How Does Deadpool Know He's a Comic Book Character? | Idea Channel | PBS Digital Studios
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- Опубликовано: 13 сен 2024
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Has Deadpool reached a higher level of consciousness?
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• DEADPOOL's Inner Voice...
According to the philosophical theory of ‘phenomenology,’ our consciousness is unfalteringly dependent upon the experiences of our body. The concept of the mind is inseparable from that of the body because we experience the whole of our reality THROUGH our body. But in Deadpool’s case, his body is not so much a part of his reality as it is just another object that he interacts with. He is unfazed by his own mutilation, and has experienced his own physical destruction too many times to keep track of. So has this fundamentally altered his state of consciousness, to the point of delusion? We think it is very possible, but please let us know your opinions in the comments below!
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What if we're all in a comic-book that super-heroes read?
oh god.
That actually seems like a good comic book!! lot's of lore.
+The Skeptical Nerd Then my story will be very NSFW lelelele
I'd feel sorry for them
+TagRoss54321 same lol
Thanks for having me on, Mike!
+NerdSync Thanks for understanding the whole only-1-chimichanga thing... you're a real sport.
+PBS Idea Channel you know deadpool awarness was explained in the comic
+BioFeld cause not every one reads them the reason before was loke telling him
+BioFeld yeah but the real question is how dose loke know
+NerdSync that sub for sub bit with the boxes was apt/awesome :D
If I knew I am a fictional character, I would be obsessed with the idea of my creator. Everything I do, I know, I think, I feel, is made by him/her.. Am I a figment of his/her imagination? Or am I just a product of the way his/her world shaped his/her mind? That means I am the result of a universe I am not aware of, a universe that I cannot even perceive. And why would they create a character that questions his own existence so much? Does that mean that they also question their own existence? Are they also the figment of someone else's imagination? o.O
+Michael Pérez This is a very interesting concept and has been tackled before. In Deadpool Kills the Marvel Universe a version of Deadpool from the multiverse finally snaps and realizes that no matter how much he wants to die, due to his popularity as a comic book character the writers will always find a way to bring him back. This causes that version of Deadpool to kill every character in the Marvel Universe, then go and try to kill every single version of Deadpool in the multiverse, then kill the inspiration for every character, then eventually finding his way to the real world where he kills his own writers.
If your interested in this concept, there's also a movie called "Stranger Than Fiction" about a person who realized that he's a fictional character and that his author is going to kill him off at the end of the story so he sets out to find them and prevent it from happening.
+Michael Pérez It would be sick if there was a comic where that was a character's struggle, and at the end they beg the writer to end the comic, because in comic universes if a character doesn't have a book but they aren't dead it is presumed they are off doing something, just without reader reading. So that would be the only way for them to have free will. And then it ends, implying that the writer fulfilled said request.
Liam Baillargeon There is, it's called Deadpool Kills the Marvel Universe. In fact I wrote about just that in the comment directly above yours.
+Michael Perez Deadpool Kills The Marvel Universe, Deadpool Killustrated, and Deadpool Kills Deadpool should answer your questions.
isn't that the basis of religion and destiny, to do right by the powers that be?
Hey there, guys! Jordan D. White here, editor of the Deadpool comic lines for the last...oh...five years or so.
First off, great vid, interesting ideas. I can't say I was really familiar with the idea of phenomenology before now, so I have never really considered that as part of the reason Deadpool knows he is a comic book character...but it's a fascinating idea and well laid out. I know there are also other "in world" explanations for how/why Deadpool thinks this...but as there are a few, I like to leave it to the reader to decide why they believe it to be the case.
I would be interested in hearing how your idea would interact with the "Deadpool Killogy" series we did. Written by Cullen Bunn, it was made up of a trilogy of miniseries that went as far into the "clever metaness" as we could...but that's why I wonder if it would play nice with the phenomenological idea. In the first mini, "Deadpool Kills the Marvel Universe", we decided that we wanted to do an alt-universe Deadpool where we'd take everything that is cute and fun about the regular Deadpool and make it creepy. A big part of that was his 4th wall breaking, as the idea that he is in a comic book is what leads him to decided to kill all the other super heroes--to save them. The second series "Deadpool Killustrated", sees the same Deadpool going into the "ideaverse" to kill great works of literature...and while it is super funny, it's less relevant to this discussion. But the last part, "Deadpool Kills Deadpool" is--and some spoilers for it follow. In DP Kills DP, this same alt U Deadpool (who we sometimes call Dreadpool) has determined that the reason he cannot successfully end the story and free himself is that Deadpools (including and especially the main, Earth 616 Deadpool who he fights in this series) is himself actually the progenitor of all things, and that he literally creates the universe by existing in it and interacting with it. So...I think that would be a far more literal interpretation of what you've described than is usually meant, right? Still...interesting.
Keep up the great work.
Jordan D. White It is an honor to bask in the light of your comment sir. May I lick your toes
Man that was a rabbit hole
The subscriber number 668,899 gives me so much satisfaction
+Esteban Hernández OCD Endorphine rush!!!
I'm gonna unsubscribe and the subscribe again just to watch it happen.
+Riley Riley *trembles a little*
It fills you with determination.
I accidentally moaned a little
Not mentioned is how Deadpool, from time to time, has referenced past events specifically by book title and issue number. That would tend to give substantial weight to the idea he is a self aware comic book character, not that he just thinks he is.
+Charlie Irons Provided he reality *is* a comic book line. He could have any number of reasons for doing that and to my knowledge (please correct me if I'm wrong) he's never pointed that information out to a fellow hero...costume wearer. I'm not saying you're wrong but I don't think it lends as much credence.
+biohazard724 And here's an example of where he's shared that with another hero: static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/0/308/136080-37044-fourth-wall.jpg
Okay, technically Bullseye isn't a hero, but it's between Deadpool and another character.
+biohazard724 And here's an example of him doing so with an actual hero: underscoopfire.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/02/deadpool-fourth-wall-spiderman.jpg
+biohazard724 here he is referencing an entire story arc event: 41.media.tumblr.com/46bc53f6905354a9ca2099635d23d394/tumblr_inline_nlmomvDW6R1rbdoc1_500.jpg
+biohazard724 This is him referencing to us, in front of other characters; downtomarz.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/09/IMG_1679.jpg
So is it a comic about a guy who thinks he's in a comic and is OR is it a comic about a guy who thinks he's in a comic but isn't. Is the fact that there's a comic about him incidental to his belief that he's in one.
+99thTuesday It has been confirmed that he is , in-universe, a comic book character along with the rest of the Marvel Universe. He has in fact interacted with his writers before and even killed them at one point.
+99thTuesday In which case he is VERY good at guessing where the camera is
That's what I was wondering. It would be funny if he is just plain crazy and it just so happens that his delusions actually true.
"Just because you're paranoid, doesn't mean they're not after you"
+99thTuesday I think you forgot your question marks.
?
Here you go, have one on me.
+Jézusmária Thanks
I could actually buy that DeadPool's ability to understand the medium he's in if it weren't for one thing he does very often: references to our world. If his fourth wall breaks were limited to interacting with the panels, making quips and nods about the idea of "readers", and joking about general comic book (or video game or movie) tropes, then I'd be on board with the idea that he is hyper-aware due to his constant physical torment and knowledge of his own perceptions. however, he somehow has knowledge of things that do not seem to exist in the world he inhabits, such as memes, pop culture references, and things like "Leeroy Jenkins". His hypersensitivity can explain his knowledge of the medium he's in (an integral part of the reality he inhabits), but I don't see a way that it could explain him knowing about things that, as far as I'm aware, do not exist in his reality.
Couldn't it be argued that he isn't aware of pop culture references, but comes up with random stuff on the fly (on account of being bonkers) that just so happen to overlap with memes in our cultural space by the writers' will, to further muddy the line between actual knowledge about being in a comic book, and belief thereof? (To be fair, I am not that familiar with Deadpool, and can't argue about what does and does not exist in the universe he's in, so who knows)
+TasteDatRainbow How do you know about things that don't exist in your reality? Exactly!
+CurlyRecords That's actually a pretty cool thought, that to him the stuff he says is just him being insane, but it ends up coinciding with our reality. I could get on board with that. It's no more absurd than him being aware that he exists in a comic book or that he can regenerate his body from any injury. Though I still wish there were a more substantive reason behind it, one that more fully explained how he could have consistent knowledge of things in our world, this idea is pretty interesting! And honestly I don't know too much about deadpool either, past a few of the more famous panels of fourth wall breaks, so if anyone who reads this knows more about the world of deadpool, and could show me that the references could also exist in his world, that'd be great!
The reason I don't think that's the case, though, is he'll sometimes make a reference, and people around him will have no idea what he's talking about, making me think they aren't a part of that world. Again, I very well could be wrong.
+Suvi-Tuuli Allan I don't, which was exactly my point. Like I said, it's easier for me to suspend disbelief that he can sense the limitations and workings of his world (the text bubbles and panels, both of which, though no one else sees them, he is able to know about), but only because those are still a part of his world. They aren't known by anyone else, but they are there for them. Some of his knowledge, however, does not seem to be able to be explained in any way except, "The writer wanted a reference", rather than there being an in-universe reason that he could know it. I like the gentleman above me's idea that maybe to him the references are just nonsense, a byproduct of his insanity, that happen to coincide with our world, but again, that's just a bit less substantive of a reason than is true of the first part, so I'm trying to think of other possibilities for how he could attain knowledge from outside his reality.
He's like Jesus or something. He's like a prophet. The writers are his gods. We are his angels. Amen! Hallelujah!
It kind of reminds me of the Crimson Chin from Fairly Odd Parents. The Chin thought his world was real... until he found out it wasn't. After that, he knew he was in a comic, but accepted the fact that the comic WAS his reality.
I think the Marvel universe is the same. Everyone lives in the comics thinking it is the real world. But somehow, Deadpool found out that truth. The writers let him know that his reality is not THE reality. But he has no control over it, so he does the best he can with that information.
Deadpool Kills the Marvel Universe, anyone?
+Bum Luck An interesting point.
IKR, DEADPOOL IS OP !!!
+Death Crow Not as much as squirrel girl.
yep
+Bum Luck Not the 616 deadpool(who I refer to as Deadpool Prime) but Dreadpool. Though the fact that Dreadpool died before Deadpool Prime (Deadpool Kills Deadpool) and it took a universe colliding with another one to kill Deadpool Prime does say a lot..
While healing factor facilitates perceptions and buffoonery, it is ultimately driven by want. Wade's fourth-wall power is based in need. Specifically, while he is volatile, he is no longer able to have emotion (anger/fear). Volatility and experience don't affect him. He has nothing to do but serve others. Fourth wall power is service to readers. Our emotions are as close as he can get to that raw experience. As such, Wade takes on the role of parent or teacher - showing us how to read and think "comic books".
*while he is volatile = although he is volatile
Talking about him being hyper aware reminds me of what I go through with fibro and how constant pain really does reflect your reality.
Also, I really, really, really want Reynolds as Deadpool to make a video in response to this.
Metametametametameta
Counter argument to the Deadpool thinks he's a comic book character because he's crazy is that there are other marvel characters who have the meta awareness power.
+DFTGamer That doesn't effect him though. He could still think he's a comic book character because he's crazy...
It's a good play on the eternal question of whether crazy people are just crazy, or if they truly do see and understand the world better than everyone else
Schizophrenia can actually be described as hyper-awareness... Excess dopamine causes things to feel meaningful even when they're not. Madness, genius and art have a tangled history together.
+Peter Townsend He also makes specific comment on and use of comic tropes and manipullates his existance as a fictional character although that could actualy be an alternate power where deadpool actualy has the ability to force the rules of his madness onto his reality.
+Connor Swanson
+Limey Lassen
Yes! This!
Genius has often been a mere few steps from crazy. And art, I think, is giving one's self over willingly to the crazy. I frequently have what I call "writer's delusions" - I know and understand these ideas aren't real, but I give myself wholly over to them anyway.
Gotta live it to make it honest.
...like method acting...
What if his delussion is just .... a delusion ?
Like if he thinks he is a comic book character and he was just LUCK that he is in one. Is there a diference of thinking that you are actualy talking with interdimensional beings that don't answer you and actualy talking to invisible beings that can't answer you ?
What if it is just a coincidence and he just THINKS he can see trough the 4th wall but cannot ?
That would contradict with the fact that he can influence and change his own story against his writer's will.
+CZTachyonsVN
But this is where it gets interesting ... is it REALLY against his writer's will ?
I mean ... in OUR WORLD that was the writer's intention all along.
+Platy News
Him wanting to change the writer's intention is just ... another simple coincidence like he getting the numbers right of the last comic he meet up bullseye =P
+Platy News This sort of touches on a really interesting thing in Epistemology called "Gettier cases of 'knowledge.'" Before Gettier, we assumed that in order to "know" something, we need 3 things:
1) I must have a belief
2) The belief must be true
3) I must be justified in having said true belief.
But let's say I go for a drive and I see an animal on a hill. I say "there's a sheep on the hill." It turns out that the animal I thought was a sheep wasn't a sheep (it was a very hairy dog). But, coincidentally, on the other side of the hill-- but still on the hill-- there was indeed a sheep. So I seem to have all of the criteria-- but I just got lucky. I didn't know there was a sheep.
Could this apply to recent reboots of Deadpool? He has a belief that is justified and ultimately true-- but if it comes about solely as a result of his delusion, did he really "know?"
+Professor Politics
Awesome.
Would also create an interesting doubt that .... if he is adapted into knowing he is a movie character, is it the same delusion (since he breaks the 4th wall the same way) or is it a diferent delusion since ... well it is a diferent type of delusion since he will not be able to comment on onomatopoeia, for example. If any of the 3 things that we need change we still have the same thing ?
Excellent interpretation through the phenomenological lens!... I just found this through the NerdSync vid & LOVE it!. Being an MA graduate in psychology from one of the few schools in the US that specializes in Humanistic, Existential, Phenomenological, & Transpersonal perspectives (University of West Ga) - I found this extremely insightful! ~ Thanks!
WAY shorter explenation...loki told him he's in a comic.
I've followed this channel for ages now and have always loved it and I've probably said this loads of times before, but I have to the urge to say it again.
This channel is awesome.
Except that She-Hulk broke the 4th Wall first. It's just a trope.
There is a huge list of characters that break the 4th wall on Wikipedia.
powerlisting.wikia.com/wiki/4th_Wall_Awareness
+Dale MacKinnon Sure! I guess I'm not clear on how your "except" functions here? I think there are two things: the degree to which She-Hulk and Spider Man and Animal Man, et al, canonically "know" they're comic characters (in comparison to Deadpool, e.g.) vs "simply" breaking the 4th wall. And also: theorizing about how DP's sense of his context may come about doesn't mean other characters must align or have similar experiences, I don't think?
+PBS Idea Channel Yeah no, in sensational she-hulk you can see her walking directly from a box of her page to another just to get to her office faster, if that isnt "knowing they are a comicbook character" i dont know what else can be
StNico no because in the page she said how easier is that being trapped in those boxes, nerdsync has the page showing that sorry i cant find it
+eljamaicano1 But how does that effect Deadpool in anyway? Just because other characters break the 4th wall in varying ways doesn't mean they all directly effect each other. In other words, what's your point?
+eljamaicano1 it wasn't she holk it was a old lady
I love watching this stuff because it makes me feel like a grand intellectual yet I have no clue what the hell was going on here.
Love ya, Mike!
4:17 Me and my mom have this in joke where we'd go "phenomena" and then "do do do" to the tune of that "mana mana" song and I was thinking about it and then...hahahaha too funny.
Ah, my dad does that too occasionally.
Another interesting thing is that in the movie, Wade Wilson says: "Don't make the suit green...or animated." Which means that he is also aware of the actor that is portraying him. He is referencing the Green Lantern, where Ryan Reynolds played the Hal Jordan. Wade Wilson is aware that audiences did not appreciate that movie so he bags on it before he is even given his powers and made into Deadpool.
13 years after the battle of Zion...
Morpheous: Neo, Smith has returned.
Neo: Impossible...
Morpheus: The truce with the machines has collapsed. It never was a real truce. It was a false victory for Zion.
Neo: Morpheus, where am I?
Morpheus: You're a hard man to find Neo. Fate, is not without Her sense of humour, but you were easier to find the first time....Trinity is alive.
Neo: Bullshit..
*Morpheus extends both hands, to present Neo the red and blue pills*
Morpheus: Do you still want to see how deep the rabbit hole goes?
Neo: Morpheus, what the hell is going on?
Morpheus: Neo, you are still sleeping...
7:15 you wan't me to do a time loop? I just came from Scott's video and now you made me do it again? Well fine. I could watch it another time, though. It was rly interesting
What if every "fictional" show/story we create or have created actually made us "create" it? And what if we were created by those stories and they made us create them. What if every single person in the world is the centre of an independent/interconnected story with our own individual creators?
Deadpool's phenomenological differences are part of why so many disabled people look up to him. Because of his unique sensations, he experiences things that other people never will, and it changes his outlook and opens up new possibilities. Also, I'm autistic, and I see some overlap between DP's extreme sensations and autism's Intense World Theory.
I thought he couldn't die because of a curse from Thanos AND the healing factor, not just the latter.
+Leoric This is indeed the case. It's often overlooked because nobody other than Thanos (and presumably Death) know about it, so it never gets mentioned in the comics - everyone he knows just assumes he survives because his healing ability is ridiculous.
The curse got removed in a recent series.
+Joshua Pearce Plus he has actually flat out died as in nothing was left of him to even regenerate from during the recent secret wars event. Which honestly can mean two things one. One that so called curse clearly wasn't permeant at all to begin with (unless thanos at some point decided that during all the craziness happening during secret wars to remove it).Or two writers obviously didn't want to follow this mundane rule that no one can kill him.
KON- EL Do you mean secret secret wars (the deadpool side story), or the secret wars where everything got "rebooted" anyways?
Secret wars where status quos were changed.
I think you could write an interesting Deadpool story around the concept that his 4th wall awareness is a permanent mania with the symptom of psychosis. Think about it; the risk-taking behaviour, the over-confidence in himself, the factured personality, and the hallucinations and paranoia that results in him believing that he's always being watched by some meta-universe. And while it can be fun to be around someone like that...sometimes, but it can be very scary and it would be a cool twist on the generic "insanity" that's often attributed to him.
Of course, this could really only work in an alternate universe or something. It would be interesting to turn the whole ~he's so craaazy~ thing into "he's got a legitimate mental illness".
Since Gravity Falls is over, are you FINALLY gonna do an episode on the show?
+AlbinoTanuki Can it be a long shot of me being really sad? Really tho: I think so. I really want to do an episode about how the suburbs (which I mean, was Gravity Falls the burbs or rural? I guess that arguable) is more "weird" than any city. See Twin Peaks, Stepford Wives, etc.
+PBS Idea Channel Good point. I think, in general, there are places around the world that have their own regional weirdness to it. I live in New Mexico and whether you're in Santa Fe, Los Alamos, Taos, etc, you're bound to find some sort of weirdness.
Also, I would classify the town of Gravity Falls and rural.
Of course, with the show in general, I think it's all about accepting "weirdness", no matter if they be places, things, or people.
As someone who lives rural, people in "the cities" tend to underestimate the difference between suburbs and "the town". In my experience, it's urban and suburban, small town and rural. Gravity Falls is definitely "the town" though there are rural characters there (Wendy is a country kid surrounded by townies for instance). There's a certain isolation to the small town plus rural experience that you can't replicate with urban suburban, the weird dichotomy of being The Population and Cultural Centre, while still having the city on the hill over there reminding you that there are places where you can't know everyone's name and where you measure distance in blocks not minutes. Basically, The Town acts a lot like an urban centre, while having major aspects of suburbia, wrapped in the bubble wrap of emptiness.
(Distance measured in minutes: my parents live half an hour from my town in cow country, The City is an hour away from either of us. I have lived in all four zones, in different parts of north america.)
This is so much cleverer than it needs to be; keep on showing that that critics shape art as much as the artist, you beautifully minded man.
What will happen if you cut deadpool straight in half?
You get two deadpools. Not kidding you, there is a comic series of deadpool dealing with exactly that
Taxan I knew it! Thanks for taking your time to reply!
+jusk He gets separated from Mad Cap. Seriously, that happened. It was used to explain why he had the yellow and white text boxes. Well he was more torn apart by Luke Cage and Thor.
+Taxan Which one?
+Aaron Kordish if I remember right, it was actually about, deadpool tossing out his cut out parts of his body in a trash can. Over time, all of them were fixed together and formed a more mentally degraded version of deadpool. There were also other "clones" ,formed in the same series, in a similar manner. Just search online.
I'm not nearly as well-informed as some others are, I haven't done research and I'm barely a casual fan, however I do have a very unique theory about Deadpool. He has an extreme healing factor, he has super strength, he has godly luck... And he has the ability to understand his own situation from an outside perspective. This is a list of and traits that have little-to-no connection... SOME connect because of Weapon X, but certainly not all. I've always thought of it like this: Deadpool has a super power. Just one. Only one. His super power? He knows he's the main character. That's it, that's all. He knows that this is HIS comic. He knows that no matter what he does, he'll win. So he f*cks around and has fun with it, because he might as well keep it interesting! He knows the writers can't kill him off and they explain it away with a healing factor, but in reality, he's in control of them. He OWNS them.
Wouldn't Deadpool's brain regenerate from damage?
probably
is did before
+The Skeptical Nerd except how would healing powers differentiate between beneficial and detrimental changes to the workings of the mind? it might be able to heal internal hemorrhaging of the mind, but healing of or ticking back of changes in the mind or mental state of a person would create a brain incapable of internalizing new information or developing in general. Something to think about.
physically but not psychologicaly
+The Skeptical Nerd If it's actual physical "damage," then yes. But if it's just a matter of his brain being re-wired in a different way, probably not.
A few years ago I took to heart the notion of 'residual self-image' (having re-watched The Matrix while recovering from a traumatic auto accident). Some friends sought to boost morale during physical rehab & would call out ridiculous events Daily; "You're having a classic movie day/ Anime day" etc. Just thinking about paradigms of different media genres helped me re-assemble my own thoughts into appropriate modes. Imagining uplifting/ cheesy stories to motivate progress can help; especially for nerds who've absorbed YEARS of those narratives. After some months of such pop-culture assisted rehab, i discovered comics again- and Deadpool! He really has a keen balance of humor, chaotic personality & superhuman survival; traits I aimed to internalize while putting my memories, habits and SELF back together. Recovered & Re-calibrated closer to 'normal' now, it seems funny that such chaotic fictional characters could help shepherd my mind back to equilibrium; but I'm glad there was quality stuff to inspire that journey
Deadpool knows he's a comic book character because his creator (Rob Liefeld) decided to tell him.
...
I think I just broke the 4th wall from our side.
We have more than five senses, there are nine of them. You have sight, smell, hearing, taste, feeling of pressure, pain and heat, balance, and inner movement of muscles. I like the rock from from over the garden wall. Such an underrated mini-series. :)
All this explanation... He's just written that way. Period.
I would just like to say that the media clips were on point this week. Bravo.
Deadpool, Sartre, and the phemenology of embodied cognition in one video. I cannot tell you how much this makes me happy.
It's funny watching Mike talk about Deadpool interacting with his medium while watching Mike interact with his medium. You know, pointing down towards the doob-lee-doo, invoking smaller pannels of himself in previous videos or perfectly anticipating and interacting with smash cuts.
I'd also say that Mike has a variety of voices and monologues running at the same time as he participates in the writing of the show, has other writers available and makes use of direct quotes in his performance. I'm sure that all the prep work, reading and rehearsing invades his thoughts as he actually does perform and shoulder up to his more personal thoughts and opinions, each taking their turn to be voiced.
I guess it would be cool to know what it would be like to 'know' you're performing a video essay even when you're not. I'd imagine right away you'd start trying to use your powers to communicate with your editor or the medium. After doing it for so long it would feel pretty natural but that's really only after seeing the final versions lots of times and understanding what your 2D space looks like to a viewer. So I guess what I'm asking is how does deadpool perceive himself and his world? Is he seeing what we see as a viewer or does he intuitively understand its form. Does he read the text around him or read it on the page like we do?
this was great. first I ever heard of phenomenology. now I'm hunkered in my hospitals medical library researching phenomenology as a resource for improving the patient experience and the patients understanding of illness.
Thanks!
I just love how any time a video reviews Deadpool or cosplayer dresses up as him, it's always the same. They take on the persona of Deadpool and his frame of mind when talking to others.
When you start getting into complex theories like phenomenology I always end up finding my grasp on the entire thing somewhat tenuous, like I'm trying to hold the entire thing in my head an only barely making it. It's a very interesting sensation, like trying to do a puzzle that is becoming steadily more complex, almost the mental equivalent of going to the gym and pushing a little further than you did last time.
I like it : )
I was always fascinated by the philosophical implications of Deadpool Kills The Marvel Universe, Deadpool Killustrated, and Deadpool Kills Deadpool.
A Kick-ass Mind's Eye reference at 4:12, followed by a beautiful Muppet moment? Delightful.
Coincidentally I've just stayed to read Phenomenology of Perception this week for a class, I think you did an excellent job.
This is the first time I actually scrolled down to read the comments.
Now I understand why this is such an awesome show.
I'm liking the Dismemberment Plan vinyl on the back wall!
The thing I found the most interesting is that he does not get close to dying often, he DIES often. He crosses out of existence over and over again. Every thought and memory obliterated many times per day, and then is dragged back into existence, I have to wonder if he almost gets to peek into what is beyond.
And yet I would describe him as a joyful character, of course he is crazy but he is not broken.
He could easily stop doing things, he can never die. He could simply not care. But he continues to go in and do things within his world. He knows that his life is in a comic book that it is all just a story, but he still sees a point to all of it.
Niiiice, an interesting episode about Deadpool AND you use BOTH the title pictures of a TOOL album AND a Soen album! Love it!
Bit surprised Abed Nadir from Community wasn't mentioned, as he presents a slightly more grounded example of a character with a complicated relationship with the context of his existence. Couldn't help but be reminded of him every time you mentioned the dilemma of whether Deadpool KNOWS he's in a comic or merely THINKS he is, as that question is often raised with Abed.
this was actually really interesting, gonna have to add a few books to my amazon list.
I've always thought of it like seeing the dead in Beatlejuice. deadpool is strange and unusual, he is also very insane. his mind can break through the fourth wall because he is so broken himself his perception is altered to the point off seeing beyond any other character.
I purpose a different theory. Deadpool isn't aware he is in a comic book, just that something is off. He lives in a world full of super characters with extraordinary abilities, almost all of whom, surprisingly, fall into good guys or bad guys. With the sheer number of people that are neither good nor bad but somewhere in the middle (though usually through empathy and societal pressures lean toward the good), it makes no sense for all those with super powers to, by and large, fall into one category or the other. As such, as a way to deal with the great soul crushing losses he has had and continues to have and to deal with the psychological torture of the pain inflicted to him, Wade Wilson escapes reality to place where this all makes sense... a land of imagination where he is a comic book character.
This interpretation is all the more interesting when you consider that he stays true to himself. Just like a childhood game of "cowboys and indians" it is interesting that it becomes more "Cowboys vs Wade", whereby he doesn't take the imaginary role of another persona like an movie star doing a radio interview or a Cop stopping terrorist in a building over Christmas, but his life is super enough and insane enough to be his own lead character. It also speaks to his ego in a weird kind of way.
So in this play he sees extraordinary things carried out by extraordinary people who are extraordinarily two dimensional and who inexplicably fall into binary categories. That doesn't fit the reality he has seen. Not only that, he finds himself counted among these beings but knows he isn't so binary. So, as a coping mechanism, he begins a foray into madness where all of this can make sense... he is in a comic book. And obviously because he is different than those other spandex wearing super goody guys or mustache twirling dime store Doctor Dooms, he is the main character. The guy who has the readers. And as such, he has to keep he audience interested or else the book gets canceled, the story ends... he ends.
While not completely in line with what you posit as it is not a case of perception creating reality, it is a case of hyper perception + psychological damage = false reality. The choice of cracking jokes all the time is another coping mechanism. You can laugh or cry. His life as a mercenary taught him to laugh and now he uses it to entertain his fantasy audience. So it isn't that we are reading a comic book with a self aware character, our perceptions have been fooled as we are inside the mind of a mad man... we are the delusions.
*Edit: While I know quite a bit about the Marvel universe as it exists not only on screen but in writing, I am by no means an expert. And quite honestly Deadpool is one of the more popular supers I know the least about, so grains of salt and all that. I also know many characters don't fall so neatly into these categories such as Frank Castle, Magneto, Cable, and even Wolverine. The recent trends have been to make more full fleshed out 3d characters and that is a good thing. However, generalities have to be taken for the sake of brevity.
Actually the white voice in Deadpool's head is that of Madcap, who was fused with Deadpool for a while. It happened in an annual issue a few years back( can't remember which issue).
To all questions as they relate to Deadpool: yes, and that is so awesome from philosophic, aesthetic, and pop perspectives. GREAT VIDEO!!
I'm so glad you had that Muppets clip. I CANNOT hear the word "phenomena" (or similar) without hearing those do-deet-dos. And you said it, just a whole bunch. The worm in my ear needed feeding, I guess.
This is so weird. I just subscribed to NerdSync yesterday, mainly because it seemed like an Idea Channel for comic books. What a coincidence!
The slow transformation into Mr Rogers is going well. Keep up the good work, neighbor.
I know this a deep video and all, but can we just take a moment to appreciate the glory that is Mike's Deadpool sweater?
I like to think of deadpool as the comic book photobomber. He's in the picture where everyone is being serious and trying to look nice and yet seperate from it, because he's making a goofy face or an obscene gesture. And he's appeared as a cameo in so many comics books, that eventually he became a sort of meme and people wanted to know his story. He's the kind of person who knows he's comicbombing his own world for an audience he'll never see. Kinda like making fun of the people on the other side of a two-way mirror in a police interrogation room, except that room is his entire world.
Clicked on the video planning on writing a comment about how Deadpool is not a person, has no consciousness, and "knows" he's a comic book character because it's meta... but then you addressed exactly that at the beginning.
As someone who deals with health issues that cause chronic pain, and other issues, I can attest that such things do alter one's sense of the world. One becomes aware and constantly reminded of things that most other people never think about. Primarily, of course, it's in areas about the human body and its functions. This does create a sense of one's body being a separate object that is in conflict with the mind and/or spirit. In my case, I have often said to doctors and therapists that my medical issues feel like I'm being constantly betrayed and violated by my own body. This kind of separation where the body is sensed as something "external" acting on one's "self" can easily lead to psychological issues related to poor body image and body dysmorphia.
Your ideas about Deadpool cosplayers fits perfectly with why I think Deadpool fans are the most delightful. And they are!
When I write, I have this rule which says that characters that are pure of heart can see through/break through the 4th wall. Then I take the loosest possible/most counterintuitive interpretation of "pure of heart" and see what happens.
One of the most interesting videos I've watched in a while... on any topic.
Thank you for answering the question I had after watching Deadpool's first movie. I was hoping to see the transition between semi-normal Wade Wilson to Captain Deadpool! Okay, he was right, that DOES sound stupid.
Huzzah, great video with two of my favorite channels teamed up! Also, I like the new set. It reminds me of a coffee shop I used to hang out in, back in Waco, TX.
LOVED THIS VIDEO
I saw Deadpool this past Saturday, and this video made me LOVE IT ALL THE MORE!
I played a few video games that have explored issues of the mind in pretty neat ways. I recently finished a survival horror game called SOMA that dealt a lot with ideas of the separation of mind and body, meaning of human consciousness, and balancing one's awareness and ignorance to maintain sanity. Another game that comes to mind is The Talos Principle, where one plays a character in a simulated reality where one solves puzzles to help prove whether they pass a version of the Turing Test but along the way discovers comments left by previous "test takers" on the nature of life, consciousness, and other such issues.
Fantastic video- as someone who actually has a degree in philosophy, I think that you do a phenomenal job (pun not intended) of addressing challenging issues in continental philosophy.
What's interesting is that while Deadpool may have his awareness due to phenomenological reasons, he seems to construct his own identity in a dualistic sense. In the 2012 comic reboot, we often see him in a sort of mental museum where his various "selves" communicate with one another (or with any shield agents that happen to be sharing a body with him). Plus, he has a sense of continuity even when almost every last bit of him has otherwise been destroyed thanks to his regenerative factor, bringing up a ship of Theseus sort of situation. Presuming he just wouldn't hijack the dang boat to become a pirate.
In this sense, maybe Deadpool is more meta than we realize. Provided that the in-cannon justification for his sense of being a comic book character is correct, he experiences reality phenomenologically but relies on a dualist construct to cope. If Merleau-Ponty is correct then, perhaps, so do we.
Also, fun fact, I actually just bought that same mask for me to use in a video that I'm filming on Deadpool.
02:45 Ok, officially freaked out. Ultimate 4th wall break.
Also probably helps that Deadpool has dimensional warping device that lets him jump realities. In recent years they've pretty much framed it as "Deadpool actually has been to all the companies in our world involved with his merchandising" and whatnot.
I'd always wondered if Deadpool's ultimate healing ability did something to his brain that allows him to see and realize the incongruities in his world. The Comic Book World has all sorts of things that conflict each other and maybe the fact that Deadpool heals from everything also enables his brain to work faster and more efficiently and so he sees these things. A great example of this is in the movie *small spoiler* when they tell him he's going to see Professor Xavier and he asks "Stewart or McAvoy?" He already shows he's above average in his wit, but maybe that's related to the healing powers and the fact that his brain just doesn't show signs of fatigue or other age related strain.
I love that there is a Tool (Lateralus) and a Soen (Cognitive) album cover in the same video. My two favourite bands.
"How does Deadpool know he's a comic book character?"
"Because that's what the writer wanted."
One of the things I liked about the film is how they modified Deadpool inner voices. In the film the audience is his inner voices.
It was a really interesting way to break the 4th wall.
i think this is a good explanation because if i recall correctly from the movie, before deadpool "became a mutant", he was not aware of his audience, so the explanation that his perception of everything has become "hyper-real" or "hyper-dimensional" because of his extreme healing abilities/enhanced perception is really viable and intriguing to me.
I think that the "truth" (assuming that there is one to be reached) is more simple.
As someone who (were I more motivated) is a creator, the characters in my head have a sort of dissonance from myself. The natural creative process for characters starts with vague ideas and concepts that sort of congeal into a character, and then you kind of put the finishing touches on them yourself, and once you have something you're happy with, they kind of become their own entity that you can conjure up, or sometimes they force themselves to the forefront when you're feeling inspired.
With that in mind, you can think about a character and know a fact about them, and this is relevant because I think that deadpool, to us (the copy of deadpool we've inserted into our brains via the media he's in,) and to his creator is just a character that has the knowledge that he is a character. And he retains this knowledge when being written.
I don't really have a rebuttal as for why, but I don't think that his "knowing" that he's a character in a comic book is derived from his circumstances in universe. It's derived from his circumstances in his creator's head. Put simply, it's more to do with how our brains work, than deadpool's.
The explanation I've always been fond of is based on one that Nicieza has given in regards to Deadpool's sexuality: Because of the constant destruction and recreation of his cells, in particular his brain cells, his brain is every shifting and changing and with it his personality, sexuality etc. In universe this has lead to people being unable to read him, because they can not detect any pattern in his behavior/fighting style.
Out of universe it's not only a handy way for writers to explain changes in the character and his apparent insanity, it has also lead a lot of fans (me included) to conclude that the ever changing perspective on the world is what made him aware of the fourth wall and his own context (and inspired him to break out of the confines that not being aware has put on him...). Which I guess is kind of what you're talking about in the video. xD
I like this thesis more than the explanation that his adventures with Loki clued him into the nature of things. I think its worth noting that Deadpool eventually contracts an overwhelming death wish. That's a heavy endorsement for us to keep our pleasant fictions.
I started Deadpool Cosplayers of NYC to organize the madness. I noticed that alot of deadpools getting together would end up focusing on over doing one another becouse all the people watching. with the help of D-piddy, we were able to organize a comicon take over like no other at NYCC 2015. since then everyone just started to not impress the world, but just have fun with one another and do the whole, "dance like no one's watching" mentality. in that way everyone became their own unique deadpool building up to just one big deadpool movement.
Not to say we don't have own own stand alone members that are amazing all on their own their amazing too. I just find that nothing brings it out more then your fellow deadpools.... hope that makes sence and they don't realize I'm studying them...
This video has some super cool editing. Nice work!
When you got to the point about how you see yourself from someone else's view I literally screamed "that is what I have been trying to say for years" This whole analysis of deadpool is amazing and is basically all of the reasons that I love his character.
"You are what other people think of you" Great point. But without examining the ensemble of Deadpool's world and how they view him how can we hope to learn how to view him? This is explored in other runs down to his very identity?
I came from nerdsync and I'm here to stay! awesome video 👌
As far as wearing a Deadpool costume goes, I will say this: To wear a an Identity that is not your own is a transformative experience. I have worn both a military uniform when I served and a full-body costume at conventions, and it is a similar experience, thought the full body one was more "total". You adopt an identity that is not your own, fully or in part, and you become someone new. If you get the chance I recommend trying it at least once.
I think the "16th wall break" in the recent film disproves the theory that he actually doesn't know he's a character.
First of all great video, also glad you brought NerdSync into the video as well.... Making me really want a chimichanga now...
Anyway I do believe due to his "behind-the-comic" bringing and the literal idea he is supposed to be the crazy person who breaks up all the darkness and despair in most comics; his character is perfect as a mockery of Deathstroke. His name is close to Slade Wilson on purpose; he looks like Deathstroke on purpose, and if we consider him to understand he is in a comic, I'm sure he understands he is a (mind you arguably better) copy of a comic character from another comic company.
Great episode! I agree with some of my fellow commenters here that Deadpool is not alone in comic book personas breaking the fourth wall or being aware of the medium they are in. I can think of Superman winking to the audience in comic books, cartoons, and movies, effectively acknowledging the presence of the audience. I wonder if this stemmed from the same 'free reign' given to Deadpool's writers over the year, namely the self-consciousness of comic books occupying infantile spaces and the necessity of more actively engaging the reader and making him/her 'invest' in the story. Deadpool might then be a maturing of this phenomena, reflecting both a change in readership (one more aware of comic book universes and their tropes) and in the authorship (one more adept of pushing the boundaries of sequential art - for example, the use of dialog callouts, thought balloons, captions, and onomatopoeia are all text interacting with both the art and the preconceptions of the reader). Deadpool's self-awareness might be attributed to the nature of his 'body', but for the longest time, characters such as Superman and The Spirit proved to be only restrained by the imagination of its creators and not much else.
A Tool/Alex Grey and *two* Big Lebowski references?! Oh yeah, this is a good week!
I always just assumed it worked on both levels. In universe, Deadpool is imagining his life is a graphic novel, or that he's in a video game, and his delusions line up to match where needed. Out of universe, it's a tongue in cheek comic with 4th wall breaking.
I think Deadpool's real power is to affect the perception others have on his reality to match his own. He doesn't simply see the medium he exists in and comments on it. He manipulates and warps it to his whim, if only to a degree, to show the readers how he sees his world, not by telling, but by literally showing.
As an incredibly loving Deadpool fan this video was amazing!! The only thing I wish is that you had gone more over the history of the white box/yellow box, especially with the Annual revealing his white box was Madcap (an underrated Marvel character in my opinion). Especially talking about how Deadpool perceives the world as it is because he feels his body, everywhere, all the time, versus Madcap who lost all sensation and sense of pain (which gives an entirely different perspective to the white box too).
I actually interpreted the link between Deadpool’s superhero
abilities and his fourth-wall-breaking insanity in the reverse order: that his
knowledge of the comic was what gave him his powers. I thought that somehow in
the experimental process, he got a look into our world - or more specifically,
the comics of our world - and saw either himself or other characters he
recognized. He saw the tropes of the genre and gleamed things about his place
in them. Key ideas such as the “status quo” meant that Deadpool had to always
survive and thus he must have unlimited regenerative capabilities. Super
strength? Amazing combat skills? These are musts to be a comic book main
character: the rule of power-creep means eventually everybody who is somebody
must get them. I find that even his strong sense of confidence and sexuality
come from his awareness of how comics are a sexualised medium (and ultimately so
it’s his duty to provide).
I see his persona as the result of having witnessed a truly
monumental experience of understanding where his life is (i.e. in that of the
viewer) and so he has to be a superhero to stay relevant (as cancellation is
the only thing that could kill him). The split personality is just a result of
what happens when someone is flooded with more information than they could
possibly understand. The constant inner turmoil of questions like “who am I in
this abstract world created outside all that I perceive?” and “If this is
cancelled, I will cease, what must I do to keep the audience watching?” are what
drives him. His powers like immortality and super-strength are just convenient
vessels allowed in this universe that he can use to serve in answering those
questions.
That was FASCINATING!
I REALLY need to find more videos discussing these theories... Cartesian Dualism and Phenomenology... Wow...
I think you overlooked the idea that Deadpool sort of encapsulates the story of Sisyphus as imagined by Camus, with both fictional beings living a life that is primarily suffering, repetitive (due to the nature of comics both having a certain structure as well as repeated tropes) and both being inescapable (this being directly tackled in Deadpool kills the Marvel Universe). And like Camus, Deadpool arrives at the same metaphysical rationalisation of Absurdism: that the only way to 'win' in this hellish existence is to rebelliously laugh in its face
A video about all the punk futures and the history behind them and of course their likelyhood would be an interesting one to watch.