I just went and checked out their product page for the MK4. I would argue that Prusa is still honest, but they are definitely skirting the line. I think the main complaint is the whole input shaper bit, which is at the top of their marketing material. They hype that feature quite a lot, and from what I understand it is not implemented yet. Their marketing material DOES reflect that, saying that it is just around the corner in a firmware update, but it definitely isn't a good look. Why include it in marketing materials at all if it isn't implemented? One of the other features I've heard about is the touch screen, which isn't functional as a touch screen yet. However, they don't say anything about a touchscreen in their materials, so I don't really think you could argue they are being dishonest on that point. Hopefully they will get the input shaper stuff implemented soon, if not I'm sure they will get plenty more criticism, and I think they will deserve it.
I got my information about what this printer has and would have in the future from their blog and videos. I wasn't even aware that their product page listed those features as though they were already in there.
Also, the 2 years of promising and delaying the XL. Regardless of the issues we know and understand... I suspect the sudden uptick of "less than forthcoming behaviour" from Prusa has to do with the change in the market. When you can just sit back and keep selling the same old machine with no real competition then it's easy. As soon as a new company comes in and did what they did... Then I can see where suddenly the urge to hype up the new release, or maybe sell a product before it is fully developed to try and stay relevant. The mk4 has been a big red flag for me... The embargo on discussion of printing speeds, and my worry: the claim of 1000000 print hours tested yet the #1 claim of the input shaping and the fast print speed that comes with that update is so new that it's not possible to have tested it long term. I understand why the current attitude but I hope it isn't a permanent change in them because they have been a fantastic foundation for our industry and I would hate to see them fall from grace to scrap in the mud with the new wave of machines hitting the market.
Prusa stated that the features would be available at a later date through a firmware update and not on release. They were completely up front about it and didnt try to hide it.
from prusa's blog "Since it’s all still under development, it also means that Input Shaper and Pressure Advance won’t be available in the shipping firmware. But I’m sure you’re eager to try it as soon as possible, so we will probably soon release an alpha firmware with input shaping and Pressure Advance in a few weeks. It won’t be as feature-packed as the full firmware, but you can play around with it until we merge the two branches. 🙂"
Actually the marketing material says that "Support for high-speed printing is just around the corner via a firmware update". So technically not dishonest, but you generally don't want to be technically honest, and I definitely think Prusa was towing the line a bit. You should just leave features out if they aren't ready, that would have been more honest.
Prusa and their so called honesty is definately overestimated at this point. They are also laging behind on development compared to the machines in theire price range. In my opinion the Mk4 was a huge let down!
@@EspenShampoo25 you want to talk honestly why does bambulab encrypted the log files what are they hiding what information is their slicer and 3d printer sending bambulabs from your computer. Their is evidance that stuff is sending information even when it not in use. What honest company patent open source hardware that is not theirs to patent. How does bambulab file for patent on reprap and Voron designs.
Back in the day, way back, I worked for IBM as a customer engineer. I knew the equipment and was expected to support it. I look at this new industry and I see terrible engineering, a lack of quality in anything less than x dollars. Even a simple Kodak camera had an instructional manual and delivered beautiful prints, at a low cost. Of course the Nikon was a pleasure to use. But both were well engineered.
Flashforge is deceitful about the Adventure 3. When I purchased the new v2 Adventure 3 it touted HD camera and automatic bed leveling. The HD camera is only 640x480. The auto leveling is a 9 point manual level that takes the average and then sets that average as the z offset. If working properly is a requirement then the network send feature is a fail also as it is very spotty. Generally, you can always send the first print after a reboot. Every send afterwards is iffy. I thought maybe it was wifi so I ran an Ethernet cable to it and had the exact same issues. I contacted support about the camera thinking maybe there was so another way to get an HD feed. I had tried directly streaming through VLC and through Flashprint. Support responded by asking how I got the stream information. I responded saying that should be irrelevant and they told me the camera can only do 640x480 video but 2MP images though that is not supported by the software yet.
I've never had any problem with the wifi on the A3, but the A4 is kinda spotty. But I agree that "HD" isn't what I'd use to describe the camera on that printer. Neither is "Auto" what I'd use to describe their leveling process. But the camera is HD compared to some, and the bed level "Auto" adjusts your print after you give it the inputs about your beds level. But their definitely skirting the line in terms of being clear with those features.
Interesting take on Flashforge. This is a brand that I never considered before, but I keep hearing good things about them. They told me on Twitter that they are coming out with new machines in May. I look forward to it.
@@chdcase Why? I have a Flashforge Foto that has been 100% reliable for me. And it not only does everything they said, it's totally solid and I thoroughly enjoy it.
I'm 3 mins in and before I listen to the rest, which I will, here is my take. In general the buyers of 3D Printers often do not use and/or understand what 3D printers are. Example: of my 10 3D Printers 7 of them I bought on eBay marked as "As Is, for parts only". In other words broken. Now since they are not returning these to where they bought them from they exceeded the warranty period. I bought the 7 and was able to fix every one. What was broken on them? 1 of them, not broken at all, misuse of the slicer as it was a delta and, evidently the seller didn't configure the slicer correctly. 2 others we either assembled wrong, or disassembled and reassembled wrong. One of them had guide rail supports upside down, the rambo card completely wired wrong, gantry wasn't squared off. The other had a broken LCD screen and damaged build plate. I could go on to the others but, bottom line some buyers, who might claim that the machines are inferior or promised on something that wasn't delivered, you have to wonder if the machines are not understood, damaged by the buyers, etc. In my case the 7 work as advertised, ZERO complaints. AND, when you buy a 3D Printer it is NOT an appliance like a microwave where you put food in, press a button, and perfection comes out, unless you don't read the directions and keep it in too long. But then you won't get a buyer saying the microwave over didn't deliver on what it was advertised to do. Now I will keep listening and see if you mention companies. One that comes to my mind that you might mention is Ankermake which promises AI camera detection of prints that might be failing. Although if you read more closely the APP is in Beta mode so it might not be perfected. I don't own one but I've read the comments.
I could tell it was a more casual video - no tie :) And I can't really comment on companies in general - as I've only had 3 printers. One (Snapmaker) I wasn't all that impressed with, a second (Kywoo) that I'm still on the fence about, and the third (Anker) that has really worked well for me. From a consumer point of view I'd say that Anker has been honest. Have they always hit their goals first time around? Nope. But they've always been up front about changes and the new expectations. Not sure how you count that.
I agree with Flashforge... kind of - Creator pro 2, the most reliable printers I've ever used, some of mine are pushing 5000 hours and have only had nozzle replacements. Ad3, the ultimate prototyping machine, so quick sat on my desk with wifi. Flashforge have even sent me replacement parts for my other printers without question, solid company. I got what I expected. HOWEVER, Adventurer 4 - what went wrong, literally lies all over to box, price that is out of this world for what you get and what a lemon in terms of quality, it's like a thought experiment to see what they could get away with. The worst thing is, IT WORKED! People fell for it.
I agree the A3 was a better machine for the price, but what about the A4 didn't work for you? For me the wifi was a little spotty, but otherwise it delivered, and even made the camera somewhat useful. Though I do wish it were higher resolution.
@@3dpprofessor It's not so much that it didn't work for me, it feels more like an Adv3.5 but more than double the price. At least in the UK it was advertised with auto levelling, which to me means some sort of probe like the guider, creator 3, etc... but what you got was the same 9 point average manual levelling which is as good as one point manual levelling - my main issue is the price seems dishonest for what it is when they sell better printers for cheaper. Coming from owning creator 2s, a creator 3, a creator 4, 2 guider IIs, all of which are exactly "as sold" when it comes to the stuff I read before getting them... the Adv4 is this strange item in FF's line up that fills no niches or roles and is frankly miss sold (in my opinion) however if I got an Adv4 as my first printer knowing no different I'd be amazed... which I think FF are abusing with it
What's your take on advertising features on launch that aren't there yet software wise? MK4s input shaping comes to mind, and didn't a prusa machine have to wait a year for it to get wifi(Can't remember which one) even though it was equipped out of the box? I'll never buy a prusa, as a 1k bed slinger is just too much for me, but prusa has done some iffy marketing as well.
Yeah, I really wish they hadn't done that. Though they were open about those things being future features in their blog and videos, and that's where I got my information.
I do llike Prusa. But it isn’t true that they don’t advertise what they don’t deliver. Good example is the Prusa Mini and Wifi… it was sold for more than two years with „WiFi support“ without having it implemented. I just ordered a MK4 Kit, I really hope they don’t do the same as with the Mini.
@@3dpprofessor The point is, it got advertised from the beginning it was launched, more or less two years ago, but was only recently implemented. For me, that's a false advertisement then. Many people bought this printer for their farms because of the Wifi feature.
Bought an mk4. I'm not disappointed. Great machine and good upgrade from mk3. Would I be happy with bambo as well - probably yes. But in reality - there are no difference except bragging to your 3d printing friends.
Stratasys has way more incentive to be honest than any consumer brand. They cant afford to be known for screwing a company that looked to spend 10 million on a rack of printers and years of support contract. If creality gets a little shaky on whats in their copy vs what is in the box there is 200 other people ready to buy an Ender 3 at MicroCenter with a coupon.
I use high end J850 polyjet printers and many others from Stratasys, and honesty in their business isn't optional when they are dealing with medical companies, defense contractors, and other highly regulated industries. If they lie about a certain spec, it can mean a massive lawsuit for the company that ships out that part with that advertised spec that they get from Stratasys. But you pay for it dearly with the cost of resin, filament, and powder, print heads, and all the other awesome consumables. That is where they make their money, that, and shipping out their stratasys techs to maintain your printers. But, they work. Plus our stratasys guy is awesome.
I just saw the Creality Falcon laser cutter engraver promo video.Great video with CGI but the claims are either not true of half-truths. ie it can cut 15mm in one pass....But at what speed. It can cut 0.05 stainless steel.....who needs stainless steel that's 1/20mm in thickness. Lots of usual comments about the laser beam shielding...Or the lack of it (no doubt they will spin something to say it's better as you can see the cutting better. That's why I went for the Elegoo Phecda Kickstarter for their laser cutter engraver version which is realistic in how it advertises and does have safety issues thought out a bit better..
I will add one. And it' a US company. Lulzbot. I have 2 TAZ 5 machines. Fully open source. Any part that fails, that is 3D printed, the file is there to download and print. And, if you only own 1 3D printer and it's the Lulzbot you need a part for, they do sell it. I contacted them for support and, next day flawlessly the answer. Great support. Also they have instructions on how to build your own toolheads. I built a E3D titan with a ,4 mm nozzle that used 1.75mm filament. The stock toolhead is a ,5mm nozzle that uses 2.85mm filament. I also read instructions and bought parts to build what they call a MoarStruder. You could buy it built or they have downloadable files to build your own. I built a Moarstruder that uses the .285mm filament on a 1.2mm nozzle for 4 times the speed rapid prototype. The definition of a final production part is not there but to rapid prototype and then move the file for .5 or .4 nozzle printing is awesome. So, I put a vote in for Lulzbot.
I'm in the wrong line of business. I should be a psychic. I knew you would get a subthread of comments that Prusa isn't honest. I knew it. I don't own a Prusa so I can comment so I won't. In general I expect no 3D Printer to attain the advances they claim. For example, auto bed leveling. I have 2 machines that claim they auto bed level and one that has assisted bed leveling. I'm not going to say which machines but I will say this. I choose to manually bed level. It seems I do a better and more careful job. Then I make, what I think, are logical choices. For example, do I want a machine with belts or lead screws. To me lead screws logically seem like they would be more accurate. Lead screws mean that the fast speeds will be harder to come by so that's the sacrifice. Also I prefer direct drive vs. bowden tube. That decision adds weight to the toolhead/printhead as the extruder in inside the printhead vs. at the other end of the bowden tube. That sacrifice slows my potential max print speed down. So, bottom line, I expect to have to tinker with any machine I buy and currently have. I expect periodic filament jams, I expect to replace nozzles, I expect to replace a PTFE tube that slightly melted due to printing in ABS. I expect ABS printing to always be a pain in the butt. So, when I see claims of "perfect first layer", "nozzles that will last x number of print hours", "the best designed printhead that won't have heat creep into the heatblock, etc." I expect to have to babysit and tweak any and all machines. So, making a determination of how honest a company is on building, selling, marketing, and supporting their machines is tough when people expect 3D Printers to just be a single pressing of a button, they walk away immediately, and expect perfection. And, it's 2023 people LOVE complaining. There should be an academy award for the best complainer on social media.
There's something to this. I wanted to follow this up with a video that was, basically, "how to tell when you're being lied it", but I realized it's difficult to set a baseline for what's possible when 3D printing already seems kind of impossible and magical. After "Yeah, you can hit go and get whatever you want", things like "and it'll print a benchy in 10 minutes" seems perfectly reasonable.
I have one other company that still makes 3D Printers but I can't say if they are honest with their new products. 3D Systems. I bought a relic, 2012 machine, a piece of history that looked interesting. A cubify generation 2. It sold, new, for $1400. I saw the old youtube footage about what it does and it was not "really" honest. It has no heated bed and they claimed it could print ABS. Very very small ABS models it can print and I have printed cable chain links and those printed. But what impressed me is that I bought this cubify 4 months ago and the files the machine reads are ,cube files, not the ,gcode files. I contacted the company and they told me where I could grab the slicer software for this OLD old machines. I thought that was cool because I thought I would be only limited to printing the files on the supplied thumb drive. But I can slice what ever I need to, within reason. And it prints average, which is to be expected on a 11 year old machine.
I mean, they didn't lie when they said it could print ABS. They never said it could print ABS well. I've heard some folks say you can mod them to take GCode, but I don't know if that's possible. I mean, if what you've got works, don't knock it.
I think Sovol have been upfront with their marketing, and I dont recall Voxelab ever promising something that wasnt delivered either. Kudos to you Joe for highlighting this, honesty is a trait I very highly value in all walks of life and where we discover honesty we should celebrate it.
Welll.... For Sovol, see the blog post to my video about the SV06, my last full length video. VoxelLab is just the bargain arm of Flashforge, so that tracks, though.
@@3dpprofessor I've had some pretty bad experiences with Voxelab, with both their FDM and SLA printers. The Voxelab Proxima 6 (same thing as the Flashforge Foto iirc) swapped out the mainboard from a chituboard to something much, much less capable in one of their hardware revisions without telling anyone (it couldn't load gcode files, or show the masks on the display, and locked you into their terrible slicing format/slicer) and the Voxelab Aquila had *three* different mainboard SKUs with different processors that needed different firmware that wasn't even open sourced yet. It was basically a grab bag, maybe you'd get one you could flash custom firmware for say, a bltouch on, or maybe you'd get one that you're stuck with the stock firmware (which didn't have even thermal protection enabled until way after launch). Not to mention my Aquila bed was considerably warped and my Proxima LCD panel died within the first week. I'd stick with something else if you're looking at Flashforge/Voxelab (at least on their lower priced options)
Disagreeing with the assessment on Flashforge. The "auto" leveling of the Adventurer 3 is garbage and there is no real way to even manually level the bed the way it's designed. I will NEVER buy another Flashforge product.
I find it's useful to do a test print that goes around all 4 corners and edges, and a little in the middle, and adjust from there. Then print and repeat until it's fully level. I agree that "auto" probably wasn't the best word to use there, though.
Looks to me that Prusa are wetting their pants about Bambu Labs and upcoming Creality K1 ....therefore pushed out Mk4 when development is not yet complete. I received my P1P in 2 days and oh boy is this thing a speed demon, yet cheaper than a MK4 kit. I have had PRUSA machines for years and no issues, but, the game has now moved on. Interesting developments from Prusa but bedslingers are not going to be the future.
I think that it's a combination of the Bambu eating their lunch and customers getting impatient with the tool changer. And for consumers, this is a good thing. I'm rooting for Prusa, but I'm still using my Bambu.
Seems like a lot of people are lashing out because they feel like they're being backed into a corner... It's not us vs them, It's them vs them. Sure we as consumers can take a stand and vote with our wallets but innovation and price will always win. Basically donating your money to an outdated platform is not going to do you favors in the future. I'm a business person who relies on speed and quality. Only 1 machine can provide that consistently. We all know what this video is really about unfortunately and it's sad to see a fan base devolve into this. Ask for better, don't make excuses for.
Kind of odd to make a video praising Prusa for their honesty while MK4 is out with advertised Input Shaping, but actually not ready in the shipped firmware. Honest?
This is kinda frustrating, but it's not like it's up in the air whether it's going to happen. Marlin input shaping code is already there, even if still somewhat experimental. It's going to be integrated by Prusa sooner or later, probably sooner, and in worst case community can do it because Prusa isn't one of the GPL infringers.
from prusa's blog "Since it’s all still under development, it also means that Input Shaper and Pressure Advance won’t be available in the shipping firmware. But I’m sure you’re eager to try it as soon as possible, so we will probably soon release an alpha firmware with input shaping and Pressure Advance in a few weeks. It won’t be as feature-packed as the full firmware, but you can play around with it until we merge the two branches. 🙂"
Or the 20 minute benches that's not possible with the printer, yet taunted as a feature? They wouldn't even send the g-code to people that asks for it, starting to think it's a 50%benchie or something...
Not a fan oft Prusa trolling his user base about the mk4 for an April fools joke and found it disrespectful. (I'm aware it was in development, and I'm aware he eventually delivered on it but my point still stands)
Agree with your p.o.v. on the whole video. Loved the list and the fact you separate honesty from good product, this provode us the chance to choose what to backuo and what to... not. Also...Keep the full beard, but make it short. Seems like a lady's guy. 😅. Also you could pull a HarleyDavidson and look bad@ss. Lol.
Not much of a list, is it? You were better off saying "the only two honest 3D Printing companies" in the video. Something's telling me that this video isn't honest!
I mean, I want to remain positive. And I think there's different degrees of dishonesty. Maybe a "how to tell when you're getting fleeced". Things like obviously photoshopped sample prints and the like.
I apologize for my lack of succinctness. I do tend to ramble, and while these days brevity seems to be king, myself, i still enjoy just letting the stream of consciousness flow. There's something Zen like about it. That's why I don't write scripts. Though, if I did write a script first, maybe I'd be able to condense my thoughts into a more digestible format for you. Plus, I just sound different when I'm reading a script, even one I've written myself, then when I'm just talking, and I think many people appreciate the more conversational tone. It's welcoming and develops a sense of comradery, even if a one sided one in real life. That's what makes fairs and conventions, like the Rocky Mountain RepRap Festival that I just got back from, an interesting proposition. I'm meeting all these people who, like yourself, _I've_ never seen and, at most, barely interacted with, and yet they have had a rich, one-sided relationship. And many people understand that, and so they approach me with this sort of strange awkwardness. But I've learned over the years to just pick up on the relationship as they expect it. But that's not the main point. The main point is I tend to make my point using too many words, when it could be done with fewer words. I get that. Though, that reminds me of a time when a girl I was interested in challenged me to talk for 1 minute. No prompt, just make word noises with my mouth for a solid minute. And I did. No problem whatsoever. I mostly talked about how easy it is to talk for a mere 60 seconds and how 15 minutes would have been a challenge. Things like that. And apparently she was impressed by that because now she's my wife. So considering how well that worked out, you know. You know you can watch my videos in 2x speed. I won't be offended.
@@3dpprofessor View at 2X? I was viewing at 2X. In any case, I'm not mad at anybody, just letting you know that there was too much there for my purposes. May the wind always be at your back and all your viewers delighted with your style. (which seeps into your messages as well as your videos)
anyone who produces a BILLFOLD and calls it a WALLET and is at least as old as i am if not a bit older is not to be trusted. was interested right up till that commercial now i dont care what you have to say, you just threw away your credibility
I think Prusa being more honest in their marketing might also be linked to them being in and from Europe. Whereas you seem to think that a salesman lying is normal, most in Europe will frown upon someone making huge claims without in-depth evidence and there is still a bit more control over how far statements in advertisements (at least in traditional media) can go. Things are moving in the same (bad) direction as the US and especially China though - as control over ads on the Internet is far less and honestly. Even Prusa now seems to go the bad route, mentioning and even boasting about important features (input shaping) yet then not having them implemented yet ... I think that stunt should make them drop significantly on your scale ...
I don't know if I want to chalk it up to culture entirely. After all, a lot of folks are impressed with Elegoo, and they're not from Europe either. As for Prusa, on their blog and videos I knew that they were releasing the MK4 feature incomplete with updates coming later. So while that might not be what people want, in my book that's still honest.
@@alanb76 Yes and they had to run a company in crisis mode. Broken supply chains, corona and so on. No chinese company invests in open source that way. They just copy and call themselves inventors lol.
@@alanb76 The number of people working on the project is not an indicator of the actual value contributed. Maybe these 20 guys just spend all their time rewriting what was already perfectly functional so that Prusa can claim they have unique code.
Do you Github? Because when they bring in features from Marlin it shows on their Github. Likewise when features they develop are incorporated into the main Marlin branch, it is likewise attributed.
I disagree with Prusa being the most honest 3D printer company. They wasted a lot of my time by not being honest about a problem I was having. If you want more information, please let me know.
I have only had a handful of 3d printers. Currently I have my MK3S+ and an Ender 3 Pro. I keep the Ender around just to mess with. The MK3S+ prints well and is a good printer. I just can't support them anymore based on my experience. Anyway, I think Elegoo and Kingroon are honest companies and would buy from them again in the future. That Sliceworx KP3S looks great. I'm going to hold off buying another until after this wave of Corexy/Klipper printers. I have really enjoyed your videos lately. Keep up the good work!
This was biased. Rambling And unscientific. Intro was 50% Content 5% outro 45% (felt). It was rough to hear you praise the manufactures you work with. And the open source/drum for pruza .
For what? For being open about what features they will be adding in the future? If you read their blogs and watch their videos they've been very clear about all the features, current and future, that the Mk4 has.
@@3dpprofessor Dear Mr. 3D Printing Professor, it is of course nothing personal but it strikes me that everyone in You Tube land is in the Prusa advertising mode. Be honest It's just very noticeable. (and maybe I would do it myself! It depends on what it slides!) ;-) Healthy and Friendly Greetings from the Netherlands! Rob
@@hobbyrob313 You clearly haven't seen CNC Kitchen's video on the MK4. Or Layer by Layer's. Or Uncle Jessies. The consensus on the MK4 seems to be "It's good, but it's hard to recommend it when the Bambu is right there still eating it's lunch. Lemme give you some intsight into *my* thought process in making this video. I had just made a video for one company where I had to bite my tongue about a feature they were promising, even recommending, that their hardware couldn't actually deliver on. Otherwise the printer was fine, but they felt they had to over promise on this feature to be competitive. Then, I was also in the middle of another review that, again, was maing marketing promises that their software in this case couldn't keep. So instead of making a video where I am as mad as I can be and I make others mad too, I decided I'd go the other direction. I'd look for companies I'd work with that never let me down. So I made a list of every 3D printer manufacturer and looked at them from the aspect of Honesty. Only honesty. Whether Id had ever had to deal with broken promises from them. My initial thought was to discount anything coming from China, but I was grateful that hypothesis was show down when I went to the community. Then I remembered *my* experience with the Prusa MK3s, how unexpectedly responsive and easy it was to use. Sure, their UI looked like the love child of an Apple IIe and a speak and spell, but it had features I didn't even remember them touting. I remembered that despite numerous delays on releasing their tool changer they always communicated what was going on. And even with the MK4, they were open about what features they had and were coming on their blog and videos where I was getting my information. About this time Josef also made a blog post about Open Source and it potentially doomed future, and it too resonated with me. This video wasn't made to prop up Prusa. It was made in reaction to others and in my research I rediscovered Prusa. And, if you read the blog post in the pinned comment, you'll see I really wanted to include Bambu, but I'll let that post stand on it's own.
@@3dpprofessor - Hello Professor, The message has arrived! At one point I also had something like should I have written this? But I also want to be honest and I think quite a lot of attention is given to the Prusa's! ( not just only by you!) (maybe I'm wrong, could be!) BUT I'm not going to worry too much about it, Don't do that either because it's not worth the effort for the rest! Apart from all this, I hope the translation goes well and has gone oke! I wish you all the best and success with your videos best regards again! Rob
There is a concept in Psychology called Beautiful is Good. I can't link in the comments to just Google "Attractiveness biases attributions of moral character, study finds" Basically most people automatically assume the moral character of a beautiful person to be good when in fact beautiful people have a standard distribution of morality. I think you are doing something similar here. To you, Prusa is beautiful and therefore you are attributing other good traits to that man/company which they did not actually earn. Good customer experience does not mean the company is honest. Those are not the same thing.
Prusa ain't beautiful. The i3 is an open air box that I had to assemble myself, and I still have trauma from that experience. So what dishonest thing has Prusa done that you think it needs being taken down a notch for?
@@3dpprofessor I genuinely have a lot of respect for you and I know you love Prusa. I don't want to make you feel bad. That's not my motivation. There is so much love for Prusa but the flip side of that is extreme hate for anyone who doesn't drink the cool aid too. So, while your admiration feels good to you there is a dark side of it that I experience. To directly answer you question Prusa copies everything. You may not have seen it but that great new feature on the Prusa XL (which is conspicuously missing on the I4) where the nozzle can detect a jam because of the load cell. That was copied from an Itallian 3D Printer company startup (I documented this in my XL video). That's just the latest example. Going back, everything about the Prusa is copied. So that's what I would claim is the primary dishonesty of Prusa. Taking credit for everyone else's innovations. The I4 is not the I4 It's the Prusa MENDEL Iteration 4. But they dropped the Mendel name long ago and now everyone calls moving bed printers "I3 style." I know what you are going to say "That's everyone else doing it, it's not Prusa." But Prusa doesn't correct or go out of their way to thank the original creators. They just want to maintain the status quo where they are using everyone else's hard work to earn $7 Million per month. Meanwhile how much does Ed Sells make for inventing the Printer that made Prusa rich? How much does Scott Lahteine earn for creating the Prusa Firmware? How much does Alessandro Ranellucci earn for creating Prusa Slicer? These guys get no credit or pay. Yet Prusa gets PAID and LOVED for being open source. But he/they use open source more than they contribute. Where are the I4 files? Did those get released yet? We all lose our minds when Creality delays releasing their files but when Prusa doesn't do it: Meh. No big deal. The love is out of control. It creates a double standard and that makes fertile soil for a tyrant to arise. Does that sufficient sway you to take it down a notch?
@@DesignPrototypeTest Do you GitHub? Because nearly everything you're complaining about, the source of where certain changes came from and their incorporation into the designs and software, are all documented on GitHub. Do you understand the concept of Open Source? Because you're calling using Open Source copying, which it's not. Well, it is, but it's open copying. It's not negative the way you're making it sound. Also, do you understand the difference between reverse engineering and copying? Because they're not the same thing either. And Scott is a great dude, and I love him. Dude's done more for 3D printing than I have. But IIRC he joined marlin project after Prusa forked it for their firmware (I think Jetty was still working on it back then). And when Scott's work gets incorporated into Prusa, it gets attributed on Github, and when he incorporates Prusa firmware into marlin, it also gets documented on GitHub. It's been a mutually beneficial, and very open, relationship. Now, admittedly, Prusa's been a bit slow to update their GitHub here. Releases are tough. Let's give them a little time to make ti good before we pull out the pitchforks and torches.
@@3dpprofessor I don't GitHub. Neither do most. I've had commenters leave extremely negative words to me and then give credit for Trinamic technology to Prusa! They got this idea from the Prusa blog apparently. So the narrative continues: Prusa is the source of everything good in 3D Printing. When anything negative is said about Prusa it is punished or repressed but effusiveness like you display is rewarded. The whole group starts to sound like a religion. Non believers are ostracized. What do you think about me being banned from RMRRF? This is hobby robotics/engineering why are there tru believers here? You say let's wait to get the pitch forks out. That's my point! The Pitch forks work for Prusa. Never have I seen a Mob criticizing Prusa. All criticism just kind of disappears. Why is Prusa the favorite son who we must love and not criticize? For example there is only 1 video on RUclips about the massive inconsistent extrusion issue. That's an instance where Prusa under delivered. But all you want to talk about is when they over deliver.
They're out of stock because people keep buying their machines. The amount they send out for marketing is pittance compared to their stock. IF they were sending out so many, I'd have reviewed more than just one of theirs.
@3dpprofessor Well, it would have been more honest to tell that right away in their publicity instead of letting the consumer to do homework and investigate if their claims are true at launching date. To me, that's walking a VERY fine line between lying by omission (on purpose, no less) and telling the truth, and honestly they are leaning more towards the lying side when doing those kind of stunts. It's not a matter of "they are transparent because they told it... In their blog", but a matter of them hiding those facts in their blog instead of discussing them in the public area most people will only see: their ads.
![Felix "Unfair" | [Stray Kids : SKZ-PLAYER]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/Oswujxm2Ag0/mqdefault.jpg)
What about that one company I didn't mention? www.3dpprofessor.com/2023/04/18/what-is-the-most-honest-3d-printer-company/
From what I have heard, Prusa has dropped the honesty ball with the MK4. Their materials mention several features that are not available at release.
I just went and checked out their product page for the MK4. I would argue that Prusa is still honest, but they are definitely skirting the line. I think the main complaint is the whole input shaper bit, which is at the top of their marketing material. They hype that feature quite a lot, and from what I understand it is not implemented yet. Their marketing material DOES reflect that, saying that it is just around the corner in a firmware update, but it definitely isn't a good look. Why include it in marketing materials at all if it isn't implemented? One of the other features I've heard about is the touch screen, which isn't functional as a touch screen yet. However, they don't say anything about a touchscreen in their materials, so I don't really think you could argue they are being dishonest on that point. Hopefully they will get the input shaper stuff implemented soon, if not I'm sure they will get plenty more criticism, and I think they will deserve it.
I got my information about what this printer has and would have in the future from their blog and videos. I wasn't even aware that their product page listed those features as though they were already in there.
Also, the 2 years of promising and delaying the XL. Regardless of the issues we know and understand...
I suspect the sudden uptick of "less than forthcoming behaviour" from Prusa has to do with the change in the market.
When you can just sit back and keep selling the same old machine with no real competition then it's easy. As soon as a new company comes in and did what they did... Then I can see where suddenly the urge to hype up the new release, or maybe sell a product before it is fully developed to try and stay relevant.
The mk4 has been a big red flag for me... The embargo on discussion of printing speeds, and my worry: the claim of 1000000 print hours tested yet the #1 claim of the input shaping and the fast print speed that comes with that update is so new that it's not possible to have tested it long term.
I understand why the current attitude but I hope it isn't a permanent change in them because they have been a fantastic foundation for our industry and I would hate to see them fall from grace to scrap in the mud with the new wave of machines hitting the market.
@@3dpprofessorthey did this with the prusa mini including Wi-Fi too, but it took like 3 years & is terrible
Prusa stated that the features would be available at a later date through a firmware update and not on release. They were completely up front about it and didnt try to hide it.
PRUSA is an innovator, THE REAL DEAL.. and earned my MK4 purchase.
Prusa saying the mk4 has input shaper and then releasing without it isn't honest. Not even an asterisk saying it will be added later
from prusa's blog "Since it’s all still under development, it also means that Input Shaper and Pressure Advance won’t be available in the shipping firmware. But I’m sure you’re eager to try it as soon as possible, so we will probably soon release an alpha firmware with input shaping and Pressure Advance in a few weeks. It won’t be as feature-packed as the full firmware, but you can play around with it until we merge the two branches. 🙂"
They did mention in prusa live and in their blog.
Actually the marketing material says that "Support for high-speed printing is just around the corner via a firmware update". So technically not dishonest, but you generally don't want to be technically honest, and I definitely think Prusa was towing the line a bit. You should just leave features out if they aren't ready, that would have been more honest.
Prusa and their so called honesty is definately overestimated at this point. They are also laging behind on development compared to the machines in theire price range. In my opinion the Mk4 was a huge let down!
@@EspenShampoo25 you want to talk honestly why does bambulab encrypted the log files what are they hiding what information is their slicer and 3d printer sending bambulabs from your computer. Their is evidance that stuff is sending information even when it not in use. What honest company patent open source hardware that is not theirs to patent. How does bambulab file for patent on reprap and Voron designs.
Gread video Jo. I did noticed that on the Prusa Mini with the file just showing up when inserting USB drive
I love that feature.
Back in the day, way back, I worked for IBM as a customer engineer. I knew the equipment and was expected to support it. I look at this new industry and I see terrible engineering, a lack of quality in anything less than x dollars. Even a simple Kodak camera had an instructional manual and delivered beautiful prints, at a low cost. Of course the Nikon was a pleasure to use. But both were well engineered.
Great video as always!
I totally agree about Prusa. It simply just WORK.
Thanks for sharing your thoughts with all of us 👍😀
I don’t own a 3d printer yet but I have my eye on a Prusa. The other brand I was looking at I can’t in good conscience buy due to the security risk.
Flashforge is deceitful about the Adventure 3. When I purchased the new v2 Adventure 3 it touted HD camera and automatic bed leveling. The HD camera is only 640x480. The auto leveling is a 9 point manual level that takes the average and then sets that average as the z offset.
If working properly is a requirement then the network send feature is a fail also as it is very spotty. Generally, you can always send the first print after a reboot. Every send afterwards is iffy. I thought maybe it was wifi so I ran an Ethernet cable to it and had the exact same issues.
I contacted support about the camera thinking maybe there was so another way to get an HD feed. I had tried directly streaming through VLC and through Flashprint. Support responded by asking how I got the stream information. I responded saying that should be irrelevant and they told me the camera can only do 640x480 video but 2MP images though that is not supported by the software yet.
I've never had any problem with the wifi on the A3, but the A4 is kinda spotty.
But I agree that "HD" isn't what I'd use to describe the camera on that printer. Neither is "Auto" what I'd use to describe their leveling process. But the camera is HD compared to some, and the bed level "Auto" adjusts your print after you give it the inputs about your beds level.
But their definitely skirting the line in terms of being clear with those features.
@@3dpprofessor I think the v2 came out really close to A4 release. There may be something there.
Interesting take on Flashforge. This is a brand that I never considered before, but I keep hearing good things about them. They told me on Twitter that they are coming out with new machines in May. I look forward to it.
Absolutely run away from Flashforge. Stick with Bambu, Prusa, etc.
@@chdcase Why? I have a Flashforge Foto that has been 100% reliable for me. And it not only does everything they said, it's totally solid and I thoroughly enjoy it.
@@chdcase no reasoning at all here, you made a really good point /s
I'm 3 mins in and before I listen to the rest, which I will, here is my take. In general the buyers of 3D Printers often do not use and/or understand what 3D printers are. Example: of my 10 3D Printers 7 of them I bought on eBay marked as "As Is, for parts only". In other words broken. Now since they are not returning these to where they bought them from they exceeded the warranty period. I bought the 7 and was able to fix every one. What was broken on them? 1 of them, not broken at all, misuse of the slicer as it was a delta and, evidently the seller didn't configure the slicer correctly. 2 others we either assembled wrong, or disassembled and reassembled wrong. One of them had guide rail supports upside down, the rambo card completely wired wrong, gantry wasn't squared off. The other had a broken LCD screen and damaged build plate. I could go on to the others but, bottom line some buyers, who might claim that the machines are inferior or promised on something that wasn't delivered, you have to wonder if the machines are not understood, damaged by the buyers, etc. In my case the 7 work as advertised, ZERO complaints. AND, when you buy a 3D Printer it is NOT an appliance like a microwave where you put food in, press a button, and perfection comes out, unless you don't read the directions and keep it in too long. But then you won't get a buyer saying the microwave over didn't deliver on what it was advertised to do. Now I will keep listening and see if you mention companies. One that comes to my mind that you might mention is Ankermake which promises AI camera detection of prints that might be failing. Although if you read more closely the APP is in Beta mode so it might not be perfected. I don't own one but I've read the comments.
So far I have listened to what reviewers are saying more than the manufacturer. Also I get on a forum for a printer I am considering.
I could tell it was a more casual video - no tie :)
And I can't really comment on companies in general - as I've only had 3 printers. One (Snapmaker) I wasn't all that impressed with, a second (Kywoo) that I'm still on the fence about, and the third (Anker) that has really worked well for me. From a consumer point of view I'd say that Anker has been honest. Have they always hit their goals first time around? Nope. But they've always been up front about changes and the new expectations. Not sure how you count that.
I agree with Flashforge... kind of - Creator pro 2, the most reliable printers I've ever used, some of mine are pushing 5000 hours and have only had nozzle replacements. Ad3, the ultimate prototyping machine, so quick sat on my desk with wifi. Flashforge have even sent me replacement parts for my other printers without question, solid company. I got what I expected. HOWEVER, Adventurer 4 - what went wrong, literally lies all over to box, price that is out of this world for what you get and what a lemon in terms of quality, it's like a thought experiment to see what they could get away with. The worst thing is, IT WORKED! People fell for it.
I agree the A3 was a better machine for the price, but what about the A4 didn't work for you? For me the wifi was a little spotty, but otherwise it delivered, and even made the camera somewhat useful. Though I do wish it were higher resolution.
@@3dpprofessor It's not so much that it didn't work for me, it feels more like an Adv3.5 but more than double the price. At least in the UK it was advertised with auto levelling, which to me means some sort of probe like the guider, creator 3, etc... but what you got was the same 9 point average manual levelling which is as good as one point manual levelling - my main issue is the price seems dishonest for what it is when they sell better printers for cheaper. Coming from owning creator 2s, a creator 3, a creator 4, 2 guider IIs, all of which are exactly "as sold" when it comes to the stuff I read before getting them... the Adv4 is this strange item in FF's line up that fills no niches or roles and is frankly miss sold (in my opinion) however if I got an Adv4 as my first printer knowing no different I'd be amazed... which I think FF are abusing with it
I actually didn't skip the sponsor. Nice job.
What's your take on advertising features on launch that aren't there yet software wise? MK4s input shaping comes to mind, and didn't a prusa machine have to wait a year for it to get wifi(Can't remember which one) even though it was equipped out of the box? I'll never buy a prusa, as a 1k bed slinger is just too much for me, but prusa has done some iffy marketing as well.
Yeah, I really wish they hadn't done that.
Though they were open about those things being future features in their blog and videos, and that's where I got my information.
Flashforge might be one of the oldest companies making 3d printers in China. I got one of the Makerbot copy back to 2015.
I do llike Prusa. But it isn’t true that they don’t advertise what they don’t deliver. Good example is the Prusa Mini and Wifi… it was sold for more than two years with „WiFi support“ without having it implemented.
I just ordered a MK4 Kit, I really hope they don’t do the same as with the Mini.
I did just update my Mini with Wifi, adn I'm kind of impressed with it. It's slow, but it works.
@@3dpprofessor The point is, it got advertised from the beginning it was launched, more or less two years ago, but was only recently implemented. For me, that's a false advertisement then. Many people bought this printer for their farms because of the Wifi feature.
Bought an mk4. I'm not disappointed. Great machine and good upgrade from mk3. Would I be happy with bambo as well - probably yes. But in reality - there are no difference except bragging to your 3d printing friends.
Stratasys has way more incentive to be honest than any consumer brand. They cant afford to be known for screwing a company that looked to spend 10 million on a rack of printers and years of support contract. If creality gets a little shaky on whats in their copy vs what is in the box there is 200 other people ready to buy an Ender 3 at MicroCenter with a coupon.
I use high end J850 polyjet printers and many others from Stratasys, and honesty in their business isn't optional when they are dealing with medical companies, defense contractors, and other highly regulated industries. If they lie about a certain spec, it can mean a massive lawsuit for the company that ships out that part with that advertised spec that they get from Stratasys.
But you pay for it dearly with the cost of resin, filament, and powder, print heads, and all the other awesome consumables. That is where they make their money, that, and shipping out their stratasys techs to maintain your printers. But, they work. Plus our stratasys guy is awesome.
I just saw the Creality Falcon laser cutter engraver promo video.Great video with CGI but the claims are either not true of half-truths. ie it can cut 15mm in one pass....But at what speed. It can cut 0.05 stainless steel.....who needs stainless steel that's 1/20mm in thickness. Lots of usual comments about the laser beam shielding...Or the lack of it (no doubt they will spin something to say it's better as you can see the cutting better. That's why I went for the Elegoo Phecda Kickstarter for their laser cutter engraver version which is realistic in how it advertises and does have safety issues thought out a bit better..
Amen!
Was hoping to see a longer list.
Who would you have added?
@@3dpprofessor It's not about what I would add. It's just that I wish more companies were honest.
For me a honest company is Ultimaker.
I should do a Part 2 and mention them and Lulzbot.
I will add one. And it' a US company. Lulzbot. I have 2 TAZ 5 machines. Fully open source. Any part that fails, that is 3D printed, the file is there to download and print. And, if you only own 1 3D printer and it's the Lulzbot you need a part for, they do sell it. I contacted them for support and, next day flawlessly the answer. Great support. Also they have instructions on how to build your own toolheads. I built a E3D titan with a ,4 mm nozzle that used 1.75mm filament. The stock toolhead is a ,5mm nozzle that uses 2.85mm filament. I also read instructions and bought parts to build what they call a MoarStruder. You could buy it built or they have downloadable files to build your own. I built a Moarstruder that uses the .285mm filament on a 1.2mm nozzle for 4 times the speed rapid prototype. The definition of a final production part is not there but to rapid prototype and then move the file for .5 or .4 nozzle printing is awesome. So, I put a vote in for Lulzbot.
Lulzbot should absolutely have been on the list.
I'm in the wrong line of business. I should be a psychic. I knew you would get a subthread of comments that Prusa isn't honest. I knew it. I don't own a Prusa so I can comment so I won't. In general I expect no 3D Printer to attain the advances they claim. For example, auto bed leveling. I have 2 machines that claim they auto bed level and one that has assisted bed leveling. I'm not going to say which machines but I will say this. I choose to manually bed level. It seems I do a better and more careful job. Then I make, what I think, are logical choices. For example, do I want a machine with belts or lead screws. To me lead screws logically seem like they would be more accurate. Lead screws mean that the fast speeds will be harder to come by so that's the sacrifice. Also I prefer direct drive vs. bowden tube. That decision adds weight to the toolhead/printhead as the extruder in inside the printhead vs. at the other end of the bowden tube. That sacrifice slows my potential max print speed down. So, bottom line, I expect to have to tinker with any machine I buy and currently have. I expect periodic filament jams, I expect to replace nozzles, I expect to replace a PTFE tube that slightly melted due to printing in ABS. I expect ABS printing to always be a pain in the butt. So, when I see claims of "perfect first layer", "nozzles that will last x number of print hours", "the best designed printhead that won't have heat creep into the heatblock, etc." I expect to have to babysit and tweak any and all machines. So, making a determination of how honest a company is on building, selling, marketing, and supporting their machines is tough when people expect 3D Printers to just be a single pressing of a button, they walk away immediately, and expect perfection. And, it's 2023 people LOVE complaining. There should be an academy award for the best complainer on social media.
There's something to this. I wanted to follow this up with a video that was, basically, "how to tell when you're being lied it", but I realized it's difficult to set a baseline for what's possible when 3D printing already seems kind of impossible and magical. After "Yeah, you can hit go and get whatever you want", things like "and it'll print a benchy in 10 minutes" seems perfectly reasonable.
Lulzbot Is a honest player in the 3DPrinting game
Note:I do not make a cent over this comment
But figured it was worth mentioning
I should add them.
One that should not be on - Creality
I have one other company that still makes 3D Printers but I can't say if they are honest with their new products. 3D Systems. I bought a relic, 2012 machine, a piece of history that looked interesting. A cubify generation 2. It sold, new, for $1400. I saw the old youtube footage about what it does and it was not "really" honest. It has no heated bed and they claimed it could print ABS. Very very small ABS models it can print and I have printed cable chain links and those printed. But what impressed me is that I bought this cubify 4 months ago and the files the machine reads are ,cube files, not the ,gcode files. I contacted the company and they told me where I could grab the slicer software for this OLD old machines. I thought that was cool because I thought I would be only limited to printing the files on the supplied thumb drive. But I can slice what ever I need to, within reason. And it prints average, which is to be expected on a 11 year old machine.
I mean, they didn't lie when they said it could print ABS. They never said it could print ABS well.
I've heard some folks say you can mod them to take GCode, but I don't know if that's possible. I mean, if what you've got works, don't knock it.
I think Sovol have been upfront with their marketing, and I dont recall Voxelab ever promising something that wasnt delivered either.
Kudos to you Joe for highlighting this, honesty is a trait I very highly value in all walks of life and where we discover honesty we should celebrate it.
Welll.... For Sovol, see the blog post to my video about the SV06, my last full length video.
VoxelLab is just the bargain arm of Flashforge, so that tracks, though.
@@3dpprofessor I've had some pretty bad experiences with Voxelab, with both their FDM and SLA printers. The Voxelab Proxima 6 (same thing as the Flashforge Foto iirc) swapped out the mainboard from a chituboard to something much, much less capable in one of their hardware revisions without telling anyone (it couldn't load gcode files, or show the masks on the display, and locked you into their terrible slicing format/slicer) and the Voxelab Aquila had *three* different mainboard SKUs with different processors that needed different firmware that wasn't even open sourced yet. It was basically a grab bag, maybe you'd get one you could flash custom firmware for say, a bltouch on, or maybe you'd get one that you're stuck with the stock firmware (which didn't have even thermal protection enabled until way after launch). Not to mention my Aquila bed was considerably warped and my Proxima LCD panel died within the first week. I'd stick with something else if you're looking at Flashforge/Voxelab (at least on their lower priced options)
Disagreeing with the assessment on Flashforge. The "auto" leveling of the Adventurer 3 is garbage and there is no real way to even manually level the bed the way it's designed. I will NEVER buy another Flashforge product.
I find it's useful to do a test print that goes around all 4 corners and edges, and a little in the middle, and adjust from there. Then print and repeat until it's fully level.
I agree that "auto" probably wasn't the best word to use there, though.
Need a video on dishonest companies
I probably won't be doing a name and shame video. But I might do a "how to tell you're being taken for a ride" video.
Just to prove I didn't skip your sponsor, key wallet...
Looks to me that Prusa are wetting their pants about Bambu Labs and upcoming Creality K1 ....therefore pushed out Mk4 when development is not yet complete.
I received my P1P in 2 days and oh boy is this thing a speed demon, yet cheaper than a MK4 kit.
I have had PRUSA machines for years and no issues, but, the game has now moved on. Interesting developments from Prusa but bedslingers are not going to be the future.
I think that it's a combination of the Bambu eating their lunch and customers getting impatient with the tool changer.
And for consumers, this is a good thing. I'm rooting for Prusa, but I'm still using my Bambu.
Seems like a lot of people are lashing out because they feel like they're being backed into a corner...
It's not us vs them, It's them vs them. Sure we as consumers can take a stand and vote with our wallets but innovation and price will always win. Basically donating your money to an outdated platform is not going to do you favors in the future.
I'm a business person who relies on speed and quality. Only 1 machine can provide that consistently. We all know what this video is really about unfortunately and it's sad to see a fan base devolve into this. Ask for better, don't make excuses for.
Kind of odd to make a video praising Prusa for their honesty while MK4 is out with advertised Input Shaping, but actually not ready in the shipped firmware. Honest?
So, I might have recorded this before the MK4 came out, and I agree it kinda disappointed me to see them promising something as there that is coming.
This is kinda frustrating, but it's not like it's up in the air whether it's going to happen. Marlin input shaping code is already there, even if still somewhat experimental. It's going to be integrated by Prusa sooner or later, probably sooner, and in worst case community can do it because Prusa isn't one of the GPL infringers.
from prusa's blog "Since it’s all still under development, it also means that Input Shaper and Pressure Advance won’t be available in the shipping firmware. But I’m sure you’re eager to try it as soon as possible, so we will probably soon release an alpha firmware with input shaping and Pressure Advance in a few weeks. It won’t be as feature-packed as the full firmware, but you can play around with it until we merge the two branches. 🙂"
Or the 20 minute benches that's not possible with the printer, yet taunted as a feature? They wouldn't even send the g-code to people that asks for it, starting to think it's a 50%benchie or something...
@@lilypowerit possible with it current alpha of firmware that has input shaping
Some?
Many?
Sell the sizzle, not the steak.
Not a fan oft Prusa trolling his user base about the mk4 for an April fools joke and found it disrespectful. (I'm aware it was in development, and I'm aware he eventually delivered on it but my point still stands)
First April Fools on the internet? You'll get used to it.
@@3dpprofessor First comment you don't agree with? You'll get used to it.
@@TheNewBloodDan not even on this video.
Agree with your p.o.v. on the whole video. Loved the list and the fact you separate honesty from good product, this provode us the chance to choose what to backuo and what to... not. Also...Keep the full beard, but make it short. Seems like a lady's guy. 😅. Also you could pull a HarleyDavidson and look bad@ss. Lol.
You're very handsome!
My mom birthed me though, I don't know about this "God" guy xD
Oh, you should get to know Him. He's done more for you than you know.
Not much of a list, is it? You were better off saying "the only two honest 3D Printing companies" in the video. Something's telling me that this video isn't honest!
I hope you do "dishonest company" video also! and I respect your beliefs, but I am not religious... at least not for a long time anymore...
I mean, I want to remain positive. And I think there's different degrees of dishonesty.
Maybe a "how to tell when you're getting fleeced". Things like obviously photoshopped sample prints and the like.
Verbose. 4 times longer than it needs to be. I’ll never get those minutes back.
I apologize for my lack of succinctness. I do tend to ramble, and while these days brevity seems to be king, myself, i still enjoy just letting the stream of consciousness flow. There's something Zen like about it. That's why I don't write scripts. Though, if I did write a script first, maybe I'd be able to condense my thoughts into a more digestible format for you.
Plus, I just sound different when I'm reading a script, even one I've written myself, then when I'm just talking, and I think many people appreciate the more conversational tone. It's welcoming and develops a sense of comradery, even if a one sided one in real life.
That's what makes fairs and conventions, like the Rocky Mountain RepRap Festival that I just got back from, an interesting proposition. I'm meeting all these people who, like yourself, _I've_ never seen and, at most, barely interacted with, and yet they have had a rich, one-sided relationship. And many people understand that, and so they approach me with this sort of strange awkwardness. But I've learned over the years to just pick up on the relationship as they expect it.
But that's not the main point. The main point is I tend to make my point using too many words, when it could be done with fewer words. I get that.
Though, that reminds me of a time when a girl I was interested in challenged me to talk for 1 minute. No prompt, just make word noises with my mouth for a solid minute. And I did. No problem whatsoever. I mostly talked about how easy it is to talk for a mere 60 seconds and how 15 minutes would have been a challenge. Things like that. And apparently she was impressed by that because now she's my wife. So considering how well that worked out, you know.
You know you can watch my videos in 2x speed. I won't be offended.
@@3dpprofessor View at 2X? I was viewing at 2X. In any case, I'm not mad at anybody, just letting you know that there was too much there for my purposes. May the wind always be at your back and all your viewers delighted with your style. (which seeps into your messages as well as your videos)
anyone who produces a BILLFOLD and calls it a WALLET and is at least as old as i am if not a bit older is not to be trusted. was interested right up till that commercial now i dont care what you have to say, you just threw away your credibility
*That* threw away my credibility?
I think Prusa being more honest in their marketing might also be linked to them being in and from Europe. Whereas you seem to think that a salesman lying is normal, most in Europe will frown upon someone making huge claims without in-depth evidence and there is still a bit more control over how far statements in advertisements (at least in traditional media) can go. Things are moving in the same (bad) direction as the US and especially China though - as control over ads on the Internet is far less and honestly. Even Prusa now seems to go the bad route, mentioning and even boasting about important features (input shaping) yet then not having them implemented yet ... I think that stunt should make them drop significantly on your scale ...
I don't know if I want to chalk it up to culture entirely. After all, a lot of folks are impressed with Elegoo, and they're not from Europe either.
As for Prusa, on their blog and videos I knew that they were releasing the MK4 feature incomplete with updates coming later. So while that might not be what people want, in my book that's still honest.
Prusa just uses features in marlin its not prusa lol
Well and yes and no. Prusa marlin has almost nothing to do with marlin v1 anymore. Even the buddy firmware has significant changes.
If I heard correctly Prusa has about 20 people working on firmware. Quite an investment. Not just using features..
@@alanb76 Yes and they had to run a company in crisis mode. Broken supply chains, corona and so on. No chinese company invests in open source that way. They just copy and call themselves inventors lol.
@@alanb76 The number of people working on the project is not an indicator of the actual value contributed. Maybe these 20 guys just spend all their time rewriting what was already perfectly functional so that Prusa can claim they have unique code.
Do you Github? Because when they bring in features from Marlin it shows on their Github. Likewise when features they develop are incorporated into the main Marlin branch, it is likewise attributed.
I disagree with Prusa being the most honest 3D printer company. They wasted a lot of my time by not being honest about a problem I was having. If you want more information, please let me know.
Who would you say is the most honest 3D printer company?
I have only had a handful of 3d printers. Currently I have my MK3S+ and an Ender 3 Pro. I keep the Ender around just to mess with. The MK3S+ prints well and is a good printer. I just can't support them anymore based on my experience.
Anyway, I think Elegoo and Kingroon are honest companies and would buy from them again in the future. That Sliceworx KP3S looks great. I'm going to hold off buying another until after this wave of Corexy/Klipper printers.
I have really enjoyed your videos lately. Keep up the good work!
This was biased.
Rambling
And unscientific.
Intro was 50%
Content 5% outro 45% (felt).
It was rough to hear you praise the manufactures you work with. And the open source/drum for pruza .
Thanks for the engagement.
Obviously your lying to yourself and being dishonest if you believe prusa should be on that list. Sorry but you lost all credibility in my eyes.
For what? For being open about what features they will be adding in the future? If you read their blogs and watch their videos they've been very clear about all the features, current and future, that the Mk4 has.
@@3dpprofessor I can't help you if you can't see the obvious lies but meh
@@user-tj7xr6xd9z Sure you can. You just list them. You know, ennumerate.
pity yet Yep again advertising, what a pity!
Bla Bla Bla...
BHOEOEOEOeoeoe...
Thanks for the engagement.
@@3dpprofessor
Dear Mr. 3D Printing Professor,
it is of course nothing personal but it strikes me that everyone in You Tube land is in the Prusa advertising mode.
Be honest It's just very noticeable.
(and maybe I would do it myself! It depends on what it slides!) ;-)
Healthy and Friendly Greetings from the Netherlands!
Rob
@@hobbyrob313 You clearly haven't seen CNC Kitchen's video on the MK4. Or Layer by Layer's. Or Uncle Jessies. The consensus on the MK4 seems to be "It's good, but it's hard to recommend it when the Bambu is right there still eating it's lunch.
Lemme give you some intsight into *my* thought process in making this video. I had just made a video for one company where I had to bite my tongue about a feature they were promising, even recommending, that their hardware couldn't actually deliver on. Otherwise the printer was fine, but they felt they had to over promise on this feature to be competitive. Then, I was also in the middle of another review that, again, was maing marketing promises that their software in this case couldn't keep.
So instead of making a video where I am as mad as I can be and I make others mad too, I decided I'd go the other direction. I'd look for companies I'd work with that never let me down. So I made a list of every 3D printer manufacturer and looked at them from the aspect of Honesty. Only honesty. Whether Id had ever had to deal with broken promises from them. My initial thought was to discount anything coming from China, but I was grateful that hypothesis was show down when I went to the community.
Then I remembered *my* experience with the Prusa MK3s, how unexpectedly responsive and easy it was to use. Sure, their UI looked like the love child of an Apple IIe and a speak and spell, but it had features I didn't even remember them touting. I remembered that despite numerous delays on releasing their tool changer they always communicated what was going on. And even with the MK4, they were open about what features they had and were coming on their blog and videos where I was getting my information. About this time Josef also made a blog post about Open Source and it potentially doomed future, and it too resonated with me.
This video wasn't made to prop up Prusa. It was made in reaction to others and in my research I rediscovered Prusa. And, if you read the blog post in the pinned comment, you'll see I really wanted to include Bambu, but I'll let that post stand on it's own.
@@3dpprofessor - Hello Professor,
The message has arrived!
At one point I also had something like should I have written this?
But I also want to be honest
and I think quite a lot of attention is given to the Prusa's! ( not just only by you!)
(maybe I'm wrong, could be!)
BUT I'm not going to worry too much about it,
Don't do that either because it's not worth the effort for the rest!
Apart from all this, I hope the translation goes well and has gone oke!
I wish you all the best and success with your videos
best regards again!
Rob
There is a concept in Psychology called Beautiful is Good. I can't link in the comments to just Google "Attractiveness biases attributions of moral character, study finds" Basically most people automatically assume the moral character of a beautiful person to be good when in fact beautiful people have a standard distribution of morality. I think you are doing something similar here. To you, Prusa is beautiful and therefore you are attributing other good traits to that man/company which they did not actually earn. Good customer experience does not mean the company is honest. Those are not the same thing.
Prusa ain't beautiful. The i3 is an open air box that I had to assemble myself, and I still have trauma from that experience.
So what dishonest thing has Prusa done that you think it needs being taken down a notch for?
I think he's blocked and can't answer?
@@3dpprofessor I genuinely have a lot of respect for you and I know you love Prusa. I don't want to make you feel bad. That's not my motivation. There is so much love for Prusa but the flip side of that is extreme hate for anyone who doesn't drink the cool aid too. So, while your admiration feels good to you there is a dark side of it that I experience.
To directly answer you question Prusa copies everything. You may not have seen it but that great new feature on the Prusa XL (which is conspicuously missing on the I4) where the nozzle can detect a jam because of the load cell. That was copied from an Itallian 3D Printer company startup (I documented this in my XL video). That's just the latest example. Going back, everything about the Prusa is copied. So that's what I would claim is the primary dishonesty of Prusa. Taking credit for everyone else's innovations. The I4 is not the I4 It's the Prusa MENDEL Iteration 4. But they dropped the Mendel name long ago and now everyone calls moving bed printers "I3 style." I know what you are going to say "That's everyone else doing it, it's not Prusa." But Prusa doesn't correct or go out of their way to thank the original creators. They just want to maintain the status quo where they are using everyone else's hard work to earn $7 Million per month. Meanwhile how much does Ed Sells make for inventing the Printer that made Prusa rich? How much does Scott Lahteine earn for creating the Prusa Firmware? How much does Alessandro Ranellucci earn for creating Prusa Slicer? These guys get no credit or pay. Yet Prusa gets PAID and LOVED for being open source. But he/they use open source more than they contribute. Where are the I4 files? Did those get released yet? We all lose our minds when Creality delays releasing their files but when Prusa doesn't do it: Meh. No big deal. The love is out of control. It creates a double standard and that makes fertile soil for a tyrant to arise.
Does that sufficient sway you to take it down a notch?
@@DesignPrototypeTest Do you GitHub? Because nearly everything you're complaining about, the source of where certain changes came from and their incorporation into the designs and software, are all documented on GitHub.
Do you understand the concept of Open Source? Because you're calling using Open Source copying, which it's not. Well, it is, but it's open copying. It's not negative the way you're making it sound.
Also, do you understand the difference between reverse engineering and copying? Because they're not the same thing either.
And Scott is a great dude, and I love him. Dude's done more for 3D printing than I have. But IIRC he joined marlin project after Prusa forked it for their firmware (I think Jetty was still working on it back then). And when Scott's work gets incorporated into Prusa, it gets attributed on Github, and when he incorporates Prusa firmware into marlin, it also gets documented on GitHub. It's been a mutually beneficial, and very open, relationship.
Now, admittedly, Prusa's been a bit slow to update their GitHub here. Releases are tough. Let's give them a little time to make ti good before we pull out the pitchforks and torches.
@@3dpprofessor I don't GitHub. Neither do most. I've had commenters leave extremely negative words to me and then give credit for Trinamic technology to Prusa! They got this idea from the Prusa blog apparently. So the narrative continues: Prusa is the source of everything good in 3D Printing. When anything negative is said about Prusa it is punished or repressed but effusiveness like you display is rewarded. The whole group starts to sound like a religion. Non believers are ostracized. What do you think about me being banned from RMRRF? This is hobby robotics/engineering why are there tru believers here?
You say let's wait to get the pitch forks out. That's my point! The Pitch forks work for Prusa. Never have I seen a Mob criticizing Prusa. All criticism just kind of disappears. Why is Prusa the favorite son who we must love and not criticize? For example there is only 1 video on RUclips about the massive inconsistent extrusion issue. That's an instance where Prusa under delivered. But all you want to talk about is when they over deliver.
Elegoo sucks, they're too busy sending free printers to greedtubers to bother having any in stock to buy.
They're out of stock because people keep buying their machines. The amount they send out for marketing is pittance compared to their stock.
IF they were sending out so many, I'd have reviewed more than just one of theirs.
Honest? Not Prusa that's for sure, damn con aritsts.
Ah, yes. The con artist who writes blog posts and makes videos *before* the release of something explaining what you can expect. Devious.
@3dpprofessor
Well, it would have been more honest to tell that right away in their publicity instead of letting the consumer to do homework and investigate if their claims are true at launching date.
To me, that's walking a VERY fine line between lying by omission (on purpose, no less) and telling the truth, and honestly they are leaning more towards the lying side when doing those kind of stunts.
It's not a matter of "they are transparent because they told it... In their blog", but a matter of them hiding those facts in their blog instead of discussing them in the public area most people will only see: their ads.