Honestly I’m more disappointed in Melfi‘s therapist than her, he really missed some marks with her that could have helped her with Tony. Instead he treated their therapy as a party conversation, which is super unethical.
@@lacym9278 essentially he convinced his patient not to treat another patient. He didn’t do that just by the study, he embarrassed her to do this. It wasn’t for her treatment, or Tony. it was him interfering for his own curiosity Regardless of the study, her job is to help people.
I'm a therapist, and people forget what a big deal this show was for the community. They would have articles in magazines and case conferences discussing what she did right or wrong each week
Wow, thats actually really cool, so many newer shows i've seen the therapy scenes feel disingenous and just put there just to be there, in sopranos it felt very organic, and like he actually needed the sessions
Psychotherapy is a bunch of hokum. Going to a priest, rabbi, minister, or talking to a sympathetic friend that possesses a modicum of pragmatism and a moral compass is likely as productive. I´m not, however, denying that it requires a ot of investment in time, and education and is a prestigious and lucrative profession. After all the best illusionists are well educated in their craft while being very disciplined and highly practiced technicians.
Melfi was the Greek Chorus, a stand-in for us, the audience. She spent an hour week with Tony, just like we did, observing from the outside, commenting, sometimes making tentative moral judgments. She is alternately fascinated and disgusted by him. I remember when the show originally aired and the tone, and Tony’s actions, got darker and darker and he became less and less likable until that penultimate episode when she finally washed her hands of him and I thought yup, me too. Which was probably the effect Chase was trying for.
Melfis restraint in not using Tony to eliminate her attacker was one of the smartest moves a character makes in the show, and one of the most difficult. The shows an interesting analysis of corruption and temptation at one level
I agree, because I’m not sure if I’d be able to stop myself from doing it in that situation honestly, but as most things in The Sopranos are not black and white, the question is to what extent was this a moral right v. wrong judgment, or a practical and rational decision in a sense that she was smart enough to know she shouldn’t owe anything to the Mafia.
Good video. I once discussed The Sopranos with my own therapist, and she told me that when it was on the air, she and a lot of her colleagues would have parties watching the show and picking apart the therapy scenes. Her assessment of Melfi was that overall, she was a very good therapist to Tony and helped him make some major breakthroughs to cope with his mother's borderline personality disorder... but she also had a problem of crossing boundaries, to the point of being complicit in his criminal acts (giving him consultation on how to be a better mob boss, etc.). The show does a masterful job of slowly building this dilemma. The "human side" of Melfi's relationship with Tony is that on some level, she simply enjoys being around him; he's funny, what he reveals about his life is fascinating to her, and she can relate to his Italian-American sensibility in a tribal way. This is what allows her to hold strong and do great work, even as Tony rages at her for pointing out his mother's faults. But it's also what leads her to enable his behavior, when he actively refuses to engage with her questions about what he really wants out of life. It's extremely frustrating to watch her dump him as a client after all their years together, but in this context it's a perfect resolution to her arc.
@@StoutProper sometimes it helps people to just talk about random subjects with therapists instead of only speaking about there problems and it can even make people open up more
@@StoutProper yeah I can be pretty cynical aswel even thought I often get annoyed at people for being cynical which makes me a hypocrite but hey were all hypocrites and selfish cunts so
It makes the show more realistic no matter how wrong someone did you or how much you think someone deserves to die most people with never actually go through with ending a life
I think you overlooked the fact that because Tony is a CRIMINAL and can't talk about his actual crimes which obviously have a HUGE impact on his life, then the therapy is operating on more of a superficial surface level. That is ultimately not effective in actually improving his life and choices. Melfi did complain about this to him, but she knew what the situation was from the start.
I actually thought about this the other day so many of Tony’s life that is actually the reason he needs therapy doesn’t get talked about by tony because he simply can’t ormeta & all
As a child of a borderline mother, his decrease in panic attacks is probably linked to Livies death. It's a relief for him to know she can't mess with him anymore.
Melfi was super incorrect with that DX. She even goes back on it sometime later in the show where she describes Livia as a narcissist. I'd agree that Livia is absolutely a narcissist and doesn't have BPD. I have BPD and I do not do anything that Livia does. My relationships with others are mostly stable, especially if we're already friends. I know BPD affects people differently but I've known a LOT of people with BPD and still have yet to find one who acts like her. On the other hand, my father is a narcissist, my mother is probably one too, and so is my ex....Acted exactly like her.
I'm not a psychiatrist, but I am a health care professional. One thing I appreciate about Melfi is her use of what's called 'therapeutic communication,' where she uses open ended questions, repeating Tony's statements and sometimes silence to get him to explore his own thoughts. She refrains from offering advice, passing judgment or making 'everything's going to be okay' generalizations, none of which are helpful. The writers definitely did their research on this.
Great comment and thanks. I'm not a media critic but being 50 and holding a lifelong love of all Screens I've yet to find a more astute one than this Kino young man, best wishes fellas ✌️🙏
Sorry, but you are 100% wrong. A good therapist challenges the patient, breaks down misconceptions and beliefs which are not identifiable or provable. In Tony's case he needed to see a very specific type of counselor, one who specializes in cognitive-behavioral therapy as that was what Tony needed, not some pseudo-Freudian psychologist. Tony needed to change his behaviors, his perceptions, and his overall identity of self which is done through CBT, not Freudian, early developmental examination. That comes AFTER the current behavioral issues have been addressed, not before. Bottom line, there is no such thing as a well adjusted mobster and no counselor could help one unless that mobster wants out of the life entirely. The two are mutually exclusive, not congruent in any fashion.
@@tedwojtasik8781 was watching a documentary where a much older women describe her challenging her mothers role and beliefs about her dead father who as a staunch SS she brings home a book this is 1960s Germany when she learns from a book who her father really was it basically nullified anything her mother said about her dead father. When confronted with the questions her daughter asked and evidence of his crimes her - asked her mothers role and lack of action in the Holocaust by asking her mother these open ended questions- her mother reacted like the sky was falling she psychologically could not process her daughters words running around the house saying she couldn’t talk about this and refused to look at the book or listen to her daughter saying look look at this ! Look at these photos ! She starts following her around the house reading the testimony of a jewish witness in the book describing how cruel and sadistic he was -her mother could not confront these questions her daughter was asking throwing justifications at her and trying to say it was overly exaggerated and her father was wrongfully punished and then the final coffin in their relationship her daughter said in the documentary-you see they were dangerous to Germany it had to be done. Its sad but true nobody wanted it do it. But it had to be done . and the interviewer said thats when in her mind their relationship died. She said on her mothers hospice bed dying one day 20 years later she said out the blue to her “its good they talked about what happened to the jews”. Thats it. nothing else .
Lots of people will continue to convince themselves of their own delusions for as long as they can spin the facts and evidence to suit what they want to believe. Some people get lucky enough at some point to be confronted with something that makes reality plainly unavoidable.
What I liked about Dr. Melfi was that although she developed personal feelings for Tony overtime She never slept with him. Which is a good thing because he would have chewed her up spit her out like all the others and he would have lost respect for her and left therapy.
I like the theory that as long as Tony has a chance of redemption he sees Melfi - but in the final episode he has no chance for redemption anymore. Thematically speaking, the doors are all shut. I do think, ultimately, that she has seen through his bullshit. It matters how she got there, and I think she was utterly lacking in professionalism regarding Tony, but stll, she was right to dump him. She should also dump Elliot, by the way. Let him know that gossiping about her patient drunkenly at a party was way out of line.
The scenes with Melfi are basically allowing us to study the depth of Tony's character. She was never capable of helping him, only rationalizing to the audience why he is who he is.
I always find it interesting that every time she tells Tony they’re making progress, all the therapy really is doing is delving more into his troubled and often disturbing psyche and doubles down that Tony is unwilling to change for the better. We often see that he still struggles of wanting to open up normally and instead is just talking of how he feels and hardly wanting to work through it. This is especially noticeable in the aftermath of his son’s suicide attempt. There’s often a sense of understanding, but that’s usually short lived. Ultimately, he feels that therapy is a waste of time and that things should be left unsaid while keeping silent about anything that shouldn’t be heard again.
A huge motivator for Melfi ending it when she did has everything to do with Eliot gossiping, revealing Tony's name at the dinner party filled with therapists, clearly an ethical violation that will no doubt spill into the wider world... IMHO this pushed her over the edge, and the study served more as a rationalization.
She meant well, but she's too "nice'. She's scared to be tough with him. He tells her so many horrific stories especially about his childhood. She gives him the "Lightbulb" Moment many times but he doesn't listen to her. In the LGBT community alot of men go for therapy like the Late Chester Weinberg the former Mentor of Calvin Klein over his sexuality but he stopped. Also if you took every actor/actress out of therapy in Hollywood, there'd be nobody left. The guy who Carmella counselled with should have been perfect for him.
There's a saying: "People change, but not much." As you pointed out, Melfi and Tony's sessions probably helped him make a couple of positive changes (like reducing his panic attacks), but they were never going to be able to do something like cure him of sociopathy. So within the realm of what she could reasonably do, perhaps she was a decent therapist. But if she thought, again, that she had a shot at significantly treating his sociopathy, then she was deluding herself.
@@Handgun777 The thing is, He had the chance to change, but pu'ss betrayal and livia literally haunting him after her death changed him and made tony more paranoid, then Junior was sent to Jail and the Lupertazzi started to intervene hard, he had all the chances to change, but he didn't in the end.
@@countryboyred I've seen world class athletes firsthand. They're rare but they exist. Most people aren't world class athletes though, similarly most people won't change much if any.
@@excalibro8365 ok did you even read my comment? I said most people won’t change. So it seems like we agree. Why even make a comment towards me? Just to be a fucking douche?
I always thought that the reason Melfi doesn't tell Tony about the rape is because she doesn't want to sink to his level, not because she fears being indebted to him
I think being indebt to Tony would have definitely play an intricate part that Melfi would have dreaded the most in the future, if she were to ask Tony a favor. Nothing's free in life and with Tony, he always collects what's he owed at the end and Melfi couldn't bear with herself knowing what she did to get herself in the situation and the risk of losing her job and respect from her family. But I'm glad she never told him, it would have been way out of character for her to do so.
It’s definitely a little bit of both but I think it was directly in the heat of the moment, making sure her moral compass was aligned the opposite of Tony’s. But it is a really good thing that she didn’t because he would’ve held it over her head and that would’ve probably ruined her life. In the first season it was fun, but after realizing how ruthless he and his lifestyle actually was telling her she was in actual danger (and if i remember correctly someone was actually sent to kill her and was clipped very shortly after being picked up from the airport) she set a boundary that could never be crossed again by refusing to tell Tony about her rapist.
If anything it showed her there is a world where people like Tony are needed. The funny thing is she gets all high and mighty with her morality but what actually happened? All her emotional turmoil means absolutely nothing because she let him get away with it. Not only did she let him get away with it she let him get away to do it to others. Melfi is a bad person.
@@davidgreen3001I find this interesting because, this is basically the gray area where by not telling Tony of the Rapist, the Rapist will continue to do harm to other women out there. Because even though Melfi has the choice to ask Tony to do harm to evil, does it in fact do any good knowing that Tony prevented God knows how many victims, despite the fact that it might have cost Melfi her morals and what not. It’s definitely an interesting topic of discussion.
@@Johnnysmithy24 "Take it easy, we're not making a western here" Tony wouldn't kill him, he'd just piss and moan, break a few things and slam the door on the way out. Killing a shrink would bring too much heat
Tony often questioned why he kept coming to therapy. I dont think Tony really wanted to change, I think he kept going to therapy because he saw Melfi as a friend that he could talk to in a way nobody else could. and the times he tried to become romantic with her, it was like Tonys attempt to leave his life for a healthier more normal life
Not a friend, a mother. Tony was always searching for a mother figure since his was his own personal devil. Melfi was the closest he had that wasn't a romantic partner, and that meant a lot to him. That's why some men and women sleep around constantly, they are trying to find a way to replace the opposite sex parent in a weird way, to find that acceptance they never got as kids. Tony was notorious for it too.
Tony is and always will be a criminal. They don't see the world in terms of relationships, but transactions. Dr. Melfi was just a way to function better in life, that means stopping his panic attacks, reduce negative feelings like quilt and depression, and getting tips on how to treat his family/ employees. He even try to seduce her, because that's what he thought women are for.
@@JCDenton3David chase has confirmed this in a recent documentary on Max. He said Melli was a mother figure for him. David chase also had sen an Italian female therapist who he said represented a mother figure for him also.
I think she genuinely wanted to help him. I think she saw it as a challenge for herself. However, I don't think she realized how manipulative he would be.
While the series was going on, I was hoping for at least one full hour episode of a therapy session between Tony and Melfi. Mainly because the their therapy sessions were my favorite parts of the series.
@@Anticommunism99skipped most of them? I’d say you need to rewatch the entire thing with a different mindset if you want to get the most out of this show and appreciate it for what it really is
Young man you so dedicated and the not only have you gifted us all the finest rundown of Sopranos episodes /series but you have flowed on to these further angles without losing any value and I'm... well I guess you can see I'm impressed and I thank you once again and best wishes 🙏
You should note that the woman is a licensed psychologist while the man is a therapist. In most countries, therapist is an unregulated term anyone can call themselves, rehardless of education/training/licensing. A licensed psychologist requires a graduate degree (if not a phd) in order to call themselves that in most countries. I have no idea what education the man has (he might very well be incredibly qualified), but I know for a fact that the woman has years of specialized training behind her opinion.
I viewed it as a tragedy. On a deep level, I think she really wanted to help him as much as he really wanted help. Unfortunately, his upbringing and the sociopathic tendencies that nurtured, as well as the truth of his life in the Mob got in the way and made it impossible.
As I recall my fav bit in the entire series was when it was figured out how Tony's panic attacks tended to be brought on by meat, due to him having a particularly bad childhood memory involving the family's butcher.
The thing about it that is interesting is that Melfi in many ways couldn’t be a good therapist to Tony. They uncovered what caused the panic attacks and those were largely resolved. However, Tony never viewed his own narcissism and sociopathy as a problem (those types almost never do), so really no amount of therapy regardless of who the therapist is would fix Tony. I would say Tony Soprano is incurable.
Most people with mental illnesses are uncurable. You can't cure genetics. You can however make it easier to tone it down and make it much easier to manage.
Melfi can’t be judged as either a good or bad clinician just because of occasional countertransference. It’s more often than not, an entirely unconscious process. Even so, it’s not necessarily always a bad thing. Clinicians are HUMAN. Through the season, we see signs of Tony’s transference in Melfi. We see how it affects her. She dreads seeing him. That’s usually the first sign. Maybe she should have dropped him as a client then, but she’s not a “bad clinician” for struggling with that decision. It’s also really not a therapist’s job to pass judgement on their clients, give objective advice, or necessarily give moral assessments. It’s amazing to me how many people have no idea what therapy is for. Carmela’s Doctor gave objective advice because she was in crisis, and she explicitly. asked for advice.
Lmao come on. She completely ignores overt hints that Tony hurts and kills people. She explicitly says she has to report that. If I’m remembering correctly anyway. She’s implicit even if that wasn’t happening because she knew who he was and reports on what was happening under him were on television all throughout the series.
It IS a therapist's job to pass judgements and give objective advice. I think you have confused a psychologist with a Peer Advocate (who can't do those things). A diagnostic conclusion is a judgement. A course of treatment is professional advice.
@MomMom4Cubs as a therapist...no its not our job to give advice. In fact, we're trained to do more listening and inquiring than flat out giving advice. If a client asks, you go through scenarios with them and explore what they think they should do. If you give advice, and it doesn't work, it can damage the therapeutic relationship.
This is just something I have noticed from watching the sopranos. Season 1 her office is bright from sunlight and generally bright. But as the seasons progress the office gets darker and darker. But when she stops seeing Tony her office is bright again.
As someone who has gone through many therapists, I would have loved to find one like Melfi. She seemed more concerned in helping Tony realize why he was having the feelings and thoughts that he was, in a way I saw as of getting to the root of the problem. She never passed judgement on Tony, and she never tried to make a generalization of "Everything will be fine."
Melfi failed HIPAA standards of protecting patient identity and information. HIPAA violations of this degree require medical board investigations and the medical practitioner opens themselves up to civil suits. Subconsciously, she wanted people to know she was treating a dangerous celebrity, which adds to the theory she gets a thrill from treating Tony in general.
Doesn’t she also say stuff like “if you tell me about crimes where you’re hurting people I have to report that” and flat out ignore overt signs of that? If she existed irl she’s immoral af, as a character device I don’t think we’re *supposed* to see her that way. I think sopranos is well written, especially compared to its television contemporaries… but people put it on a pedestal I don’t think it deserves.
We can't blame Dr Melfi for Tony becoming more evil as time went on. The weight of being the boss of the family and the events surrounding that took it's toll on him.
It's too bad Jackie got cancer. Losing him was the beginning of the end for that entire crime family. Him being alive throughout the show would have given Jersey a better outcome against the Brooklyn family. Hell, maybe that war would never have escalated. Plus he coulda helped keep his brother Richie in line after his release.
@@ict113090 This right here. In the brief span of time we saw Jackie’s leadership style, he showed he was cool-headed, intelligent and fair. His way of steering the ship commanded respect.
@@nxtwomenfan497 You're right I think Tony fukked everything up everything went downhill with his reign as it did with the real jersey mob kinda ironic
I’m glad they didn’t make her a love interest. I feel her cutting tony out of her life was for the best. Tony just didn’t want to get better, and eventually would’ve gotten Melfi killed sooner or later.
Maybe the Sopranos is Tony in purgatory and looking back on his life and Dr Milfy is an Angel helping him accept his death. The last scene is his actual death and he revisits it so he can eat da besht onion ringsh in da tri-state area.
I think the abrupt ending Melfi delivered was finally the crack in her armor. NO wire hangers EVER. She disregarded self-discipline and professionalism, which seemed a religion to her at her better moments.
Melfi's relationship with tony reminds me of a quote by Mark Twain "But who prays for Satan? Who in eighteen centuries, has had the common humanity to pray for the one sinner that needed it most" Melfi's work with tony was in a way her praying for the devil, trying to heal/help tony despite what he is. But just as it would be taboo to walk into a church and ask to say a prayer for satan, it is taboo for melfi to try and help tony work out his issues. Melfi stuggles with this and becomes attached to tony because she realizes shes the only one willing to help him, and like a doctor treating a patient she knows its her responsibility to help tony no matter how awful the things tony does are. Imagine an ER doctor had a patient come in who was a convicted rapist, a doctor wouldnt question weither or not to treat said patient because what the patient is isnt their concern, their only concern is to treat people "do no harm" . This is what melfi does but instead of treating external wounds she works on tony's internal wounds, something that we in out society still dont view with the same level of urgency and priority.
I think this is probably true at first, but if she feels this way, why dump him in the end? I don't think a single study is a good justification, clinically speaking nor in the case of her motivations. It was, at least in part, the judgement she received from her peers for "praying for Satan". She ultimately decides, "screw Satan, he probably can't be helped, I need to just save myself"
She was a very useful tool to inform the audience about Tony's feelings and thoughts. She ended it all for the right reasons which are the professional conclusions (from her, her therapist and the study) that she cannot properly help Tony. Realistically, however, the realization comes years too late, which in real world terms makes her a poor therapist.
8:20 I should note that Tony does have a very minor panic attack when Meadow Gold loses in "Chasing It". Tony's vision obscures, the audio slows down, and it looks like he's about to pass out before he gets ahold of himself.
That failure is more on Melfi, it was her job to make Tony realize why it benefits him to get better. That's the single most important job of a therapist
@@DragonZombie2000 hard no. This is not remotely true. Like rehab it only works if you want it to work. It’s very clear Tony did not want it. Not in the slightest. Melfi had worked with him for several years and watched him relapse into who he was in the beginning. Meaning Tony just got used to her the way that he got used to hurting people stealing lying cheating. She realized she wasn’t gonna have an effect on him even if she stayed. She’d become apart of his routine.
We all get so caught up in Tony's game. He is a mass murder who is willing to kill anyone to get what he wants. Melfie legitimately tries to help him, but she doesn't know the scope of Tony's crimes. Tony deserved to get cut off like that.
The choice of the name "Soprano" has always intrigued me. The meaning of the word and its etymology and why the name was chosen for the main character. I wonder, given that castrato's were men whose genitals had been amputated to enable them to sing in the range of a soprano in the 16 to 18th centuries, was Tony living his life in a manner that "proved" that he had not been castrated? It's a very american phrase for men to claim that someone who takes big risks is, lets say, well endowed, so I always wondered if Tony was subconsciously reacting against his own name.
A big part of the reason Tony would never be able to benefit from therapy is simply due to his external reality of being a mob boss. Had he become a more compassionate, kind person it would have put himself and his entire family at risk. This is why therapy for him was constantly one step forward two steps back.
Exactly Vito was an example. How he truly felt which he honestly didn’t care about it which he stated to his therapist but he had to do what was needed to be done otherwise they would’ve looked at Tony differently.
Just taking Melfi as a character, and sticking to her role in the story, she is our point of view character for Tony's emotions. She is supposed to be us. She gets angry at him, questions why she continues her work with him, and even has a hard time talking about anything else but him. When you look at her this way, I feel she can be a character people can come to enjoy more.
I think it's hard to evaluate Dr. Melfi as a therapist for me because somebody like Tony Soprano is near impossible to treat. Somebody like Tony could push even the best of therapists to their absolute limits. And yeah, I would also say that I agree with the analysis that it's hard to box Melfi into a category, a bit like most of the characters in the show, which I think is what Chase is trying to get at.
I also feel like Melfi’s attachment to Tony was to irresistible for her and I feel it really was the best thing for her to drop him as a patient. As much as she cared about him and really wanted to help heal his wounds she then realized that maybe it’s to late for Tony and he can not be helped. I also feel like she felt like she was just wasting her breath at that point, and Tony was just refusing to get better. I also feel like whenever Melfi would talk to her own therapist and whenever she would open up to him about these personal feelings she had for Tony I kinda get the feeling that she has always been attracted to guys like Tony who is also a masculine Alfa Male she just never talked about it. I also think that it’s a possibility that Tony may be cursed as well and she has been carrying this curse with her and it was time to let it go before it’s to late. If Tony wasn’t such a narcissistic, sociopath then maybe it’s a possibility that he could’ve been easily treated. But unfortunately due to Tony’s upbringing he was just prone to depression, and a life of crime. I mean honestly Tony can blame it on his upbringing all he wants but there was even at one point where Melfi tried to make Tony understand that it’s real easy to blame it on your upbringing but at the end of the day you are the one in control of your decisions in which path you choose to go down in life. Tony is the one who made the conscious decision to be in the mafia and rise in the ranks as the capo. Because the thing is whenever people have shitty upbringing sometimes they rise above it and also sometimes people become consumed by it. And in Tony’s case he became consumed by his upbringing and chose a life of crime. I honestly believe that if Tony during his younger years would’ve seen and realize the hell and misery that awaits him if he goes down the path of being in the mafia I believe he would’ve done the right thing and went to college like he wanted to and just went down a straight narrow path. But either way I feel like Tony would’ve been miserable either way and I don’t think that he would’ve enjoyed living a boring normal life and basically being a nobody and being like everybody else. I feel like in his mind being a mob boss was better than being a nothing but as much as it also brought him a lot of pain and suffering I feel like he would rather deal with the misery of being the boss of a crime family then deal with the misery of every day normal boring suburban life. Because at least in the mafia he felt like he was something,, something bigger and larger than life and being a part of something greater than himself. I also feel like it’s where he gained some of his confidence and it made him at times feel good and feel strong. But at the end of the day it turned him into an asshole, cold, and cynical. And it also brought out the monster in him, we all always have two sides of our personalities and we all go through our doctor Jekyll and Mr. Hyde phases. And it reminds us that there’s good and bad and everybody. All of the bad things aside Tony also had some good qualities to him he loved animals, he was at times a good father to Meadow and AJ, I wouldn’t necessarily say he was a good husband because he did cheat on Carmela a lot but at the same time though he did also love her too and there was good moments between Tony and Carmela. I honestly feel like the best thing Tony ever did was killing Ralphie because let’s be honest that sick son of a bitch had it coming and if Tony wasn’t going to do it someone else was eventually gonna whack him. Because honestly Tony did do a lot of bad shit but honestly I feel like Ralphie was worse than Tony he was just a sick twisted freak. And for me when Ralphie killed the horse and when he killed Tracy that was in my opinion way more of a terrible heinous act.
Melfi is by far my favorite character on The Sopranos, and she gets sadly little attention from fans, so I really appreciated this video. I hated how her final episode played out, but it wasn't because I didn't like the concept, I just thought it was poorly executed. One thing I disagree with (if I'm understanding you correctly) is the statement at 9:00 that she kept Tony as a patient for a variety of reasons, but that "professional ethics" was not amongst them. I don't think that's true. As you mentioned, early in season 2, when she tries to drop Tony as a patient, she is wracked with guilt over having abandoned her duty to help him. Melfi cares deeply about her patients and her work. It's just that she's human, and so the unprofessional motives like fear (especially in Employee of the Month and its immediate aftermath) and fascination get tangled up with the professional ones. Does she stick with Tony because she thinks it's the right thing to do, or because it's what she wants to do? Because she truly believes in his capacity for change, or because she wants to prove naysayers like Elliot wrong? It's all of the above and more. She is deeply flawed AND deeply admirable and I adore her. Thank you for shining a spotlight on her! (Side note, it drives me crazy when viewers act like Dr. Krakower is a better therapist than she is because of his uncompromising morality. Therapy should be about making a difference, not being right. At least Melfi TRIED to help Tony improve. Krakower just gave Carmela a lecture she was absolutely not going to take to heart and sent her away.)
(spoilers) the simple fact that Melfi didnt use her position on tony to get revenge on her rapist shows that no matter her flaws she still tried as good as she could, she is honestly a good psychiatrist on many other plans.
That's how therapy goes sometimes or even with people in your life. Relationships can often end abruptly, someone moving, retiring, or a conflict of interest, things just... end sometimes. I've had abrupt changes in therapists, from one to another even if I had been with one for years. I've never had a therapist straight out kick me out and end counciling sessions, but I can see how she has the right to do so should she see fit to.
Melfi's techniques as a therapist are all outstandingly good. The problem I felt is that she had so many nuanced feelings about her relationship with Tony that looked, at least from the outside, like triggers for her own issues. Her therapist would have been the one to address this and work her through it. Not continuing with Tony was necessary, and I agree that she waited too long, but her own underlying issues were preventing her from seeing him clearly. So her therapist saying she is there for him and not for herself is the core issue here. She was getting an emotional and psychological payoff by the therapy with him, and that is the reason for ending it.
Viewers should note that being licensed psychologist requires at least a graduate degree (if not a phd) in clinical psychology in many countries, whereas "therapist" is an unregulated job title anyone can ca themselves. Of the two people consulted for this video, I'm much more inclined to take the word of the woman who is a licensed psychologist.
I'd bet you that if the show continued she'd eventually take him back, this is more or less the same reason she dumped him as a client before embarrassment.
@@brennanc4321 to be fair, one of her clients did commit suicide because she wasn’t able to get to them because she was in hiding because of her relationship to Tony. But I think you’re right, after all her job is to deal with mental disorders
I think there's also a certain duty to Tony, once people violated her confidentiality, she had to drop him as a patient for his safety and her own. (Imagine if the FBI tried to squeeze her)
You, sir, are premium content. I am a huge proponent of therapy, and I appreciate you educating yourself. Loved having guests on the channel! It was interesting to get a non-fan's opinion. That being said, I agree with Bracco that Melfi cared about Tony. I think it would have been more difficult to quit him. In the show, I think she did so so unceremoniously because her "friend" Elliott outed her! She used Tony like alcohol and was embarrassed her actions became public.
Yes! She is embarrassed, can barely believe she has been tarnished. But the bigger sin was her therapist (so detached at their sessions) outing her over food, wine, and colleagues. Shame on him.
Ripping the page was not "the straw". It was just an excuse or something that she mentions. The reason was because of the article, that says that their sessions are being used for Tony to hone his manipulative skills. Tearing off the page has nothing to do with that.
I cannot criticize how Tony and Melfi split up, it felt real... authentic and something that would happen IRL. Regarding whether she was a good therapist, Tony is a textbook narcissist, every person they meet is an opportunity to take advantage of and manipulate as they mention many times in the show. Being the boss in some ways requires narcissism - if he suddenly had a revelation that what he's doing is bad, then he'd have to completely give up his lifestyle, the mob and so forth (which would put him and his family in jeopardy.) Good stuff, thank you for the vid. EDIT - Unfinished thought. So basically, there is nothing she could do. She probably should have handed this case off to someone else, but was somewhat emotionally involved / intrigued. Can't blame her for being human, but professionally there isn't much you can do with a narcissist like Tony because he's in a very deadly lifestyle that requires him to do violent acts (in theory, at least everyone asks him to murder other people.. he's directly in charge of disputes that inevitably our out of his control)
Always wished Tony had found out about Melfi's assault/rape through some police contact. He would have handled the situation without ever telling her. The thug rapist would have just been another floater.
Kino, another great video, thanks! Dr. Allison reminds me in several different ways of Meadow, even her looks. She'd be a great counselor to Meadow in the next phase of the show, when Meadow becomes the head of the family and has the same probs that T did (Meadow having problems with her own mothere who is now enamored by Furio and he wants to take over from Meadow).
I was married to a man who was diagnosed as a malignant narcissist. He was always in therapy. Several of his therapists dumped him because he became rude and violent, but some clearly enabled them and told him ways to justify his actions
I understand why Melfi didn't tell him about her attack, but a small small part of me wished she would have so he could find the bastard and get justice for her. But I do understand why she didn't.
The episode in which Dr Melfi is attacked in the parking garage is both one of the most disturbing and one of the best written pieces of storytelling in the history of film. The sudden and shocking brutality of it coming out of nowhere, how fast it happens, the excruciating lack of anything happening afterward, the lack of justice, the lack of closure, culminating in Dr. Melfi having this heart stopping moment of inner conflict-realizing that she could ask Tony to kill the man who did it to her. Set her free of the fear, give her the priceless gift of revenge and security in knowing that he’d be gone forever. And he would do it for her. We the audience know he would, and honestly, Tony would probably do it himself. He might not even involve anyone else, or tell anyone else, and it would be their secret. All she had to do was say the words. And she doesn’t. Her fear and desperation and rage are so palpable, and she _doesn’t do it._ She does the “right thing”. And I put that in quotes because…is it the right thing? Doesn’t she deserve that freedom from the evil that was done to her? Doesn’t that random man deserve punishment? Because Dr. Melfi never gets that justice, nor that freedom or closure or mercy. She chooses to live with that horror in silence, forever.
@Pure Kino , can you please do a video about the only true love story in the Sopranos - Tony and Artie? Artie was able to borrow 50k, beat up Benny, convince Tony to not murder the Pedo and point a gun all without Tony's punishment! Tony's one true love!
I'm sorry, but your assessment of why she left Tony is wrong. She left Tony because it had gotten to the point where she was getting negative judgment from her peers for treating him. She read the literature on sociopaths and realized it was right. She could no longer lean on the excuse that she might be able to help him, and the fact that continuing the therapy would cause her professional embarrassment pushed her over the edge into dumping him as a patient.
The important thing to know is Narcissists make you think for a long time that you can change them, but eventually you realize it's all a con. Everything a Narcissist does is a con.
Everybody is making this more complex than it needs to be. This is a relationship between a man and a woman. It's impossible to deny that Tony and the Doctor were attracted to each other. Melfi knew from the very first episode that Tony was a mobster and this excited her. She compromised immediately because she was curious and thrilled by this dangerous man. This wasn't a romantic relationship exactly, but it was a mutual affection dynamic. Tony liked that she was Italian, and pretty. Also, Tony was a hound, so his attraction was primal. The ending of the relationship was prefect since this is the way most relationships end. It's never pretty and never satisfying. Melfi ended the relationship because she felt like she was being used and unappreciated. Even the trivial matter of the magazine was only a final straw that proved to her that Tony was completely selfish. Tony also had mommy issues and Melfi was his surrogate mother. Tony couldn't communicate with his wife, his mother and even his daughter. Melfi was a woman who allowed him to expose his vulnerable side without judgement. Tony felt as if he could communicate with Melfi. This means he came to rely on his being able to vent during his sessions. When Tony tried to confide in friends, it was a complete failure. Both Tony and Melfi were in need of the other. Tony needed a gentle listener. And Melfi needed a challenge in hopes of breaking out of her own psychological prison. After all, she also had a therapist and her own issues. Tony and Melfi became co-dependent on the other for the wrong reasons. I love the dynamic of the relationship. It's so true to life, and mirrors my own interactions in therapy with women. I've seen firsthand what drives social workers to want to take on an almost impossible task. They want to save the world. Melfi wanted to save Tony, so she could save herself. Tony wanted to be nurtured. Tony was a baby.
@@yannick245 Yea, that ain't "normal" to be attracted to a sociopathic killer my boy. It's normal to be attracted to excitement and adventure, and a strong male and all that, but not normal to be attracted to *that.*
Through most of the second half of the show, Melfi was no longer attracted to Tony in any way, she even became repulsed by him. She really wanted to help him though and it took her a while to really see and believe that the kind of therapy she was giving him just wasn't helping.
I saw Melfi as someone who adapted to what she had to work with professionally. She definitely broke some ethical principles when it came to discussing Tony outside of work, but she remained as professional as she could during treatment. Tony was making significant progress but he was never going to strive for better change. Melfi recommended him going to CBT to progress from psychotherapy, quitting his job in the mafia, and challenging his thoughts and lifestyle. But the series proved that Tony would never truly get better because of his involvement in the mafia. So the ending of the show hit harder when Melfi took the professional route and dropped him as a patient, showing us that he was hopeless in redemption at that point
Melfi as a therapist it was never her job to fix Tony's morality or get him to stop being a criminal, anymore than it would be a heart doctor's job, and that's the crux of the issue. Whether it's Tony or some "regular person", a therapist doesn't make a more moral person, it makes a more stable and insightful psyche, but that's it. The job was to fix his panic attacks primarily, and perhaps help lead him to some emotional breakthroughs and insights. We can see she's hardly professional (and her therapist is less professional than her, as he casually breaks privilege). Tony is her celeb client, but once her peers rejected that they rejected her too. It was peer pressure and social embarrassment that drove her in the end, as well as probably fear (the last part being at least understandable). But in the end, who was she in Tony's world? Just another self-interested character trying to survive North Jersey.
As a huge fan of Lorraine Bracco, I loved every scene and every New York accented word that came out of her mouth. She was an excellent addition to this incredible cast of characters. She was right about how the relationship should have been ended just as she was right about not accepting the initial offer to play Tonys wife. So, I think all the analysis that was done here was fantastic. I watched it so I could watch Lorraine at her craft with her elegance, beauty and East Coast edge. Love that woman! ❤🎉
It felt like the show was making a definitive statement about Melphi and Tony when it repeatedly reframed their relationship by showing the sharp contrast with that other therapist that Carmela saw, and when it showed her reading the study. Which was that Melphi was not helping Tony become a better person because he didn't want to, and that that had essentially become a normal or accepted thing in their dynamic. The fact that he was a brutal criminal had become a part of the basic contract of personal acceptance between therapist and client, when it either should never have, or at least it should only have if it was temporary and it gave him the space to change. Tony did not want to change, and Melphi had allowed her concern for Tony to cloud her judgement about that. She was enabling him. I think she confronted that mistake at the end of the show, and that the show considers her to have finally made the right decision after a series of wrong ones.
Going to be a solid "no" from me, and Chase himself illustrates precisely why in "second opinion" - when carmella goes to the other therapist he 100% lays exactly whats wrong on the table, and indirectly blasts Melfi: "Many patients want to be excused for their current predicament because of events that occurred in their childhood. That’s what psychiatry has become in America. Visit any shopping mall or ethnic pride parade and witness the results." Its clear that Tony has unresolved trauma from his childhood, and he absolutely needed to resolve that, but while he absolutely would not have listened to Krakower, what Tony REALLY needed was to confront the hard truths about his lifestyle and what it was doing to him and his family.
I should also mention that there's an ongoing theme in the show of people going to therapists and then just not taking the therapists advice whatsoever, so judging on a purely consequentialist basis, it may not be possible to be a good therapist in the sopranos universe, because no one ever seems to listen to them.
I feel like therapists are generally self-important hacks and manipulative quacks (like Kupferberg). Melfi at least wanted to help Tony and was a genuine person. So I’ll give her some credit. But I don’t think he wanted help
It's not a cop-out answer at all... the show (like life) is far too complicated for such a reductive answer as yes or no. I think Melfi may be a great therapist for someone who wants real change, but the only change Tony wants is to stop having panic attacks, mainly in order to thrive as a mafia boss... as you said, judging by his absence of attacks by the final season, the therapy could be considered a "success". However, those panic attacks are a result of the life he leads - the symptom, not the cause... repeated panic attacks can be the wake-up call you need to turn your life around. But instead of changing his behavior, he wants to be able to continue causing incredible pain & devastation, only without his conscience screaming out and incapacitating him. You can see Melfi occasionally pleading with him to fundamentally alter his life, but he seems to be learning about his conscience merely to shut it out, to better manipulate others and to supply himself with excuses for acting the way he does. He has become far worse by the end of the series - committing several horrific acts that would've previously caused more attacks - yet he no longer has them. By series end, he has finally become the mythic _golem,_ the walking dead; you can see it in his eyes during his peyote trip in the Vegas casino, when his "luck" changes... he is dead inside. Progress? 🤔 I think not lol... but that's on Tony. The conundrum from episode one, is that any true growth on his part would almost certainly necessitate him leaving the Jersey mob. Of all the critiques Chase gives us of American society, this is one of the greatest, to me: our tendency to always treat the symptoms of a problem, never the root cause. Tony only lets Melfi help with symptoms, not the cause...
Honestly I’m more disappointed in Melfi‘s therapist than her, he really missed some marks with her that could have helped her with Tony. Instead he treated their therapy as a party conversation, which is super unethical.
Also Tony is a horrible patient. Some people are beyond help.
Yes! That therapist Elliot was the worst. He was terrible to her. She was great
Why was Elliott so bad as her therapist? I definitely hated that dinner party conversation moment and found it unethical, but otherwise...?
@@lacym9278 essentially he convinced his patient not to treat another patient. He didn’t do that just by the study, he embarrassed her to do this. It wasn’t for her treatment, or Tony. it was him interfering for his own curiosity
Regardless of the study, her job is to help people.
@@bgdojo damn do you know which episode in particular that takes place in? really thoughtful conclusion by the way
I'm a therapist, and people forget what a big deal this show was for the community. They would have articles in magazines and case conferences discussing what she did right or wrong each week
Wow, thats actually really cool, so many newer shows i've seen the therapy scenes feel disingenous and just put there just to be there, in sopranos it felt very organic, and like he actually needed the sessions
@@chasejordan9295 haha yep. And he did need the sessions. The man was passing out randomly before he started therapy.
What was the prevailing thought on her effectiveness as a therapist?
Psychotherapy is a bunch of hokum. Going to a priest, rabbi, minister, or talking to a sympathetic friend that possesses a modicum of pragmatism and a moral compass is likely as productive. I´m not, however, denying that it requires a ot of investment in time, and education and is a prestigious and lucrative profession. After all the best illusionists are well educated in their craft while being very disciplined and highly practiced technicians.
@@jaelge interesting that the sopranos actually does pay some attention to whether therapy is even useful
Melfi was the Greek Chorus, a stand-in for us, the audience. She spent an hour week with Tony, just like we did, observing from the outside, commenting, sometimes making tentative moral judgments. She is alternately fascinated and disgusted by him. I remember when the show originally aired and the tone, and Tony’s actions, got darker and darker and he became less and less likable until that penultimate episode when she finally washed her hands of him and I thought yup, me too.
Which was probably the effect Chase was trying for.
this is the best take ive read
Yes I think you've hit the nail on the head with that comment 👏
Good insight I had not thought of that
Which episode are you referring to?
@@buttonman6262 Season 6 Ep 20 is when melfi drops tony
Melfis restraint in not using Tony to eliminate her attacker was one of the smartest moves a character makes in the show, and one of the most difficult. The shows an interesting analysis of corruption and temptation at one level
I just don’t understand why it showed Melfi getting raped when nothing came from it?
She still got satisfaction from the knowledge that she could have if she wanted to.
Nah fuck that I wanted to see that guy die
I agree, because I’m not sure if I’d be able to stop myself from doing it in that situation honestly, but as most things in The Sopranos are not black and white, the question is to what extent was this a moral right v. wrong judgment, or a practical and rational decision in a sense that she was smart enough to know she shouldn’t owe anything to the Mafia.
It definitely makes her the strongest character in the show too. Any lesser person would've given in immediately
Good video. I once discussed The Sopranos with my own therapist, and she told me that when it was on the air, she and a lot of her colleagues would have parties watching the show and picking apart the therapy scenes. Her assessment of Melfi was that overall, she was a very good therapist to Tony and helped him make some major breakthroughs to cope with his mother's borderline personality disorder... but she also had a problem of crossing boundaries, to the point of being complicit in his criminal acts (giving him consultation on how to be a better mob boss, etc.). The show does a masterful job of slowly building this dilemma. The "human side" of Melfi's relationship with Tony is that on some level, she simply enjoys being around him; he's funny, what he reveals about his life is fascinating to her, and she can relate to his Italian-American sensibility in a tribal way. This is what allows her to hold strong and do great work, even as Tony rages at her for pointing out his mother's faults. But it's also what leads her to enable his behavior, when he actively refuses to engage with her questions about what he really wants out of life. It's extremely frustrating to watch her dump him as a client after all their years together, but in this context it's a perfect resolution to her arc.
Damn… that’s a fabulous summary. Kudos to you for going to therapy, and kudos to your therapist for dissecting the relationship so well.
Thanks! :)
Not sure your therapist was giving you the best use of her time there
@@StoutProper sometimes it helps people to just talk about random subjects with therapists instead of only speaking about there problems and it can even make people open up more
@@benlawson5939 yeah. It also helps them get paid. I’m a cynic, forgive me
@@StoutProper yeah I can be pretty cynical aswel even thought I often get annoyed at people for being cynical which makes me a hypocrite but hey were all hypocrites and selfish cunts so
Melfi stopping herself from telling Tony about the rape is one of the best moments in the series
To me that moment it frustrates me as the guy could've been dealt with, I suppose that says more about me as a viewer
It makes the show more realistic no matter how wrong someone did you or how much you think someone deserves to die most people with never actually go through with ending a life
It’s infuriating! First time watching through you’re just praying that she tells him.
@@KrisBryant99 you type like an outraged facebook mom. If anything she was enabling him through a lot of it.
@@bigboss3206 Big Boss, that's the wrong person you replied to. 🫡
I think you overlooked the fact that because Tony is a CRIMINAL and can't talk about his actual crimes which obviously have a HUGE impact on his life, then the therapy is operating on more of a superficial surface level. That is ultimately not effective in actually improving his life and choices. Melfi did complain about this to him, but she knew what the situation was from the start.
I actually thought about this the other day so many of Tony’s life that is actually the reason he needs therapy doesn’t get talked about by tony because he simply can’t ormeta & all
this comment needs to be at the top
@@ho2618 "superficial surface level" this comment should be at the bottom
@@AB-gb6zz So a minor piece of redundancy completely invalidates their point? Sounds fair
I mean he does talk about them, just in code which I admit is not the same as actually talking out his problems.
As a child of a borderline mother, his decrease in panic attacks is probably linked to Livies death. It's a relief for him to know she can't mess with him anymore.
Melfi was super incorrect with that DX. She even goes back on it sometime later in the show where she describes Livia as a narcissist. I'd agree that Livia is absolutely a narcissist and doesn't have BPD. I have BPD and I do not do anything that Livia does. My relationships with others are mostly stable, especially if we're already friends. I know BPD affects people differently but I've known a LOT of people with BPD and still have yet to find one who acts like her. On the other hand, my father is a narcissist, my mother is probably one too, and so is my ex....Acted exactly like her.
@@2wickie686”super incorrect” no she was right on the money. Borderlines can be very conniving
Awwww I love seeing the stigma and demonization of BPD! Don’t project your trauma onto other people and make such ignorant, broad generalizations.
I'm not a psychiatrist, but I am a health care professional. One thing I appreciate about Melfi is her use of what's called 'therapeutic communication,' where she uses open ended questions, repeating Tony's statements and sometimes silence to get him to explore his own thoughts. She refrains from offering advice, passing judgment or making 'everything's going to be okay' generalizations, none of which are helpful. The writers definitely did their research on this.
Great comment and thanks. I'm not a media critic but being 50 and holding a lifelong love of all Screens I've yet to find a more astute one than this Kino young man, best wishes fellas ✌️🙏
Absolutely. The first thing we were taught in Counselling behavioural training was how to show an astute level of active listening.
Sorry, but you are 100% wrong. A good therapist challenges the patient, breaks down misconceptions and beliefs which are not identifiable or provable. In Tony's case he needed to see a very specific type of counselor, one who specializes in cognitive-behavioral therapy as that was what Tony needed, not some pseudo-Freudian psychologist. Tony needed to change his behaviors, his perceptions, and his overall identity of self which is done through CBT, not Freudian, early developmental examination. That comes AFTER the current behavioral issues have been addressed, not before. Bottom line, there is no such thing as a well adjusted mobster and no counselor could help one unless that mobster wants out of the life entirely. The two are mutually exclusive, not congruent in any fashion.
@@tedwojtasik8781 Wow really, what on earth have I been shelling out for then for the last 15 years?? 🙏
@@tedwojtasik8781 was watching a documentary where a much older women describe her challenging her mothers role and beliefs about her dead father who as a staunch SS she brings home a book this is 1960s Germany when she learns from a book who her father really was it basically nullified anything her mother said about her dead father. When confronted with the questions her daughter asked and evidence of his crimes her - asked her mothers role and lack of action in the Holocaust by asking her mother these open ended questions- her mother reacted like the sky was falling she psychologically could not process her daughters words running around the house saying she couldn’t talk about this and refused to look at the book or listen to her daughter saying look look at this ! Look at these photos ! She starts following her around the house reading the testimony of a jewish witness in the book describing how cruel and sadistic he was -her mother could not confront these questions her daughter was asking throwing justifications at her and trying to say it was overly exaggerated and her father was wrongfully punished and then the final coffin in their relationship her daughter said in the documentary-you see they were dangerous to Germany it had to be done. Its sad but true nobody wanted it do it. But it had to be done . and the interviewer said thats when in her mind their relationship died. She said on her mothers hospice bed dying one day 20 years later she said out the blue to her “its good they talked about what happened to the jews”. Thats it. nothing else .
I love how he confides in her about the copious amounts of murder in his line of work, but tearing a magazine page is the final straw for Dr. Melfi.
The magazine page incident made their relationship look more like a marriage.
Lots of people will continue to convince themselves of their own delusions for as long as they can spin the facts and evidence to suit what they want to believe. Some people get lucky enough at some point to be confronted with something that makes reality plainly unavoidable.
Tony: I can't open up to women
Also Tony: *Personally chooses a therapist that is a woman*
Needs replacement for his mother, but is also terrified of maternal figures 🤷🏼♀️
According to Tony, he picked her because she was the only Italian out of the 3 options. 😂
Perfect for a mob boss tho
What I liked about Dr. Melfi was that although she developed personal feelings for Tony overtime She never slept with him. Which is a good thing because he would have chewed her up spit her out like all the others and he would have lost respect for her and left therapy.
I don't know, when I first watched the show I thought they would be a power couple
@@ripvanwinkler1548 lol Tony is compulsive as fuck, he was a dog that was never being domesticated.
@@ripvanwinkler1548 red dead reference in your name ?
@@lukasskywalker6514don't goto therapy they'll tell you something you don't like
@@miketrujillo3677In order to change, you need to face the truth.
I like the theory that as long as Tony has a chance of redemption he sees Melfi - but in the final episode he has no chance for redemption anymore. Thematically speaking, the doors are all shut. I do think, ultimately, that she has seen through his bullshit. It matters how she got there, and I think she was utterly lacking in professionalism regarding Tony, but stll, she was right to dump him. She should also dump Elliot, by the way. Let him know that gossiping about her patient drunkenly at a party was way out of line.
🤣🤣🤣 Elliot my boy !
Weird how I watched the same show as you but I get the complete opposite take. What a spectacular show it is. The best ever.
@@sole__doubt It's a mark of a great show, that there's so much nuance.
Of course she sees through all his BS. Her entire existence is BS, and no one can see BS like a BSer.
The scenes with Melfi are basically allowing us to study the depth of Tony's character. She was never capable of helping him, only rationalizing to the audience why he is who he is.
I always find it interesting that every time she tells Tony they’re making progress, all the therapy really is doing is delving more into his troubled and often disturbing psyche and doubles down that Tony is unwilling to change for the better. We often see that he still struggles of wanting to open up normally and instead is just talking of how he feels and hardly wanting to work through it. This is especially noticeable in the aftermath of his son’s suicide attempt. There’s often a sense of understanding, but that’s usually short lived. Ultimately, he feels that therapy is a waste of time and that things should be left unsaid while keeping silent about anything that shouldn’t be heard again.
A huge motivator for Melfi ending it when she did has everything to do with Eliot gossiping, revealing Tony's name at the dinner party filled with therapists, clearly an ethical violation that will no doubt spill into the wider world... IMHO this pushed her over the edge, and the study served more as a rationalization.
It was interesting when Tony went to see another therapist that the other therapist refused to see him past the first visit.
Bcuz of Analyze This
She meant well, but she's too "nice'. She's scared to be tough with him. He tells her so many horrific stories especially about his childhood. She gives him the "Lightbulb" Moment many times but he doesn't listen to her. In the LGBT community alot of men go for therapy like the Late Chester Weinberg the former Mentor of Calvin Klein over his sexuality but he stopped. Also if you took every actor/actress out of therapy in Hollywood, there'd be nobody left. The guy who Carmella counselled with should have been perfect for him.
I thought the "break up" HAD to be rough and abrupt. Dr. Melfi feared Tony was a master manipulator who could talk her into continuing...
There's a saying: "People change, but not much."
As you pointed out, Melfi and Tony's sessions probably helped him make a couple of positive changes (like reducing his panic attacks), but they were never going to be able to do something like cure him of sociopathy. So within the realm of what she could reasonably do, perhaps she was a decent therapist. But if she thought, again, that she had a shot at significantly treating his sociopathy, then she was deluding herself.
Right. She was treating a sociopath, they don’t like changing or taking responsibility.
Some people dramatically change. I’ve seen it happen firsthand. It’s rare but it can happen. Most of the time you are right though.
@@Handgun777 The thing is, He had the chance to change, but pu'ss betrayal and livia literally haunting him after her death changed him and made tony more paranoid, then Junior was sent to Jail and the Lupertazzi started to intervene hard, he had all the chances to change, but he didn't in the end.
@@countryboyred I've seen world class athletes firsthand. They're rare but they exist. Most people aren't world class athletes though, similarly most people won't change much if any.
@@excalibro8365 ok did you even read my comment? I said most people won’t change. So it seems like we agree. Why even make a comment towards me? Just to be a fucking douche?
I always thought that the reason Melfi doesn't tell Tony about the rape is because she doesn't want to sink to his level, not because she fears being indebted to him
Yeah, this is borne out in her discussion about justice vs. revenge with (iirc) Elliot.
I think being indebt to Tony would have definitely play an intricate part that Melfi would have dreaded the most in the future, if she were to ask Tony a favor. Nothing's free in life and with Tony, he always collects what's he owed at the end and Melfi couldn't bear with herself knowing what she did to get herself in the situation and the risk of losing her job and respect from her family. But I'm glad she never told him, it would have been way out of character for her to do so.
It’s definitely a little bit of both but I think it was directly in the heat of the moment, making sure her moral compass was aligned the opposite of Tony’s. But it is a really good thing that she didn’t because he would’ve held it over her head and that would’ve probably ruined her life. In the first season it was fun, but after realizing how ruthless he and his lifestyle actually was telling her she was in actual danger (and if i remember correctly someone was actually sent to kill her and was clipped very shortly after being picked up from the airport) she set a boundary that could never be crossed again by refusing to tell Tony about her rapist.
If anything it showed her there is a world where people like Tony are needed. The funny thing is she gets all high and mighty with her morality but what actually happened? All her emotional turmoil means absolutely nothing because she let him get away with it. Not only did she let him get away with it she let him get away to do it to others. Melfi is a bad person.
@@davidgreen3001I find this interesting because, this is basically the gray area where by not telling Tony of the Rapist, the Rapist will continue to do harm to other women out there. Because even though Melfi has the choice to ask Tony to do harm to evil, does it in fact do any good knowing that Tony prevented God knows how many victims, despite the fact that it might have cost Melfi her morals and what not. It’s definitely an interesting topic of discussion.
Can you imagine if Tony had gone to visit the Jewish Doctor. Oh man that would have been amazing to have heard the dialogue
The Jewish doctor would’ve gotten killed, he would tell Tony what a bullshitter he is and Tony wouldn’t be able to handle it
@@Johnnysmithy24 "Take it easy, we're not making a western here"
Tony wouldn't kill him, he'd just piss and moan, break a few things and slam the door on the way out. Killing a shrink would bring too much heat
@@anthonydunkley7844 Yea
I think that guy would be wise enough to not bother
@@anthonydunkley7844 Yeah, he just would have left and never come back (which maybe means he would have wasted much less time than Melfi).
Tony often questioned why he kept coming to therapy. I dont think Tony really wanted to change, I think he kept going to therapy because he saw Melfi as a friend that he could talk to in a way nobody else could. and the times he tried to become romantic with her, it was like Tonys attempt to leave his life for a healthier more normal life
Not a friend, a mother. Tony was always searching for a mother figure since his was his own personal devil. Melfi was the closest he had that wasn't a romantic partner, and that meant a lot to him. That's why some men and women sleep around constantly, they are trying to find a way to replace the opposite sex parent in a weird way, to find that acceptance they never got as kids. Tony was notorious for it too.
Tony is and always will be a criminal. They don't see the world in terms of relationships, but transactions. Dr. Melfi was just a way to function better in life, that means stopping his panic attacks, reduce negative feelings like quilt and depression, and getting tips on how to treat his family/ employees. He even try to seduce her, because that's what he thought women are for.
@@nicomal this is a very good point
@@JCDenton3David chase has confirmed this in a recent documentary on Max. He said Melli was a mother figure for him. David chase also had sen an Italian female therapist who he said represented a mother figure for him also.
I'm actually more fascinated by that fact that you managed to find a mental health professional who HADN'T watched The Sopranos before.
I think she genuinely wanted to help him. I think she saw it as a challenge for herself. However, I don't think she realized how manipulative he would be.
While the series was going on, I was hoping for at least one full hour episode of a therapy session between Tony and Melfi. Mainly because the their therapy sessions were my favorite parts of the series.
Such a BS the most boring part of the series skipped most of them
@@Anticommunism99 Good for you, sweetheart.
@@Anticommunism99skipped most of them? I’d say you need to rewatch the entire thing with a different mindset if you want to get the most out of this show and appreciate it for what it really is
@@Adam_Aydiar it's overrated that's what it is . Sopranos is nothing more than a glorified series .
@@Anticommunism99oh buddy why would you watch it if it wasnt your type of a show.. now you look so wrong
Young man you so dedicated and the not only have you gifted us all the finest rundown of Sopranos episodes /series but you have flowed on to these further angles without losing any value and I'm... well I guess you can see I'm impressed and I thank you once again and best wishes 🙏
Comedic gold on The Sopranos 9:23 Tony telling someone else what they're doing to him is immoral.
But remember he's just a soldier
The hypocrisy 🤣💀
Wow quite impressed that Kino actually went out of his way to bring therapists onto his channel!
You should note that the woman is a licensed psychologist while the man is a therapist. In most countries, therapist is an unregulated term anyone can call themselves, rehardless of education/training/licensing. A licensed psychologist requires a graduate degree (if not a phd) in order to call themselves that in most countries. I have no idea what education the man has (he might very well be incredibly qualified), but I know for a fact that the woman has years of specialized training behind her opinion.
I think she was. The only reason Tony didn't get better because he was stuck in the mafia.
..or maybe because he was a dangerous sociopath
I dunno. Modern psychiatrist have complained about her.
@@Bale4Bond both
@@DanJuega yeah but I mean, this show aired years ago so can we really compare 2022 psychiatrists to ones from 1999
@@ilovehotmoms5804 We would need a psychiatrist to tell us.
I viewed it as a tragedy. On a deep level, I think she really wanted to help him as much as he really wanted help. Unfortunately, his upbringing and the sociopathic tendencies that nurtured, as well as the truth of his life in the Mob got in the way and made it impossible.
I completely agree
As I recall my fav bit in the entire series was when it was figured out how Tony's panic attacks tended to be brought on by meat, due to him having a particularly bad childhood memory involving the family's butcher.
Yeah I picked up on this and it was never really raised again
I noticed that a lot of things were sometimes abruptly skipped over and weren't mentioned again.
The thing about it that is interesting is that Melfi in many ways couldn’t be a good therapist to Tony. They uncovered what caused the panic attacks and those were largely resolved. However, Tony never viewed his own narcissism and sociopathy as a problem (those types almost never do), so really no amount of therapy regardless of who the therapist is would fix Tony. I would say Tony Soprano is incurable.
Most people with mental illnesses are uncurable. You can't cure genetics. You can however make it easier to tone it down and make it much easier to manage.
Nearly incurable. I wouldn’t go as far as to say he’s a lost cause
@@jimirsayssponsor5844Why not?
@@CT--jv2ur Only a Sith deals in absolutes.
Sociopathic narcissists see a therapist as a challenge. They are right and the therapist is wrong.
They may potentially see things from a different angle, but they never think it through to the other perspective.
Melfi can’t be judged as either a good or bad clinician just because of occasional countertransference. It’s more often than not, an entirely unconscious process. Even so, it’s not necessarily always a bad thing. Clinicians are HUMAN. Through the season, we see signs of Tony’s transference in Melfi. We see how it affects her. She dreads seeing him. That’s usually the first sign. Maybe she should have dropped him as a client then, but she’s not a “bad clinician” for struggling with that decision.
It’s also really not a therapist’s job to pass judgement on their clients, give objective advice, or necessarily give moral assessments. It’s amazing to me how many people have no idea what therapy is for. Carmela’s Doctor gave objective advice because she was in crisis, and she explicitly. asked for advice.
Lmao come on. She completely ignores overt hints that Tony hurts and kills people. She explicitly says she has to report that. If I’m remembering correctly anyway.
She’s implicit even if that wasn’t happening because she knew who he was and reports on what was happening under him were on television all throughout the series.
It IS a therapist's job to pass judgements and give objective advice. I think you have confused a psychologist with a Peer Advocate (who can't do those things).
A diagnostic conclusion is a judgement. A course of treatment is professional advice.
@MomMom4Cubs as a therapist...no its not our job to give advice. In fact, we're trained to do more listening and inquiring than flat out giving advice.
If a client asks, you go through scenarios with them and explore what they think they should do. If you give advice, and it doesn't work, it can damage the therapeutic relationship.
This is just something I have noticed from watching the sopranos. Season 1 her office is bright from sunlight and generally bright. But as the seasons progress the office gets darker and darker. But when she stops seeing Tony her office is bright again.
As someone who has gone through many therapists, I would have loved to find one like Melfi. She seemed more concerned in helping Tony realize why he was having the feelings and thoughts that he was, in a way I saw as of getting to the root of the problem. She never passed judgement on Tony, and she never tried to make a generalization of "Everything will be fine."
"Many fans were upset with the lack of resolution in their story."
And then of course they got the finale...
What do you mean? She is not in the finale?
@@bas_ee He means that they got even less resolution in the finale
@@thebadwolf3088 Ah, thanks for explaining
Tony got deleted by the guy in the "Members Only" jacket after he came out of the bathroom. David Chase has since confirmed this.
@@williamhermann6635I've seen others say he's been misquoted and never stated Tony's fate
Melfi failed HIPAA standards of protecting patient identity and information. HIPAA violations of this degree require medical board investigations and the medical practitioner opens themselves up to civil suits. Subconsciously, she wanted people to know she was treating a dangerous celebrity, which adds to the theory she gets a thrill from treating Tony in general.
When did she fail HIPAA?
@@Chinintoo16 when revealing tony's identity to her own therapist.
Call the Hippa police!!
@@potatobro6380but didn’t she blurt it out by mistake when she was getting frustrated? And it was with her own therapist too so?
Doesn’t she also say stuff like “if you tell me about crimes where you’re hurting people I have to report that” and flat out ignore overt signs of that? If she existed irl she’s immoral af, as a character device I don’t think we’re *supposed* to see her that way.
I think sopranos is well written, especially compared to its television contemporaries… but people put it on a pedestal I don’t think it deserves.
We can't blame Dr Melfi for Tony becoming more evil as time went on. The weight of being the boss of the family and the events surrounding that took it's toll on him.
100 percent agree
It's too bad Jackie got cancer. Losing him was the beginning of the end for that entire crime family. Him being alive throughout the show would have given Jersey a better outcome against the Brooklyn family. Hell, maybe that war would never have escalated. Plus he coulda helped keep his brother Richie in line after his release.
@@ict113090 This right here. In the brief span of time we saw Jackie’s leadership style, he showed he was cool-headed, intelligent and fair. His way of steering the ship commanded respect.
@@nxtwomenfan497 You're right I think Tony fukked everything up everything went downhill with his reign as it did with the real jersey mob kinda ironic
Melfi, however, could have admitted that to herself and ended therapy on a better note (if possible) earlier.
I’m glad they didn’t make her a love interest. I feel her cutting tony out of her life was for the best. Tony just didn’t want to get better, and eventually would’ve gotten Melfi killed sooner or later.
Maybe the Sopranos is Tony in purgatory and looking back on his life and Dr Milfy is an Angel helping him accept his death. The last scene is his actual death and he revisits it so he can eat da besht onion ringsh in da tri-state area.
There’s no way to treat or “correctly” cut off someone like tony.
No instruction for patient with a hot trigger finger?
I have to say the abrupt ending was (realistically) right. I feel that i like it.
I think the abrupt ending Melfi delivered was finally the crack in her armor. NO wire hangers EVER. She disregarded self-discipline and professionalism, which seemed a religion to her at her better moments.
you went out of your way for this video Kino, I think everyone appreciated it, cheers!
Melfi's relationship with tony reminds me of a quote by Mark Twain "But who prays for Satan? Who in eighteen centuries, has had the common humanity to pray for the one sinner that needed it most"
Melfi's work with tony was in a way her praying for the devil, trying to heal/help tony despite what he is. But just as it would be taboo to walk into a church and ask to say a prayer for satan, it is taboo for melfi to try and help tony work out his issues. Melfi stuggles with this and becomes attached to tony because she realizes shes the only one willing to help him, and like a doctor treating a patient she knows its her responsibility to help tony no matter how awful the things tony does are. Imagine an ER doctor had a patient come in who was a convicted rapist, a doctor wouldnt question weither or not to treat said patient because what the patient is isnt their concern, their only concern is to treat people "do no harm" . This is what melfi does but instead of treating external wounds she works on tony's internal wounds, something that we in out society still dont view with the same level of urgency and priority.
I think this is probably true at first, but if she feels this way, why dump him in the end? I don't think a single study is a good justification, clinically speaking nor in the case of her motivations. It was, at least in part, the judgement she received from her peers for "praying for Satan". She ultimately decides, "screw Satan, he probably can't be helped, I need to just save myself"
She was a very useful tool to inform the audience about Tony's feelings and thoughts.
She ended it all for the right reasons which are the professional conclusions (from her, her therapist and the study) that she cannot properly help Tony.
Realistically, however, the realization comes years too late, which in real world terms makes her a poor therapist.
8:20 I should note that Tony does have a very minor panic attack when Meadow Gold loses in "Chasing It". Tony's vision obscures, the audio slows down, and it looks like he's about to pass out before he gets ahold of himself.
I think Melfi was good. For a person who really wants to get help and get better, she can be very effective. Tony didn’t really want to get better.
That failure is more on Melfi, it was her job to make Tony realize why it benefits him to get better. That's the single most important job of a therapist
@@DragonZombie2000 hard no. This is not remotely true. Like rehab it only works if you want it to work. It’s very clear Tony did not want it. Not in the slightest.
Melfi had worked with him for several years and watched him relapse into who he was in the beginning. Meaning Tony just got used to her the way that he got used to hurting people stealing lying cheating. She realized she wasn’t gonna have an effect on him even if she stayed. She’d become apart of his routine.
No therapist can treat someone who refuses to be held responsible
Melphi had good intentions, but seemed guilable and naive at times
We all get so caught up in Tony's game. He is a mass murder who is willing to kill anyone to get what he wants. Melfie legitimately tries to help him, but she doesn't know the scope of Tony's crimes. Tony deserved to get cut off like that.
Definitely she should’ve done it earlier tho. In my opinion she was being vicarious.
The choice of the name "Soprano" has always intrigued me. The meaning of the word and its etymology and why the name was chosen for the main character. I wonder, given that castrato's were men whose genitals had been amputated to enable them to sing in the range of a soprano in the 16 to 18th centuries, was Tony living his life in a manner that "proved" that he had not been castrated? It's a very american phrase for men to claim that someone who takes big risks is, lets say, well endowed, so I always wondered if Tony was subconsciously reacting against his own name.
This reminds me of Leotardi's complaint
A big part of the reason Tony would never be able to benefit from therapy is simply due to his external reality of being a mob boss. Had he become a more compassionate, kind person it would have put himself and his entire family at risk. This is why therapy for him was constantly one step forward two steps back.
Exactly Vito was an example. How he truly felt which he honestly didn’t care about it which he stated to his therapist but he had to do what was needed to be done otherwise they would’ve looked at Tony differently.
Just taking Melfi as a character, and sticking to her role in the story, she is our point of view character for Tony's emotions. She is supposed to be us. She gets angry at him, questions why she continues her work with him, and even has a hard time talking about anything else but him. When you look at her this way, I feel she can be a character people can come to enjoy more.
I think it's hard to evaluate Dr. Melfi as a therapist for me because somebody like Tony Soprano is near impossible to treat. Somebody like Tony could push even the best of therapists to their absolute limits.
And yeah, I would also say that I agree with the analysis that it's hard to box Melfi into a category, a bit like most of the characters in the show, which I think is what Chase is trying to get at.
Psychiatrist? that's just a racket for the Jew's! -Livia
Based
Based
Based
I also feel like Melfi’s attachment to Tony was to irresistible for her and I feel it really was the best thing for her to drop him as a patient. As much as she cared about him and really wanted to help heal his wounds she then realized that maybe it’s to late for Tony and he can not be helped. I also feel like she felt like she was just wasting her breath at that point, and Tony was just refusing to get better. I also feel like whenever Melfi would talk to her own therapist and whenever she would open up to him about these personal feelings she had for Tony I kinda get the feeling that she has always been attracted to guys like Tony who is also a masculine Alfa Male she just never talked about it. I also think that it’s a possibility that Tony may be cursed as well and she has been carrying this curse with her and it was time to let it go before it’s to late. If Tony wasn’t such a narcissistic, sociopath then maybe it’s a possibility that he could’ve been easily treated. But unfortunately due to Tony’s upbringing he was just prone to depression, and a life of crime. I mean honestly Tony can blame it on his upbringing all he wants but there was even at one point where Melfi tried to make Tony understand that it’s real easy to blame it on your upbringing but at the end of the day you are the one in control of your decisions in which path you choose to go down in life. Tony is the one who made the conscious decision to be in the mafia and rise in the ranks as the capo. Because the thing is whenever people have shitty upbringing sometimes they rise above it and also sometimes people become consumed by it. And in Tony’s case he became consumed by his upbringing and chose a life of crime. I honestly believe that if Tony during his younger years would’ve seen and realize the hell and misery that awaits him if he goes down the path of being in the mafia I believe he would’ve done the right thing and went to college like he wanted to and just went down a straight narrow path. But either way I feel like Tony would’ve been miserable either way and I don’t think that he would’ve enjoyed living a boring normal life and basically being a nobody and being like everybody else. I feel like in his mind being a mob boss was better than being a nothing but as much as it also brought him a lot of pain and suffering I feel like he would rather deal with the misery of being the boss of a crime family then deal with the misery of every day normal boring suburban life. Because at least in the mafia he felt like he was something,, something bigger and larger than life and being a part of something greater than himself. I also feel like it’s where he gained some of his confidence and it made him at times feel good and feel strong. But at the end of the day it turned him into an asshole, cold, and cynical. And it also brought out the monster in him, we all always have two sides of our personalities and we all go through our doctor Jekyll and Mr. Hyde phases. And it reminds us that there’s good and bad and everybody. All of the bad things aside Tony also had some good qualities to him he loved animals, he was at times a good father to Meadow and AJ, I wouldn’t necessarily say he was a good husband because he did cheat on Carmela a lot but at the same time though he did also love her too and there was good moments between Tony and Carmela. I honestly feel like the best thing Tony ever did was killing Ralphie because let’s be honest that sick son of a bitch had it coming and if Tony wasn’t going to do it someone else was eventually gonna whack him. Because honestly Tony did do a lot of bad shit but honestly I feel like Ralphie was worse than Tony he was just a sick twisted freak. And for me when Ralphie killed the horse and when he killed Tracy that was in my opinion way more of a terrible heinous act.
Excellent assessment 👍
Melfi is by far my favorite character on The Sopranos, and she gets sadly little attention from fans, so I really appreciated this video. I hated how her final episode played out, but it wasn't because I didn't like the concept, I just thought it was poorly executed. One thing I disagree with (if I'm understanding you correctly) is the statement at 9:00 that she kept Tony as a patient for a variety of reasons, but that "professional ethics" was not amongst them. I don't think that's true. As you mentioned, early in season 2, when she tries to drop Tony as a patient, she is wracked with guilt over having abandoned her duty to help him. Melfi cares deeply about her patients and her work. It's just that she's human, and so the unprofessional motives like fear (especially in Employee of the Month and its immediate aftermath) and fascination get tangled up with the professional ones. Does she stick with Tony because she thinks it's the right thing to do, or because it's what she wants to do? Because she truly believes in his capacity for change, or because she wants to prove naysayers like Elliot wrong? It's all of the above and more. She is deeply flawed AND deeply admirable and I adore her. Thank you for shining a spotlight on her! (Side note, it drives me crazy when viewers act like Dr. Krakower is a better therapist than she is because of his uncompromising morality. Therapy should be about making a difference, not being right. At least Melfi TRIED to help Tony improve. Krakower just gave Carmela a lecture she was absolutely not going to take to heart and sent her away.)
(spoilers)
the simple fact that Melfi didnt use her position on tony to get revenge on her rapist shows that no matter her flaws she still tried as good as she could, she is honestly a good psychiatrist on many other plans.
I’m continually so impressed how great you are at this. It’s just an insane amount of dedication outside of just making the videos. Wow.
Thank you so much!
Cunnilingus and psychiatry brought us to this...
That's how therapy goes sometimes or even with people in your life. Relationships can often end abruptly, someone moving, retiring, or a conflict of interest, things just... end sometimes. I've had abrupt changes in therapists, from one to another even if I had been with one for years. I've never had a therapist straight out kick me out and end counciling sessions, but I can see how she has the right to do so should she see fit to.
Melfi's techniques as a therapist are all outstandingly good. The problem I felt is that she had so many nuanced feelings about her relationship with Tony that looked, at least from the outside, like triggers for her own issues. Her therapist would have been the one to address this and work her through it. Not continuing with Tony was necessary, and I agree that she waited too long, but her own underlying issues were preventing her from seeing him clearly. So her therapist saying she is there for him and not for herself is the core issue here. She was getting an emotional and psychological payoff by the therapy with him, and that is the reason for ending it.
Viewers should note that being licensed psychologist requires at least a graduate degree (if not a phd) in clinical psychology in many countries, whereas "therapist" is an unregulated job title anyone can ca themselves. Of the two people consulted for this video, I'm much more inclined to take the word of the woman who is a licensed psychologist.
I think Melfi dumped Tony out of embarrassment from her friend's after the dinner party.
My thoughts exactly. On the money.
I really think that’s part of it, her therapist outing her like that and humiliating her would be a hit on anyone’s ego
I'd bet you that if the show continued she'd eventually take him back, this is more or less the same reason she dumped him as a client before embarrassment.
@@brennanc4321 to be fair, one of her clients did commit suicide because she wasn’t able to get to them because she was in hiding because of her relationship to Tony. But I think you’re right, after all her job is to deal with mental disorders
I think there's also a certain duty to Tony, once people violated her confidentiality, she had to drop him as a patient for his safety and her own. (Imagine if the FBI tried to squeeze her)
You, sir, are premium content. I am a huge proponent of therapy, and I appreciate you educating yourself. Loved having guests on the channel! It was interesting to get a non-fan's opinion.
That being said, I agree with Bracco that Melfi cared about Tony. I think it would have been more difficult to quit him. In the show, I think she did so so unceremoniously because her "friend" Elliott outed her! She used Tony like alcohol and was embarrassed her actions became public.
Yes! She is embarrassed, can barely believe she has been tarnished. But the bigger sin was her therapist (so detached at their sessions) outing her over food, wine, and colleagues. Shame on him.
Ripping the page was not "the straw". It was just an excuse or something that she mentions. The reason was because of the article, that says that their sessions are being used for Tony to hone his manipulative skills. Tearing off the page has nothing to do with that.
I cannot criticize how Tony and Melfi split up, it felt real... authentic and something that would happen IRL. Regarding whether she was a good therapist, Tony is a textbook narcissist, every person they meet is an opportunity to take advantage of and manipulate as they mention many times in the show. Being the boss in some ways requires narcissism - if he suddenly had a revelation that what he's doing is bad, then he'd have to completely give up his lifestyle, the mob and so forth (which would put him and his family in jeopardy.) Good stuff, thank you for the vid.
EDIT - Unfinished thought. So basically, there is nothing she could do. She probably should have handed this case off to someone else, but was somewhat emotionally involved / intrigued. Can't blame her for being human, but professionally there isn't much you can do with a narcissist like Tony because he's in a very deadly lifestyle that requires him to do violent acts (in theory, at least everyone asks him to murder other people.. he's directly in charge of disputes that inevitably our out of his control)
She spent 6 years treating a patient, that she knew was borderline psycho but still went with it
She never should have seen him after he physically assaulted her. End of story
Always wished Tony had found out about Melfi's assault/rape through some police contact. He would have handled the situation without ever telling her. The thug rapist would have just been another floater.
Kino, another great video, thanks! Dr. Allison reminds me in several different ways of Meadow, even her looks. She'd be a great counselor to Meadow in the next phase of the show, when Meadow becomes the head of the family and has the same probs that T did (Meadow having problems with her own mothere who is now enamored by Furio and he wants to take over from Meadow).
I was married to a man who was diagnosed as a malignant narcissist. He was always in therapy. Several of his therapists dumped him because he became rude and violent, but some clearly enabled them and told him ways to justify his actions
I understand why Melfi didn't tell him about her attack, but a small small part of me wished she would have so he could find the bastard and get justice for her. But I do understand why she didn't.
The episode in which Dr Melfi is attacked in the parking garage is both one of the most disturbing and one of the best written pieces of storytelling in the history of film. The sudden and shocking brutality of it coming out of nowhere, how fast it happens, the excruciating lack of anything happening afterward, the lack of justice, the lack of closure, culminating in Dr. Melfi having this heart stopping moment of inner conflict-realizing that she could ask Tony to kill the man who did it to her. Set her free of the fear, give her the priceless gift of revenge and security in knowing that he’d be gone forever. And he would do it for her. We the audience know he would, and honestly, Tony would probably do it himself. He might not even involve anyone else, or tell anyone else, and it would be their secret. All she had to do was say the words.
And she doesn’t. Her fear and desperation and rage are so palpable, and she _doesn’t do it._ She does the “right thing”. And I put that in quotes because…is it the right thing? Doesn’t she deserve that freedom from the evil that was done to her? Doesn’t that random man deserve punishment? Because Dr. Melfi never gets that justice, nor that freedom or closure or mercy. She chooses to live with that horror in silence, forever.
@Pure Kino , can you please do a video about the only true love story in the Sopranos - Tony and Artie? Artie was able to borrow 50k, beat up Benny, convince Tony to not murder the Pedo and point a gun all without Tony's punishment! Tony's one true love!
I'm putting this response in a place of prominence 😃
Well done, Kino! Thanks for another great video...and thanks fr the links to Allison and Phillip!
I'm sorry, but your assessment of why she left Tony is wrong. She left Tony because it had gotten to the point where she was getting negative judgment from her peers for treating him. She read the literature on sociopaths and realized it was right. She could no longer lean on the excuse that she might be able to help him, and the fact that continuing the therapy would cause her professional embarrassment pushed her over the edge into dumping him as a patient.
as a therapist. I can not even watch this show and say no, no she was not.
Short answer: No.
Long answer: No, but she was a damn good consigliere.
She was second best first was sil
That's absolutely beautiful! Perfect comment.
How come "Dr. Melfi" didn't convince James Gadolfino to lose weight, eat healthy meals, and exercise? He might have lived longer.
Hell no she wasn't. I remember after Pie o mi was killed and Tony was crying about she was very dismissive about it and said it's just a horse.
And? It was just a horse.
The important thing to know is Narcissists make you think for a long time that you can change them, but eventually you realize it's all a con. Everything a Narcissist does is a con.
Everybody is making this more complex than it needs to be. This is a relationship between a man and a woman. It's impossible to deny that Tony and the Doctor were attracted to each other. Melfi knew from the very first episode that Tony was a mobster and this excited her. She compromised immediately because she was curious and thrilled by this dangerous man. This wasn't a romantic relationship exactly, but it was a mutual affection dynamic. Tony liked that she was Italian, and pretty. Also, Tony was a hound, so his attraction was primal. The ending of the relationship was prefect since this is the way most relationships end. It's never pretty and never satisfying. Melfi ended the relationship because she felt like she was being used and unappreciated. Even the trivial matter of the magazine was only a final straw that proved to her that Tony was completely selfish. Tony also had mommy issues and Melfi was his surrogate mother. Tony couldn't communicate with his wife, his mother and even his daughter. Melfi was a woman who allowed him to expose his vulnerable side without judgement. Tony felt as if he could communicate with Melfi. This means he came to rely on his being able to vent during his sessions. When Tony tried to confide in friends, it was a complete failure. Both Tony and Melfi were in need of the other. Tony needed a gentle listener. And Melfi needed a challenge in hopes of breaking out of her own psychological prison. After all, she also had a therapist and her own issues. Tony and Melfi became co-dependent on the other for the wrong reasons. I love the dynamic of the relationship. It's so true to life, and mirrors my own interactions in therapy with women. I've seen firsthand what drives social workers to want to take on an almost impossible task. They want to save the world. Melfi wanted to save Tony, so she could save herself.
Tony wanted to be nurtured. Tony was a baby.
Idk man, that sounds kinda complex ahaha
@@chasejordan9295 exactly
@@chasejordan9295 I don't think so. He's describing normal male/female interaction.
@@yannick245 Yea, that ain't "normal" to be attracted to a sociopathic killer my boy. It's normal to be attracted to excitement and adventure, and a strong male and all that, but not normal to be attracted to *that.*
Through most of the second half of the show, Melfi was no longer attracted to Tony in any way, she even became repulsed by him. She really wanted to help him though and it took her a while to really see and believe that the kind of therapy she was giving him just wasn't helping.
No psychologist would see a mobster . This is one aspect of the show that was utterly ridicules
LIterally Tony in every session : This therapy is bullshit , blah blah blah ! See you next week....
I saw Melfi as someone who adapted to what she had to work with professionally. She definitely broke some ethical principles when it came to discussing Tony outside of work, but she remained as professional as she could during treatment.
Tony was making significant progress but he was never going to strive for better change. Melfi recommended him going to CBT to progress from psychotherapy, quitting his job in the mafia, and challenging his thoughts and lifestyle. But the series proved that Tony would never truly get better because of his involvement in the mafia. So the ending of the show hit harder when Melfi took the professional route and dropped him as a patient, showing us that he was hopeless in redemption at that point
more like Dr. Milfy amirite
Low key was waiting for a BetterHelp plug 😅. Great video though !
Melfi as a therapist it was never her job to fix Tony's morality or get him to stop being a criminal, anymore than it would be a heart doctor's job, and that's the crux of the issue. Whether it's Tony or some "regular person", a therapist doesn't make a more moral person, it makes a more stable and insightful psyche, but that's it. The job was to fix his panic attacks primarily, and perhaps help lead him to some emotional breakthroughs and insights. We can see she's hardly professional (and her therapist is less professional than her, as he casually breaks privilege). Tony is her celeb client, but once her peers rejected that they rejected her too. It was peer pressure and social embarrassment that drove her in the end, as well as probably fear (the last part being at least understandable). But in the end, who was she in Tony's world? Just another self-interested character trying to survive North Jersey.
As a huge fan of Lorraine Bracco, I loved every scene and every New York accented word that came out of her mouth. She was an excellent addition to this incredible cast of characters. She was right about how the relationship should have been ended just as she was right about not accepting the initial offer to play Tonys wife. So, I think all the analysis that was done here was fantastic. I watched it so I could watch Lorraine at her craft with her elegance, beauty and East Coast edge. Love that woman! ❤🎉
Another great, insightful video!
It felt like the show was making a definitive statement about Melphi and Tony when it repeatedly reframed their relationship by showing the sharp contrast with that other therapist that Carmela saw, and when it showed her reading the study. Which was that Melphi was not helping Tony become a better person because he didn't want to, and that that had essentially become a normal or accepted thing in their dynamic. The fact that he was a brutal criminal had become a part of the basic contract of personal acceptance between therapist and client, when it either should never have, or at least it should only have if it was temporary and it gave him the space to change. Tony did not want to change, and Melphi had allowed her concern for Tony to cloud her judgement about that. She was enabling him. I think she confronted that mistake at the end of the show, and that the show considers her to have finally made the right decision after a series of wrong ones.
Going to be a solid "no" from me, and Chase himself illustrates precisely why in "second opinion" - when carmella goes to the other therapist he 100% lays exactly whats wrong on the table, and indirectly blasts Melfi:
"Many patients want to be excused for their current predicament because of events that occurred in their childhood. That’s what psychiatry has become in America. Visit any shopping mall or ethnic pride parade and witness the results."
Its clear that Tony has unresolved trauma from his childhood, and he absolutely needed to resolve that, but while he absolutely would not have listened to Krakower, what Tony REALLY needed was to confront the hard truths about his lifestyle and what it was doing to him and his family.
Damn your bias is showing
@@sagvjc2525 Oooooh!! He's just sayin how Tony f*n perceives
@@threegenders201 "going to be a solid "no" from me". Did you not read the first sentence?? Lol
I should also mention that there's an ongoing theme in the show of people going to therapists and then just not taking the therapists advice whatsoever, so judging on a purely consequentialist basis, it may not be possible to be a good therapist in the sopranos universe, because no one ever seems to listen to them.
@@sagvjc2525 just worry about how you're f*n perceived. I'm past worrying I gotta be top commenter every second
I feel like therapists are generally self-important hacks and manipulative quacks (like Kupferberg). Melfi at least wanted to help Tony and was a genuine person. So I’ll give her some credit. But I don’t think he wanted help
It's not a cop-out answer at all... the show (like life) is far too complicated for such a reductive answer as yes or no. I think Melfi may be a great therapist for someone who wants real change, but the only change Tony wants is to stop having panic attacks, mainly in order to thrive as a mafia boss... as you said, judging by his absence of attacks by the final season, the therapy could be considered a "success".
However, those panic attacks are a result of the life he leads - the symptom, not the cause... repeated panic attacks can be the wake-up call you need to turn your life around. But instead of changing his behavior, he wants to be able to continue causing incredible pain & devastation, only without his conscience screaming out and incapacitating him. You can see Melfi occasionally pleading with him to fundamentally alter his life, but he seems to be learning about his conscience merely to shut it out, to better manipulate others and to supply himself with excuses for acting the way he does. He has become far worse by the end of the series - committing several horrific acts that would've previously caused more attacks - yet he no longer has them. By series end, he has finally become the mythic _golem,_ the walking dead; you can see it in his eyes during his peyote trip in the Vegas casino, when his "luck" changes... he is dead inside.
Progress? 🤔 I think not lol... but that's on Tony. The conundrum from episode one, is that any true growth on his part would almost certainly necessitate him leaving the Jersey mob. Of all the critiques Chase gives us of American society, this is one of the greatest, to me: our tendency to always treat the symptoms of a problem, never the root cause. Tony only lets Melfi help with symptoms, not the cause...
Fantastic analysis ✨️
Narcissists, sociopaths, and physcopaths can’t get better with therapy and can get worse with their manipulation.
She's one of my favorite characters. She's pretty incredible.
Wasen't it AJ telling Livia that Tony visits a shrink, and Livia then playing Junior like a child and puts the idea in his head to have Tony killed?
Yeah AJ dropped the ball
any psychiatrist worth his salt, would have refused him from the first encounter. they're trained how to respond to criminals.
A therapist who takes your money for longer than 6 months of a bad therapist.