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This is really good...but I'm not certain he is a "good" Jedi, but perhaps a sith or "grey" since Disney has decided to make the force much less white and black (light and dark)
*excellent *passionate *extraordinary *enthralling *incredible, etc. please stop using **_*fire_* You’re capable of more than that. I don’t remember Luther saying the rebellion is lit. 🎅🏿
This theory had blow my mind! Even Kassian says to Luthen on the first episode, when they meet: the Empire is so arrogant about their power, that they don't notice the enemy living under their noses! That's why Luthen lives in Coruscant, the Empire will never imagine to hunt a Jedi on their own home
when he asked for that thing back, I instantly thought it was a light saber, especially the way he cautiously wanted the guy to give it back as to not hurt himself or that it had a great meaning to the owner.
Let's all just agree that we, fans of the Andor series would be very satisfied with the cane being a lightsaber! 😁Even if there was no plausible explanation it would still blow my mind😮
More people should give Andor love! It's a really great show and takes a hard look at the institutionalized rise of evil. It makes the rebellion so much more important.
My friends and family didn't give it chance past the first two episodes because of how slow they are. I assured them that all other episodes are fire, but they didn't want to give it a chance again. It's so frustrating because the show is, in my opinion, better than Mandalorian.
Yes! I rewatched it lately with my son, and was surprised how much I enjoyed it the second time! Sooooo much better that Mandalorian, Obiw Wan and Book of Boba Fet!
A main theme of the show is “hiding in plain sight”. This is why Andor was recruited by Luthen, and then Andor explains how it’s easy to hide in plain sight because the empire is too confident in themselves and would never expect it. This theory is very solid and would be a great twist
@@MeanLaQueefa you’re right. That’s why Luthen is no longer one (if we’re buying into the theory..or at least I am). I think he cut himself off from the Force so that he could remain on Coruscant. Right under the emperor’s nose.
NNOOOOOOOOOOOO. makes no sense. he is just so determined he rises to the importance of the Jedi. Too Many Chiefs not an enough Indians. sorry I grew up on John Wayne- its a prcess. one day at a time.
glad you made this video. i just finished Andor and am so sure that Luthen was a jedi. This show found so many ways to tell us that Luthen is or used to be a jedi. his walking stick looked like a prop light saber. the kyber crystal and his attachment to it scream 'decommissioned light saber'. his entire sacrifice speech described what it must be like for a jedi to disconnect from the force and embrace the ways of the sith in order to hide and stay in the fight. the most jarring part of the answer was the first...'calm.' ONLY a jedi would give this answer. also, the beams from his ship were suspiciously light saber-y. there have to be precious few in the galaxy that could or would build something like this into a starship...and be able to use it. your idea that Kleia may be an ex-padawan, seems good as well, she is kind of like an early or dark Ahsoka in her way of thinking. i'm going to rewatch. i'm betting they give us more clues.
And given how impossible it is to hit both tie fighters with the lasers while spinning, you would have to be extremely precise with perfect calculation, something I think only a Jedi can pull off.
@@Erik20766 anyone can benefit from being calm, but calm is the foundation of being a Jedi. i suppose he could have been a bomb maker or a vascular surgeon, but that wouldnt be very Star Warsy.
oh brother. somewhere Tony Gilroy is kicking himself for those bloody laser beams. look if he were a Jedi his beams would have been green, or blue or at the very most purple. BUT NEVER RED. Luthen is just a damn courageous man.
Definitely thought this since the appearance of the Sentinel mask. I’d like to think that the Jedi Sentinel mask & some of the artifacts observed in his shop are his and he failed to protect the temple, including the Younglings. Losing the temple and the order spiritually decimated him. He’s so beyond in the area of tactics & strategies, is treated with a sort of subtle reverence by Kleya & Vel; the man would know to keep both a low profile yet hide in plain sight, also mentions sharing his plans with “ghosts” and the khyber crystal he gave Andor may be his own saber’s (hilt seen in ep.11). This Wookieepedia entry as well has me convinced now, “Many served as freelance law enforcers, and were respected as Jedi that could be approached with any problem. When the Galactic Empire came to power at the end of the Clone Wars, the Sentinels suffered fewer casualties than the other Jedi in service to the Order due to their ability to remain anonymous, their avoidance of temples, and their proclivity for working in city environments.”
@@johnathangebert8844 Like I mentioned, if we want to take the BioWare . Obsidian KOTOR / TOR era games as analogy, my own wild theory is that he could be the Darth Imperious (A Sith Inquisitor / Lord Kallig origin story who made mostly lightside decisions despite starting off as a Force Sensitive slave of the old Sith Empire), who was living incognito and had no care of what is going on until the Empire began persecuting and targeting force sensitives. This will greatly explain why he knows about the Rakatans so well - He used their technology to heal himself and possibly alter his lifespan! Talking to ghosts? Well, he has already done that before in The Old Republic.... Having BOTH Jedi and Sith artifacts? Just a carry over from his old standard story conclusion in the Old Republic. - Sphere of Ancient Knowledge. Even in the Luthen Rael persona, I am reminded of that fantastic triple pun line a Sith Inquisitor can invoke: "It's a good thing that manipulating power is one of my specialities..."
I always thought that Luthen had way too many jedi artifacts. The biggest clue of Luthen being a secret jedi, on top of his "wooden cane" and monologue; was he has god damn lightsaber lances connected to his ship that he can use with ease.
I think it’s more likely that Luthen is like a male version of Padme, meaning he was in love with a Jedi, they hid their relationship, and she (or he, let’s not rule anything out) was killed during Order 66. This is what gives him the motivation to work towards the demise of the Empire.
@screencrush what Luthen means when he says," he is fighing for a sunrise he will never see" means all of his efforts are actions put into motion which will take some time to manifest, so much time Luthen will not be alive to witness the defeat of the Empire... it may take 50- 100 years or more..
Yeah as a person who isn't involved with Kenobi, or the Skywalkers he has no way to predict Luke, etc blowing up the Death Star twice and Vader throwing Palpatine off a balcony. Him thinking this could take a generation is completely feasible and realistic.
I think it's that AND the fact that he believes there is no place in the world he hopes to help create for a man like him. He's done too much evil in the service of good.
Solid theory but I would be kinda disappointed if they went that way. Luthen and the rebels being regular people with the determination to take down an Empire is what makes the show great.
Yeah, it would go against the whole spirit of the show. I don't think that they'll make a silly decision like that. They may as well add a cringe-worthy character like Grogu.
I mean one jedi leading and connecting a sea of regular able rebels is far more believable than every 4th character seeming to be force sensitive in the 7,8,9 sequels so I'll take it!
Except the rebels have always had force users backing them. Ashoka, Kanan, Ezra, Luke, Leia, and I'm sure there are others I'm forgetting. This is Star Wars and there are force users I don't understand how that takes away from regular people's determination? There are so few force users in the background of the rebels and sooo many more regular people, doesn't your point still hold? They would only be adding one more force user in comparison to the thousands of regular rebels. I think Luthen being a jedi would make perfect sense.
@@LJ_S1K It would be lazy and predictable to the point of parody. The empire always builds bigger planet destroying weapons, that doesn't make it any less boring to see it play out on screen on every film. Besides, I don't think the Luthen being a Jedi that willingly entices the empire to increase it's barbaric oppression of multiple star systems, just to get a reaction makes much sense at all.
@@Aurich88 Very much agree. I think that line refers to the people he truly knew all being dead, perhaps the Jedi given the convenient timing lining up with the genocide, and probably acceptance that he and his fellow leaders of the Rebellion are fated to the same. He wouldn't have been far off, as Mon Mothma was the last of the originals still standing by the time the Empire finally collapses.
@@Raddon Many Jedi fell from the path set down by the old Order following Order 66, either drawing upon the Dark Side for survival or simply because their spirit was broken. Even Jedi with good intentions can fall to the Dark Side trying to achieve them. I think Luthen has been standing in the grey between, teetering on giving up, but that Maarva Andor's speech brought him back to having hope again.
@@Raddon think again Obi-Wan did in his own series because he didn't want to be exposed as a jedi i remember he stood by several times as people were robbed or assaulted
Thank you ScreenCrush for covering this show and analyzing its dialogue the way it DESERVES to be analyzed! Andor is a lesson in the art of film in all its aspects and is taking Star Wars to a whole new level.
I thought this was fluff until I relistened to his monologue, and I TOTALLY forgot about the crystal - why else would it mean so much to him? This theory has legs for sure.
The other thing that struck me was the stable red lasers on his ship. Sort of like a large duel light saber (Darth Maul type) - if the Jedi had fallen from grace and any Kyber Crystals he used on the ship would then be red. However he keeps his blue Kyber crystal for his original light saber as a reminder of who he used to be.
@@raudan3105 ask yourself what is Andor about? it is what ordinary people can do if they join together. The jedi couldn't even spot Palpatine under their bloody nose. keep Andor a Jedi Free zone.
This theory makes complete sense. Another detail that I just noticed was in the music from the show; the piece on the soundtrack entitled “Luthen of Coruscant” subtly hints at him being a former Jedi. If you listen for it carefully, I can hear fragments of the Force theme/binary sunset theme, except recontextualized to sound melancholy and somber, rather than the nostalgic vibe of the iconic scene with Luke in episode IV. I’m so hyped for the finale!
The theory absolutely has legs. If after ep 12 we find out Luthen is indeed Force sensitive, then we'll all be like, "yah, signs were there all along."
His clothing is very much like Luke's Return of the Jedi Jedi robes, even down to the same side opening jacket. If we ever see Luthen's lightsaber, I hope it will have a green crystal and be the source of Luke's ROTJ green lightsaber. The blue could have been his master's crystal. If the Dooku padawan theory holds true, the blue could be Dooku's and the green could be Qui-Gon Jinn's.
nope i'll be like fk off. cant we just have ONE STAR WARS SHOW without Jedi. you were loving Andor before this stupid theory was ever suggested. Plz dont fall for this nonsense. The point of Andor is that rebellions aren't built on Superheroes. just ordinary people willing to fighjt for each other. when the Rebels attacked the Death Star they did so believeing they had no chance, no heroes. even Luke himself was just willing to do what he could in the face of 99.99% certain death. womp rats in his T-16 or no. He only succeeded because Porkins and all the other ordinary heroes sacrificed themselves. And it still took Han & his Wookie to save him at the last minute. oh Chobb im taking this way too serious.. I was going to accomplish so much this evening til I watched this.
Yes! Finally someone else is saying it! I've been running with this theory since he handed Andor his Kyber crystal saying, "It'll always be worth more to me." That one line had me thinking, He's a former Jedi in hiding.
I like this theory. It makes sense with your breakdown of his character. Also, his escape from the Empire ship and tractor beam is the most badass I've seen in all of Star Wars.
This is actually one of the best theories I've heard. His monologue does line up perfectly, and the two holocrons generating a cloud of Force Whitenoise is quite likely the best reason to explain why they were made to be so much bigger than ever preciously depicted in any other SW properties. The producers wanted them to be noticed by more than just the people like you who always look for EEs in the background. The production crew made them impossible to ignore. Maybe the other background props around them from other Lucas film properties (like the stones from Temple of Doom, etc) are meant to be a hint to EE hunters that this origin story is reaching way, way back into the old original canon sources for this one. Clues for where to look, hidden in places where they know you will look. I really like this idea, and I'd love to see it play out this way. Even before this theory came up, he's become one of my favorite characters in the franchise and his ship design is also one of my favorites, right up there with the Falcon, and the Razor Crest. And, though a little off-topic, I'm just gonna throw this out there... Skarsgard would make a great Rick Sanchez in a Rich and Morty Live Action movie. Just sayin'.🤯
The art gallery/ museum link is a massive coincidence if it's just a coincidence but I wouldn't be surprised if he's a new character partly inspired by that story.
I have thought this all along as well. And then when I saw the lightsaber ship barrel roll and take out those tie fighters...I knew it to be true. This is the best Star Wars we have gotten in so long and I hated to see it end. I hope and pray to the Jedi Temple that they adjust all the other series to match this intensity. Tired of the kid friendly shows...give the true Star Wars fans that pay the bills what they want. So happy to see Disney spreading its wings and becoming more.
Andor was 10/10 Star Wars. I'm a Star Trek guy so while I've found Star Wars to be sometimes entertaining, I never considered myself a SW fan. But Rogue One was my first SW film that I watched multiple times because it was excellent. Andor is so damn good and can't wait for season 2. I think Mandalorian is entertaining, not on Andor level but when it's not being over the top silly it's solid. Boba Fett was mostly cringe. Star Wars.....when it's good it's really good. When it's bad it's embarrassing lol
@@vrASMR180 Agreed. I am a big Trekkie as well because I like the story of earth and science eventually getting us to the point to of peace and space exploration. Star Wars is fun, but it is pure comedy the way they try to rationalize things sometimes and the fanbase is the cringe part of Star Wars...they will die on their lightsabers to argue the most minor details. hahaha
@@dred9174 Rebels was not a abomination. Was it kid friendly? At first, of course it was. But through the 4 seasons hit some darker themes and had some true character growth that isn't seen in kids shows.
How did that seal the deal for you? There's literally zero indication that his ships lasers are in any way related to a lightsaber. You're literally just making that up.
Such a great theory and so plausible! And it would be pretty satisfying if it turns out to be the case, but I wonder if Tony Gilroy and the other writers have something a little less straightforward up their sleeve than Luthen being a Jedi that wasn't purged . In the CNET interview about episode 10 one way out, Beau Willmon references a few times doing something that hasn't been seen before, in this case a different prison, or a different kind of torture (Bix), and also he mentions moral conundrums, characters not being black or white, nobody is just good or bad. Willmon also mentions that in Luthen's conversation to Lonnie on the skybridge, Luthen says that the last thing he sacrificed was "Love" ( Calm. Kindness, kinship. {pause} Love ). So Luthen lost someone huge, someone more that he loved ( in likely addition to the Jedis purge of Order 66) . Couple other things of note, the scene at the end of episode 12 in Luthen's ship, Cassian and Luthen is strongly reminiscent of Palpatine/Anakin in ROTS after Mace gets fried. And those red lasers from Luthen's ship , and him flying it in a spinning motion reminiscent of Inquisitor light sabers. Looking forward to season 2 !!!
The first time I watched that speach I immediately thought he might be some fallen jedi. I'm not sure of him cutting himself off from the force though. If he is using the dark side, he can cloak himself easily enough. Yoda said that this is a quality of the dark side. The ability to cloud things, that is. I see no reason a dark side user couldn't also cloud other dark side users. Just my two cents on it.
Can we also talk about the fact Lutheran getting into character on his ship the way he presents himself both hair and dress wise is literally palpatine from episode 1-3
I remember my first thought when hearing Luthen’s monologue was that it had a lot of Jedi oath/Sith oath vibes. Clearly the words were different but there was something about the way he delivered it.
Damn! I knew there was something more to Luthen’s monologue, but you have to really dig deep for that. Awesome!!! I love the series and can’t wait for Season 2.
I knew it the moment he retracted his cane in the first scene he's in. I know a lightsaber when I see one. How easy was it for Obi-Wan and/or Anakin to play roles when infiltrating different outfits and organizations? Cad Banes crew, The Zygerian slavery market, Ahsoka routinely pretended to be someone else to keep herself and her companions safe during the clone wars.... Deception and lies, subversion and espionage are some of a Jedi's most powerful weapons. This is a no brainer for me.
No one has mentioned the expert piloting skills and how he basically 'mind tricked' the guard into giving his cane back, just without the hand wave. He even manipulated Two Tubes to walk up to him so he could steal his weapon.
Its pretty normal for people with money (Luthen's clientele) to have different rules to everyone else- so a blind eye is turned to buying jedi artifacts for the rich but not the poor. Really interesting theory which is plausible and adds to Luthen's story.
That's why I love this channel. I always miss sometimes obvious clues and the crew at ScreenCrush always put things together in such a great and well thought-out way.
If he's a Jedi, then there has to be a good narrative reason for it, that underscores Cassian's story. Luthen may have given up everything....Casa had so little to lose.
Luthen being a Jedi shows how weak the Jedi has become and how much time has changed. Matter of fact it shows an even greater importance to the rebels because of how little the Jedis can do to change the course now and it's all up to the rebels to decide the fate. All Luthen can do if he really was a Jedi, is play the messenger and hope he can get rebels to work together.
This theory has legs. I think your ideas are quite solid. and I love it! Adds a complexity I'll enjoy thinking about on my second watch through! Thank you!
I don't think that's a hint. Other ships in star wars use those kind of beam weapons. Look at the gunner balls on the LAATs used by the clones. They fire similar beams in a green colour.
@@harrydamien6346 Those beams don't stop after a short distance, like a lightsaber does. There are no other ships in Star Wars like Luthens ship that I am aware of.
It surely would explain his ability to escape the Empire the way he did...and those red beams of saber-like weapons would echo his connection to the Darkside even if they weren't actually powered by kyber crystals...the poetic rhythm in the writing is just beautifully done if this is true...
I get the feeling he was a close friend to a jedi or even had a lover who was part of the jedi order. When he saw his friend get slaughtered he had to fight for their injustice. The Kyber crystal could be his Jedi friends crystal
yeah. the crystal can actually be carried separately to both keep the cane impossible to use as a lightsaber (keeping his identity secret) and as a mean to put it back in and use the lightsaber if needed. I think this theory really holds itself
@@thegoodrevbadandyarr4272 Very true, and I don't think the mere presence of a former Force user in a minor role would kill the whole regular-human-being vibe. It's the idea of supernatural power solving problems that regular folk are learning to solve on their own, with ordinary courage and peppered with personal flaws, that would break the structure of the story.
Ok so I 'm glad that someone else noticed the Holocrons sitting on his shelf, but nobody wants to talk about the shelf next to it with what appears to be Sankara stones from Temple of Doom? Luthen better watch his back in case Mola Ram comes looking for them.
Red Herrings - I think he was someone who knew Padme, was close to Padme. Explains the Naboo artifacts, why he would know about Jedi, would have found out about Sith, not just that the Jedi "betrayed" the Republic and how he had her headdress.
That particular headdress was part of her disguise as a refugee, so it is not even in the Nubian style. Last place we see it is in Theed Palace on her head. Maybe he was part of the Palace Security who knew her from her reign as well as the later queens?
@@dred9174 he probably paid someone on Ferrix to ask around. thats why he has bankrupted Mon Mothma. Pure dear had to sell her kid and he had 100 million credits she bankrolled. and all she was short is 400,000. she should have been like "gives it back or im calling Palpatine right now"!
I don’t think we should take Yoda’s quote so seriously - there was no way Yoda could know that there are no other jedi left, even despite his ability to sense them through the force. I took it as more of an inspirational encouragement for Luke.
Not to mention, he would've been very wrong. Both Legends and the "new canon" have told us that many Jedi survived the Purge as well as the Galactic Civil War, even some who were participants in the latter. They went on to help Luke found and teach students at his academy. Luke was of special note and overshadowed others in the story only because he had the connection to Vader, and perhaps because Yoda and Obi-Wan had some extent of knowledge (through viewing the future or communing with Force Ghosts like Qui-Gon) that the twins would be instrumental in ending the Sith. He and his sister both had vast inherent power and potential, but in terms of skill, he was pretty much an average Jedi Knight by Old Republic standards as of RotJ.
Except Luthen wasn't a Jedi, he gave up the order in order to fight the Empire. Therefore Yoda was still right. Most likely Luthen's path is a downward spiral, as indicated by his conversations with Kyela. Keyla's future story will probably be very interesting in season 2.
@@julesmo323 well we don’t know for certain that Luthen is even force sensitive, plus I’m more referring to other Jedi who are more obscure or could be potentially alive still, or even the [high] possibility that there are other ‘background’ jedi who are still alive at the time of Yoda’s quote
He really hates Sidious, so...I could see Crimson Dawn helping fund random rebel cells. Maul's contribution to picking apart the Empire, piece by piece without getting his hands dirty and drawing Palpatine's eye.
@@TheDarkPorkins From the beginning, Maul was always split between the idea of helping folks against Sidious. He seemed OK with it, as long he got his cut. 😏
Nothing makes commercials as enjoyable as ScreenCrush. Kudos, Doug. At 7:18 do I see the Shakari Stones(sp?) from Temple of Doom? Luth also wears his hood in the final episode too…
Love the deep dive - all the artifacts are fantastic. When he gave ANDOR the kyber Crystal I was like - JEDI!!- he’s not using force very similar to how they showed obi wan also not using force - well done
After the monologue I was sure he sacrificed a life as a jedi to fight the empire however he had to. The word choices were very specific. Love this theory. It may not be 100% but its gotta be close. Brilliant acting by Skarsgard.
Additional point: the way Cassian recognizes "jedi" potential in Chirrut Imwe in SWRO suggests he's seen one at work in his past. I don't think that has happened thus far where we are in his story.
I didn't peg this particular guy, but I definitely thought he was a former jedi. The big give away was when he first showed his cane (shown at 12:28 ). He even carries it like a light saber and it looks like one.
I agree. Even the way he dresses, his wide-ranging assets, his contacts, and finally that space battle when he deployed not one but two light saber-like weapons. I totally agree. And he talks trash like one: his 'sacrifice speech' is up there with the "Tears in Rain" speech from Blade Runner. Small wonder Andor wants to join him.
I feel the same way, I thought he was a sith after watching the last few episodes. The red ship sabres, the fact he spreads fear, and he's always in dark robes.
I feel you. But the video makes the point that Luthen's line about being forced to use the tools of his oppressor would explain him behaving like a "Sith".
cool theory! for me the escape from the tractor beam and the lightsaber-esque weapons on his ship were the biggest signals, that whole sequence with his confidence and the way he flew was way more than simply 'rebel fighter'
@@GRAFFDEMON Getting those lasers to hit both tie fighters while spinning like that requires extreme precision and timing. You have to account for the trajectory of both enemy ships, your own ship, your spin rate, and time it perfectly so that it takes out both ships as you’re flying toward them. It’s akin to deflecting a blaster shot back at the enemy with the lightsaber.
@@captainlockes2344 We saw his ship is equipped with after market advanced equipment, one of which includes that computer interface we see in alot of shots of his cockpit. Wouldn't necessarily put it past the capabilities of this ship to have an advanced targeting computer or some such. Doesn't really mean he's a jedi. Also imo would cheapen the story if he was a jedi. Andor is about regular folk performing extraordinary feats by way of even choosing to stand up to the empire. Not everything has to revolve around them and I'm glad Andor doesn't.
Ryan, I like the idea presented here, and I think there's another deep dive possibility of Luthen being a former Jedi. In the book "Master and Apprentice," We get introduced to Dooku's first apprentice Rail Averross (I've probably spelled his name wrong since I listened to the book not read it), but how Rail's character is introduced and his semi non Jedi conforming ways, his association and history with both Dooku and Qui-Gon as well as other aspects suggested in the book he maybe the ever elusive Luthen.
To add to the theory, the Kyber crystal "celebrates the uprising against the Rakatan invaders." The Rakatan were dark side force users who developed hyperspace travel and the technology only worked for force users. Maybe he discovered one of their ships (he is a artifact dealer) that is what is powering Luthen’s ship. Cassian questions what is powering the ship “What's powering this? I've been in a Fondor Haulcraft. I've flown them. Never seen one do that.”
The thing you have to remember about Jedi is that they play fast and loose with the truth. What Yoda said about Luke being the last could well have been a load of old baloney with the full intent of putting pressure on Luke to do things he didn't want to do. Again.
This show is a masterpiece in the planning and nurturing of a rebellion. Certainly, Luthen appears to be balanced on a knife's edge -- the qualities of immense power and restraint vs the surprising passions that could tip him over to the dark. The space battle in the season finale was the clincher for me. I really hope its true. He is a Jedi nearing the end of a long masquerade.
I cringed when that old troguta said "Ahsoka is Jedi", Jesus fucking christ... Jedi is a rank not force sensitive people. That is why people are so confused
Love the theory but I think the Jedi he used to be is Rael Aveross from the master and apprentice book. Former student of Doukku who also was off corasaunt during most the clone wars and already known to be a black sheep amongst the jedi
I really like this theory. I would be interesting to see it play out if true. He won me over when he's Sacrificed Everything monologue. (And won me over as an actor. I only really know him from this and his role in the MCU.)
Screen Crush is the best recap/ Easter Egg channel on RUclips! I feel like Luthen uses the Mind Trick on Saw and Tubes in E11 in the cave. He senses Andor is on the ship in the last episode, the computer didn't even have to warn him.
Stellan is EPIC in this role. Wow! I adore this Jedi theory. Makes a lot of sense and makes him so much more interesting. Episode 11 was fantastic. 👍🏾🖤
Now lets figure out how the Sankara Stones on the shelf next to the holicrons get into Molaram's hands and how he uses them to rip the hearts from the living in a galaxy far far away a long time after this (India 1930s).
In Bruce Lee's Enter The Dragon (1973), there's this wonderful scene where Lee is sparring with a martial arts student. Naturally, Lee whoops his butt, but then gives him a lesson on focus: "It is like a finger pointing away at the moon" *The student then immediately looks at Lee's finger in stead of where it's pointing* "Do not focus on the finger, or else you will miss all of that heavenly glory." We the audience of Andor are focusing on the finger with stuff like this. Luthen both as a dealer in antiquities and as the leader of a rebel faction is both figuratively and literally ~selling nostalgia~. Whether it be a Gungan shield or a dream of a time before the empire, he is a broker of memories. The audience of the show isn't meant to so literally become a customer of his. Luthen being revealed as a secret Jedi would IMO cheapen his character, the show, and Star Wars as a whole. It's important that, like Andor, Luthen is just some guy who wakes up each morning with the will to fight.
I think he’s a Jedi Templar because they would go on missions and blend in with their surroundings. Taking up job other than being a Jedi and clearly that’s is what he has done.
That rod could speciffically be his lightsaber. In one of the Clone War episodes, the younglings are building their first lightsabers and the materials for making one using wood are presented to a youngling at their request with them being informed they are not the first to ask.
A very strong theory. I would also add that it would explain how he can come and go in almost plain sight without attracting attention. I think there may be some residual Force in him that acts on his unconscious will. When he doesn't want to be noticed he becomes unremarkable, non-descript. There is a real medical condition where a person may look at someone's face and see what everyone else sees, but they cannot recognise them no matter how well they know them. They are just "man with brown hair" or "tall woman with blue eyes". This is because the part of the brain that analyses the shape patterns that make up a face and matches them to a known person no longer functions. Could a Jedi cause a fog in this part of some people's minds in order to go unnoticed even by those that should find them distinctive? It would be like an electric eel that still carries an imperceptible field of energy around it even when it's not consciously emitting a charge. It can still "feel" the water around it and affect other creatures. Or maybe like an overhead power line can cause illusions and cancers when it's near to occupied properties. After all, Obi-Wan Kenobi all but lost his powers when in hiding. But, the Force was still gently guiding his destiny. And Qui Gonn was waiting for him to embrace it - tied to him by a faint string of Force. Anyway, that's my flight of fancy. Anything's possible in a fictional universe where the power of the mind can affect the very fabric of reality.
If Luthen is a Jedi, I like how the show is very subtle about it. It fits perfectly with how a Jedi would behave in the real world. You don’t go around and show everyone that you’re a Jedi and get targeted. It’s much more effective if you’re able to manipulate people and get them to do things without them knowing.
Star Wars Theory: Andor (and the rebellion) is basically the story of Chushingura and the 47 Ronin. Luthen seems to represent the actual leader of the 47 Ronin, Yoshio Oishi. Andor appears to be the fictional character Genba Tawaraboshi (or even Kai from the Hollywood adaptation). This would make some sense as Star Wars has appeared to return to its Japanese movie and culture influence (*see Mandalorian and "Lone Wolf and Cub"). As such, I'm predicting that Luthen is a former Jedi or Jedi in disguise. Maybe we'll find out tonight in the season finale.
Your hashing this out seems pretty solid. I'm totally liking where it's going. The first season was a pleasant surprise, so I can only hope for such a storyline (hidden Jedi). Love it! 🙏
Even if he technically isn’t a Jedi, It’ll be badass if at some point, he just pulls out a lightsaber and starts wrecking people, having studied the Jedi fighting techniques. Basically the direction they went with Finn, but actually explore it.
Finn funnily enough became a jedi after the 9th movie according to the canon material since he was force sensitive. The direction you're thinking is that one special forces stormtrooper that uses a lightsaber but doesn't have the force.
Yoda was hiding on Dagobah which is a world powerful in the dark side. That's how he remained undetected by Palpatine. So Yoda may not have been able to sense every remaining Jedi despite how powerful he was.
If this were any other recent Star Wars series I would say, "You are putting too much thought into it. There is no way the writers have thought it through that well." This series tho... I think you may have something here. I can see in season 2, this being a huge twist (That you just ruined LOL).
Disney could probably retcon this but I always thought it was interesting that Cassian asked Chirrut Imwe in Rogue One if he was a jedi as if he had seen an actual jedi before and thus being able to recognize a force user. Especially interesing considering that likes such as Han Solo whom has been all over the galaxy did not even believe the jedi were real. Luthen could possibly be Cassians introduction into the world of force sensitives.
Could Luthen simply be the artifacts dealer who had a love affair with a Jedi who was purged? Hence the kyber crystal meaning so much to him, and perhaps how he acquired Jedi/Sith artifacts? Once his love interest would have been killed, he wanted revenge. (lining up with the 15 years ago remark.)
Several people have mentioned Luthen might have been motived to fight the Empire because he had a Jedi lover who was killed during Order 66, but what about a child? The Younglings killed by Anakin had parents. I'm thinking a guy who gives up EVERYTHING (Luthen's caps, not mine) must be doing it for his kid. ... Or maybe he's a Jedi.
@@streetsafenm287 Hey, hadn't thought of that. That's a pretty good explanation for the absolute fury constantly seething beneath his skin whenever he isn't playing his antique shop character.
I LOVE this theory about Luthen. I always had a feeling he was a Jedi but had to hide his powers. You sold me! Back to listen to his "I've lost everything" speech again.
When he did his speech at the end, I was like yeah, this guy use to be a Jedi. Everything he talked about, all the stuff he had to sacrifice. Everything that a Jedi has to sacrifice.
Honestly I'd like to see a series just on Luke studying Jedi culture and discovering artifacts. Maybe we'll get some of those earlier flashbacks in Ahsoka
Maybe the fact that Cassian didn't even raise an eyebrow at Chirrut's abilities in Rogue One, is also another telltale sign since he's been in the presence of another force wielder before.
My thought exactly. I watched the frist meeting scene again and he wasn't surprised by Cassian's words, he just grinned and replied that their arrogance is memarkable. So, he's just happy that others found empire weak spot and exploit it (a recurring theme of the rebels). the tools of his ennemies : He does exactly what Palpatine did : hiding in plain sight in Coruscant, of course but also exploiting arrogance. Remember that Yoda and Luke made that same reproach to the Jedi, Luke states that their hubris was their downfall. It was and it is clearly shown in the prequels. and that same flaw will bring the Empire down : Hubris makes Tarkin stay on the Death Star when it is attacked, Hubris makes Vader just deactivate the hyperdrive on the Falcon rather than just smash it, Hubris makes the Emperor let the rebels come to execute their plan.
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They debunked it it's a knife not a saber
This is really good...but I'm not certain he is a "good" Jedi, but perhaps a sith or "grey" since Disney has decided to make the force much less white and black (light and dark)
Yo! At 7:18 are those the Indiana Jones stones from Temple of Doom?
Or not...Looks like-em tho.
Very interesting theory. I'll look for clues tomorrow or maybe they will do a big reveal.
Kanan Jarrus, aka Caleb Dume, died while trying to rescue Hera on Lothal.
Sounds solid. That speech that Luthen gave about sacrifice was fire. He killed it.
Such good writing and acting. Every sentence was a goosebump factory.
Absolutely favorite scene of the series!
*excellent *passionate *extraordinary *enthralling *incredible, etc. please stop using **_*fire_*
You’re capable of more than that. I don’t remember Luther saying the rebellion is lit. 🎅🏿
He absolutely did!
@@DaddyDumptruckDeluxe but he's the one who .... lit .... it...
This theory had blow my mind! Even Kassian says to Luthen on the first episode, when they meet: the Empire is so arrogant about their power, that they don't notice the enemy living under their noses! That's why Luthen lives in Coruscant, the Empire will never imagine to hunt a Jedi on their own home
This also explains why they hid Luke on Anakin's home planet.
Luke didn't really have a choice but yeah I guess
@@shots6140 I never said he did.
Also why Yoda hid on Dagobah to hide his force presence due to negative force energy.
@@scorpiusbalthazar4327 its funny because your comment literally implies that he didnt have a choice...
when he asked for that thing back, I instantly thought it was a light saber, especially the way he cautiously wanted the guy to give it back as to not hurt himself or that it had a great meaning to the owner.
A cane lightsaber appeared in the Clone Wars 3D series.
I didn't even realize it was a cane, I thought it was a lightsaber from the start.
The toy of him shows that it’s not a saber
Let's all just agree that we, fans of the Andor series would be very satisfied with the cane being a lightsaber! 😁Even if there was no plausible explanation it would still blow my mind😮
More people should give Andor love! It's a really great show and takes a hard look at the institutionalized rise of evil. It makes the rebellion so much more important.
I'm not a star wars fan and have been indifferent to the original trilogy but watching Andor makes me want to revisit the movies
My friends and family didn't give it chance past the first two episodes because of how slow they are. I assured them that all other episodes are fire, but they didn't want to give it a chance again. It's so frustrating because the show is, in my opinion, better than Mandalorian.
Yes!
I rewatched it lately with my son, and was surprised how much I enjoyed it the second time!
Sooooo much better that Mandalorian, Obiw Wan and Book of Boba Fet!
@@EJD339 Yes, rewatch Rogue One especially.
@@BoatMurderedDF Way better!
And yes I think the episodes got better through the series, especially the last few, after the first few slow ones.
A main theme of the show is “hiding in plain sight”. This is why Andor was recruited by Luthen, and then Andor explains how it’s easy to hide in plain sight because the empire is too confident in themselves and would never expect it. This theory is very solid and would be a great twist
I also like that it’s taking a page straight from the emperor himself…who hid in plain sight for the entirety of his assent to power.
A Jedi wouldn’t live on Coruscant. Impossible
@@MeanLaQueefa you’re right. That’s why Luthen is no longer one (if we’re buying into the theory..or at least I am). I think he cut himself off from the Force so that he could remain on Coruscant. Right under the emperor’s nose.
@@jameskelly6039 As Luthen said, he's condemned to use the tools of his enemies to defeat them.
nope its shitty, regressive, and would ruin a good series- all about ORDINARY people standing up.
Klea being an ex Padawan could be absolutely lethal. She’s so ruthless and clever.
Yeah, I love that little touch. I actually hope this theory turns out to be true.
I suspect Kleya is Cassian’s long lost sister.
@@KaiOcean That might be a bit of a stretch.
No...just...no
@@KaiOcean spot on!
Stellan Skarsgård is really a top-tier actor, I liked his role in the Chernobyl series especially!
Nice theory as well.
Chernobyl was so dang good!!
this guy rocks every role he plays
@@Mihayan1 agreed, if the script is good. he was utterly wasted in the MCU
Hell….the whole “Skarsgard” family is excellent actors! And they’ve been in a lot of movies!!
and Goodwill Hunting, great movie.
"Put it down or give it back." He's given it back. Subtle Jedi mind trick right there.
Luthens battle scene in space and the way he handled it...He's seen a lot of battle. Luthen being a hidden Jedi makes the most sense.
I was thinking the same thing
NNOOOOOOOOOOOO. makes no sense. he is just so determined he rises to the importance of the Jedi. Too Many Chiefs not an enough Indians. sorry I grew up on John Wayne- its a prcess. one day at a time.
@@Devilburk reverse course.
Luthen is heroic like Han was heroic -by sacrificing EVERYTHING!!!! despite his lack of super-duper powers.
glad you made this video. i just finished Andor and am so sure that Luthen was a jedi. This show found so many ways to tell us that Luthen is or used to be a jedi. his walking stick looked like a prop light saber. the kyber crystal and his attachment to it scream 'decommissioned light saber'. his entire sacrifice speech described what it must be like for a jedi to disconnect from the force and embrace the ways of the sith in order to hide and stay in the fight. the most jarring part of the answer was the first...'calm.' ONLY a jedi would give this answer. also, the beams from his ship were suspiciously light saber-y. there have to be precious few in the galaxy that could or would build something like this into a starship...and be able to use it. your idea that Kleia may be an ex-padawan, seems good as well, she is kind of like an early or dark Ahsoka in her way of thinking. i'm going to rewatch. i'm betting they give us more clues.
And given how impossible it is to hit both tie fighters with the lasers while spinning, you would have to be extremely precise with perfect calculation, something I think only a Jedi can pull off.
@@captainlockes2344 i just figured the ship did the work since it seems to be autonomous
Only Jedi can be calm? This is just wishful thinking
@@Erik20766 anyone can benefit from being calm, but calm is the foundation of being a Jedi. i suppose he could have been a bomb maker or a vascular surgeon, but that wouldnt be very Star Warsy.
oh brother. somewhere Tony Gilroy is kicking himself for those bloody laser beams. look if he were a Jedi his beams would have been green, or blue or at the very most purple. BUT NEVER RED. Luthen is just a damn courageous man.
Definitely thought this since the appearance of the Sentinel mask. I’d like to think that the Jedi Sentinel mask & some of the artifacts observed in his shop are his and he failed to protect the temple, including the Younglings. Losing the temple and the order spiritually decimated him. He’s so beyond in the area of tactics & strategies, is treated with a sort of subtle reverence by Kleya & Vel; the man would know to keep both a low profile yet hide in plain sight, also mentions sharing his plans with “ghosts” and the khyber crystal he gave Andor may be his own saber’s (hilt seen in ep.11). This Wookieepedia entry as well has me convinced now, “Many served as freelance law enforcers, and were respected as Jedi that could be approached with any problem. When the Galactic Empire came to power at the end of the Clone Wars, the Sentinels suffered fewer casualties than the other Jedi in service to the Order due to their ability to remain anonymous, their avoidance of temples, and their proclivity for working in city environments.”
I've called Sentinel or Shadow from the first time I saw his "cane".
Definitely an excellent theory and would make sense that no one recognizes him because he would always be wearing that sentinel mask
Oooh. That description describes Luthen to a tee.
And the seemingly “light saber” beams from his ship. Red too boot.
@@johnathangebert8844 Like I mentioned, if we want to take the BioWare . Obsidian KOTOR / TOR era games as analogy, my own wild theory is that he could be the Darth Imperious (A Sith Inquisitor / Lord Kallig origin story who made mostly lightside decisions despite starting off as a Force Sensitive slave of the old Sith Empire), who was living incognito and had no care of what is going on until the Empire began persecuting and targeting force sensitives.
This will greatly explain why he knows about the Rakatans so well - He used their technology to heal himself and possibly alter his lifespan!
Talking to ghosts? Well, he has already done that before in The Old Republic....
Having BOTH Jedi and Sith artifacts? Just a carry over from his old standard story conclusion in the Old Republic. - Sphere of Ancient Knowledge.
Even in the Luthen Rael persona, I am reminded of that fantastic triple pun line a Sith Inquisitor can invoke: "It's a good thing that manipulating power is one of my specialities..."
I always thought that Luthen had way too many jedi artifacts.
The biggest clue of Luthen being a secret jedi, on top of his "wooden cane" and monologue;
was he has god damn lightsaber lances connected to his ship that he can use with ease.
Exactly - and we flies like a Jedi
Imagine having a lightsaber looking cane and a blue kybercrystal seperated
Giving it away and asking for it back.
He’s undercover.
Yeah, agreed. To get a ship with dual lightsabers to spin just right and hit those TIE's perfectly....was VERY Jedi-like.
@@alexgavieres8293 Very Sith like you mean. Those were red lightsabers coming from his ship lol
@@LJ_S1K He's secretly an undercover agent for palpatine. The whole rebel thing is a lie. He's playing the long game like Thrawn.
I think it’s more likely that Luthen is like a male version of Padme, meaning he was in love with a Jedi, they hid their relationship, and she (or he, let’s not rule anything out) was killed during Order 66. This is what gives him the motivation to work towards the demise of the Empire.
Thissssss is a great theory.
i like this just as much
I think he is the father of padme... ;) And that's why Mon Mothma now him well as he is the father of her friend
@@24hayate that’s an interesting take
Much more simple and elegant.
I think it's better with him not being a Jedi.
The movie close to andor also had a force relevant character who wasn't a jedi
Yes part of the attraction of this series is that it had little to do with all that Jedi/Skywalker aspect.
Made it fresh.
It’s like poetry, it rhymes
@@pedrogutierrrez1953 Lol
Ya someone stated it well. Those who can’t rely on the force have to use more morally grey strategies to take down the empire
@@pedrogutierrrez1953 pottery
@screencrush what Luthen means when he says," he is fighing for a sunrise he will never see" means all of his efforts are actions put into motion which will take some time to manifest, so much time Luthen will not be alive to witness the defeat of the Empire... it may take 50- 100 years or more..
Yeah as a person who isn't involved with Kenobi, or the Skywalkers he has no way to predict Luke, etc blowing up the Death Star twice and Vader throwing Palpatine off a balcony. Him thinking this could take a generation is completely feasible and realistic.
Yes that's how I interpretted it.
I think it's that AND the fact that he believes there is no place in the world he hopes to help create for a man like him. He's done too much evil in the service of good.
Agree, this series is so well written that it would be hard to believe that Luthen’s monologue doesn’t have the meaning that is implied in this video.
Solid theory but I would be kinda disappointed if they went that way. Luthen and the rebels being regular people with the determination to take down an Empire is what makes the show great.
🤩 exactly
Yeah, it would go against the whole spirit of the show. I don't think that they'll make a silly decision like that. They may as well add a cringe-worthy character like Grogu.
I mean one jedi leading and connecting a sea of regular able rebels is far more believable than every 4th character seeming to be force sensitive in the 7,8,9 sequels so I'll take it!
Except the rebels have always had force users backing them. Ashoka, Kanan, Ezra, Luke, Leia, and I'm sure there are others I'm forgetting. This is Star Wars and there are force users I don't understand how that takes away from regular people's determination? There are so few force users in the background of the rebels and sooo many more regular people, doesn't your point still hold? They would only be adding one more force user in comparison to the thousands of regular rebels. I think Luthen being a jedi would make perfect sense.
@@LJ_S1K It would be lazy and predictable to the point of parody.
The empire always builds bigger planet destroying weapons, that doesn't make it any less boring to see it play out on screen on every film.
Besides, I don't think the Luthen being a Jedi that willingly entices the empire to increase it's barbaric oppression of multiple star systems, just to get a reaction makes much sense at all.
I love this theory. Especially the part about the holochrons concealing his presence and him talking with ghosts.
I think the ghost line goes way harder if you take it to mean that he and everyone he associates with is as good as dead.
@@Aurich88 Very much agree. I think that line refers to the people he truly knew all being dead, perhaps the Jedi given the convenient timing lining up with the genocide, and probably acceptance that he and his fellow leaders of the Rebellion are fated to the same. He wouldn't have been far off, as Mon Mothma was the last of the originals still standing by the time the Empire finally collapses.
There is one HUGE flaw in this theory. No Jedi would sacrifice human lifes to protect their secrets, never, EVER.
@@Raddon Many Jedi fell from the path set down by the old Order following Order 66, either drawing upon the Dark Side for survival or simply because their spirit was broken. Even Jedi with good intentions can fall to the Dark Side trying to achieve them. I think Luthen has been standing in the grey between, teetering on giving up, but that Maarva Andor's speech brought him back to having hope again.
@@Raddon think again Obi-Wan did in his own series because he didn't want to be exposed as a jedi i remember he stood by several times as people were robbed or assaulted
Thank you ScreenCrush for covering this show and analyzing its dialogue the way it DESERVES to be analyzed! Andor is a lesson in the art of film in all its aspects and is taking Star Wars to a whole new level.
too right.
I thought this was fluff until I relistened to his monologue, and I TOTALLY forgot about the crystal - why else would it mean so much to him? This theory has legs for sure.
Jyn Urso’s Kyber Crystal meant a lot to her and she’s no Jedi. I don’t think that should automatically make him a Jedi
@@SpaceAcex Totally fair, but I think the crystal plus the hilt, plus a lot of the hints in the monologue, form a pretty strong argument
The other thing that struck me was the stable red lasers on his ship. Sort of like a large duel light saber (Darth Maul type) - if the Jedi had fallen from grace and any Kyber Crystals he used on the ship would then be red. However he keeps his blue Kyber crystal for his original light saber as a reminder of who he used to be.
@@SpaceAcex thank you.
@@raudan3105 ask yourself what is Andor about? it is what ordinary people can do if they join together. The jedi couldn't even spot Palpatine under their bloody nose. keep Andor a Jedi Free zone.
This theory makes complete sense. Another detail that I just noticed was in the music from the show; the piece on the soundtrack entitled “Luthen of Coruscant” subtly hints at him being a former Jedi. If you listen for it carefully, I can hear fragments of the Force theme/binary sunset theme, except recontextualized to sound melancholy and somber, rather than the nostalgic vibe of the iconic scene with Luke in episode IV. I’m so hyped for the finale!
The theory absolutely has legs. If after ep 12 we find out Luthen is indeed Force sensitive, then we'll all be like, "yah, signs were there all along."
His clothing is very much like Luke's Return of the Jedi Jedi robes, even down to the same side opening jacket. If we ever see Luthen's lightsaber, I hope it will have a green crystal and be the source of Luke's ROTJ green lightsaber. The blue could have been his master's crystal. If the Dooku padawan theory holds true, the blue could be Dooku's and the green could be Qui-Gon Jinn's.
nope i'll be like fk off. cant we just have ONE STAR WARS SHOW without Jedi. you were loving Andor before this stupid theory was ever suggested. Plz dont fall for this nonsense. The point of Andor is that rebellions aren't built on Superheroes. just ordinary people willing to fighjt for each other. when the Rebels attacked the Death Star they did so believeing they had no chance, no heroes. even Luke himself was just willing to do what he could in the face of 99.99% certain death. womp rats in his T-16 or no. He only succeeded because Porkins and all the other ordinary heroes sacrificed themselves. And it still took Han & his Wookie to save him at the last minute. oh Chobb im taking this way too serious.. I was going to accomplish so much this evening til I watched this.
i'll want a refund.
Yes! Finally someone else is saying it! I've been running with this theory since he handed Andor his Kyber crystal saying, "It'll always be worth more to me." That one line had me thinking, He's a former Jedi in hiding.
I like this theory. It makes sense with your breakdown of his character. Also, his escape from the Empire ship and tractor beam is the most badass I've seen in all of Star Wars.
Omg right!?! It was soooo badass
yeah I remember Master Solo doing something just as badass ass by pretending to be garbage!.
Another point: The „hiding in plain sight“ would mirror Palpatine displaying Sith artifacts in his office and wearing Sith robes.
When did palpatine do this? What artifacts?
@@jeffreybrantley5308 Just check the scenes in his office and his final speeches. The novel „Darth Pleagueis“ gives more insight.
This is actually one of the best theories I've heard. His monologue does line up perfectly, and the two holocrons generating a cloud of Force Whitenoise is quite likely the best reason to explain why they were made to be so much bigger than ever preciously depicted in any other SW properties. The producers wanted them to be noticed by more than just the people like you who always look for EEs in the background. The production crew made them impossible to ignore. Maybe the other background props around them from other Lucas film properties (like the stones from Temple of Doom, etc) are meant to be a hint to EE hunters that this origin story is reaching way, way back into the old original canon sources for this one. Clues for where to look, hidden in places where they know you will look.
I really like this idea, and I'd love to see it play out this way. Even before this theory came up, he's become one of my favorite characters in the franchise and his ship design is also one of my favorites, right up there with the Falcon, and the Razor Crest.
And, though a little off-topic, I'm just gonna throw this out there... Skarsgard would make a great Rick Sanchez in a Rich and Morty Live Action movie. Just sayin'.🤯
The art gallery/ museum link is a massive coincidence if it's just a coincidence but I wouldn't be surprised if he's a new character partly inspired by that story.
It is a settling that is great for a potential appearance of art collector Thrawn.
I have thought this all along as well. And then when I saw the lightsaber ship barrel roll and take out those tie fighters...I knew it to be true. This is the best Star Wars we have gotten in so long and I hated to see it end. I hope and pray to the Jedi Temple that they adjust all the other series to match this intensity. Tired of the kid friendly shows...give the true Star Wars fans that pay the bills what they want. So happy to see Disney spreading its wings and becoming more.
Things like Star Wars the clone wars are for people of all ages but Star Wars Rebels was an abomination even Kids thought it was too kid friendly.
Andor was 10/10 Star Wars. I'm a Star Trek guy so while I've found Star Wars to be sometimes entertaining, I never considered myself a SW fan. But Rogue One was my first SW film that I watched multiple times because it was excellent. Andor is so damn good and can't wait for season 2. I think Mandalorian is entertaining, not on Andor level but when it's not being over the top silly it's solid. Boba Fett was mostly cringe. Star Wars.....when it's good it's really good. When it's bad it's embarrassing lol
@@vrASMR180 Agreed. I am a big Trekkie as well because I like the story of earth and science eventually getting us to the point to of peace and space exploration. Star Wars is fun, but it is pure comedy the way they try to rationalize things sometimes and the fanbase is the cringe part of Star Wars...they will die on their lightsabers to argue the most minor details. hahaha
@@dred9174 Rebels was not a abomination. Was it kid friendly? At first, of course it was. But through the 4 seasons hit some darker themes and had some true character growth that isn't seen in kids shows.
How did that seal the deal for you? There's literally zero indication that his ships lasers are in any way related to a lightsaber. You're literally just making that up.
Such a great theory and so plausible! And it would be pretty satisfying if it turns out to be the case, but I wonder if Tony Gilroy and the other writers have something a little less straightforward up their sleeve than Luthen being a Jedi that wasn't purged . In the CNET interview about episode 10 one way out, Beau Willmon references a few times doing something that hasn't been seen before, in this case a different prison, or a different kind of torture (Bix), and also he mentions moral conundrums, characters not being black or white, nobody is just good or bad. Willmon also mentions that in Luthen's conversation to Lonnie on the skybridge, Luthen says that the last thing he sacrificed was "Love" ( Calm. Kindness, kinship. {pause} Love ). So Luthen lost someone huge, someone more that he loved ( in likely addition to the Jedis purge of Order 66) . Couple other things of note, the scene at the end of episode 12 in Luthen's ship, Cassian and Luthen is strongly reminiscent of Palpatine/Anakin in ROTS after Mace gets fried. And those red lasers from Luthen's ship , and him flying it in a spinning motion reminiscent of Inquisitor light sabers. Looking forward to season 2 !!!
The first time I watched that speach I immediately thought he might be some fallen jedi. I'm not sure of him cutting himself off from the force though. If he is using the dark side, he can cloak himself easily enough. Yoda said that this is a quality of the dark side. The ability to cloud things, that is. I see no reason a dark side user couldn't also cloud other dark side users. Just my two cents on it.
exactly, HE is a Sith, and the Rule of 2, once the Emperor came to power, with Vader, he would know he has to get rid of the Empire, period
his willingness to sacrifice Kreeg too, I kind of had this thought in the back of my mind as well, I need to rewatch the series noww haha
Can we also talk about the fact Lutheran getting into character on his ship the way he presents himself both hair and dress wise is literally palpatine from episode 1-3
I remember my first thought when hearing Luthen’s monologue was that it had a lot of Jedi oath/Sith oath vibes. Clearly the words were different but there was something about the way he delivered it.
Damn! I knew there was something more to Luthen’s monologue, but you have to really dig deep for that.
Awesome!!!
I love the series and can’t wait for Season 2.
means more if he is NOT a bleedin Jedi.
His indifference to the deaths of others makes me feel like he's very much a Jedi.
I knew it the moment he retracted his cane in the first scene he's in. I know a lightsaber when I see one. How easy was it for Obi-Wan and/or Anakin to play roles when infiltrating different outfits and organizations? Cad Banes crew, The Zygerian slavery market, Ahsoka routinely pretended to be someone else to keep herself and her companions safe during the clone wars.... Deception and lies, subversion and espionage are some of a Jedi's most powerful weapons. This is a no brainer for me.
No one has mentioned the expert piloting skills and how he basically 'mind tricked' the guard into giving his cane back, just without the hand wave. He even manipulated Two Tubes to walk up to him so he could steal his weapon.
Right on. I think this is a much more mature way of showing Jedi mind trick than the waving of the hand and getting the victim to repeat after you.
Its pretty normal for people with money (Luthen's clientele) to have different rules to everyone else- so a blind eye is turned to buying jedi artifacts for the rich but not the poor. Really interesting theory which is plausible and adds to Luthen's story.
I love this theory! Even if it ends up not being canon I will not think of him any other way now.
It makes sense to me. Luthen's speech pretty much nailed it for me.
That's why I love this channel. I always miss sometimes obvious clues and the crew at ScreenCrush always put things together in such a great and well thought-out way.
Easily the best installment of the show I've seen yet! I'm now fully twice as excited to watch the season finale! Holy crap you guys, you did great!
If he's a Jedi, then there has to be a good narrative reason for it, that underscores Cassian's story. Luthen may have given up everything....Casa had so little to lose.
It doesn't undermine his story. It adds to the big picture which Cassian is but a part of
@@nonofyourbusiness7631 Agree! Exactly.
Luthen being a Jedi shows how weak the Jedi has become and how much time has changed. Matter of fact it shows an even greater importance to the rebels because of how little the Jedis can do to change the course now and it's all up to the rebels to decide the fate. All Luthen can do if he really was a Jedi, is play the messenger and hope he can get rebels to work together.
This theory has legs. I think your ideas are quite solid. and I love it! Adds a complexity I'll enjoy thinking about on my second watch through! Thank you!
Its possible. The writing for Andor has been lightyears above anything Disney have done for Star Wars so far.
I'm surprised his lightsaber ship wasn't mentioned! That's a big hint, I'd say!
I don't think that's a hint. Other ships in star wars use those kind of beam weapons.
Look at the gunner balls on the LAATs used by the clones. They fire similar beams in a green colour.
@@harrydamien6346 Those beams don't stop after a short distance, like a lightsaber does. There are no other ships in Star Wars like Luthens ship that I am aware of.
Ooooh yes!
@@TheOlvan well, they could be regulated...but indeed is not sure
How is that a big hint?
It surely would explain his ability to escape the Empire the way he did...and those red beams of saber-like weapons would echo his connection to the Darkside even if they weren't actually powered by kyber crystals...the poetic rhythm in the writing is just beautifully done if this is true...
I get the feeling he was a close friend to a jedi or even had a lover who was part of the jedi order. When he saw his friend get slaughtered he had to fight for their injustice. The Kyber crystal could be his Jedi friends crystal
viable theory too.
I think your theory is more likely than him being a Jedi
sure if you want.
@@shamblingheat is it though?
You convinced me when you brought up that cane and the crystal. It's actually a very convincing theory.
yeah. the crystal can actually be carried separately to both keep the cane impossible to use as a lightsaber (keeping his identity secret) and as a mean to put it back in and use the lightsaber if needed.
I think this theory really holds itself
The cane is a hidden knife confirmed by his action figure. Sorry. Also Tony Gilroy isn’t a liar. There’s no Jedi on this show
@@thezeek2745 Which is not to say there arent any former jedi on this show.
@@thegoodrevbadandyarr4272 Very true, and I don't think the mere presence of a former Force user in a minor role would kill the whole regular-human-being vibe. It's the idea of supernatural power solving problems that regular folk are learning to solve on their own, with ordinary courage and peppered with personal flaws, that would break the structure of the story.
@@fumfering Indeed, I am by no means expecting Luthen at any point to actually start using any sort of force powers, light or dark.
Ok so I 'm glad that someone else noticed the Holocrons sitting on his shelf, but nobody wants to talk about the shelf next to it with what appears to be Sankara stones from Temple of Doom? Luthen better watch his back in case Mola Ram comes looking for them.
Red Herrings - I think he was someone who knew Padme, was close to Padme. Explains the Naboo artifacts, why he would know about Jedi, would have found out about Sith, not just that the Jedi "betrayed" the Republic and how he had her headdress.
That particular headdress was part of her disguise as a refugee, so it is not even in the Nubian style. Last place we see it is in Theed Palace on her head. Maybe he was part of the Palace Security who knew her from her reign as well as the later queens?
His speech to Andor when they first met on Ferrix also gives hints that he is a jedi or force sensitive....
Well yeah how could he have possibly known how where Andor father was hanged or why.
@@PablitaPicasita I meant hanged.
no. it doesn't.
@@dred9174 he probably paid someone on Ferrix to ask around. thats why he has bankrupted Mon Mothma. Pure dear had to sell her kid and he had 100 million credits she bankrolled. and all she was short is 400,000. she should have been like "gives it back or im calling Palpatine right now"!
I don’t think we should take Yoda’s quote so seriously - there was no way Yoda could know that there are no other jedi left, even despite his ability to sense them through the force. I took it as more of an inspirational encouragement for Luke.
Not to mention, he would've been very wrong. Both Legends and the "new canon" have told us that many Jedi survived the Purge as well as the Galactic Civil War, even some who were participants in the latter. They went on to help Luke found and teach students at his academy. Luke was of special note and overshadowed others in the story only because he had the connection to Vader, and perhaps because Yoda and Obi-Wan had some extent of knowledge (through viewing the future or communing with Force Ghosts like Qui-Gon) that the twins would be instrumental in ending the Sith. He and his sister both had vast inherent power and potential, but in terms of skill, he was pretty much an average Jedi Knight by Old Republic standards as of RotJ.
Except Luthen wasn't a Jedi, he gave up the order in order to fight the Empire. Therefore Yoda was still right. Most likely Luthen's path is a downward spiral, as indicated by his conversations with Kyela. Keyla's future story will probably be very interesting in season 2.
@@julesmo323 well we don’t know for certain that Luthen is even force sensitive, plus I’m more referring to other Jedi who are more obscure or could be potentially alive still, or even the [high] possibility that there are other ‘background’ jedi who are still alive at the time of Yoda’s quote
I think whoever he is he's working with Maul. His ship is inspired by the saber staff, imagine Maul being part of the start of the Rebellion
He really hates Sidious, so...I could see Crimson Dawn helping fund random rebel cells. Maul's contribution to picking apart the Empire, piece by piece without getting his hands dirty and drawing Palpatine's eye.
This theory on a theory is something I now accept as head cannon
@@TheDarkPorkins From the beginning, Maul was always split between the idea of helping folks against Sidious.
He seemed OK with it, as long he got his cut.
😏
@@alexgavieres8293 Maul knew things that most people didn't. I think he's involved playing the long game.
@@TheDarkPorkins Exactly.
Nothing makes commercials as enjoyable as ScreenCrush. Kudos, Doug.
At 7:18 do I see the Shakari Stones(sp?) from Temple of Doom?
Luth also wears his hood in the final episode too…
Love the deep dive - all the artifacts are fantastic. When he gave ANDOR the kyber Crystal I was like - JEDI!!- he’s not using force very similar to how they showed obi wan also not using force - well done
Compelling theory. Thanks for sharing. And credit to the user who thought of it!
After the monologue I was sure he sacrificed a life as a jedi to fight the empire however he had to. The word choices were very specific. Love this theory. It may not be 100% but its gotta be close. Brilliant acting by Skarsgard.
Additional point: the way Cassian recognizes "jedi" potential in Chirrut Imwe in SWRO suggests he's seen one at work in his past. I don't think that has happened thus far where we are in his story.
thats a stretch no?
I didn't peg this particular guy, but I definitely thought he was a former jedi. The big give away was when he first showed his cane (shown at 12:28 ). He even carries it like a light saber and it looks like one.
I agree. Even the way he dresses, his wide-ranging assets, his contacts, and finally that space battle when he deployed not one but two light saber-like weapons. I totally agree. And he talks trash like one: his 'sacrifice speech' is up there with the "Tears in Rain" speech from Blade Runner. Small wonder Andor wants to join him.
I feel the same way, I thought he was a sith after watching the last few episodes. The red ship sabres, the fact he spreads fear, and he's always in dark robes.
I feel you. But the video makes the point that Luthen's line about being forced to use the tools of his oppressor would explain him behaving like a "Sith".
Like a dark jedi
cool theory! for me the escape from the tractor beam and the lightsaber-esque weapons on his ship were the biggest signals, that whole sequence with his confidence and the way he flew was way more than simply 'rebel fighter'
Yeah that was an epic scene👍.
That’s the biggest giveaway for me as well. No way a rebel pilot could take out both tie fighters like that.
@@captainlockes2344 Why not?
@@GRAFFDEMON Getting those lasers to hit both tie fighters while spinning like that requires extreme precision and timing. You have to account for the trajectory of both enemy ships, your own ship, your spin rate, and time it perfectly so that it takes out both ships as you’re flying toward them.
It’s akin to deflecting a blaster shot back at the enemy with the lightsaber.
@@captainlockes2344 We saw his ship is equipped with after market advanced equipment, one of which includes that computer interface we see in alot of shots of his cockpit. Wouldn't necessarily put it past the capabilities of this ship to have an advanced targeting computer or some such. Doesn't really mean he's a jedi.
Also imo would cheapen the story if he was a jedi. Andor is about regular folk performing extraordinary feats by way of even choosing to stand up to the empire. Not everything has to revolve around them and I'm glad Andor doesn't.
Ryan,
I like the idea presented here, and I think there's another deep dive possibility of Luthen being a former Jedi. In the book "Master and Apprentice," We get introduced to Dooku's first apprentice Rail Averross (I've probably spelled his name wrong since I listened to the book not read it), but how Rail's character is introduced and his semi non Jedi conforming ways, his association and history with both Dooku and Qui-Gon as well as other aspects suggested in the book he maybe the ever elusive Luthen.
To add to the theory, the Kyber crystal "celebrates the uprising against the Rakatan invaders." The Rakatan were dark side force users who developed hyperspace travel and the technology only worked for force users. Maybe he discovered one of their ships (he is a artifact dealer) that is what is powering Luthen’s ship. Cassian questions what is powering the ship “What's powering this? I've been in a Fondor Haulcraft. I've flown them. Never seen one do that.”
The thing you have to remember about Jedi is that they play fast and loose with the truth. What Yoda said about Luke being the last could well have been a load of old baloney with the full intent of putting pressure on Luke to do things he didn't want to do. Again.
At first I didn’t think so.. but after his monologue and seeing him fly that ship.. I’m totally in on it
And his ship even has light sabers
Yeah that flying was just too perfect for a non force user. Such a cool scene.
This show is a masterpiece in the planning and nurturing of a rebellion. Certainly, Luthen appears to be balanced on a knife's edge -- the qualities of immense power and restraint vs the surprising passions that could tip him over to the dark. The space battle in the season finale was the clincher for me. I really hope its true. He is a Jedi nearing the end of a long masquerade.
Luthen is a prime example of a Sin Eater. A man who is good and righteous who does the dark things that are needed to protect the greater good.
"Do you, hmm... Do you consider yourself a bad man?"
"The world needs bad men. We keep the other bad men from the door."
I wasn't on the Luthien Jedi train before watching this, but I like the way you lay this out. Definitely fits.
He's more likely to be Rael Averross - Dooku's other apprentice. The name, the age, and he clearly took something from Dooku in his mindset.
Yeah yoda specifically said the last of the “jedi” you can be force sensitive without being an actual jedi this is a great theory
But wasnt Ezera Bridger still alive when he said that?
@@robertreid9256 yes but like i said just because your “force sensitive “ dosent mean your a jedi! There could be plenty out there
I cringed when that old troguta said "Ahsoka is Jedi", Jesus fucking christ... Jedi is a rank not force sensitive people. That is why people are so confused
@@Cestariarts exactly! Thats why i said it’s probably plenty of FORCE sensitive people out there! Everybody dont have to be a jedi!
Also, how could Yoda know if Luke were the “last Jedi”? Yoda’s definition of Jedi would also make a difference in his statement.
Love the theory but I think the Jedi he used to be is Rael Aveross from the master and apprentice book. Former student of Doukku who also was off corasaunt during most the clone wars and already known to be a black sheep amongst the jedi
I had the same thought, Rael Aveross would absoLUTEly make sense. OOOOOOOOOOO PLEASEEEEEEEEE
I've been thinking this too, talk about hiding in plain sight.
I really like this theory. I would be interesting to see it play out if true. He won me over when he's Sacrificed Everything monologue. (And won me over as an actor. I only really know him from this and his role in the MCU.)
Did you see Dune? He’s great as Baron Harkonnen
@@Wakeman8791 Not yet, but it's on my to-do list.
Screen Crush is the best recap/ Easter Egg channel on RUclips!
I feel like Luthen uses the Mind Trick on Saw and Tubes in E11 in the cave.
He senses Andor is on the ship in the last episode, the computer didn't even have to warn him.
I'm with you 100 percent the Cane even looks like a light Saber
Stellan is EPIC in this role. Wow! I adore this Jedi theory. Makes a lot of sense and makes him so much more interesting. Episode 11 was fantastic. 👍🏾🖤
Now lets figure out how the Sankara Stones on the shelf next to the holicrons get into Molaram's hands and how he uses them to rip the hearts from the living in a galaxy far far away a long time after this (India 1930s).
😅😅
And that Incan calander too!
That wooden hilt is not a lightsaber, it’s a knife. Black series action figure confirmed this.
We also see it in ep 2 it was a sword like thing
Maybe it was repurposed to be a sword? If he's given up the life of a Jedi, why would he keep it as a lightsaber?
basing it off of a toy is incredibly obtuse.
@@bowtopostulio toys are usually big spoilers. But the hilt is not a lightsaber. That don’t mean he is not a force sensitive either way.
In Bruce Lee's Enter The Dragon (1973), there's this wonderful scene where Lee is sparring with a martial arts student. Naturally, Lee whoops his butt, but then gives him a lesson on focus:
"It is like a finger pointing away at the moon"
*The student then immediately looks at Lee's finger in stead of where it's pointing*
"Do not focus on the finger, or else you will miss all of that heavenly glory."
We the audience of Andor are focusing on the finger with stuff like this. Luthen both as a dealer in antiquities and as the leader of a rebel faction is both figuratively and literally ~selling nostalgia~. Whether it be a Gungan shield or a dream of a time before the empire, he is a broker of memories. The audience of the show isn't meant to so literally become a customer of his. Luthen being revealed as a secret Jedi would IMO cheapen his character, the show, and Star Wars as a whole. It's important that, like Andor, Luthen is just some guy who wakes up each morning with the will to fight.
I think he’s a Jedi Templar because they would go on missions and blend in with their surroundings. Taking up job other than being a Jedi and clearly that’s is what he has done.
Love the way he breaks down the information. Great content
That rod could speciffically be his lightsaber. In one of the Clone War episodes, the younglings are building their first lightsabers and the materials for making one using wood are presented to a youngling at their request with them being informed they are not the first to ask.
whatever you are smoking I want some too.
A very strong theory. I would also add that it would explain how he can come and go in almost plain sight without attracting attention. I think there may be some residual Force in him that acts on his unconscious will. When he doesn't want to be noticed he becomes unremarkable, non-descript. There is a real medical condition where a person may look at someone's face and see what everyone else sees, but they cannot recognise them no matter how well they know them. They are just "man with brown hair" or "tall woman with blue eyes". This is because the part of the brain that analyses the shape patterns that make up a face and matches them to a known person no longer functions. Could a Jedi cause a fog in this part of some people's minds in order to go unnoticed even by those that should find them distinctive? It would be like an electric eel that still carries an imperceptible field of energy around it even when it's not consciously emitting a charge. It can still "feel" the water around it and affect other creatures. Or maybe like an overhead power line can cause illusions and cancers when it's near to occupied properties. After all, Obi-Wan Kenobi all but lost his powers when in hiding. But, the Force was still gently guiding his destiny. And Qui Gonn was waiting for him to embrace it - tied to him by a faint string of Force.
Anyway, that's my flight of fancy. Anything's possible in a fictional universe where the power of the mind can affect the very fabric of reality.
If Luthen is a Jedi, I like how the show is very subtle about it. It fits perfectly with how a Jedi would behave in the real world. You don’t go around and show everyone that you’re a Jedi and get targeted. It’s much more effective if you’re able to manipulate people and get them to do things without them knowing.
Star Wars Theory:
Andor (and the rebellion) is basically the story of Chushingura and the 47 Ronin. Luthen seems to represent the actual leader of the 47 Ronin, Yoshio Oishi. Andor appears to be the fictional character Genba Tawaraboshi (or even Kai from the Hollywood adaptation). This would make some sense as Star Wars has appeared to return to its Japanese movie and culture influence (*see Mandalorian and "Lone Wolf and Cub"). As such, I'm predicting that Luthen is a former Jedi or Jedi in disguise. Maybe we'll find out tonight in the season finale.
Your hashing this out seems pretty solid. I'm totally liking where it's going. The first season was a pleasant surprise, so I can only hope for such a storyline (hidden Jedi). Love it! 🙏
Even if he technically isn’t a Jedi,
It’ll be badass if at some point, he just pulls out a lightsaber and starts wrecking people, having studied the Jedi fighting techniques.
Basically the direction they went with Finn, but actually explore it.
Finn funnily enough became a jedi after the 9th movie according to the canon material since he was force sensitive. The direction you're thinking is that one special forces stormtrooper that uses a lightsaber but doesn't have the force.
@@FrostDK98 I didn’t think they continued the story after...what would be the point, Rey’s all powerful already.
Yoda was hiding on Dagobah which is a world powerful in the dark side. That's how he remained undetected by Palpatine. So Yoda may not have been able to sense every remaining Jedi despite how powerful he was.
Yea, Yoda just being wrong has to be at least a possibility. But I get that they don't want to overwrite Cannon too much.
If this were any other recent Star Wars series I would say, "You are putting too much thought into it. There is no way the writers have thought it through that well." This series tho... I think you may have something here. I can see in season 2, this being a huge twist (That you just ruined LOL).
"Put it down, or give it back". Meaning : I don't want you to light it up by mistake. It couldn't be any
clearer.
Honestly this is the best idea I’ve heard so far about who Luthen is. This makes sense and doesn’t rely on too many “ifs”.
Disney could probably retcon this but I always thought it was interesting that Cassian asked Chirrut Imwe in Rogue One if he was a jedi as if he had seen an actual jedi before and thus being able to recognize a force user. Especially interesing considering that likes such as Han Solo whom has been all over the galaxy did not even believe the jedi were real. Luthen could possibly be Cassians introduction into the world of force sensitives.
This is a highly underrated and insightful comment!!!
Could Luthen simply be the artifacts dealer who had a love affair with a Jedi who was purged? Hence the kyber crystal meaning so much to him, and perhaps how he acquired Jedi/Sith artifacts? Once his love interest would have been killed, he wanted revenge. (lining up with the 15 years ago remark.)
Jedi with secret love interest is more played out than Jedi surviving the purge
Several people have mentioned Luthen might have been motived to fight the Empire because he had a Jedi lover who was killed during Order 66, but what about a child? The Younglings killed by Anakin had parents. I'm thinking a guy who gives up EVERYTHING (Luthen's caps, not mine) must be doing it for his kid. ... Or maybe he's a Jedi.
@@streetsafenm287 Hey, hadn't thought of that. That's a pretty good explanation for the absolute fury constantly seething beneath his skin whenever he isn't playing his antique shop character.
@Destiny The Empire likes to call it a purge. But they boast.
@@streetsafenm287 Or both.
I LOVE this theory about Luthen. I always had a feeling he was a Jedi but had to hide his powers. You sold me! Back to listen to his "I've lost everything" speech again.
He dresses like Dooku and Padme Amidala's father, and ROTJ era Luke Skywalker. Perhaps he has some tie to Serenno or Naboo.
When he did his speech at the end, I was like yeah, this guy use to be a Jedi. Everything he talked about, all the stuff he had to sacrifice. Everything that a Jedi has to sacrifice.
I WANT Luthen to be a Jedi (or even a Sith)... Stellan Skarsgård has charisma ; he must be !!
If Luthen can see the ground beneath him, is he the master of the high ground 😂
He’s so high up that after a while he can’t even SEE the high ground
@@Matt-bg5wg dude needs to lay off the grass
Honestly I'd like to see a series just on Luke studying Jedi culture and discovering artifacts. Maybe we'll get some of those earlier flashbacks in Ahsoka
yes yes
Maybe the fact that Cassian didn't even raise an eyebrow at Chirrut's abilities in Rogue One, is also another telltale sign since he's been in the presence of another force wielder before.
My thought exactly. I watched the frist meeting scene again and he wasn't surprised by Cassian's words, he just grinned and replied that their arrogance is memarkable. So, he's just happy that others found empire weak spot and exploit it (a recurring theme of the rebels).
the tools of his ennemies : He does exactly what Palpatine did : hiding in plain sight in Coruscant, of course but also exploiting arrogance. Remember that Yoda and Luke made that same reproach to the Jedi, Luke states that their hubris was their downfall. It was and it is clearly shown in the prequels. and that same flaw will bring the Empire down : Hubris makes Tarkin stay on the Death Star when it is attacked, Hubris makes Vader just deactivate the hyperdrive on the Falcon rather than just smash it, Hubris makes the Emperor let the rebels come to execute their plan.
Hubris lets Palpatine think that his apprentince will kill Amidala's son. 25 years is a lot of time to come to regret.