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Rework the Zeah favour to be a "Member's Tutorial" - teach people about the new skills, how to use them, etc. It's one thing we don't have - a member's tutorial. It'd be far more interactive, and it's optional. In Lumbridge, point out Veos is in Port Sarim.
agree, the favor system was not well designed in terms of gameplay but it's a good concept for worldbuilding which is more important than people give it credit for
Yep the favour made alot of sense it was just too damn tedious and slow if they just made it alot faster people wouldn't mind but it being gone is a positive too fuck doing favour for the 100th time
Since my favourite things about RuneScape are its quests, dialogues and the world building I wholeheartedly agree with you. I try hard with tick-manipulation or try getting good at bosses from time to time but in the end what started my journey and what keeps me around is the story
I stopped playing OSRS approximately when Zeah was introduced into the game. I came back to the game October 2023 with my quest cape still in the bank that I was now unable to equip. After completing quests such as DT2 and Dragon Slayer 2, all that was left for me to re-equip the quest cape was Zeah. But the whole continent was entirely foreign to me and is a massive land mass that I entirely avoided it to the point where I had half of my elite diarys done and didn't even have Kourend Easy diary started. Just as I was about to go for the Favour system, the blog came out about removing it, so naturally I continued to avoid it until yesterday with the rework which I now absolutely turboed the quests and only have a kingdom divided to go now. Once I finish that, I'm confident that I will still have 0 understanding of the purpose of Zeah because of the removal of the favour system not forcing me to understand it.
I don't really play OSRS, but I remember feeling sad when I heard about this from my friends that did, because it sounded like something that if done right I would have really liked! I really like the worldbuilding elements and faction alliance sort of themes.
This actually mirrors exactly what I thought of when this was announced. I feel it's a missed opportunity not to have an additional poll option that says something along the lines of, "I think there should be a change, but not like this." It also didn't help that a lot of the bigger names were in favor (lol) of this change because they make multiple accounts and cry about Lovakengj favor. mining sulfur gives me cancer too on every account, but part of the draw of this game is that the world feels real and lived in.
I don't see why these proposed miniquests can't give some small xp in the skills specific to the house theme/old favour methods, it's about time Jagex stops throwing lamps at people or the whole early game will become running errands for the genie to pump your ass to base 70s with all these lamps from seemingly random places, herblore isn't even a skill on new irons anymore
well you do get a fair bit of xp from the actual favours instead in related skills, the 5x 2k lamps are just to replace the 10k xp lamp from the removed miniquest edit: i slightly misunderstood your comment. i think giving some xp defenitly feels nice and gets new players more interested. it could however be focused more on gp/item rewards instead
@@heboxjonge Ye some xp rewards are definitely nice and I missed how the 5x2k is a replacement because of the Architectual Alliance lamp my bad, I just think lamps should always be avoided because aside from being very arbitrary and already overused in the game, it would suck if your good ideas for thematic content became another chore on the list to 'avoid herb/agi on an iron' when it can just have the relevant xp reward instead
I agree with you! Personally I didn't mind the favor system at all I just think it should have been polished and less tedious. This change definitely feels like a step backwards for an MMORPG, I was hoping they would end up introducing quests to keep the areas relevant.
These are all pretty good suggestions, which I would support. I am glad it was removed because it was really annoying and bad as implemented, but these optional miniquests would be nice
You hit a really great point about "looking the other way" before deciding to make this, I can imagine there are loads of people resonating with that aspect myself included, it is great we have you able to express and deliver these ideas like this because it's an area of expertise that is dying out within the community. It's a hard path to walk so thank you for doing it.
I really appreciate this video and is pretty much exactly how I feel about this situation, from the first time I heard about the idea to remove the favour system I thought to myself that it should just be reworked and would be a massive shame to see it just be straight up removed.. 1 little thing I wanna add is that favour grinds and systems exist is MANY mmorpgs, its a pretty classic element to the genre, gaining the trust of certain factions that then open up to players, becoming less hostile towards the player which eventually leads to their willingness to share their technology, secrets, spells, crafting recipes, cosmetics or whatever else with the player, its a pretty cool immersive piece of world building that can really make you feel like your character actually got to know these people and make an impact on them, in a similar way quests can, Im not advocating for a traditional favour system in OSRS but I think taking that concept from the genre and making it our own is what they tried to do with zeah favour, which I commend, but the system obviously didnt turn out that well, and didnt age well either... I think it could be a really cool thing if we found a way to successfully make a unique favour system that people actually enjoyed, and I think your ideas here in this video are a great place to start.
Is a very good argument, i dont want a rework on the favour but i do like the chores would give xp books for all chores, also think woodcutting and farm guild/ tithe farm and cooking range maybe locked behind med diarys and cox behind hard. Seems fair apart from everything is now unlocked after a simple quest
locking things behind diaries will lock certain restricted account out of content they had acces to before like redwoods in the wc guild, would like to avoid that. locking certain things like messhall behind doing a favour for the cook there makes a lot more sense, same with tithefarm. farming guild is in the kebos lowlands so idk how that would work.
Its a weird move indeed. I recently made a new ironman and spent about 15 minutes trying to figure out wtf happened to the ploughs in hosidius. Couldnt find any information about what happened and then i stumbled on this video. Havent played in a while so i totally missed this update and you are right, it feels bad to just straight up remove content instead of changing it for the better
I like your suggestions As someone who started playing only about ~15 months ago, the Zeah favour stuff is one of the first things I did when I began playing. It gave me goals that felt achievable, and a tangible reward (Recolouring my graceful set), while also giving me an introduction to the area and some very minor direct skill benefits. Seeing those bars slowly fill up after grinding a bunch of expectedly menial tasks was quite satisfying - especially since I didn't know how much worse it was compared to the rest of the game, as I fully expected OSRS to be just this kind of relaxed grindfest in general :)
What would have been really awesome is to make all the favour content into one long quest where you like you say, you have to do it all once. It could be called 'One Larger Favour' and follow that previous structure of having to run around from place to place resolving issues for people in a long chain. Would be massive for lore and worldbuilding while not taking as long as the old system used to.
I greatly appreciate that you have offered a solution or fix instead of just ranting. I would add that doing these little favours (or grinds previously) helps you learn your way around. i know so little of the area south of mount quidamortem because i have barely ever needed to go there. In shayzien i can tell you about chasm of fire, the bit with the healing soldiers, the bank, the challenge area, the ladder leading to the crypt place. The lack of content makes the area less memorable and more like a sandbox empty map
I like your thinking. Digging a ton of worms up or making saltpetre wasnt fun or interesting, but completely removing the favour feels hollow and isnt true to what OSRS stands for. Whats next on the chopping block?
I remember the mods talking about removing zeah favor years ago, so I always knew it was coming, but I expected it to be replaced by something else to fill that gap in content. The quests and reworked town areas were a part of that, but so was splitting up the catacombs which I haven't heard anything about for years out of jagex. Like really wth are all the dragons, dagaonths and dust devils doing in some catacombs? Split that place up into new dungeons around zeah, maybe with some new areas like idk dagganoths invading piscarilius and theres a dungeon on the coast with npcs for all of that to give some context and flesh things out.
I'm cool with them keeping the favor system for unlocking things like shortcuts, disease-free farming patch, etc but the free transportation unlocks were huge for ironmen. Zeah is enormous in general and it was time-consuming trying to get around the place without Xeric's talisman. I know it isn't hard to get in general, but as a skiller ironman, killing mobs of lizardmen hasn't been feasible lol
I think it’s fair to have the ‘one time tasks’ unlock quest, quest unlocks 100%. I personally hated this, but it was apart of game building and accessing zeah fully without any reqs is kind of dumb. I’m just glad I can do thralls on my alts without favour grind lol.
well im my idea there is no 100% anymore, just do some tasks get xp and gp and when you did all tasks of a house you get an xp lamp. not tied to quests or anything soyou can still get your thralls ;p
I agree. There was no reason to remove Kourend favor. Sometimes this community really annoys me. Whiney people fucking just complain loudy on mutliple social medias and make it seem like more people want something. They need to poll things in game and not use social to judge their community.
It would be cool if the stuff you can do for the NPC's is randomized, similar to fairy tale pt1 item requirements. Not only the tasks, but the NPC from whom you get the task. You'd have to go all around Kourend talking to NPCs just to see which ones give you tasks. After a certain amount of completions, perhaps you get the final "unique" reward and from then on it's exp/gp type stuff for continuing them. Perhaps some other (random) NPC's could give you hints as to where your task giver might be. It would be nice that some tasks also just require you to share some lore, like they're asking for information and you answer them correctly. In order to do this well and dissuade people from just using the Wiki for everything, they'd have to make some stuff really in-depth and varied per player, along with having a ton of different options in every "RNG" bracket. Like legit 200 possible NPCs, 1000+ possible tasks, choice dependent lore tasks, lore that builds upon previously answered questions, etc.
Something I've noticed seems to be an unpopular opinion is I think having vast, open spaces does wonders for immersion and the feeling of adventure. Being able to walk from one major city to another in 5-10 minutes just makes the world feel so small. I really enjoy the noticeboard suggestion you proposed. Gameplay-wise the favor system wasn't very fun, but like others have said, it helped a ton with worldbuilding.
But hebox, everyone has 8 jobs and 3 families, getting rid of favor is good because now i can do my PVM sooner. Now they just gotta add rs3 afk xp rates and turn this into an idle game except for PVM. I love shooting stars
I usually vote yes to polls, and I even recently started a new iron that benefits from not having to get favor, but I still voted no to removal of the favor because it really felt like it made me engage better with the areas. These rework ideas sound so cool and would’ve been the better option
voting no in polls is unfortunately useless these days. u need to be very vocal right after a dev blog drops to make any changes. I really hope something can be done to implement atleast something for kourend
I voted no to the removal, mostly because of how ham-fisted the question was. I didn't want favour removal but do think the rest of the additions are good.
Removing the favour only really makes sense from the perspective of a player that is already familiar with Zeah. I've done the AA miniquest on 3 accounts and I certainly didn't enjoy doing it, especially repeatedly, but removing it completely and not giving the (still) huge areas new purpose with few exceptions is indeed an over-correction. I think this would be a nice middle-ground.
I always thought of Kourend should have quests that you run into while traversing the area, like someone with a broken cart in the middle of no where. It really needs something to replace the intended worldbuilding from favour.
I think the Kourend Favour system was fundamentally flawed. One of its best analogs in another game is reputations in WoW. You are able to progress reputation to unlock perks, cosmetics, and gear for your character, which seemed like their initial goals with Kourend Favour. However, WoW does a few things substantially better than Kourend Favour: 1. Reps are worldwide with hundreds of reps and thousands of unique rewards. Zeah reps are limited to a specific region and function as requirements rather than reward tracks. 2. WoW reps provide incentives for continuing to grind the rep past 100%, with things like prestige cosmetics, which keep the systems evergreen 3. WoW reps, especially more recent ones, offer several different means of progressing reputations with unique mechanics (they’re not as simple as do action A until bar is full for a myriad of reps) 4. They’re OPTIONAL gameplay that aren’t required for character power progression, and instead emphasize an alternative method of account progression for both collectibles and gear. Zeah’s rep removal was fundamentally flawed because it provided nearly zero meaningful content. If OSRS wants to utilize reps to reinforce RPG elements, the rework would’ve led to Favour being functionally deleted in its current iteration and replaced with something that looks completely alien to Kourend Favour sans maybe the name anyway. I want to see reputations introduced to OSRS. Leagues does a fantastic job of demonstrating the importance of our game’s different regions. But specifically Kourend Favour was a real stain on any meaningful employment of that kind of system in the game, and I believe the game is better off without it. I hope to see a great implementation of reputations and favours in the future that take a more wholistic approach to design, which will require hundreds and hundreds of hours of dev time to do properly
Love this suggestion, really hope Jagex sees this because the game has needed a few other early game task systems that funnel people into skilling. The writing and the skilling separate RuneScape from other MMO's.
I think to get 100 approval you should’ve been required to complete every single task like 1-5 times. You’d get exposure to all of the content but don’t have to do an hour of extremely boring and repetitive content
length of the tasks are ofc not set in stone. It could be interesting if there was a small pool of different tasks that could pop up on the board. but some houses really do not have a lot of content in them. arceuus mainly has library and shayzien has like 3 things too. so maybe doing more of the same tasks is the way to go like you said
I'm honestly really glad the kourend favor is being removed. One of my least favorite grinds when I was an early level player. Mining volcanic Sulphur was such a boring and unenjoyable grind. Reworking the entire thing would have been kind of a pain as well and still wouldn't have made Kourend tasks anymore enjoyable. Even though I did finish maxxing out Kourend favor a month before they announced they would remove it, I'm glad no new players will have to go through that entire grind anymore.
Good video, I would have voted for a simplified or reworked favour system, or even just a buff to all the favour methods to streamline the process for new players. Mining sulfur and handing in saltpetre adds nothing to the experience of new or experienced players
Honestly Kourend just needs more small/short quests. The favour system was just a copycat implementation of similar systems from other games and I'm happy it's gone even though I may not ever play OSRS again. Kourend Favour was basically the EOC of non-combat activities. They did it because everyone else did it, for no other good reason.
The reason favour was removed is that Jagex does not have the time budgeted to make favour better, sadly. I'm sure there's jmods that would have prefered reworking it to be in a much better place, but it would have taken a lot of work. But between "keep it as it is" and "remove", I feel "remove" was the better option, even if ideally it would have been "rework".
i feel that this was the reason too, but the team is grown in size tenfold over the years since zeah release. surely they would be able to rework it if they really wanted to. also not to mention they were going to rework the houses themselves, but meanwhile they are only 2/5 atm and the last one was over 2.5 years ago. somehow the bigger the team gets the less work they manage to do (from an outside perspective)
I agree getting 100% in all houses was horrible, I am disappointed it's gone cuz i wasted all that time but i understand why it needed to change but removing it completely was a bad move. I love the look of Zeah but it is just so empty, it's an empty slate that's begging for content to be added and they just removed what little content there was. If they continue with this and start adding more enjoyable tasks in it's place then removing the favour system was a great move, but i hope they don't leave it as is
I voted no against removing it too. I see people constantly complain that reworking it is a waste of "dev effort", but the work that went into removing it was probably significantly more than just making it a really short grind by multiplying the rate at which you gain favor. Honestly doubt anyone would have even complained about favor if it were gained at a rate of whole pecentages, and at least that would've kept the content in the game, with some reason to explore Zeah outside of CoX and handful of quests for thralls.
Usually don't comment but, when you asked if they have removed other content without addressing issues and taking the easy route, yes. Multiple iterations of pking content. And before you write me off, im in the same breath as you, i have a maxed account i pvm on. But Ive been a pker for many years and us pkers legitimately brought this game to fruition when we petitioned for it. Jagex has time and time again shit on the pk community instead of actually working with us to provide healthy content. It sounds like a rant and maybe it is but, its a cop out way of dealing with things. Zulrah was never shut down for the billions and trillions of generated botted wealth, neither has any other pvm content been removed directly due to bots. As a community we should stand together more for healthy updates in all aspects. Not just our tight little cliques of content.
I thought id come into this video totally disagreeing with you because I hated the favour system but I'm very impressed with ur ideas and wish i had these things as a new player
Was heavily against your tweet, but if you look at this from the perspective of a new player I guess it's worth putting this in. I don't think this 'miniquest' should be a requirement for anything though, just a nice way for new players to earn some cash/xp.
Yeah they should have just made the favor gain process more rewarding, like when you get runecrafting XP from arceuus. Nobody wants to sit and do stuff like mine sulphur or push ploughs for an hour
Reworking favor is a cool idea. The issue would likely be committing dev time to the rework vs full removal which would slow down other updates. But maybe it’s something they would revisit in the future unless they have other ideas.
I don't think this would make Kourend more lively, as after you get those lamps it practically turns into dead content again. This is a good idea but the content needs an actual purpose after you complete the miniquest.
some of these favours would be repeatable low level training methods, but not everything needs to have an actual end game purpose to be added to this game imo
I agree and I like your ideas but it’s like you said. They’re focusing on new content and leaving zeah behind. Would be nice but they prob need more dev power.
All the ppl that did the annoying grinds to get that favor should be rewarded with exclusive cosmetics at the very least just delete it for jack is a big fuck you to ppl who grind the bullshit
Removing favor was the best thing to happen to this game since Tombs. The whole idea is absolute garbage. No rework could fix it. Diaries give the new players a tour a zeah anyway.
not reworking favor = common jagex L not to mention the random bits of lore that make no sense now, most glaring .. . why the fuck is hosidius patch disease free now??? (you did go on to cover some of these in the vid towards the end)
A rework definitely. Sure it was annoying doing this small single day grind for 100% in all, but they could almost make some kind of minigame out of it. Have some unlocked based on favor gained, rewards you could keep doing for small xp or w.e, and even some cosmetics?
Favor didn't make zeah more alive because it didn't actually tie into the lore in any capacity, and if you compare zeah's density to the rest of the game it's about equal after the map rework. The only real issue it has is a lack of skilling options at these locations. They should shrink the catacombs and instead place the creatures in there in various places across zeah, add some simple extra spots for skilling such as granite and teaks, and that'd fix the remaining issues.
true the old favour system didnt do that. my proposal would make it feel like that there is life in these cities, that ppl have been actually living their lives there before you (the adventurer) came along. thats a different meaning of "alive". only 2 houses got reworked so far and its been 2.5 years since, i do think adding more life in terms of skilling spots and tidying up areas is very needed too
I don't really care that they removed it, but I'm really mad that there's nothing for people who actually did the Kourend grind. It's a pretty boring continent and I do agree that we should have gotten a proper rework indeed
i am aware i am too late with this, i mentioned it in the video. when it was proposed 2months ago i looked at it from my perspective as a high level skiller and didnt care what happened. but when i took a step backwards to look at the game as a whole it would have made so much sense add some form of a rework for new players. at least i got it off my chest now
This does set a bad precedent. Now bad and unpopular content can be deleted rather than redesigned. Even other content they had removed in the past (BH for example) was removed with the eventually fulfilled promise if being reworked. Think of other terrible content that just ha s no function, NMZ. Is it useless and arguably harmful for the game in its current state? Yes, but that doesn't mean to remove it entirely. Find the problem and address it instead of wipe it away.
id would do a LOT for a NMZ rework. they should make it so that it is actually the best place to quickly get ring imbues. make it more challenging by removing the absorbtions etc and have preset short rumbles of quest bosses. example: all the troll quest bosses that you have to kill with melee only and no prayer to be able to imbue the melee rings. once you killed them all you are done, no endless mode bs
@@eaqiie Yeah, always maxed players want to nerf or remove something just after they use it to the bottom and don't need it anymore. Believe me there are new players who are playing for the first time ever and want to try PVM.
Unfortunately it just feels like one of those things - where everyone at the time hated favour and wanted it gone - but then when it was actually removed, everyone realised what they actually had. Now so many players realise they want compensation and actually miss favour, which is one of my issues with the power the devs give players in the polls. Players don’t know enough about making a game to make integral decisions like these!
![I.N "HALLUCINATION" | [Stray Kids : SKZ-PLAYER]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/n5B5q1Hwt_U/mqdefault.jpg)
Rework the Zeah favour to be a "Member's Tutorial" - teach people about the new skills, how to use them, etc.
It's one thing we don't have - a member's tutorial. It'd be far more interactive, and it's optional.
In Lumbridge, point out Veos is in Port Sarim.
i like this a lot actually
agree, the favor system was not well designed in terms of gameplay but it's a good concept for worldbuilding which is more important than people give it credit for
not in osrs it isnt
BUM@@TheWesen18
Yep the favour made alot of sense it was just too damn tedious and slow if they just made it alot faster people wouldn't mind but it being gone is a positive too fuck doing favour for the 100th time
100% agree. A rework would have been much better.
We all know how that would have ended
Since my favourite things about RuneScape are its quests, dialogues and the world building I wholeheartedly agree with you. I try hard with tick-manipulation or try getting good at bosses from time to time but in the end what started my journey and what keeps me around is the story
raids 4 when? leagues 5?? - the playerbase nowadays..
@@heboxjongemeanwhile skilling methods are useless due to the sheer amount of resources raids and bosses give now.
I completely agree. Removing it leaves zeah even more dead
Fun fact, Kourend was never meant to be so big - Mod Mat K messed up the sizes of map squares so it was designed fair bigger than he planned
Dude watched the sae bae podcast
This dude definitely Sae Baes
and other fun facts? like what Mod Mat K eats for breakfast?
1 tile became 2x2 tiles😂 it's such a strange feeling continent
Yeah heard this on the saebae cast
I stopped playing OSRS approximately when Zeah was introduced into the game. I came back to the game October 2023 with my quest cape still in the bank that I was now unable to equip. After completing quests such as DT2 and Dragon Slayer 2, all that was left for me to re-equip the quest cape was Zeah. But the whole continent was entirely foreign to me and is a massive land mass that I entirely avoided it to the point where I had half of my elite diarys done and didn't even have Kourend Easy diary started.
Just as I was about to go for the Favour system, the blog came out about removing it, so naturally I continued to avoid it until yesterday with the rework which I now absolutely turboed the quests and only have a kingdom divided to go now.
Once I finish that, I'm confident that I will still have 0 understanding of the purpose of Zeah because of the removal of the favour system not forcing me to understand it.
I don't really play OSRS, but I remember feeling sad when I heard about this from my friends that did, because it sounded like something that if done right I would have really liked!
I really like the worldbuilding elements and faction alliance sort of themes.
This actually mirrors exactly what I thought of when this was announced. I feel it's a missed opportunity not to have an additional poll option that says something along the lines of, "I think there should be a change, but not like this." It also didn't help that a lot of the bigger names were in favor (lol) of this change because they make multiple accounts and cry about Lovakengj favor. mining sulfur gives me cancer too on every account, but part of the draw of this game is that the world feels real and lived in.
I don't see why these proposed miniquests can't give some small xp in the skills specific to the house theme/old favour methods, it's about time Jagex stops throwing lamps at people or the whole early game will become running errands for the genie to pump your ass to base 70s with all these lamps from seemingly random places, herblore isn't even a skill on new irons anymore
well you do get a fair bit of xp from the actual favours instead in related skills, the 5x 2k lamps are just to replace the 10k xp lamp from the removed miniquest
edit: i slightly misunderstood your comment. i think giving some xp defenitly feels nice and gets new players more interested. it could however be focused more on gp/item rewards instead
@@heboxjonge Ye some xp rewards are definitely nice and I missed how the 5x2k is a replacement because of the Architectual Alliance lamp my bad, I just think lamps should always be avoided because aside from being very arbitrary and already overused in the game, it would suck if your good ideas for thematic content became another chore on the list to 'avoid herb/agi on an iron' when it can just have the relevant xp reward instead
I agree with you! Personally I didn't mind the favor system at all I just think it should have been polished and less tedious. This change definitely feels like a step backwards for an MMORPG, I was hoping they would end up introducing quests to keep the areas relevant.
When is jagex not taking a step forwards and 3 steps back?
These are all pretty good suggestions, which I would support. I am glad it was removed because it was really annoying and bad as implemented, but these optional miniquests would be nice
You hit a really great point about "looking the other way" before deciding to make this, I can imagine there are loads of people resonating with that aspect myself included, it is great we have you able to express and deliver these ideas like this because it's an area of expertise that is dying out within the community. It's a hard path to walk so thank you for doing it.
I really appreciate this video and is pretty much exactly how I feel about this situation, from the first time I heard about the idea to remove the favour system I thought to myself that it should just be reworked and would be a massive shame to see it just be straight up removed.. 1 little thing I wanna add is that favour grinds and systems exist is MANY mmorpgs, its a pretty classic element to the genre, gaining the trust of certain factions that then open up to players, becoming less hostile towards the player which eventually leads to their willingness to share their technology, secrets, spells, crafting recipes, cosmetics or whatever else with the player, its a pretty cool immersive piece of world building that can really make you feel like your character actually got to know these people and make an impact on them, in a similar way quests can, Im not advocating for a traditional favour system in OSRS but I think taking that concept from the genre and making it our own is what they tried to do with zeah favour, which I commend, but the system obviously didnt turn out that well, and didnt age well either... I think it could be a really cool thing if we found a way to successfully make a unique favour system that people actually enjoyed, and I think your ideas here in this video are a great place to start.
Is a very good argument, i dont want a rework on the favour but i do like the chores would give xp books for all chores, also think woodcutting and farm guild/ tithe farm and cooking range maybe locked behind med diarys and cox behind hard. Seems fair apart from everything is now unlocked after a simple quest
locking things behind diaries will lock certain restricted account out of content they had acces to before like redwoods in the wc guild, would like to avoid that. locking certain things like messhall behind doing a favour for the cook there makes a lot more sense, same with tithefarm. farming guild is in the kebos lowlands so idk how that would work.
Its a weird move indeed. I recently made a new ironman and spent about 15 minutes trying to figure out wtf happened to the ploughs in hosidius. Couldnt find any information about what happened and then i stumbled on this video. Havent played in a while so i totally missed this update and you are right, it feels bad to just straight up remove content instead of changing it for the better
I like your suggestions
As someone who started playing only about ~15 months ago, the Zeah favour stuff is one of the first things I did when I began playing. It gave me goals that felt achievable, and a tangible reward (Recolouring my graceful set), while also giving me an introduction to the area and some very minor direct skill benefits. Seeing those bars slowly fill up after grinding a bunch of expectedly menial tasks was quite satisfying - especially since I didn't know how much worse it was compared to the rest of the game, as I fully expected OSRS to be just this kind of relaxed grindfest in general :)
What would have been really awesome is to make all the favour content into one long quest where you like you say, you have to do it all once.
It could be called 'One Larger Favour' and follow that previous structure of having to run around from place to place resolving issues for people in a long chain. Would be massive for lore and worldbuilding while not taking as long as the old system used to.
great idea, like the name especially.
I greatly appreciate that you have offered a solution or fix instead of just ranting.
I would add that doing these little favours (or grinds previously) helps you learn your way around. i know so little of the area south of mount quidamortem because i have barely ever needed to go there. In shayzien i can tell you about chasm of fire, the bit with the healing soldiers, the bank, the challenge area, the ladder leading to the crypt place.
The lack of content makes the area less memorable and more like a sandbox empty map
I like your thinking. Digging a ton of worms up or making saltpetre wasnt fun or interesting, but completely removing the favour feels hollow and isnt true to what OSRS stands for. Whats next on the chopping block?
Forestry 😂
I remember the mods talking about removing zeah favor years ago, so I always knew it was coming, but I expected it to be replaced by something else to fill that gap in content. The quests and reworked town areas were a part of that, but so was splitting up the catacombs which I haven't heard anything about for years out of jagex. Like really wth are all the dragons, dagaonths and dust devils doing in some catacombs? Split that place up into new dungeons around zeah, maybe with some new areas like idk dagganoths invading piscarilius and theres a dungeon on the coast with npcs for all of that to give some context and flesh things out.
I'm cool with them keeping the favor system for unlocking things like shortcuts, disease-free farming patch, etc but the free transportation unlocks were huge for ironmen. Zeah is enormous in general and it was time-consuming trying to get around the place without Xeric's talisman. I know it isn't hard to get in general, but as a skiller ironman, killing mobs of lizardmen hasn't been feasible lol
yes minecart system update was amazing! been using it a lot to get to raids 1 mountain
I think it’s fair to have the ‘one time tasks’ unlock quest, quest unlocks 100%. I personally hated this, but it was apart of game building and accessing zeah fully without any reqs is kind of dumb.
I’m just glad I can do thralls on my alts without favour grind lol.
well im my idea there is no 100% anymore, just do some tasks get xp and gp and when you did all tasks of a house you get an xp lamp. not tied to quests or anything soyou can still get your thralls ;p
I agree. There was no reason to remove Kourend favor. Sometimes this community really annoys me. Whiney people fucking just complain loudy on mutliple social medias and make it seem like more people want something. They need to poll things in game and not use social to judge their community.
It would be cool if the stuff you can do for the NPC's is randomized, similar to fairy tale pt1 item requirements. Not only the tasks, but the NPC from whom you get the task. You'd have to go all around Kourend talking to NPCs just to see which ones give you tasks. After a certain amount of completions, perhaps you get the final "unique" reward and from then on it's exp/gp type stuff for continuing them. Perhaps some other (random) NPC's could give you hints as to where your task giver might be. It would be nice that some tasks also just require you to share some lore, like they're asking for information and you answer them correctly. In order to do this well and dissuade people from just using the Wiki for everything, they'd have to make some stuff really in-depth and varied per player, along with having a ton of different options in every "RNG" bracket. Like legit 200 possible NPCs, 1000+ possible tasks, choice dependent lore tasks, lore that builds upon previously answered questions, etc.
would be very cool to implement something like this, but 1k tasks would be alot more dev work haha
Something I've noticed seems to be an unpopular opinion is I think having vast, open spaces does wonders for immersion and the feeling of adventure. Being able to walk from one major city to another in 5-10 minutes just makes the world feel so small.
I really enjoy the noticeboard suggestion you proposed. Gameplay-wise the favor system wasn't very fun, but like others have said, it helped a ton with worldbuilding.
But hebox, everyone has 8 jobs and 3 families, getting rid of favor is good because now i can do my PVM sooner. Now they just gotta add rs3 afk xp rates and turn this into an idle game except for PVM. I love shooting stars
harsh reality unfort
How do we color our graceful sets now?
I usually vote yes to polls, and I even recently started a new iron that benefits from not having to get favor, but I still voted no to removal of the favor because it really felt like it made me engage better with the areas. These rework ideas sound so cool and would’ve been the better option
voting no in polls is unfortunately useless these days. u need to be very vocal right after a dev blog drops to make any changes. I really hope something can be done to implement atleast something for kourend
@@heboxjonge yeah that has seemed to be the case lately for sure
I voted no to the removal, mostly because of how ham-fisted the question was. I didn't want favour removal but do think the rest of the additions are good.
Removing the favour only really makes sense from the perspective of a player that is already familiar with Zeah. I've done the AA miniquest on 3 accounts and I certainly didn't enjoy doing it, especially repeatedly, but removing it completely and not giving the (still) huge areas new purpose with few exceptions is indeed an over-correction. I think this would be a nice middle-ground.
Yeah I was upset when it was removed. I put so much work into it, and Zeah is empty without it.
I always thought of Kourend should have quests that you run into while traversing the area, like someone with a broken cart in the middle of no where. It really needs something to replace the intended worldbuilding from favour.
I think the Kourend Favour system was fundamentally flawed. One of its best analogs in another game is reputations in WoW. You are able to progress reputation to unlock perks, cosmetics, and gear for your character, which seemed like their initial goals with Kourend Favour. However, WoW does a few things substantially better than Kourend Favour:
1. Reps are worldwide with hundreds of reps and thousands of unique rewards. Zeah reps are limited to a specific region and function as requirements rather than reward tracks.
2. WoW reps provide incentives for continuing to grind the rep past 100%, with things like prestige cosmetics, which keep the systems evergreen
3. WoW reps, especially more recent ones, offer several different means of progressing reputations with unique mechanics (they’re not as simple as do action A until bar is full for a myriad of reps)
4. They’re OPTIONAL gameplay that aren’t required for character power progression, and instead emphasize an alternative method of account progression for both collectibles and gear.
Zeah’s rep removal was fundamentally flawed because it provided nearly zero meaningful content. If OSRS wants to utilize reps to reinforce RPG elements, the rework would’ve led to Favour being functionally deleted in its current iteration and replaced with something that looks completely alien to Kourend Favour sans maybe the name anyway.
I want to see reputations introduced to OSRS. Leagues does a fantastic job of demonstrating the importance of our game’s different regions. But specifically Kourend Favour was a real stain on any meaningful employment of that kind of system in the game, and I believe the game is better off without it. I hope to see a great implementation of reputations and favours in the future that take a more wholistic approach to design, which will require hundreds and hundreds of hours of dev time to do properly
Love this suggestion, really hope Jagex sees this because the game has needed a few other early game task systems that funnel people into skilling. The writing and the skilling separate RuneScape from other MMO's.
I think to get 100 approval you should’ve been required to complete every single task like 1-5 times. You’d get exposure to all of the content but don’t have to do an hour of extremely boring and repetitive content
length of the tasks are ofc not set in stone. It could be interesting if there was a small pool of different tasks that could pop up on the board. but some houses really do not have a lot of content in them. arceuus mainly has library and shayzien has like 3 things too. so maybe doing more of the same tasks is the way to go like you said
Some great ideas in this vid. like you say, it could be a fun little project an would be cool for new accounts
I'm honestly really glad the kourend favor is being removed. One of my least favorite grinds when I was an early level player. Mining volcanic Sulphur was such a boring and unenjoyable grind. Reworking the entire thing would have been kind of a pain as well and still wouldn't have made Kourend tasks anymore enjoyable. Even though I did finish maxxing out Kourend favor a month before they announced they would remove it, I'm glad no new players will have to go through that entire grind anymore.
im not. now everyone gets evrything for free and its bs. trash update im new to osrs not new to rs2, this is for who? not gamers
Good video, I would have voted for a simplified or reworked favour system, or even just a buff to all the favour methods to streamline the process for new players. Mining sulfur and handing in saltpetre adds nothing to the experience of new or experienced players
Honestly Kourend just needs more small/short quests. The favour system was just a copycat implementation of similar systems from other games and I'm happy it's gone even though I may not ever play OSRS again. Kourend Favour was basically the EOC of non-combat activities. They did it because everyone else did it, for no other good reason.
Hard agree, you also provided a well fitting low-intensity alternative. W's across the board.
MY LITTLE TASKS!! MY DOPAMINE RESERVOIR!!!! i take a break for a week and they do this?!! i was in the middle of favour grinding (ToT )
Getting 100 percent arceuus favour was such ass. I remember losing my shit just walking around looking for books. Im glad they got rid of it
This is a very good idea. The favors give tangible rewards, and have reasonable requirements instead of requiring several hundreds of things.
Great suggestion. I like a lot of these scrapped favors becoming low level training methods so we don’t lose the interaction with this huge continent
so how will i unlock the herb patch at the farming guild without hisidius favour?
The reason favour was removed is that Jagex does not have the time budgeted to make favour better, sadly. I'm sure there's jmods that would have prefered reworking it to be in a much better place, but it would have taken a lot of work. But between "keep it as it is" and "remove", I feel "remove" was the better option, even if ideally it would have been "rework".
i feel that this was the reason too, but the team is grown in size tenfold over the years since zeah release. surely they would be able to rework it if they really wanted to. also not to mention they were going to rework the houses themselves, but meanwhile they are only 2/5 atm and the last one was over 2.5 years ago. somehow the bigger the team gets the less work they manage to do (from an outside perspective)
Im just trying to figure out how to get “trust” in pisc its kinda confusing
I just returned to playing osrs and i was so confused when i couldn't find the favour level lol
I agree getting 100% in all houses was horrible, I am disappointed it's gone cuz i wasted all that time but i understand why it needed to change but removing it completely was a bad move. I love the look of Zeah but it is just so empty, it's an empty slate that's begging for content to be added and they just removed what little content there was. If they continue with this and start adding more enjoyable tasks in it's place then removing the favour system was a great move, but i hope they don't leave it as is
meanwhile they working hard on fortnite colloseum, we play pvm scape these days
remove zeah completely
They removed dangerous random events from the game, first thing that came to mind when you talked about other pieces of content that are gone now
good shout yeah, another quirky osrs gimmick that had to make way for convenience
I hate the favour system but completely removing it is worrying about the future of the game even more so than other updates
They already do this with fossil island so I don't see why they cannot do this here.
100%, I voted no on the poll initially just because I'd rather see a rework
Complaining that you don't get to have the early xp infarming/magic/rc is pretty dumb. The activities aren't gone you can still do them
At least it gives them a good excuse to rework the visual layout of the cities
I voted no against removing it too. I see people constantly complain that reworking it is a waste of "dev effort", but the work that went into removing it was probably significantly more than just making it a really short grind by multiplying the rate at which you gain favor. Honestly doubt anyone would have even complained about favor if it were gained at a rate of whole pecentages, and at least that would've kept the content in the game, with some reason to explore Zeah outside of CoX and handful of quests for thralls.
for real yeah, its not as simple as just delete a few lines of code (i think) to remove something from a game like this
I hated doing this on both my main and UIM and now people get away FREE no favour needed. Well fuck you Jagex
Welcome to Kourend heres 4 quests.
im already mentally preparing for sailing release... they got an entire ocean to fill
Usually don't comment but, when you asked if they have removed other content without addressing issues and taking the easy route, yes. Multiple iterations of pking content. And before you write me off, im in the same breath as you, i have a maxed account i pvm on. But Ive been a pker for many years and us pkers legitimately brought this game to fruition when we petitioned for it. Jagex has time and time again shit on the pk community instead of actually working with us to provide healthy content.
It sounds like a rant and maybe it is but, its a cop out way of dealing with things. Zulrah was never shut down for the billions and trillions of generated botted wealth, neither has any other pvm content been removed directly due to bots.
As a community we should stand together more for healthy updates in all aspects. Not just our tight little cliques of content.
I thought id come into this video totally disagreeing with you because I hated the favour system but I'm very impressed with ur ideas and wish i had these things as a new player
Good bye favour system, won't be missed
Was heavily against your tweet, but if you look at this from the perspective of a new player I guess it's worth putting this in. I don't think this 'miniquest' should be a requirement for anything though, just a nice way for new players to earn some cash/xp.
:) its all about perspective, i do struggle with that myself too sometimes. thats why i didnt care at first when they originally proposed removing it
Yeah they should have just made the favor gain process more rewarding, like when you get runecrafting XP from arceuus. Nobody wants to sit and do stuff like mine sulphur or push ploughs for an hour
Theres always that one weirdo that wants to ruin it for everyone
this would be completely optional, you didnt even watch the vid lmao. you are the weirdo here i fear..
How many people mined for lova favour?
Reworking favor is a cool idea. The issue would likely be committing dev time to the rework vs full removal which would slow down other updates. But maybe it’s something they would revisit in the future unless they have other ideas.
I don't think this would make Kourend more lively, as after you get those lamps it practically turns into dead content again. This is a good idea but the content needs an actual purpose after you complete the miniquest.
some of these favours would be repeatable low level training methods, but not everything needs to have an actual end game purpose to be added to this game imo
Actually like this idea. I didn’t mind favor though
I voted no to the favour being removed for these reasons
I agree and I like your ideas but it’s like you said. They’re focusing on new content and leaving zeah behind. Would be nice but they prob need more dev power.
All the ppl that did the annoying grinds to get that favor should be rewarded with exclusive cosmetics at the very least just delete it for jack is a big fuck you to ppl who grind the bullshit
It only takes a very hours to get full favor with all clans anyway.
but i dont have a few hours, i got to feed my 4 families and work 7 jobs!!!
Jagex make an RPG server for this guy and allow ERP on those servers, let this guy get laid at least online
Banger comment
@@heboxjonge 🥺Pretty stupid comment ngl
Removing favor was the best thing to happen to this game since Tombs. The whole idea is absolute garbage. No rework could fix it. Diaries give the new players a tour a zeah anyway.
1 thing they should do is not locked that stupid teleport Xeric's honour behind a raid.
minecarts bro
What's the cursor plugin you're using here?
im not sure what you mean
thats so crazy i had no idea this happened
not reworking favor = common jagex L
not to mention the random bits of lore that make no sense now, most glaring .. . why the fuck is hosidius patch disease free now??? (you did go on to cover some of these in the vid towards the end)
Just remove the diaries and then OSRS is the perfect game 😎
Thanks for someone else sharing same opinion
yep
Support
A rework definitely. Sure it was annoying doing this small single day grind for 100% in all, but they could almost make some kind of minigame out of it. Have some unlocked based on favor gained, rewards you could keep doing for small xp or w.e, and even some cosmetics?
seems pretty convoluted, my idea no favour, instead you are doing favours. would be relativily easy to implement i think
Favor didn't make zeah more alive because it didn't actually tie into the lore in any capacity, and if you compare zeah's density to the rest of the game it's about equal after the map rework. The only real issue it has is a lack of skilling options at these locations. They should shrink the catacombs and instead place the creatures in there in various places across zeah, add some simple extra spots for skilling such as granite and teaks, and that'd fix the remaining issues.
true the old favour system didnt do that. my proposal would make it feel like that there is life in these cities, that ppl have been actually living their lives there before you (the adventurer) came along. thats a different meaning of "alive".
only 2 houses got reworked so far and its been 2.5 years since, i do think adding more life in terms of skilling spots and tidying up areas is very needed too
I'm late but I would honestly prefer them update achievement diaries, they're so outdated
going to do a vid on those soon :)
@@heboxjonge can't wait!
Damn i agree with everything u said
No thanks. Yes they should fix the sprawling map and useless npc’s and buildings but no more favor is perfect
100% agreed
Strijder maat!
I hated the favor thing since it came out
I don't really care that they removed it, but I'm really mad that there's nothing for people who actually did the Kourend grind. It's a pretty boring continent and I do agree that we should have gotten a proper rework indeed
Fully agreed
This video is about 2 months too late. But that's kinda what you do, just say stuff that makes sense in hindsight
i am aware i am too late with this, i mentioned it in the video. when it was proposed 2months ago i looked at it from my perspective as a high level skiller and didnt care what happened. but when i took a step backwards to look at the game as a whole it would have made so much sense add some form of a rework for new players. at least i got it off my chest now
This does set a bad precedent. Now bad and unpopular content can be deleted rather than redesigned. Even other content they had removed in the past (BH for example) was removed with the eventually fulfilled promise if being reworked.
Think of other terrible content that just ha s no function, NMZ. Is it useless and arguably harmful for the game in its current state? Yes, but that doesn't mean to remove it entirely. Find the problem and address it instead of wipe it away.
id would do a LOT for a NMZ rework. they should make it so that it is actually the best place to quickly get ring imbues. make it more challenging by removing the absorbtions etc and have preset short rumbles of quest bosses. example: all the troll quest bosses that you have to kill with melee only and no prayer to be able to imbue the melee rings. once you killed them all you are done, no endless mode bs
They should remove NMZ completely.
@@eaqiie Yeah, always maxed players want to nerf or remove something just after they use it to the bottom and don't need it anymore. Believe me there are new players who are playing for the first time ever and want to try PVM.
Unfortunately it just feels like one of those things - where everyone at the time hated favour and wanted it gone - but then when it was actually removed, everyone realised what they actually had. Now so many players realise they want compensation and actually miss favour, which is one of my issues with the power the devs give players in the polls. Players don’t know enough about making a game to make integral decisions like these!
ffs hate my life got all the favors 2 weeks ago and now they gone wtf is that :(
They should give all the players that already did it a 100K XP lamp or something so it doesn't feel like it was a waste of time.
nop
Lol removed it, isnt it like an introduction from the kourends ? Dead content times 2 now