Unfortunately every manufacturer can have these issues. With these trucks getting more and more complex and powerful its bound to happen. What really matters is how the dealer takes care of it.
Sadly its not up to the dealer, its up to FCA. Sure the dealer can fix it but FCA pays the bill not the dealer. But there is manufacture warranty for a reason.
Don't know why he would call you. Oh I know click bait so you can get more views. It sounds like a bad injector and if that is so, they need to replace all the injectors because the others will fail down the road too. It's under warranty and FCA will fix it. Once the dealer diagnoses the issue I see them replacing the engine. I wouldn't continue to drive it and then posting it on youtube. Maybe FCA will make you partcially responsible for causing further damage to the engine. The dealer will do whatever FCA tells them to do. You will be dealing with them. The dealer is the middle guy. AND all these shade tree mechanics putting after market parts on these very complex vehicles makes it worse. They were not designed for these parts ever. Also buy DEF fluid like you buy milk. Thats what my dealer told me. Buy it when you need it not when it's on sale. I bought a bumper to bumper warranty when I bought my 2017 Ram 3500 single wheel Big Horn because their are 14 computers in the vehicle controling everything from the A/C to the air bags and to emission system. You need a warranty.
Funny I am a certified diesel tech. He called me because we are friends and he wanted to share the bad news I thought it might be worth filming so there you go. Literally no click bait.
@@VBELTandSON Sorry I'm entitled to my opinion. I live in NE Az and knew the 3 dealers I had access too used mechanics who were unqualified to work on my truck when I first bought it. I went to a dealer 43 miles away and they told me they had 1 qualified tech to change my oil and fuel filters on my truck. My first clue when I was there, that they were using an unqualified person was when they asked me what kind of oil was used on this engine. I use Shell Rotella T5 because it produces less soot. I then learned that the 1 qualified poson at the dealer was at school that week. Why did you schedule me when he wasn't there? After that I go to the only dealer I can use up here located 77 miles one way away from my house. At the time they only had 2 techs qualified to service my truck. Now 4 years later they have numerous. They know what I want and they won't use anyone not qualified. There is a difference between being certified and qualified to work on a perticular engine and it's being very difficult to find qualified techs now days. I'm not downing anything you do on your channel. I am a subscriber and wouldn't be if I didn't like what you do on here. I paid about 67,000 dollars for my truck and I'm damn serious about who works on it. I want and do document every service for the warranty I paid 2500.00 dollars for. I have never needed it but 43,000 miles now on it and you never know. Hope things work out for your friend on his truck but it's out of the dealers hands. Take care Sam.
@@VBELTandSON Great video Sir !! You don't have to explain your self to nobody about anything !!! This is your channel and you do what you want with it !!! If the snowflakes can't handle it so be it I stand with you !!! Back to the topic at hand !!! under 500 miles sure is a shocker !!!
Wake up. Any, and I mean any vehicle, piece of equipment, aircraft, tool made by any manufacture can fail at some point. Don't go all hot and bothered about it by calling it ridiculous. You Sir obviously have not been in any kind of maintenance business on anything. It a wonder the keyboard you typed on has not broken down yet.
@@johnirwin1837 I don’t know who you directed your statement at ,but me and Mike do all our maintenance on our Ram diesels. I agree with Mike , it is ridiculous for a brand new truck to fail so quickly. Also their are many other 2019s and 20s with the same cp4 failure. So it’s RIDICULOUS. LOL Plus I work maintenance for 29 years in paper mills as a matter of fact I’m going to work shortly. So you have a happy new year. Lol
@@LoneWolf-cf5tp , how about 20 years of doing maintenance on multi million dollar aircraft from very large to 2 engine small ones. I have even had personal laptop computers fail me. How about 21 plus years in the electrical installation and maintenance field with new and older equipment. Yip junior I fell off the tree yesterday. I have had both Ford and Chevy trucks litterly quite running right under me. Have a nice chat on your computer.
Any updates on what the problem is? Do you know what the build date was on his truck? From what I’m reading on forums the newer trucks(build date of 8/9 to now of 2020) have the newest pump, which is yet to be determined if it’s any better than the older version of the CP4 that’s on the older builds. Just curious if it’s the latest version. I just bought a 2020 3500 with a build date of 10/2020. Keeping my fingers crossed that this pump is better!! Just FYI to new buyers, Mopar is offering a money back extended warranty now. If you don’t file a claim against it, they refund you the full amount at the expiration. BUY IT!!!! For $30-$40 a month, its the best insurance policy you can have against these types of mechanical failures.
I will stick with my 2003 for life. 17.5 years years old, special ordered it the way we wanted it, 252,000 miles later and only have replaced the water pump on the engine. This truck has been great. Plus it has a 6 speed mans mission.
ordered my 2000 Quad cab 4X4 6spd in Fall 1999, 21 years old 340K miles. still on original Clutch. Love it. will hopefully order a 2022 next year. but will never sell my 2000
@@superduty3632 it’s a known issue. (If it CP4) you spend $$$ you expect quality. (Even in a Dodge, at least the engine). The first time a vehicle fails like this. You lose faith in it.
I've got a June 2020 Ram 3500 Limited. I have been putting additive In the fuel (power service and lucas) Also, using premium desiel for the first 6000 miles. No issues. I do let it warm up for 20 minutes during the cold. I never let the tank get less then 1/4 (~50Gal. Tank). The warming is critical. It needs to be 187° +/- a few degrees to move at all. Even if it is 120° the truck will sound strange if I move it. A good rule of thumb is to not allow the pressure get above 50psi while warming up. For example I drove with the truck at 70°F the pressure jumped to 55psi. I pulled over and let warm up. I could see how it could get damaged if the truck wasn't warmed up and you mashed the pedal. Currently towing a gooseneck with a small load. Night and day difference from the 2010 Ram I had. But this 11'6" wide load @ 8,600lbs I am getting about 5.2mpg. I hope heading back to Minnesota with a 7,200lbs tractor will yield me much better fuel economy. Needless to say I am looking a titan auxiliary fuel tank.
My wife and I just bought new ram Laramie Longhorn fully loaded last week. Basically we buy a new one Cummings diesel 3500 every year and put them in our fleet. We have seven and the oldest is a 2015. Before buying our new 2020 we asked our dealer about this issue. His reply was he sold over a Thousnd of these and four had cp4 failures. They all failed before 12000 miles and Chrysler stood behind them all. We have no complaints with our ram trucks and Ford also is using the cp4 pump and has had issues.
That is bad. I hear people saying the powerstrokes have the same issue but I have had had a 17 with 293000 miles no issues and now have a 2020 with no issues. I seem like ram is having this problem more consistently than ford or gm. I wonder if the Cummins has to run a higher fuel rail pressure and that may be causing this to happen more frequently?
I think you made the right call with Taylor’s car. I’ve been looking into a new car for my wife and I’m thinking Honda Pilot. She’s thinking xc90. But we looked at Fca and I don’t trust them anymore. Both my neighbors and my sister in law had fca vehicles take a crap on them. Jeep Grand Cherokee didn’t make it home from the dealer and the engine blew up and jeep replaced the engine on something with 127 miles. My sister in law had a renegade and the cat went out twice right outside of 36k warranty and it’s was drinking oil. My other neighbor had a ram 1500 ecodiesel, that he eventually got a buy back on. Long story short I don’t think they make them like they used too.
The Cherokee probably wasn't broken in and they were running it too hard. The renegade has a fiat engine. The ecodiesel is also a fiat engine. Fiat isn't exactly known for making good engines. This isn't fca's fault. They don't make the 6.7 cummins.
It sounds just like my buddies Cummins. I tore into and found cam lobe completely broken off as well as the rocker arm was broken. Good luck and sorry you went through this. Please inform us what it was please. God Bless you all
I really dont like how they made the newer diesels quite, I love the sound of a cummins goin down the road, and plus you can hear if anything is goin hay wire alot better to! I guess I'm just a sucker for diesels and everything about em!! I just wish they wouldnt use that DEF system, just more things to worry about!!!
I hate it for your buddy. My 2020 Laramie 2500 grenaded at 10k miles. It was going to be such a long wait for it to be repaired I went ahead and traded it for a 21. Glad to be back with a CP3.
Please stay with this one for sure. Want to know the outcome. Our friends are general engineering contractors and they tow heavy with the newer trucks, it is amazing what they will do. I will sticking with my 07 3500 5.9 4x4 CC DRW for the foreseeable future. The 6 speed is a wonderful thing, and she is about to break 55k, so it'll last a bit longer, LOL. I love the power the new trucks put out the the creature comforts are off the hook, but problems like these scare the heck outta me. I can find a decent 50 state tune to run at some point. Tell your Dad JG said hi, he has been my wood guy for 15 years or more, will have to rent a box trailer to come back and pick it up once we get moved over the hill, hopefully in 2021.
Hopefully the dealership helps him out with it. I know a Lot of Dodge guys with the new 19+ trucks are having serious problems with their CP4 pumps and most of them are all on back order due to Dodge not having enough of them on hand to battle the constant problems people are having with them.
The cp4 is super picky about fuel. I don't know that it exists for anything other than ford, but Snyder Performance Engineering makes a cp4 disaster prevention kit for the Ford that separates the fuelbused to lube the pump and the fuel that gets injected into the motor, as well as a heavy duty screen on the return to catch the metal WHEN the pump fails. That being said, my work F750 has a cp4 and it's been running great for 40k miles and countless hours idling for PTO usage.
How would a cp4 failure result in a single cylinder misfiring? When the cp4 goes the truck isn't going to run at all. It's It's catastrophic failure nearly every time. Been there done that. 74k on my first cp4 and 65k on the second so far.
Hard to tell by the sound at the exhaust, but it sounds like it dropped a cross head/valve bridge on cylinder 6. They will have low power, shake and you can noticeably hear the difference. Especially being as it’s throwing the code for only cylinder 6 misfire, my guess would be a cross head came off, whether it be a damaged rocker arm, bent push tube or just a loose adjusting screw on the rocker arm but that’s my guess
My uncle has a 19’ 3500 mega cab dually also with the HO. Hopefully his won’t have an issue like this. Thus far he only had to replace a battery and did some maintenance while it was in for a new battery. Think it was like $800 for all of it. Overall he does love it but we do miss his 06 2500 mega cab with the 5.9. It was in good condition given its mileage
I had the extended warranty on mine and the CP4 failed, the dealer insisted it was from fuel contamination which is specifically not covered by the warranty. I filed a claim with the gas station which was also denied. $9800 out of pocket repair.
Fight it. Not knowing facts, your state.... it MIGHT be a case where you can also recover legal fees. Find a lawyer that deals with this. Most will do free initial consult.
Being a child and acting out gets nothing accomplished. Id get an initial F$&K YOU POS yelled out but not worth keeping blood pressure up. You might need better friends.
My 2017 had a fuel system module that I asked the dealer about at 4 days before my warranty went out . I did have then fix it and they did cover it since I talked to them about it before my warrenty went out
On the DEF do NOT buy and re fuel until after you’ve nearly used 1/2 tank. I filled mine at 1/4 just to see how much it took and easily over fueled it and the truck threatened to go into limp mode after 30 miles. Dealer said I over filled it and drained some,...took driving nearly 200 miles before it resolved itself. Geez I miss my old 3rd gen 5.9!!
My '18 Ram is in the shop for transfer case issue. They gave me a jeep renegade (junk) loaner. Did you guys check the oil and see if there was any metal?
That really is a nice truck. I’ve recently come into the need for a dually and have been mulling it over. Not ready to trade my ‘18 Laramie 3500 single in just yet though and I’ll admit that the fuel pump is one reason. That and the possible larger cab and different trans. Even that color and interior.
Important to remember that this same thing could have happened to you or me as well. Just because it’s a 2020 doesn’t mean more chance of failure than an older truck.
I was talking to a Dodge Tech about the problems they are having with the New motors! He siad the last one was a complete new motor repalcment as the pump crashed and sent metal thru the injectors, 6 injectors = $12,000, plus new pump $6,000, not including labor.
The cp4s have a big malfunction. That have been falling apart in the casing and sending metal dust through the engines causing major failure if driven long enough. I've worked on fee trucks where the pump failed and the drivers didn't drive much after that and I was able to clean the entire fueling system and of course new injectors fuel rail and lines and all that good stuff and put in a new cp4 pump and they've been doing better
Bummers. Been kinda waiting for these videos to start showing up😬. Glad i bought an 18. Cp3's have done well. Best of luck to your buddy. Hopefully it gets taken care of quick. I'd buy a 2018 or older if I need another truck. 2003 3500 srw 263k has never taken an unplanned day off in its life.
If I bought any truck with a cp4 I would do a cp3 conversion from S&S diesel. Warranty or not. It’s cheaper than replacing and cleaning the whole fuel system from injectors to tank..
I did just that with my 2016 Chevy. Went from 0-60 slower than a 4 cylinder Honda Accord and only got 6 mpg driving on the freeway. Now very much faster and 20mpg below 85mph. I deleted while still in factory warranty. The dealer had a truck like mine in for pump, total fuel system and cam replacement from a failed CP4. The cost to repair a failedCP4 in a 6.6 is $22,000 at the dealer and $24,000 for a new engine with the same model pump. I still put fuel pump lubricant additive in for my CP3 pump, can’t be too careful at these prices.
@@DWBurns no kidding man, I have a 2005 LLY and it has been a great truck but with its own set of issues. I am looking at 4500 series rig either ram or Duramax for a new work truck. It won’t be a year with the cp4 pump though. That’s insane dealer cost for repairs man..
My buddy bought a 2020 2500 it lasted 877 miles, water pump failure, dealer had it for 2 months because it's a known issue, and dealer can't get part's because they're on back order. They actually had to take a part off of a brand new one sitting on the lot, to satisfy one of their customers... Gonna be seeing more on this issue.
Wow, I lost the #6 cylinder on my 97 and it sounded labored like that. That sucks, less then 500 miles. Glad it was only an injector. I have had new parts be bad. Just like that.
I’m dealing with the same thing. It’s not the CP4. It’s a lubricant issue. Mine needs a new cam, push rods, rockers and lifters. It should be a brand new engine due to metal being pushed throughout the engine. Trading it this week. My check engine light hasn’t illuminated yet.
For all you cp4 owners, lubricity additives dont really guarantee that the cp4 wont explode. The pump will last a bit longer but once there is a bit of internal movement it just takes the perfect storm for the pump to come apart... The best thing you can do is buy a powerstroke hehe
There's a recall for the cp4 pump now. The dealers are removing them and converting to a cp3. All of the new trucks are being delivered to the dealer lots with cp3 pumps from the factory as well from now on.
I can tell none of you work at a dealer. A TSB is a recall released before a manufacturer is mandated to do so by th NHTSA. So in other words ram realized there is an issue and they released a tsb to rectify the situation before it gets worse.
@@AdventureintheOzarks a TSB is a technical service bulletin. Every TSB does not equal a recall. Regarding this, there is one CP4 is asymmetrical lobes and one with symmetrical lobes that started going on in July 2020. The TSB instructs how to recognize which one is installed and gives instructions on how to calibrate. It says ZERO about replacing with a CP3.
That absolutely sucks. I could hear the difference. Wasn't pretty. Praying it's something simple. Could be cause how much I love Ram and Dodge, but it wouldn't keep me from buying one if I could.
I have 26k miles on 2019 ram HO aisin no issues yet but been adding additives to almost every fill up. If cp4 does grenade and they dont cover warranty im doing cp4 to cp3 conversion kit i think its cheaper upfront and long run.
The last price I saw for a complete fuel system replacement, CP-4 pump, injectors, all of the fuel lines, was over $8,000. Besides reverting back to a CP-3 pump in non smog states, until California gets the emissions certification tests bought off, there is no easy solution. The best advise is never run the truck low on fuel, and have a lift pump with filter installed. Both Ford and Chevrolet/GMC with the Duramax are having identical problems with the Bosch pumps. This might make the Takata airbag recall look like a speed bump on the highway of life.
a buddy of mine said a friend of his has a 2020 ram 2500 diesel and had the same thing happen to his but after a day, it went back to normal and wound up driving it to South Carolina from New York with no issues.
@@stkcattleandhay ,I'm guessing you've tried putting it in neutral,etc?Crawl underneath and check for any binding in the linkage that's if it's a manual tcase or pull the relay or fuse and reset the system for the tcase motor if it has one.
i had a 6.4 hemi, it shit itself at 22000 miles, the 6.4 isnt no wonderful motor either, mopar and gas v8's are a bad day, ill keep my 6.7 cummins thou
@@braaapattack2937 most of our fleet truck are 6.4 hemis. Zero issues with 100s of thousands of miles on them . My personal truck is a 2020 6.4 with the 8 speed . I can pull anything I need with no diesel meltdown issues .
Wow! My engine went out at 33,000 miles. Warranty and Ram engineering is back and forth. Beginning to sense I need a lawyer. I’m definitely not feeling very good at this point about my 3500. I understand things break. I’m mostly disappointed about the lack of customer service I’m getting after the failure.
Def keep us in the loop bud. The only things I had go in my 2018 was a exhaust sensor at 30,000 miles and my clutch at 50k but the clutch was expected. Got a southbend dual disc in there now 😎👍 A person does have to be careful buying the first year of any gen of pickup. Mines a 2018 so all the bugs were worked out for the most part.
I had ordered a new (2017)Ford... went 756 miles and the engine just ate itself. Was a pain in the backside, but Ford made it right. Cummins is a solid engine builder and should make it right.
Aren't you ASE certified? Or just RUclips certified? With the Magnussen Moss Act. Your trade school experience. The experience of maintaining and trading your fleet of pickups. And video proof of success The only thing missing is a Scan Tool print out. Don't you have one of the bi-directional scan tools? I received a Launch X431 V 4.0, last week. Interesting device. As I was poking through the features over the weekend. I tested it on our '18 Ram 2500 6.7L. Our '16 Ram 1500 3L. 2020 Dodge Durango GT. And our old '03 Ford Explorer 4L. Your friends Ram 3500 may require the "Heavy Duty Truck" box to interface between the scan tool and the OBD2 port. The dealer seems to treat me nicer when I step up to the service writer with a diagnostic print out. Since the service writer only has a lower level code scanner. The service writer goes out to the shop to talk to the service techs. Before they write the service order. But as you suggest about a wiring fault. That takes old fashioned elbow gease and tenacity to find many times. Hopefully it is a loose or not fully pressed in connector. Rather than bad parts.
Only the early 6.7l Fords had minor problem besides the emissions. Later one are good and the newest one is even stronger and looks more promising but only time will tell. And it has steal pistons on 2020. U might want one to dump ram sorry.
CP4 failure would’ve gotten all cylinders, not just one. Not saying it’s not an issue, but it’s more likely an injector related issues rather than the HPFP. If it’s in it’s early stages of failure which generally happen very rapidly, then maybe it’s possible it’s only gotten one cylinder. Pretty much all of these failures have been super quick and takes out everything. It’s catastrophic and fast. This sorta goes against the normal grain here. But again, could be early in the failure mode.
Part of this issue is the war on workers. These large manufacturers source parts from the cheapest countries and try to hire the cheapest people to assemble them. They feel that if they simplify the process enough like one guy only tightens a few bolts on the whole truck any dummy can do it. But if that guy isn't mechanically inclined he doesn't know if the part he just installed is good/defective/or damaged. He just puts it together and moves it down the line. Its a shame but can happen to any brand. All these large corporations care about is profit, and quality comes second. Sorry Rant over
damn that sucks but it doesn't matter how good something is every now and then there's a bad egg. knowing Cummins well the Australian end of Cummins if its a bad egg they will fix / replace it.
This is why I got rid of my 2019 and got a 2020 L5P Duramax with the Denso HP4. Cummins was stupid to puta flawed injection pump ruining their reputation.
I here all the nightmares about people messing up and putting gas in these things. When I was younger we would pull up to a pump throw 3-5 gallons of gas in a 95-100 gallon diesel tank and ride. You could always tell wh didn’t in the morning because at -20-30 they were on the side of the road. Those old 237 Mack’s,350 cats,and 8v Detroit’s would really throw the fire from the stacks.
My brother bought a brand new 2020 power stroke drive it home from the dealer and it’s been on the hook 3 times in 3 days. It’s been at the dealer for 4 weeks and they don’t wanna just replace it after they can’t figure out the issue but have a truck there they want him to trade in for that he doesn’t want but they say his truck is now used so they will give him $5500 less for it in trade. He put 120 miles on it needless to say he is pissed and has been using my Cummins since he hauls a trailer everyday and the loaner they gave him was a v6 f150
I bought a lemon once. Drove the ford off the lot and the transmission went out in front of the dealership. The fixed it and after the 3rd time I sold it.
My buddy's had a similar issue, its on its 2nd trans now and the eco boost is having all kinds of issues, they've pulled the cab twice now. it's a permanent fixture at the dealership and he just keeps taking it back, idk why.. whatever
You got a lemon truck my dad took his 2020 ram when he first got it put 2000 miles on it and then drove it 4000 miles round-trip toes just fine drives just fine I really think you got a lemon truck something wasn’t right when you got it
Sometimes you have 14 days to return the truck. It’s in fine print. Think you can’t go over like 1200 miles. I’d have them take it back and wait on 21’s.
Unfortunately every manufacturer can have these issues. With these trucks getting more and more complex and powerful its bound to happen. What really matters is how the dealer takes care of it.
Sadly its not up to the dealer, its up to FCA. Sure the dealer can fix it but FCA pays the bill not the dealer. But there is manufacture warranty for a reason.
Don't know why he would call you. Oh I know click bait so you can get more views. It sounds like a bad injector and if that is so, they need to replace all the injectors because the others will fail down the road too. It's under warranty and FCA will fix it. Once the dealer diagnoses the issue I see them replacing the engine. I wouldn't continue to drive it and then posting it on youtube. Maybe FCA will make you partcially responsible for causing further damage to the engine. The dealer will do whatever FCA tells them to do. You will be dealing with them. The dealer is the middle guy. AND all these shade tree mechanics putting after market parts on these very complex vehicles makes it worse. They were not designed for these parts ever. Also buy DEF fluid like you buy milk. Thats what my dealer told me. Buy it when you need it not when it's on sale. I bought a bumper to bumper warranty when I bought my 2017 Ram 3500 single wheel Big Horn because their are 14 computers in the vehicle controling everything from the A/C to the air bags and to emission system. You need a warranty.
Funny I am a certified diesel tech.
He called me because we are friends and he wanted to share the bad news I thought it might be worth filming so there you go. Literally no click bait.
@@VBELTandSON Sorry I'm entitled to my opinion. I live in NE Az and knew the 3 dealers I had access too used mechanics who were unqualified to work on my truck when I first bought it. I went to a dealer 43 miles away and they told me they had 1 qualified tech to change my oil and fuel filters on my truck. My first clue when I was there, that they were using an unqualified person was when they asked me what kind of oil was used on this engine. I use Shell Rotella T5 because it produces less soot. I then learned that the 1 qualified poson at the dealer was at school that week. Why did you schedule me when he wasn't there? After that I go to the only dealer I can use up here located 77 miles one way away from my house. At the time they only had 2 techs qualified to service my truck. Now 4 years later they have numerous. They know what I want and they won't use anyone not qualified. There is a difference between being certified and qualified to work on a perticular engine and it's being very difficult to find qualified techs now days. I'm not downing anything you do on your channel. I am a subscriber and wouldn't be if I didn't like what you do on here. I paid about 67,000 dollars for my truck and I'm damn serious about who works on it. I want and do document every service for the warranty I paid 2500.00 dollars for. I have never needed it but 43,000 miles now on it and you never know. Hope things work out for your friend on his truck but it's out of the dealers hands. Take care Sam.
@@VBELTandSON Great video Sir !! You don't have to explain your self to nobody about anything !!! This is your channel and you do what you want with it !!! If the snowflakes can't handle it so be it I stand with you !!! Back to the topic at hand !!! under 500 miles sure is a shocker !!!
Holy shit ! A New truck already down That’s ridiculous 🙈 I keep driving my old ones 🤷🏻♂️
Yep , keep driving the old ones till they update the truck and a 10 speed. 👍🏻
Wake up. Any, and I mean any vehicle, piece of equipment, aircraft, tool made by any manufacture can fail at some point. Don't go all hot and bothered about it by calling it ridiculous. You Sir obviously have not been in any kind of maintenance business on anything. It a wonder the keyboard you typed on has not broken down yet.
@@LoneWolf-cf5tp yes ! It would be also cool if they offered manuals again 💪🏻
@@johnirwin1837 I don’t know who you directed your statement at ,but me and Mike do all our maintenance on our Ram diesels. I agree with Mike , it is ridiculous for a brand new truck to fail so quickly. Also their are many other 2019s and 20s with the same cp4 failure. So it’s RIDICULOUS. LOL Plus I work maintenance for 29 years in paper mills as a matter of fact I’m going to work shortly. So you have a happy new year. Lol
@@LoneWolf-cf5tp , how about 20 years of doing maintenance on multi million dollar aircraft from very large to 2 engine small ones. I have even had personal laptop computers fail me. How about 21 plus years in the electrical installation and maintenance field with new and older equipment. Yip junior I fell off the tree yesterday. I have had both Ford and Chevy trucks litterly quite running right under me. Have a nice chat on your computer.
Any updates on what the problem is? Do you know what the build date was on his truck? From what I’m reading on forums the newer trucks(build date of 8/9 to now of 2020) have the newest pump, which is yet to be determined if it’s any better than the older version of the CP4 that’s on the older builds. Just curious if it’s the latest version. I just bought a 2020 3500 with a build date of 10/2020. Keeping my fingers crossed that this pump is better!!
Just FYI to new buyers, Mopar is offering a money back extended warranty now. If you don’t file a claim against it, they refund you the full amount at the expiration. BUY IT!!!! For $30-$40 a month, its the best insurance policy you can have against these types of mechanical failures.
I will stick with my 2003 for life. 17.5 years years old, special ordered it the way we wanted it, 252,000 miles later and only have replaced the water pump on the engine. This truck has been great. Plus it has a 6 speed mans mission.
ordered my 2000 Quad cab 4X4 6spd in Fall 1999, 21 years old 340K miles. still on original Clutch. Love it. will hopefully order a 2022 next year. but will never sell my 2000
Man, I saw this magnificent beast in the notification thumbnail, read "2020 Ram Cummins..." 😍🥰 and then ...."engine _fail..."_ 🤯🤯😒😑 😂
What month and year was this truck made? Will be on sticker in door... Just curious if it has one of the updated cp4
He is taking it well. I would be a lot more upset. God bless
It will be covered under warranty so no reason to worry.
@@superduty3632 it’s a known issue. (If it CP4) you spend $$$ you expect quality. (Even in a Dodge, at least the engine). The first time a vehicle fails like this. You lose faith in it.
I've got a June 2020 Ram 3500 Limited. I have been putting additive In the fuel (power service and lucas) Also, using premium desiel for the first 6000 miles. No issues. I do let it warm up for 20 minutes during the cold. I never let the tank get less then 1/4 (~50Gal. Tank). The warming is critical. It needs to be 187° +/- a few degrees to move at all. Even if it is 120° the truck will sound strange if I move it. A good rule of thumb is to not allow the pressure get above 50psi while warming up. For example I drove with the truck at 70°F the pressure jumped to 55psi. I pulled over and let warm up. I could see how it could get damaged if the truck wasn't warmed up and you mashed the pedal.
Currently towing a gooseneck with a small load. Night and day difference from the 2010 Ram I had. But this 11'6" wide load @ 8,600lbs I am getting about 5.2mpg. I hope heading back to Minnesota with a 7,200lbs tractor will yield me much better fuel economy. Needless to say I am looking a titan auxiliary fuel tank.
That truck should be a dealer buy back, if it's doing that brand new, lord knows what else could be wrong with it. CP4's are having so many problems.
Cummins went back to the cp3 for 2021
No, a bad injector does not warrant a buyback.
Was bad injectors. Ram offered to buy this truck back lol
My wife and I just bought new ram Laramie Longhorn fully loaded last week. Basically we buy a new one Cummings diesel 3500 every year and put them in our fleet. We have seven and the oldest is a 2015. Before buying our new 2020 we asked our dealer about this issue. His reply was he sold over a Thousnd of these and four had cp4 failures. They all failed before 12000 miles and Chrysler stood behind them all. We have no complaints with our ram trucks and Ford also is using the cp4 pump and has had issues.
That is bad. I hear people saying the powerstrokes have the same issue but I have had had a 17 with 293000 miles no issues and now have a 2020 with no issues. I seem like ram is having this problem more consistently than ford or gm. I wonder if the Cummins has to run a higher fuel rail pressure and that may be causing this to happen more frequently?
I think you made the right call with Taylor’s car. I’ve been looking into a new car for my wife and I’m thinking Honda Pilot. She’s thinking xc90. But we looked at Fca and I don’t trust them anymore. Both my neighbors and my sister in law had fca vehicles take a crap on them. Jeep Grand Cherokee didn’t make it home from the dealer and the engine blew up and jeep replaced the engine on something with 127 miles. My sister in law had a renegade and the cat went out twice right outside of 36k warranty and it’s was drinking oil. My other neighbor had a ram 1500 ecodiesel, that he eventually got a buy back on. Long story short I don’t think they make them like they used too.
The Cherokee probably wasn't broken in and they were running it too hard. The renegade has a fiat engine. The ecodiesel is also a fiat engine. Fiat isn't exactly known for making good engines. This isn't fca's fault. They don't make the 6.7 cummins.
It sounds just like my buddies Cummins. I tore into and found cam lobe completely broken off as well as the rocker arm was broken. Good luck and sorry you went through this. Please inform us what it was please. God Bless you all
What year is your buddies truck?
Keep us posted! I recently bought a 2020 3500 HO as well and have a belt squeak. Apparently I’m not alone either with that.... 😠
Nope my brothers low output 2019 does the same mine doesn't tho 🤷♂️
I really dont like how they made the newer diesels quite, I love the sound of a cummins goin down the road, and plus you can hear if anything is goin hay wire alot better to! I guess I'm just a sucker for diesels and everything about em!! I just wish they wouldnt use that DEF system, just more things to worry about!!!
I got my 3500 back in June and drove it straight to Alaska it has 16,700 miles on it guess I got lucky with mine lol
I hate it for your buddy. My 2020 Laramie 2500 grenaded at 10k miles. It was going to be such a long wait for it to be repaired I went ahead and traded it for a 21. Glad to be back with a CP3.
I heard for '21 Ram said new injection pump, I think back to the cp3
Please stay with this one for sure. Want to know the outcome.
Our friends are general engineering contractors and they tow heavy with the newer trucks, it is amazing what they will do.
I will sticking with my 07 3500 5.9 4x4 CC DRW for the foreseeable future. The 6 speed is a wonderful thing, and she is about to break 55k, so it'll last a bit longer, LOL. I love the power the new trucks put out the the creature comforts are off the hook, but problems like these scare the heck outta me. I can find a decent 50 state tune to run at some point.
Tell your Dad JG said hi, he has been my wood guy for 15 years or more, will have to rent a box trailer to come back and pick it up once we get moved over the hill, hopefully in 2021.
Had the HPFP grenade on my 09 6.4PS. $10K later it was fixed. Bummer. Hope my new 2020 Ram 2500 doesn't do this.
Hopefully the dealership helps him out with it. I know a Lot of Dodge guys with the new 19+ trucks are having serious problems with their CP4 pumps and most of them are all on back order due to Dodge not having enough of them on hand to battle the constant problems people are having with them.
The cp4 is super picky about fuel. I don't know that it exists for anything other than ford, but Snyder Performance Engineering makes a cp4 disaster prevention kit for the Ford that separates the fuelbused to lube the pump and the fuel that gets injected into the motor, as well as a heavy duty screen on the return to catch the metal WHEN the pump fails. That being said, my work F750 has a cp4 and it's been running great for 40k miles and countless hours idling for PTO usage.
Did you take the cap off and check for blow by....? Or is that my grand dads 2nd gen?
I was on a tow truck day 3, with less than 500 miles. Ended up with a new egr on my 2018 2500. 80000+ miles later no other issues at all.
How would a cp4 failure result in a single cylinder misfiring?
When the cp4 goes the truck isn't going to run at all. It's It's catastrophic failure nearly every time.
Been there done that. 74k on my first cp4 and 65k on the second so far.
Every manufacturer try’s hard to get out of warranty repairs
First thing there going to do is send out a fuel sample to try to get out of warranting it....
Hard to tell by the sound at the exhaust, but it sounds like it dropped a cross head/valve bridge on cylinder 6. They will have low power, shake and you can noticeably hear the difference. Especially being as it’s throwing the code for only cylinder 6 misfire, my guess would be a cross head came off, whether it be a damaged rocker arm, bent push tube or just a loose adjusting screw on the rocker arm but that’s my guess
That sucks big time👎👎👎. Hopefully they take very good care of your buddy. Thanks for sharing Sam👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻🇺🇸
What’s the build date on that truck? I saw Paul at PD Diesel mentioned that a build date after August had a revised CP4.
I have a 2020, it has the updated pump Paul was talking about, it has a dimple in the pump at the fuel inlet fitting.
@@tylerwalden6912 out of curiosity what’s the build date on your truck?
Apparently cp3s are back on the 2021. Must of had enough failures.
I was just fixing to type this.
There might be a huge inventory of used 2019-20 rams on the market. Lol.
16000 miles on mine and yes cp3 is the replacement from warranty dont wait $$$$$
Damn that cylinder deactivation! LOL
My uncle has a 19’ 3500 mega cab dually also with the HO. Hopefully his won’t have an issue like this. Thus far he only had to replace a battery and did some maintenance while it was in for a new battery. Think it was like $800 for all of it. Overall he does love it but we do miss his 06 2500 mega cab with the 5.9. It was in good condition given its mileage
I had the extended warranty on mine and the CP4 failed, the dealer insisted it was from fuel contamination which is specifically not covered by the warranty. I filed a claim with the gas station which was also denied. $9800 out of pocket repair.
Send the fuel to a lab for analysis.
Fight it. Not knowing facts, your state.... it MIGHT be a case where you can also recover legal fees. Find a lawyer that deals with this. Most will do free initial consult.
@@larrythompson8630 Thats good advice,I know.
They always look for reasons to not honor the warranty.
Great video Sam. Please update us when you get a update.
I hear that RAM gonna releasing the 2021 models with CP3 with 1,075 ft lbs
I seen the article on it too they are not going to have CP4-2 in 2021. They should replace all the 2019-2020 models too that’s ridiculous.
@@wilmingtonperformancediese230 It has been confirmed that the 2021's have gone back to the CP3
@@wilmingtonperformancediese230 it’s confirmed a CP3
@@matthew6202 they did go to a CP3 for 2021, mine has it from factory!
@@wilmingtonperformancediese230 it is a cp3 for sure.
He sounds so calm. My buddy was outraged when his 2019 powerstroke windshield wipers quit at 60,000 miles.
What else is he going to do?
Being a child and acting out gets nothing accomplished. Id get an initial F$&K YOU POS yelled out but not worth keeping blood pressure up. You might need better friends.
My 2017 had a fuel system module that I asked the dealer about at 4 days before my warranty went out . I did have then fix it and they did cover it since I talked to them about it before my warrenty went out
On the DEF do NOT buy and re fuel until after you’ve nearly used 1/2 tank. I filled mine at 1/4 just to see how much it took and easily over fueled it and the truck threatened to go into limp mode after 30 miles. Dealer said I over filled it and drained some,...took driving nearly 200 miles before it resolved itself. Geez I miss my old 3rd gen 5.9!!
My '18 Ram is in the shop for transfer case issue. They gave me a jeep renegade (junk) loaner.
Did you guys check the oil and see if there was any metal?
Nope you saw all we did to it. It’s headed to the shop now
Did the warranty cover the repair ? I’m starting to worry about mine
Yes I made a video on what happened
Just out of curiosity do all of these trucks (your friends live in the same area and) use the same fuel station?
Idk where they fuel up. All with in 50 miles but 200’stations they could use
Keep us updated and Def definitely has shelf life but it seems like a deeper issue
That really is a nice truck. I’ve recently come into the need for a dually and have been mulling it over. Not ready to trade my ‘18 Laramie 3500 single in just yet though and I’ll admit that the fuel pump is one reason. That and the possible larger cab and different trans. Even that color and interior.
Important to remember that this same thing could have happened to you or me as well. Just because it’s a 2020 doesn’t mean more chance of failure than an older truck.
I was talking to a Dodge Tech about the problems they are having with the New motors! He siad the last one was a complete new motor repalcment as the pump crashed and sent metal thru the injectors, 6 injectors = $12,000, plus new pump $6,000, not including labor.
The cp4s have a big malfunction. That have been falling apart in the casing and sending metal dust through the engines causing major failure if driven long enough. I've worked on fee trucks where the pump failed and the drivers didn't drive much after that and I was able to clean the entire fueling system and of course new injectors fuel rail and lines and all that good stuff and put in a new cp4 pump and they've been doing better
Bummers. Been kinda waiting for these videos to start showing up😬. Glad i bought an 18. Cp3's have done well. Best of luck to your buddy. Hopefully it gets taken care of quick. I'd buy a 2018 or older if I need another truck. 2003 3500 srw 263k has never taken an unplanned day off in its life.
If I bought any truck with a cp4 I would do a cp3 conversion from S&S diesel. Warranty or not. It’s cheaper than replacing and cleaning the whole fuel system from injectors to tank..
I did just that with my 2016 Chevy. Went from 0-60 slower than a 4 cylinder Honda Accord and only got 6 mpg driving on the freeway. Now very much faster and 20mpg below 85mph. I deleted while still in factory warranty. The dealer had a truck like mine in for pump, total fuel system and cam replacement from a failed CP4. The cost to repair a failedCP4 in a 6.6 is $22,000 at the dealer and $24,000 for a new engine with the same model pump.
I still put fuel pump lubricant additive in for my CP3 pump, can’t be too careful at these prices.
@@DWBurns no kidding man, I have a 2005 LLY and it has been a great truck but with its own set of issues. I am looking at 4500 series rig either ram or Duramax for a new work truck. It won’t be a year with the cp4 pump though. That’s insane dealer cost for repairs man..
My buddy bought a 2020 2500 it lasted 877 miles, water pump failure, dealer had it for 2 months because it's a known issue, and dealer can't get part's because they're on back order. They actually had to take a part off of a brand new one sitting on the lot, to satisfy one of their customers... Gonna be seeing more on this issue.
Wow, I lost the #6 cylinder on my 97 and it sounded labored like that. That sucks, less then 500 miles. Glad it was only an injector. I have had new parts be bad. Just like that.
Kind glade I got the 6.4 now on the new dump truck
Did the automatic start stop working on this truck when the check engine light came on?
I have a 2019 Cummins. Just over 7800mi been running hot shot secret since first fill up. No issues yet thank GOD.
I’m dealing with the same thing. It’s not the CP4. It’s a lubricant issue. Mine needs a new cam, push rods, rockers and lifters. It should be a brand new engine due to metal being pushed throughout the engine.
Trading it this week. My check engine light hasn’t illuminated yet.
Put it on the back of the dimond c and haul it with the g56 98 12 valve dodge 😆 that'll hit some views
Definitley a bad deal there. Dealer should tow it and give him a rental. Can't believe they cheated him out of centercaps too.
Ram is going back away from the CP4.2 due to a crazy number of failures
For all you cp4 owners, lubricity additives dont really guarantee that the cp4 wont explode. The pump will last a bit longer but once there is a bit of internal movement it just takes the perfect storm for the pump to come apart... The best thing you can do is buy a powerstroke hehe
So what was wrong with his new truck?
There's a recall for the cp4 pump now. The dealers are removing them and converting to a cp3. All of the new trucks are being delivered to the dealer lots with cp3 pumps from the factory as well from now on.
The 2021 come within a revised cp3 pump but there is no recall out on this yet. I think a tsb is out but the are conditions that need to be met.
There is not a recall to replace with CP3. There are two versions of the CP4 and there is a TSB to calibrate.
I can tell none of you work at a dealer. A TSB is a recall released before a manufacturer is mandated to do so by th NHTSA. So in other words ram realized there is an issue and they released a tsb to rectify the situation before it gets worse.
@@AdventureintheOzarks a TSB is a technical service bulletin. Every TSB does not equal a recall. Regarding this, there is one CP4 is asymmetrical lobes and one with symmetrical lobes that started going on in July 2020. The TSB instructs how to recognize which one is installed and gives instructions on how to calibrate. It says ZERO about replacing with a CP3.
@@jmobs7524 ok boomer. I guess the truckload of 2021 trucks we got that all have CP3 pumps must of been imaginary.
That absolutely sucks. I could hear the difference. Wasn't pretty. Praying it's something simple. Could be cause how much I love Ram and Dodge, but it wouldn't keep me from buying one if I could.
Had a buddy down in Texas at a Ram dealer just recently tell me they've put several HO Engines in trucks with
I have 26k miles on 2019 ram HO aisin no issues yet but been adding additives to almost every fill up. If cp4 does grenade and they dont cover warranty im doing cp4 to cp3 conversion kit i think its cheaper upfront and long run.
That dealership should send a tow. If it blows up they'll try to blame you.
The last price I saw for a complete fuel system replacement, CP-4 pump, injectors, all of the fuel lines, was over $8,000.
Besides reverting back to a CP-3 pump in non smog states, until California gets the emissions certification tests bought off, there is no easy solution.
The best advise is never run the truck low on fuel, and have a lift pump with filter installed. Both Ford and Chevrolet/GMC with the Duramax are having identical problems with the Bosch pumps. This might make the Takata airbag recall look like a speed bump on the highway of life.
Is there 100% confirmation yet the 2021 has the cp3? Which seems to be the case by everything ive seen....
a buddy of mine said a friend of his has a 2020 ram 2500 diesel and had the same thing happen to his but after a day, it went back to normal and wound up driving it to South Carolina from New York with no issues.
There's really no excuse these days with how much these trucks cost now and a gas rig wouldn't be havin' those issues.
This is why I have a 6.4 hemi. But now my transfer case is stuck in 4lo from pulling a pickup out of the snow.
@@stkcattleandhay ,I'm guessing you've tried putting it in neutral,etc?Crawl underneath and check for any binding in the linkage that's if it's a manual tcase or pull the relay or fuse and reset the system for the tcase motor if it has one.
i had a 6.4 hemi, it shit itself at 22000 miles, the 6.4 isnt no wonderful motor either, mopar and gas v8's are a bad day, ill keep my 6.7 cummins thou
You think in 2020 mopar could figured out cams/lifters, and use the correct wrist pins... but that’s wishful thinking
@@braaapattack2937 most of our fleet truck are 6.4 hemis. Zero issues with 100s of thousands of miles on them . My personal truck is a 2020 6.4 with the 8 speed . I can pull anything I need with no diesel meltdown issues .
So now that it's been a week have they found out the problem? I'm sure everyone wants to know
Wow! My engine went out at 33,000 miles. Warranty and Ram engineering is back and forth. Beginning to sense I need a lawyer. I’m definitely not feeling very good at this point about my 3500. I understand things break. I’m mostly disappointed about the lack of customer service I’m getting after the failure.
If you think you need a lawyer, you already do.
Def keep us in the loop bud. The only things I had go in my 2018 was a exhaust sensor at 30,000 miles and my clutch at 50k but the clutch was expected. Got a southbend dual disc in there now 😎👍 A person does have to be careful buying the first year of any gen of pickup. Mines a 2018 so all the bugs were worked out for the most part.
I had ordered a new (2017)Ford... went 756 miles and the engine just ate itself. Was a pain in the backside, but Ford made it right. Cummins is a solid engine builder and should make it right.
Id b pissed.hope it get resolved and they should throw in rear hub caps.good luck garret
Please keep us posted on what is wrong with his truck
I've noticed 3 issues that seem to come up frequently with the 19 and up Rams. CP4 failures, lifter failures, and turbo failures.
Aren't you ASE certified? Or just RUclips certified? With the Magnussen Moss Act. Your trade school experience. The experience of maintaining and trading your fleet of pickups. And video proof of success
The only thing missing is a Scan Tool print out. Don't you have one of the bi-directional scan tools?
I received a Launch X431 V 4.0, last week. Interesting device. As I was poking through the features over the weekend. I tested it on our '18 Ram 2500 6.7L. Our '16 Ram 1500 3L. 2020 Dodge Durango GT. And our old '03 Ford Explorer 4L.
Your friends Ram 3500 may require the "Heavy Duty Truck" box to interface between the scan tool and the OBD2 port.
The dealer seems to treat me nicer when I step up to the service writer with a diagnostic print out. Since the service writer only has a lower level code scanner. The service writer goes out to the shop to talk to the service techs. Before they write the service order.
But as you suggest about a wiring fault. That takes old fashioned elbow gease and tenacity to find many times. Hopefully it is a loose or not fully pressed in connector. Rather than bad parts.
Lemon law, I’d make them give me a whole new truck, wash your hands of that one.
It not that easy
Lemon Law requires the same or related failures to occur repeatedly and or over 6-12 months and the manufacturer not be able to fix it.
My 2021 3500 4x4 lasted 684 miles before a fuel leak. They had it 3 months.
Sounds like bad fuel with water in it. Did he fill up at the Pilot?
We don’t have pilots around here so I’d say no
Whats the break in period
Only the early 6.7l Fords had minor problem besides the emissions. Later one are good and the newest one is even stronger and looks more promising but only time will tell. And it has steal pistons on 2020. U might want one to dump ram sorry.
CP4 failure would’ve gotten all cylinders, not just one. Not saying it’s not an issue, but it’s more likely an injector related issues rather than the HPFP. If it’s in it’s early stages of failure which generally happen very rapidly, then maybe it’s possible it’s only gotten one cylinder. Pretty much all of these failures have been super quick and takes out everything. It’s catastrophic and fast. This sorta goes against the normal grain here. But again, could be early in the failure mode.
That’s what I was kind of thinking. But who know till they open her up and find out
Curious, I just bought a 2020 5500. Do you know if the de-tuned 6.7 uses a CP4?
Yup
@@VBELTandSON gotcha, I guess is what it is. I wonder if the Air Dog or FASS fuel system is a good way to go for some preventive measures..
When the cp4 fails it clogs the injectors and normally don’t start, you can pull the fuel quantity sensor on the pump to see if there’s metal in it.
It's hard to like a video when your buddy's is sick at 484 miles. I'm not a Dodge fan but I do feel bad for Garrett.
Damn I’ve been seriously considering dodge on the next work truck but this has me nervous...especially after hearing how the dealer treated him
Wait till 2021. Couple ppl saying they going back to cp3 then it will be awesome af again
At the prices these dealers are asking these days it’s a pretty crazy thought that this is even a possibility.
Tell us what went wrong with the truck when you find out
Part of this issue is the war on workers. These large manufacturers source parts from the cheapest countries and try to hire the cheapest people to assemble them. They feel that if they simplify the process enough like one guy only tightens a few bolts on the whole truck any dummy can do it. But if that guy isn't mechanically inclined he doesn't know if the part he just installed is good/defective/or damaged. He just puts it together and moves it down the line. Its a shame but can happen to any brand. All these large corporations care about is profit, and quality comes second. Sorry Rant over
damn that sucks but it doesn't matter how good something is every now and then there's a bad egg. knowing Cummins well the Australian end of Cummins if its a bad egg they will fix / replace it.
This is why I got rid of my 2019 and got a 2020 L5P Duramax with the Denso HP4. Cummins was stupid to puta flawed injection pump ruining their reputation.
2030?! What kind of connections do you have!! Lol sorry I just had too....
@@treyschmidt762 damn fat fingers of mine lol.
I here all the nightmares about people messing up and putting gas in these things. When I was younger we would pull up to a pump throw 3-5 gallons of gas in a 95-100 gallon diesel tank and ride. You could always tell wh didn’t in the morning because at -20-30 they were on the side of the road. Those old 237 Mack’s,350 cats,and 8v Detroit’s would really throw the fire from the stacks.
My 04.5 runs like a champ. Keeping it forever. Not quit at 200k but very close. If that was me I would be pissed.
My brother bought a brand new 2020 power stroke drive it home from the dealer and it’s been on the hook 3 times in 3 days. It’s been at the dealer for 4 weeks and they don’t wanna just replace it after they can’t figure out the issue but have a truck there they want him to trade in for that he doesn’t want but they say his truck is now used so they will give him $5500 less for it in trade. He put 120 miles on it needless to say he is pissed and has been using my Cummins since he hauls a trailer everyday and the loaner they gave him was a v6 f150
I bought a lemon once. Drove the ford off the lot and the transmission went out in front of the dealership. The fixed it and after the 3rd time I sold it.
My buddy's had a similar issue, its on its 2nd trans now and the eco boost is having all kinds of issues, they've pulled the cab twice now.
it's a permanent fixture at the dealership and he just keeps taking it back, idk why.. whatever
Did warranty cover it?
Yeah
Somebody has to get the truck built on a Friday afternoon. Unfortunately this time it was your buddy. Hopefully they get it fixed up right
If an injector is leaking--it'll wash the cylinder down and ruin the rings.Have it picked up.
Smoke the bottom end as well due to oil dilution..
I would definitely get rid of that CP4 pump. An put a CP3 back in it.
Yes, the CP4 is terrible!
You got a lemon truck my dad took his 2020 ram when he first got it put 2000 miles on it and then drove it 4000 miles round-trip toes just fine drives just fine I really think you got a lemon truck something wasn’t right when you got it
Sometimes you have 14 days to return the truck. It’s in fine print. Think you can’t go over like 1200 miles. I’d have them take it back and wait on 21’s.
All new equipment can have issues, but when a dealer doesn't come and collect it and gives you a loaner while it's sorted, is not a good dealer.