Another bombed city - war still not ended - October 23, 1943 - War Against Humanity 083
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- Опубликовано: 2 июн 2024
- Trainload after trainload arrives at the slave and murder factories in Auschwitz, and a fire storm is created in Kassel, while the United Nations War Crimes Committee UNWCC is formed.
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Director: Astrid Deinhard
Producers: Astrid Deinhard and Spartacus Olsson
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Written by: Spartacus Olsson, Joram Appel
Research by: Joram Appel, Spartacus Olsson
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Mikołaj Uchman
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Dememorabilia - / dememorabilia
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Spartacus Olsson
Source literature list: bit.ly/WW2sources
Archive footage: Screenocean/Reuters - www.screenocean.com
Image sources:
USHMM
Leiden University Libraries
IWM WPN 153, FRE 11857, Art.IWM ART LD 467, HU 67287, HU 6307, D 1523
Yad Vashem 7919/65, 3518/7, 1448, 1907/6, 1907/3
Instytut Pamięci Narodowej
Famile Aufderheide
Picture of Kassel on fire, courtesy of Heinz Körner
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Out the Window - Wendel Scherer
Equations of Motion - Farrell Wooten
Falling Clouds - Trevor Kowalski
Time to Face Them - Wendel Scherer
Slow Discovery - Cobby Costa
Barrel - Christian Andersen
Nighttime - Farrell Wooten
Darkness Closing In - Max Anson
Icicles - Jon Bjork
Duels - Farrell Wooten
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The United Nations War Crimes Commission which is founded this week in 1943 only gets a short mention in the episode, but it’s a really big milestone in the evolution of international law. In 2022 with 20/20 hindsight we can also say that the system of international order that it will become part of is flawed at best, to not say in many ways dysfunctional.
Nevertheless, stability, prosperity, and human life depends on it - in fact without that basis for international cooperation, humanity will face even bigger challenges to solve any other problems we face.
While a greater understanding of history in and of itself doesn’t create international order, it is the very basis we need to forge such solutions. To make a humble contribution to that effort is our mission, and what the members of the TimeGhost Army are part of creating.
So, if you haven’t already, join the TimeGhost Army and the fight for a better future based on understanding the failures and successes of our ancestors. Excelsior!
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So was the United Nations War Crimes Commission the first UN organisation formed? I did not know that
@@Cybonator it was. The UNWCC remained in operation until 1948, when its work was considered concluded. The successor organization is the UN International Law Commission formed in 1947, and made active in 1949. Both commissions were/is hampered by a lack of prosecutorial power. The UNILC recommended the creation of international courts already in the early 50s, but the Cold War stood in the way. In 1998 the International Criminal Court was formed through the adoption of the Rome Statute, but is hampered by that the US and Russia withdrew from ratification, despite signing the statute, and China never even signing the statute.
Speaking of strategic bombing, Bret Deveraux has a blog post on "A Collection of Unmitigated Pedantry" regarding strategic bombing and it's consistent failure to produce results.
I wish Time-travelers would modernize the Bronze Age nations then no World Wars or Putin!
@@christiandauz3742 The Bronze Age were as cruel than Putin. 1st Samuel 15:3 "Now go, attack the Amalekites and totally destroy all that belongs to them. Do not spare them; _put to death men and women, children and infants,_ cattle and sheep, camels and donkeys."
As a geriatric nurse I took care of a woman who, as a child, was trapped in a cellar under the rubble of her house during the bombing of Kassel. Up until her last day on this earth, she always insisted on having the lights turned on in her room 24/7 and wearing the collars of her shirts as wide as possible in the chest area. All because she never could forget the experience she had to go through during her time down in that cellar, the utter darkness whilst hardly being able to breathe...
I absolutely hate this program. I keep checking to see how much is left every few seconds. Keep checking how much more of this I have to see, it often makes me feel ill. You are doing an amazing job, keep up the good work. This NEEDS to exist. Never forget.
Thank you, and I’m sorry, but not sorry for putting you through it.
Like I constantly tell people his is one of, if not the, most important series done by you guys. I also tell people at the same time to be ready for a gut punch. As frankly this is hard to process and listen to. It’s heart wrenching, but it’s essential. And I thank you all for going through this and sharing it. I know I will never know what you all have to read and go through to make these videos. I can only imagine it’s far more and even more heart wrenching. But I thank you all from the bottom of my heart for doing this.
I'm very glad that Sparty has ceased to refer to this as a "sub-series." The fate of individual non-combatants is as important as the results of open battle. As with Spies & Ties and On the Home Front, as well as their other specials et. al., this IS the story of the war, just from a different perspective.
Full agreement here. Cataloging the entirety of the horrors of the War is a crucial task for the future... Yet, it avoids the moniker of "thankless" by the support this community can offer the Time Ghost team, and Spartacus specifically.
So, thank you Spartacus, for doing this terrible, soul-crushing task for the sake of posterity. We are with you, to the end.
Thank you all! ❤
I've always appreciated your use of the word "murdered" rather than liquidated, exterminated, gassed, or some other euphemism. I have to think it is a purposeful decision and adds to the primary goal of this series: to open the eyes of the modern person to the personal horror and impact evil on an industrial scale which minds lulled by peace and comfort instinctively reject. The crimes against humanity of this era were not, are not mere statistics and we must come to terms with that fact even if we must force ourselves to do so. Never forget must be more than a slogan.
He actually used all those words in the series. One needs to avoid repetition for rhetorical reasons.
The barbers testimony hit me really hard, I really begin to realize the suffering that they had to go through
Compare that 'suffering' to what people suffered in the DEATH CAMPS !! That barber was far better off.
@@gedeon2696 Are you trying to gatekeep suffering and death in war?
@@Nostripe361well, I feel for the barber because he had to bury his family, but the death of the people in the cellar did sound a lot better than being worked to death or being gased in Auschwitz.
The barber's story and closing speech here are especially powerful, thank you as always for covering all this.
I worked as a volunteer for VSO in Bangladesh from 1974 to 1976, When I went there a devastating flood had left the country 60% under water. one million died of famine or disease in the first three months. There wks. some help but not much. this was in a time of peace not war. For myself. I worked, watched people die on the streets and returned home to eat, so I have no moral superiority. Never forget? Similar horrors are happening today in Tigray
@@coling3957 Seems to me British policies and inaction actually made the famine far worse than it would’ve been were it dealt with properly. The hoarding of rice and grain in the cities while the countryside was starving was an act of neglectful mismanagement, to say the least, exacerbated by the colonial authorities own racist attitudes towards the populace, whose repeated entreaties they ignored or wrote off until their plight became manifestly impossible to ignore.
Well the British had such a good track record with famine after all…
You can't compare hand of G-d (flood) with man made murder...
True, evil still exists to this day, either due to war, cooperate greed, national politics, or international failure or anything between. What is important is to report on the horrors as it happens and to repeat it so often that the public international attention will switch to this. Failure on that part will makes what you have seen, will happen again and again
and Sri Lanka
3:44 The image of a skeleton of the starved man is somewhat disturbing to me. I probably cannot even imagine how terrible it must have been when even the vultures and jackals have eaten your body.
Thank you covering the bombing the Kassel as well. Often it is the civilians on both sides that have to suffer the effects of aerial bombing. As always, never forget.
People raised in western culture tend to have a romantic sense of propriety. We are horrified by any form of dismemberment, but less so by suffocation. Members of primitive societies often possess no such illusions. To them, dead is dead; the cause of death is less relevant than what should be done about it. To illustrate this point I'll quote from a book I'm currently reading, "Hunter", the autobiography of one of Africa's greatest professional hunters (whose name happened to be Hunter). He describes the common native practice of the time (early to mid 20th century) of leaving dead and dying family members to nature's scavengers. In one extraordinary case a native chief requested the government help him locate and destroy a marauding lion that had killed his mother. The local game ranger found the woman's remains, and knowing the lion would return to the kill that night, asked permission of the chief to incise the body and plant strychnine. The chief agreed and the following morning the dead lion was found straddled over the woman's half-eaten body. The English officer offered his sincerest apologies and promised the government would spare no expense for the funeral. He added he would grant any wish the chief desired. The chief replied, "Well, I hate to see the old lady wasted like that. We've been having a lot of trouble with hyenas lately. Let's leave her out another few nights and see and see if she can't get some hyenas."
Powerful and thought provoking as ever, This series is making me question all the beliefs that were part of my upbringing in a Post war UK - Thank you Spartacus
The barber's story really hit me in the feels
Very tough video to watch, especially the final 5 minutes or so. Thank you for reminding us of all that had been happening. As you always say, "Never Forger!"
Thank you
I appreciate that you use the term 'murdered' rather than the more neutral 'killed'.
Yes… murder is after all both the legal definition, and the morally correct term.
Murder is the correct term. The Bible doesn't say thou shall not kill, it says thou shall not murder.
@@dr.barrycohn5461 The bible wasn't written in English.
Indeed. It was Nazi ideology to murder their victims. Not the Allies. The Nazis and the Japanese had to be defeated by whatever forces were available at the time. Never Forget that.
@@Carewolf but difficult words exist in different languages to convey the same meaning
one day, Indy will get to say : "The war is over."
and then, in true whimsical (?) Indy fashion , he'll ask: "But is it , really?"
the continuation after that will be no less epic for the work already done . .
Sparty also gets to say : "The war is over".
as he will then have to sadly but honestly add - "But the "war on humanity" is not! -ever".
and he'll keep right on going . .
join the time ghost army
you'll want to be hearing more
Every time that I think that there is no way that you could possibly put a finer point on your closing statement, I'm proven wrong.
Thank you for keeping these stories alive, and reminding all of us that we're only one wrong decision away from becoming what we despise.
"An eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth, a child for a child does nothing to improve the Earth. Hatred and revenge do not bring power.
They are places where those who can't confront themselves go to hide."
How chilling are Spartys words, oh so gently he said them with a look in the eyes that talks about not beeing able to understand the source of the driving force behind them.. But shurely on point like every time, and as my grand grand father always repeated to me YES TO FORGIVE, NEVER TO FORGET!! He was a Dachaü inmate..
Respect to your grandfather - and thank you.
@@spartacus-olsson Thank you Sparty, form the hart out, and for the inspiration and all the good behind every word..
I will tell you a curiosity because it would be a shame to not mention that too..
So, my grand grand mother(his wife) was a Birkenau inmate, working daily in Monowitz for AG Farbenn as she told me that they were assembling bombs.. They both survived and lived to die as a 100 and a 98 year old coupple cca 10 years ago.. In the last coupple of days they were situated in a medicaly supported oldhouse and were inside the same room but in different beds, as my ggfather started to depart over to the other side my ggmother aswell followed him by less than a min later.. It was so humboling that I almost could not believe what I had withnesed..
I wanted to share that little piece of history with you konwing that I am telling it to a person that can fully understand the matter in hand..
Once again I'm sending all the best and all the love,
Thanks,
Filip
@@FilipMatacin bless them both! Thank you for sharing that.
@@spartacus-olsson Thank you for the toughts and the kindness, I know how proud would they be by watching you guys reviving all the WWII monents that they had so much fear people will forget in time..
Sparty thank you once more from the bottom of my hearth.
Thanks Sparty - that was the best speech against the death penalty I have ever heard. An eye for an eye achieves nothing positive: the goal of modern legal systems is to prevent further violence, not to exact retribution/vengeance.
Justice remains the only factor in whether a sentence is correct or incorrect, however. And prevention of violence will often be very unsympathetic to the imprisoned; rightfully.
Another thought provoking episode. As hard as it is for us to watch, it must be doubly hard for you to deliver. I appreciate the tenderness you show for the innocent victims and collateral damage of total war on both sides equally. This series helps new generations to, hopefully, NEVER FORGET! Thank you good man!
I wish this could inspire action, that for an entire week, month or year, the world would stop conducting business with China - wholly, forfeiting cheaper products and even luxury goods to make a statement against tyranny. It's not just Uighurs, Christians, Falon Gong, but people outside of China. How much will we tolerate and for how long? It's already gone too far. I'm ashamed at being a modern human being. The 20th/21st centuries have not made us more vigilant. It's as if we have *forgotten.*
After each episode, I wonder about the material you didn’t present because it was too terrible to see. We are lucky that color photography wasn’t common in this period. I’ve seen colorized Great War photos that showed the carnage as it was.
@@657449 Excellent point! I’ve done much reading, watching, researching material on the Holocaust and WWII so I KNOW what Sparty doesn’t tell us.and thank you for reminding me. It is up to all of us who believe in humanity and that we CAN do better and we MUST come together, united as the human species to save our planet and embrace our uniqueness while celebrating our commonality! I hope this made sense-had trouble sleeping, saw your reply and started typing.
@@annehersey9895 I keep thinking of what the Franz Ferdinand moment is in our lifetime. Who thought that his death in 1914 would lead to the Great War and later the Even Greater War. I think that the invasion of Ukraine is it. Things are sliding out of control. As in the Fall of 1914, it wasn’t going to be a quick war. But the next battle, the next new weapon, etc, would end it. It didn’t.
Our leaders are incompetent, senile, or have an agenda beyond our countries. Things can escalate to a point where we get to use the Doomsday weapons. Not on purpose, but it was the next step. Putin like Hitler, wanted a quick war. It didn’t happen. It has become a war of attrition and his support at home is dwindling. He needs a face saving exit strategy.
I watch the other videos in the series and even in the 19th century wars, there was carnage. As you watch the battle lines on the map of these wars and WW2, they run over the bodies of soldiers and civilians of both sides. Carnage of people and the products of civilization. It will take generations to rebuild.
In 1903, Mark Twain wrote a story called the War Prayer. When you call for the death and destruction of your enemy, you are also putting a curse on his family members. Your enemy loves his family the same way you love yours. He will be missed the same way you will be missed.
Never Forget!
What I find hard to understand is why the Allies, especially RAF Bomber Command thought they could break the spirit of the German civilian population. The example of British civilian morale in the face of Luftwaffe bombing earlier in the war should have informed their planning.
I grew up near Coventry in the 1960s, and when discussing the damage that city suffered I often heard the view expressed that the Germans deserved everything they got from the RAF. As Harris said, they sowed the wind and reaped a whirlwind. The other view was that bombing was the only course open at that time to hit back at the enemy.
Sadly I have come to the conclusion that in wartime human beings must lose some of their humanity, the need to regard your enemies as sub-human in some way may affect a lot more of us than we would hope.
Maybe it's racial ideas that the German's will to fight is weaker than British one
The breaking of their spirit wasn't the main goal. It was to destroy Nazi Germany's war fighting potential. The daylight bombing with escorts was in part designed to destroy the Luftwaffe and it very much did that. The destuction of the the Luftwaffe allowed the allies to invade France and also helped the Soviets too. The bombing also really helped the Soviets by diverting AA guns from the eastern front to Germany.
@@rring44 sorry Bob, but that simply isn’t correct. It’s sort of correct for the USAAF, but definitely not for the RAF. I’ll let Arthur Harris himself explain:
“The aim of the Combined Bomber Offensive ... should be unambiguously stated [as] the destruction of German cities, the killing of German workers, and the disruption of civilised life throughout Germany ... the destruction of houses, public utilities, transport and lives, the creation of a refugee problem on an unprecedented scale, and the breakdown of morale both at home and at the battle fronts by fear of extended and intensified bombing, are accepted and intended aims of our bombing policy. They are not by-products of attempts to hit factories.”
@@spartacus-olsson Even leaving out the obvious moral problem, didn´t this effort also consume valuable resources that could have been used elsewhere at that point? I know the Allies had resources to spare at this point in the war, but even still, it seems like a waste to do so many of these raids. Maybe one or two every month just for propaganda reasons, but this volume seems excessive.
@@spartacus-olsson okay it's terrible for civilians but as I've said for years who have started that madness first.?
The History of WW2 series would not be complete without these side series. What was perpetrated both both Axis and Allies in an attempt to resolve the war, defies belief. The horrors inflicted on the ordinary people of the world are mindnumbing. To turn a blind eye to these events is to pretend it never happened. To know that it did, reinforces the belief it should never happen again. Sadly it does. War is horrible.
it still feels weird to "like" these videos, but i would like to thank you for the ongoing coverage to show us the atrocities as accurate and highlighted as they require!
Spartacus, every time I watch you tackle these horrors I admire and pray for you. Please take care of yourself and have help at the ready while you make this dark history present for us all to see.
Every week its gets grimmer and grimmer and yet there are rays of lights and the spark of resistance. Never forget
Another bone chilling, deeply moving, exceptionally well written episode by Spartacus. THANKS
Thank you
maaaan that ending was brutal. this is how ww2 should be taught in school.
Never Forget Never Again
That’s a powerful question at the end.
Thank you for mentioning that the war crimes tribunal as such was only looking into the crimes of the other side, not war crimes generally.
Just noticed the very accurate pronounication of german names, ranks and towns etc. here. As a german thats quite rare to see/ hear when hearing english speaking people try to pronounce our sometimes quite weird words. Very nice job on that.
Some truly horrific stuff here. Thanks for your hard work
Sparty you did a great job on this and all episodes of the war against humanity series . Thank you .
This is one of the only channels I respect. Even tho I have not watched the videos, I find this to be an interesting idea posting these videos in real time. Very interesting!
I very much appreciate these videos. Thank you
Very well done episode as always!
this episode resonated with me for one specific reseon i am from a small town near kassel and know that is has been almost completly destroyed in ww2 (about 90% of it)
"An eye for an eye makes the world a blind place"
-Matmatma Gandhi.
Never forget
Yup appeasement works far better huh ?
@@davidhaaijema4521 It's still one hell of a quote.
Christ concurred.
@@bloodrave9578 It's a stupid quote devoid of reality and how actual human beings work.
@@davidhaaijema4521 It warns of the dangers of revenge which can then spiral out of control very fast.
Be it an imagined enemy or a real enemy.
The desire for revenge of some form has always been with us, it's the demon we all must learn to live with.
I wouldn't say that the deaths of the children in the cellar was just. War is grotesquely unfair, and the weakest always suffer the most.
But I would then ask how the allies could have prevented the deaths of those children? I suppose the answer would be to not bomb them in the first place. But what else were they to do? They didn't have the technology to carry out precision bombing raids. They had to take the war to Germany because after all, they initiated the whole thing. They had to degrade the German capacity to wage war. Anyone suggesting that pulverising cities, breaching dams, bombing factories and raining down death and destruction didn't have any effect on Germany's ability to wage war is naive. The Air forces required to defend day and night, the concrete for building bunkers, the constant repair of factories and production lines, the Flak troops not on the Eastern front, the degrading and damage caused had a huge cumulative effect even if it didn't undermine the civil will and morale. For example, hundreds of thousands of tonnes of concrete and 6 months of work by construction workers were required to repair the dams after the dambusters raid - materials and personnel much needed elsewhere.
Ultimately, I think that the responsibility for what happened to those children, as well as all the other children whose lives were cut short by WW2, falls back to Hitler. Had he not attacked Poland, and Russia, and western Europe, and used his vicious ideology to justify all the other monstrous things he did, the allies would not have been forced into the position of having to bomb anything, including those poor children.
I mourn their deaths, but don't believe that the western allies should be forced into some sort of self flagelation and take the ultimate responsibility for what happened.
Who’s talking about self flagellation? None of us were around, and the decision makers are all long dead. Or do you believe that the sins of the father are inherited? As for the narrativere of winning the war, reducing the Allied casualties, or even shortening the war… it didn’t though. Wait and see.
As for naive… isn’t the thing that is naive to think that the war will be won this way after concluding that it didn’t work in your own country?
In many ways, your way of thinking is awfully familiar to that of Rwanda's Paul Kagame. During the Rwanda g*nocide of the Tutsi people, he had seen his fellow citizens fall victims to a powerful and extremist aggressor. Yet, when he came to power, he thought that the best way to deal with said aggressor (in this case the Hutu people) was by committing equality heinous, if not worse, retributions.
Kagame allowed his military to commit horrifying atrocities against fleeing Hutu civilians, which he believed were just as guilty as the Hutu government because they had willingly stood by when the horrors were unleashed upon the Tutsis.
He also authorized the invasion of neighboring Congo to hunt down the retreating Hutu leadership responsible for the Tutsi g*nocide. The result: the deadliest war since WW2 as well as the murder of millions of innocent Congolese civilians that had played no part in the events of Rwanda.
To top it all off, it would all end in the most ironic way possible. By the final months of the war, when the Rwandese government began to buckle under the increasingly strong outside pressure, the army choose as a last resort to ally themselves with the very same Hutu leaders that had been responsible for the g*nocide in the first place.
The result was that everyone, except for the leaders directly responsible for the g*nocide, suffered. If anything, this goes to prove just how ugly and dehumanizing wars are, especially when it turns into petty acts of retribution. It also demonstrates how governments willingly turn a blind eye to their own hypocrisy if it means that they can prioritize their own continued existence (even at the expense of their own civilians).
The British had limited options to bring the fight to the Germans early in the war. Air warfare was an obvious option. But that doesn't necessarily mean the indiscriminate bombing of cities. Other targets were possible. And by 1943 they also had the means to attack with more precision. Some operations they did with the De Havilland Mosquito come to mind. There are some documentaries about those on YT.
Still your argument feels like it is permitted to smack the kid next door because you have an argument with his father. In life and in war you have an obligation to act appropriate and target the person whom it concerns.
I am particularly moved by this episode and all the accounts and testimonies it contains. I fully agree with your conclusion, Spartacus. Thank you
great and wise thoughts, Spartacus
A powerful and informative episode as always, as always it manages to bring me sadness after knowing of the suffering and pain all these people had, are, and will go through for many more months.
It is important to fight and defeat the enemy, but you and the team manage to show how no country is a monolith and that many lives are taken unnecessarily just to fulfill the desire of vengeance.
I want us as fellow humans to be better and to do better, so that when we fight monsters we do not become ones ourselves.
Thank you once more Mr Spartacus for talking about it and helping us remember. May we never forget .
Thank you
As always thanks guys
I'm doing my laundry while watching this. Like I said, tyranny and terror is defeated when they fail to stop us from living our normal lives. But I have tears running down my cheeks thinking of what kids in that cellar went through. It just hurts me to know that people think that kind of treatment is justified. I just don't know what say 😭. All I can say is: Never Forget.
Never forget indeed!
What a horrible time to live.
I couldn’t agree more.
excellent commentary
It's criminal that the US (and I'm a US citizen) disrupted the prosecutions of all those who perpetrated crimes against humanity on the Japanese side.
Heavy Duty, as usual. That's a tough gig, Spartacus...
Thank you for the lesson.
Thank you for not pulling punches.
Thank you.
What a powerful conclusion. Never forget.
My Aunt told me a story while in Wein there was a bombing, and she in her Sunday's clothes as she was visiting and one house collapsed and a water main broke. She and others worked to get the rubble cleared to rescue the people. Unfortunately they drowned as they couldn't clear the rubble fast enough. She just turned 99 this last Wednesday and doing well for her age. But its one of those stories I recorded of her youth growing up during the war.
Mark Twain wrote a story in 1903 called The War Prayer. It would fit perfectly with the closing monologue. When we wish death to our enemies we are also wishing it to their families.
We have a greater duty to resist authoritarianism and fascism than merely to not vote for it.
Very nicely stated at the end Sparty.
Always hard to watch. Your concluding statements are thought provoking. Thank you.
A comment to show my support for the channel, and to help with it's algorithm
As a German I can only say that the part of my family that supported the regime and were Nazis until 45 and then later pretty far right wing conservatives had definitely hardships in WW2 but all survived and lived fulfilling lives.
On the other side of my family my grandma lost her father who tried everything to evade the military by joining the merchant fleet at age 6 when he horribly bled to death in the channel, lost their home to bombing then fled the red army and then got separated from her mother and her younger brother through the wall. My grandma is now close to 90 and carried the trauma of her family being torn apart her whole life.
But nothing hit me more than meeting a survivor of the atomic bomb in Hiroshima who was just a little elementary school boy and suffered his whole life from the after effects and almost none of his friends survived the bombing and the following two weeks. His school was also fairly close to a construction side were many Korean forced laborers died horrible deaths from the heat and radiation.
War is unfair and has terrible consequences on the innocent while some guilty people easily get away. Its horrible and I can’t believe there are still warmongers in 2022… thanks for this series.
In many ways, the warmongers' way of thinking is awfully familiar to that of Rwanda's Paul Kagame. He had seen fellow citizens fall victims to a powerful aggressor. Yet, when he came to power, he thought that the best way to deal with said aggressors (in this case the Hutu people) was by committing equality heinous, if not worse, retribution.
Kagame allowed his military to commit horrifying atrocities against fleeing Hutu civilians, which he believed were just as the Hutu government because they had been bystanders. He also authorized the invasion of neighboring Congo to hunt for the Hutu leaders responsible for the original g*nocide. The result: the deadliest war since WW2 as well as the murder of millions of innocent Congolese civilians that had played no part in the events of Rwanda.
To top it all off, it would all end in the most ironic way possible. By the final months of the war, when the Rwandese government began to buckle to increasing outside pressure, the army choose as a last resort to ally themselves with the _very same Hutu leaders_ that had been responsible for the g*nocide in the first place.
The result was that everyone, except for the leaders directly responsible for the g*nocide, suffered. If anything, this goes to prove just how ugly and dehumanizing wars are, especially when it turns into petty acts of retribution.
The innocents have always been victims of war. Always. If you're going to fight a war you have to accept this. The only way to avoid this is to surrender immediately you are attacked. No one in their right mind would advocate that.
Those are some very, very hard questions.
Spartacus makes a very good point, vis-vis the suffering of German Civilians, but it's still extremely difficult for me to muster any sympathy for them.
Imagine if all these bombs fell not on German cities, but on the frontline or railways. War would've ended much sooner.
like Sparty said in a recent IG post, this was a rough one which speaks volumes about how well made and important these are.
Never the end justifies evil means.
Never forget.
Thanks for appealing to our memory and humanity.
Good work
Crush it, Sparty! Never forget.
Intuitive closing comments. All sides committing atrocities, everyone suffers. Never Forget.
Well done.
Damn, these WAH episodes are so depressing. What a disaster this war was.
These episodes are getting harder to watch. Never forget.
My thanks again, for acknowledging the contrast. I will always try to be cognizant of my own bias, however in 1943, the line between humanity and inhumanity was clearly drawn.
It is sad, however, that the UN war crimes commission would voluntarily discredit themselves by only investigating Axis crimes
An eye for an eye leaves the whole world blind. I think that's how that quote goes
its difficult to understand that the amount of people who die in a day are normal people with their own fears, dreams, beliefs and hopes
There is another quote from Frederick Douglass that gives the perfect telling of the war against humanity to tell the next generation ( agitate agitate then agitate some more)! So keep the telling the world on what happened against humanity by agitating the next generations so they won't forget!....
fear and the immobilizing effect it has kills many of the people talked about in this series. afraid to leave the cellar, afraid to run from the ghetto, afraid to fight the guards. yes, fighting against the armed guards will bring about the immediate death of some of the people fighting them, but failing to fight the guards brings about the slower death of everyone. running through the fire might kill you and certainly hurts but failing to means certain death from asphyxiation.
in contrast many of the heroes are able to function through what would likely be paralyzing fear for nearly anyone and they sometimes live 'against all odds' while saving others, or trying and failing to save others as in the barber's tale
I enjoyed this episode because we are again today getting into the pit of collective guilt. All humans have agency, and their actions and guilts need to be understood in the context of -- but not mixed in with -- the collective/average behavior. And it also must be understood that pointing this out has nothing to do with attempting to equalize the fighting sides somehow. In talking about millions of people suffering, we try to apply our innate sense of what is right and what is wrong onto groups of people and that can only lead to incomplete and imperfect conclusions.
Another well-done, and important video in the series. The death of innocent people in war is horrific, and the deaths of innocent Germans in this war can be squarely laid at the feet of the Nazi regime that triggered the insanity.
Werner Best sounds like a guy who is just done with the Nazis, knows the gig is up, and is positioning for his future war crimes hearing. Which sounds bad except that helping to save the lives of thousands of innocent people is the sort of thing that makes your future war crimes hearing go a lot smoother for you.
And it worked for him…
I never knew of the POW exchange. Germany would have needed these men.
Powerful ending!
I'm actually trying not to cry.
And I fail.
Chilling. We humans need to be reminded of this over and over again. THANK YOU for the bitter pill, Sparty.
The children should have been safe in the countryside while proper airraid shelters should hve been available for the adults. We had a shelter ( brick and concrete ) in the backyard .... not comfortable for the family but you only had to sit there for a few hours till the flames died down....
That's not how it really works. The thing that killed the most people wasn't the flames themselves, but rather the lack of oxygen caused by the intense fires. No amount of protection is going to save you if you can't breath.
Sounds like you have read one of the new book trying to change the story about Werner Best. Still it is not very clear if he was changed by his position in Denmark.
Actually I haven’t. I use the original first hand sources, that is the diplomatic correspondence from the German Foreign Office archives. That’s the beauty of a chronology… it shows you what happened in what order, and puts any post construction into a new, clearer light.
Another nasty fact about carbon monoxide is that it binds to the hemoglobin with a stronger bond then oxygen. So basically the red blood cells will often not trade it for oxygen when it becomes available. So you can suffocate from it even after you got to safety. The only treatment for it is breathing in pure oxygen and increase the chances of it being replaced but this takes a long time and a lot of pure oxygen.
U are awsome
Please cover Unit 731. Given Indian contribution to the war in so many regards it is a travesty that China is a permanent member of the security council but India is not.
Hope this comment passes community comment standards.
They have covered it in a previous episode. They have also made some videos on the plagues that they unleashed against the Chinese popilation back in 1941-42, so that's where you will find more videos about them.
@@extrahistory8956 thanks. Will check them out.
India should be, I agree.
Never forget!
My hometown
Sadly just go with the flow😢
To the question at the end, the Old Testament, Hosea 8:7 has the answer: "For they have sown the wind, and they shall reap the whirlwind." And the harvest is death.
Doubtless, the actions of Germany as a nation had consequences for Germany as a nation. But we should be careful how much, if any, collective guilt we are to assign to civilians. Whatever may be said of the bible's moral authority, it also states plainly that the sins of the father should not be born by the son, nor the son by the father.
@@nicholashollis1522 I'd say that having to bear the sin is not the same as being impacted by the consequences of that sin.
I feel like I always knew that Freddy Kruger was a nazi name
"Don't start nuffin, won't be nuffin" - Harris
I hope everyone has a good day, I'm fucking exhausted. Always seek context and understand that for every action, there's an equal an opposite reaction until your air force can't fight back anymore effectively
Never forget.
Thank you very much for covering the man made Bengal famine of 1943 which is artificially created by the British Government of that time and particularly it was a plan of British Prime minister Winston Churchill to ravage Bengal and Bengalis through the weapon of Hunger. As per the school and College books of India and Bangladesh more than six million innocent civilians died in that 1943 great famine of Bengal ( India ) which was artificially created by the British Government and one of the war crimes of British Government against India during the second World war. There was no difference between Adolf Hitler, Joseph Stalin, Musolini or Winston Churchill, all of them kill millions of innocent non combatants civilians by the weapon of artificially created famine and the resultant real hunger of the masses.
If you cannot differentiate those you mention it’s a sad reflection indeed. Kulaks? Armenian Christians? Pogroms have always been. Strange that the British invested more in India than they ever took. Think railways and stopping the warlords and unifying a nation. Since the British left has that society become more fair and enlightened?
I fear you are getting too good at telling us of these horrors, Mr Olsson.
I hope you are watching out for yourself.
never forget.
never again.
First I appreciate that you view and present the bombing campaign as a crime against humanity. Because the victorious can write history and give medals to the participants of their crimes while the losers will get prosecuted.
Second If Wavell gets results in say a couple of months on the Famine then the prick that was before him is someone with a lot of blood on his hands. Leaders are as much guilty because of actions as they are because of the lack of actions. The Irish famine is another example of that same lack of actions. Worsening it terrible.
I would caution against the 'victors write the history' notion. Even if it were true of past historians, modern historiography has done a tremendous job at shining a light on atrocities committed by the Allies. That's why we're able to learn about it. Whatever attempt the Allies (Soviet Union particularly) made at whitewashing their history, they failed, scholarship triumphed over censorship.
@@nicholashollis1522 I agree, but this is a very recent development. I would caution not to overextend this trend of self criticism. Nowadays history involving slavery for example clearly gives a false representation of facts. Historians may find the truth (if they really want to), but the general public has often a much more one-sided view driven by public agenda.
One thing to bear in mind that whilst today we learn what is going on through the media, in the past that wasn't a thing. That meant incompetence could be hidden, there being no public pressure for anything to change, hence the ability for Hope to claim he left the country in good trim. It was even worse at the time of the Irish Famine.
To your final point:
Do the junior soldiers and officers, young men called up for service of their country deserve to die any more than civilians? Many were not Nazis, a large proportion brave and fair soldiers who were just doing their bit like everyone else. My grandmother lived in Hungary through the war, and said the German army units were honourable and disciplined, and even after 4 years of continuous fighting they were all clean shaven every morning.
War is a terrible thing, and innocent people die for a small minority’s aims. War is in itself against humanity, and only the dead truly see the end of war.
How come you do not cover in anywhere near as much depth the murder of 2-3 million Russian POWs? The murder of German POWs by the Russians?
I’ve covered it when it happened… it’s not happening in this week in October 1943. Soviet POW are not being starved, they are now enslaved. German POW in Russia are not being executed, or let to die as they were earlier this year, they too are now enslaved.
As for the rest… well yes, War is a really bad idea, but when it happens there are rules: one of the most basic of them is that killing enemy soldiers in combat is not murder. Another basic one is: killing any civilians, or surrendered enemies is murder. In both cases their political opinions, their own crimes, and who they are is inconsequential - It’s still murder.
I will point out hundreds of thousands of Jews were killed in Hungary in 1944. It would not have happened if German officers and enlisted men had not occupied Hungary in 1944 regardless of their "honorable" behavior. Too bad they did not behave that way to the Jews of Hungary.
This sort of thing is going on today in Ukraine. Never forget.
Is he related to Ivar Krueger?