Chinese Dual-Purpose Cleaver Review - Leung Tim Chopper Factory (Chopper - 文武刀)
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- Опубликовано: 11 июл 2024
- In this video, I will be reviewing the Leung Tim Chinese Vegetable Cleaver/Slicer. Leung Tim Chopper Factory is a long exciting brand with a shop in Hong Kong that sells a lot more knife types for various customers.
Leung Tim Chopper Factory has a lot of versions that look similar but are totally different in usage.
Measurements*:
Length: 20cm
Width: 9cm
Thickness: 1.9mm across the entire spine
Weight: 284grams
Steel-Type: Stainless
Handle: Stainless Steel handle
Handle Lenght: 10.5cm
Logo: Stamped
*Rockwell and Measurements may differ per knife.
N O T E S: I highly recommend buying from your local Asian supermarket as they tend to be a lot cheaper there than ordering online.
Address: Hong Kong, Sham Shui Po, Cheung Sha Wan Rd, 221
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T I M E S T A M P S
00:00 - Intro
00:43 - Dual Purpose vs Vegetable Cleaver?
01:58 - Aesthetic & Specification
02:44 - Knife Handle & Comfort
03:17 - Gripping Style & Balance Point
03:35 - Knife Profile
03:48 - Sharpness & Edge retention
04:15 - Key Takeaways & Recommendations 
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this is from one of the oldest knife shop in hong kong and there is a reason why they are still around. also i really like how u chop siu mei with it, it is one of the most popular dishes and hong kong is known for making the best siu mei.
Thank you for another excellent review!
Great review as usual
Nice to see that you upload new videos. Looking forward for more content about cleavers and knives. Maybe you could do videos about honing rods? Steel rods and ceramic rods, benefits and if ceramic rods are worth to buy
I have a few honing rods in the planning :)
For what it's worth - my stone progression is currently 320 - 1000 - 3000 - 6000 grit and basswood/leather strop with no compound.
The finishing grit depends on the knife's purpose and I just do a few stropping motions after sharpening and when the knife edge gets a little bent.
Otherwise, it's a touch up on the stone I used to finish that particular knife, following which would be a quick sharpening session.
I've heard that even ceramic rods don't offer high grit, being in the range of 2000-4000 grit, so if you have time a strop with or without compound is better.
If you are a busy pro, ceramic rods would probably do great in the heat of service.
Maybe @ChefPanko would cover stropping one day (:
@@jiahaotan696 yeah what you finish on is a preference/purpose indeed.
I only have one company that has a very smooth high grit rating on their honing rods (currently still searching for one that I can recommend when it comes to ceramic rods, but when it comes to Diamond coated ones I feel that any of them will do great).
There was a company called work sharp that I did a review on their ceramic rod has a rating of 6000 (2-4µm grain size) but cuts like 400/4000. It gave me a very nice finish and if used wet it is even smoother. The added texture made it possible for it to cut like a 400/1000 ceramic rod. It was very interesting and would have been my go-to rod if it wasn't for the short length and handle design as the focus of that product was for the home cooks with their built-in angle guide. And I was not really sold on the microforge wheel that they included, I can see the benefits in some situations but I prefer without it. The ceramic bind had a glass-like feel to it and the reason why I asked them what grit rating they have it on since they did not specify it on the website but after an explanation from the lead designer (Dan Doval) I understand why (the rating would not justify what the product actually does in terms of their own ceramic binding).
Basically, the rating on the rod is #6000 (2-4µm grain size)
But their process and bindings produce 0.7-0.8 µm grain size on the smooth surfaces.
So it won't have the same feel and material removal rate as a 6000 Waterstones.
It is a very hard bond that won't leave a slurry if used wet.
The added grooves will add a rougher finish off (45-55 µin) this is done because of the lesser surface area for the aggressive material removal while having the same 6000 grit abrasive rating.
So a grit rating of 6000 but a feel of 16.000 (0.7 microns) with a removal rate of 400/4000.
It was a very fascinating talk with the Lead Designer at Worksharp ''Dan Doval'', I prefer talking to the designers/makers than talking to the marketeers. (really hope that they update the handle and added a longer honing rod preferably a little bit thicker for the newer versions if they plan to serve the professional market since the rod that they include with their sharpener is of great quality).
If it is very busy and in heat of service I will bring my workhorse knife out and use a diamond rod and force a new edge. As I would like to extend my lifespan on my nicer knives :P
I would love to cover stropping but I need more hands-on time with stropping since I actually never strop on leather.
At work and if it is busy I don't strop on leather but finish on a higher grit stone, if it is not busy I will use a free newspaper to strop on, that I grabbed while I was omw to the restaurant.
@@chefpanko I found that having a strop in the kitchen... tends to wet the wood and leather very easily lol. I mean, I clean my countertop frequently, but the water remaining after cleaning with a cloth also needs time to dry, right? Then I get dismayed with the spots of water on my strop lol
In my biased, one man sample size POV, salespeople I talk to often have no idea what I'm talking about. Clearly not interested and paid too little to care about their product... So I cultivate the habit of researching thoroughly about stuff I purchase. It's like a hobby and lets me learn and appreciate the stuff I own. Would be nice to talk to the people who designed them of course!
It a really good review, as usual. Thank you very much. What is the best vegetable chinese cleaver for around $100?
Nice video chef!
Thanks! :)
Hello Chef Panko. That Grandsharp Nakiri I told you about came in. Turns out they still have quality control issues. Hardess test is fine but spine thickness at the tip was advertised as 2.0 mm and I got one with 2.8 mm, huge mistake.
It also has other smaller problems but that's the big one.
Did you test any knife with 14Cr14MoVNb power steel. Xinzuo and Hezhen have a new line with this steel. Both have target hardness 63 HRC but I haven't seen anyone talking about it.
0.8mm off is quite a lot!
I did not test the 14Cr yet, I have seen them selling the new line I have them on my wishlist and I will be waiting for a special sale.
Since I have too many knives to test at the moment, usually on the 11.11 sale day it will have a huge discount. (waiting for that)
Hello sir !
Super helpful content !
U should try Chopper King White #2 cleaver ,u find them cktg. I think better quality and price / performance ratio than CCK.
its hitachi white steel too ,and thin as a mtfk👌
They look good, I will see if I can order them locally here in the Netherlands since importing them will be quite expensive or if I visit Taiwan.
Thanks for the mention it looks good and the white steel-type is interesting to see.
@@chefpanko ഇത് വാങ്ങുന്ന തിന് എന്ത് ചെയു ണം
@@chefpanko എനിക്ക് ഒരു െെ ഫ് വാങ്ങണം
@@poulosecc782
ഈ വീഡിയോയിൽ ഉള്ളത് ഹോങ്കോങ്ങിലോ ഓസ്ട്രേലിയയിലോ വാങ്ങാം, ആ രാജ്യത്തിന് പുറത്ത് അവ കണ്ടെത്തുന്നത് ബുദ്ധിമുട്ടാണ്, തിരഞ്ഞെടുത്ത ചില ചൈനീസ് സൂപ്പർമാർക്കറ്റുകൾ മാത്രമേ അവ വിൽക്കുന്നുള്ളൂ.
A+++ REVEU
I ordered some xinzuo newest 64 Hrc powder steel. Wish me luck!
Good Luck! And if it arrives tell me what you think about them (the prices of their powdered steel is quite steep and the main reason for not purchasing one yet).
I saw one that I was interested at but the pricing was very steep, it was a Bohler M390 steel (for some reason out of stock for a very long time and even unlisted on Ali).
Also curious about their SG2 (or equivalent version) steel that I have on my Watchlist.
@@chefpanko this is the sg2 equivalent. I will let you know how they are when I receive them. Prices are high for sure! $70-$100 usd a knife.
@@sledhead904 $70-100 is not bad (if it is on par with or close to SG2 then it is a great deal), was it during a sale day? Or is it for their utility knife versions?
The price I get is approx 200 Euro (approx $210 USD for a Chef's knife or a Nakiri right now so it is sitting on my watchlist I may have missed the special sale day).
@@chefpanko I see that, I may have misspoke. I ordered from this family US $68.93 33%OFF | 2022 XINZUO 7" Nakiri Knife 73 Layers Damascus Steel 62-64 HRC Chef Cleaver Knife Restaurant Comfotable Wood Handle Cutter
The next level above mine they say is imported sg2 and they are $200, but at that price point id probably be shopping for non- Chinese knives.
This one is 14cr14movnb powder steel that I'm hoping is the Chinese equivalent to sg2.
@@sledhead904 yeah at $200 you can get SG2 that is made in Japan.
Very curious what you think about their 14cr steel, never heard of it just like the 10cr it was quite a journey to get a 10cr that I'm happy with since there were a lot of mixed results when I first went into the rabbit hole of Chinese made Japanese style knives. But they improved a lot over the years (still a lot of retailers selling bad quality ones finding the correct one can be a hard task).
That being said Xinzuo so far has surprised me they were pretty consistent so far (did not try their newest versions and steel types, but the 10cr, 440c, and 1.4116 steel were all good). Hopefully, the 14cr will be great for you, let me know what you think once it arrives.
Anyone know where to buy in Manhattan?
That's a beautiful knife. Do you have a link to where I can find it?
I don't know which online web shop has them since they are not that popular compared to the CCK's.
While the shop is just a few streets away from the CCK store in Hong Kong.
Most Asian/oriental supermarkets do have them in the stores beside the CCK's.
Here in the Netherlands they can be bought at Amazing oriental, Wah Nam Hong and more oriental supers.
I had hoped by now you would move on from all the cleavers, I have seen so many on your channel they now all start to blend together. Out of the last 15 videos 7 were focused on cleavers. The quality both in content and production from your videos continues to be great, just looking forward to more reviews outside of the realm of cleavers.
Thank you for the feedback :)
I'm planning to close the cleaver chapter wich is almost done as I plan to make one complete guide for it and then move on to the other knives that I have tested.
I planned to upload some of the other knife review but for some reason the recorded footage were all out of focus (have to redo most of the shots).
Some of them are the Misono Gyuto 440C, Misono Handmade, Misono EU Carbon Steel.
Some paring knives that I'm planning to cover.
Some more Chiense made Japanese styled knives
Also planning to move to extra content beside the reviews and focus more on the other aspects of the knives.
So more guide/explainatory oriented videos besides the review videos.
@@chefpanko I really enjoy your content on Chinese cleavers as they are typically under appreciated among kitchen knife enthusiasts.
@@LeeavAccordian There are still a lot of unknown Chinese cleaver-styled knives. But there is also a lot of confusion between what is a ''cleaver'' and what serves what purpose.
Some people buy the wrong version which does not serve their purpose.
So I delve into them to uncover them a bit more and hope that the confusion can be taken away.
As to what knife does what, despite looking similar.
Currently, there are 4 major ones that people get confused about.
And besides that, they have similar-looking cleavers that are designed for ''dumplings'', duck butchering, etc. (while still maintaining the ''cleaver look on all of them'')
So that is the final guide about the 4 major ones and the reason why I have been covering the Chinese ''cleavers''.
And trying to explain the 4 major ones that I will add below here (also have a dumpling knife and a duck cleaver that will be used in the final Chinese ''Cleaver'' guide):
1. Chinese ''Vegetable'' Cleaver or also called the ''slicer/slicing knife.'' (片刀 = Slicing Knife (known as CaiDao)
- to slice vegetables and boneless meat (Workhorse knife but do not slice through bones)
2. Mulberry Knife 桑刀 (Also seen as a CaiDao but usually thinner and a harder heat treatment vs the #1)
Usually thinner and harder heat treatment than #1 for more delicate work.
3. ''Dual purpose'' Cleaver, sometimes called ''all-purpose''Cleaver or Multi-purpose Cleaver. (文武刀 = chop and slice knife)
- the 2/3th front part is for slicing the 1/3th heel area is designed to go through smaller bones not larger than a chicken or duck bones/carcass. Thicker and heavier than #1 and #2
4. ''Bone'' Cleaver
- to cut harder/bigger bones like a pork rib. Not ideal for cutting vegetables as they will split rather than cut.
The above 4 are the most recognizable, but there are more knives for professional use as a special cleaver for duck, pork, or one designed to slice through duck skin only.
Or Cleavers for smaller bones for professional use where they need to constantly go through Duck bones/ Chicken bones and cut meat all day long.
The most used search term is ''Chinese Cleaver'' when they think about the ''Chinese Chef's knife'' but in reality, they usually look for #1, #2, or #3.
So it should be named:
#1 slicer
#2 Mulberry Knife
#3 Chopper
#4 Cleaver
@@chefpanko Out of curiosity, after the many Chinese cleavers (hehe) and nakiris you've used and tested, which do you prefer more?
I'd expect the answer to be 'it depends' and for most people, the nakiri would do better at small to medium sized vegetables
And the Chinese chef's knife (slicer/mulberry) would be better for general, all-purpose food prep, and obviously not be as great or as easy to master at cutting any single specific thing as other knives
- which is of course is as per their intended purpose.
Your thoughts on the matter would be interesting.
Also for what it matters, I have a Shiro Kamo gyuto with a curvy belly and I only realised I prefer flatter profile knives after buying the darn thing (of course...).
For my next knife, I'm probably going to get a CCK 1301 or similar (carbon steel Chinese slicer)
or a Moritaka kiritsuke gyuto (dreaming of it) or similar, i.e. something taller than a slicer, shorter than a Chinese chef's knife, very flat and comes with a tip.
Any thoughts? :D
Not sure if I shared, but I recently acquired a 165mm funayuki (a very thin deba traditionally used by fishermen as an all-purpose knife; mine happens to be double bevelled) which is sufficient most of the time as a home cook - I love it to bits.
When I cut tomatoes, citrus and other stuff that requires a knife thin behind the edge, and/or to save the edge of my funayuki, I use my 150mm petty (mini sujihiki shape)
When I prep for parties, I use the Shiro Kamo.
It's possible the reason why I don't like the Shiro Kamo is because it is 210mm and with a curvy belly. I guess that's why Americans like 240mm or 270mm gyutos because of that profile. At least, that's my deduction based on lurking on kitchen knife forums...
So that is the context.
@@jiahaotan696 haha it indeed depends, but right now I actually prefer the CCK KF1912 (Vegetable/Slicer) with the wooden handle.
While the all stainless is good too I prefer the wooden texture feel and added grip. And the reason to go for the slicer/mulberry version is that I don't go through bones and prefer the sharper performance of the thinner and lighter knives.
Currently also testing the Shibazi S210-1 carbon version, and I must say it may replace the CCK (sure it is not stainless but liking it so far and it is a lot cheaper).
While I'm not from NA I was asked to test the Dexter Russel Chinese Chef's knife but at the current price and import tax, I need to wait for a sale.
My preferable knife style is still a Gyuto but then with a straighter profile.
As for the Moritaka kiritsuke gyuto:
When it comes to a Kiritsuke alone I find them more on the preference for meat and not as versatile as a Gyuto.
In terms of Kiritsuke Gyuto, it depends on the knife maker's intention some of the Kiritsuke, Gyuto's have added a rounder belly but for most still very flat, some have a distal taper and some don't.
Not sure which Moritaka Kiritsuke Gyuto you are looking at but most I saw is leaning more towards a Kiritsuke side (only saw the 24cm a 21cm is usually rare but will usually have a curvier blade profile).
But overall it looks good and the pricing of approx $170+ for a 24cm is also nicely priced.
While I like a flatter profile the Moritaka Kiritsuke Gyuto seems a bit too flat for my liking.
Funayuki 165mm and double bevel Deba! That is nice to see the double bevel Ryo-Deba's is one that I want in my own collection.
150mm petty is a good length choice! I wish I went for a 130mm but deiced to try a 130mm with the mind of repurposing it as a paring/fruit knife.
But I did not like the 130mm as a repurposed knife, and rather use a fruit knife like the paring knife from Victorinox.
So I wish that I just went straight for a 150mm petty.
the reason why I like 240mm is when it comes to the westernized handles. Is the handle thickness and length, since I have a large hand size the 21cm westernized handles are a bit too thin and cramping my fingers if I use them too long.
The second thing that is common indeed is the belly profile they are usually a lot curvier than the 24cm ones (not always but most of the time they are).
The reason why I love the Takayuki Shibata 21cm is that he maintains a flat profile on the 21cm and the octagonal handle is a handle that does not cramp up my hand for an extended period of use. (one of the reasons I prefer octagonal over the oval/round traditional handles when it comes to 21cm gyuto's since the 24/27cm have a slightly thicker and longer handle).
So my current favorite Gyuto's are categorized below (Lasers, middleweight, workhorses):
Current favorite laser: Shibata Takayuki Type III 24cm, Aogami #2
Current Favourite middleweight: Makoto Kurosaki 24cm, Aogami #2, Kurouchi Finish*, and the Misono EU Carbon 24cm (It can be a workhorse knife too, but due to the high carbon and non-stainless property I have this as a middleweight since it needs some care).
My favorite workhorse: Misono 440C
*I tried the non-Kurouchi finish from Makoto Kurosaki, like the Makoto Kurosaki AS, and Sakura from a colleague but he has changed his blade profile and knife thickness.
Therefore I like the Kurouchi version since that one is thicker, and had a flatter blade profile and a better height.
Favorite steel-types:
Shirogami White #1: for an omakase-style sushi restaurant, this steel-type may not have the same edge retention as the Aogami #2 or the Shirogami #2 but you can get a far more cleaner edge and can get the edge back a lot faster on a whetstone compared to the Shirogami #2 or Aogami #1 or #2 (but in return it is more brittle less durable and has a lesser edge retention despite having the same rockwell as the other steel-types).
How clean you can get the edge is what makes Shirogami #1 the perfect choice for an Omakase-style sushi restaurant.
However, not everyone will notice or appreciate the traits of a cleaner edge over the longer edge retention.
Due to the shift in speed and menu changes at the restaurant (westernizing sushi like adding fried chicken, beef in the rolls etc): I now Prefer Aogami over Shirogami steel but when I first started the Shirogami was the gold standard for the Japanese sushi chefs as I was told during my apprenticeship program. (however, durability is a concern and therefore the shift in the menu means a shift in core material, especially with the single bevel Yanagiba's). This was also one of the select few reasons we had a Deba to preserve the clean edge of the Shirogami White #1 since the pin bone on the fish can microchip the Yanagiba's. (but with the shift in prep work in the westernized Japanese cuisine I slowly replaced the steel-type and knife style for filleting).
Favorite less maintenance steel-type: R2/SG2
The best VG10 brand currently goes to Ryusen Hamono (very expensive and premium-priced but their VG10 is noticeable better).
I have no idea what they do to their VG10 heat treatment but their VG10 feels so much better in sharpness, re-sharpening, edge retention etc compared to other brands.
They told me that they use different added powders to get their VG10 the way it is now but they did not want to answer any other questions to keep their process a secret.
(They actually provided a workshop/showcase at one of the restaurants I worked in the Netherlands years back). It really is a lot different than the first few knives they offered with VG10, the only brand that offers VG10 that has improved their own earlier VG10 versions.
Potential new favorites: HAP40, ZDP189.