Is Luca Turin a Charlatan?
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- Опубликовано: 28 окт 2024
- Luca Turn Annihilates Les Abstraits Des Cendres calls it "Awful...brutally chemical" - we discuss and debate this on the livestream.
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Les Abstraits Des Cendres
Hi Ramsey, I have a very large fragrance collection and have tried Des Cendres, I really did not like it, it really does feel like you are supporting this because it is Eugene! I love Eugene but think this is a miss, don’t forget, Eugene has not held back on other fragrances in the past when he didn’t like them. Luca can have his opinion and like it or not, is well respected in the community.
You can say you didn't like it but don't question my integrity
Ask yourself this, would you make as much fuss if Luca had commented similar about another fragrance brand? that should answer the integrity question for you!
Go watch my 30 minute review of Des Cendres, and read his 2 sentence blurb, and tell me who deserves to be questioned.
BTW if you watch my channel regularly, which I think you are new to my channel, go watch my 1000 + videos, not behind a paywall like Luca & tell me who's integrity should be questioned. Go on, I will wait. Might take you 6 months or so to catch up on my content. And yes if Luca said something about any other fragrance that I consider the fragrance of year, for me Des Cendres is the best fragrance of 2023, I would have responded the same way. But he is entitled to his opinion.. I am entitled to call him out on it
Ramsey, I am not new to your videos. I have watched at least half and liked your video’s and Rich’s because it wasn’t all about getting adds in. I also love Eugen’s because he was a big Chanel fan like me, I am not new to this, started collecting in the 80’s, with Chanel, Dior etc after trying Cuir de Russie and purchased 5 bottles to collect, I have over 200 Chanel alone, mostly older like Bois Noir, God knows how many bottles of other brands and stopped trying to categorise years ago when it got into the many 100’s, some shops in the UK call me if they get something older I might want, last week I purchased 5 of the silver discs of YSL Nu from 2002. So please don’t treat everyone like they have 2 bottles of Sauvage and don’t have a clue, why do all RUclipsrs talk like they are the only experts? You all follow the same trend, hate PDM, Initio, etc it’s like a script you all must follow. To be honest, I find a lot of the RUclipsrs do it because they are lonely or have nothing else to do and feel the need to keep pushing content out, I don’t hide behind anything, I just don’t agree with all your comments. It was odd that Luca gave an opinion, and you and Rich come out screaming, making rude comments, it’s just in poor taste. Take Fragrantica, on Belle Ame, a reviewer (mignique) summed things up with a long review that I am sure didn’t go down well. But he has some points, the same group of people, Houdini4, Cdub5, alphairone, all absolutely love everything Eugen does, really? Fully understand wanting to support your friend like anyone would, but it’s not correct to stick the boot in if someone calls you out or doesn’t agree with your comments. Let’s leave it at that, you have your opinion, I have mine!
I did a Belle Ame review didn't buy it and bought something else over it instead.... I have publicly said I like Herod & Layton even though they are what they are...if you are going to talk ish at least get your facts straight... your name doesn't ring much of a bell in the comments section is why I said you must be new to the channel...but if you are not and just lurked a lot what make you feel so compelled to so strongly comment on this video? Lol
In fragrances more than anything else i think you have to accept people can have totally opposing opinions, i often agree with you, sometime disagree, but i don't hate you for it (i love your videos and your genuine love for fragrances), nor does it change the opinions i have, sometimes my views on a perfume is so different from yours that my first reaction is to think you are desingenuous and then i remember that we are talking about fragrances and that people are experiencing them totally differently.
That's true but there are some ground rules...he called a chypre a fougere.... and some of the comparisons he makes are like WHAT?! But you are correct it's all subjective
@@RamseytheRam Yes he is not the most consitent and i 100% agree that his reviews are low effort and lack in actual information/analysis , i think he found his niche, the snarky perfume reviewer with one liners, looks like it's working for him, and it can be pretty fun
I've always considered Turins reviews the same way as anyone else's, as their own subjective opinions, some we may agree on and, some we may disagree on. Eg, Turin highly rated one of my past signature scents, and utterly trashed another, but it doesn't change my own personal opinion of those fragrances, (or make either one of us right or wrong).
I think the only people paying to access Turins opinions will be those who already know what to expect, ie brief, sometimes amusing, word salad.
It wont do Les Abstraits any damage, if anything it will just bring more attention to a house that some people haven't heard of.
Agreed... I loved Eugene's response
Well to give another discurse. Mona di Orio was pretty backed down on US market because of his reviews. I mean i personally can not say that he is not one of the most sought perfume reviewers but yeah he tends to be hateful for some reason that goes beyond objective fragrance opinion. And is strange to see a scientist with such a big ego as a part of reviewing not a perfumer per se. Also i must admit that the funny tone he gives through his reviews kinda goes in same way with his very subjective opinions of social roles and perfume in meaning how your personality should transcend through it
To be fair, vintage Eugene reviews used to tear up fragrances he didn't like and used all sorts of expletives without holding back.
That's cool I like that type of content👍🏻
It's been a while since I watched this channel, I'm happy to see that everything continues as usual. Best regards.
David.
😂😂😂
Welcome back 💪🐏
I bought an earlier edition of Perfumes A-Z for a few dollars at a used bookstore, and i was surprised as others have mentioned about how short some of the reviews were (literally one-line anecdotes that barely describe the actual perfume), or how long they could be without saying much about how the perfume smells or performs at all until the very last few lines. He goes off on really odd tangents, trying to seem smug by being able to ignore the substance of what he is reviewing and instead going off into meta territory. He’s supposed to be a professional… what? Chemist? That instantly makes him an authority on what objectively smells good? He even admits he wore the same fragrance for a very long time, so, how much does he really test all of these out anyway? He probably judges most based on a quick test strip sampling lol. Some of the best reviews I’ve ever read or heard came from amateur nobodies.
That right there is the power of the internet... it breaks down the silos that these supposed people of authority have... I was given a free one month substack subscription by Rachel to Luca Turin Substack... I would bet everything I have that my free youtube channel in a small corner of fragcom offers WAY more substance and insight in the fragrance world than him hiding behind his paywall
To me personally it is his subjective opinion/conclusive anecdote, which doesn't necessarily allign with my own, and what's more important - it doesn't really influence me - respectfully, as well as does not yours.
And I believe that we should perceive it as such - it's fun & exciting when there are occasional common grounds that we can resonate at, but in the end we are building the frag collections, big and small, based on our own cravings and preferences, and our own only.
All I'm saying that it's his opinion, not even a professional one, but an enthusiastic one. And that comes to the "guide" too - I struggle to believe that anyone reasonable takes it as a bible: it's chuckle-full and ironic, and in that way iconic, but pulp fiction, worth a weekly column in some edgy magazine to be taken in with good humor, is all.
Him bashing your friend's creation might have been not entirely fair, but the same way you have at times been bashing quite severely Bianchi and Marly products too, and none of their fanbase been making up these kinds of reactions.. Not that I'm enjoying any of those, but I'm just thinking whether this counter-action was a right thing to do in the time when shit is hitting the fan way too often around us all 🕊️✌🏼
Cheers!
Edit: syntax
Thanks for sharing your thoughts 🙏
I thought Luca Turin retired from fragrance reviews. But yes, I developed a distase for him as a reviewer as well. The straw that broke the camel's back for me was rating Cool Water over Green Irish Tweed. He hates everything Creed and lets his hate influence his critiques.
He did step away...then he stepped back in using substack or something...either way he wants you to pay
He also rates every single Lorenzo Villoresi fragrance a 1 star. And they’re all very well blended, composed, and its clear that some are better than others so to basically rate them all evenly means theres some underlying motive, as if he just personally dislikes Villoresi the person, and even if 90% of fragrance enthusiasts respect and like a certain fragrance (Teint de Neige, Musk, Alamut, Kamasurabhi, etc.) he’ll still rate it a zero just because he hates the guy. If you go on Fragrancenet you’ll see many people disagree with his perspective, although I do agree with him that Mitsuoko is one of the greatest masterpieces of all time.
@992turbos yes he was smart enough to navigate his way around the vintage Guerlain minefield... there would have been hell on if he gave Mitsouko a 1 ⭐️
That whole star rating system is just dumb anyways... why not 1.3 stars... or 4.7 ... it's just compressed sound bites for the masses
I'm not a longtime follower of Eugen but have watched his videos off and on and it's ABUNDANTLY clear that he is a true lover of fragrance and not an influencer shill ala TLTG. Because of that, I've always been tempted to pick up samples of his frags because I knew they would be expressions of art rather than cash grabs. I'll confess that Luca's recent review of Des Cendres is what pushed me over the edge into buying a sample.
Luca's certainly entitled to his opinion, but it's absolutely absurd that he says it's "brutally chemical." It's really one of the most natural-smelling fragrances I've come across and probably the most accurate recreation of the scent of the forest I've smelled. It really seems like he went out of his way to be needlessly cruel in his assessment of it; that's what I think people have taken umbrage about (and rightfully so.)
Yes Luca writes like he is offended someone like Eugene could possibly start a brand that is a great brand... meanwhile he just angrily yells at the sky
Yea, Ram totally. When someone (an "Author" er "Critic") passes off their perspective as an objective one - such as Turin - while only offering subjective conjecture and hyperbole that's obviously founded in their personal bias... Why should anyone put more weight in his words than anyone else's, let alone against their own feelings from just sampling the damn thing; And how long has Turin been doing this (after an alleged break)?.. Pomposity is a helluva drug.
Pompous is spot on .... he is just an elitist ... I like to think everyone is welcome, he seems to want to only allow people in the club if he deems it acceptable
@@RamseytheRam Exactly, a very apperent elitist mentality. And, duelly noted long ago, good sir - is also among the reasons why someone like myelf gravitate to a channels like this of yours 🙏
Where did he wrote it? Where can we find the text?
His substack accout or maybe IG I don't remember
Ramsey, I’m only 10 minutes into your video, so pardon me if I am pointing out something that you addressed yourself, but . . . Since I was unfamiliar with Luca Turin (neophyte here) I Googled him and he’s in Wikipedia- he is said to have a scientific theory of olfaction that I won’t bore you with, but there are no fewer than 20 citations in Wikipedia to scientific articles about studies that not only disprove, but also appear to make fun of his supposedly scientific theory. (There may be more than 20, but some of them were in French, so . . . )
No I didn't see that lol
That is hillarious
There is a great book about this called The Emperor of Scent
let's pretend to be civilized
Weren't we? 🤷🏻♂️
I could not stand Des Cendres, DE is perfect. But do Cendres did not work- something is missing in its construct.
Well to each their own ... what do you think they should have added? I love it as much as Devin and I consider Devin one of the greatest Green Chypres of all time 💪🐏
@@RamseytheRam I am unsure, but maybe less smoke and more honey patchouli. The problem is that I have over 200 fragrances, and we have similar taste- and Gentleman Givenchy vintage has ruined me forever, in the best way possible.
@samtoronto9121 🤣🤣🤣
I hear ya...but this composition just isn't that
It’s that theory of vibration with respect to different types of molecules that was disproved by the 20 plus articles cited in Wikipedia- he certainly sounds like a charlatan, or maybe he’s just foolish.
Ohhhh interesting ... thanks for sharing 👍🏻
Auphorie does have few very nice compositions!
Oud Ipraxan
Encens Oud Huangdi
Never smelled anything from the house but I have heard baaaaad things
Hey Ram just catching up with all your stuff as I’ve been away visiting family. Well what can I say about this- hopefully any publicity is good publicity! 😂
That's it! 💪🐏
☆Hi Ram, I can confirm we do indeed 'smell vibrations' whence farting... oh, and apparently when L. Turin speaks😂!!! I dono the guy, and judging by the critiques, probably well off for it. I love fragrance and moreover those who take the time to craft creations as expressions of their passion and devotion to making the world a better smelling place☆much luv and cheers to the whole of the Ram Frag Fam♡♡♡🐏🐏🐏🐏🐏🐏🐏🐏🐏🐏🐏🐏🐏
Yes we are way more into fragrance than that guy is.. I can tell you that
When I read his one-line review of Must de Cartier I gave up on his whole book. Must is the green Shalimar for me, LT is essentially an entertainer imo, not serious about perfume, he'll sacrifice any good fragrance for a one-liner.
Well said...
Great point. Sometimes he puts little to no effort into his reviews, meanwhile some of his reviews will literally be one line about how the perfumer made no effort according to him.
Because perfume is SERIOUS business and not just entertainment for the nose...
Turin is, at times, looked at like a god-like figure of the perfume journalistic world, but it is just a fancily dressed up opinion, that is all it is. His A-Z guide with Tania Sanchez is a useful reference book (for me anyway) but it is not the Magna Carta, you are well within your rights to disagree. And some of their one star reviews in there are bordering on personal, scything attacks.
Well said... thanks for watching & commenting 🍻
Only 12 minutes into watching this and I just went and blind bought the 100ml because, fuck it. 👊🏼👊🏼
Heck ya😂 💪🐏
Yes seems like Luca really hacked your mic bad! 😂😂
🤣🤣🤣
To be fair if he finds something uninspiring, it's hard to give a detailed review when there're countless of other fragrances waiting. But I've seen him giving better reasonings for much worse.
My problem with him is about him not being impartial enough. If a brand does something that he doesn't like (branding, pricing, naming, marketing etc...) then he would be dismissive and sassy. I dislike Roja for various reasons, but to say his scents are downright terrible felt dishonest to say the least.
I agree I find him very childish
@@RamseytheRam Also I just saw his Twitter, yeah that guy is very fond of his own world view apparently. Maybe his status overinflated his ego abit, but one might think he'd be abit more subjective considering he's a professor and all.
I can assure you Luca didn’t even know by him doing this he was just finishing him self by him self
The phrasing on his review is just him being nasty. Not an opinion that I'd pay for...
If you are going to dump on something there are so many fragrances worthy to dump on... but Des Cendres ? Come on
@@RamseytheRam Well - I think there's likely more to it.
He hasn't seen much success with RUclips for example (he dislikes YT I think), so there's probably some pettiness and disgruntlement in there. All he does by posting that kind of content is reveal that and therefore reinforce how irrelevant his opinion is.
It was just quite funny as I was literally talking about Des Cendres recently and meaning to get samples... so odd timing. Turin's an ass.
@@beebot yup I agree... I think youtube brings out someone's personality... you can't hide who you are on yt
Damn that’s a really groovy cold! Your throat sounds almost electronic
🤣🤣🤣
Great stream Rams, hopefully you’ll kick that annoying sickness, Anyways Luca Turin should stick to his scientific lane and focus on whatever degree he got in whatever field he plodded around in , that is if he hasn’t been ridiculed by his peers as a self proclaimed expert and therefore dismissed by all in that scientific arena , That said he is of course entitled to his opinion as everybody is , however if anyone is held in an esteem in a particular subject, then by god they have a responsibility to be very careful and precise and factually on point with that opinion,good or indeed damning, as they can be called out and disputed far more than an avegage joes just shooting their mouths, cheers buddy stay safe and happy Saturday 💪👊🤛
Well said Bren... you sir are getting a knack for these comments 🍻
Spot on
I just kind of found out about Luca Turin this year and watched some video with him and his wife and I also got a free month where I could read his content. Not impressed. Watching the video, my impression was that he was a tired and bored old man that didn’t even seem to enjoy fragrance. I couldn’t watch to the end, it was too boring. Very low energy. I have skimmed one of his review books and the ratings honestly seemed very random. These three encounters, video, blog and book left me feeling done with this guy. Nothing he says now could convince me about anything regarding fragrance!
Spot on
Do you have some guy friends who will wear these fragrances of yours so you can judge the scents from that perspective?
Nahhh I judge everything on my own skin for the most part... sometimes a guy I work with will wear fragrances I own to work and I can usually pick them out pretty easily... also sometimes I will put fragrance on my daughter... but this channel is about my journey through the fragrance 🌎
@@RamseytheRam good answer. I got into this passion during the pandemic. I have collected around 150 samples and two dozen full bottles. I always go back to Creed because it’s so easy to wear and they’re all good. I’ve worn GIT since the early 90’s as my signature scent but got tired of wearing the same thing every day. I’ve always enjoyed a good scent.
It’s not even Luca disliking des cendres.. it’s the cheek to make people pay for what is essentially a blurb
Yes! Cheeky 🍑
I guess anyone who knows of him would know to expect that, so would know in advance what they're going to get in return.
Old ramsey is back. You can't buy ramsey! no amonth of money can beat the truth.
@@hichouification I plan to stay that way 💪🐏
Whenever I encounter hyperbolic fragrance review with some kind of unrelated anecdote just to piss on a fragrance I tune out.
Shame Luca would do stuff like that, for whatever reason...
He's not made for 2024 ....not a fan of hiding behind a paywall... what's funny is Rachel bought me a months subscription and I felt the content I was putting out for free was better than his written content
@@RamseytheRam
He is all over the place.
Took a peek at his twitter account, think he's just gone full cuckoo.
It is definitely a working theory
Food for thought brother. You always talk about these huge conglomerates acquiring all these colossal larger then life brands. Do you not think they could pay someone like Luca Turin to take a piss on Eugene's perfume and brand who are still able to provide you fragrances worth your dollar. You already gave an e.g. of going paid subscriptions for monetary gains!! Money motivates him clearly. Since all these bigger conglomerates or brands falling under them don't have the intestinal fortitude to give you what Les Abstraits and Papillon are able to offer you at the price they do!
Yeah nothing surprises me anymore tbh
It's an interesting thought
I'm with you bro all the way!! I'm glad we have a beacon ... a light. A sense of belonging I find in you and the niche artisan fragrance houses. Ritchie mitch, Eugene, robes08 etc
Kind of have more clarity when I see reviewers pushing the same brands and them fuck boy flankers and dud releases.
Keep up the movement... what you've started is colossal bro
I'm making myself a tee ... it'll read I don't need fragrantica ... at the backbiting says I've got The RAM 🐏
Tuck Furin
👌
Wonder if Lil Luca has ever ranked any of Antoine’s work? I won’t bother to check because he’s irrelevant.
Seems like a jaded kook.
😂😂😂
Kook lol
I bought a lot of good perfume when his first book came out of his recommendations for which I’m thankful but he wrote Creed original vetiver was a mess which completely threw me. Might not be the best scent ever made but it can’t be called a mess !
Yeah I agree....thanks for watching & commenting 🍻
The audio is scratchy, Ramsey.
It is only a short time it's scratchy....I didn't realize streamyard changed my mic mid stream... that's why
This was fun Tfs
Glad you enjoyed... I liked making it 🤣
Still scratchy
💪🐏
Yes yes, luca turin is an arrogant jerk! Couldn't even acknowledge that even ONE roja dove was good. And claimed that diaghilev was downright terrible..
He just goes on these crusades against brands...not everything Roja did was good and not everything was bad....but to not give everything a fair shake seems to be his coming undone