@@jeremynuckoles2907 They’ve been making Rhinos for a few years now. I’ve had mine over a year and it’s amazing. I couldn’t imagine it any better. It did cost $800 though…
@@Tkw-ez4ke bruh, are you doing okay? it sounds like you've got some issues you're working through. it's got nothing to do with covid, infact, covid expanded the market for controllers. it's due to a single company having owned the licences and copyrights to force feedback joysticks. that's no more.
Hornet in DCS doesn’t provide FFB, it just acts as regular spring stick. Try it with F-14 and F-4, or warbirds, there FFB really shines, completely transformative
Came to say the same. Flybywire wont feel like the f15e f14 f1. I am curious about the Harrier feel and helos. Did that take virpil tm grips if not a big lost opportunity.
Su-27. edit: With a stock MSFFB2, not these recent sticks. I bought one other FFB2 for a resistor mod that I've never got around to, I'll see how much the price and quality rest when FFB becomes more normalised. Afterall, it is in racing.
@@vondalo5504except TM is reasonably back in the game with the AVA base. And you can argue the others are better, but if you are in Europe TM is still a lot more affordable (except for Winwing, Winwing is probably the bang for EUR winner), Virpil is incredibly expensive in Europe because you have to add tax to their price and it's 23% here in Portugal! And it used to be worst because until recently they charged a hefty shipping fee, now free for orders above 100€ (almost anything you can order from Virpil). And VKB is incredibly expensive period.
DCS players have been after a dedicated FFB stick for a while. There's a few niche ones out there, but this might fit the bill as a mainstream quality piece of kit for those looking to embellish the flying experience.
@@rawnukles my first FFB, lol, I used Gunfighter Base before. It’s great, no complaints. Very smooth, no cogging, no deadzone, very precise. The Strength is more than enough for me, I usually run it between 50-75%. Software is really nice and adds neat Effects for DCS
Same. Got myself a VPForce Rhino. Not sure if I'd grab a Moza, never heard of this brand before and VPForce already does good work especially for software development, with updates practically daily. But it's nice to see some more people try to get into making FFB stuff. And the more popular FFB gets, the more standard it will become in the flight sim games again, after so many years of being neglected. Hopefully more and more big-name brands can get on board, like Thrustmaster, Logitech, Virpil and VKB
Great video mate 😊 and same here, I've got the Rhino, the software is what makes the VPForce Rhino really shine. I'll have my latest video out later today about it. This Monza unit is crazy exciting. it's about time we had a bigger push in this area.
I would recommend trying this force feedback stick in a plane that doesn't have a fly-by-wire system. The F/A-18C has no direct linkage from the control stick to the actual control surfaces, so the feeling of resistance is entirely artificial (in essence, the plane has its own force feedback stick in the cockpit). With propeller-driven aircraft, you should be feeling no centering forces when airspeed is zero or very low, and then when the airspeed picks up, the control forces grow progressively stronger and the stick would become more firmly centered in a neutral position (which should depend on trim setting).
Same with the F-16. The 16 has very little movement in the sidestick in any direction. There is no additional force felt when moving the stick while the aircraft is turned off or when it's in the air pulling 9 G's. With that said, it's not an easy stick to move to complete stop in any direction. But in the air, very small inputs go a long way so you aren't fully yanking on the stick unless you really need to. It would be awesome if there was a setting on this device that would allow for the F-16's design in which the stick only moves about 1/4 inch in any direction.
@@Danlovestrivium F-16 was the first US fighter design that used a force-sensing control stick and a fly-by-wire system. Initial design of the stick was completely rigid and had no movement, you just had to push on it and the system would read the pressure on the load cell, and use that as a control input for the FBW system. The pilots expressed dislike and difficulty to adapt to a completely non-moving stick, so the completely rigid stick was given a slight range of movement. The method of detecting inputs still relies on load cells rather than an positional tracker such as potentiometres or magnetic sensors.
I am SO pumped MOZA is getting into the flight game. Seems like Thrustmaster has fallen behind on things as much as I dig some of their stuff, but for a company a bit more mainstream than Virpil/VKB and having multiple sim categories in their lineup this is INCREDIBLE. Obviously riding the hype at the moment but dang I'm pumped. Great video, man!
I used to own a thrustmaster stick and throttle until I called them to ask for a part that broke from normal wear and tear and they said they don't make that part so I need to pay another $500 for a new throttle. That was the last time I wanted to own thrustmaster products. I'm now all VKB but I don't have replacement pedals yet so I hope this company has good ones without them costing an arm and a leg
Best test of the FFB would be with one of the heatblur modules like the F-14 or F-4, because the hydraulics and bellows etc are simulated - f-18 being FBW isn't really a good example
You should test this in a warbird, as that is where ffb really shines. Fly by wire jets like the f18 can't really show it off. F14 is also a great jet to demo it with as it has very old school hydraulic controls.
F/A-18C is fly-by-wire plane. Not the best to test a force feedback joystick. Could you test it with a non fbw plane ? For instance : F-14, F-5, P-51, Spitfire, MiG-29, MiG-21, MiG-15, Mirage F1, etc... Thank you for your review !
Hopefully they will add a "Force Trim" option. An option where you can set the trim position that it will return to, and then you need to release the force trim brake to reposition it.
I owned the Microsoft Sidewinder Force Feedback Flightstick 1 and 2 back in the day. It had a lot of features as you mentioned. Did not have adjustments but was an amazing flightstick. You could definitely tell the difference between a cessna and a 747. You could feel when the plane stalled and guns being fired etc. Weird that it is not a standered now since I owned mine in 95 or 96. Can't remember the price but it was under $100. This Moza looks cool especially with forcefeedback rudder peddles.
The MS Sidewinder2 FFB Joystick HAD adjustments, admittedly not as fancy as the Moza, but then it wasn't as powerful either, so it wasn't going to break your arm, if you crashed! However, when MS, gave up on the hardware, they took the master software control for their hardware away too, I seem to recall, it was during an update in XP that finally did it in. It screwed me right up, 'cause I had both the Sidewinder2 FFBs, the Joystick & the Steering Wheel, in addition, I also had the Microsoft SideWinder Strategic Commander too. Bloody brilliant controller for RTS & FPS games and more. While the Stick & Wheel could still be used, they were totally dependent on the Sim/Game, for settings & input/output of signals & response. However, the Strategic Commander sadly died an early death, 'cause although it was fully functional, the OS simply refused to 'see it' and no third-party workarounds worked.for me. I just wish I'd kept it, because apparently, in excellent working condition, in the original box with everthing, they're can be worth a small fortune. DAMN-IT!!!
Glad I have my VPFORCE Rhino, but I like the idea more people will have access to FFB base. This is needed. This will push developers to program better support for FFB.
I'll pay a certain amount for it but if it is $1000USD like the other FFB sticks that are out there this is not viable for the market at large. The old MS Sidwinder FFB was like $100USD and laid the foundation for stuff like this but for some reason it never came into its own.
Aside from simulating mechanical and hydro-mechanical flight controls, this is gonna be a huge leap for rotary wing simulation if it's able to hold a force trim! Glad to see more products like this available to the public
Moza is going crazy this year, first the truck sim wheel, tilt mount, and stalks that’ll be releasing later on this year and now flight sim. Love to see it, excited to see what Moza can do in the future
Thrustmaster finally takes a step forward, everyone feels the need to one up them again lmao Moza and WinWing announcing FFB bases. Stay on bottom, Thrustmaster
Hey Moza if you are listening (and I’m sure you are) couple things about your F-16 stick. First, great job. Really good thoughts. Your website says the hats are 8-way. This is cool but it would be good to have all hats have a press-function as well. This is pretty important, particularly for the one under the thumb (think A-10). But, you should have it for all the hats. Second, just a quibble, but on the F-16 your hat right below the red pickle button needs to be rotated 90 degrees as it is on the real aircraft. That change will help the thumb interface with the hat. Other than those two things, what I see in the photos on the site are really encouraging. The idea for the module on the side is great and your site suggests that more could be in the future which is also incredibly exciting. What would be nice on the stick (or on the module maybe) is another button that could be accessed without using your thumb which could act as a “shift” button of sorts. On most aircraft the “pinky” button is too important to be used as a shift button.
Finally!! If the other manufacturers don't follow suit Moza will eat their whole market. Every new over priced spring and cam base that was released was driving me insane. The demand for this is going to be very very high.
Thanks so much for covering this in such a detailed and balanced way!! So psyched for the coming force feedback revolution and the whole slew of force feedback products on the horizon, but especially this one!
True though tbh if the base has sufficient throw like 20° in each + & - of the axis then you can get away with having the base mounted higher & either little or no extension. The main reason ppl use an extension, other than ergonomics, is to increase the amount of throw on the axis which makes control easier for things like formation, a2ar or heli flight etc. But if someone is going to mount this in their "realistic" sim pit then yeah they'll likely have it mounted on the floor with a ~200mm extension.
@@parithon2397 Yeah 9nm isn't crazy high like some DD wheels or the FFBeast but I wouldn't say "only" 9nm. 9Nm is plenty enough for the effects to come through & you can make it feel really heavy compared to a spring/cam set up. A lot of ppl are running 200mm or even longer extensions on their Rhino, depending on grip weight it can have a bit of an effect of the felt forces but still much nicer than a spring/cam set up, that's the biggest thing for me with FFB is the ability to customise the feel of the stick with just a profile change. Even if there was no ffb effects after owning the Rhino I could never go back to a normal base. Just the sticktion problem alone on a spring/cam/dampener base is enough for the Rhino to be better. FFBeast levels of torque (~30Nm) are actually getting dangerous, this isn't a steering wheel that spins while locked in place, you have a likely metal grip being flung around on the end of an extension @~30Nm that can do some damage. Even this AB9 should have an emergency stop button. I'm really happy there's a company binging FFB back to the market & it looks like Winwing is joining in on the fun too!
Damn dude… that’s pretty cool! Can’t wait to see when they release this to the public, the no dead zone is actually a game changer for me… irl when the jet is off (or at least in the F-18 and I’m pretty sure some other jets) I’ve seen that the joy stick falls to one side like that. This looks like it will be an awesome product! I hope they come out with more joystick replicas in the future to go with it. I think this will take flight sims like (DCS or MSFS) to a whole other level.
Thanks a lot for reviewing this product for us. The last one I had was the sidewinder back in the day. Great that’s it’s compatible with the Thrustmaster grips. Love your insight on this one.👍👍
Welcome to the FFB joystick community! 😆. Seriously though it's awesome to see MOZA bringing FFB joysticks back to market. I hope they do a yoke too! I've had my VPforce Rhino base for a while now & it's been a total game changer for flight sims. FFB effects are cool for immersion etc. but the best thing about ffb is the ability to customise how the stick feels by just changing the config profile, no need to change springs or cams & tighten or loosen dampeners. You can have it feel suited to something like the F-18 a fly-by-wire jet then with the change of a profile you can have it feel more suited to something like the F-4 or F-14. Warbirds are great with ffb you can really feel the flight control surfaces so much better & the same goes for GA/Bush planes. Helicopters though are where FFB joystick bases really shine! having legit force trim is so much different to having a spring & cam stick even with light springs & tight dampeners it's just not the same, plus you can make the stick feel lighter or heavier according to if it's a small or larger heli. Anyone with FFb & DCS needs to try the F-14 Tomcat as it has some of the best native FFB effects in DCS.
Been eyeing the Rhino and just recently got on the long waitng list. Primarily for DCS helicopters, warbirds, Hornet and Mudhen that I fly the most. Especially the Kiowa and Apache!
One nice feature that would be awesome to have is the increased stiffness in the stick when hydraulics are off. Or in other cases the 0 spring 0 force on some aircraft when they are off. I don't know exactly when each one aplies, but it would be awesome to have these effects.
What I'd like to see for helicopters is that when u trim the heli with buttons the stick moves with it, so the motor pushes it according to your trim inputs. And that you can set a new center with trim release button and recenter it with trim reset button.
This looks awesome! And thanks! Would you mind trying it out with the TF-51 mustang or another warbird? The feel of the ailerons and elevator should change quite a bit depending on airspeed, it would be interesting to see if that effect is present.
Agreed. I have the NLR Boeing Simpit and I don’t see any good options for mounting. I guess I could take out the crossmember all together and out the huge base on the floor?
Like others have said, it's the older generation of aircraft and helecopter trim where force feedback shines. The DCS warbirds are especially good because as the control surfaces lose their grip on the air, the stick will flutter and become loose. The Phantom FFB is unlike anything else. As for the software. Spring is the centering force. Friction is the force required to keep the stick moving. Dampening is the resistance to sudden or large movements. Inertia is the resistance to sudden change to stick movements in progress.
The F-18 Hornet is a fly-by-wire aircraft, which means that the stick is not directly connected to the control surfaces via cables or hydraulics, but is connected to a computer which takes inputs on the stick and makes the corresponding changes to the control surfaces. This means that force feedback is not realistic if you are feeling more resistance at higher speeds. Force feedback is suited more towards older jets, like the F-4 Phantom, and warbirds, like the P-51, or any aircraft with cable or hydraulic control. In less technical terms, the control surfaces of the F-18 are computer controlled. You don't feel any direct feedback through the stick from the control surfaces. But other than that, this looks like an excellent choice for those who don't want to build their own force feedback stick.
The thing about it that really jumps out at me is that because of the height of the base you won't be putting it on your desk for flying. You're sort of forced into a different mounting solution. Considering how popular force feedback sticks were in the early 2000's I'm surprised there's not more offerings these days now that flight sims have advanced so much and FF racing wheels are so common.
I love the Moza product line, I own the R9, a couple wheels, h pattern shifter and a handbrake. I am so happy to see them enter the Flight sim market. I hope they will make it easy to use VKB sticks. I own a Gunfighter Ultimate and I will buy the FFB base in a heartbeat if it is compatible with the Gunfighter stick!
you should of had your name down for a VPforce Rhino! They have a passthrough adapter for VKB. I've had my Rhino for a fair while & love it! Been using it with my MCGU plus winwing f-18 grip (via adapter), Virpil Warbrd (plug & play same as TM) & the VKB KG-12 (adapter) too! You can also check out the FFBeast, but it's more diy & less options for grips, you need all passthrough-to-base adapters.
@@Beeroshima21 from what i can see the steering wheel with pedals is 550, thats way better than somebodies garage designed joystick base (nothing wrong with that) for $1800 without the stick itself.
Afaik Moza came in and made racing sim prices lower by competing more reasonable prices, making entry level options. Could be decent, I think, but we'll see
Fantastic! Thanks for the TM compatibility. I have 2 TM sticks F-16 and FA-18 and this is a gamechanger for me! Kudos if it all works. Looking so forward to flying the AH-64 as it should be.
Blu Games. FYI a note on the Helicopter trim; as a general rule it's referred to as force trim & the stick will in fact have some spring resistance to it while centred. When you want to transition to say level forward flight, you press & hold the force trim button on the grip move the grip to the position needed then release the trim button, at that moment the spring tension will return making that new position feel as the centre. So pretty much hold the trim button maneuver then release to "create a new centre position". Great video too m8.
Have you flown the Kiowa yet? Interested in your experience with it using the Rhino. I'm currently using the Virpil CM3 dry clutch setup, but I really need FFB!
@@redtailpilot yeah m8 the Kiowa like any other heli is awesome with FFB. It really is game changing for flight sims & especially heli as even with a diy dampener set up on other bases you still don't get the force trim. I would get my name down for a Rhino asap & you cn wait to see what specs & price the new FFB for Moza & winwing will be, you can always cancel the Rhino preorder.
@@PiNKMuDSimGaming My thinking exactly. Yeah I got on the list a week prior to hearing about the two new kids joining the party, lol. Can't wait to see prices and reviews on them. Now I need to be even more patient 😂 Exciting times!
I have Moza gear for my driving sim build and they make really good stuff. Shipping was a bit of a nightmare and if you can buy in your region, that is suggested. But, if you are not in a big hurry when you order or can get it locally, they do make some higher end stuff at good prices.
Like to see it being able to do a dual stick operation for Star Citizen with a Omni Throttle style stick like VKB sim has for their dual sticks> That would be cool. Star Citizen also needs to write software for it
I once had this Logitech FF G940 which was pretty cool, but had loads of precision problems. They discontinued the support, so I had to sell it and used a Thrustmaster Warthog. When I saw this video, I directly pre-ordered this device! I'm really looking forward to have FF again, together with my buttkicker. :-)
OMG I love just flying around in my DCS Mustang. I can go up in the skies, head for the mountains and fly around for an hour that just zips by doing nothing. I shudder to think what happens if (when) I finally succumb to FFB.
@@redtailpilot I watched a video a year ago where the guy said that his high end racing wheel coupled with VR is so good it kinda ruined his life. he stated he can spend 10hrs a day racing as it fills him with so much serotonin and good feelings that when he comes out of that virtual world into this one he gets depressed.
@@dealwolfstriked272 LOL that's definitly believable. The only reason I haven't succumbed to the same thing with my flight sim hobby, is lack of time. When I have an hour or two in VR, 6DOF motion and all my gear in DCS (MSFS occasionally) I'm in another world!!!
@@dealwolfstriked272 Keeps me in the air when I can't get in the real cockpit for one reason or another :) Started this hobby as a teen over three decades ago. Became a private pilot two decades ago 🙂
They impressed the heck out of me with this! I was not expecting it at all, even when they emailed me before the event i was still like whaaaaaat???? 😮
@belgeode Did you get to try it out? If so, I'd like your thoughts, because I just pre-ordered that sucka 🤣 Couldn't believe the price point compared to what the other ones cost!
Allowing us have it detect the DCS module we are in and have separate presets auto selected would be awesome. It is possible too as DCS VAICOM and SRS autochange based on module being used.
Oh hell yes! We absolutely needed FFB flight sticks. It will make dcs and Sims so much more accurate along with letting us feel the plane more.... if it reacts to buffeting that will allow us to keep energy levels up better!!! This is a total must have!
Honestly it seems like this would be ideal for flying helicopters, put the base on the ground, use an extension, and bam you’ve got a pretty accurate home sim of heli cyclic
Same here bro. Was the best thing you can get short of ffbeast and the like so my full winwing stuff would be awesome to be able to use. Can't friggen wait bro, I'll be ordering mine the second it's out
Unfortunately, I think the connection or encoding or whatever technical nonsense WW uses is proprietary. Like the VPF Rhino, we could mount the stick with an adapter, but the connector needs to have an extension to an also plugged in WW base for the buttons to work. Please don't make me use a Thrustmaster grip :/
I'm still running an old MSFFB2 and dreading the day it breaks. Now we all have options for new FFB. I want one. PS. FA-18 is a fly by wire jet. So much more feed back in the older jets like the F-4 or the Mig-21. The F-4 you can feel how fast or slow you are by the stick force without having to look at the air speed dial.
I think we're entering a flight sim golden age in mid 2024. New sims announced. New products announced. FFB sticks making a comeback. VR making leaps and bounds. Continually opening up to the wider console ecosystem. Only downer is the Razbam-ED situation. Otherwise, it's a good time to be in the hobby!
I think what would work for my setup would be to mount this to the Warthog base plate, screw that into the floor then use an extension to get in to the correct height for my chair. I'm hoping the price isn't too prohibitive as this looks like the perfect base that we'll also be able to buy in the UK from the likes of Overclockers without import fees or silly delivery charges.
Moza is an outstanding company. I have a lot of experience with them in the sim racing world due to my involvement in professional sim racing, iRacing/ACC/RF2 ect. If they are setting out to make a FFB flight base, you can bet it will be done right.
In the software did you notice a way to map a force trim interrupt? That’s the way a helo is to be flown and if this unit does that I’ll for sure pick one up!
Attention MOZA: We still need detailed info on adapters to be offered by MOZA to allow VKB GF4 MCGU (and other) grips to be used with this base. VPForce has these already for theirs, that "might" work here too.
I don't know if they make it but you might benefit from a more realistic setup by having the base on the floor with an extension from the base to your hand control like a real centre stick aircraft has the control column come up through the floor This would prevent your wrist and arm contacting the beautiful force feedback base you have
This looks really great! I’m looking forward to its pricing, I hope not all that expensive. I do hope they have something to easily place it on/at my desk, as I have to remove my controls daily. Most FFB systems seem to require to be installed permanently. Also, any chance you could demonstrate it with a warbird? I think the F/A-18 has a FBW system, which centers it automatically?
Most important thing, can you feel the plane buffeting when you load the plane under high g? Or are you just feeling a progressive load as you pull? I'm not worried about the roll axis much I'm really interested in if you can feel the buffet as your pulling? It would be a huge advantage if you could so you could feel it as it starts to come up so you can relax slightly to reduce the energy scrubbing. Also is it liner? Or is it progressive? The more you pull the harder it gets?
This is what I’ve been looking for! Specifically a base that is suited for a long shaft on the stick. Tired of the short wiggly joysticks, I want a long center mounted stick with huge throw and no center snap.
Promising, and if this end up well executed, a possible contender to replace my Virpil setup. For me, switching would be considerably easier if I could keep my Virpil grip and extension. Also, a good implementation for IL-2 Sturmovik would be paramount as that's what I play.
If this is fully compatible with Virpil grips I will be getting one as soon as possible. If it is like the Thrustmaster base where you can use the Virpil grip but you loose lots of functionality then it will be a harder sell.
The force feedback feature is great but its the ability to tune the type and level of FFB through the base, with different software profiles for each aircraft/ aircraft type that really excites me. Being able to software switch between helicopters, cold war jets, FBW jets warbirds is what I want. AND being able to whack my current TM F-16/ A10 and F/A-18 joystick handgrip straight on top is a deal clincher for me!
If it's anything like their sim racing software and implementation, there might be a phone companion app where you can change saved profiles in a second. It's works great on the sim racing side, and shouldn't be hard to integrate here.
Thanks for sharing this. It would seem to me that if you had an extension and the base sat on the floor that would be great. I have an extension on my VKB tomcat stick and I wonder if that would work on one of these bases.
I hope it won't be too expensive and yes the base is huge! I want to use it for flight sims like DCS, helicopters and airplanes but also Star Citizen or other Space Games.
The Hornet has FBW with an artificial feel system that provides stick force depending on phase of flight. It’s stick force per G in regular flight, and stick force per AOA with wheels down. It maybe different depending on hook bypass switch as well. I just hope they implement this as hornet is my first love
it can only go off what telemetry data DCS sends out & I'm not sure it send out that sort. This could maybe be emulated via the Moza telem software itself. The hard parts would be making it know when to read the AoA & when to read the G forces, I can see it being possible to make it read from one or the other but from both at different times would completely depend on the telemetry data DCS sends to the base.
I still have my ancient Microsoft Sidewinder FFB Pro sitting around after all these years. I just recently drug it out to use with MSFS, though the actual FFB is only really present as a spring force. Game compatibility seems to be one of the bigger issues for FFB, at least as far as flight sims go. Admittedly I don't have much experience with them though. I bought my stick way back in the Mechwarrior days (it was bundled with MW3), which was kind of built around the FFB it offered. Seemed like several games supported it back then, but then it just kind of trailed off. Even now it seems like you need to have add-ons and mods to use it to its best effect.
@@BrunoBarata78 then comes the question on if the motors can handle the increased exertion needed with an extension installed... much less the other hardware handling the increased weight.
@@parithon2397 its probably a good bet to ask VPForce Rhino owners how they're getting along with it. But keep in mind that just asking for extension length won't do, as some rhino's have a bit of a length to the stick adapter but others are shorter. So for netter comparison you want to know length from the pivot point at the gimbal, and you'll need the same for the MOZA.
@@BrunoBarata78 the Rhino uses a belt system to drive the force so it may not be as ineffective as the direct drive system used here. Additionally the reciprocal forces applied would be significantly different for the same reasons.
I can’t wait for this, we are so lucky to have a manufacturer do a ffb stick! I fly a lot in DCS, all modules. I have just bought a Moza R5 bundle and I love the quality and software, so this item will be excellent. Would be nice for FFB pedals at some point :) please price this right Moza I am poor 😂
I've been wanting to get into FFB bases. I fly helicopters and being able to get a more accurate feeling in DCS as well would definitely help in practicing.
Looks like something I would buy but I have to say I think I would like to see some sort of cutoff switch included in the price. I fly a centre mounted stick and the Idea of a large piece of metal or plastic flapping round between my legs after a crash or from some kind of bug gives me pause.
I need this base. My Sidewinder FFB2 is at legal age already (still going BTW! Probably used it on like 2/3 of the days over two decades, that thing is the literal definition of "rock solid") and I want something more precise and with more hats and buttons on it. Flying without FFB is like flying with broken trim. Also, FFB might be one of the few things that give us at least something that a butt meter would provide. We need all of that if we can have it.
was about time thes companies finally make some ffb bases
Been waiting over 20 years now.
ikr feel like this wouldve been a thing way sooner if covid never happened .
@@jeremynuckoles2907 They’ve been making Rhinos for a few years now. I’ve had mine over a year and it’s amazing. I couldn’t imagine it any better. It did cost $800 though…
@@Tkw-ez4ke bruh, are you doing okay? it sounds like you've got some issues you're working through.
it's got nothing to do with covid, infact, covid expanded the market for controllers. it's due to a single company having owned the licences and copyrights to force feedback joysticks. that's no more.
@@isaacwest So am i right in guessing it was Microsoft that held the licenses?
I'm guessing this cuz of the old sidewinder sticks from years ago.
Hornet in DCS doesn’t provide FFB, it just acts as regular spring stick. Try it with F-14 and F-4, or warbirds, there FFB really shines, completely transformative
Mirage F1 also has some very well done FFB for cold war hydraulics setup
Definitely this!
Came to say the same. Flybywire wont feel like the f15e f14 f1. I am curious about the Harrier feel and helos. Did that take virpil tm grips if not a big lost opportunity.
this
Su-27.
edit: With a stock MSFFB2, not these recent sticks. I bought one other FFB2 for a resistor mod that I've never got around to, I'll see how much the price and quality rest when FFB becomes more normalised. Afterall, it is in racing.
Moza on their way to overtake Thrustmaster as the most varied sim accessory manufacturer
Like VPforce Rhino?
Nothing special... Thrustmaster is awful. Winwing, Virpil, VKB is already years ahead
Honestly hoped for 3 seconds that the AVA base would be FFB, but no TM decided to try competing with virpil. In 2015.
@@vondalo5504except TM is reasonably back in the game with the AVA base. And you can argue the others are better, but if you are in Europe TM is still a lot more affordable (except for Winwing, Winwing is probably the bang for EUR winner), Virpil is incredibly expensive in Europe because you have to add tax to their price and it's 23% here in Portugal! And it used to be worst because until recently they charged a hefty shipping fee, now free for orders above 100€ (almost anything you can order from Virpil).
And VKB is incredibly expensive period.
@@vondalo5504 not in the budget market, the t16000m hotas is still a very good product.
DCS players have been after a dedicated FFB stick for a while. There's a few niche ones out there, but this might fit the bill as a mainstream quality piece of kit for those looking to embellish the flying experience.
I already got the Rhino FFB but im really happy Moza is mass producing a off the shelf FFB now, bright future for flight simming ahead 💪
How are you finding the Rhino? What FFB were you using before that?
@@rawnukles my first FFB, lol, I used Gunfighter Base before. It’s great, no complaints. Very smooth, no cogging, no deadzone, very precise. The Strength is more than enough for me, I usually run it between 50-75%. Software is really nice and adds neat Effects for DCS
Same. Got myself a VPForce Rhino. Not sure if I'd grab a Moza, never heard of this brand before and VPForce already does good work especially for software development, with updates practically daily. But it's nice to see some more people try to get into making FFB stuff. And the more popular FFB gets, the more standard it will become in the flight sim games again, after so many years of being neglected. Hopefully more and more big-name brands can get on board, like Thrustmaster, Logitech, Virpil and VKB
Great video mate 😊 and same here, I've got the Rhino, the software is what makes the VPForce Rhino really shine. I'll have my latest video out later today about it. This Monza unit is crazy exciting. it's about time we had a bigger push in this area.
I would recommend trying this force feedback stick in a plane that doesn't have a fly-by-wire system. The F/A-18C has no direct linkage from the control stick to the actual control surfaces, so the feeling of resistance is entirely artificial (in essence, the plane has its own force feedback stick in the cockpit).
With propeller-driven aircraft, you should be feeling no centering forces when airspeed is zero or very low, and then when the airspeed picks up, the control forces grow progressively stronger and the stick would become more firmly centered in a neutral position (which should depend on trim setting).
Same with the F-16. The 16 has very little movement in the sidestick in any direction. There is no additional force felt when moving the stick while the aircraft is turned off or when it's in the air pulling 9 G's. With that said, it's not an easy stick to move to complete stop in any direction. But in the air, very small inputs go a long way so you aren't fully yanking on the stick unless you really need to.
It would be awesome if there was a setting on this device that would allow for the F-16's design in which the stick only moves about 1/4 inch in any direction.
This is what I wanted to see with these sticks. Pulling out of dives taking more strength for example.
@@Danlovestrivium F-16 was the first US fighter design that used a force-sensing control stick and a fly-by-wire system.
Initial design of the stick was completely rigid and had no movement, you just had to push on it and the system would read the pressure on the load cell, and use that as a control input for the FBW system.
The pilots expressed dislike and difficulty to adapt to a completely non-moving stick, so the completely rigid stick was given a slight range of movement. The method of detecting inputs still relies on load cells rather than an positional tracker such as potentiometres or magnetic sensors.
@@HerraTohtori I was F-16 Avionics in the USAF for 6 years.
I am SO pumped MOZA is getting into the flight game. Seems like Thrustmaster has fallen behind on things as much as I dig some of their stuff, but for a company a bit more mainstream than Virpil/VKB and having multiple sim categories in their lineup this is INCREDIBLE. Obviously riding the hype at the moment but dang I'm pumped. Great video, man!
I used to own a thrustmaster stick and throttle until I called them to ask for a part that broke from normal wear and tear and they said they don't make that part so I need to pay another $500 for a new throttle. That was the last time I wanted to own thrustmaster products. I'm now all VKB but I don't have replacement pedals yet so I hope this company has good ones without them costing an arm and a leg
@@deekamikaze All companies have product that have a end of life date and are not supported after that.
Best test of the FFB would be with one of the heatblur modules like the F-14 or F-4, because the hydraulics and bellows etc are simulated - f-18 being FBW isn't really a good example
or the warbirds....
@@TechGaming45even better!
or how about an f16 lol, the only jet in the game that actually has this irl
@@CallsignWombat428 ur confusing ffb in a gaming sense w the pressure sensitive stick in the f16, they force feedbck for different reasons
@@DessertUnicorn not even that. Force sensing and force force feedback are completely unrelated.
You should test this in a warbird, as that is where ffb really shines. Fly by wire jets like the f18 can't really show it off.
F14 is also a great jet to demo it with as it has very old school hydraulic controls.
FFB really shines with non fly-by-wire like ww2 aircraft or F-14 and such :D
F/A-18C is fly-by-wire plane. Not the best to test a force feedback joystick. Could you test it with a non fbw plane ? For instance : F-14, F-5, P-51, Spitfire, MiG-29, MiG-21, MiG-15, Mirage F1, etc... Thank you for your review !
Hopefully they will add a "Force Trim" option. An option where you can set the trim position that it will return to, and then you need to release the force trim brake to reposition it.
I owned the Microsoft Sidewinder Force Feedback Flightstick 1 and 2 back in the day. It had a lot of features as you mentioned. Did not have adjustments but was an amazing flightstick. You could definitely tell the difference between a cessna and a 747. You could feel when the plane stalled and guns being fired etc. Weird that it is not a standered now since I owned mine in 95 or 96. Can't remember the price but it was under $100. This Moza looks cool especially with forcefeedback rudder peddles.
The MS Sidewinder2 FFB Joystick HAD adjustments, admittedly not as fancy as the Moza, but then it wasn't as powerful either, so it wasn't going to break your arm, if you crashed!
However, when MS, gave up on the hardware, they took the master software control for their hardware away too, I seem to recall, it was during an update in XP that finally did it in.
It screwed me right up, 'cause I had both the Sidewinder2 FFBs, the Joystick & the Steering Wheel, in addition, I also had the Microsoft SideWinder Strategic Commander too. Bloody brilliant controller for RTS & FPS games and more.
While the Stick & Wheel could still be used, they were totally dependent on the Sim/Game, for settings & input/output of signals & response. However, the Strategic Commander sadly died an early death, 'cause although it was fully functional, the OS simply refused to 'see it' and no third-party workarounds worked.for me.
I just wish I'd kept it, because apparently, in excellent working condition, in the original box with everthing, they're can be worth a small fortune. DAMN-IT!!!
Glad I have my VPFORCE Rhino, but I like the idea more people will have access to FFB base. This is needed. This will push developers to program better support for FFB.
I’ll gladly pay for something like this. I love playing with as much realism as possible!
I'll pay a certain amount for it but if it is $1000USD like the other FFB sticks that are out there this is not viable for the market at large. The old MS Sidwinder FFB was like $100USD and laid the foundation for stuff like this but for some reason it never came into its own.
@@ImpendingJokeror CH Products. For the elderly among us..
@@ImpendingJokerprice is $549 as of today!
Man I remember my old Microsoft Sidewinder FFB stick, playing mech warrior 3 and combat flight sim back in the day was amazing.
Aside from simulating mechanical and hydro-mechanical flight controls, this is gonna be a huge leap for rotary wing simulation if it's able to hold a force trim! Glad to see more products like this available to the public
Moza is going crazy this year, first the truck sim wheel, tilt mount, and stalks that’ll be releasing later on this year and now flight sim. Love to see it, excited to see what Moza can do in the future
They beat them all to the market with this Baby.
TM AVA = Dead on Arrival. Go MOZA
Thrustmaster finally takes a step forward, everyone feels the need to one up them again lmao Moza and WinWing announcing FFB bases. Stay on bottom, Thrustmaster
Would like more detail on how they are compatible with all 3rd party joysticks.
Nice video, A switch on the base with 4 settings that you can custom edit and switch on the fly between settings, that will be cool.
Hey Moza if you are listening (and I’m sure you are) couple things about your F-16 stick. First, great job. Really good thoughts. Your website says the hats are 8-way. This is cool but it would be good to have all hats have a press-function as well. This is pretty important, particularly for the one under the thumb (think A-10). But, you should have it for all the hats. Second, just a quibble, but on the F-16 your hat right below the red pickle button needs to be rotated 90 degrees as it is on the real aircraft. That change will help the thumb interface with the hat. Other than those two things, what I see in the photos on the site are really encouraging.
The idea for the module on the side is great and your site suggests that more could be in the future which is also incredibly exciting. What would be nice on the stick (or on the module maybe) is another button that could be accessed without using your thumb which could act as a “shift” button of sorts. On most aircraft the “pinky” button is too important to be used as a shift button.
Finally!! If the other manufacturers don't follow suit Moza will eat their whole market. Every new over priced spring and cam base that was released was driving me insane. The demand for this is going to be very very high.
IKR, been waiting for an FFB base from the bigger players for ages.
What's important to me is that can you assign the trim button and then activate it does the joystick hold firmly in place
Thanks so much for covering this in such a detailed and balanced way!! So psyched for the coming force feedback revolution and the whole slew of force feedback products on the horizon, but especially this one!
I agree, i would love to have the base on the floor and have an extension on my tomcat stick.
I think the most people will use it like the real lenght stick. The base will be on floor and via lenght extension used as the center stick.
True though tbh if the base has sufficient throw like 20° in each + & - of the axis then you can get away with having the base mounted higher & either little or no extension. The main reason ppl use an extension, other than ergonomics, is to increase the amount of throw on the axis which makes control easier for things like formation, a2ar or heli flight etc. But if someone is going to mount this in their "realistic" sim pit then yeah they'll likely have it mounted on the floor with a ~200mm extension.
This base only has 9NM of force. I fear if you put an extension on it, you'll have too much leverage for the feedback to be effective.
@@parithon2397 Yeah 9nm isn't crazy high like some DD wheels or the FFBeast but I wouldn't say "only" 9nm. 9Nm is plenty enough for the effects to come through & you can make it feel really heavy compared to a spring/cam set up. A lot of ppl are running 200mm or even longer extensions on their Rhino, depending on grip weight it can have a bit of an effect of the felt forces but still much nicer than a spring/cam set up, that's the biggest thing for me with FFB is the ability to customise the feel of the stick with just a profile change. Even if there was no ffb effects after owning the Rhino I could never go back to a normal base. Just the sticktion problem alone on a spring/cam/dampener base is enough for the Rhino to be better. FFBeast levels of torque (~30Nm) are actually getting dangerous, this isn't a steering wheel that spins while locked in place, you have a likely metal grip being flung around on the end of an extension @~30Nm that can do some damage. Even this AB9 should have an emergency stop button. I'm really happy there's a company binging FFB back to the market & it looks like Winwing is joining in on the fun too!
Damn dude… that’s pretty cool! Can’t wait to see when they release this to the public, the no dead zone is actually a game changer for me… irl when the jet is off (or at least in the F-18 and I’m pretty sure some other jets) I’ve seen that the joy stick falls to one side like that. This looks like it will be an awesome product! I hope they come out with more joystick replicas in the future to go with it. I think this will take flight sims like (DCS or MSFS) to a whole other level.
Never heard of them. Hopefully my VKB works with this! If so, I'll totally buy!
Please do a follow up video with a non fly by wire acft. Does it get hot, is there a fan if so how loud is it?
They don't have fans in it right now, one of their marketing points. Dunno about the heat situation tho
Thanks a lot for reviewing this product for us. The last one I had was the sidewinder back in the day. Great that’s it’s compatible with the Thrustmaster grips. Love your insight on this one.👍👍
They need to sort the depth for your average monstertech clamp or better still give them a secure floor mounting option, that thing is a giant.
Welcome to the FFB joystick community! 😆. Seriously though it's awesome to see MOZA bringing FFB joysticks back to market. I hope they do a yoke too! I've had my VPforce Rhino base for a while now & it's been a total game changer for flight sims. FFB effects are cool for immersion etc. but the best thing about ffb is the ability to customise how the stick feels by just changing the config profile, no need to change springs or cams & tighten or loosen dampeners. You can have it feel suited to something like the F-18 a fly-by-wire jet then with the change of a profile you can have it feel more suited to something like the F-4 or F-14. Warbirds are great with ffb you can really feel the flight control surfaces so much better & the same goes for GA/Bush planes. Helicopters though are where FFB joystick bases really shine! having legit force trim is so much different to having a spring & cam stick even with light springs & tight dampeners it's just not the same, plus you can make the stick feel lighter or heavier according to if it's a small or larger heli. Anyone with FFb & DCS needs to try the F-14 Tomcat as it has some of the best native FFB effects in DCS.
Been eyeing the Rhino and just recently got on the long waitng list. Primarily for DCS helicopters, warbirds, Hornet and Mudhen that I fly the most. Especially the Kiowa and Apache!
One nice feature that would be awesome to have is the increased stiffness in the stick when hydraulics are off. Or in other cases the 0 spring 0 force on some aircraft when they are off. I don't know exactly when each one aplies, but it would be awesome to have these effects.
What I'd like to see for helicopters is that when u trim the heli with buttons the stick moves with it, so the motor pushes it according to your trim inputs. And that you can set a new center with trim release button and recenter it with trim reset button.
Can you mount it like 8” lower on your setup? Then you can rest your wrist on your leg. Hugely important for helis
Good to know this is everything I wanted for flying rotorwing in DCS. I'm an Apache enjoyer and have been wanting more out of my controls for it.
Hyped for this!
This looks awesome! And thanks! Would you mind trying it out with the TF-51 mustang or another warbird? The feel of the ailerons and elevator should change quite a bit depending on airspeed, it would be interesting to see if that effect is present.
Will be curious to see what mounting options will come specifically for this! Thanks for the preview man!
Agreed. I have the NLR Boeing Simpit and I don’t see any good options for mounting. I guess I could take out the crossmember all together and out the huge base on the floor?
Like others have said, it's the older generation of aircraft and helecopter trim where force feedback shines.
The DCS warbirds are especially good because as the control surfaces lose their grip on the air, the stick will flutter and become loose.
The Phantom FFB is unlike anything else.
As for the software.
Spring is the centering force.
Friction is the force required to keep the stick moving.
Dampening is the resistance to sudden or large movements.
Inertia is the resistance to sudden change to stick movements in progress.
The F-18 Hornet is a fly-by-wire aircraft, which means that the stick is not directly connected to the control surfaces via cables or hydraulics, but is connected to a computer which takes inputs on the stick and makes the corresponding changes to the control surfaces. This means that force feedback is not realistic if you are feeling more resistance at higher speeds. Force feedback is suited more towards older jets, like the F-4 Phantom, and warbirds, like the P-51, or any aircraft with cable or hydraulic control. In less technical terms, the control surfaces of the F-18 are computer controlled. You don't feel any direct feedback through the stick from the control surfaces. But other than that, this looks like an excellent choice for those who don't want to build their own force feedback stick.
Oooh this is interesting, and definitely something to keep an eye on! Thanks for this sneak-peak, I’m looking forward to further videos 🙂
The thing about it that really jumps out at me is that because of the height of the base you won't be putting it on your desk for flying. You're sort of forced into a different mounting solution.
Considering how popular force feedback sticks were in the early 2000's I'm surprised there's not more offerings these days now that flight sims have advanced so much and FF racing wheels are so common.
How is this the only review so far? Where is everyone? Also pleas try some actual non flybywire planes. F4, F14, warbirds etc.
I love the Moza product line, I own the R9, a couple wheels, h pattern shifter and a handbrake. I am so happy to see them enter the Flight sim market. I hope they will make it easy to use VKB sticks. I own a Gunfighter Ultimate and I will buy the FFB base in a heartbeat if it is compatible with the Gunfighter stick!
you should of had your name down for a VPforce Rhino! They have a passthrough adapter for VKB. I've had my Rhino for a fair while & love it! Been using it with my MCGU plus winwing f-18 grip (via adapter), Virpil Warbrd (plug & play same as TM) & the VKB KG-12 (adapter) too! You can also check out the FFBeast, but it's more diy & less options for grips, you need all passthrough-to-base adapters.
man if its more affordable than all the third party ones I would buy it right away
I think you should prepare yourself for "Sim Racing" prices.
R.I.P.
@@Beeroshima21 from what i can see the steering wheel with pedals is 550, thats way better than somebodies garage designed joystick base (nothing wrong with that) for $1800 without the stick itself.
Afaik Moza came in and made racing sim prices lower by competing more reasonable prices, making entry level options. Could be decent, I think, but we'll see
@@shyneus9773 ^this
@@shyneus9773I’m hoping something around 400-500 comparing to their other simracing bases
Fantastic! Thanks for the TM compatibility. I have 2 TM sticks F-16 and FA-18 and this is a gamechanger for me! Kudos if it all works. Looking so forward to flying the AH-64 as it should be.
Blu Games. FYI a note on the Helicopter trim; as a general rule it's referred to as force trim & the stick will in fact have some spring resistance to it while centred. When you want to transition to say level forward flight, you press & hold the force trim button on the grip move the grip to the position needed then release the trim button, at that moment the spring tension will return making that new position feel as the centre. So pretty much hold the trim button maneuver then release to "create a new centre position". Great video too m8.
Have you flown the Kiowa yet? Interested in your experience with it using the Rhino. I'm currently using the Virpil CM3 dry clutch setup, but I really need FFB!
@@redtailpilot yeah m8 the Kiowa like any other heli is awesome with FFB. It really is game changing for flight sims & especially heli as even with a diy dampener set up on other bases you still don't get the force trim. I would get my name down for a Rhino asap & you cn wait to see what specs & price the new FFB for Moza & winwing will be, you can always cancel the Rhino preorder.
@@PiNKMuDSimGaming My thinking exactly. Yeah I got on the list a week prior to hearing about the two new kids joining the party, lol. Can't wait to see prices and reviews on them. Now I need to be even more patient 😂
Exciting times!
I have Moza gear for my driving sim build and they make really good stuff. Shipping was a bit of a nightmare and if you can buy in your region, that is suggested. But, if you are not in a big hurry when you order or can get it locally, they do make some higher end stuff at good prices.
Already have a Rhino, but interested to see how this stacks up in terms of price and performance. Looks real slick
Like to see it being able to do a dual stick operation for Star Citizen with a Omni Throttle style stick like VKB sim has for their dual sticks> That would be cool. Star Citizen also needs to write software for it
I once had this Logitech FF G940 which was pretty cool, but had loads of precision problems. They discontinued the support, so I had to sell it and used a Thrustmaster Warthog. When I saw this video, I directly pre-ordered this device! I'm really looking forward to have FF again, together with my buttkicker. :-)
OMG I love just flying around in my DCS Mustang. I can go up in the skies, head for the mountains and fly around for an hour that just zips by doing nothing. I shudder to think what happens if (when) I finally succumb to FFB.
sounds like myself 😂
@@redtailpilot I watched a video a year ago where the guy said that his high end racing wheel coupled with VR is so good it kinda ruined his life. he stated he can spend 10hrs a day racing as it fills him with so much serotonin and good feelings that when he comes out of that virtual world into this one he gets depressed.
@@dealwolfstriked272 LOL that's definitly believable. The only reason I haven't succumbed to the same thing with my flight sim hobby, is lack of time. When I have an hour or two in VR, 6DOF motion and all my gear in DCS (MSFS occasionally) I'm in another world!!!
@@redtailpilot the future looks amazing for simmers! Take care and enjoy the open skies :)
@@dealwolfstriked272 Keeps me in the air when I can't get in the real cockpit for one reason or another :) Started this hobby as a teen over three decades ago. Became a private pilot two decades ago 🙂
They impressed the heck out of me with this! I was not expecting it at all, even when they emailed me before the event i was still like whaaaaaat???? 😮
Riiiiight. I never expected this
@belgeode
Did you get to try it out? If so, I'd like your thoughts, because I just pre-ordered that sucka 🤣 Couldn't believe the price point compared to what the other ones cost!
Allowing us have it detect the DCS module we are in and have separate presets auto selected would be awesome. It is possible too as DCS VAICOM and SRS autochange based on module being used.
my fav comp. I got the R9 + GS, I'm happy with the Quality and Proformance. I put this on the wishlist
Oh hell yes! We absolutely needed FFB flight sticks. It will make dcs and Sims so much more accurate along with letting us feel the plane more.... if it reacts to buffeting that will allow us to keep energy levels up better!!! This is a total must have!
Just now starting to get into flight simulator, super excited to check out this joystick, looks like the future of flight sims are getting insane
The base is humungus. The stick is super high above the legs.
Honestly it seems like this would be ideal for flying helicopters, put the base on the ground, use an extension, and bam you’ve got a pretty accurate home sim of heli cyclic
You won’t be mounting it like this guy.
uh you mount it lower on a profile rig
Its probably designed for extensions so will mount near ground
@@Captain_Yogurtdo you think that a joystick extension would work with this ffb? Maybe too much pressure on the gauges?
Hopefully they can provide an adaptor for WinWing grips. 🤞🏼
Same here bro. Was the best thing you can get short of ffbeast and the like so my full winwing stuff would be awesome to be able to use. Can't friggen wait bro, I'll be ordering mine the second it's out
Unfortunately, I think the connection or encoding or whatever technical nonsense WW uses is proprietary. Like the VPF Rhino, we could mount the stick with an adapter, but the connector needs to have an extension to an also plugged in WW base for the buttons to work. Please don't make me use a Thrustmaster grip :/
Hey! It was great to meet you this weekend!
I hope they get the tuning right for extensions because it will be the primary use for a base like this.
Epic Video man! I am stoked for this!
I'm still running an old MSFFB2 and dreading the day it breaks. Now we all have options for new FFB. I want one.
PS. FA-18 is a fly by wire jet. So much more feed back in the older jets like the F-4 or the Mig-21. The F-4 you can feel how fast or slow you are by the stick force without having to look at the air speed dial.
A Force Feedback Joystick Base was very needed, especially for Helicopter Simulations
I think we're entering a flight sim golden age in mid 2024. New sims announced. New products announced. FFB sticks making a comeback. VR making leaps and bounds. Continually opening up to the wider console ecosystem.
Only downer is the Razbam-ED situation. Otherwise, it's a good time to be in the hobby!
Soooooo true.
I think what would work for my setup would be to mount this to the Warthog base plate, screw that into the floor then use an extension to get in to the correct height for my chair. I'm hoping the price isn't too prohibitive as this looks like the perfect base that we'll also be able to buy in the UK from the likes of Overclockers without import fees or silly delivery charges.
Moza is an outstanding company. I have a lot of experience with them in the sim racing world due to my involvement in professional sim racing, iRacing/ACC/RF2 ect. If they are setting out to make a FFB flight base, you can bet it will be done right.
In the software did you notice a way to map a force trim interrupt? That’s the way a helo is to be flown and if this unit does that I’ll for sure pick one up!
Attention MOZA: We still need detailed info on adapters to be offered by MOZA to allow VKB GF4 MCGU (and other) grips to be used with this base.
VPForce has these already for theirs, that "might" work here too.
I don't know if they make it but you might benefit from a more realistic setup by having the base on the floor with an extension from the base to your hand control like a real centre stick aircraft has the control column come up through the floor
This would prevent your wrist and arm contacting the beautiful force feedback base you have
This looks really great! I’m looking forward to its pricing, I hope not all that expensive. I do hope they have something to easily place it on/at my desk, as I have to remove my controls daily. Most FFB systems seem to require to be installed permanently. Also, any chance you could demonstrate it with a warbird? I think the F/A-18 has a FBW system, which centers it automatically?
won't work on a desk, will be waay to high, with this joystick you have to use a desk mount that lowers the stick down
Most important thing, can you feel the plane buffeting when you load the plane under high g? Or are you just feeling a progressive load as you pull? I'm not worried about the roll axis much I'm really interested in if you can feel the buffet as your pulling? It would be a huge advantage if you could so you could feel it as it starts to come up so you can relax slightly to reduce the energy scrubbing. Also is it liner? Or is it progressive? The more you pull the harder it gets?
Progress load. At the moment. I have given them feedback and hopefully they will add more detail and make some changes before they release
Great to see HOTAS options increasing. Virpil and VPC have had the duopoly for the most part.
This is what I’ve been looking for! Specifically a base that is suited for a long shaft on the stick. Tired of the short wiggly joysticks, I want a long center mounted stick with huge throw and no center snap.
Promising, and if this end up well executed, a possible contender to replace my Virpil setup.
For me, switching would be considerably easier if I could keep my Virpil grip and extension. Also, a good implementation for IL-2 Sturmovik would be paramount as that's what I play.
One question - I use a VKB stick currently and I like the grip. Is there any way to mount a VKB stick on a TM base?
Airbus Sidestick Simulation including solenoid ap lockout would be an amazing addition!!
So excited to see options popping up in this segment. I absolutely cannot stand how my cheap spring stick feels, particularly the on-center detent.
Finally a large company with an ffb base!!! I do hope they implement fligh by wire correctly tho(
I really love this idea. what would be cool is seeing moza racing making a yoke system more suited for Microsoft flight simulator.
If this is fully compatible with Virpil grips I will be getting one as soon as possible. If it is like the Thrustmaster base where you can use the Virpil grip but you loose lots of functionality then it will be a harder sell.
The force feedback feature is great but its the ability to tune the type and level of FFB through the base, with different software profiles for each aircraft/ aircraft type that really excites me. Being able to software switch between helicopters, cold war jets, FBW jets warbirds is what I want. AND being able to whack my current TM F-16/ A10 and F/A-18 joystick handgrip straight on top is a deal clincher for me!
If it's anything like their sim racing software and implementation, there might be a phone companion app where you can change saved profiles in a second. It's works great on the sim racing side, and shouldn't be hard to integrate here.
Thanks for sharing this. It would seem to me that if you had an extension and the base sat on the floor that would be great. I have an extension on my VKB tomcat stick and I wonder if that would work on one of these bases.
I hope it won't be too expensive and yes the base is huge! I want to use it for flight sims like DCS, helicopters and airplanes but also Star Citizen or other Space Games.
The Hornet has FBW with an artificial feel system that provides stick force depending on phase of flight. It’s stick force per G in regular flight, and stick force per AOA with wheels down. It maybe different depending on hook bypass switch as well. I just hope they implement this as hornet is my first love
it can only go off what telemetry data DCS sends out & I'm not sure it send out that sort. This could maybe be emulated via the Moza telem software itself. The hard parts would be making it know when to read the AoA & when to read the G forces, I can see it being possible to make it read from one or the other but from both at different times would completely depend on the telemetry data DCS sends to the base.
I still have my ancient Microsoft Sidewinder FFB Pro sitting around after all these years. I just recently drug it out to use with MSFS, though the actual FFB is only really present as a spring force. Game compatibility seems to be one of the bigger issues for FFB, at least as far as flight sims go. Admittedly I don't have much experience with them though. I bought my stick way back in the Mechwarrior days (it was bundled with MW3), which was kind of built around the FFB it offered. Seemed like several games supported it back then, but then it just kind of trailed off. Even now it seems like you need to have add-ons and mods to use it to its best effect.
One question I'd have is if the motors are strong enough to handle stick extensions.
9nm isn't huge but it's the same as the VPForce Rhino and I've seen people using that with modest extensions.
@@BrunoBarata78 then comes the question on if the motors can handle the increased exertion needed with an extension installed... much less the other hardware handling the increased weight.
@@parithon2397 its probably a good bet to ask VPForce Rhino owners how they're getting along with it. But keep in mind that just asking for extension length won't do, as some rhino's have a bit of a length to the stick adapter but others are shorter. So for netter comparison you want to know length from the pivot point at the gimbal, and you'll need the same for the MOZA.
@@BrunoBarata78 the Rhino uses a belt system to drive the force so it may not be as ineffective as the direct drive system used here. Additionally the reciprocal forces applied would be significantly different for the same reasons.
if they do this right its gonna sell out FAST! excited to get my hands on one
Preorder is out at $549!
Thrust master stick compatible, thank you Moza! Omg. This is exciting.
I'd be curious if any space sims support this.
Elite, Citizen, etc
Great question. I hope so
I can’t wait for this, we are so lucky to have a manufacturer do a ffb stick! I fly a lot in DCS, all modules. I have just bought a Moza R5 bundle and I love the quality and software, so this item will be excellent. Would be nice for FFB pedals at some point :) please price this right Moza I am poor 😂
wonder how well it will work with a 200mm extension. i am glad moza decided to put skin in the flight sim world. when you doing pre orders moza
I've been wanting to get into FFB bases. I fly helicopters and being able to get a more accurate feeling in DCS as well would definitely help in practicing.
Looks like something I would buy but I have to say I think I would like to see some sort of cutoff switch included in the price. I fly a centre mounted stick and the Idea of a large piece of metal or plastic flapping round between my legs after a crash or from some kind of bug gives me pause.
How does this feel in warbirds and the old hydraulics of the pre-cold war jets?
Just when I think I know what to buy you go and show us this 😮🎉
Hahaha
I need this base. My Sidewinder FFB2 is at legal age already (still going BTW! Probably used it on like 2/3 of the days over two decades, that thing is the literal definition of "rock solid") and I want something more precise and with more hats and buttons on it. Flying without FFB is like flying with broken trim. Also, FFB might be one of the few things that give us at least something that a butt meter would provide. We need all of that if we can have it.