Why So Many Students Drop Out Of German Universities
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- Опубликовано: 3 май 2024
- The drop-out rates at German universities are quite high, especially in admission-free degree programs at big classic universities. I want you to be prepared to study in Germany and be aware of the difficulties of the Bachelor's and Master's degrees.
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Finally someone says it. German Uni is hard. I went to Cambridge, Oxford and ENS Paris, but both mass universities I've been to in Germany have been much harder. And I'm talking about the humanities! Don't underestimate mass uni in Germany :)
Just don't go there. simple
Don’t go there ,nowadays it’s very hard to get admission in public universities
The problem isn't that it's hard. My MA studies in the US were *much* harder than any study I ever did in Tübingen, Marburg, or Heidelberg. The difference is that Germany does nothing to support students, and the quality of teaching is simply not that great. So, yes, it's "hard," but it's not academically more difficult.
@@preferanonymous Can you give an example of the support you mean?
@@preferanonymousAha, weird because my biomedical degree was a lot easier in the US than it was in Belgium. 😂
A comment on the thing you said about the first exams are the hardest at around 2:00 . In my experience the first exams seem pretty hard and have the highest failing rates. But the exams in higher semester are equally hard, but the fail rate is better because the below average students are already gone. So the exams are pretty much the same each semester.
Plus with time you simply learn how high the demands are. Some people go to university thinking they can just learn a few days for an exam like they did in school.
Exactly
Worst Thing is that when you live in Germany, People still tell you this Kind of Fairytale of University being the best Time of your Life where you have a lot of Free Time, collect Tons of new Experiences due to supposedly having a lot of Free Time and make Friends for Life, but when you actually start going you instead get an overwhelming Amount of Work and everything but that since People also come from a lot of different Places (I study in the Western Palatinate, but come from the Saar Region, some others do too but we live far apart in different Towns or Villages, we have someone from Brandenburg, a lot of People come from Baden-Württemberg too, Hesse or Northrhine-Westphalia and one Guy even comes from Central France. It's basically the polar Opposite of what you are made to think it's going to be.
I think those are the old ones telling you from their experiences because it was indeed amazing in those times but not anymore.
It depends on the subject. Social sciences for example are in general much easier compared to for example physics or mathematics. I studied business administration at my university and I already saw a massive difference between the specialisations students chose. Human resources and other subjects were you had practically no math were sought after and recommended to boost your GPA because they were free As and Bs. Calculation heavy specialisations were never recommendet, like fianance and accounting because As were nearly impossible. Some students got Bs, most however only landed on Cs and Ds, which still was good.
I took specialisations in tax, national and international accounting, and controlling. For every 4 ECTS I had to calculate an average of 1,5 to 2 weeks of learning time to get a grade C or better. In one specialisation we even had an exam about the whole semester (= 20 ECTS). Thankfully parts of the exam were already asked in other exams so I had only to learn for 6 weeks. On week of learning consisted of about 6-8 hour a day for 5 days a week.
In comparison to really hard subjects, I had an easy life. And then there are subjects like history or political science were you have to learn around 1 day per ECTS. Nobody takes theses students serious. Most of them also don't get a job. If they get jobs, they are poorly paid. Somebody I knew finished his master degree in history. In his first job he got paid so little, that he got additional payments from the government, so he has enough to survive. In comparison, I started as a controller and earned more than enough and it will get better really fast. 🙂
I don’t agree with your statement.
My study times were the best time of my life (I’m now on my 30s, I’ve started study computer science when I was 21).
For sure, it was quite hard working to get a degree but you will learn so much about yourself (what you can and what you can not). I had also a lot of free time when there was no lecture. During those times you are learning for exams, but after that you are free to do what you want. Most of the time after the exams I went to raves and drugged the shit out of my life.
Personally, hard working always pays out
Most importantly for me was to find a group of friends who is also hard working. It makes your life a lot easier, share knowledge and funny times.
Also really hard (and useless outside of teaching) is latin and ancient greek. I wouldn't hesitate to call them harder than math.
I studied at a German university and had an overall great time. Of course there were times with lots of work but there was also time for yourself.
Don’t forget that your study ends after 3 failed exams. (Edit in one course, not gernerally)
That's insane.
@@RayaanFaisal you think so? How is it in your college? I thought this is pretty normal 😀
You forgot to mention that if you get kicked out from particular program, it will no longer be available in other german universities
@@greentech58 yep, but I’m not sure if you can’t study anything that contains this module or you can’t study your subject/class anymore.
Well, I don't know, if it changed, but when I studied (2011-2019): After 3 failed exams, you are "endgültig nicht bestanden" (definitely not passed). 1. You get kicked out of the subject you re currently studying and 2. you are not allowed to study this subject again - 3. not only in Germany, in THE WHOLE EU.
As someone who has studied physics for 2 semesters at the University of Duisburg and Essen, I've personally witnessed and lived through hell in the 1st half of the year. The demands, even though you only had 4 classes to attend, were to some degree insane. The amount of hours I've had to put in just to be permitted for the exam is uncountable, especially as someone who isn't as gifted as some of the students were, also not to mention covid and that the school programs vary from school to school, which means that some were prepared a bit better for the hell in comparison to others(started as 100 people in the beginning, only saw about 35 during the exams). After 2 semesters I decided to change the major and the school and honestly it was one of the better decisions I have ever made.
Anything physics related at UDE really sucked. I feel you
I dropped out of Uni Stuttgart and went to Uni Basel in 🇨🇭. One of the best choices in my life. The Swiss system is not so different but very practical oriented in grading students. Plus there are only 17 students in my data Sc program and around 80 in the whole Mathematik und Informatik dept. As an Indian who now has studied in 🇨🇭,🇮🇳,🇸🇬,🇩🇪 universities, I honestly think unless you are studying something that you like and wish to pursue a career in, any course in any Uni in any country will be too challenging and strenuous.
Do u have any tips how did u apply in uni in Switzerland? Ty
Means German exams are difficult?
Your case is not considered as drop out because you after the dropout switched to different program so it rules it out
Bhai please how to get admission in Switzerland
Wow India is invading the west literally
I quit my business administration studies at LMU Munich after semester 4 (should have taken this decision after semester 3) and changed to another university at which I successfully graduated.
What I have to say about the first 3 semesters: The workload wouldn’t have been that crazy if there weren’t that many repetitive subjects. Many professors just wanted to hear EXACTLY what they wrote down in their scripts. If you weren’t able to repeat almost the exact same sentence, you failed the exam. For me, exactly these subjects were the challenging ones as it just consumed too much time to learn each sentence one by one - I therefore failed several times in these subjects. As you only have max. 8 semesters to finish your bachelor degree, the pressure got too high for me and I decided for a restart. All subjects which focused on deeper understanding, I didn’t have problems.
So from my point of view: The bachelor system also plays a significant role as it’s too much focusing on repetitive learning. I wish there would be more time to deeply dive into a topic, but that’s sadly not the case in German university bachelor programs.
Finished my computer science degree, lots of people just enrolled for the money and were not able to identify AT ALL. They simply didn't enjoy the topics and therefore had no motivation, which eventually led to their dropout. Even though university in Germany is almost free cost-wise, you should carefully consider your decision, after all you are investing your time. It has been very demotivating to see that lots of people just didn't care about anything and were not into tech, didn't contribute to group projects and overall were dissatisfied. Even though it therefore was often rough, I still can say with 100% certainty that Computer Science was the right choice for me and that this is NOT only a job, but also my private life and my hobby. I don't need much, therefore money isn't too important for me and I am glad that I can fully identify with my course of studies and job and hope it will always stay like that!
I graduated from TUM doing my masters in computer science. I think you raise an important point that the university does seem to accept anyone meeting the basic requirements, but isn't very selective. I can see the merit behind this, however in my experience it also sucks because in uni, you typically do group projects, or perhaps network with people and so on, but I found many people in my masters program that lacked even the basics, as well as just not having any interest. So I think this policy can be detrimental to the student.
Additionally, there are some points one can talk about when critiquing German universities. I think the education system itself is old/backwards, in most universities around the world, the coursework is divided among a final exam, midterm, quizzes, assignments, projects if applicable, etc. often times the final exam has a weight of 35-40%. In my experience in TUM all courses gave a 100% for the final exam :) I think it simply makes more sense to evaluate the student on their performance along the whole semester and not just the final exam.
Not to mention, the final exam itself often relies on memorizing (you hear the phrase "learn by heart" a lot), I also didn't notice this in other unis.
All in all, this is my personal experience as well as my personal opinion, but I believe there can definitely be some reforms to the German higher education system.
a reform is definitely needed, but 'learning by heart' also depends on the subject. When you study philosophy or the like, 'learning by heart' is more or less impossible, while in physics or such, where there is definite factual knowledge you can learn (like formulas), it is easier for professors to make up exams where you only have to write down the answers you have learned before and pass with even good grades. But of course and as you say, that should not be the only thing you learn.
Traditional academic universities in Germany are rigorous/un-compromising. This is uniformly true across all, even in low-ranking, "unknown" universities, unlike other countries where there might be a big discrepancy in difficulty and grading between elite and ordinary universities.
I know a friend who was doing bachelor's in physics at a "no name" university, and applied for an internship at University of Cambridge. Even the professor there was surpised that we learnt pretty advanced maths in 2nd year undergraduate physics (Lie algebras, representation theory).
The problem is not academic rigour, but lack of support (depending on student size). I went to a very small university and could get in touch with professors more easily.
Still, people regularly dropped-out from programs, due to changing interests or wanting something more hands-on (e.g. at applied universities (FH) or work placement (Duales Studium). This is perfectly fine because there is no financial pressure to finish a program which doesn't suit you. The society also doesn't need everyone to master abstract theories or become a thinker/researcher.
I think the reason lays in it being free for the most part. People just try here and there with less ambition for a year or even just chill. Its not my case? Who cares ill just change the subject and i dont gotta pay a ton of money for doing it
"prestigious" doesn't mean anything in the job market. It's just about the marks and the subjects, and a degree is a degree. It's actually a good thing that students fail early, so little time is wasted, and there's also no stigma. It's absolutely ok to fail in physics, just choose something else that fits better. How would you have known earlier? No way. Many students make good use of this freedom.
I completed my computer science diploma in the 90s and currently study for a second time. What I really see that the math knowledge of the young students is ... very low. It seems that schools don't teach math anymore like they used to. Of course then math in all MINT courses is overwhelming, but unis offer "Brückenkurse" that you can attend before starting your proper courses to get your math brought up to what you will need. Use them.
And by the way, you don't need to go to uni. Vocational training is really good in Germany.
Actually the admission free degrees are quite advantageous. U don’t get punished for not having perfemormed perfectly in Highschool. So everybody get a chance and the most ambitious people deserve the chance to continue the degree and not the one with the best Highschool grades. In addition it’s nice that anybody can take a look inside the first semester of a degree and decide to continue or not ( but yeah u have to prove it in the first 2 )
Well you could also do tests before the study so everybody has the same chance (you can repeat the test). So the study doesn’t have to be so hard. But NC isn’t pretty nice, you’re right. But just bc a study is with NC it doesn’t mean, that everybody succeeds or it’s easier, just because not everybody comes in.
In Italy is the same, in first year of computer engineering we were 250 students, 2 years later only about 80 of us "survived"; and also mine is supposed to be a 3-year degree but the analytics of my course at my uni say that on average it takes people 6 years to graduate because of those first crazy exams😢
I studied in Italy (Cagliari) and Germany (Mainz) and I can tell you it's no match, German education is much harder but I would say the quality of education is also higher.
@@issamikbi3337 Well it depends on which part of Italy you studied. If you had studied in Milan, well trust me, German Uni is almost a piece of cake above all compared to universities in Berlin.
Dropped out in the first semester because my Grandpa has cancer and they wouldnt allow me to put another semester to the basic seven to have time to care for him and be there for him in his probably last months when he is one of the reasons i got this far. The profs and some students even kinda said: Your carreer is more important just let that old boomer die, money and science is more worth than a Human life. So i said to myself: Im a student that aces every grad but Family cant be buyed with money. If it wouldnt be for my gradpa i would probably be without a job and probably would never gotten out of my depressen. He showed me the fun of gardening work and kinda what to live for. And guess what...i got a job with great salary now with a lot of trust and Responsability reserved usually for Engineers (i still got the knowledge just not the nice paper). You just have to look for mid sized Companies instead of the Large Corps like Porsche or Mercedes. And in a few years i go for the "Techniker" a Title similar to an Engineer. And now i still have time to care for my Grandpa and i never want to go back to a University. Money can buy you a lot but Family, Love and Real Friends are things that cant be bought.
Ehrenmann
Much respect 🫡
Thx for the heart and tbh it wasnt an easy choice for me but looking back i dont have any regrets at all
As someone that was sorted out in the first year by this system, I am grateful that it is that way. It made me stop and think "do I really want this?" and I cant imagine what I would be like today, had I decided to push through.
The German education system is divided into three tranches, but it is very transparent and permeable even after training.
I am the perfect example of this.
At the age of 14, I finished my primary school education. For family reasons, I then had to take up an apprenticeship and train as a cook. I broke off this apprenticeship because, as I will explain in a moment, it did not suit my talents. I then learned the profession of radio and television technician, which I practiced for about 4 years. After that, the German state allowed me to catch up on my intermediate school leaving certificate (BAS) and then I was also allowed to catch up on my high school diploma (BOS). During this time, I received financial support from the state so that I could concentrate on school. After graduating from high school, I began studying computer science and mathematics at the Technical University of Munich, which I successfully completed. I then got a doctoral position at the TUM (Technical University of Munich) and completed this course with a Dr. rer. nat. (Phd) The German state tries to promote talent and does so with great success.
Now try Switzerland. Up to 50 % of all students drop out in the first year.
That's crazy. Do people in Switzerland switch universities often?
@@maxyoko That's the problem. If you drop out of one university, you're banned from accessing another university in Switzerland.
@@jankaufmann4305 Even if it's a different degree?
@@maxyoko There are two kind of universities in Switzerland (A and B). A is harder than B. If you fail a test twice in your degree, you will be banned from studying this degree in every university of this category. If you fail at University B, you can't study everywhere obviously. If you fail at A, you could change to B. But you would need to start from over agian. Not that it does matter - it's still inhumane. I know students who have been studying five years and then were banned because they simply having troubles in one class. It's insane.
Or try the system they had back then in East Germany...
It was sorting the wheat from the chaff on a high level.
studying physics in Bavaria in the late 90s wasn't any better.
But do you really want an engineer, lawyer or doctor to "just pass" even if his capabilities are mediocre at best? Even if we don't like to hear it, not all of us can run marathon, do the 100m in 10s or play Champions League - and not all of us are smart enough to really earn a university degree.
Thank you for your time, actually I spend my whole childhood in Germany and then before highschool started I came back...Now I'm planning to go again after college and I know lots of things changed there- all I'm doing now is to keep my german language fluent till now
Hey I'm German with a chinese background and I have to warn you that Germany is developing backwards. Regardless of your worldview, it's statically proven that we become poorer, dirtier and more criminal.
I would like to add a few of my cents as a graduated physicist and now PhD student at the RWTH University. First thing out of the way, most of the video is correct, most of the things described apply to the RWTH as well. Many science courses don't have any (difficult) entrance exams at all, physics for example. The "extremely difficult" first semesters are by design, but they are rarely unfair (in physics at least), i.e. the subjective feeling of something "extremely difficult" has two sides: The difficulty of the exam and the skill level of the student. Our secondary school system, the Abitur, frankly sucks. It is getting worse every year and is underpreparing students for the workload and the mindset that needed for engineering and science. In fact you see a massive decline in drop-out rates after the first two semesters. This has nothing to do with the curriculum itself but everything with the students' study habits. The downsides of this filtering system are obviously that students loose time until they realize that they aren't made for university, on the other hand this process is much more rigorous (and under the student's control) than a single entrance exam. You experience alot more during a whole semester and the sum of all parts shows you a better picture in my opinion.
Edit: Some more statistics about physics (at the RWTH): about 16% of all first-semester students pass all exams in the first two semesters, and one or more failed exams during that period increases the likelihood of dropping out by a whopping 40% (forgot the source sorry).
My experience was the same in the beginning of year 2000 I started my (one of the last diploma-) Fachhochschul-studies with 100 students in Semester 1.
Math, Physics and stuff was crazy and workload was high which made 60 less convinced/motivated students leave until semester 2.
It was good to get rid of all these people because in Semester 1 our lessons were frequently disturbed by loud chatter and laughter. From Semester 2 on it was quiet and we could finally focus on our subjects
You mention a real problem. German Unis are made for adults... but kids apply! In the past, students were more matur adults. Due to 13 years + military service, working experience... etc. . Even apprenticeship for example. Guys like me even finished several years apprenticeship. Ok, not much at Uni but Fachhochschule. It is really a differences to have childish boys of 18 at the Uni or young men, 21+ !
I studied physics in Germany myself and it is by far one of the hardest subjects to study. I know most people want to believe that every subject is similar in difficulty but that is just not the case. Around 80% of our physic students left in the first two semesters and most of them started studying something different. Most of them felt like a huge burden had been taken from them and their new subject was much easier and more relaxed.
Many people rate German universities pretty low because we do not have "elite universities" like many other countries. The overall quality of our academic landscape is still pretty good though. The biggest difference is the amount of money that is put into your academic field. German universities usually do not get money from super rich ex-students but are publicly funded. That is why some German universities really struggle financially.
This is the consequence of offering free education. It's a brutal but very fair system. A degree should be earned. I prefer this over the American pay-to-win system. Being able to adapt quickly and be persistant enough to overcome challenges is the most important skill a university should teach you. Without this skill you would fail in your future job even with your degree.
Life is hard, man. To me, the German education system doesn't seem too bad. Back in my days, there weren't much of such complaints:
In Germany, anyone who meets the entry requirements can attend university without paying fees. This makes education accessible regardless of social status or family wealth.
German universities tend to filter out students in the first semesters.
As a company, we receive CVs from candidates all over the world. During interviews, we occasionally wonder how some candidates obtained their degrees, especially those from countries without alternative education systems to produce qualified employees.
Germany, like some other European countries, offers an excellent dual education system that produces some of the most talented and competent workforces in the world.
Not everyone needs to go to university.
There are some Points you missed:
- If you want to change your Degree and recieving BAföG, you need to drop out before the 3rd Semester to continue recieving it.
- You don't need a Degree in Germany for a good Career. People learning a Craft (in the widest Sense) often earn as much as many People with a Degree.
True. But a professional choice is more then just about money. Future prospectives, working conditions, ability to move around.. All this is relevant. And it is to mentiion that many degrees are just of professional kind, e.g. murcing or early child education, some IT degrees. In some other countries you get bachelor degree in these professions but in Germany it ist vocational education.
still, 2/3 of the people with a uni degree earn more than people with an 'Ausbildung'sdegree, but I'd assume that will change in time when more and more people have useless BA degrees
I am one of the German university students who dropped out to start their career off instead with Ausbildung (a more practical job training and qualification). I underestimated what it means to study Computer Science. Unless you are really really passionate about abstract Maths, this is pure torture.
This is how it should be. Not everyone should be able to get a higher degree. Look at the US, your universities are so easy that the degree is just worth nothing.
In Psychology it was hard, but in a different way. Here, the admission requirements were extremely hard (Abitur of 1,4 or better). The courses itself where not that hard, BUT we were put on an extremely high pressure regarding grades - basically anything worse than 1,7 was not good enough in order to have chances to get a decent Master. I personally have a grade of 1,63 for my Bachelor, which is just under the average of Psychology Bachelors in Germany (1,68). And since many Masters do have a Numerus Clausus of 1,2 or 1,4, it's hard (if not nearly impossible) to get accepted. I am looking for a Master in a familiar field rn, as these usually have a NC of 2,5 and Psychology students have very good grades in comparison to students of other Bachelors.
yeah i wanted to do psychology too, impossible if you are average in school (i had an abitur of 2.5). i went to the netherlands and got my degree there (it was taught in english)
i am currently studying biochem at TUD and finding the curriculum challenging, but giving up on my dream is not an option.
It's supposed to be challenging! Germans find it challenging too. Challenges are to be mastered. Do continue!
@@HS-wp5vb yess thanks 💪
D for Dresden or D for Darmstadt? :) As a Darmstadtian myself I was appalled at the branding clash when I discovered it, but I guess it goes both ways... 😅
@@Marc42 Dresden
A major aspect is also the alternatives to university in Germany. People could also choose to go with proper job training instead, which many countries do not offer in such a broad way.
Yes, I did an apprenticeship previously to TU. It really helped much. Especial boys... should do an apprenticeship... because they are almost all kids, aged 18/19. To start to study at the Uni 20/21 with a skilled worker diploma got some advantages.
1. You are an adult, used to fulltime jobs...
2. No further practica needed
3. No need to do unskilled student jobs...
4. The technicians at the Institutes respect you... they allow you to use the tools, ... etc.
are*
Brother can you make a detailed video about job prospects and application for cs bachelors from public uni .It would be a great help because I can not gather much info on that from my country but i want to make everything sure before coming
you mean job prospects for working in Germany with a German CS-BA-degree? They are good. Quite good, I assume. Most German unis are public and that is in no way bad, it is absolutely normal in Germany for a uni to be public and not private. The most prestigious universities in Germany are public universities. Some employers might even be wary of certain private universities because some of them - not all! - might be considered to be open for those who where not good enough to get into the public unis and now their parents have to pay for their degree because they would not get it out of their own merit. Many universities are especially known for certain subjects, for example, law at Heidelberg university has a very good reputation, while Goethe university in Frankfurt seems to be known for sociology. Most employers in Germany don't care at which uni you got your BA in CS, unless you have REALLY high ambitions or are looking for something very, very specific.
The German uni system is organised differently from the US and that sometimes f***s up the rankings (QS, times higher education, etc). Most universities will be considered 'good enough' in Germany, especially if you want to work in the industry and not in academia. But it is important to maybe do some internships, volunteer work or side jobs and gather first experience in the workplace and start forming contacts and acquaintances who may give you your first job or recommend you to someone.
I did a BA degree in arts and humanities at a small no name university and did a little bit of paid journalism work, volunteer work in event and culture industry and side jobs and I usually get invited if I apply to jobs or internships within my profile of work. The last job I turned down because I decided to continue studying and pursue a PhD
And never forget: Germans LOVE certificates, stamped and signatured, for whatever you are certified in or for. If you can get your hands on a certificate, do it, even if it is only a one week course in excel or some programming language or whatever and did not really teach you stuff.
Finally a video about how hard german student lifes are. Its normally always about japanese or other asian students how hard they have it.
A fab video, very helpful 👍🏻
Appreciate it 🫶
Very good video and summary! I want to give my mustard to it, as we say in Germany: (its a long one)
Right now iam studying robotics engineering in also a well known school in terms of Robotic Championchip cups like the robothon etc. and i can agree with pretty much everything what was mentioned in the Video.
Firstly i want to say that, I did my Abitur at a "Kolleg" which is for people with jobexperience or a finished apprenticeship (or minimun 2 years of working in that field) who want to educate themselve further and for a better future/possibilitys due to the given high school diploma you get there if you finish with success.
I was always a tech nerd and in the last year of my Abitur i was given the chance to build a robotic hand with the help of a 3D-Printer. I had alot of hurdles to overcome but i was able to finish the project, enjoyed it and learned so much from it.
So i wanted to know if there was a studying field in that direction. And there was it, actually just down the road where i did my Abitur was the University, who offered next to various other studies, also robotic engeneering.
So I signed up and got accepted. Given that, that i was always mediocore in math, but better in physics generally i still was kinda afraid but also curious what lectures await me in that kind of direction.
Generally it can be said, the subjects and exercise got absurdedly harder from month to month. I remember that in our programming course (we started with C++, God knows why...)
the first task was just to programm a simple Calculator, something like a ~12 line Programm who can do simple addition, substraction, division and multiplication. 4 Weeks later we should programm a complex sensoric system, in which a warning and self regulating mechanism should be activated when 1 of the 3 rooms was below a certain temperature threshhold + showing how much of the heating liquid was still in the tank.
High workload was another thing: It was expected from you to put in a minimum 40h a week into university and it would be the best if you would be active in several communitys from the school. We once had a presentation about the Robothon and the presenters were asked, how much someone should invest in the week if they´re interested, as the person who asked the question additionaly mentioned, that he could do 4-5 hours probably. And they just said "Ehhh... 4-5 hours might be to little."
Additionally to that some people don´t get "bafög" so they need to put some extra hours of work into their life to maintain it.
What i always thought was weird is, when professors brag about their course and then they say, that they have a 50-70% fail rate at their course. "Congratulation, you suck at you job." is always my very first thought. Tho it needs to be said, that some professors just read from their Powerpoint and don´t give a sh*t about the University and the studying experience of the students. But others are just a blessing and really do want to help the students.
Probably my favorite quote from Professors next to "Then the answer is pretty easy to see.*professor looking at his note* " [after writing the most complext theorem in existence]
I have no doubt that Professors know alot in their fields, but some can´t teach. They better should´ve stayed in the research-sector etc.
After i did succeed and completed my first and second semester I came to the conclusion that University isn´t for me. For me personally its the lack if practical excersice, next to the (in my mind) often unnecessary workload it is given to you. Iam now in my third semester and it will be my last. I always thought a gap year was unnecessary, as i kinda saw it as a time waste. But now iam in that position and i think a gap year is a pretty good idea! I still like engineering and will definetly keep it as a hobby, same as programming, but can´t find the motivation to study further in that field and only a few lectures with some professors still keep me joyous on some days.
What really spoke out of my heart was your "The less practical it becomes, the more you don´t really know what you´re going to become later or what you´re studying for [...]."
We had around 2 practical lessons per semester and the best one yet was a "Cobot lab-report" in which you actually programmed a industrial robotic arm with others and solved little tasked that are actually used and useful in an industrial work environment. Best day i had in the university as it was a really good simulation.
Thanks for the Video! I hope everyone who keeps studying or wants to study will find their field of passion. I hope you´re taking care of yourself. GL in the exams :)
I always said the hardest part of studying is organising you studies. Figuring out what you need to do and in which order and managing your time well is the most difficult. Once you get a hang of that and it will get a lot easier and manageable.
I can tell you that usually it is only the first through third semester that is the hardest, at least in engineering. They teach you the basics and little about the actual topic. Once you make it past the third or maybe forth semester it usually get easier. Not because the classes are easier, but because you get used to the methodology.
I want to point out the pressure only applies to certain degree programmes. It´s mainly the big STEM / MINT and engineering bachelor degrees that use "Rauswurfklausuren" (very hard exams to make sure a lot of people fail them to ensure there is enough capacity for future courses). Some exams even get graded compared to your competition.
I personally have completed a STEM / MINT bachelor degree at RWTH Aachen University (Yep, that one is also known for insane exams, just like TUM) and still doing my masters degree there as well, but my degree is different: It has an NC (Numerus Clausus) / not-admission free / "zulassungsbeschränkter Studiengang". You basically need a specific average grade on your Abitur / highschool diploma to even get into the Bachelor´s programme in the first place (the required grade depends on how big the capacity is and the pool of applicants for that degree in this specific year), same for a "zulassungsbeschränkter Masterstudiengang" where your average bachelor grade has to be good enough to get into the programme. This meant that there were roughly 100 people at all starting a new degree each year, not couple of hundreths if not thousands like the engineering degrees.
While I admit University expects a lot from you and you will have to spend a lot of time on your degree, I personally have never seen one of those Rauswurfklausuren myself. The highest I ever encountered was 40% fail rate, and then maybe 20% fail rate for the 2nd worst (mostly Bachelor exams in the first 1-3 semesters). Those exams usually expected us to get at least 50% of all available points to pass (grade 4.0).
What I want to tell you with this: It entirely depends on your chosen field and even the very specific degree programme that can vary vastly between universities. Inform yourself before you do your programme and compare them between the different universities (at least when you are willing to move, for me personally it was clear what universities were my only options).
Thank y so much for the video
You're welcome!
Traditional Hungarian and German system are quite similar. 20% knowledge, 80% stress tolerance. If you are good at the latter, you'll probably graduate even if you are not Einstein but merely a hard-working guy. Drop-out rates at Hungarian universities were absurdly high especially in the early 2000s when they set the admission threshold to a ridiculously low level. The universities needed the insane number of students just for the money they get for them, and, after a few semesters, they just let them drop out.
Having read some old Oxford exam sheets in my subject area, I found out that they are much more practice-oriented. Moreover, you are free to choose from 2-4 groups of questions. You still have to study a lot, of course.
Hey Max - first time viewer and your experiences sound VERY familiar! Happy to see you are enjoying your new degree. I also studied physics at LMU a couple of years ago, right after graduating from high school. I wasnt good in school, because I was kinda arrogant and thought that I would just start to learn, when its really worth learning, like at university. Which was absoutely stupid. I got blown away by the workload of the first two semesters. Everyone was struggeling and they said, after the 3rd semester, it would be easier and also more fun because we could start to specialize. Dropped out after the 3rd semester. Its embarrassing, but I didnt even take a single exam. I always got so stressed before exams that I couldnt sleep for days and was seriously getting stomach problems. Was the best decision ever. Moved to another city. Took a half year off, started studying geosciences. Also very hard the first semester with a huge workload, even more than in physics actually. But as you said, it was also more practical. Finished my bachelors during corona, a bit later. Now writing my master thesis in planetary geodynamics. I wanted to do something with astrophysics, so It kinda all worked out for me. Hope it will also work out for you.
Again top video max .Would be great if you made a video completely for students who want to pursue Masters or MBA from Germany.
Thank you :)
One of the most serious social issues with our university system is class. If your parents (and/or other people in your family) were academics and went to university, you are much better prepared and have a far better chance of making it. It's just far easier if you can get support from your own family, because school is not really preparing you for working by yourself.
I was lucky, both of my parents had doctorates in the field I went in later, so I learned how to search for research papers in 11th grade in school, how to structure essays and could always come to them if I had any questions regarding my degree. Both work in unrelated fields now, but even with information 20 years out of date, this was just so much help for me. Comparing this to my friends, a lot of whom came from families where no one went to university at least a couple of generations back, they had no support at home and some even had to fight with their parents to contiue studiyng, or they would be cut off from money. (Yes, we have BaFög in germany, but it's actually hard to get that when your parents are not cooperating, because they are supposed to pay you depending on their income, and you have to prove that they don't)
Sorry if I went a little off topic here, but I still find this part of the problem is not talked about enough. I basically got 6 CP in my first 2 semesters and had to repeat basically everything. I would not have been able to do that without the help of my parents, and I still managed to graduate with a grade of about 2.0.
Unfortunately, too many people study in Germany who are in fact not capable of doing so. That's why there are high drop-out rates. Many would be better off in vocational training (Ausbildung) that is more practically oriented. You can also earn very well with an Ausbildung degree. Unfortunately, it is wrongly said that studying is better than doing an Ausbildung, but that certainly is not true.
Sort of, but most other countries have even higher rates of college education than Germany.
In the US a degree can be anything from complete trash to world class education. In Germany even the most random FH has to follow a certain quality standard, otherwise they wouldn't be permitted to grant a degree.
So naturally a lot more people drop out, because the bottom tier of 'diploma mill' type universities doesn't exist.
Well, take a look at some others statistics, the small number of students who attended German universities some decades ago and the large number of students who are enrolled today. That is a HUGE difference. Why is that? Well, take a look at the small number of German Abiturienten in the past and the large number of German Abiturienten today. That is a HUGE difference as well. Anyone who is familiar with the education system in Germany knows about the "inflation of top grades" in German Abitur. So, how does that effect these students? They think they are genuises with these kinds of grades. Until they hit university, that is.
I think another aspect to all of this, which ties into the "practicality" aspect and the high standards and feeling overwhelmed, is that we also have the option to do an apprenticeship instead. I am doing an apprenticeship in software development (I also dropped out of high school due to mental health issues, because I knew that I had an alternative option), but most people I've met in my apprenticeship are in fact not people who dropped out after 10th grade and immediately went into the apprenticeship because they already knew exactly that they wanted this career path. No, the VAST majority of the people I've met are somewhere between 21 and 26 (with one out of 30 still being 17 at the start of the apprenticeship and some people even being in their 30s, married and with children) and had started studying something like computer science and were either overwhelmed or just realised that this wasn't a good way for them to learn. Others had started or even finished their degrees in things like sociology and then didn't know what to do with such a pretty useless degree.
And then of course there are also those who went through several different career paths and ended up here.
I plan to study in germany in the coming years. I will be coming from a non-eu country. What happens to my visa, if i,lets say, wanted to change my degree programm. Some Studiengangs beginn only on wintersemester so i have to wait a semester before i enroll again. Would this invalidate my visa? Do i have to go through admissions from zero or can i do that within the uni's system
thanks in adnvance for answer
Bro ask the student representation of your university, they will know. Don't ask this on RUclips, you might get false answers
Most Universities also offer intro courses and orientation weeks. Some Orientation weeks are meant to help you choose the correct study program for you, others will help prepare you for a specific program. I strongly urge evey new student to visit both of those, if possible also at multiple universities. It might look like a lot of work / time wasted, but they are most of the time organized by students, and meant to start you off by socializing with other new students, as well as give you an overview over what you can study and how you can study.
Can confirm every single point he made. I studied physics for three semesters at RWTH. German final school exams is very easy compared to other countries, so I excelled and thought it was going to be easy. Oh boy was I wrong. This semester i switched to Computer engineering science but feeling like a complete failure really hurt.
A fellow Aachen depression enjoyer.
I think high school exams is fairly easy in every country. I took A level's
I still dont even realy know what i want to study(and only have like 2 months left to decide xd) just that it is some area of computer science with alot of math involved(am quite talented at everything related to math), and hearing about studying in Germany pretty much confims what i know/think about it(like that the beginning is brutal, likely even more so since if i study something that has alot to do with math, I likely wont accept anything less than close to perfection in the exams(but if i dont have fun than thats gonna be pain)), hope i will atleast have some fun doing this.(not just annoyence)
I too when I came here in October 22 heard a lot about how difficult the degree is and how so many of my seniors are struggling. But, I say this with all humility after 3 sems and completing all my modules apart from thesis, that its not as hard it was made out to be. It's just the atmosphere of negativity and pessimism that gets to the new students. All it takes is a bit of planning and a little hard + smart work at the correct time to complete your subjects. All the best guys. Don't be bogged down by the crowd. You guys will do it.
But despite all this, I would say that ironically the subject I'm studying is supposed to be practical, but there are not many choices in terms of practical subjects in the modules that can be taken. The ones that are offered have 25 seats for a class of 300 students(per batch). So its kind of mismanaged imo. Also there's not even a mandatory internship available in the course. That is making it hard for a person like me who came here directly after my bachelors for my masters. Despite me having good grades and completing my subjects on time, I'm not getting many job interviews and internship interviews. Its the chicken and egg thing here, were they are taking people who already have experience, but no grades and credits. So, I do feel a bit hopeless that despite working hard I'm not getting the results I want. But, I'll keep working till the lady Luck smiles upon me!
lol, completed bachelor's in physics and doing a master's in computer engineering, Since I love application-level things
German here. I had a friend who first trained as an industrial mechanic before going to university. He told me that his first semester was very easy for him because he had already learned a lot in his vocational training.
I got a skilled worker diploma previously to Uni also. I can't say it was not hard... but to be used to a fulltime job really helped. 😉
Thats what equality of opportunity looks like 😊
I got into BSBI, I am enrolled in BSC hons in computer science and digitisation(English course) Do you think it’s worth it? I have studied computer science in my country for 3 years and I am familiar with programming languages and concepts, I have built projects on my own and I have pretty good grades, so is scoring good grades really difficult in Germany? I am very scared and excited as well. It would be really nice if you guide me a little bit please ❤️
Hello Max, are students from NC programs also drop out their course like that?
As I said in the video, yes also students from NC programs drop out
But not as frequent as admission free ones
@@maxyoko thanks
I love your videos so much, so apt, please my question is, am a mom looking to do my masters in Germany, please can I come with my baby when coming over for masters. I can't keep her and apply later because she is a year old, please do respond
Thank you
Its all about motivation. I was mediocre at school but finished my master in economics in munich 25 years ago. It was hard as you describe, i simply loved what i was doing. That was the key i think.
I completed a bachelors both in TUM and in another not as well-known technical university in Germany. Both were extremely hard, but TUM was clearly in a league of its own
Respect 🫡
RWTH and TUM are known for their insane programs. Avoid if you dont wanna lose all your hair.
Roughly 35% of students drop out of university in Quebec - the rest of Canada seems to fare better. 30% drop out of bachelor, 40% out of masters, 50% out of PhD's... I am not sure if it's because Quebec uni's are hard, it might be a combination of several reasons - lack of recognition of university degrees in the job market, lack of opportunities in the job market, cost of life during studies, cost of studies (very low in North America, but still high compared to Europe). What I have seen in engineering studies: exams are made hard, but in a way that creates attrition, without much intellectual, practical or professional justifiability for the difficulty. Same issues apply in other disciplines like nursing...
Well… universities really don’t know why people drop out either. It’s hard to mitigate. Studies on this will be more frequent in the future.
First semester exams being very hard is common as, like you said, it makes sense. But at the same time, we need more physicists and mathematicians.
You cannot make a mathematician or pysicist if the person is not determined and intelligent enough. Better teaching this lesson early.
@@Gabriel-gw6gb Sure, but the way the subjects are taught (especially maths), is in many cases asinine.
Max ! which is better vocational training or pursuing a degree in a uni ?
Both are good. It depends on what your goals are
I started to study at a German private university at the age of 31 after being in the army for 10 years.
The start wasn't easy just because I wasn't used to reading so much stuff.
But now I'm about to finish it with a BA.
And it's actually not that hard. I do a ton of other stuff on the side like content creation and freelancing.
Idk... maybe it's the difference between a private university vs a public one.
I do everything from home.
"Many are called but few are chosen" philosophy application is being implemented by the German education system. I also applied to a German FH (Applied Science Uni) which offered a master's design program as I hold a bachelor of design degree but faced an immediate rejection before the aptitude test and selection started. In the final decision letter, they mentioned my admission process as a disappointment. Before this, I had to get my document verified by APS in my country since German uni receives large amounts of applicants from India (my home country) & SE Asia which took some time & get an IELTS Academic score of 6.5. Meanwhile, I also had to pay application fees. The total cost of the process is equal to the entry-level salary of a typical working professional in my country.
But why did they reject your application ?
@@avi......2091 Germany is very strict about qualifications. Even no-name universities here have to follow rigorous standards, otherwise they won't be permitted to hand out degrees.
In other countries, there is no such process, a Bachelor's degree can be anything from complete junk to world class.
So if you want to get into a German Master's program, they will assess your degree first and if you don't meet the criteria, your degree isn't considered valid.
@@marceldiezasch6192 all crap , my friends with bachelors from low class unis easily got into germany
Hey bro how is the job situation in Germany for international students? Also is Gottingen university good?
waht about the management and technology program at TUM? Does it also have high drop out rate?
I believe this one has an NC, so the dropout rates are a bit lower
I have a couple of friends who study this, it seems to be quite demanding
admission-free colleges would be similar to community College here in the US. Many people drop out because they’re not ready for college despite being easier than a 4 year university. I went to one and I took Calculus, Biology, chemistry etc and this is where around >50% of students failed this classes. After 2 years you have to transfer to a 4 year university since Community college are only for 2 years and many people drop put before this or no University admits them because of their low grades and only a handful are capable of finishing and transferring. For my school only 33% graduated and the number of people successfully transferring is even lower
1. I studied nutrition science and I remember very well that the first 2 semesters were basically as full as a school semester. I had university from 8 to 16 o'clock + learning + doing homework + preparing stuff.
2. It was quite abstract for my subject (you have a lot of mathmatics, phsyics, statistics, non-organic chemistry, botany) and a lot of people with 0 ambitions who just went there "to see how university is" were kicked out really fast.
3. My mom always wanted to force me into a semester job during my first years of college. And I simply had no motivation for that at all. I felt so overwhelmed. Now I know why: German universities are hard.
4. When I waited for an oral test, I met a girl I had never seen before. I asked her what semester she was (I was in my 3rd) and she said in her 7th. I was shocked and she explained, that here supporting money (Bafög) was cancelled and combining a science degree with a job was very difficult and made her studies extremely long.
Very interesting video! I'm doing a PhD in physics at LMU now and was wondering why the number of students between the first and second year of the bachelor's program was so different!
I did my bachelor's in physics at the Tokyo Institute of Technology. I have to disagree that good universities in Japan are a walk in the park once you're in ;) at least not always
is the physics exams are quite hard at Tokyo institute of technology ?
I am thinking about taking it in my bachelor's in data science but some are saying to take informatics as what if the data science may have less value in future and take data science in masters but when I think about it after my bachelors i have to work due to financial problems before masters and if i start as a my job after learning informatics will i have a problem in doing data science related jobs?
Please help anyone...😢
That is pretty accurate. I am studying Chemistry right now. However i not only study Chemistry i also have to got through advanced Math, physics and Computer sciences.
for international students, the situation is more difficult. you have to find part time jobs which can be difficult if you live in small cities. and if you fail any subject in three attempts your german dream is almost over. i know a guy who spent 5 years in doing bachelors, he has completed his everything including thesis and internship except one subjet. in that suject he failed eventually in his third attempt and then returned to his home country without any degree. another african guy got heart attack after he knew that he failed in third attempts. i myself had failed two attempts in advanced mathmatics but luckily managged to pass in that third attempt. these extreme pressure most of the international student dont know before enrolling in german universities.
The three attempts also apply to national students though? If you fail you don't get any degree and are banned from studying that subject again for eternity (in Germany).
Yes, but it is not new. 40 years ago, we had it in Braunschweig also. Dipl.-Ing. As mentioned before, they pinned a Gausscurve at the door. Guess where the Maximum was located .😊 And you really have to understand the concepts. I passed an exam what would be called " electrical physics" at other Unis , delivering almost nothing on the paper, ... but correct. others deliver loads of paper... but "zero points". I guess nothing changed... it is not much , helps much! Really not!
Another banger! Let’s goooo
🤝🤝
I studied and graduated in Agricultural Sciences in Germany. What I learned in the first few semesters is that we learn very different things for the Abitur in the different federal states. We had students in the first semester who had never learned probability calculation in maths or only had politics but nothing on economics. Not to mention most didn’t have any chemistry in the last 3 years of school at all! I was one of the lucky ones, who had all of these subjects in school. Just to imagine the workload on top of what I already had to do is mind blowing. I doubt I would have been able to graduate like that.
In the end out of 76 people starting the semester 18 were left in the last semester and only of them 7 graduated “on time”. Others needed extra semesters. I don’t even know if all of them made it through graduation in the end. Also, having time for part-time work or parties during Uni is a myth. Or you have very patient and rich parents to finance a few extra semesters for you…
What do you think about DHBW Ravensburg? Is it hard?
My brother always told me, that tum Munich is much harder than Oxford or Cambridge, couldn't believe it.. but it's really hard - he finished his masters a few years ago, wouldn't do it again.
I never went to university, I don't like to learn the whole day haha😂
The issue is admittance - lack of rigour to get in. No competition, to process to go through, to entrance essay, no grit!!!!!! People enter the university without the requisite study disciplines!
Thankyou so much,, I've got all of my papers ready just waiting for the application portal to open for the winter intake,, Passing B2 German exam is hell😅.Please suggest high probability uni for international students like me
How much did you study? Because I am going to take an intensive course this summer and I need to get a B2?
@@ezequiellisondo7931 Honestly it's not easy,before anything else you must be able to read German,,see a German word and read it,,then German sentence structure aren't like English ones so to qualify for in German B2 it needs intensive,, learning.Reading, writing and understanding German almost fluently
I really hate when professors hit you with that „look to your left, look to your right …“ etc. sentence. It’s so ignorant. It might even be funny for some people who are always good at everything. But for people who are taking a big step even being there, or for those who are going to struggle with things they’re being taught for the first time in their life, professors saying things like that can be very demotivating.
@@silverraven3007 don't let anybody's words steal your motivation or passion
🇨🇭here, I studied at EPFL, the sister school of ETH Zurich in Lausanne. We started with about 160 people and only 70 graduated the Master (counting all specializations), with a few joining our Master from other Bachelor programs, so I would say only 1/3 of people who started with me made it to the end. Other studies like Architecture are famous for having craaazy workload and sorting out 70%+ of students after 1 year. But, tuition was only 600.-/semester and as long as you have a Swiss highschool diploma you're allowed in, no matter what grades you graduated higschool with. Which means, now my former department has to deal with more like 350-450 first semester students, which means that number tripled in only 15-ish years (yes I am old).
ngl the only reason I wanna drop out is because I lost interest in my subject and it bores me to death now
I don‘t know why but I absolutely loved my university studies and the system in Germany. (Physics) I found it freeing that anyone can enroll and see for themselves if the degree fits to them. Most of my friends who persevered would eventually graduate, too, even though some exams were difficult.
It should be noted that many students also enroll because of „Kindergeld“. As long as one pursues some education program, the state pays the parents money for the child up to the age of 25.
which university you would suggest for computer science bachelor program?
Can anyone tell me if this system is similar in austria as well? Someone told me german and austrian education system is kinda same
Interesting. However, my experience studying at a German University isn't so good. And coming with a 240 ECTS degree it is easy for me to see why people from UK, Switzerland, Balkan countries, US, Canada, are avoiding Germany to study masters. (Why study 2 years masters when you can do it in 1 year).
At first I thought, alright it is what it is I will do 4+2 years of study. It will be worth it. I will learn more. Right? Wrong! Turns out it' not the case. It still depends on the study programs.
Tip for everyone, go to a smaller university. We had around 33% who failed the exam.
The system doesn't seem to be very practical. In Poland we have system where public universities are also free, and high-school graduates can submit applications wherever they want (they can even submit multiple applications to different faculties and/or unis). The more points they scored at high-school graduation exam (there are also points from some other sources) the better the chance to qualify for a better and more popular faculties/unis. But they always get somewhere, based on point limits. The system allows best people go to to best universities, and there are no logistical issues. If, for example, computer science at Jagiellonian University was open for everyone who graduated literally any high school, then probably 20k people would enroll or maybe even more - how would that work in practice? Interestingly, unis take in a little bit more students anyway, as there are still dropouts, sometimes even quite high, especially in STEM faculties.
So this happens in case of bachelor's program only or this is same for a master's program (like CS/AI/DS)
In my and most people's experience, getting a Master's is reasonably chill. Some hard work, some more relaxed times.
They really try to get rid of people in the first 3 semesters of your Bachelor's, all courses with high failure rates are placed early on.
Thanks buddy for sharing this. I was so worried after Max uploaded this video. Was planning to study in Germany for so long and thought about giving up for studying abroad.@@marceldiezasch6192
Yeah, the dropout rates are much higher in the bachelor's degrees!
Because easier to entrance, the exit less. US univ once announced "holding rate" the registration rate to 3rd year that starts the major course. This means 'if you dont want the major, you do not waste your time but change to other major".
Today German univ achievements in research works is unheard.
Uni in Germany was just many years of hard work and commitment.
I German language the word for „job“ is „Beruf“ which originates from „Berufung“ which translates to „vocation“. I am thinking that someone should not study just to get a job or just because everyone else studies. Someone should study if he is really interested in the subject of study. My daughter does the Master‘s degree course in chemistry at the University of Gießen, then she is intending to do a doctorate. She has always been curious about how and why things work and she still is. Yes, sometimes she is cursing badly about an experiment or a presentation she is supposed to do, but in general no problems whatsoever.
Can you please recommend some universities in Germany for being a dentist
I think that each university should have an admission exam which passing means you have enough knowledge to take the first year, what sense is there in just allowing anyone in?
"Subject related career opportunity in Germany could be a worth for new video from your perspective".. Just suggesting 😄
Thanks a lot for the suggestion ^^
What about masters in public health ?
woah this is making me feel anxious to see if I should still study in Germany or no, I think I can survive, I will go to Berlin because my relatives are there!
Honestly depends on the subject. And I think even more on your mentality. I am currently in the 4th Semester of Business Administration and in the last 3 Semester I usally saw failing rates of 35% up to 50% on most modules. I seldom saw things like 25% failing a Module and nothing below. But usally when I talk to people it seems like they don't do enough for Uni and/or are not smart enough about it (like not thinking about what is the core learning and what is "optional" for understanding). I honestly think that everything is doable and even with a good grade. But you definitely have to cultivate your curiosity and your willingness to learn new things but at the same time do very decisive cuts on exploring subjects to have enough time for everything . Most people I got to know usally think that Uni is annoying or things similiar to that. They are also the same people who have trouble not failing...
Is this video was dedicated to only undergrad or under and postgraduate too?
Mainly undergrad, in a masters degree the dropout rates are lower
On the first day at university in Germany older students organized a welcome lecture for us. They told us to look at our neighbor to the right and at our neighbor to the left. "Statistically, it's either the one on the left to drop out, or the other, or maybe it's you."
I made it through to the end, but it has to be said that many of the "dropouts" just continue studying something similar. For example, in medical studies they continue with biology. Some of the medical students drop out (or keel over) as soon as they have to cut open their first corpse.
And what about Applied Science university? Is the dropout rate for these universities same as Technical universities, given applied science universities focus on practical approach rather than theory.
If anyone can share their experience it would be a great help.
The dropout rate is a little lower at Fachhochschulen, I believe it's around 25%
Well, you also have to say, enrolling is more or less free and gives you healthcare coverage up to 25 (in most cases). So a lot of people just enroll for fun or to bridge the time until they know what they want to do. If you have to pay a fortune for your studies, you think twice about what you want to do with your time. Honestly at least 30-50% of the students would be better off just doing an Ausbildung right away. But applying for an actual job is much harder than enrolling in an admission free subject. You can also enroll at the Universities of Applied Science, they prepare you better for actual jobs than the "normal" Universities. They should imho be reserved for students who want to go into research. If you ask me, University is still too easy.
._. I am older than you, and I entered Physics, in Spain.
I started with 160 people, and after 5 years we only graduated 40. I was an average student, so I earned my degree in 8 Years, I checked the numbers and that was the average time to finish physics on my university... (*)
I saw how my companions left their degrees to change for other degrees, or left the university.
(*) But I Love Physics and research, so I stayed in university and obtained a Master's and Doctor's degree.
A high number of dropouts is expected, for two reasons:
1) Everybody thinks that to have in the future a job, you need to go to the university and obtain a degree.
2) You study physics and it is more easier some technical degrees (Several of my friends changed Physics for Informatics degrees) I also thought about that change; my grades in the programming subject were in the top 3%. But I didn't stop studying, and I stayed for hours trying to dominate that difficult content.
Easy requirement grades are the easiest way to say that everybody enters the university but does not have a lot of university graduates.
Because it is free to study some people try it out and realize that it is not for them. It is as simple as that.
That's part of the reason, but most German universities are just brutal.
I got my degree at RWTH Aachen and went on an exchange semester at UC Berkeley.
Berkeley was far more forgiving, getting good grades wasn't easy, but passing was basically free and they were much more supportive in general. German universities don't have the budget to provide a good staff ratio, you are mostly on your own.
Lohnt es sich an einer TU9 Bachelor in Informatik zu machen? Oder lieber erstmal an einer Nicht-TU9 studieren und eventuell für den Master an eine TU9 oder Auslandsuni.
Es ist schwer aus meiner Perspektive zu sagen ob "es sich lohnt". Ich weiß leider nicht was deine Ziele sind oder was für Skills du hast
Informatik an einer TU ist meistens sehr theorielastig und anspruchsvoll
@@maxyoko also das ist jetzt keine Einzelberatung oder so. Aber falls du oder jemand Zeit hat kann er mir ja helfen. Bei mir ist es so, dass ich eher in die Industrie will (daher Master nur "eventuell") Trotzdem interessiere ich mich für den Theorie-Teil und das kann ich mir nicht entgehen lassen. Skills: Ich kann programmieren in Java (hab mit Frameworks Apps programmiert). Ich verstehe die bekannten Algorithmen und Datenstrukturen und bin teilweise auch mit der Notation vertraut.
Man muss verstehen, dass die Bildungsqualität nur einen Teil der Unireputation ausmacht. Bei den TU9 ist es oft die Forschung, die den Ruf bestimmt. Eine solide Grundlage wirst du überall bekommen. Programmieren ist defiinitiv kein Ziel an der Uni. Es ist eher das Nebenprodukt, das du dir selber erarbeitest.. Eine Uni legt den Fokus auf die Theorie und hat zum Ziel, wissenschaftlichen Nachwuchs zu bilden. Daher ist sie sehr theorielastig. Eine FH ist eher für Leute, die in der Wissenschaft nicht arbeiten wollen. Dort findet man mehr praktische Fächer vor.
Ich habe an der RWTH studiert und sehe nicht wirklich, wozu die Quälerei gut war.
Am Ende sitzt du in Unternehmen im Büro neben Kollegen von der FH, die auch nicht weniger verdienen als du und 30-50% weniger Mathe und TI credits machen mussten. Stattdessen gab es bei denen mehr Programmiermodule, die einerseits einfacher und andererseits auch praxisrelevanter sind.
Wenn du in die Forschung willst, sieht die Welt natürlich anders aus. Und vergiss die Idee mit dem Master an der TU nach dem Bachelor woanders, zumindest bei uns an der RWTH mussten die "fremden" Absolventen so viel nachstudieren, dass es keinen Sinn macht.
Its true that the initial tests are hard, but I mean the system fair. If you make the first semesters, you're very likely to finish. German universities aren't selling false promises.