Watsonville, CA Mid-Air Collision August 19, 2022
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- Опубликовано: 18 авг 2022
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As an old Cherokee pilot, this one ticks me off. The older, more experienced, richer, hot rod twin pilot comes blasting in like an X15 to an uncontrolled airport where the less experienced, new pilot is doing training touch and goes around and around the pattern. The hot rod twin pilot automatically assumes that his hot rod status gives him priority. A Cessna 150 is about the slowest bird out there, and it's so slow that after watching the twin barreling down on him, he couldn't even get out of the way. Airplanes are hard to see in ground clutter. The twin pilot was careless and reckless barging straight in to a pattern where he knew there were at least two other airplanes flying "normal" rectangular patterns. How was he going to stop anyway? Chop power, shock cool engines, dump the flaps, dump the gear, plop it down and stand on the brakes? The 152 pilot should have made an emergency steep turn away from the extended center line of the runway to get away from the twin pilot, but who wants to steep turn away from somebody you can no longer see when you're only a few hundred feet in the air? We're not crop duster pilots! Standard pattern entry at uncontrolled airports is recommended for just this reason. Straight in approaches are always subject to higher risk. There's a reason such a high percentage of mid air collisions happen on short final! Great job as usual Juan!
I wonder if a dive toward the ground and a medium steep left turn would have cleared the twin? I have a lot of time in Cessna 150/152's and that is all I can think of. Try to go down and away.
Geof, as a 11000 hour CFI, I think you dead on spot. The Airman's Information Manual states, aircraft are to enter uncontrolled airports at a 45 degree to downwind leg only. Any other leg, then they should yield to any aircraft that they are creating a conflict with. Just because they have a more expensive aircraft does not give them the right of way. The 340 is guilty of "careless and reckless operation of an aircraft". In other words, he is 'Dead wrong'.
Geoffrey, as an old Grumman pilot, I share all those emotions and I share your chop on this. I'm sure you've been in this situation and after a near disaster having gone to the "X15 pilot" with too much testosterone and had a chat with the offender on the ramp after turning off the aluminum fans. My experiences in those conversations has been mixed. Sometimes my inner drill sergeant did the talking. In other cases my plodding detective Columbo did the talking. Regardless of who does the talking, I like to tell them something like this: "Five decades of flight experience talking here, I've seen this before, I know how it ends - you probably think you're going to live forever, but you're wrong. You think you're lucky, but fate will catch you. If you don't change, I can see how it ends for you." I really hate these moments.
As an 1800-hour pilot, I only do straight ins when the tower says so. at my home field I always flew the correct approaches just because of Idiots like this.
@Geoffrey Arnold Exactly my thoughts!
This has been a complaint of mine for years as a tower controller. These high performance twins and singles refuse to slow down and insist on doing in excess of 150kts in the pattern full of Cessnas and Cherokees doing 90. They get indignant when you ask them to slow.
Some people learn very difficult lessons when they can just pull back on the ego.
sad when someone puts speed in front of safety. The one thing I have learned from watching Juan is taking responsibility for safety
As a former, now retired, airline pilot, I thought the tower controllers had a bit of pull with the FAA. As far as reporting those bozos that don't pay by the rules. Lots of egos out there, just like the guy in the 340 in this accident. What an ass, actually. !80 kts on final when the gear speed is 140 - what in the hell was he thinking?
I fly a King Air and go into some busy GA fields. They always ask us to slow down to slowest possible speed and I slow down as much as possible
@@kenclark9888 you sir are the real MVP, but unfortunately the exception to the rule.
Thank you as always for your professional and thorough report. This is reason 25 why I stopped flying as a private pilot. I’ve been in this exact scenario at least three or four times. In all cases I extended my downwind in anticipation of the faster aircraft. I absolutely despise straight in approaches at uncontrolled controlled fields. This guy came screaming in because he didn’t feel like waiting in line with everybody else. The Cessna did everything right and ultimately cost him his life. He monitored and communicated on the frequency and scanned for traffic, and recognize the threat and decided to go around. This one just makes me mad. Rest In Peace
152 made the right decision to go around and call it on radio. 340 should have immediately done the same.
Yes.
Scott, I am not a pilot but the ONE time I went up with an acquaintance who just got his license, he had to peel out of the pattern because of another pilot who wasn't communicating his actions.
I remember flying into Elstree airport near London as a student in a 152, also no ATC at that time, and my instructor told me a few days previously a Grumman Tiger (low wing) had landed on top of a student 152 (high wing) as they came into land. No radio calls from the Tiger, 152 normal calls. Luckily no one was hurt but the wheels came through the 152 roof and barely missed the student. One of the many reasons I also no longer fly.
I agree that the 152 pilot did everything right, but I'm a student myself. During my training my instructor has called to other pilots more than once to notify them there are other aircraft in the pattern and to request the join on thw downwind leg. A direct call like this to the twin may have avoided this tragedy.
That old timer 340 pilot just grinds my gears. I’m sorry I’m not ageist but we all know those type of old timers and their attitudes. When you assume you know it all that’s when disasters happen in the air and you put countless lives in the danger flying like that.
So sad. This is why we have traffic patterns! I know people don’t have to use them … but this is why we use them. I know it’s tempting to do a long straight in, especially after a long flight
, but this is why we have traffic patterns. Thanks for the report Juan
I've seen many of your videos and have nothing but respect for you and your passion for teaching, but this is short sighted. You know as well as anyone that InFO 15012 requires VMC practice IAPs to be flown to the DA/MDA for each published segment in order to satisfy 61.57(c). Yes, use the traffic pattern when you can, but it's not that simple. The regulations literally require that you not at least 6 times semi-annually to be a legal IFR pilot. So let's stop pretending that just flying the traffic pattern is a panacea. There are legitimate reasons to fly long straight ins, and maintaining instrument currency and proficiency is one of the most compelling.
The real solutions: see and avoid, keep your head on a swivel, understand 91.113(g), operate your plane in a manner compatible with 91.13, understand what other plane's telephonics suggest about their speed, don't turn base in front of and cut off fast moving traffic established on a 3mi final, understand non-standard traffic pattern entry, know what spots in the air may be hot spots (similar to the ones on your taxi diagram), etc. Really just live the aviation lifestyle. Go all in, commit, practice regularly, study the FARs, and stay proficient.
At the end of the day, the 340 driver was likely operating in violation of 91.13, but he had the right of way. 91.113(g) and NTSB Order No. EA-4236 clearly settle that matter. The 152 erred in cutting off traffic established on final, and in so doing killed himself and 2 others.
Yes! I have flown in Watsonville many a time. I never use a straight in. I overfly above pattern altitude to get a visual on the situation and then set up an entry into the pattern depending on what type of traffic and weather. Fly the pattern! The C340 driver was just out of control on this approach. The approach speeds were unreal and I really question his motives at those speeds.
Exactly. In my flightschool all of our teachers would have killed me if I would've told them that I'll go for a straight in approach at an uncontrolled field. Doesn't matter where we are coming from and what the active runway is, we always enter 45 degrees in the downwind. And there are many tragic evidences from the past that you are way better off spending an additional 5 minutes to enter via the downwind and live another 40 years rather than losing your life just because you tried to save 5 minutes in an approach...
@@ss-tx-rx2860 recipe for disaster shooting an instrument approach to uncontrolled field, head in the cockpit and not looking outside for vfr traffic. Total tragedy, must have been terrifying for all three victims.
@@ss-tx-rx2860 I might agree with part of your post, if 340 was actually being flown like on a instrument approach, you don’t fly approaches, even practice ones above gear and flap speed. The 340 looks to be in violation of 91.13, and the 152 had the right of way as he was lower. I’m sure the speed of the 340 surprised the 152. Total cowboy flying.
Juan Brown - Your saving lives with these videos. These are teachable incidents, and your work matters. Please continue doing what you're doing here. SC
I met Juan a year ago, shook his hand and said almost the exact same thing. #truth
@Are Dee the rules of aviation are written in aviators blood unfortunately.
These types of videos are an educational to all aviators.
Having abandoned flying after forty years I still listen to every word from Juan. What a service to the profession his insights. Truly unique. Once as I was about to rotate in a 150 at a small field much to my surprise a twin Barron was about to land from downwind. The Barron pilot was never on the radio and did not have any idea where he was.
@@georgyporgy777 two mini strokes
I was there. I was ordering lunch at the restaurant just off the runway when this happened with my good friend who actually knows the pilot of 90FL.
We had just landed about 10 minutes earlier, and were on the CTAF with the 152. It was pretty crazy and horrifying seeing it happen, especially right after talking to the victim of it.
I looked over after someone exclaimed, so all I saw was debris falling down and the twin cessna going wayyy too fast, with its gear and flaps up. (According to someone there, flightaware clocked them at about 190 knots at the time of the collision) I even thought it was going to go around and recover until I heard an explosion and saw a massive cloud of smoke coming up over the hangers between the restaurant and the twin Cessna’s final resting place.
After confirming what I saw with other people there, I thought at first that the twin cessna was just trying to show off by doing a low pass and didn’t take proper precautions.
Listening to the audio though, makes we wonder why the hell, if he DID intend to land (or at least stated so) he was carrying so much speed and had his gear up??
Based on the facts I’ve been given and the observations made by, and told to me, no matter how you look at it, it’s the fault of the twin Cessna’s pilot.
At the very best, he decided not to overfly the field to look for traffic, instead deciding to come straight in to a pattern with at least 2 other planes, while going a hell of a lot faster than both of them. Not to mention probably going well in excess of even his gear speed.
He was not technically breaking the law by doing so, but for those who don’t know, it’s a well known safety precaution/rule to fly above traffic pattern altitude over the field to get a sense of what’s going on before entering the pattern and coming in to land.
To be honest, not that it’s even anywhere close to an excuse for any pilot to be this careless, but I really believe that if Watsonville had a tower, which many people already believed it should (considering an average of about 150 arrivals a day) that this would’ve been easily avoided. I hope they finally decide to get one after this; not that it should’ve taken 4 deaths to get that to happen.
This guy killed himself, his passenger (who I assume is his wife, girlfriend, or some other family member), his pet dog, and a student pilot minding his own business in the pattern, all because he couldn’t bother to take the time to circle over the field, or to approach at a safe speed.
I'm not a pilot by any means but enjoyed your anecdotal experience. I find it CRAZY that an airport with 150 arrivals per day doesn't have a fucking tower! This is especially true when you consider all of the residential and commercial buildings in the pattern.
Saying that he was coming full stop while making preparations for a high speed fly over is a pilot deviation.
It seems like the Cessna 340 was basically in the wrong for multiple reasons. Way too fast, not respecting the existing traffic in the pattern, just assuming they can beat the other aircraft to the punch. My feeling is that's why he had such a high rate of speed; he figured he could beat the 152 which was still downwind, and make them have to go around. Turns out his math was off.
I see this happen a lot on road construction projects when we close 1 lane out of 2 in the same direction. People will accelerate into the construction zone to get ahead of slower traffic. We call it "racing to the taper."
@@smo-guiver8315 Totally relatable Smo,. In this instance, the" pilot" in the 340 most likely had to be "tapered" into the coffin because of his outlandish ego. Condolences to the families. Lesson for all of us humans. 🙏💫
@@hydroponichomesteader6852 Same here. My instructor never taught straight in approaches to uncontrolled airports.
I don't know. Looks a bit like cocaine does not mix with flying a high speed airplane.
@@smo-guiver8315 We call it "running the gauntlet" or "shooting the gap".
I have roughly 30 hours in the accident 152, and my sister witnessed it and called me right afterwards. I don’t believe I know anyone involved in this accident, but it certainly hits close to home. Juan I pretty much 100% agree with you, though due to local reports and webcams I believe the collision was more over the street near 20 with the 152 impacting right inside the airport boundary fence. We do have quite a bit of corporate and faster traffic at Watsonville, and just from radio calls I imagine the unbelievable closure speed threw the 152 pilot way off, assuming he would have been able to land and t/o before any sort of separation issues arose. I was at lunch shortly before this accident and then at least the pattern seemed fairly full so again why this 340 thought he could just slam through is irritating to say the least. Talking with others since yesterday, we shared our own near misses due to others pulling similar stunts, fly the standard approach at reasonable speeds and everyone gets to go home.
The 172 that I trained and check rode in, ended up having a fetality accident. It's awful that you can be the most prudent and cautious pilot, but still have to share the sky with arrogant pilots who think they're invincible. This is a lot of the reason why I no longer fly.
@@mctransportation9831 Gotten to be like riding a motorcycle. Really.
Do you think a tower controller should be used there?
@@Mike-01234 honestly I don’t know. Would it help, sure; but I would say that there would also be something lost as well. Something of a throwback to the golden age of aviation. Realistically while Watsonville frequently has more traffic than Salinas, due to the ILS and regional positioning I should think they should keep the tower there. I personally much prefer uncontrolled fields (I am biased as that’s how/where I started). The solution isn’t a tower though (see the recent Las Vegas accident), the solution is character and training people the value of patience, standards, and why those standards exist.
@@mctransportation9831 like @HotRod Ray says defensive tactics can certainly mitigate a lot of that risk, I hope you come back to flying. It’s sad this is such an issue in recent years…
Honestly I'm impressed the 152 could track the 340 behind him and overtaking. I've been into WVI several times in jets, the largest was pushing our luck in a G-III - I remember asking all the pattern aircraft to wait since we'd be running the circuit at 160 KIAS. The local traffic was kind enough to oblige and when we landed there was a lineup of a half dozen Cessnas waiting to get back in the air. That said, the twin Cessna coming in faster than I'd approach an uncontrolled airport in a jet, another pilot with too much airplane and not enough sense.
That last sentence is nicely phrased sir
Agreed
The 340 was never really behind the 152. When the 152 says "you're behind me" he's halfway through the base leg, and the 340 is 1.5 miles at 2 o'clock. Then when he says "you're coming up on me pretty quick" he is still about 45 degrees from runway heading and the 340 is 3 to 4 o'clock and 1/2 mile. I've been plotting the tracks in Google Earth, and there is a lot going on. I also took the C340 track from 8/12 between the same airports, and if you overlay that track onto the 8/18 track starting at 10 miles from the airport, he ends up 3 miles behind the 152. There is something going on with the speed of the C340, we may never know whey he flew so fast that day.
Mirrors freeway traffic.
@@josephkelley8641 you mean the drivers who have too much car and not enough sense?
Or if you meant something else please say more ...
Having landed at this airport 3 weeks ago, I might add my first time. It was a Saturday and busy I was coming from the north and considered a mid field fly over and tear drop into the downwind leg. But they had parachute operation that day and was concerned about a conflict. I considered a straight in approach but after listening to the traffic on the radio I opted for southern approach into a 45 into the downwind leg. There was at least 3 planes in the pattern doing pattern work and one other coming straight in, I had to extend my downwind for the straight in approach guy. Flying south and coming in on a 45 gave me time to assess all the planes in the pattern and where they were. Everyone was on there radios announcing their positions. Busy airport and very sad story, I’m not a fan of straight in approaches at uncontrolled airports.
Yeah, honestly, eliminating straight-ins to uncontrolled airports is a regulatory change I'd support. It would use up some additional fuel, but it would undoubtedly save lives.
I fully agree. I flew into and landed on 20 at KWVI many times. Extremely reckless conduct by the 340!
Unfortunately, the younger, fresher pilots think about these rules, but the older speed jocks somehow don't get this info in their flight reviews.
@@TheTiktok4321 You are making assumptions. Statistically, the most dangerous time for a pilot is between 400 and 800 hours, when they have sufficient experience to think they are competent and insufficient experience to realise that they are not.
Would have been my suggestion.
I think we all realize that you are limited in "hardware" to make such videos from a hotel room but it was still presented in a concise, understandable and informative manner. Good job.
VERY well done!
Sometimes, like this video, the pen-and-paper schematic are better at presenting the material.
I don’t think you needed much more hardware it was pretty cut and dry. I fly out of that airport all the time and he is absolutely correct.
Indeed!👍
That's an excellent point. I've never seen a video on this channel before this one, and it was clear this was not his normal setup. Considering he was holding a tablet up to the camera, playing radio transmissions through a speaker (from his phone or whatever), and relying on his own pencil drawing of the pattern (for the benefit of those of people like me who are not pilots and don't know the background), this was a very clear explanation of what happened. It's obvious, even to me, that the 152 pilot needed to take aggressive action to get out of the way, but he couldn't have possibly expected that the 340 was tearing in at a speed nearly twice anything safe. He first decided to land ahead of him, and then decided to go around. What he didn't know was that he needed to abandon the pattern completely and get well out of the way of this maniac. I guess it's important to assume that just because you're following the rules, doesn't mean everybody is.
“I see you, you’re behind me.”
“I’m gonna go around ’cause you’re coming at me pretty quick man.”
The 152 pilot clearly had sufficient situational awareness to be looking back, and was trying to get out of the way. My suspicion is that the 152 pilot heard the twin pilot call 10 mile final, and thought that he could safely make another touch and go and still be out of the way. He clearly didn’t think that the twin would be coming in so fast. Why would he? Why would anyone?
Plus, legally, he had right of way.
You are absolutely right, 10 miles out would normally mean you have 5 mins at least, which is enough time for a full pattern in a 150. The thing that comes with experience is to know that a twin on a straight-in approach will probably do everything they can to avoid a normal pattern, so the thing that I would have done - not saying that the 150 guy did anything wrong - is to announce an extended downwind to let the straight-in go in front. We have to accept the reality of how some of these guys fly, to keep ourselves safe.
@@dermick the C150 guy was probably TYRO and had already announced base, he should have just powered up straight through the extended centre line of final. Ah, the benefit of hind sight.
"Why would he?" Spot on. This poor kid was doing what he was trained to do. No way he had any idea this idiot was barreling in on him that fast. You can't tell how fast an object is going at that distance, but clearly the 152 pilot knew the 340 was way to fast to be on a full-stop final, unfortunately too late.
These guys are blaming the c150. With cowards like these, suckking the bigger airplanes like girls, USa GA will never be safe in the pattern. The faster guys know how coward the others are. the "I will zoom you coward girls" kind of BULLY will continue Showboating to others. You promote that. My CFI slapped a guy that zoomed him. The guy learned not to do that again, and even become a better pilot too and a friend of all.
There was 27 seconds between the 340's 3 mile call and 1 mile call, 4 miles a minute is 240kts. The adsb of 180 kts is completely reasonable, far too fast to be on short final. The 152 likely would have had a hard time getting a visual on the 340 with him 3 miles out, in the time it took the 152 to make the base to final turn the 340 closed the distance. 340 pilot was completely at fault for recklessly approaching the uncontrolled field at an excessive rate of speed. The 152 pilot paid the ultimate price for not visually identifying the 340 prior to turning final.
I'm not a pilot but curious about things in general. After the 152 announced that he would go around because of the closing speed of the 340, is the pilot of the 340 obligated to first see the 152 and know where it is before trying to land? Is it proper for the 340 pilot to acknowledge the report from the 152 to get them closer to being on the same page? It's sad because it seems to be so avoidable. The 152 says "I'm in front of you". The 340 pilot doesn't see him so should he assume the 152 is in his blind spot and act accordingly? Finally, I've flown many times in a friend's 172 up and down the state and most of the airports were uncontrolled. I cannot recall ever not making a pass around before landing. It was so routine that I just assumed it was required.
Couple of variables to think of. First, when the 340 called his position at 3 and 1 mile final where exactly was he when he called those positions? Was he visually looking and guessing his distance from the runway. Second, where did the 152 turn his base in relation to the runway and where base and final leg would intersect, perhaps putting him closer to the path of the 340 on final.
I think the Cessna 340 pilot was also reckless in declaring a straight-in approach to an uncontrolled field that can be fairly busy at times. It wouldn't have hurt him at all to make a high-altitude reconnaissance pass over the airport, then have descended and made a standard 45-degree entry into the downwind leg of the traffic pattern.
@@deernation9326 The 340’s one mile radio call took 10 seconds. At 180kts, that’s 1/2 mile closure during his radio call alone. About 10-20 more seconds, at most, is all he had to find the traffic, make a decision, and execute.
@@deernation9326 The 340’s one mile radio call took 10 seconds. At 180kts, that’s 1/2 mile closure during his radio call alone. About 10-20 more seconds, at most, is all he had to find the traffic, make a decision, and execute.
I'm not convinced the Cessna was "late" realizing the conflict and late getting out of the way. I just don't think he expected(and why would you) the 340 to be coming in at 160-180kt.. He's nearly double a normal approach speed, and therefor the closure rate.
I would have been "late" realizing that too, because that's just not something that is done... ever.. and for good reason.
The 152 was ahead of(any reasonably flown aircraft) and below on final. "Calling" a 10 mile final doesn't automatically protect that airspace. And he alerted the 340 he was coming up on him. What the hell was the 340 up to coming in that fast.
That is right, and normally you expect a twin engine aircraft at 10 Nm away to arrive at approximately 5 minutes (2 miles/minute, at 120 knots) A C-152 can complete a full pattern in less than 4 minutes (down wind ~1 mile, 1 min at 60 knots; final, touch and go also ~1 min , cross wind and base, each ½ mile at most, 2 × ½ min , total less than 4 minutes.
That means that the student pilot had plenty of time to do a touch and go, from the time he called his cross wind position, before the arrival of a normally approaching twin, 10 miles away. The twin did not announce his speed, and his call of 10 miles out was made probably at a smaller distance .
I do not see any misjudgements on the student's part.
Typically a fast twin, a Beech Duke approaches around 120 and 115 knots on final.
"Im gonna go around youre going at me pretty quick man."
You have to talk to people. This man did his part the speeding aircraft was obviously not on the ball.
As always, great early analysis. Thank you Juan! So sad that the 152 pilot even called out the 340 was coming at him too fast, but the collision still occurred. In hindsight, who wouldn't happily give up a few minutes/gallons for a one lap around the patter to avoid loss of your own life and others. So avoidable. So sad.
He came in from the sun with the whole nine yards!
Very sad indeed.
There's also something Juan does not mention. Over on Kathryn's report it mentions there were 2 people and a dog on board the C340. Maybe that pilot was distracted by the other person or the dog which is why it seems he wasn't close to flying a stable approach.
180kts is a nautical mile every 20 seconds or a standard mile every 17.4 seconds. That's seriously fast.
He made a call at 3nm. In time that's 60 seconds from the threshold. He should be focused on speed, which he wasn't, flaps, gear, engine settings, prop settings,..... plus a passenger and a dog. That's a lot with traffic in the pattern.
Its also clear from Kathryn's that the C152 belonged to a flying school which tends to indicate it was a low hours student on board. There's numerous comments on Kathryn's from commercial pilots who all say that when you fly into these sorts of fields with flying schools you have to assume (for safety) that all C152s (or similar) are student pilots with low hours.
@@tonywilson4713
Other than a poor writing skill and poor knowledge of the English language-
You are correct.
Suggest you undertake an extensive reading program to improve your
knowledge of English and writing skill.
- Bear in mind that when I make a criticism I will also offer a solution.
Also note - do not place punctuation marks (dots) after a numerical value -
unless it is a decimal point. and no such dots following a URL or email address
Good luck and goodbye - Below is the corrected text and layout:
Tony Wilson -- 2022.08.195.2126
There's also something Juan does not mention.
Over on Kathryn's report it mentions there were 2 people and a dog on
board the CESSNA C340
Maybe that pilot was distracted by the other person or the dog which
is why it seems he wasn't close to flying a stable approach.
180kts is a nautical mile every 20 seconds or a standard mile every
17.4 seconds. That's seriously fast.
He made a call at 3nm -- In time that's 60 seconds from the threshold.
He should be focused on speed - which he wasn't - flaps - gear -
engine settings - prop settings ... plus a passenger and a dog.
That's a lot with traffic in the pattern.
It's also clear from Kathryn's that the CESSNA C152 belonged to a
flying school which tends to indicate it was a low hours student
on board. There are numerous comments on Kathryn's from commercial
pilots who all say that when flying into these types of fields with
flying schools one has to assume (for safety) that all CESSNA C152s
or similar are student pilots with low hours.
NOTE: Third party replies are ignored - as I am too busy with other matters.
@@tonywilson4713 I don't feel inclined to believe the 340 pilot was distracted by anything other than getthereitis at twice the speed he should have been. His recklessness cost 3 lives.
Thank you for explaining this all so clearly. I'm not a pilot, and I had heard the audio before, and struggled to paint the picture of how this occurred. Good job
Ugh...This same thing happened to me back in 1981 with only a few hours in the 152. I was doing touch and go's with my instructor on runway 34 at the Salina, KS airport when a Sabreliner shot out underneath us on final. As a 16 year old, it made quite an impression on me. So sorry this ended this way. My heart goes out to their families.
That is exactly what I was wondering. Why was the faster plane at the same altitude as the slower one? As u discovered faster planes come in lower and flatter than slower planes for the same distance off the runway.
My understanding was that the 152 pilot was a student. Sad on all accounts.
The problem is that old guys love straight in approaches and they are dangerous, fly the damn pattern and look around.
Was old. Was bold. Now just a mistake to be retold.
A perfect example of why a 45 degree entry to downwind is so important. Too many times people think it’s ok to come in straight as long they can outrun everyone to final. I do like being able to make a long straight approach at KWLW but it is open, rural, and mostly flat. But even there if there is anyone else around, whether in the pattern or on a distant approach, I still swing wide for a 45 downwind entry. It’s not worth compromising safety assuming I’ll get there first, especially considering the speed of my 170. Thanks Juan for your work, hopefully someone may hear this and realize just because their ego says they are more important than everyone else it’s not worth the risk of expecting everyone else to bow before them.
Thank you! Not a pilot but my bro. Buz Marten had a near fatal in MD through the windshield fuselage came down on his neck. You guys are my heroes.
Been waiting for this analysis. Thanks for all you do
You are a excellent commentator and always explain these reports so people can understand. Thx Juan.
My father was a CFII as a hobby (kept racking hours so he figured he might as well rack up ratings: Mooney, twins, glider, aerobatics, Docteurs Sans Frontierre in Africa, etc...). He sweated every aspect of every flight no matter how routine, VFR or IFR, planned it all out, had backup plans in case of weather or equipment failure, never caught gotta-get-there-itis. The 340 pilot, well we'll never know what was going on in that pilot's head however it shows that just like driving a car, you can do everything correctly (the 150 pilot) and still get hurt by someone not focusing on the task at hand. I live not far from Watsonville and heard about this crash. I searched today for the details and found your explanation. Thank you.
I took at look at the Friday 8/12 O15-WVI flight and there the last FlightAware speed is about 90kts. I don't know if it was the same pilot though. If it was, then he clearly knew the parameters of his aircraft. So odd.
Thanks for that breakdown Juan! Something similar almost happened to me when I was a student pilot. I trained and fly out of Bend Municipal (KBDN), one of the busiest uncontrolled airports in the US. It was my second time flying solo. I was in a C150 on a left downwind for 34 and there was a Beachcraft Duchess doing a practice instrument approach on about a 10 mile final. Not taking into account the Duchess' higher speed I continued to fly the pattern normally rather than extending my downwind. By the time I turned base we were way too close for comfort. I ended up doing a left 360 turn on base to avoid the Duchess but it was a fairly alarming experience for a student pilot.
I'd say the one of the BIGGEST keys to avoiding potentially dangerous situations at uncontrolled airports is not just communicating but also LISTENING. There was plenty of position calls before this mid-air that both pilots could've seen a potential accident brewing. Another example, a few days ago I was on short final when another pilot decided to back-taxi down the runway (also KBDN). I ended up doing a go-around. This pilot did a great job communicating on CTAF that he was back-taxing, but failed to hear my calls for base and final. I'm not faulting him, we all make mistakes and he thanked me for doing the go-around. But it's a good reminder not to get tunnel vision focusing on your own mission to the point that you lose situational awareness of what everyone else around you is doing.
Fly safe everyone.
I hear you Keenan, I'm scared of KBDN. I fly a 140 out of KDLS just north of you. Once I had a Gulfstream call a 10 mile final when I was on DW, by the time I turned final he advised "departing traffic" where he was. I was landing, not departing. He wasn't even listening and had zero situational awareness. But my bad for misjudging his speed and failing to recognize the conflict in the first place. I did a go-around and lived. I know what I'll do next time. Fly safe!
@@KNosnhoj Glad you both made it through that situation unharmed. I did my XC solo from KBDN to KDLS, it's a beautiful area to fly. Hopefully the Gulfstream guy learned a valuable lesson from that experience as well.
that is congested traffic over there when you might think it shouldn't be. I fly part 121 into Redmond a lot and with the north/ NE flow the terrain kind of hems in everyone at a similar altitude... thank goodness the approach controllers over there are really good.
Never do straight-ins unless on an IFR approach that you actually need to do.
I taught my daughter at a young age that it doent matter if you're right or wrong, it will be of little consolation that you were right when you're dead. Always err on the side of caution, even if it means you're going to inconvenience yourself a little bit; a 15 or 20 min delay is preferable to not going home again. As a slower vehicle, it's generally easier/better to just let the faster vehicle go first.
Thats the thing. The faster pilot did not indicate he was going fast. He didn't realize the guy was a speed demon until he visually determined the closing rate, and he then did the smart thing and planned to abort his landing and get out of the way. Unfortunately he still didn't appreciate how fast the guy was really going and didn't make it. And apparently the faster pilot never saw the lighter plane until just before colliding with him. I have no idea what the faster pilot was thinking. I mean at the speed and attitude he was in how he thought he could land in any safe manner. Its like running thru an intersection at 90 miles an hour.
Similar situation happened to me back in ´98 while flying a King Air 200. I was on short final after flying a standard pattern in an uncontrolled airport when an Embraer 120 flying in direct from a left base behind me collided with my aircraft from above. It turned out that the Embraer pilot had turned down the volume on his radio as he was talking on radio 2 and never heard my position reports. Fortunately, we both managed to land in one piece. The lesson here is beside following standard procedures in an uncontrolled airport, always...I mean always make sure you see all traffic and that you are SEEN as well. SEE and be SEEN!
The only close call I ever had with another aircraft in the air was over a very small uncontrolled airport. A Long-EZ pulled in at a 90° angle from my right to line up for a downwind about 100 yards in front of me. He never said a word on the radio at any point. I reported my position, which I had done a couple of times, and he clicked his mic and said, "Cessna in the pattern, where did you say you were?". I responded, "100 yards behind you.". I had seen his plane on the ramp when practicing there before, so I knew it was his home turf and he just assumed he had it to himself as usual. As a student on a solo I was pretty shocked that there were people out there ignoring a whole bunch of procedures and rules in that situation. The only thing he got right was pattern altitude, as he was dead nuts at the same height I was.
Built and flew a veri eze smaller and faster than the Long eze. They are also very difficult to see!! And fly the pattern faster than most typical Cessna types. Our touch down speed was 90. Pattern was 120.
Unbelievable what was the twin pilot doing at that approach speed!! Bizarre!!
There was something wrong there. I really hope it was not a gung-ho chad showing off to his girlfriend. Either way, they are all dead.
@@neilwilson5785 There was also a dog in the twin. Dead also. Poor thing.
Have a listen to the twin pilot's manner of speaking on the radio, and see if you notice any potential signs of impairment. I saw an MD's comment about it under another video about this crash and so I played it again and could detect some potential signs. I hope it is possible to obtain a blood sample for analysis, because the result of that could be informative. Like any other incident, it doesn't matter to me whether arrogance or impairment caused it, the result and the blame are the same. But if impairment was involved then it could explain part of what happened. I have zero tolerance for behaviour like this that risks the lives of others. There's a reason why it's against the law.
I rarely do straight in approaches, and when I do, they make me nervous. I never do a straight in approach if I know anyone is in the pattern.
I was in a near miss as a passenger in a Cesena 182 vs a Skymaster who dove from high left to low right missing our right-wing strut by six inches with his right-wing tip. We were at the correct altitude for our heading over Lake Geneva WI. Total elapsed time from first sight to the miss was under 3 seconds no chance to get his number. Keep up the good reporting to raise awareness in the community of the hazards that complacency can bring.
I had a similar scenario to this. A few weeks after I got my Private I was flying at a local airport in the pattern, there were probably 3 of us in the pattern and a twin Cessna on a straight in approach. He called his location and intentions, but being a low time pilot I had little experience with faster twin engine aircraft so I thought I could get in and do my touch and go before he landed. I was wrong. I ended up going around to let him land but he then decided he was doing a touch and go which made my go around and downwind leg even more stressful. Luckily everything ended up okay unlike this situation.
That's three (three!) recent midair collisions in which it appears that a pilot flying too fast in the pattern contributed to if not caused the accident. (Cirrus & Metroliner @ APA, Mirage Jetprop & C172 at North Las Vegas, and this one). Maybe time for a safety standdown about how to fly in the traffic pattern including not overshooting final. Three strikes and we all need a time out.
While a good thought a safety stand down nationwide is impractical
Any such safety stand down would be voluntary and would only get volunteers who would be less prone to doing something like this, anyway.
About half the people in this country need a time out. They drive too fast, won’t turn their lights on before the sun sets, and think they’re more important than everyone else.
Thanks for the analysis Juan! It's clear the 340 pilot was completely reckless and trying to beat the 152 to the runway. Complete disregard for any reasonable amount of airmanship at all. Such a senseless killing of the 152 pilot that hopefully, his family can get reparations from the 340 pilot.
A accidental death is only worth about 5-10 million dollars to insurance companies.
i mean all he had to do was start coasting after the mountains like a normal human being and all would have been well...
@@sanfranciscobay Better than 0 million.
@@danielgregory3295 100 Million Dollars was recently awarded to a 65 year old Man who was paralyzed as a Quadriplegic from Police excessive force. He will die prematurely, slow and miserable.
@@sanfranciscobay Hope he can collect, and it helps with his life! Juries are getting better at dealing with macho cops..🖖
Accident especially relevant for me, I operate a military cargo twin turboprop as a civilian instructor, teaching the customer who purchased the aircraft.
I operate from military bases an airstrips, part of the curriculum is VFR, and we mix with other platforms with different speeds, especially helicopters.
99% of the time, English is a second aeronautical language for everyone involved.
20-30’ minutes of pattern work an I am actually tired! 😂😂
Lots to unpack from this excellent video, still reading comments
Many years ago on a Christmas Eve flight at night in a Cherokee 140 I almost was run over by commercial twin at an airport with active tower while flying direct from Stockton.
I was listening to both Oakland Center (active flight following) and Redding tower. I was also visually tracking a commercial aircraft direct from SFO and mentally calculating our converging flight paths. Worth noting that there were several aircraft behind me also with the same destination.
Center turned me over to the tower where they cleared me as number1. I declared 10 out and landing ILS while still monitoring Center. After declaring 3 out I heard Center turn the Commercial over to tower. Tower cleared them number 2 behind me.
This is where it went wrong.
The commercial PIC told tower that he had already passed the Cherokee (behind me!! Well behind me, ( had not even called 10 out or contacted tower yet. Was not on Center either.
At this point the tower cleared them as #1.
Granted I was low enough to not be seen perhaps in all the city lights but that matters not.
Note: I was practically over my own home. Also had my sister with me who has never been in a small aircraft before.
Instantly I declared an emergency hard right 360 for the Commercial behind me while going to full power and climbing to avoid wake turbulence. Got an air wake hard bump but was okay. Cut My sisters headset out of the audio circuit after telling her I was doing a simple 360.
Landed long to avoid wake with dead silence on the radio. Declared exiting runway via taxiway I normally would to park and get fuel.
Shortly tower contacted me and requested switch to a frequency that wasn't normal for this location.
Anyway both the tower and the commercial PIC came on both of which were obviously freaked out.
This was an incident and a real shitstorm for them.
I knew the tower people by voice because I flew into Redding from San Carlos a min. of 3 days a week.
At this point I pointed out this was Christmas Eve, I had lost two good friends not long before this in a mid air collision that was similar to this, and I expected them to never forget what had almost occurred. With that I said that I considered the matter closed and have a good Christmas with their families.
Fueled up and continued flight into Oregon VFR on top to the only airport that was VFR with my alternate (uncontrolled grass strip, family informing clear, {they live there).
Christmas went well.
Didn't tell sister what happened for several years nor anyone else except father-in-law who was pilot/instructor during WW2 and spent teaching me to be ready and never hesitate to be the best PIC I could ever be.
Thanks for sharing that amazing (terrifying) story, tip of the hat for taking charge of the situation under maximum pressure.
You should have radioed tower frequency and said "Tower Controller, possible ATC deviation, I have a number for you to call when able".
That’s only slightly horrific. WOW!
@@SusanKay- W it wasn't on my mind at the time I had no idea how many people were on that commercial flight. They also were a factor to consider. They didn't need the possible news media intrusion in their lives.
@@j700jam4 Cell phones were not a thing yet and I was on vacation.
This has been a bad year for GA. This one, like many, was totally preventable. Thank you, Juan for your excellent "field report" while flying your own commercial route. I have learned so much from you and "Grumpy" Dan. Keep preaching brother!! Prayers for the families of these pilots.
Every year is a bad year for GA and your “prayers” comment is nothing but self serving and looking for thumbs ups at best. Grow up.
Excellent analysis. I am based at KWVI and fly just about every week there. It is true that the pattern can be very busy at certain times of the day with student pilots, helicopters, parachute operations and even the occasional jet aircraft. Many times while returning to Watsonville I encounter aircraft attempting straight in approaches typically inbound from the East over the ridge. Most of the time the pilots attempting these straight ins will communicate and work with the traffic in the pattern and decide to make a standard 45 entry if needed. However, I have had quite a few close calls in the pattern there over the past several years. We need to be more vigilant when arriving at an uncontrolled airport. Situational awareness and good communication should be a top priority. This was a very sad occurrence - condolences to the family of the pilots.
Did you report these close calls ? Im not a pilot so I dont know what reporting mechanism is available , if its a known issue surely the rules for that airport need to be adjusted . They say that for every one death in the construction industry there is 10,000 close calls . Seems to me listening to this recording the single engine guy was to relaxed and the twin was to goal focused .
@@chlyon The standard place to report such things in the US is NASA ASRS.
@@MarkRose1337 Nope, NASA way is for the pilot to report that he made a mistake. He is saying to report the pilot that did something nasty. You report by email to the FAA nearest office.
@@emergencylowmaneuvering7350 Thank you for clarifying!
I also fly out of WVI and this sort of conflict is all too common. Whenever I see a potential problem I'm the one who takes positive action in a timely manner in order to save my own bacon. It's bad enough it's happening on the freeways but I'm seeing more of this behavior in the air.
Thank you as always for a great explanation and update on this case!
Juan you are such a valuable asset to the GA community! Thank you for your information and efforts in making flying safer. I’m heading over to Patreon now to become a supporter! 🙏🏽
Great video! This situation happened to me and my uncle. We where on short final in a T-34 in Liberal KS and a DC-3 almost hit our tail. A quick push of the stick forward saved our lives. DC-3 had only a handheld radio and all their cockpit windows open, never heard or saw us.
My daughter received her PPL day before yesterday. I used to regularly shoot approaches into Watsonville. We’ve talked a lot about uncontrolled field operations, but it’s still my nightmare scenario. Thank you for the report.
Uncontrolled fields are the best. However, it takes two things to be a great pilot. Skill and judgment. They certainly missed the judgment part on this one.
@@pittss2c601 Yup.
Congratulations to your daughter! It's one of the scenarios that also can give me a cold sweat at night from time to time. I had a near miss myself many years ago in the pattern, it still haunts me to this day. The other aircraft was non-radio and from my perspective I wasn't aware of it until it near filled the windscreen.
@@wingandaprayer883 I had an encounter with a non-radio at an uncontrolled airport years ago. I learned about it after I waved goodbye to Approach and was setting up to land. I never could find him visually. Really makes you sit up and pay attention.
My #1 as well!
I live very close to Watsonville and I heard of this accident on the radio on my way home as there were road closures as a result. I have been waiting for your report on it as you bring so much information to the table. Thanks for what you do here.
I appreciate your effort in putting together the video so soon. It’s important we learn the lessons from incidents like this, and your videos play an important role in getting the message out.
Conflict identified: egos in command.
Maybe straight in approach needs to be reviewed
This entire debrief screams complacency, I did Eight years in the navy, That was the line that i preached after watching multiple small things go wrong during a high danger evolution. Debriefing afterward we would always address the little bullshit holes in the cheese, but when we would get a report for a rescue and assist for an evolution thats gone wrong, We would take the time to debrief to learn from the mistakes which 100% of the time boiled down to over confidence and impatience.
Thank you so much, sent to all former students and flying friends for a review. Well done and many lives will be saved because of your commitment to aviation safety.
My go-to channel for this type of information. Always detailed and well done.
Always get the straight explanation from you, so us non pilots can understand.
When I was a student pilot on my 3rd solo in a 152 I was cut off by a twin in the circuit pattern. I was crossword about to turn downwind when the twin joined downwind at a great rate of speed and it scared the he'll out of me. My instructor saw the incident and gave the twin pilot a blast.
Something is really wrong with this particular scenario. Flaps and gear up, 180/190 knots, claiming full stop and ignoring the concerns of the 152. There is an unknown factor here, either impairment or suicide or similar. This was not just a momentary loss of visual contact with traffic.
he never had visual contact until moments before colliding. I suspect he was distracted with some non-flying concern and just forgot some basic flying rules. Like he had an important meeting to go to or something.
@@armastat yeah but a pilot of a twin THAT capable doesn’t “forget” basic flying rules in a manner this egregious. Sounds to me like this guy was wildly incompetent at best. Makes me question the validity of his certifications/mental state/ etc.. honestly his voice sounds a little ‘off’, maybe I’m just being crazy, but he wouldn’t be the first drunk or impaired pilot to ever hit the skies. It’s a possibility at least
I just listened to it again over at VAS, listen to him try to say “Whisky Juliet” he’s struggling with it both times. I suspect carbon monoxide or something
@@jmythngdmb Yeah your idea or mine, it all comes down to not having his brain engaged in the moment. I am also thinking he may have misheard the Cessna pilot when the guy said 'you're coming on fast {i'm} go around'. In another airplane with al the noise He could of thought the slower plane was telling Him to go around. which would explain why they were at the same altitude when they collided (a faster plane - who is landing - should of been lower than a slower one) AND why the faster plane ended up so far down the runway when he crashed. If he had been descending he would of hit the ground closer to the other end of the runway. The quick pull up moment before the collision would not account for that.
@@jmythngdmb or alcohol
Love the field report. Thanks for taking the time to bring us this info!!
OMG, that was heartbreaking to listen to. Not only were they actually talking to each other, but the 152 noted he was being overtaken.
The elephant in this room, yet to be given the mic, is the use of antiquated radios that allow pilots to transmit simultaneously, thus blocking both from hear the other's transmission.
Then again if we had a hard & fast rule from the FAA that NO straight in approaches ever ALLOWED EXCEPT FOR DECLARED EMERGENCIES!
@@michaelamick8295 I agree on " antiquated radios " A feature called Busy Channel Lock out ( BCLO ) has been available for > 40 years to prevent TX Conflicts, with a secondary Emergency Override so if the BCLO has failed or some one is sitting on a TX switch you can still make a call which should be be heard by other users in your proximity - danger zone, the unit transmitting won't hear it but others will. Add a TX Timeout Timer so if someone is sitting on a TX switch it will time out after a defined time and give a loud audible to the offending unit warning that you are no longer TX even though the TX is hammered down.
A feature that is overdue is TX Radio ID (should equal Aircraft ID ) which can show on the receiving radio display ( Nav Panel ) when someone is transmitting - the same way your Car Radio displays the Station Name - Song or Name of the Show you are listening to, a simple Data Burst at the start of the call.
No perfect solution as Pilot Overload- Pilot Overconfidence plays into loss of situational awareness. No different than the driver on the highway who decides to pass a left turning vehicle (right turn in some countries) or a vehicle that is going slow without first assessing why the vehicle is slow and conflicting traffic patterns.
Personally I'm never in a rush to be the first at the scene of the accident.
Condolences to those involved. Flew in and out of Watsonville many times in the past. This one hits close to home. Thanks for your information, Juan.
I taught in a C-310. I thought my students to be blue line +10 ( this would be around 102-112 kts)at the most in the pattern for this exact reason, you don’t want to be over running slower traffic. Also unless it is IFR you enter the traffic pattern with everyone else.
Another excellent report, Juan. Thank you.
Maybe the regs and FAR/AIM have changed, but I was taught the only pattern entry to an uncontrolled airport is “on the 45.” Overfly the airport above pattern altitude, once outside the downwind track, descend to pattern altitude and circle back to enter on the 45. Airspeed is adjusted to blend with the flow of aircraft already established in the pattern. Sure, we’ve all done a straight-in late at night when there was nobody around, but never with airplanes in the pattern.
Exactly the way I was taught. Overfly the airport, 1000 ft above pattern altitude. Bleed off airspeed and slow down in preparation to enter the 45 to downwind. Not that hard to understand and that is what people expect at an uncontrolled airport.
The uncontrolled field I fly out of has IFR approach procedures, so from time to time you have to expect someone on a straight in final.
@@danspiteri4350 cool man 👍. My first airport was uncontrolled with approaches as well….good times!
AC90-66B (9.5) addresses this scenario. This isn’t word for word, but it says when transitioning to the visual segment, the standard pattern is recommended. However if the pilot elects to do a straight-in, it must be done to not disrupt the VFR aircraft in the pattern and the VFR aircraft have the right of way.
It was never an issue at the airport I mentioned earlier though because if the weather was down and the field was IFR, there wasn’t anyone in the pattern (so a straight-in didn’t disrupt any VFR aircraft). If the field was VFR, the aircraft that flew the practice approach sequenced themself with aircraft already in the pattern…….and if the pattern was full, they flew the overhead and joined on the 45.
That too is my practice. Doesn't prevent another plane from coming on the opposite runway. I've seen that while flying over an uncontrolled field.
I almost got run over while turning final in my 172 by a KingAir making a high speed straight in approach at an uncontrolled airport without communicating… I know I’m not worthy of sharing the airspace with such an elite pilot and aircraft but they would have been just as dead as I was had I not been able to avoid that collision… one of the benefits of the lowly but agile 172
Juan excellent analysis of this collision, thanks for your contribution to airline safety.
Very appreciative Juan...Thanks
No more straight in approaches at uncontrolled airports. 45 degrees at TPA to enter the downwind. Get stabilized folks.
It’s not illegal to do a straight in. Pilots just need to be reminded about right of way rules, to clear every turn, and to deconflict appropriately on the radio. Handcuffing pilots to a 45 degree turn is not always feasible and it’s still not required. I think training and building situational awareness might serve as a better teacher.
I couldn't agree more. I had a very near miss at Watsonville with someone playing fighter pilot doing a non-standard pattern entry for a civillian airport.
Straight in approaches are not ever going to go away at uncontrolled airports. #1 reason is instrument approaches. They need to be practiced for training on VFR days. Many instrument approaches have at least a 5 mile straight in segment. At my home airport it’s uncontrolled and we have twice daily airline service. The guys in the jets always fly the instrument approach even in VFR weather. They make the necessary radio calls, but are stabilized, slowed down ( as much as a CRJ-200 can ) and on the lookout for the guys with no radio.
Juan your dedication to the subject matter is truly admirable and appreciated. The way you weigh speed of reporting with measured, well thought out and respectful analysis is truly remarkable. I always say, how you say something is often just as important as what you say. You go above and beyond sir and you make a difference, all of this with humility and respect.
He is a gift to the avaition community.
Thanks. I always appreciate your videos.
I used to fly out of Lodi, in an ultralight and my favorite thing to do was fly touch and goes. My fear was the jump plane, they did not fly a pattern approach. I would then need to extend my downwind. I ended up getting remarried and sold the plane.
Love your show
Eric
Local news reported that a dog was in the 340, too. It didn't survive.
😪😪😪
😒
Was waiting for your response
When I saw the news report about the air crash I have been waiting for you to explain what happened. Thank you very much
Thanks for this description. I’m just a dispatcher and a aspiring pilot. Trying to visualize what went on was difficult for me but this helped a lot.
A few days ago the Denver area had extreme thunderstorms flare up during late afternoon hours. I was watching FlightAware while simultaneously listening to DEN Approach. It was impressive. ATC in rapid fire directing aircraft into multiple holding patterns with multiple aircraft in each, pilots doing what they do best, and then ATC unwinding the holding patterns one-by-one to get all aircraft on the ground after the worst of the storm had moved east. It was a pleasure to listen and observe. Hats off to ATC. He was a true professional and made it appear effortless.
The Denver ATC is first class. Back in the day, I enjoyed listening to them on UAL Channel 9.
And a 1951 Cessna 195 (N1097D) crashed yesterday in El Cajon at the Interstate 8 Greenfield Drive overpass.
The plane is a total loss and the pilot sustained some serious injuries.
William,
Dang! I used to live in East San Diego County & know exactly where that is.
What happened? Cause?
@@OceanSwimmer I don't know what caused the pilot to attempt an emergency landing. Engine failure or low fuel are the two likely causes.
I watched a video about the crash landing on the "ONSCENE TV" RUclips channel.
“I’m gonna go around because you’re coming at me pretty quick, man.”
Dang is that chilling.
Thank you for your expert and unbiased opinion. Your breakdowns really explain to the novice and non-pilots, how accidents happen.
Something similar happened to me when I was a student pilot at LVK, a controlled airport. I was on final and saw a low wing aircraft turning left base to final higher than me but descending steadily. I had just enough time to say to the tower that he was gonna hit me and then I immediately turned right, away from the aircraft. The tower tells me to go around and I said UNABLE. I would have lost sight of the other airplane and I wasn’t having that. I actually did a full 180 but knew there was no one behind me. The tower calls me and says what are your intentions. I said I can do a full 360 and line up for final again or I can climb back up to pattern altitude and make a right base to final, which is what they approved. Sometimes you have to take matters into your own hands. It was only me up there and I was lower than the aircraft on base. I had the right of way but I chose to live rather than be right. I refused to pull the nose up and go around because I would have lost sight of the other aircraft. ATC was late in telling me to go around. I was already turning right, away from the runway. First I aviated, then I let the tower know what I was doing. We both landed safely and to be honest I don’t think the guy on base ever even knew what happened.
Thanks Juan. I was really curious to know what happened on this one. I can’t believe they saw each other and neither took evasive action. My condolences 🥲
Helluva report! Thanks!
well executed! thanks for sharing
One minor thing: the 152 pilot did see the twin and he DID take evasive action.
It is very similar to your own story. The 152 pilot decided to go around because Maverick was coming at him at likely 160+ mph.
152 pilot seems to be at zero fault here. He certainly had the lesser ego of the two pilots!!
😌🫣😌🫣
They just saw eachother too late.
@@endokrin7897 just a tiny bit late
As usual your analysis is very insightful. What I cant escape is the thought that I could be making these same errors and finding myself in the same situations. Always be aware!
I love your channel. It is always very informative and awesome! 💯
Thank You Jaun for an objective evaluation of this incident.
I will pick up your Patron videos.
Juan, exceptional analysis. Thank you for your clear, concise, and plain language explanation of the available facts and use of available resources. I especially like your digging into the Airplane Flying Handbook and getting proper procedure form the horses mouth as it were. As soon as the 152 called on base the 340 should have discontinued the approach as there was now an aircraft between them and the runway, at least that's what they should have assumed since they did not have the traffic in sight. It's incredible and tragic that some lessons are never fully learned.
Thank you Juan because I fly in and out of a uncontrolled airport and it gets very busy especially when the student pilot is on his solo and I myself makes the callouts at my 10 mile marker out and my head is constant on the Swivel at all times
Waiting all day for this video. Thanks Juan
Thank you Juan for your excellent analysis and explanation. When I first saw this in the MSM a few days ago I knew we didnt have the complete picture and was waiting to see your take on it. Honestly, this accident was completely preventable and should never have happened. I know Dan at Probable Cause is going to be all over this one. Its heartbreaking!
It reminds me of the old story of a ship yelling at what he thought was another ship with a very bright light coming at him. They go back and forth for awhile as they approach each other, with the ship captain telling the smaller ship to MOVE out of the way, citing all the so-called rules and right of way for bigger ships. Finally after all the arguing and an impending collision, the guy with the bright light says, "I am a lighthouse, move now or you are going to go aground and crash upon the rocks and sink.
The guy in the bigger and faster plane seemingly felt he had the right of way over smaller and slower planes flying correctly in the pattern. Granted, the larger plane continually stated I am coming in on DIRECT approach, said it at least 3-4 times from my count. Somone at that airport on ATC or the planes in the pattern, should have said, NEGATIVE, NO direct, must enter into the standard downwind pattern! Somone should have told that psycho speed king to back off from direct, slow down, and follow standard FAA required right of way and approach pattern rules.
However, this was not done and unfortunately only ENABLES the pilots irresponsible behavior. He assumed becuase he had announced his intentions that he automatically had the right of way and that all other planes in the pattern should just back off and allow him to land. It was his arrogance that overruled common sense and common courtesy at a small airport. No pilot should ever assume or believe they have any right of way at any approach.
They should always approach under an abundance of cation and be prepared to abort the final and go around. Alwasy assume you will be required to use the standard circular approach versus a direct, unless you have an emergency landing requirement, then announce mayday mayday need direct asap!
My prayers and condolences go out to the families of the three people who lost their lives. My heart breaks for them as this was entirely preventable and avoidable!
Thanks Juan! No pattern, too fast, undeterred by the occupied airport pattern. And there is a good chance the 340 was equipped to display the conflict traffic. On top of having two sets of eyes in the 340. The 152 seems to even tell the 340 of his position behind the 152.
Is this a case of the biggest hanger owning the airport?
Thank you Juan for what you do.
As always great advice and a great reminder to us all
R.I.P. to those who lost their lives during the accident. Truly tragic !! Thanks for the invaluable analysis of the possible causes.
Gracias Juan! Always a privilege listening to your dissections, and dissertations. Your facial expression reflects what we AVIATORS feel anytime accidents, either fatal or not, occur. Condolences to the families. Keep the 🔵side up. 🙏💫
Such a tragedy, especially when you hear the 152 pilot saw it developing. Thanks for the breakdown Juan. Condolences to the families.
you're my go-to guy ever since Oroville! Thanks for what you do. Fly safe!
If I'd just climbed off a London flight, no way I could've delivered such a thoughtful analysis. Nice job. One of our newly-retired DFW peers (I just hit 9 mos) bought a 340 last month in CA but is safely home. I'll convey this to him.
Great analysis as always and it amazes me that the 340 pilot was intentionally risking structural damage to his flaps and gear doors to make a fast approach especially when he knew that the 150 was slow and near to the approach. Thanks so much for your videos that shine light on these tragedies so that all may learn.
Thanks! as always, a great report, Juan.
Thanks Marilyn!
@@blancolirio 👍
Thanks for that detailed analysis. Impressive to do it so quickly and with such accuracy. Amazing the data that is available to the public now. I got my private out of Oakland about five years ago. The Bay Area is one of the most congested and challenging places to fly with so many small airports. My heart goes out to the victims and the families.
That reminds me on the accident of Manfred Strößenreuther, a highly experienced aerobatic pilot who collided at march, 29, 1986,
with an other aircraft at the beginning of the runway at the Rosendahl airfield. All four occupants were killed.
On august, 12th, 2022 another collision happened in Germany at the airfield Klippeneck near Villingen-Schwenningen where a two seater glider plane with a 14 year old student and his 56 year old instructor colided with a "TL-96 Sting Carbon" near the airfield. The two occupants in the glider where killed, the pilot of the motor plane was able to land his plane and survived.
I guess if the pilot of the 340 hadn't been so fast, the accident wouldn't have happened. Who do expect that someone comes in to final with a speed higher than the V-ne of a Cessna 182? That was madness!
Thanks, Juan. I fly in and out of KWVI often. The traffic volume there is very high, lots of student traffic, (fixed and rotary wing), recreational flying, EMS aircraft, and sky diving. Unicom only! My base airport is KSNS (18NM southeast), where there is a tower, and, the traffic volume is no where near what Watsonville experiences. I've thought for years that KWVI should be towered, and not Salinas. Again, thank you, Juan.
I used to fly in Pitts Specials getting training at the School of aerobatics there in Salinas. I hated the control tower there.
The FAA won't act until there are dead bodies
We used to say the same thing about Watsonville airport 30+ years ago.
Watsonville is the only airport that I have ever had a aircraft pull onto the runway while I was on short final, at nighttime. .No radio calls, nothing.
I pulled alongside his port wing and flew in formation with him as he was doing his takeoff roll, all the while cussing him out on UNICOM. Still not a word from him.
Keep a good scan folks. And never assume that the other aircraft sees you.
Salinas is also my home airport and I couldn’t agree more
Thank you for this post and your analysis of these events.
This was really helpful to understand the Dynamics of how they managed to intercept each other. Thanks, bud!
Thanks for the great analysis 👍 As a low time pilot with 222 total and about 83 cmd. This type of accident just scare the heck out of me!
Here in AU, regulation 91.395 states that pilots conducting a straight in approach should give way to all pattern traffic and any aircraft on base or final has right if way.
The authority’s here still say pilots in pattern, especially on base should continually check for traffic entering along final approach path.
It sounds like the poor 152 pilot had almost no time to react. So sad.
I’ve only done a straight in a couple of times. Both times ensuring there was no pattern traffic, communicating and ensuring I was stabilized.
My preference will always be to overfly the field at least 500 above cct, usually 1000 above cct, to check the wind, descend dead side and either enter crosswind or mid crosswind.
I used to fly out of a private grass strip for many years. Even when we knew no one was around we still flew the pattern.
@@pittss2c601 excellent! My CFI said that’s why procedures are there. Following and practicing them, no matter the situation will increase safety 👍