Lightweight 160-watt Crystalline Solar Panel |
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- Опубликовано: 26 июл 2024
- A portable crystalline solar panel from PowerFilm Solar. Today on OH8STN we take a look at a 160-watt portable monocrystalline solar panel which is both lightweight and folding. We will also talk about the difference amorphous vs crystalline, and why you might choose one over the other. We'll also compare this160-watt panel, with 3 of the most popular portable or moveable monocrystalline solar panels available.
The PF 160-watt crystalline comes in with higher energy density, more power and with a smaller footprint, than the amorphous solar panels, but with a lower price point. This video should help you decide which brand and technology is best for your application. I'll be integrating this portable crytalline solar panel into my off-grid portable power system very soon.
Enjoy
73
Julian oh8stn
Video URL: • Lightweight 160-watt C...
The PowerFilm 160-watt Crystalline can be found at:
- GigaParts: oh8stn.net/pf_160w_crystalline
- California PC: oh8stn.net/pf_160watt_californ...
Both suppliers ship worldwide.
#oh8stn #powerfilmsolar #offgrid
00:00 Introduction
00:40 Background & first reaction
01:55 Electric bike charge with solar
04:19 160-watt panel specs
05:17 Crystalline vs amorphous comparison
06:11 Comparison Goal Zero, Off Grid Trek, Bioenno Power
07:40 Field Station implecations
08:24 EcoFlow River, Delta Delta Pro
09:57 Final thoughts
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I really like Oliver at DIY559. What a helpful and nice person. His PA500 is by far the best PA!
I am in an area between big metropolitan areas (Pontiac and Flint Michigan USA). If I want to operate from an island in a park, I need to know the park manager and reassure we will not harmfully impacting their area. My vehicle needs to be in a boat launch area where they do not expect over night parking. This is not easily handled, but necessary in a highly populated area. Not happy about that, but needs to be accommodated (LOL). Wish I was your partner in Finland 😀😀😀
Back before I left the States, one could do hobbies like radio, freely without much fuss. Here in Finland, we have a right to movement and public lands, within reason. It's a blessing!
I got the rollable 60W after watching some of your other reviews, and absolutely love the reliable output and strength of the package. That said, I have definitely been waiting for a more affordable package with higher output and a more compact footprint. As others have said, I am definitely interested in a long term review, for durability, but this looks like another excellent product. Thanks as always for your video!
Great video. Thanks.
This is the one I will buy. Excellent video!
Great content as always, great location filming also.
Great video. You are always one of the first to share the latest tech with your viewers.
Thanks! You got me into ham radio and taught me about power, charging, use, efficiency and weight. I appreciate your hard work, knowledge and judgment.
Best comment of the day 🙏
Hey and thanks for the super thanks. I didn't notice it when I was reading the comment. This is greatly appreciated🙏
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Julian oh8stn
This is so relevant for me right now! Ive been looking to upgrade my older panel... thumbs up
Great video as always man. 73
Thanks Eduardo. 👍
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Julian oh8stn
Thx for the vid. Very informative.
You are very welcome Ted.
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Julian oh8stn
As always, nice comprehensive presentation. Great to see capacity going up and weight going down. As you mentioned price, we can only hope that's the next piece of the puzzle to benefit the portable operation.
Thanks Doug. Agreed. The price is still a sticking point for sure. I've discussed this in meetings. Hopefully it makes a difference.
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Julian oh8stn
Most American's have a Snapper Lawn Mower. Julian has a Snapper, tail gunner!
😉👍
Julian, your videos are the most informative I have watch so far and has cost me a pretty penny because I end buying the items your running. 😂 Keep up the great work 73 Julian!!!
Ouch, yes some of the gear is costly. Hopefully we only ever have to train with it.
Thanks for watching, commenting and the kindness.
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Julian oh8stn
Again a very interesting explanation. It gives much to think about. Thank you and 73's de PD1XAN
Thanks for watching and commenting. Greatly appreciated.
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Julian oh8stn
Great piece. Had no idea the crystalline was THAT much more efficient.
One observation (as an EE).. You could probably cut your 160W panel down to 1/2 that simply by better controlling your orientation of the panel to the sun. You're losing 1/2 of your solar capacity by just laying the cells flat on the ground. You may not care, and would rather just take the path of lease resistance (being lazy is some times the right call). But think about shrinking your solar mass-load by 1/2. Is that appealing?
It's a good point Thomas. When it's critical, I'll use cordage, sticks and trees to orientate the solar panel in the direction of the Sun. When it's not critical, laying them out flat is not only less work, its draws less attention when looking upon the station from a ways out.
The station is also so efficient now ~280ma on rx and less than 10A @60-watts. So there's some over head.
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Julian oh8stn
Thank you sir for this video. I'm an "old" guy from the Vietnam Era who is just getting his General and Extra license. I'm really enjoying your videos.
'73 KG7DTF Joe
Looks like those other dogs were jealous @ 2:42
That was my wife with our other dogs 👍
Thanks!
Thank you Dan 👍
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Julian oh8stn
I’d like to add the 160w to use with my station and other power things, what controller do you recommend? Great for the bike, how do I use it for radio / computer / battery 12v 6Ahr, buy once, cry once. Thanks Marine
Do you already have a battery for your station or are you going to buy one to go with the panel? The charge controller I always recommend for radio things is the Genasun GV10L or GV5L. If you're still using a lead battery, you have to get the lead versions of them. If you have a lithium iron phosphate battery, pick up one of these charge controllers meant for 4S lithium iron phosphate.
You can see how I set up my battery and charge controllers with 160 in this other video. Never mind the dual charge controllers in that video. One is enough if you're just using a single panel. Hope this helps.
Semper Fi
ruclips.net/video/L-_V8qOf0hM/видео.html
I hope they make a 100w version. This will be a game changer.
I recently started carrying my portable solar via car camping.
Let me tell you. Lugging around a couple/several 15-20lbs solar panel every time...gets tiring fast. I want to invest in, at least, ONE ultralight panel.
Unfortunately, the price is what we pay for portability.
Yeah, agreed. I wish there were some better alternatives
Perfect! Just received mine this afternoon. Now waiting on the Genasun.
Excellent 👍. Please let me know how you get on with them.
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Julian oh8stn
@@OH8STN -> Which eBike do you prefer? I’m thinking about a folding eBike to use from a sailboat.
Although very inefficient, I an a hardened eFatbike Rider. It suits the terrain, and builds those quads 👍😂
I’m new to ham radio, and recently stumbled upon your channel while researching portable power options. I’ve currently got a Yaesu ft891, and I’m interested in adding a power film panel to my kit. You’re most definitely helping me along the way. Thank you for making these videos.
You are very welcome. Welcome to our ham radio community
This panel is more than enough if you live in moderate latitudes. The better question is the battery that goes along with a solar panel. The 891 has pretty high current consumption even when the power is turned down. So you'll need an adequate battery. Take a look at this video I did a few weeks ago ruclips.net/video/L-_V8qOf0hM/видео.html
For the controller, I always suggest Genasun MPPT controllers.
Finally for General understanding of solar power for ham radio, watch this video. ruclips.net/video/CAUamTA9G90/видео.html
I would love to have one of these for EmComm in the field. The ability to have small compact lightweight equipment is important. I see people make these huge rugged carry cases that need two people or more to pick up and carry. I just wish I could afford powerfilm. I guess you do get what you pay for.
I didn't realize the Genasuns could handle that high an input voltage.
They can handle that voltage natively. No special handling required.
Nice......................
Thanks. Always like presenting new options.
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Julian oh8stn
Excellent vid and content...Thanks for the heads up and upgrade on the new more efficient foldable panels...I have a 200W AllPowers that I bought just before the pandemic...It served it's purpose as my "Introductory Portable Solar Panel" and with portability in mind I agree with you that "You basically get what you pay for" and that this new PF 160-watt crystalline panel would be a better upgrade to what I currently have...Thanks for the vid and review.
Happy you found it useful.
Perhaps now we need a video showing the differences between amorphous and crystalline.
Thanks for watching and for the kindness.
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Julian oh8stn
@@OH8STN Thank you Julian...and yes a video about the Pros and Cons of Amorphous and Crystalline woud be great and dispell the myths of either...In addition consider a request from me for a video on the effects of an EMP and protecting our radios and power supplies (i.e. Solar Power Stations)...Given the recent increase in popularity and power output of these units, not to mention the reduction in cost, My concern is to avoid investing money on what might transform it's self due to an EMP into a pile of expensive plastic and metal...(Basically an expensive paperweight)
I opted for this quality panel even though the price was substantially greater than "competitors". Made in USA was important and that costs more, much more!. Your use of the single Genasun LiFePO4 controller was not recommended by Genasun/Sunforge. Their caution was the total Voltage/output of the PowerFilm 160w panel exceeded the Genasun-Li capacity and suggested their alternative, the Blue Sky Energy SB1524iX(-Li). This controller is larger (panel mount) and I used a portable Nanuk 903 case to house it perfectly.
Thanks for watching, commenting on for your setup. I'm a little surprised they suggested the blue solar over the Genasun. The Genasun has a max voltage of 30v. Either way, sounds like you have a good setup. Please let us know how it works out for you.
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Julian oh8stn
Thanks for organizing this information into an enjoyable format. It appears the Crystalline panel is the winner in the watts to kg contest. I wonder if you could easily deploy the panel on a spiderbeam. Thanks again, 73
Thanks for kindness.
I believe the Spiderbeam is too fragile, but I may be wrong.
Even here in Finland, it did fine on the ground. Sometimes I used cordage to angle it towards the sun.
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Julian oh8stn
@@OH8STN Agreed, the ground just works. Why complicate it. 👍
Excellent review. It is a very exciting advancement. 👍👍
I was left with 2 questions:
(1) What are your thoughts about durability in the field with potential rough handling of the monocrystalline vs. the amorphous cell products?
(2) The literature says " Not designed for use in the rain". Does this mean that it must be packed-up and kept dry in anticipation of a rain shower/rain storm?
Thank you.
Thank you Douglas, this is an excellent question. The crystalline panel is definitely more fragile than the amorphous. I also had concerns about its durability when the panel arrived. As I'll have redundant panels soon, I'll be more willing to risk losing one to testing. All I can say for now is I've been hiking with it, carrying it in a soft pannier on my bike, and throwing it down on the ground with little care. It's been quite okay since. We really won't know more until it's been around the block a few times.
As for the IP rating or resistance to rain, I'll need to reach out to Power film and ask them their opinion. I've had this panel in rain, but I've always tried it off afterwards. This definitely isn't one I would leave out in the rain. Anyway, let's see what PF says.
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Julian oh8stn
I was kind of wondering the same. Additionally I was wondering about the possible durability of the powerfilm against its heavier competitors mentioned.
@@OH8STN Maybe DIY customization may solve the question of reliability? I mean ask some company to cover it with some flexible transparent material, as army does with its foldable panels/ The only question is what about temperature hops...
Always love your videos !! I have learned quite a bit from them! However Someone else also asked the question how do you use a 160W 28V solar panel to charge a 14v Lithium or a 12V non Lithium battery ??? Which Charge controller do you use to ensure proper voltages to the batteries so chargers and/or batteries don't get damaged! It would be great to see a video on how you set this up. Thanks. KJ6VCM
That’s what I was wondering as well
1000+ for a panel? Wow
How has the crystalline panel been working out? Very much look forward to a long term review! Thanks for these videos! Contingency power is a shortcoming of mine and looking to change that!
The crystalline panel is magnificent. This is usually the one stored permanently on my e-bike, for field charging. I've also recently started using it with my eco flow river. That's worked out really well. I've got a video coming out in a couple of weeks on the eco flow river and the crystalline panel.
Thanks for commenting and watching. Much appreciated.
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Julian oh8stn
@@OH8STN Perfect! Look forward to it! Semper Fidelis Julien! - Mike/K2FAM
Very informative video, thank you! I just have a question, have you tested exactly what wattage you get out from the panel? I've seen many panels that have stated i.e. 160W but in real life it can only provide around 100W.
I have and PowerFilm panels are dpot on. If the panel doesn't meet PowerFilms ruslity specifications, it goes in the dumpster. 👍
Do you have a video on choosing the proper solar charge controller for solar panel & battery type?
No I don't yet but I did answer your comment a couple of minutes ago and explained how it works.
Great demo. I need to just buck up and get one and be done with it. When it comes to preparedness, to whatever angle you want to apply that to, if your primary consideration is cost then you’re probably about to make a poor decision. It’s unfortunate that this gear is so expensive, but what other reliable option does a guy have?
If we don't want to end up leaving it behind if we end up on foot, there really are no other options. Next week I'll prepare a blog post comparing the pros and cons of the amorphous versus this crystalline. That'll help us choose the right panel. Thanks for the comment and watching. Greatly appreciated.
Is this still flexible like previous PF blankets? Or rigid like the OGT? I would love to see a video comparing the two together. Ive been on the fence between PF and OGT for the last year but always hated how large PF was compared to the OGT for the same wattage as well as the less waterproof nature of their canvas. This is a fantastic looking update from them.
Thanks for commenting.
It's rigid like the OGT, but a fraction of OGT weight.
So what is the trade-off relative to the amorphous panels? Are they as flexible? Can they still generate near full power with several bullet holes in it like the amorphous panels? How sensitive are they to angle to the sun or when partially shaded? We all know there is no free lunch with portable power…
I'm already working on that video :-) Crystalline panels definitely don't like bullet holes. Moreover, they are rigid, not flexing at all. I wouldn't deploy these in a hostile environment. This is where amorphous panels are king. The amount of sheer abuse the amorphous panels can take is simply unimaginable. So that's the trade-off. We get more power, but we lose flexibility, bullet resistance, and add a bit of weight. Excellent question!
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Julian oh8stn
I too am curious about shade tolerance. I've got the Powerfilm 120W and that's one of my favorite features; so many of those tiny cells are run in parallel so a branch shading part of the panel has very little effect. My monosilicon panels drop in half with hardly any shading at all.
Someone did an energy test over time of the F16-7200 vs a 100W Goal Zero positioned in front of a soccer post that swept both panels throughout the day, and the Powerfilm absolutely crushed it. Would love to see a similar test with this new 160W panel. :)
I can confirm this. The amorphous panels are definitely Superior in regards to shading.
@@OH8STN I figured as much. Still an incredibly lightweight package for 160W!
I am still not sure how to correctly select the proper type of solar charge controller for the type of battery (voltage/ amperage/ solar cell/panel) being used. Do you have a video out ?
Absolutely love your content. You mention deployment in less than ideal conditions (not much sun) and this still charged your battery. How would you compare this to their flexible panels in cloudy conditions? (I understand the flexible ones are better at partial shade).
Yes the flexible amorphous panels are definitely better in the shade. There are just so many parallel connections, that you really can't shut them down with partial shading. I believe the crystalline panel performed well in the shade because of it's greater efficiency in higher voltage. I'm going to reach out to PowerFilm and ask them how these are wired and what expectations we can have with shading in mind. Perhaps I can even do a comparison video between crystalline and amorphous
Hello Julian! Thank you so much for your videos, they are very helpful, especially for complete newbies like me! I have one question. The panel is 28.3V, so you probably need to use GVB-8-Li-28.4V-WP Genasun, right? You just cannot use 14.2V one with this panel... And if we use 28.4V controller, we need adequate battery. So it cannot be 12V one, correct? And if we have not a 12V battery, we need some special power distribution with a transformer to make our radio power input happy... So, I am confused... It seems like I don't understand something basic here! I wouuld really appreciate if you could shed some light on my confusion! 73! de KC3UTT
Excellent question, let's clear up the confusion. We still use the 14.2 volt charge controller, for example the GV10L for 14.x LFP. The charge controller would do all the conversions, bringing down the voltage to something the battery likes. If you look at your charge controller specs, it has a maximum voltage. In many cases that's 28, 30, or even 60 volts. The job of the charge controller is to convert that into 14.2 to 14.4 volts for the battery. If we were using the victron charge controller, the maximum voltage for the 7515 is 75 volts. The charge controller drops that down to 14.x Volts for battery charging.
The confusion is we're not connecting a higher voltage panel to a lower voltage battery. We're connecting a higher voltage panel to a charge controller, which manages the current and voltage available to it, to charge a lower voltage battery. The charge controller is to bridge. Does this make sense?
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Julian oh8stn
@@OH8STN Thank you for the response! It does make sense now! So, for GV-10 14V LI the max panel voltage is 34V, according to the specs on gigaparts. And for GVB-8 14V LI it is 0 - 60V... (which is a little confusing). And another thing is power - for GV10 max recommended is 140W, for GVB-8 only 105W. But PF 160W (F3-48F28.3VKHAS) produces 28.3V x 5.7A = 161.31W. Is it still Ok to use either GV10 or GVB8 controllers with this panel? Thank you and 73!
I believe the GV10 will be fine. We rarely get 100% potential from solar, especially at higher latitudes. The GV8B might be overwhelmed. I have to do more testing before I can share an opinion.
@@OH8STN Thank you! This info really helps! Looking forward to watch your new videos - they are amazing! I am still undecided whether to go with this monocrystalline 160W or with 120W amorphous panel. GVB booster controller looks more attractive, though my location is at a "little" lower latitude (FM29GU) 🙂 Thank you again! 73 de KC3UTT
You are very welcome. Perhaps putting all of these questions from the video into a blog post would be a good idea. I'll start working on that at the start of the week.
Most of power cells (solar generators0 have a max input of 29v. Also, you plug the charge controller directly into the ebike battery, how exactly did you connect the charger to the battery?Thanks
Here is a Blog post I did explaining how it all works oh8stn.org/blog/2022/02/08/ebike-solar-charging-how-to/
Cool i love my fatbike
Like a jeep of bikes👍
@@OH8STN yeah fatbike can go anywhere any season had one for 12 years now still going strong
Julian, how does this crystalline pannel handle shading? My crystalline panels can loose 50% of their output with a small amount of shading.
They are no where near the awesomeness of the amorphous during shading. Still, wan't as bad I I thought it would be. I have sent this question to PF to understand why it isn't worse. Waiting for feedback.
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Julian oh8stn
I wonder how long it takes to charge the fatbike … i thought about getting a e-bike or converting mine i fatbike into e-bike .. but the charging i thought would take all day …
Here's several relevant posts.
oh8stn.org/blog/2022/06/17/fat-bike-portable-ops/
oh8stn.org/blog/2022/02/08/ebike-solar-charging-how-to/
blog.powerfilmsolar.com/how-to-solar-charge-your-ebike-with-lightweight-and-portable-solar-panels
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Julian oh8stn
Would this solad panel be compatible to charge an eb70s from bluetti
Definitely You just need the right connector.👍 I'm using this one with the Ecoflow River 2 Max, and it works perfectly.
Wow, the technology is moving along, but still pricy. That panel costs almost as much as your radio. My dual 100W folding Semi-rigid panels were only a few hundred dollars by comparison but obviously nowhere near as compact and portable. I'm holding out hope the technology will come down in price eventually.
Yes unfortunately the lighter weight and more portable panel, the higher the price. I don't like it, but it is the way it is for now.
Since you camp on the water, so much. Have you ever tried filling up clear ziplock bags, and laying them over the solar panels? Since a clear, water bag acts like magnifying glass. I wonder if it would give the solar panels a boost of power?
The infamous fresnel lens trick. Not yet.
Here's the thing. At this latitude, there is an abundance of sun for half a year, enough sun for 3 months, and very little sun for three months. The time where such a hack would be useful is during that 3 months of very little sun. During that time, all the water is ice. During the other 8-9 months, there is enough sun to power an effecient station or solar generator. At a lower latitude, it would be find to try.
Perhaps this year I'll get around to building an alcohol burning small generator.
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Julian oh8stn
what you think is the efficiency of these most monocrystalline foldables claim 23%. Is this the same or worst. And also I see in most of your video footage you have this flat , isn't efficiency much better if you have it an angle?
Efficiency is much better if you have them angle towards the sun. I prefer using a bigger panel rather than messing around with trying to aim it correctly at the sun during summer months in Scandinavia. During autumn and winter, Naturally I'll aim them directly at the sun. The efficiency is exactly as claimed in the documentation. You'll find a spec-sheet on the powerfilm website.
I have a 2m radio that has 75 watts of power... what is a reasonable solar panel to get to run that. Especially if I cranked it up to use 75 watts? Obviously 75 watts plus a fee for the radio.
Yeasu vc 8000
There's two aspects we need to look at, not just the output power. There's the output power, and the current consumption of the radio on receive. When we know these two things, we can come up with a battery capacity to supply the radio. The solar panel should be at least 2.5x more than the current consumption on receive. This is because when your radio isn't transmitting, the solar panel is recharging the battery. We need to ensure the solar panel is able to recharge the battery faster than the radio can consume the battery while listening. Does this make sense?
Do you need two genasun controllers for this solar panel or is one enough?
More context please.
1 charge controller per solar panel. I use a single Genasun GV10L with this panel when charging my LiFePO4 batteries. Also 1 boost charge controller for charging the ebike
@@OH8STN Starlink just came out with the mini or like you would say the man portable satellite, so I'm trying to figure out what I would need as far as solar/ charge controller and batteries, to keep me topped off, I'm also considering an ebike and being able to charge on the go. Not sure if you did a set up video or blog post on the boost controller.
@@vaughnburrows Cool! I am currently putting together a Starlink Mini portable station and have chosen this Powerfilm 160W panel and the Genasun GV10L controller based on Julian's reviews.
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KI7OOZ
Hi, I want to run winlink, but I notice you use a tablet.. is it Microsoft windows system you run? What brand do you use?
ruclips.net/video/r22xilag_9A/видео.html
oh8stn.org/blog/2021/10/10/microsoft-surface-go-2-faq-ham-radio-laptop/
ruclips.net/video/xIrd2l8t4l8/видео.html
Tnx fast reply, ok.. I have to educate me with your videos. I plan to get a laptop, but it seems a better idea to get the Microsoft Surface Go 2 … correct me if I am wrong. de sm4…
I would completely agree with you. There is a Microsoft Surface Go 3 now by the way. There's also a LTE version if you want to use an internal GPS. I took the basic version because my ic705 already has the GPS built in. Thanks for the question and kindness.
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Julian oh8stn
What is the make and model of your bike
Thank
It is a GZR Raw 2019 model. You can read more about it on my blog.
oh8stn.net/FatBike
The question I have is how the power output is on the panels in poor light and especially when they are on the ground (guessing that they do not give 160W/h but significantly less as the sun is not so high now and will be worse in 2 months)
and was the charger of your bike boost or back/boost?
No solar panel gives full specified wattage during overcast or low sun. It does what it says it will do.
The charge controller is a Genasun GVBoost MPPT for 13S 48 volt lithium ion.