Don't TOUCH my TOOLS! Owner Assisted Airplane Maintenance
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- Опубликовано: 27 авг 2024
- (Please Subscribe). Dan and Christy welcome back to the show well known and highly respected A&P/IA John "Cessna John" Efinger to talk about the pros and cons of owner assisted maintenance and why some mechanics don't like to do it.
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really enjoyed John's comments......great show....cheers from Florida, Paul
It’s my airplane with my life on the line especially with aerobatic aircraft. I want to check everything. My local airport will not allow owner assisted annuals. You can’t even be in their hangar while they work on your airplane. It’s crazy. That’s why you build your own Experimental airplane and give up on certified aircraft. Experimental airplanes only need an A&P not an IA for a condition inspection. Dan & Christy should build an Experimental airplane. It would completely change their outlook on aircraft.
Not a shop I’d hire if I can’t “help”
Excellent episode Dan and Christy. It's always great to have John on the show. Keep up the excellent work. Safe skies my friends 🇺🇸🛩️
Thankfully I built my own Glasair Experimental & got the A/P license from the FAA to do my own annual condition inspection.
I’ve heard that your plane is a sweet ride.
The shop supervisor in the AE (Electrical Shop) when I was with VQ-1 (Fleet Air Reconnaissance) in the Navy had a standard answer. If we are missing a tool we ain’t going home until 2500, and by damn that’s late. Naval Aviation positive tool control is no joke! No one leaves until that tool is found.
As a AM, yes. You aren't going home if anything is missing.
TAF is freedom. Total Accounted For.
The number one thing that would help all aircraft maintenance!.....Make the engineers work on their designs. I own a Bonanza and had to replace the master cylinders which are under the rudder pedals and under the floor. It took me over a week (mainly to go to my chiropractor between sessions), I had to remove the center console to lay on the floor on the right side to reach over with one hand to install one cotter pin (I am a BIG guy). Before I would get in there I put my cell phone in my pocket so if I got stuck I could call for help...seriously. I was then shown some pictures from the Beech factory of the brakes being installed by a guy sitting on a stool and reaching in through the side of the frame...and then another guy comes along and rivets the skin on. These planes were built like no one would ever have to work on them. I just had to replace the electric boost pump and fuel selector...again to access the units I had to cut, grind, bend several wrenches just to remove and then replace the fittings and fuel lines due to the location. Maintenance is a young person's game.
I really like this guy. I can totally relate.
TRUE! The Defects are Under the Dirt! ❤
I helped my dad build his plane. I am in the process of totally restoring it right now. I have another builders copy of the same plane.
In spite of my experience with the type, I can’t believe how much I learned about that particular plane by doing an owner assisted condition inspection (E-AB version of an annual). it’s really eye-opening about what you can learn about a plane when you do the owner assist. I’m so happy that my AP - AI allowed the owner assist!
You were talking about the possibility of a mechanic leaving a tool inside the aircraft. In the mid-nineteen sixties, I was an electronics mech on the F-105. I do not remember what I was doing but it involved reaching down behind the instrument panel. While reaching back there I kept feeling something loose. When I finally got it out it was a wrench someone had left back there and had not reported it because it would have required that the aircraft be grounded until the dropped wrench was found and removed. I took that wrench and put it in the toolbox in my car. One day, as I left the base, the Air Police were searching for government property. Of course,they found that wrench with USAF etched into it. When he showed me what he had found, he said that he would need to write me up and I was adamant that that wrench was mine. When I told him how I came to have that wrench he tossed it back into my toolbox, closed the trunk, and sent me on my way.
Wow, great story.
I open my Cardinal up for annual and close it back. I get no break on the price. but it is as much fun for me as flying it.
The scary part for me is that I don't know what I don't know. My mechanic will let me work on my plane under his supervision. But I only do maintenance things or disassembly of panels. And I bring my own tools! Even though my mechanics cool about it I don't like fishing around in his tools. I don't want him having to re-organize his box because I put something in the wrong place.
First couple flights out of annual are always my most nerve wracking flights. Never know what may have got left partially done and ready to blow or lock up
This reinforces the A&P classes I had to take for my pilot degree in college.
Owner assisted annual should be encouraged..at least once if you own the aircraft. These GA aircraft are generally very simple machines (that require precision care), and it's a sin to not know as much as you can about the little tin can you're up in the air with. I expect that if i slow the process down that I'm paying the tech for that extra time..would never ask a pro for free labor.
I'm an old mother hen about my tool box. And for good reason, its my lively hood and I've a major investment estimated at aprox $50k in my small tools and tool box alone, not counting the big ones that won't fit in the box like jacks, lifts, compressor, parts washers, welders etc. I'm not an A&P but have been a mechanic by trade for close to fifty years, so buy your own dam tools! Lol
That being said, I will at times let folks use my tools, but the tools will come back to the box, no excuses. :)
I know of a ATP pilot who flew a Navajo for a local company and I never saw any landing he did that wasn't a greaser. He went in upside down into Mobile Bay many years ago due jammed controls from a screwdriver left in the wing.
Completed an owner assist on our Warrior 151 last fall. Total of 12hrs disassembly and reassembly, but I'm extremely mechanically inclined. Luckily the airplane is very low hours so no squawks at all and no AD issues. Hoping for the same this fall.
We did find a flash light in the belly though, who knows when that happened years back!
Interesting topic and interview. Thanks and looking good Christy!
Most owners will just slow them down, having to redo or closely inspect your work.
Christopher Ottawa Canada have done 80% of most of the annual work on all the last 8 I craft that I have owned remove all inspection panels, change get oil, compression check, clean and test spark plugs, get all paper work organized ready for Awds, it would take me 2 days work single engine 3 days for twin include gear swing AC ready on Jacks the mechanic would spend about 1 day providing no major snags last AC was a piper 600A non turbo aerator with io540 engines, loved the work did this for 30 years, now retired started new hobby when I turned 75 racing inboard hydro planes now 85 no more hydro, what really helped me I always has very good e gine,accessed ect manuals studied them well, I a.So HD very good work sheet list showing what has been done with work sheet list on what has been done, I of course is very mechanically as a person. Christopher
Real cool show. I'm very particular about by tools too and I can tell if someone put a tool in the wrong drawer or chest. I'm very anal about tightening fasteners and usually check behind anyone helping me. Some guys over tighten fasteners or strip fasteners and don't tell the owner. I'm wary of this scenario. I get where John is coming from. I work mostly on cars as a DIY'er.
Dan, When I worked for Japan Airlines Cargo, back in the 70s we NEVER put our names on our tools. Just marks that we would know, in case someone left a tool in an awkward place!
Now that he’s not rigging, who does he recommend? I’d love to get my classic 182 rigged
Actually still doing rigging, pre-buys and limited Annuals-maintenance. Just slowing things down. Unable to maintain the full load of 30+ Aircraft like I did with staff.
@@cessnarigging I tried getting on your schedule. I’ll call Monday and try again.
Thank you for the reply!
Hey Dan, I don't guess you had the cameras rolling when you got stuck in your own airplane did you? That would be hilarious to see. 😊 So glad it was not something more major that came lose during that flight.
OMG, no! Thank goodness, LOL. The only witness was Chewy who wanted out more than me.
This was a hard video to not click away from. The "ya-know-ometer" must have rolled over twice. The story of the rag in a cylinder is really hard to believe. If it was in really in the cylinder, the engine would not turn over. If it was in the crankcase, very quickly it would get wrapped up in the crankcase around the crankshaft.
Rag in the cylinder is not a "only happened once" story. THey can get stuck in there. Doesn't mean they travel into the crankshaft.
Ya-know, I am sure they meant in the engine compartment stuffed around between cylinders. My Wife & I just viewed this vid and she had the same comment about the “ya-knows”. Believe it or not I am not from Wisconsin 👀She said “you must have been nervous”. I’m sure I was, it is a bit intimidating with all these cameras rolling if one is not used to it…
Darn cameras
I thought it was "Shaffer" not "Wong"
Recorded in studio before she decided to switch.
@@TakingOff gotcha, I think its also great for owners to learn all about their airplane and owner assist is the best way, as long as the A&P allows it.
Screws.... So many screws
Exactly!
😂