, NERVA tug to take it to the Moon?
@@Shinzon23 Both DoD and NASA believed that eventually nuclear was the way to go, but that it would take a long lead time to properly develop...in the timeframe of Lunex and Project Horizon, it was probably going to be too late if the goal was to have an operational moonbase in the middle-to-late 1960s (approx. ten/twelve years).
2:15 "Reasonably Economically" I love how they used to think back in the day... Also Air Forces Lunex Mission seemed more peaceful and friendlier... not the Apollo missions rockets that can be double used as giant icbm missiles... lol
Growing up I was incredible lucky to have lived through these times, I watched the Apollo 11 launch (and others) and various bits of the mission where possible, and having my dad and his brother both in the RAF at the time meant I had some amazing information to listen to, to see and to be aware of, but the lunex mission was waaaaay off my radar, thank you
Alright
Me too. I grew up in Philly in the late 60’s and 70’s and all of us not just Americans were following the Apollo program. The entire world was interested in this. I knew as a kid we were watching true history being made. I wish we had similar things that bring us together now. It’s badly needed. I’m hopeful.
i wish my dad who was born in 46, even believed they went to the moon. i feel like im the mails mans kid. he doesnt even believe in computers.
Top Naval Officer admitted to me they know the moon is hollow (artificial satellite)
This is a fake story. Period.
I also grew up during those fascinating years. As vitally important as it was to keep ahead of the Soviets militarily, one of President Eisenhower’s most correct decisions was to make the Space Administration a civilian agency and not leave to the sole purview of the USAF. At around the same time period, Eisenhower, a Republican, in a visionary statement, also publicly warned of not allowing the “United States military/industrial complex” to accrue too much power and influence in Government and it decision making functions.
Would that we had listened. Sadly it doesn't seem that way, look where we are now.
Whistle blowers from nasa who have given statements to organisations such as the disclosure project have stated many times that no information discovered can be revealed to the public without first being vetted by the military. As in the DOD, the DNI and the NSA.
Information which should be available to everyone on this planet is instead hoarded away by the military for tactical advantages over other countries that it calls "allies".
An invasion by an extraterrestrial race would be rather refreshing I think and allow people to be free of the yoke of the "empire" that the United State's military complex has become.
@@tomsmith8511 Do you seriously believe "an invasion from an extraterrestrial race to be refreshing"?? I seriously hope that was sarcasm, especially considering that some of the most powerful elites on earth who possess FAR too much influence and control are seriously counting on exactly that to happen- as in an interplanetary war: the ultimate war. The war to end all wars… And humanity. No joke.
@@jmchaser I think invasion was the wrong word, I meant more along the lines of the arrival of a friendly ET race in such force and numbers that the United States could not use its usual tactics to cover the fact up or try and ward the craft off. There is footage on line from a satellite which you have probably seen that shows a ET craft approaching the earth and then what looks like a laser weapon is fired from earth or somewhere in the atmosphere and the craft comes to dead stop and then takes off in reverse back into space. The beam or shot misses the target though thankfully.
These kinds of tactics by the US government have again been reported by whistle blowers in the past.
They have also spoken many times about the final false flag attack on a global scale which is as you hinted at a fake ET invasion attack using top secret craft designed to look like ET craft.
All to try and keep the war machine turning and to create a new enemy for people to focus on.
They don't want the rest of the world and normal civilians having contact with advanced intelligent being's who could give them knowledge of free clean energy and easy space travel.
Oh no that's only reserved for the United States military and it's puppet government.
@@tomsmith8511 Take your meds
All of your channels are excellent. Compact, concise, and so well presented. Packed with information, and just enjoyable. Thank you for all the hard work.
Concise? You're dreaming.
My grandfather on his couple of months before he passed away was very adamant about telling the whole family that he was part of the installation team that set up the Moon Base on the moon and that Russians were building one as well, I remember hearing the story when I was a kid and my dad saying that it was probably the morphine that was making him say odd things but now watching this video has me thinking maybe he was telling the truth.
It most definitely is not, I used personally sourced data from a radio survey of the moon to look for moonquakes and develop a dynamic model of the resurfacing rate and interior selenography of our satellite. There’s very certainly no bases
@@chandrasekharlimit4547 The moon is hollow
@@chandrasekharlimit4547 can you elaborate? I'm more likely to believe this guys grandpa than your story of "personal data" or radar readings without further information.
Who are you, how did you get that access to data etc? More importantly the moon is hollow and full of lava tubes hence the bell ringing. What did your data show on this?
@@chandrasekharlimit4547 stupid asf stop lying he's nobody why you think that he's not answering you with any facts...
@@BlacksburgEV We do have bases on the moon, there is no way the Pentagon would just leave the most Militarily and Scientifically strategic real estate unoccupied. There are videos of 24/7 footage of Mars and not on the moon?? Makes no sense. It's logic. If there was a catastrophic event on the earth, and we had not built a lunar base we would be idiots. It's the one of the biggest military secret we keep. How does the Pentagon keep losing trillions of dollars in audits? No one is keeping that money, it's going to our lunar bases. There are huge habitats built there now and on the dark side of the moon there are launch pads for deep solar system exploration and research, also drilling equipment to study the moons core. We've been at this for the last 60 years. Look at the space shuttle, that thing was made to land and take off from the moon. Our government tells us nothing.
If it does not exist "plan" belongs in the title. Using a possessive is incorrect.
Very much agree. Very click baity
Being a prick about it is just as distasteful.
They tell me you're a riot at parties.
USS Pedanterprise, now arriving!
Pretty sad that people jump in to dogpile and defend clickbait titles, but that's internet idiots for you. I love Dark5 channels but accuracy and information are why I watch. If that's missing, so is the motivation to return to anything documentary in nature.
I’m a lunar enthusiast, so it comes as both a genuine surprise & a massive treat to learn about this program for the first time tonight! Thank you for your thoroughgoing research and lean, fact-based presentation style. Too many of the space exploration videos on YT are sensationalized click-bait titles & maddening filler content. But yours are solid, informative, get what you see run-downs of trustworthy historical records. Your stuff is the best of what this platform can be and my life & the world is better because of that fact.
This is real
Ever read up on Project Horizon? There was a short story in a 1990's Asimov magazine about if they did this. Great story, I have the magazine here somewhere.
Exactly
I think whenever they impact the moon with those kinetic scientific instruments they are getting rid of these old bases to keep the ruskies and Chinese and indians out.
Great video but still a click bait title, it makes it seem like there’s actually a base on the moon
Notice every single last one of these plans for colonizing the moon were proposed before the Apollo program started
Apollo 7/1968 was the beginning, of plan A, a base on the moon.
I love the old schooly animation.
Shades of Clutch Cargo.
I was digging it too!
@@brianedwards7142 More like the cartoon series that followed Clutch Cargo which is Space Angel!
@@11jazzygd11 SPACE *pause for effect* ANGEL! 👄
The computer voice is quite annoying, though. If you are a human, I apologize.
Sounds like For All Mankind on Apple TV.
(Outstanding show btw.)
Great show concept, but tainted with social justice nonsense.
Very pie-in-the-sky stuff, this.
Literally.
Loved the Johnny Quest animation scenes!
Im so glad I found this channel. So many things I had no idea about, thanks for making us smarter.
One of my top 10 channels to watch. Along with the other “Dark” channels! Good work!!
Interesting indeed... however even IF the U.S. military had fully ran the space program, it almost doesn't change the fact that the N.A.S.A. program was still a sort of military like program in a way but just not explicitly labeled as such.
Most (if not all) of the NASA astronauts back then were still considered active military personnel in their respective branches, so in that sense, yes.
Majority of launches had at least one black ops cia, nsa, or dhs crew member purely there to supervise the secret payloads that nasa were delivering to space for them! Sometimes nasa and the astronauts didn't even know what was onboard!! 😉 A very interesting rabbit hole itself!
Supplying the PX at Fort Lunatic would be interesting. Base housing for families, schools... The 5 mile PT run for the troops... And where would they go on a 3 day pass?
Would be like an extended Antarctic posting. Leave is for when you make the the 3day trip home to Earth
The Greenland glacier base we did build shows how primitive it actually would have been.
To their credit that base was pretty cool I mean it did have it's own nuclear generator but a Moon base is about 1000x harder.
Yes we should still do it, and we should do it now, but if we had done it back then it would have been disastrous.
Didn't that base kind of start collapsing and get abandoned super-early?
This. It would have been the most Hell _off_ Earth posting in the entire branch.
@@Ye4rZero Yes, it was a success in that we showed we could do it, we can stick a base under a glacier if we need to...
In some ways the Moon would actually be easier as its topographic feature don't migrate by inches a day, especially if we put it in Lunar shadow.
But yeah we are talking about lifting dozen of effectively pressurized tin foil huts and either putting them on the surface or digging a giant trench and burning them (for radiation shielding), but it's 1000x more work to lift heavy materials and the tech, while the glacier base could use standard wooden beams.
It would have been a cluster**** if we had tried it on the Moon. It still would be, and we should still do it to gain whatever technical advances we can, but we should be under no illusion that it won't be hypercostly like ISS if we want to do it safely, or that we will have some major screw ups.
Nuclear power is one of the most efficient and clean ways of creating energy. Obviously as long as it is done correctly
But what if some Romulan space witches who hate androids hacks those androids and causes them to go haywire and commit a genocide? They might do it on Mars too if we’re not careful. Better to just not create bases on the Moon or Mars. 😁
Great video . I had read about this project many years ago which is essentially an updated version of the Nazis lunar base . I'm glad Eisenhower went with the NASA program instead and that we didn't weaponize the moon. I truly hope it stays that way and that we as a species can collaborate with each other in the future to push forward and colonize space peacefully.
I wouldn't wish the "human race" on anyone. I hope we learn how to fix shit HERE before we go and pollute other worlds and solar systems... colonize... pffft... wake the hell up...
I love that Eisenhower spent his career studying war, then used the knowledge and wisdom he accumulated to caution his government against actions that would propagate military agendas.
And yet seemingly too few took that wisdom to heart. Look where we are now.
Eisenhower was perhaps the wisest president since Lincoln, and certainly the wisest of any since his time. Then Senator Johnson was pushing for a "Department of Space" but Eisenhower countered the he didn't want to create a "permanent beuracracy" to address a temporary problem (keeping up with the Soviet space program). NASA was his compromise, and it was a great decision.
Good soldiers understand better than any other that war is never a good thing and it’s to be avoided if possible.
lol.. you people are ignorant, Eisenhower was the creator of the
Industrial Military Complex, for a damn good reason, when it comes to Security of World, an Country, public Fred is not the person to have at the helm.
Eisenhower Created 54/12
54 the yr 1954.
12/ 12 top secret Senators, to oversee the whole operation, most important of all bury the Fu Fighters out a sight, of joe public.
No, thank you! It makes us wonder just what secret projects are going on today, that remain in the dark? Maybe in twenty years or so you will inform us. You are spoiling us, and I don't mind. Keep it up!
Incredibly interesting, thank u for this amazing video
I'VE BEEN WATCHING YOUR VIDEOS FOR YEARS ... YOU TOTALLY RULE !!!
Who was the brilliant chief engineer behind this Lunex program?Has German engineering written all over it
The US Army ballistic missile team was kept in the Army after the USAAC spun off to USAF. The Germans got stashed at Redstone Huntsville.
Likely this was US and British engineering, using techniques from Germany, who in turn had used US civilian (Goddard), USAAC high altitude manned medical tests and British aerospace breakthroughs in the 20s and 30s
@Spaceman • 78 years ago reliable automobiles.
to much credit given to germans Allies had the best, that's how they won
Von Braun
They were already doing this and have a base today! But without rockets 🚀, hence the flying saucer technology and with larger payloads.
The X 34b gives the airforce everything it wants, no pilot or base needed.
I’ve been watching all the videos for the last 3 days. Love the dark docs content
I think he is one of the hardest woking men on RUclips. Remember when there was only Dark5? Seems like decades ago now.
I binged the whole channel series hard when I stumbled on Dark Docs
The Air Force was looking beyond a few short expeditions to the lunar surface and back. They had a vision for an ongoing effort in space that NASA either lacked or abandoned. They wanted to go to the Moon to stay from the get go. They were likewise committed to using nuclear rocketry to fulfill the dream of regular space travel to Luna and beyond. The Air Force thought big! After Apollo, NASA essentially went out of the manned space exploration business.
NASA didn't abandon their plans, Congress did.
NASA had no real working plans beyond Apollo. Having accomplished that, they fell into the usual obsession of any bureaucracy- self perpetuation. In doing so, they went for earth orbital missions. The manned exploration of the solar system went into indefinite hold.
@@stevenpilling5318 There is a video here on YT that shows NASA's original plans for the Apollo program. They included building a moon base. All that got cancelled because the government lost interest after beating the Russians to the moon.
That was certainly a factor. NASA, however, surrendered to political pressures and has remained surrendered to nearly the present day. They lost the spirit of adventure. That factor cannot be dismissed as a major impetus for something as monumental as interplanetary exploration.
@@stevenpilling5318 Don't blame NASA my friend, they can only do what they can get funding for. With unlimited money, they would be sending manned and robotic missions everywhere in the solar system and beyond. There's no lack of vision at NASA, just a lack of money.
Such a fascinating story and proposed ideas!
Recuerdo tus primeros videos sin narración. Me alegra ver cómo tienes tanto para expandirte por tres canales (al menos los que yo conozco). Sigue así, amigo. Espero que disfrutes mucho de hacer estos videos
Exactly!
Colonel Corso, in his Day After Roswell book, talked about a military Saturn rocket program being secretly launched out of the the Brazilian Amazon.
Nothing says rapid response force like placing them 238,900 mi away. Great video.
Still waiting for the orders to get there by 📻 radio
I don't understand the statement that the computer data storage requirements exceeded those which are even available now. We have billions of times as much capacity now as they did in the late 60s.
Yeah that threw me as well. I believe that was an incorrect statement.
7:41 "Computer data storage capabilities not yet achieved to this day".
Whaaaaat? I find that hard to believe.
You mentioned that data storage and processing capabilities required still exceed what can be done now? Has there not been huge advancement in these areas? What is the basis of your statement please?
Do you plan on doing a video about the competing Army proposal for a manned Lunar base?
An inadequate work of fiction. A.C. Clarke would be very disappointed.
I talked to a older gentleman that worked on nuclear missiles specifically the minutemen 3 which he told me he heard enough talk in his classified work to suspect we are already on the moon militarily but not yet publicly. He heard about a few missions to the moon not public but that's all he could tell me as the rest was classified.
The first JEt airliner - a 707 - took off in 1957. It looks identical to the jets today. So in 60 years we haven't come up with anything else?
Nope
Thoroughly your video content and dark themed presentation style!
01:08 Lol, a LUNAtic idea!! You just know that pun was totally intended!!!
7:45 What? What were they trying to store or even use in RAM that took up so much space?
Something like 2k maybe
@@lostpony4885 maybe I misunderstood the context, but didn’t he say “even to this day,” as in now? I just have to question that in the age of 1TB fitting in a thumbnail clipping.
@@keith_5584 Yeah that's obvious nonsense.
Beyond precocious.
I've lost confidence in this channels accuracy due to several such inaccuracies.
Your audio is sounding better! I liked the music mixed into the background. Still need to use a de-esser on the vocal track.
talking less like a robot would help too
Those were some batshit crazy days!😂🛰🚀🌛
Clearly the specific manned lunar landing date was defined to beat an expected soviet manned lunar landing to mark the 50th anniversary (1967) of the formation of the Soviet Union. The conception date (1958) was also significant as the aerodynamics of blunt reentry vehicles was not completely understood, leading the mission designers to propose a complex and heavy lifting body vehicle. The mission would have been an Earth Orbit Rendezvous (EOR) requiring multiple launches to accommodate Additional mission mass over an LOR Apollo style mission. Subsequent evaluation would have shown the simpler and lighter Apollo architecture was superior for a simple manned landing in achieving an early possible US manned landing.
This video reminds me of the video game "Lunar Lander" I used to play at the game arcades back in the 80's. Very similar, with a landing that had two factors for success based on limits on fuel and slowing velocity to not crash the Lander. Then i think there was a phase for taking off from the moon and returning to the "Mother Ship". I never got that far, but I did land safely most of the time. Crashing had it's entertainment too !
Funny that you mentioned Lunar Lander(the arcade game)... they are very rare, as many were converted to Asteroids when it came out. I have one, and have had it since 1984. I've played it for more hours than I can count.
As for the "lift off and return to the mother ship", I've never heard that rumour, and I can tell you it's not true. I literally played that game for 5-6 hours in "one game"(had to keep adding coins/tokens to put more fuel in the ship), and such a thing never happened.
You are right about one thing, though.... it was fun finding new ways to crash that lander. lol!
Surprised that project-Orion was not planned in conjunction with LUNEX, as a lifting body
That last statement is the reason for the craters on the Earth facing side of the moon.
imagine containing this much knowledge with all with channels.
Very much enjoy and, in general, think your research is spot on. Having said that, in this video you say "computer storage data capabilities NOT available to this day!". As the most advanced storage device in the early 60's was capable of only about 5 Megabytes of data and today for roughly the same cost and same space easily 10x10^10th as much data can readily be had, i must question your accuracy there.
Computer processing power, and memory storage capacity in 2021 are no longer the limiting factors for almost any operation imaginable. Any private individual can buy a flash memory card of 1 Terabyte capacity for £200. Or 1 Gigabyte hard drive in 1995. Or a 10 Megabyte hard drive in 1985. Or a mainframe 3 Megabyte Winchester in 1975, albeit it wasn't cheap as the 5¼ or 3½ inch drives of the PC era.
Or, maybe, "that day" was that day, not today.
The narrator of this channel makes quite a few grammatical gaffes in the video. I think he might have meant, "until this day".
Nice, and don't think that they have forgotten about those plans. 🏆
Goes back to the rumor/alleged, top-secret DOD Apollo missions - 18, 19 and, 20.
It’s like what inspired For All Mankind on Apple TV
I read somewhere that when the United States first visited the moon, they discovered a military base of the Soviet Union there. This is so interesting, thank you 🙏
lol .. they found no such thing.
Nazi base
My cat watches me while I sleep...
...I don't have a cat.
Enjoyed your video and I gave it a Thumbs Up
space stations now do what this sci-fi idea was dreamed to do
2:35 Imagine the result of a study that concludes further expenditures were wasteful.
It would make me wonder if I should fund a new study to see what other ideas would qualify.🙄
Well fun fact we already had a moon base then, and we still have one now. Hardly anyone knows where we actually are in space technologically, but I served with the Navy’s space program to see enough with my own eyes. The whistleblowers coming forward describing American anti gravity spacecraft and the Lunar Operations Command, or the L.O.C., are 100% correct in what they describe. I’ve seen it myself, my own eyes don’t lie, believe me if you want but I’m not crazy and I’m no lier. The Truth is stranger than fiction, and the truth is we have a MASSIVE manned space program right now, and there’s not just one.
I believe you, just like I believe Bob Lazar. And the list of exo planet astronauts with full cosmic clearance.
@@Streamcatcher Yeah Gary McKinnon saw the list, he just said that he was too high to remember the names lmao but that’s not important, he saw enough. We got an entire large part of the Navy in space where most is kept in its own black word while the conventional white world military goes about say to say unaware of what it now a breakaway civilization.
Very nice video ❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️
Really good. Thanks
Battlefield in space? LET'S GO!!!
7:40 It seems hard to believe they would have required computing capability so advanced that they surpass even today's computers.
Yeah, that's my hiccup with this one too. I don't think they could conceptualize a terabyte of storage as small as a fingernail.
@@JosiahGould parachute on the moon did not bother you? Lol
There has to be something wrong with that statement. Unless, they somehow hoped to track every human being on the planet, in intimate detail. Even then, we could probably hold the data, with quality compression techniques. Collection of the data in the first place would be the hard part. And the Moon would not be good enough to do that. You probably need about 4,000 low Earth orbit satellites to collect the data. Much of it would be retro-deducible rather than immediately known. If a bunch of people get on a bus, you may know who entered the bus, but you probably don't know which people got off where. You have to wait and see where they went to deduce who they are. You might not even know after several movements. Once it can be deduced, you can retroactively say who exited the bus and at what stop. It can be guessed at sooner of course: color of clothing, walking speed, who they are with, previous patterns of people...
If it was just tracking and recording where everyone is minus people underground or underwater, say within 50 yards, an ordinary PC could probably hold a decade of that...maybe several...at this stage. Partly it depends on the update rate. Do you want to know second by second, minute by minute, or hour by hour? Minute by minute is probably sufficient for any rational surveillance for even the most intense national security...I would think. Maybe second by second could be kept for a week and then converted to minute by minute after most of the deductions are done. Really, though, this would be a sad thing. The only way it could be good was if it was actually reveled, and all the criminals then knew they would be caught. Crime rates should drop very fast, especially abductions, rapes, and murders. Collecting all this knowledge and keeping it secret, and letting all these crimes go un-prosecuted, would be sickening.
Maybe they meant radiation hardened computing power.
Modern chips and memory gain their advantages through very small gate and trace sizes. This is unfortunately easily fried by radiation. Rad hardened chips must use bigger features that can stand having holes punched through them by cosmic rays.
Why does the US military / government think they need to spy on the world like this? Must be very insecure.
Another great content video!
5:51 Looking a lot like proto-ITIL style process management, really cool. And also really dig the old school animation.
More of a proto MPP to me ;)
That is Ralph MacQuarrie's work! George Lucas liked it so much he hired him to help do visualizations of Star Wars vehicles!
Great documentaries !!! Good work.
Great job ! I love your videos
@7:43
What computer data storage capacity is not available to this day? That had to be an insane amount of storage!
We built a base on the moon, and there are nuclear warheads on it.
Moonbase alpha
Computer storage data capabilities not achieved till date???? What you meant by that
Excellent, thank you.
Funny how we supposedly have all this technology now and have no way to get to the moon now 🤔
So good. Thanks
I still don't understand why you could have ''the high ground'' from a distance of over a third of a million kilometers. Even science fiction from that time mentions the moon as a military base. Geostationary spy satellites and spy sats in whatever lower orbit are more efficient. Please keep producing more of these kind of videos!
It would be much mor flexible to have space ships on the moon due to the low gravity.
Basically attacking enemies from space, then go back to the moon to refuel and re stock on ammunition.
" Second Variety" for example from P.K.Dick.
Agree totally... the Cold War of space exploration and lunar colonization produced a ton of great stories... most of which were just plain silly.
Very interesting video 👍👍
Love the content
Would of been glorious.
Top tier content
Talk about being optimistic.
Misdirection? Who says they didn't complete the mission 🤷🏽♂️ but of course they didn't you say..... the government NEVER LIES!!!!
Cool Idea!
(now how to force Congress to Pay for it?)
We are fortunate that space was not turned into a battlefield. Considering the paranoia of the cold war.
Impractical and too expensive
The last newspaper shown were "Rudé právo" Czechoslovakian newspapers of that era.
This proposed military plan to the moon would make a great alternative history story plot on the Sci fi channel. Similar to that other alt- history show " For All Man Kind". Just a suggestion, but I think it would be cool to see. Thanks for sharing. Love all the Dark channels. 😁❤❤👍👍
Going to the moon proved with enough time, energy and money that many things are possible.
I work at NASA as a systems engineer, it iterally takes too much resource and is too difficult to mantain a longterm presence or 'lunar base' on the moon. It's not going to happen anytime in the next 100+ years. Sure we could do extended stays of 14days approximately, but there are no actual plans for this and zero budget to make it a reality.
Ps - Mars sounds nice but it's not happening for humans.
I can be done mars harder .star ship.its old school but doable.
As a sceptic about manned space flight l watch with interest Mr. Musk's attempts at it. As far as Apollo goes, l wouldn't try to land in my local park in the Lander. Looks very Heath Robinson
I worked at NASA also, the U.S.an Canada built a Solartarium on the moon 1973 completed 1974, the purpose to study a planet that wandered, into our solar system 1960,
the planet is still here.
Would be a population of 10k plus today,
just because you work at NASA, doesn't mean you know.
Only those who need to know,/ Know..
..
Love these docs!
Idk why but thinking about the moon gets me hard as a rock!
Lunex, like the early Apollo program, envisaged large lunar landing systems of the single-unit landing-and-return type as it was felt to be technically simpler and therefore less risky than a system that used multiple smaller spacecraft that required rendezvous and docking. However, this doctrine needed massive boosters for the Earth launch phase, that made the Saturn V system look puny...imagine trying to land the weight of an Apollo command module on the Moon and taking off again...so NASA's Nova system was barely sufficient for Apollo direct Earth-Moon, and an even bigger Earth booster would have been required for Lunex's large and robust aerospacecraft.
isn't this what Sea Dragon and NERVA (And all the derivatives of Nuclear Rockets that spawned from it) were for ultimately? Sea Dragon to get it into orbit with a somewhat reusable first stage, NERVA tug to take it to the Moon?
@@Shinzon23 Both DoD and NASA believed that eventually nuclear was the way to go, but that it would take a long lead time to properly develop...in the timeframe of Lunex and Project Horizon, it was probably going to be too late if the goal was to have an operational moonbase in the middle-to-late 1960s (approx. ten/twelve years).
A " lunartic idea "
Very interesting.We are pretty good at keeping secrets, hohoho
I like this channel.
Good video.
it's 3:07 am... I find myself in: - "that place" again. - ffs YT... why?
What about the 'Van Allen radiation belt'; what is around the Earth and it is between us and the Moon?!
Dang, I'm getting Iron Skies flash backs.
2:15 "Reasonably Economically" I love how they used to think back in the day... Also Air Forces Lunex Mission seemed more peaceful and friendlier... not the Apollo missions rockets that can be double used as giant icbm missiles... lol
So...Star Wars shows us what might have been...
Some member of the Air Force brass was reading too much Robert Heinlein.
8:20 that jingle makes me think of Starcraft.
Yep. Estes didnt design the mars lander, they made a model of it.
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