As an Appliance Repair Technician, I see this all the time in all brands. Although this video is correct, I have found that using cheaper soaps speed up this process significantly. People also use WAY to much soap and don't run the "clean washer cycle". When I pull these apart, I can see the soap just caked on everything. Anyone with a new HE washer should A) Use high quality soap, B) Use less than 2 tablespoons of soap for any amount of soil, clothing or water, and C) Use the clean washer cycle that came with the washer for this purpose.
Ian Warren so what do you recommend to maintain these front loaders ?..i am in the marker for samsungs model DV42H5200GW and WF42H5200AW and i just want this thing to last atleast 7 years as wife is busy with kids and warranty is $160 for both on 3 year coverage ...thanks
Read your owners manual, seriously. Use only a table spoon of soap in your wash, no matter how dirty the clothing is, and use the "clean washer" cycle monthly or as often as it says to do so in the manual. An extended warranty is great because a single repair call will cost you at least $120 without any work being completed depending on where you live. If you can get a 5 year extended warranty now, I would recommend it, the majority of the issues will happen after 2 years.
the only problem is you are pre-paying for the worst service experience of your life. When a company makes almost nothing on your job- you are guaranteed to be at the bottom of the list, after profitable out-of warrantee work of theirs.and will wait for parts- often two weeks.
The frame should be made out of high strength aluminum, or stainless steel. Even regular steel is a better choice. I have seen low end appliances from the 80s and 90s hold up better than Samsung.
Galvanic corrosion would occur most intensely at the point of contact between the dissimilar metals. That is where the two pieces are bolted together. Stainless steel is "stainless" because the chromium in it very quickly forms a dense non-reactive oxide on the surface. This characteristic makes it useful for coupling dissimilar metals such as copper and galvanized plumbing pipe together. Given where the corrosion has taken place, this appears to be a straight reaction between the detergents/bleaches used and the metal itself. Zinc, if that is the material of the bracket, is an amphoteric element and readily reacts with both acids and bases.
Eric T.: thx much for this info, it seems to make more sense that stainless wouldn't be responsible for an electro-galvanic reaction and perhaps just the soaps or water interaction w/b the cause
Yes this is why I cant use RUclips. I just fix shit. This wastes my time. strip it, get the part and hammer it back together. I agree, too much soap, it just rusted away. I now retired being a tech and rent storage units and trucks now. Mindless work that pays the bills.
Agreed. This has nothing to do with galvanic corrosion or different metals. 5 seconds online would have explained how that actually works, and he is off on every aspect of the reactions. Whatever he really did in the air force it's good he left, or planes would be dropping from the sky.
We have a washer from the 1980's. About 10 years ago the front loader craze was in full force. I went online and a post on a technician forum that said our washer was the best one ever made. So we sat out the front loader mania. So glad we did. I have learned to fix my washer now because of RUclips and I am putting quality parts and it hasn't broken for a few years now. Same with dryer.
PLEASE READ: Hi my American friends, I'm British, and I would like to give you guys some advice as we've had these type of washers/washing machines for a very long time now. Reading comments of this video with regards to looking after the appliance and watching what this guy has said, I agree 100% on both sides. Please read below: - The guy is right, the rod should be made of stainless steel. This will prevent corrosion from occurring. The corrosion is sure to detergent, water and heat. I have never ever seen anything like this! - I've noticed that many Americans are using too much detergent for a 'HE' (High Efficiency) washer. As given in the the name, these appliances are efficient (use less) water, energy, etc. You need to use less detergent and a 'HE' detergent. In the UK, we have instructions on how much to use on the pack. - Make sure you run hot/warm washes when washing durable items, like towel, bedding, etc. This will help preventing build up of detergent, scum, etc. Avoid cold washes; they do more harm than good. This is because the cold water doesn't dissolve the detergent correctly, causing build up and corrosion. - Run the machine empty on a hot wash/tub clean/self clean, etc. cycle. You will be shocked at how much suds you see. Don't add any detergent whilst doing this. Check with your manufacturer/repairman before doing the following: you can add Baking soda to get clean results. In the UK we also have washing machine cleaner, I'm not sure if this is available in the USA or not. - Finally, leave the door open and detergent drawer. This will help your machine dry and prevent detergent build up as well as mould, mildew, etc. Stay blessed everyone.
I am from Serbia,i am using self cleaning program every 1 month ,in Serbia we have washing machine cleaner it is expensive but it is very good.And for best results i use baking soda in evry wash,im adding about 10g-20g which i think its ok.
Of course they know this. What they don't realize is the power of social media. The bad press spreads throughout the entire "Samsung" brand...potentially costing tens of millions instead of a few material changes. Makes no sense whatsoever.
It started the late 1950's when it became less profitable to manufacture a quality product that lasted. Repair shops started profiting. Read the book "The Waste Makers" written in the late 1950's by Vance Packard. By the mid 1960's we were making poorly made products that were selling based on a "name only" reputation. Really no product made now is made to last. I personally have many "vintage" items that I repair and keep using. As I say that, I am forced to type this on a cheap "Made in China" computer that cost 2K and will only last perhaps three more years
I've owned 3 front loaders in the last 20 years, before that My parents had a top load Maytag made in the USA from the 50's we use that as a back up because it still works. Corporate Greed going unchecked...that's all this is.
Buy the simplest Miele. One without the extra features that can break down. Will last you for 20 years at least. It is tested and constructed to lay that long.
@HoldenVTCalais that's unfortunately believable. It seems that todays best quality was yesterdays worst. My Grandpas Eudora Mini, Made in Austria, is still going strong after almost 30 years without service.
@@paddybm3245 Miele has converted the spider arms on all models from aluminum to stainless steel since 2018. This is fortunately no longer a problem. Greetings from Germany
If you have one of these, I recommend leaving the door open, when not in use, to allow it to dry out as quickly as possible. Leaving the door shut, traps in humidity, which causes mold and mildew smells, as well as invite galvanization. (corrosion). I recommend that for ALL front loader machines. (I do like the direct drive motor, as opposed to a small motor and belt). What genius came up with that design? Dissimilar metals bolted together constitutes a shorted battery cell, a little soap to change the PH level makes a great electrolyte, to run down that shorted battery, thus, erosion of the electrodes. BRILLIANT!!!!
I have had the Samsung wf448aap/xaa washer for about 11 years. Never a problem, totally happy. Dryer coils went out on gas valve last week, easy cheap fix. Replaced the belt as old one was starting to fray. All good to go, I couldn't be happier.
Thanks for the video. I just got one of these from Lowe’s on clearance for 250 bucks. At that price, I am absolutely thrilled with it. But it’s good to be mentally prepared for it’s inevitable failure.
We bought a Miele washing machine and paid an arm and a leg for it. Twenty three years later, the amount we paid still sounds like a lot of money but it's working perfectly and looking like a real bargain.
It's actually a very simple repair, the parts are relatively inexpensive compared to purchasing a new washer. The rear drum support parts cost less than $250.00 and can be replaced in less than an hour if you're mechanically inclined. I got ten years of service out of my washer before having any issues and decided to do the repair instead of replacing the washer, It took just under an hour and over six months without a problem so far so I figure that was a good deal. But these washers now sell for about $800.00 on sale. So when you get right down to it, it's actually a very good product considering cost to reliability. Nothing lasts forever these days, and I highly doubt these or anything produced these days will ever become antiques.
I am no expert but a few points to consider before jumping to any conclusion - 1. Corrosion depends a lot on the quality of water and detergent used. No brand will or can guarantee absolutely no corrosion after 6-7 years of usage. 2. People using descaler regularly have seen improved life of their appliances. Not sure if you used any. 3. Sometimes different metals are used for other factors such as to manage weight and wear and tear caused due to friction. Which is obviously much worse. 4. Generally, appliances are designed by all the companies to last for at least their warranty period. Things are becoming more digital and less analog - more environment friendly too. People often discuss the longevity of the older appliances but not their energy ratings. For e.g take car or your refrigerator/air conditioner. They were much worse for the environment than the stuff today. 5. I don't think it's justified to defame a single brand without showing conclusive evidence that it's only this brand which is bad and rest are better. In this day and age of such fierce competition why would any brand risk such a huge loss of image for an easy fix? 6. The condition of your shaft and rotor looks like wear and tear beyond corrosion to be honest. The metal is practically eroded, which can happen only after intense caustic corrosion. Please share how you used the machine as well. 7. You get what you pay for - feel free to buy a machine which costs may be twice if not more of this one but lasts you over 10 years or buy something in your budget and simply replace it after 6-7 years of use. I think these many years of usage with a good energy rating appliance would have paid for itself by that time if you factor savings on electricity and water. I found your review highly biased.
I'm so glad I saw this video. I was just about to buy a Samsung washer dryer today. Changed my mind instantly. I'm going to buy Hotpoint to replace the original one. It's still going strong after over 10 years of using it daily. Just buying all new appliances because of new kitchen. Thanks for uploading.
This is why top-loading is superior, gravity naturally drains the water underneath the tub, whereas with front loading you will have issues with standing water, mildew, and door seals because the water will naturally want to stay in the bottom of the tub, there is residual water that cannot be completely drained out. There are a couple people I know who have issues with their front-loading washers: One of them leaks water slightly due to a poor door seal, the other one has a mildew odor inside that transfers to their clothes due to the residual water in the tub that doesn't get drained out. With top-loading you will not have these issues. Front loaders also cost more than top loaders, so I am not sure why anyone would want to buy one since they seem to be inferior.
Our HE top loaders (I've lived with both Whirlpool and Kenmore-which is a rebranded LG) don't get the top half of the load wet, so surely it's not getting clean either. I have a tub nearby, so I was filling the washer to cover all the clothes, but then I figured out I could cancel the wash halfway through it filling. Then the clothes weigh more, and that tricks the washer into filling the drum more, so all of the clothes get clean. It defeats the purpose of using a water saving washer, but at the end of the day, I want clean clothes. I will get a used top loader that is not HE once my current set wear out, they're not actually efficient if I want them to work properly anyway, and I'm tired of having to outsmart the "smart" appliances!!
All the manufacturers of front loaders do the very same thing. There is a video of a guy who was able to get the inner basket bracket( Spider Bracket) and he painted it with aircraft epoxy paint before installing it. He states that this will make the bracket impervious to the chemicals in the soap. The manufacturers have to know this, they just don’t want to put out the $.50-1.00 it would cost to make these machines last longer.
This is a problem for nearly every front loader. I own an appliance refurbishing company, so we see this on a daily basis. Samsung and GE tend to have worse spider arm durability than most other brands. I steer people toward LG and Whirlpool if they want a chance at 10+ years with proper maintenance and care. The verdict is still out on the newest machines, but I would expect to see more of the same, if not worse across the board.
I had a kenmore if the same year as this video and it was made by Samsung what a piece of garbage the spider went on it just like this one so we bought a new pair of direct drive front load maytags with 10 year parts and service warrantee at not extra charge that should do it 🤔🙃
LG makes their spider out of aluminum as well, but then they electrocoat it with corrosion resistive material. It really is a crappy part, and yet somehow still a hundred times more efficient than what their closest competitor is doing. The issue here is really the cost, the spider has to marry some diverse characteristics/properties, and alternatives to an aluminum material are prohibitively more expensive. TLDR : LG is the best here, but that's not saying much.
My Samsung front load washer is still working perfectly. It's now just over 7 years old. I attribute that to a few things. One, when I first got it I took it apart and set it up so it would use more water in the wash and rinse cycles. I believe that dilutes the soap better helping to prevent a buildup on the spider. Two, we usually do a hot or even "Sanitize" load at least once a week, helping to cut down on soap scum on the spider as well. Three, we always leave the door open when the washer is not in use mostly to make sure it doesn't smell. I also live in a very dry desert climate so I think that keeps corrosion down as well. As far as the clean cycle feature, I doubt I've done that over 12 times in the 7 years I've had the washer. I don't think this is as important as long as you occasionally do a hot load.
Probably won't make you feel any better but my Samsung front load just hit 10 years old and the spider crumbled just like this. I thought I was doing everything right as well. It was fine until one day it wasn't. Took about two hours to replace and now it's back as good as new. But really really frustrating that the spider is literally the deepest part on the machine and it's the most likely to fail. There is no reason this thing shouldn't have been made of a better material, or coated to prevent corrosion.
Thank you for this video. My local appliance store employees are not to bright. They told me no. I showed them this video. Walked out and went somewhere else to make my purchase.
Galvanic, Bi-Metallic or Dissimilar Metals corrosion. I used to have a chart that listed metals from Base to Nobel. What a design engineer SHOULD do is pick metals that are close to each other on the chart. Stainless was included in the chart though it is an alloy, it is very common and generally more noble than all base metals. I suspect that it is not by accident that Samsung chose these metals, the term, "planned obsolescence" comes to mind. If you want to sell more washers, you don't want them lasting forever. Six years is pretty short for a premium washer though. I would expect 15-20 years from a good washer with maybe 2-3 service events in that period.
I purchased a Samsung washer in 2012 and just had the same problem. Took out the drum and this is what it looked like. The medal holding the spindle was toast.
LG uses the same spider arm material and is no better than any other brand which uses the same design/material on such a critical part. I just did this exact repair on an LG washer I bought used. It was sold as "great condition" but it was anything but that. I'm happy to report that after a few hours of work and couple hundred dollars on various parts the unit is like new again. Anyone who tells you that LG is better than Samsung (or enter brand name here) is either a brand centric fanboy or earning kickbacks from said company. All these front load washers are equally made to be repaired/disposed after 10 years.
We had basically the same Samsung washer. Purchased it brand new and got the extended warranty. 3 days before the extended warranty expired, those arm let go during the spin cycle and the unit (for lack of better terms) basically exploded. It literally destroyed every component except for the main putter body, lid and front control panel. The repair guy was scooping parts out of it with a small hand shovel looking thing. It was $10 from being a "total loss" and they ended up fixing it. $890 repair order, that we fortunately didn't have to pay for. The unit had other issues through out its life as well as the dryer. We ended up saying screw it and sold them both with in perfect functional order before something else happened and bought new whirlpool United. We now stay clear of all Samsung products.
The "spider" (drum support) should be made of stainless steel, not an aluminium alloy. The washing detergent attacks the alloy. Most washing machines are now crap.
Robert Jangda youvsre coyrrectvitvUsva scnm, but unfortunately the US brand compwies srebinnthebgsnebrightbeithbthej yhrbosrtybright along with them as I point out in my comment above, GE, FRIGIDSURE,ECTROLUX ARE BSLL THE VERY SAME LOUSY DESIGN AND BSLL PSRTSRCHANGABKE BETWEEN ALL OFTHEM. GE'; HAVE THE Same blousy sunc basketbspiderblas the Samsung's t my frigidsirrebhhsdnynhsdbthebdrumndirlll and may not everrbbrcsuse the door btokre off completely in less than two years of use. In attempting to repair it I found the the hi which carrys the heavy weightvof the diorwas very thin and brittle the part itself was nicely made and fit perfectly I bought a replacement part, which was alsold sd the correct replacement for GE, ELECTROLUX and other eregsrded American branded mschines either lrgscybreputuonnsnsnsbdlnmsschinesbwhichblererknoenbntoslmotneithboiluntexctptionntgivebdecsdesbofbttoublrbfreehichbleoulfolidlidhe r
My LG WM2501HVA just did the same thing!! It destroyed the door seal when mine came apart. The unit was smoking from the friction of the rubber chunks pinned between the drum. When replacing the seal I rotated the drum,and felt the looseness,and the drum clanking around...I dismantled the entire wash machine expecting to find bad bearings,and found this exact problem only completely broken loose all all 3 corners. The washer has been out of warranty for only a year! Found a replacement part for $65 on eBay,but between that,$25 for bearings&rear seal,$7 for the drum seal,and $50 for the door seal not to mention the coin opp laundry expenses I’m not a happy camper for something that shouldn’t be a wearable part...still need to replace the 3 shocks inside,since they all fell apart just dismantling the machine!! The real bad news is most of the parts in my LG cross with whirlpool,Frigidaire,and..Samsung. Yep,...they’re all made by the same Korean factories using the same parts!
Glad I hadn't gotten rid of my Maytag Neptune washer and dryer yet. Mine blew after a week of use after getting it used from a client. After selling their house the new buyers didn't want those units. Loved the capacity of the Samsung but it looks like it will be back to 3-4 loads a day on the 15-year-old Neptunes. Thanks, Philip, for the video. I wish I had known about this issue beforehand. luckily no money invested from my side. Cheers..From Canada.
FYI. I have this same washer about 7 year, which was operating fine. After watching your video, I decided to be proactive and replace the "spyder" before it fails. I found a couple of good videos which gave step by step on how to replace. Parts were easy to find online and cost under $200 (i did not need a door seal, since had been replaced prior). OK, this was not a simple project and would not reccommend doing only if you are very secure in your mechanical abilities. plus have a whole day to devote. During removal, yes indeed, I found that the spyder was deteriorated, but also found there was a significant amount of black mold trapped inside. Now I understand why I have a constant issue with moldy smell in clothes, no matter what method I used to eliviate. Definitely a poor design which I guess they must be are aware of. My moral here is, if you are having an ongoing odor problem, it could easily be part this same poorly designed component. I wouldn't invest any in repair(as I did) and just getting a whole new machine. Unless they have changed the design, I would never get another Samsung washer. They should stick to making phones. (oh yeh that was an issue too:-)
can you TREAT the part while its out to stop the corrosion? epoxy coating or something to increase longenvity? and maybe put some zink's in their to slow the progress?
I just replaced the spider bracket in my wife's Samsung washing machine. It looked about as bad as the one in this video. It appears what happens is that soap scum builds up on the spider bracket and traps moisture against the metal causing it to corrode. Once the steel drive shaft starts to come loose from the main part of the spider bracket the drum will spin off balance. Once it gets bad enough the vibration sensor will shut off the machine and you will get a fault code on the display.
Your wife's Samsung machine? Really? I guess you do your laundry at a laundromat, right? Is the vacuum hers, and the dishwasher, also? Or did youi decide to move in with her and become domestically incapable?
I thought stainless steel was invented so as to prevent such corrosion problems? Why are our eating utensils made of stainless steel, just our costly appliances are made of of junk that will soon fail?
It's called planned obsolesence. They want the thing to fail. Catastrophically. That way you'll go out and buy a new, even shittier one. Electrolysis is what you see, the effect similar to that used in electric batteries.
actually they never want it to fail "Catastrophically". They want it to fail on simple components that either most people won't open up to replace or they 'pot' it encasing it to you can't replace a single part or get into it. but most of the time on mostly mechanical (rather than electrical) things they have a mechanical failure something they could've easily caught in engineering the product but didn't to induce failure i.e. using a cheap part. Anyways i'm sure you knew all this, my main point was they want it to fail simply, not catastrophically because a catastrophic failure could either hurt someone, ruin costumer's other property, ruin a costumer's image of the brand ect.... they'll let a simple part fail that they could've used other means when producing to have the same desired effect with longer life but didn't. and simply bet on the consumers buying new instead of taking a look inside the machine and repairing it themselves. they can do this because years of training the consumers to simply buy new.
Just repaired my samsung broken after 15 years of use. I ignored the increased shaking started couple of years ago, the broken shock absorbers lead to breaking the spider axle. I replaced the said 3 parts and now it runs again like new. The shock absorbers take a beating and have a limited service life. If your machine breaks down because of run down shock absorbers does not mean planned obsolescence.
Nice job of explaining electrolysis and how the machine will eat the spindle strength member. (Major structural failure, due to corrosion). This is like what happened to the statue of Liberty and why she had to be rebuilt, her skin, dissimilar metals, leading to corrosion due to electrolysis. Also the large stator motor may have contributed to excellerating this corrosion due to free electrons in the field proximity. Nice video and thanks for sharing and your contribution to this problem leading towarrds a resolution. . Lastly, I want to take the time to Thank you for your service in the past and your continued service.. I am not sure what is wrong with my machine yet, but this knowledge I am happy to have as I push forward with my troubleshooting. Thanks. .appreciate it.
We paid $1,400 for our Samsung front load washer less than 7 years ago. We had the same exact problem. The repair person said it would cost $900 to repair, and to go buy another machine. He didn't show me this scenario, but he described exactly this problem. I'm shocked that a reputable company like Samsung would keep manufacturing a product that is doomed to fail. (I suppose that it is "planned obsolescence".) Our repair person said they will typically last no more than 7 years (just like ours).
Samsung's problem go beyond washers and dryers. i have a matching set of washer and dryer. the dryer first ruptured the drum at the seam, next the washer spider disintegrated. my Samsung refrigerator freezer ice maker has been replaced 3 times and has failed again. i don't trust their appliances anymore. they should have stuck to electronics,
all manufacturers have this problem it's not limited to just Samsung it is also a Whirlpool an LG and Maytag and Electrolux and GE they all have the same stuff and I know because I do appliance repair this also happens because of the Soaps and bleach for hard water the mineral content I find that people in the country Orwell's 10 to ruin the bearings much quicker than in the city due to the high mineral content of the water
Jerry Boben so what do you recommend to maintain these front loaders ?..i am in the marker for samsungs model DV42H5200GW and WF42H5200AW and i just want this thing to last atleast 7 years as wife is busy with kids and warranty is $160 for both on 3 year coverage ...thanks
I repair also. Did factory svc for Lucky Goldstar a long time ago. The reason is: they are cheapskate bastards. We are fools to give our appliance market to the Koreans. LG or Samsumg- they don't care if we live or die- just don't call then when something breaks, it's always your fault.
the only problem is you are pre-paying for the worst service experience of your life. When a company makes almost nothing on your job- you are guaranteed to be at the bottom of the list, after profitable out-of warrantee work of theirs.and will wait for parts- often two weeks.
I wish I watched this video before I purchased my used set. Thank you for the information and video. Samsung needs to fix this issue, these machines aren't cheap!
Great information I was buying a washer today and was looking at a Samsung... I feel like I dodged a bullet. Plus the part is between $200-$300 on Amazon and a nightmare to change. Yes you are right two different types of metals equals no good. THANKS
Yes, it can be prevented. remember to decrease soap based on your HE unit. the water has decreased so 2 tablespoons of he detergent will allow your clothes to scrub each other and allow the water to rinse the soap free when finished! also if using pods only use them in hot wash cycs using only cold may not allow them to dissolve in time!!
This problem doesn't only occur on Samsungs...It occurs on Bosch, Siemens, LG, Electrolux, Zanussi, Hotpoint, Indesit, Whirlpool...they all use these materials on their spiders these days which corrodes. Miele & Asko are the only washing machine manufacturers which put steel spiders on their drums!
I have repaired large commercial washers for 30 years. My house has a 2004 whirlpool duet pair. Still running great. no bearing problems. I have seen this problem on small washers mostly ones built overseas.
Because of this video I’ve left my washer and dishwasher open to dry after every use. My wife convinced me to use vinegar rather than liquid fabric softener. We use dryer sheets and leave the appliances to air out. Thousands of dollars in appliances invested, we want them to last
@@CL4SSiCS How do you know it cleans out everything perfectly? Sorry I'm just an 18 year old kid I just bought my parents a washer/dryer pair since it was on Sale on black friday and I'm just now hearing about the horror stories associated with Samsung. I'd appreciate any advice, just trying to do my research so I can prolong this washer
@@Percules0001 I can't offer advice on prolonging the lifespan of a washer and dryer. I can only tip my hat to an 18-year-old "kid" who buys his parents a washer and dryer. To begin searching for solutions to potential problems? That is far more adult than this geezer. Your parents should be proud.
Front load washers have been made like that since they firt came out if you read the user manual and use the proper amount of detergent and softner in the correct consistency (water consistency) you wouldn't have this issue so quickly that blueish taint is the gunk that gets caused by the detergent and softner that didnt break down with the HE models because of the water efficiency feature.. that gunk builds up and eats away at the cast iron spider the hard water doesnt help the situation. Look at the dispenser housing and check out all the residue from using too much softner and detergent. Other machines didnt have this issue so quickly because they were programmed to fill with more water which would help break down the softner and detergent and drain it so it wouldnt build up like this.
@@demonreamer12 ofcourse it is and i bet you this guy never did the self clean probably never even noticed the self clean cycle selector hes bashing samsung when its clearly his fault. 11 year tech here by the way
the term you want to reference is Galvanic corrosion or Bimetallic Corrosion. he is describing it exactly right. but I don't think that is whats happening. I think that is aluminum.
He has broadly described the issue, but his terms are way off. "Stronger metal" is wrong, it has nothing to do with strength. Google Galvanic Chart - gold is at one end, zinc at the other. You are also correct, it is quite clearly aluminium in the rear bracing, which is causing the protective aluminium oxide layer to get attacked. What is especially bad is having a large quantity of cathode (passivated stainless) in contact with a small amount of anode (aluminium oxide).
what ever galvanic corrosion is called on Aluminium.... when you look at the failed hub it's obviously cheap junk - I wouldn't be surprised to find the replacement made of straight plastic like the gearbox in a Whirlpool washer!
I had the misfortune of owning one of these Samsung front loaders and I replaced the spider bracket the first time it broke. The washer was noisy and never ran quite the same even thought I put it back together carefully. Later I found out that the balancing ring was stuck thus causing it to be off balance. With that, at about 18 months it broke again. I pulled out my two old Maytags that had been in storage for over 20 years and hooked up the washer and dryer. Both worked flawlessly and clean better than ever. We are still using our old set 4 years later. No more front loaders and NO MORE SAMSUNG appliances. Our first spider broke at 5 years of use.
I guess I'll be the voice of opposition. I've owned 2 sets of high-end Samsung front loader washers and dryers. First set 6 years not a single issue, sold them with my previous residence. Second set is coming up on 7 years, again not a single issue. Now would I buy a front loader again in general, no as the new top loaders are way more efficient now and IMO, seem to do and probably have always done, a better job at cleaning larger loads.
It is the norm in the UK for washing machines to have an aluminium spider and stainless steel drum. I just replaced the bearings in my 10 year old Zanussi and the aluminium spider was not corroded at all. I live in a very hard water area, which I'd guess is the major difference, the staining on the exterior of your stainless steel drum and the grime on your tub make me wonder if your tap water is mildly acidic, or if you had been using liquid detergent or pods instead of a washing powder containing oxygen bleach, which kills mould and keeps the machine clean as well as removing stains from clothing. Washing liquids also tend to leave residue coating the insides which retains moisture, promoting mould growth, but I guess it could also facilitate electrolytic corrosion even while the machine is not in use. It is also quite common here for plastic tubs to be welded instead of bolted together, especially on the cheaper machines, and sometimes the spider is riveted to the drum, at least your Samsung wasn't. I believe detecting if the load is out of balance is usually done by monitoring the back emf from the motor.
They're all like that.. Kenmore, Samsung, LG ETC ETC... I Just got done fixing our Kenmore Elite (same as LG), the support bracket was corroded to the point of it breaking on all 3 legs... it's poorly cast aluminum too. I replaced both bearings and the support bracket. When I got the new bracket.. I cleaned it real good, picked up a can of plasti-dip and coated it with about 5 - 6 coats (except for the shaft of course), making sure to get all crevices and holes coated, and inside of bolt holes coated. Hopefully this will help it last longer...
I just had this aswell. the 24 month warranty expired 6 months ago and I cant even use the washer anymore due to there being a leak. Samsung was going to charge me 200 dollars to fix it, for a machine that costed 600.
This is called A SPIDER ARM AND THE METAL IS aluminum/ All front load washer use aluminum spider arm to hold the drum. The soap is what eat the aluminum. Never Never fill the soap holder up to the fill line. 1 or 2 tablespoon of he soap only.
It's not the soap..As Phil mentioned, it's a result of corrosion from dis-similar metals in an electrolyte solution. Look up Galvanic Corrosion. The only way to fix this is to replace the aluminum (if that's what it is) with a metal with higher electrode potential, OR stick with stainless steel to match the drum. The other method would be to attach a sacrificial anode with lower electrode potential than the steel such as magnesium or zinc, and replace it regularly - See Cathodic Protection . Hope this helps!
Shaun Hammer no, it's from using to much soap through the years and not running a tub clean cycle every 40 loads with tub clean detergent. I'm a trained and certified appliance repair Technician and I see this all the time after about the 2 year mark.
Been using my Samsung front loader steam washer for over 6 years. Do at least 20 loads a week. We do have soft water system and am careful to not overload or use too much soap. No problems and machine does excellent job.
OK...I immediately knew when I saw the inner tub caked with funk that this machine was abused... when I say abused I'm talking they probably used cold water only...overloaded the machine, used too little or too much soap, probably didn't leave the door open to dry out...My Duet front load washer from 2005 has an aluminum spider and it's approaching 19 years old.... I can't say 100% but I'm willing to bet this happened because of user error... Just don't overload them, use occasionally hot water washes and leave the door slightly opened...I've never had mold or bad smells and I think this has kept my spider from deteriorating.
Same thing happened to us but they were kenmores made by Samsung so we bought 2 new fro t load maytags direct drive with 10 year parts and labour warrantee and we also bought the whirlpool stackable ventless ensemble for one of our rental units and they seem fine. It says made in Italy so hopefully that means that they are good
This is called Galvanic corrosion. The Mrs bought one of these Samsung sets--Washer and Dryer in about 2010 from a former major department store chain. The washer never spun the clothes enough to squeeze any water out of them and the washer took forever to finish a wash. We returned them a couple weeks later. The store gave us a hard time including a robocall every morning at 8am for weeks. Shortly after, we bought a Speed Queen set (Back to top loading) elsewhere which has been trouble free through 2020. We never shopped at "S" after that and now they closed almost all their nationwide stores in the US by 2019. Their troubled era was news for quite awhile. At one time, their own "K" brand was considered a leading appliance by many Americans. The bigger they are...the harder...
I'm so glad I held on to my old school regular washer. The thing is about 30 years old, washes clothes beautifully and actually fills all the way up with water! My daughter had one of the low water top load washers and the clothes didn't even get all the way wet sometimes because it wont use enough water. They have to keep buying a new one every few years because they break and the repairman says it's the same price to repair it as it is to buy a new one. Most people are not mechanically inclined to be able to rebuild it like in this video so she bought an old washer from a neighbor at a garage sale and the thing is in perfect condition and is built like a tank and has been going for years now. Sometimes the old ways are still the best ways.
Yeah mine , from 99 , just got opened up because the belt failed . No mess inside , no leak marks , bearings are pretty good . I have seen a comunist made automated washing machine still alive (but barely) in 2015 . These new appliances are a shame .
What would really have been interesting would have been a teardown of other machines so we could see how this part compares from brand to brand. The amount of corrosion would be a function of water quality more than the chosen metals in the machine. My guess is that this machine was used in a home with a water softener. Water softeners replace calcium/magnesium with salt which will accelerate corrosion. In my case, I bought a samsung washer in 2005 and it is still running today. Probably because it spent most of its life running on naturally soft water.
My Samsung front load washer has malfunctioned which is only six years old. I got it exchanged for a LG front load washer. Seems almost every Samsung FL washer has the same problem.
I had exact same problem recently. after watching a few youtube videos. I ordered a new "spider" for $122, a new ball bearing kit for $22. Clean the machine. Installed them on. Now my Samsung washer work like brand new. Easy fix
Sorry had the same machine 6 years and I took mine apart last night, tooks NOTHING like that, You clearly didn't run the cleaning programme or use it properly
Cant help but wonder why someone would take apart a perfectly good washer. It's a machine.. All mechanical machines break down from wear eventually from friction alone. No cleaning cycles is going to stop galvonic corrosion. He was 100% right in the fact they knowingly assembled metals that would cause galvonic corrosion. Planned obsolescence at its finest.
I wonder how much the cost difference would be to use stainless for the bracket vice whatever metal they used. I guess that is why some people things use to be made to last and not built to fail.
Well remember the GM ignition key module that killed people and caused car accidents .The cost to change the unit would have been .12 cents . I imagine this washer bracket would be maybe $15.00 to $20.00 more but the bean-counters won . Time to fire some bean-counters and hire some qualified engineers .
I used to work at a company that made electronic equipment. We had one engineer that used to walk around the office going "cheap, cheap, cheap...now it's so cheap, cheap, cheap it doesn't work anymore". Your analysis of this problem is absolutely correct. It's the main reason why I don't work as an engineer anymore. I got tired of having to work all night fixing these types of problems while the managers, accountants and stockholders were all at home in bed with their wives.
Sacrificial Anodes are highly active metals that are used to prevent a less active material surface from corroding. Sacrificial Anodes are created from a metal alloy with a more negative electrochemical potential than the other metal it will be used to protect. The sacrificial anode will be consumed in place of the metal it is protecting, which is why it is referred to as a "sacrificial" anode.
I would say stay away from Samsung wash machines/dryers in general. I bought brand new washer and dryer, both Samsung a little over a year ago. I have been disappointed with things not working correctly already. The load sensor in the washer and moisture sensor in the dryer are both glitchy with once to twice a week use.
Only Whirlpool and Whirlpool based Kenmore and others that are Whirlpool based that are Timer Switch Only Excluding Oasis/Calypso/Cabrio is all I will get. I was a Tech myself. The Belt driven "New World" Kenmore/Whirlpools and Whirlpool based models with the brown shift actuator without the spider drive block were good despite having rods (easy to swap gear case). I would definitely get a surge arrestor and a battery backup with ripple correction though due to the boards...
Kenmore is without a doubt one of the best. I have a 1200 watt microwave from 2010 and she’s been thru tons of moves including being in the back of my truck from az to pa 3 times.
I worked for GE for many years. I could write a book on the appliance issues alone. It's complicated and no way to explain it here. All I can say is do research before you buy anything. It may be that NO ONE is making the quality product you are looking for. There are reasons for that, and it's not just planned obsolescence. To put it simple, a great washer can be designed and built, but no one would buy it because it would not compete well in the marketplace. Sad, but not enough people will pay for quality to justify the companies designing and building products like that. Even if YOU are willing to pay extra, few people are. So the companies don't do it. For example, check out Heartland refrigerators. You pay a premium for those fridges, but not because they are actually better. They're not. What you are paying for is the design, style and appearance. They're beautiful, but inside there's nothing special.
Philip, thanks for the video, even if wiggling all OVER the place. As a guy who sells lots by video (eg- VHS tapes asent to customers all over 30 years ago), puh-leeez put your cell phone or camera on a tripod.... and keep it steady on EACH view. Also the "bracket" hodling the drum is called the "Spider Arm" Also- why not say "zinc alloy" instead of 'material' - so KNOW it can NOT be welded! You are right, it seems planned obsolecence! Anyway, thanks a lot. They could easily make this out of corrosion proof SS sheet, such as 404, if not 302 or 304 Stainless steel, just like the drum is. A $100,000 die to form the reinforcing grooves, ridges, and bending, may by amoritized over 100,000 machines. So add a $1 to the cost. We just paid a Samsung "Authorized repair" $150 for the ESTIMATE, quote being $500 to repair it!.
I have a Whirlpool Duet Front Load washer from 2008 with a similar problem. It looks like many of these appliances have identical parts and design. The metals are in a perfect environment to cause this corrosion. My washer has a ground wire bolted to the bearing housing to prevent the galvanic process, which helps, but does not prevent this entirely. Overloading or letting the machine run off-balance eventually breaks the legs of the spider. In my case, the drum continued to turn after the leg broke, which then allowed the stainless steel basket to rub and melt a groove in the plastic outer tub, opening a catastrophic leak. I learned 3 lessons: Keep a fairly light load. Beware of too much soap. Make absolutely certain to empty pockets. (coins between the basket and drum will work like a 3000 RPM can opener. One other note - these older machines were bad, but the new ones are much worse. Manufacturers now "weld" the 2 halves of the plastic outer drums together (vs. the flange clips or bolts used in the past) so you can't DIY change the bearings/seals anymore.
i work for an authorized Bosch repair shop, we repair Bosch, Siemens, Neff and Gaggenau products. Some later models we happen to repair for damaged drums fails exactly like in the video. Funny thing is that when these things gets discussed during training courses we've been instructed it's an accidental customer fault using aggressive products, and so we tell customers. This kind of stuff is so disgusting, i also do electronics as hobbist and i realized how much the authorized services are scammy. We are pretty much forced to replace expensive boards that could be repaired, sometimes DESIGNED to be repaired but you're not instructed to (and technically, not even allowed to) as they may simply have blown SMD fuses that you can replace...
Did they tell you to advise clients to use a real hotwash once in a while,like advised in operators manual,to washout unresolved detergents and softeners??sleeping in training?
Seems like all front loaders have one problem or another. I just did the tub bearings on a 10 year old Maytag, and while the bearing job wasn't too bad the outer tub had stress cracks that caused water leaks. They want $700 for that part so I went at it with my Dremel tool then filled up the cracks with JB weld. BTW, the bottom of the washer cabinet has no drain holes so that's VERY rusty from he water sitting there. We'll see if that steel lasts as long as my JB Weld repair in a few years!
rupe53 actually front load is better and more efficient most industrial washers are front load but they are stainless steel throughout so there is no corrosion
@@nightmareinaction629… and that's the main reason most people buy them. OTOH, considering they costs about twice that of a conventional top loader and last half as long before a major repair, one has to wonder if any $$ is actually saved. Anyone care to crunch those numbers over a 10 or 20 year lifespan? What I do know from actual testing is they do use less electricity, because they don't constantly change direction.
I've been told by numerous people to stay away from Samsung washers/dryers in general. They are junk and the customer service is a joke. On top of that, most of them are bought at big box stores like Lowe's, Home Depot, Best Buy, etc....and the guys that install them are not the best at installing them say compared to my local appliance store.
We bought a Samsung front loading washing machine in 2009 when we moved into our new house. We were a family of 5 (three sons) with a sixth person, my sister-in-law, living with us to make 6 people. Seven years later, in 2016, I replaced this part as it had disintegrated. The job wasn't fun, but with a few hand tools and RUclips I was able to replace it myself. This last year I had to replace it again which means that the part replaced in 2016 failed in about the same 7 year period. Some might consider this horrible, however, this is the ONLY problem that we've had with this washer, so we are not at all dissatisfied with it given the amount of use it gets. I should also point out that we have a well, with pretty hard water. Hope someone finds this helpful.
I have had this washer for 9 years. Always provide maintenance on the unit. It just started leaking last night. When I turned it on it's side I noticed what looked like a thin rock that had came through the plastic tub on the bottom. I thought maybe my kids had rocks in their pockets. This video explains what happened. The bracket started braking apart. The inner drum must have caught the metal piece and pushed it through the plastic tub. So the cause of my leaking washer is the bracket is following apart internally. Thanks for saving me the time and money of taking this apart and buying a new plastic tub. Any recommendations on another front load washer brand?
No its because of stupid people like the "doofus" that made this video. They insist on using way too much detergent. The same machine would have lasted 8 years or so (about the maximum life)
In response to the person who calls himself "broccolibeef", sorry to inform you but you're wrong in your analysis about using too much soap. in fact I've used under the amount that was suggested. As I pointed out in the video this type of damage is caused by corrosion. Corrosion happens when you have two dissimilar metals attached to one another. it's an electrolysis process whereby the anode attacks the cathode or vice versa (I can't remember which one is the strongest one). this reaction is accelerated through electrolytes and in this case soapy water. however the amount of soap in the water is not really factor here. has one person had pointed out earlier post that he sees this problem amongst people who have drilled Wells. this is an indication of a high mineral content which would accelerate the anode cathode process. of course this would depend the type of mineral in the water. as I pointed out in the video since the spider bracket which is most likely some type of zinc alloy product, was bolted to a stainless steel drum creates two very dissimilar metal reaction. and where corrosion would still happen to non-ferrous metals even if they were manufacturer of the same material the corrosion process would be much slower. however in this case the metals are so different the corrosion process it's much quicker. BTW my career field title in the Air Force was "Corrosion Control" But then I probably don't know what I'm talking about and somebody with a name like broccolibeef has a more intellectual insight into this type of problem.
I think the spider assembly is made of cast aluminum in most front loaders. You could replace it, but just getting to the spider is very labor intensive and not worth it. They make it out of cast aluminum because it costs less than stainless steel. It's called planned obsolescence.
Any Korean/ Chinese Brand will find such ways to do cost cuttings. That is one reason why Japanese and German products are usually costlier than these. Brands that I avoid: Samsung, LG(Both Korean) any Chinese Brand. Brands I trust: All Japanese Brands, Bosch, Siemens, Indesit, Braun, US Brands as well. This is my opinion, might not be right for everyone though.
Folks quite bickering about the cause! We had ours suffer exactly same fate. I was a professional sailor in US Navy. This is bi-metallic galvanic corrosion. It has nothing to do with using this or that soap, too much soap, water softener, wrong soap, blah blah blah! Google a picture of zinc anodes on a hull before they are replaced (entire anode corrodes not just contact points).....look exactly the same as these crappy cheap spider arms! There is current moving through that arm...stray current to ground, has dis-similar metal....you could run nothing but water through these machines and the spiders would corrode every time. The drum and spider should be the same material, period. I opted to throw the machine out to a recycler who did the repair and resold the machine. We went back in time and purchased a top load with direct drive. That was our longest running machine before the front loader at ~ 10+ years. Now we have a new one and despite some more noise on the drive, it washes WAY better than the front loader ever did. All the promise of saving money for less water and soap usage means nothing when the stupid machine is dead 4 years after purchase! Good riddance front loaders! BTW, there are a couple of brands from Europe that actually use steel spider, but they are hard to source and VERY expensive....
Mario D you are right about any type of water however certain types will corrode quicker. It's all about the electrolyte ability to move that current as stated earlier in the video. I did miss speak in the video, this is not a zinc alloy product but a cast aluminum product again bolted to stainless steel two very dissimilar metals
If the dissimilar metals was the problem, the corrosion would be at the metal interface. It is not, therefore the corrosion is chemical in nature, not electrolytic
The aluminum is just plain incompatible with the service. It is known to corrode rapidly in hot alkaline water, and all laundry detergents are alkaline. The cleaning pucks contain percarbonate and sodium carbonate so they are strongly alkaline and oxidizing, as is regular hypochlorite bleach. The part seems to fail at a stressed location- the joint between the arm and the round portion of the casting where the shaft attaches. While a galvanic driving force definitely exists and likely doesn't help, I'm pretty confident that even if you were to electrically isolate the drum from the arm, the spider arm would still corrode freely.
Funny, my front-loader is 15 years old and still working without a single repair needed except me personally opening it up to wash away the gunk accumulated by washing detergents in the thin inlet tube and once realigning the belt since it fell off. Learn to buy good washing machines or learn to pay the idiot tax.
This is an informative video. I had one of these Samsung washers. It had a balance issue where the washer made loud banging sounds as it walked across my laundry room. Samsung sent a rep to resolve the problem. He made a few visits to figure out the problem to no avail. The retailer took both W&D back. How could Samsung engineers NOT know about dissimilar metals that create corrosion? Btw, It’s made in China.
For many reasons I'm done with high priced washers! I just bought a $400 Amana HE top load and couldnt be happier, it washes the clothes better than my last 2 " high quality " washers that both lasted under 3 years.
@@sidneyducote7329 That's a 20 dollar belt , no ? My budget 99 indesit just breaked it's belt in 2021 (that's why i'm on ytb watching washing machines being dismantled ). It's still good inside , no leaks , no bad bearings , 30 years of weekly service . I have seen a communist made machine surviving 30 years , in a sorrow shape but functional . These new devices are a shame .
My Samsung front loader just started smoking on the spin cycle, I mean serious rubber smelling smoke. Undoubtedly the spider bracket shown in this video gave way and the unit is rubbing against the rubber seals. Won't buy another.
Totally agree never had an issue with our one, best machine we ever owned and even when it dies in years to come will just go and buy another Samsung one
Excellent description of the intentional use of dissimilar metals. As I recall in the 1980's this EXACT problem caused the engine to fall off a DC 10 airliner in Chicago killing all and some one the ground. This should be a recall!
Sure there's a galvanic process that takes place, but just like in electrical installations you're likely not going to see conductors and terminations completely eaten away beyond the actual splice points when dissimilar metals are used without any anti-oxidation products. If it's all cruddy looking then IDK what that's from. If the frames start to wiggle from the fasteners then that seems like the result of the galvanic reaction going too far.
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As an Appliance Repair Technician, I see this all the time in all brands. Although this video is correct, I have found that using cheaper soaps speed up this process significantly. People also use WAY to much soap and don't run the "clean washer cycle". When I pull these apart, I can see the soap just caked on everything. Anyone with a new HE washer should A) Use high quality soap, B) Use less than 2 tablespoons of soap for any amount of soil, clothing or water, and C) Use the clean washer cycle that came with the washer for this purpose.
Ian Warren
so what do you recommend to maintain these front loaders ?..i am in the marker for samsungs model DV42H5200GW and WF42H5200AW and i just want this thing to last atleast 7 years as wife is busy with kids and warranty is $160 for both on 3 year coverage ...thanks
Read your owners manual, seriously. Use only a table spoon of soap in your wash, no matter how dirty the clothing is, and use the "clean washer" cycle monthly or as often as it says to do so in the manual. An extended warranty is great because a single repair call will cost you at least $120 without any work being completed depending on where you live. If you can get a 5 year extended warranty now, I would recommend it, the majority of the issues will happen after 2 years.
the only problem is you are pre-paying for the worst service experience of your life. When a company makes almost nothing on your job- you are guaranteed to be at the bottom of the list, after profitable out-of warrantee work of theirs.and will wait for parts- often two weeks.
That is true about the repairman ,you have a 3 party who makes money on not paying out money .
Good advice. BTW the latest Samsung machines tell you when it is time to run a clean cycle on the display
Zinc frame, steel housing, soapy water electrolyte: it's a battery.
Samsung invented a new products: Washing Machine Battery 😂
The frame should be made out of high strength aluminum, or stainless steel. Even regular steel is a better choice. I have seen low end appliances from the 80s and 90s hold up better than Samsung.
@@davidperry4013 same reason top-load washers last longer
Galvanic corrosion would occur most intensely at the point of contact between the dissimilar metals. That is where the two pieces are bolted together. Stainless steel is "stainless" because the chromium in it very quickly forms a dense non-reactive oxide on the surface. This characteristic makes it useful for coupling dissimilar metals such as copper and galvanized plumbing pipe together. Given where the corrosion has taken place, this appears to be a straight reaction between the detergents/bleaches used and the metal itself. Zinc, if that is the material of the bracket, is an amphoteric element and readily reacts with both acids and bases.
Eric T.: thx much for this info, it seems to make more sense that stainless wouldn't be responsible for an electro-galvanic reaction and perhaps just the soaps or water interaction w/b the cause
And then there’s the time I saw stainless steel corrode but that’s another story
Yes this is why I cant use RUclips. I just fix shit. This wastes my time. strip it, get the part and hammer it back together. I agree, too much soap, it just rusted away. I now retired being a tech and rent storage units and trucks now. Mindless work that pays the bills.
Kitchen Aide had this problem with their attachments to their mixers. They powder coat them now, problem solved.
Agreed. This has nothing to do with galvanic corrosion or different metals. 5 seconds online would have explained how that actually works, and he is off on every aspect of the reactions. Whatever he really did in the air force it's good he left, or planes would be dropping from the sky.
We have a washer from the 1980's. About 10 years ago the front loader craze was in full force. I went online and a post on a technician forum that said our washer was the best one ever made. So we sat out the front loader mania. So glad we did. I have learned to fix my washer now because of RUclips and I am putting quality parts and it hasn't broken for a few years now. Same with dryer.
How?
PLEASE READ:
Hi my American friends, I'm British, and I would like to give you guys some advice as we've had these type of washers/washing machines for a very long time now. Reading comments of this video with regards to looking after the appliance and watching what this guy has said, I agree 100% on both sides. Please read below:
- The guy is right, the rod should be made of stainless steel. This will prevent corrosion from occurring. The corrosion is sure to detergent, water and heat. I have never ever seen anything like this!
- I've noticed that many Americans are using too much detergent for a 'HE' (High Efficiency) washer. As given in the the name, these appliances are efficient (use less) water, energy, etc. You need to use less detergent and a 'HE' detergent. In the UK, we have instructions on how much to use on the pack.
- Make sure you run hot/warm washes when washing durable items, like towel, bedding, etc. This will help preventing build up of detergent, scum, etc. Avoid cold washes; they do more harm than good. This is because the cold water doesn't dissolve the detergent correctly, causing build up and corrosion.
- Run the machine empty on a hot wash/tub clean/self clean, etc. cycle. You will be shocked at how much suds you see. Don't add any detergent whilst doing this. Check with your manufacturer/repairman before doing the following: you can add Baking soda to get clean results. In the UK we also have washing machine cleaner, I'm not sure if this is available in the USA or not.
- Finally, leave the door open and detergent drawer. This will help your machine dry and prevent detergent build up as well as mould, mildew, etc. Stay blessed everyone.
I am from Serbia,i am using self cleaning program every 1 month ,in Serbia we have washing machine cleaner it is expensive but it is very good.And for best results i use baking soda in evry wash,im adding about 10g-20g which i think its ok.
I'm am from Mexico but live in the USA, yes you are correct UnitedStadians here use a shit load of soap.
Thanks for the tips!
COPLETLE RIGTH.
@@marjanoviccc which washing machine cleaner do you get in Serbia?
@@johndoe-vc1we Calgon tablets! Still use them after 2 years! Washer still works 😅
Looks like planned obsolescence to me. They knew exactly what they were doing.
touche': don't patronize such a company
Exactly and cheap "Asian" made junk...
Sure they knew,
Of course they know this. What they don't realize is the power of social media. The bad press spreads throughout the entire "Samsung" brand...potentially costing tens of millions instead of a few material changes. Makes no sense whatsoever.
It started the late 1950's when it became less profitable to manufacture a quality product that lasted. Repair shops started profiting. Read the book "The Waste Makers" written in the late 1950's by Vance Packard. By the mid 1960's we were making poorly made products that were selling based on a "name only" reputation. Really no product made now is made to last. I personally have many "vintage" items that I repair and keep using. As I say that, I am forced to type this on a cheap "Made in China" computer that cost 2K and will only last perhaps three more years
I've owned 3 front loaders in the last 20 years, before that My parents had a top load Maytag made in the USA from the 50's we use that as a back up because it still works. Corporate Greed going unchecked...that's all this is.
Buy the simplest Miele. One without the extra features that can break down. Will last you for 20 years at least. It is tested and constructed to lay that long.
@HoldenVTCalais that's unfortunately believable. It seems that todays best quality was yesterdays worst. My Grandpas Eudora Mini, Made in Austria, is still going strong after almost 30 years without service.
@@paddybm3245 Miele has converted the spider arms on all models from aluminum to stainless steel since 2018. This is fortunately no longer a problem. Greetings from Germany
Car mac 1.on RUclips appliance repair and Flipping 👍🇨🇦
If you have one of these, I recommend leaving the door open, when not in use, to allow it to dry out as quickly as possible. Leaving the door shut, traps in humidity, which causes mold and mildew smells, as well as invite galvanization. (corrosion). I recommend that for ALL front loader machines. (I do like the direct drive motor, as opposed to a small motor and belt). What genius came up with that design? Dissimilar metals bolted together constitutes a shorted battery cell, a little soap to change the PH level makes a great electrolyte, to run down that shorted battery, thus, erosion of the electrodes. BRILLIANT!!!!
Pretty common sense I'd say to leave it open. Also use vinegar to clean.
Still, this doesn’t excuse Samsung cutting corners on quality. They still need to make their washing machines with better materials
@@bazil4146 i dont think something less than a platinum would withstand 3 years of constant electrolysis, lol
@@megimargareth4015 Maybe use stainless steel instead of zinc for the housing unit like the rest of the drum. That will be a start
@@bazil4146 yeah that would work too, but samsung decide to step backwards and return to pulley system
I have had the Samsung wf448aap/xaa washer for about 11 years. Never a problem, totally happy. Dryer coils went out on gas valve last week, easy cheap fix. Replaced the belt as old one was starting to fray. All good to go, I couldn't be happier.
Lasts just long enough for the warranty to run up.
Thanks for the video. I just got one of these from Lowe’s on clearance for 250 bucks. At that price, I am absolutely thrilled with it. But it’s good to be mentally prepared for it’s inevitable failure.
Does it still work?
We bought a Miele washing machine and paid an arm and a leg for it. Twenty three years later, the amount we paid still sounds like a lot of money but it's working perfectly and looking like a real bargain.
It's actually a very simple repair, the parts are relatively inexpensive compared to purchasing a new washer. The rear drum support parts cost less than $250.00 and can be replaced in less than an hour if you're mechanically inclined. I got ten years of service out of my washer before having any issues and decided to do the repair instead of replacing the washer, It took just under an hour and over six months without a problem so far so I figure that was a good deal. But these washers now sell for about $800.00 on sale. So when you get right down to it, it's actually a very good product considering cost to reliability. Nothing lasts forever these days, and I highly doubt these or anything produced these days will ever become antiques.
I am no expert but a few points to consider before jumping to any conclusion -
1. Corrosion depends a lot on the quality of water and detergent used. No brand will or can guarantee absolutely no corrosion after 6-7 years of usage.
2. People using descaler regularly have seen improved life of their appliances. Not sure if you used any.
3. Sometimes different metals are used for other factors such as to manage weight and wear and tear caused due to friction. Which is obviously much worse.
4. Generally, appliances are designed by all the companies to last for at least their warranty period. Things are becoming more digital and less analog - more environment friendly too. People often discuss the longevity of the older appliances but not their energy ratings. For e.g take car or your refrigerator/air conditioner. They were much worse for the environment than the stuff today.
5. I don't think it's justified to defame a single brand without showing conclusive evidence that it's only this brand which is bad and rest are better. In this day and age of such fierce competition why would any brand risk such a huge loss of image for an easy fix?
6. The condition of your shaft and rotor looks like wear and tear beyond corrosion to be honest. The metal is practically eroded, which can happen only after intense caustic corrosion. Please share how you used the machine as well.
7. You get what you pay for - feel free to buy a machine which costs may be twice if not more of this one but lasts you over 10 years or buy something in your budget and simply replace it after 6-7 years of use. I think these many years of usage with a good energy rating appliance would have paid for itself by that time if you factor savings on electricity and water.
I found your review highly biased.
I'm so glad I saw this video. I was just about to buy a Samsung washer dryer today. Changed my mind instantly. I'm going to buy Hotpoint to replace the original one. It's still going strong after over 10 years of using it daily. Just buying all new appliances because of new kitchen. Thanks for uploading.
This is why top-loading is superior, gravity naturally drains the water underneath the tub, whereas with front loading you will have issues with standing water, mildew, and door seals because the water will naturally want to stay in the bottom of the tub, there is residual water that cannot be completely drained out.
There are a couple people I know who have issues with their front-loading washers: One of them leaks water slightly due to a poor door seal, the other one has a mildew odor inside that transfers to their clothes due to the residual water in the tub that doesn't get drained out. With top-loading you will not have these issues.
Front loaders also cost more than top loaders, so I am not sure why anyone would want to buy one since they seem to be inferior.
Our HE top loaders (I've lived with both Whirlpool and Kenmore-which is a rebranded LG) don't get the top half of the load wet, so surely it's not getting clean either. I have a tub nearby, so I was filling the washer to cover all the clothes, but then I figured out I could cancel the wash halfway through it filling. Then the clothes weigh more, and that tricks the washer into filling the drum more, so all of the clothes get clean. It defeats the purpose of using a water saving washer, but at the end of the day, I want clean clothes. I will get a used top loader that is not HE once my current set wear out, they're not actually efficient if I want them to work properly anyway, and I'm tired of having to outsmart the "smart" appliances!!
Single tube top loader wash less clean than 2 tube toploader, let alone frontload or hand wash
Thats the reason
All the manufacturers of front loaders do the very same thing. There is a video of a guy who was able to get the inner basket bracket( Spider Bracket) and he painted it with aircraft epoxy paint before installing it. He states that this will make the bracket impervious to the chemicals in the soap. The manufacturers have to know this, they just don’t want to put out the $.50-1.00 it would cost to make these machines last longer.
This is a problem for nearly every front loader. I own an appliance refurbishing company, so we see this on a daily basis. Samsung and GE tend to have worse spider arm durability than most other brands. I steer people toward LG and Whirlpool if they want a chance at 10+ years with proper maintenance and care. The verdict is still out on the newest machines, but I would expect to see more of the same, if not worse across the board.
What about Speed Queen?
I had a kenmore if the same year as this video and it was made by Samsung what a piece of garbage the spider went on it just like this one so we bought a new pair of direct drive front load maytags with 10 year parts and service warrantee at not extra charge that should do it 🤔🙃
@@legacyturbo8485 One problem, Whirlpool bought Maytag. The good Maytags no longer exist.
LG makes their spider out of aluminum as well, but then they electrocoat it with corrosion resistive material. It really is a crappy part, and yet somehow still a hundred times more efficient than what their closest competitor is doing. The issue here is really the cost, the spider has to marry some diverse characteristics/properties, and alternatives to an aluminum material are prohibitively more expensive.
TLDR : LG is the best here, but that's not saying much.
Check out SPEED QUEEN.
My Samsung front load washer is still working perfectly. It's now just over 7 years old. I attribute that to a few things. One, when I first got it I took it apart and set it up so it would use more water in the wash and rinse cycles. I believe that dilutes the soap better helping to prevent a buildup on the spider. Two, we usually do a hot or even "Sanitize" load at least once a week, helping to cut down on soap scum on the spider as well. Three, we always leave the door open when the washer is not in use mostly to make sure it doesn't smell.
I also live in a very dry desert climate so I think that keeps corrosion down as well. As far as the clean cycle feature, I doubt I've done that over 12 times in the 7 years I've had the washer. I don't think this is as important as long as you occasionally do a hot load.
How was you able to setup so it will you use more water??
Probably won't make you feel any better but my Samsung front load just hit 10 years old and the spider crumbled just like this. I thought I was doing everything right as well. It was fine until one day it wasn't.
Took about two hours to replace and now it's back as good as new.
But really really frustrating that the spider is literally the deepest part on the machine and it's the most likely to fail. There is no reason this thing shouldn't have been made of a better material, or coated to prevent corrosion.
Thank you for this video. My local appliance store employees are not to bright. They told me no. I showed them this video. Walked out and went somewhere else to make my purchase.
Galvanic, Bi-Metallic or Dissimilar Metals corrosion. I used to have a chart that listed metals from Base to Nobel. What a design engineer SHOULD do is pick metals that are close to each other on the chart. Stainless was included in the chart though it is an alloy, it is very common and generally more noble than all base metals.
I suspect that it is not by accident that Samsung chose these metals, the term, "planned obsolescence" comes to mind. If you want to sell more washers, you don't want them lasting forever. Six years is pretty short for a premium washer though. I would expect 15-20 years from a good washer with maybe 2-3 service events in that period.
i bought mine back in 2011 and it still works well today.
I purchased a Samsung washer in 2012 and just had the same problem. Took out the drum and this is what it looked like. The medal holding the spindle was toast.
Steve Smith what metal
JUNK!!
Was it a front load as well?
Good luck finding the part, they are bulky, almost never in stock, and always carry a lead time. can you say "super size charge"?
@ Wes Lou No shit! These people with their unbelievable grammar and spelling. OMG, it hurts my brain.
LG uses the same spider arm material and is no better than any other brand which uses the same design/material on such a critical part.
I just did this exact repair on an LG washer I bought used. It was sold as "great condition" but it was anything but that.
I'm happy to report that after a few hours of work and couple hundred dollars on various parts the unit is like new again.
Anyone who tells you that LG is better than Samsung (or enter brand name here) is either a brand centric fanboy or earning kickbacks from said company. All these front load washers are equally made to be repaired/disposed after 10 years.
We had basically the same Samsung washer. Purchased it brand new and got the extended warranty. 3 days before the extended warranty expired, those arm let go during the spin cycle and the unit (for lack of better terms) basically exploded. It literally destroyed every component except for the main putter body, lid and front control panel. The repair guy was scooping parts out of it with a small hand shovel looking thing. It was $10 from being a "total loss" and they ended up fixing it. $890 repair order, that we fortunately didn't have to pay for. The unit had other issues through out its life as well as the dryer. We ended up saying screw it and sold them both with in perfect functional order before something else happened and bought new whirlpool United. We now stay clear of all Samsung products.
The "spider" (drum support) should be made of stainless steel, not an aluminium alloy.
The washing detergent attacks the alloy.
Most washing machines are now crap.
It's all scam. Samsung needs to be sued and banned.
Robert Jangda youvsre coyrrectvitvUsva scnm, but unfortunately the US brand compwies srebinnthebgsnebrightbeithbthej yhrbosrtybright along with them as I point out in my comment above, GE, FRIGIDSURE,ECTROLUX ARE BSLL THE VERY SAME LOUSY DESIGN AND BSLL PSRTSRCHANGABKE BETWEEN ALL OFTHEM. GE'; HAVE THE Same blousy sunc basketbspiderblas the Samsung's t my frigidsirrebhhsdnynhsdbthebdrumndirlll and may not everrbbrcsuse the door btokre off completely in less than two years of use. In attempting to repair it I found the the hi which carrys the heavy weightvof the diorwas very thin and brittle the part itself was nicely made and fit perfectly I bought a replacement part, which was alsold sd the correct replacement for GE, ELECTROLUX and other eregsrded American branded mschines either lrgscybreputuonnsnsnsbdlnmsschinesbwhichblererknoenbntoslmotneithboiluntexctptionntgivebdecsdesbofbttoublrbfreehichbleoulfolidlidhe r
@@oiudatropen9548 what the fuck are you saying?
Oiuda Tropen are you drunk?
@@robertjangda8089 yes samsung is very bad
I bought my Miele washer in 1990 and it still performs perfectly.
That's because they are the best!! 👍
It has a cast iron spider ;)
My LG WM2501HVA just did the same thing!! It destroyed the door seal when mine came apart. The unit was smoking from the friction of the rubber chunks pinned between the drum.
When replacing the seal I rotated the drum,and felt the looseness,and the drum clanking around...I dismantled the entire wash machine expecting to find bad bearings,and found this exact problem only completely broken loose all all 3 corners. The washer has been out of warranty for only a year!
Found a replacement part for $65 on eBay,but between that,$25 for bearings&rear seal,$7 for the drum seal,and $50 for the door seal not to mention the coin opp laundry expenses I’m not a happy camper for something that shouldn’t be a wearable part...still need to replace the 3 shocks inside,since they all fell apart just dismantling the machine!!
The real bad news is most of the parts in my LG cross with whirlpool,Frigidaire,and..Samsung. Yep,...they’re all made by the same Korean factories using the same parts!
Good you expose that matter to the public. I won’t buy a Samsung till that matter is addressed. Thank you for letting us know. Incredible.
Glad I hadn't gotten rid of my Maytag Neptune washer and dryer yet. Mine blew after a week of use after getting it used from a client. After selling their house the new buyers didn't want those units. Loved the capacity of the Samsung but it looks like it will be back to 3-4 loads a day on the 15-year-old Neptunes.
Thanks, Philip, for the video. I wish I had known about this issue beforehand. luckily no money invested from my side.
Cheers..From Canada.
FYI. I have this same washer about 7 year, which was operating fine. After watching your video, I decided to be proactive and replace the "spyder" before it fails. I found a couple of good videos which gave step by step on how to replace. Parts were easy to find online and cost under $200 (i did not need a door seal, since had been replaced prior). OK, this was not a simple project and would not reccommend doing only if you are very secure in your mechanical abilities. plus have a whole day to devote. During removal, yes indeed, I found that the spyder was deteriorated, but also found there was a significant amount of black mold trapped inside. Now I understand why I have a constant issue with moldy smell in clothes, no matter what method I used to eliviate. Definitely a poor design which I guess they must be are aware of. My moral here is, if you are having an ongoing odor problem, it could easily be part this same poorly designed component. I wouldn't invest any in repair(as I did) and just getting a whole new machine. Unless they have changed the design, I would never get another Samsung washer. They should stick to making phones. (oh yeh that was an issue too:-)
can you TREAT the part while its out to stop the corrosion? epoxy coating or something to increase longenvity? and maybe put some zink's in their to slow the progress?
I just replaced the spider bracket in my wife's Samsung washing machine. It looked about as bad as the one in this video. It appears what happens is that soap scum builds up on the spider bracket and traps moisture against the metal causing it to corrode. Once the steel drive shaft starts to come loose from the main part of the spider bracket the drum will spin off balance. Once it gets bad enough the vibration sensor will shut off the machine and you will get a fault code on the display.
Oh, does your wife live in a different place than you do? I guess that means you have your own washer, right?
Love that! "My wife has"! Thank you, finally a MAN!
Your wife's Samsung machine? Really? I guess you do your laundry at a laundromat, right? Is the vacuum hers, and the dishwasher, also? Or did youi decide to move in with her and become domestically incapable?
Think we found the feminist here...
I thought stainless steel was invented so as to prevent such corrosion problems? Why are our eating utensils made of stainless steel, just our costly appliances are made of of junk that will soon fail?
It's called planned obsolesence. They want the thing to fail. Catastrophically. That way you'll go out and buy a new, even shittier one. Electrolysis is what you see, the effect similar to that used in electric batteries.
actually they never want it to fail "Catastrophically". They want it to fail on simple components that either most people won't open up to replace or they 'pot' it encasing it to you can't replace a single part or get into it. but most of the time on mostly mechanical (rather than electrical) things they have a mechanical failure something they could've easily caught in engineering the product but didn't to induce failure i.e. using a cheap part.
Anyways i'm sure you knew all this, my main point was they want it to fail simply, not catastrophically because a catastrophic failure could either hurt someone, ruin costumer's other property, ruin a costumer's image of the brand ect.... they'll let a simple part fail that they could've used other means when producing to have the same desired effect with longer life but didn't. and simply bet on the consumers buying new instead of taking a look inside the machine and repairing it themselves. they can do this because years of training the consumers to simply buy new.
Its not electrolysis it is indeed similar to what's used in batteries although the process he's describing is called electroreduction
Galvanic corrosion might be a more accurate term for what is happening, but it is generally the same concept.
River Huntingdon reminds me of every single apple product
doesn't it come with like a 10year warranty tho
Just repaired my samsung broken after 15 years of use. I ignored the increased shaking started couple of years ago, the broken shock absorbers lead to breaking the spider axle. I replaced the said 3 parts and now it runs again like new. The shock absorbers take a beating and have a limited service life. If your machine breaks down because of run down shock absorbers does not mean planned obsolescence.
15 years is very good. Can you tell us how you maintained the machine? Powder or liquid and how many hot washes a month
Nice job of explaining electrolysis and how the machine will eat the spindle strength member. (Major structural failure, due to corrosion).
This is like what happened to the statue of Liberty and why she had to be rebuilt, her skin, dissimilar metals, leading to corrosion due to electrolysis. Also the large stator motor may have contributed to excellerating this corrosion due to free electrons in the field proximity.
Nice video and thanks for sharing and your contribution to this problem leading towarrds a resolution. .
Lastly, I want to take the time to Thank you for your service in the past and your continued service.. I am not sure what is wrong with my machine yet, but this knowledge I am happy to have as I push forward with my troubleshooting.
Thanks. .appreciate it.
We paid $1,400 for our Samsung front load washer less than 7 years ago. We had the same exact problem. The repair person said it would cost $900 to repair, and to go buy another machine.
He didn't show me this scenario, but he described exactly this problem. I'm shocked that a reputable company like Samsung would keep manufacturing a product that is doomed to fail.
(I suppose that it is "planned obsolescence".) Our repair person said they will typically last no more than 7 years (just like ours).
Same problem but here in india i paid less than 100$ for the repair.
Samsung's problem go beyond washers and dryers. i have a matching set of washer and dryer. the dryer first ruptured the drum at the seam, next the washer spider disintegrated. my Samsung refrigerator freezer ice maker has been replaced 3 times and has failed again. i don't trust their appliances anymore. they should have stuck to electronics,
I paid $500 for this washer....
@@pranayraj5731which brand
all manufacturers have this problem it's not limited to just Samsung it is also a Whirlpool an LG and Maytag and Electrolux and GE they all have the same stuff and I know because I do appliance repair this also happens because of the Soaps and bleach for hard water the mineral content I find that people in the country Orwell's 10 to ruin the bearings much quicker than in the city due to the high mineral content of the water
Jerry Boben so what do you recommend to maintain these front loaders ?..i am in the marker for samsungs model DV42H5200GW and WF42H5200AW and i just want this thing to last atleast 7 years as wife is busy with kids and warranty is $160 for both on 3 year coverage ...thanks
Speed Queen
I repair also. Did factory svc for Lucky Goldstar a long time ago. The reason is: they are cheapskate bastards. We are fools to give our appliance market to the Koreans. LG or Samsumg- they don't care if we live or die- just don't call then when something breaks, it's always your fault.
the only problem is you are pre-paying for the worst service experience of your life. When a company makes almost nothing on your job- you are guaranteed to be at the bottom of the list, after profitable out-of warrantee work of theirs.and will wait for parts- often two weeks.
what about their front loaders? I haven't seen a tremendous amount of good reviews on them
Engineered to fail, yall know the routine.
I wish I watched this video before I purchased my used set. Thank you for the information and video. Samsung needs to fix this issue, these machines aren't cheap!
Great information I was buying a washer today and was looking at a Samsung... I feel like I dodged a bullet. Plus the part is between $200-$300 on Amazon and a nightmare to change. Yes you are right two different types of metals equals no good. THANKS
Yes, it can be prevented. remember to decrease soap based on your HE unit. the water has decreased so 2 tablespoons of he detergent will allow your clothes to scrub each other and allow the water to rinse the soap free when finished! also if using pods only use them in hot wash cycs using only cold may not allow them to dissolve in time!!
That level of corrosion is absolutely astonishing over such a short period of time. You are right to call them out on this obvious design flaw.
😆😆😆
Samsung is known to do things like that on purpose. They also make their TVs live short.
Can you imagine if they made cars?
@@jonathantan2469 it would be called Dodge
@@rafadydkiemmacha7543i couldn’t get my samsung tv to die so i could replace.
Did the same thing. That piece was actually broken in 2 spots. Washer was probably 2-3 years old!
This problem doesn't only occur on Samsungs...It occurs on Bosch, Siemens, LG, Electrolux, Zanussi, Hotpoint, Indesit, Whirlpool...they all use these materials on their spiders these days which corrodes.
Miele & Asko are the only washing machine manufacturers which put steel spiders on their drums!
I have repaired large commercial washers for 30 years. My house has a 2004 whirlpool duet pair. Still running great. no bearing problems. I have seen this problem on small washers mostly ones built overseas.
Because of this video I’ve left my washer and dishwasher open to dry after every use. My wife convinced me to use vinegar rather than liquid fabric softener. We use dryer sheets and leave the appliances to air out. Thousands of dollars in appliances invested, we want them to last
You can use the drum clean cycle and use dishwashing tablets and baking soda to clean it and it cleans everything out amazingly.
We do that as well every so often, but would rather err to caution. So far everything is still running tip top and fresh.
@@CL4SSiCS How do you know it cleans out everything perfectly? Sorry I'm just an 18 year old kid I just bought my parents a washer/dryer pair since it was on Sale on black friday and I'm just now hearing about the horror stories associated with Samsung. I'd appreciate any advice, just trying to do my research so I can prolong this washer
@@Percules0001 I can't offer advice on prolonging the lifespan of a washer and dryer. I can only tip my hat to an 18-year-old "kid" who buys his parents a washer and dryer. To begin searching for solutions to potential problems? That is far more adult than this geezer. Your parents should be proud.
dryer sheets clog your lint filter
Front load washers have been made like that since they firt came out if you read the user manual and use the proper amount of detergent and softner in the correct consistency (water consistency) you wouldn't have this issue so quickly that blueish taint is the gunk that gets caused by the detergent and softner that didnt break down with the HE models because of the water efficiency feature.. that gunk builds up and eats away at the cast iron spider the hard water doesnt help the situation. Look at the dispenser housing and check out all the residue from using too much softner and detergent. Other machines didnt have this issue so quickly because they were programmed to fill with more water which would help break down the softner and detergent and drain it so it wouldnt build up like this.
The Appliance Guru 4.5 year appliance technician here, clear sign of using too much soap. 1-2 tablespoons of soap.
@@demonreamer12 ofcourse it is and i bet you this guy never did the self clean probably never even noticed the self clean cycle selector hes bashing samsung when its clearly his fault. 11 year tech here by the way
the term you want to reference is Galvanic corrosion or Bimetallic Corrosion.
he is describing it exactly right.
but I don't think that is whats happening. I think that is aluminum.
He has broadly described the issue, but his terms are way off. "Stronger metal" is wrong, it has nothing to do with strength. Google Galvanic Chart - gold is at one end, zinc at the other.
You are also correct, it is quite clearly aluminium in the rear bracing, which is causing the protective aluminium oxide layer to get attacked.
What is especially bad is having a large quantity of cathode (passivated stainless) in contact with a small amount of anode (aluminium oxide).
Also the process takes a very long time. This is what happens when you learn about something, but don't understand that something. lol
what ever galvanic corrosion is called on Aluminium.... when you look at the failed hub it's obviously cheap junk - I wouldn't be surprised to find the replacement made of straight plastic like the gearbox in a Whirlpool washer!
Aluminum can''t corrode
@@lucifersonsco.230
It can't rust, but it *can* corrode...
I had the misfortune of owning one of these Samsung front loaders and I replaced the spider bracket the first time it broke. The washer was noisy and never ran quite the same even thought I put it back together carefully. Later I found out that the balancing ring was stuck thus causing it to be off balance. With that, at about 18 months it broke again. I pulled out my two old Maytags that had been in storage for over 20 years and hooked up the washer and dryer. Both worked flawlessly and clean better than ever. We are still using our old set 4 years later. No more front loaders and NO MORE SAMSUNG appliances. Our first spider broke at 5 years of use.
Brilliant, keeping your old Maytags. I wish I'd kept our old top-loader.
This is what exactly happed to my Samsung washer. Thanks for sharing this useful information.
This is just wrong. But it is also very smart if you want your consumers to consume more
Your right if you want to have people buy more but they will not be Samsung customers, they will be someone else's
Thank you for your awesome video, this is the type of POS that these companies need to stop making. Keep up the good work!!
I guess I'll be the voice of opposition. I've owned 2 sets of high-end Samsung front loader washers and dryers. First set 6 years not a single issue, sold them with my previous residence. Second set is coming up on 7 years, again not a single issue. Now would I buy a front loader again in general, no as the new top loaders are way more efficient now and IMO, seem to do and probably have always done, a better job at cleaning larger loads.
still uses way too much water
It is the norm in the UK for washing machines to have an aluminium spider and stainless steel drum. I just replaced the bearings in my 10 year old Zanussi and the aluminium spider was not corroded at all.
I live in a very hard water area, which I'd guess is the major difference, the staining on the exterior of your stainless steel drum and the grime on your tub make me wonder if your tap water is mildly acidic, or if you had been using liquid detergent or pods instead of a washing powder containing oxygen bleach, which kills mould and keeps the machine clean as well as removing stains from clothing.
Washing liquids also tend to leave residue coating the insides which retains moisture, promoting mould growth, but I guess it could also facilitate electrolytic corrosion even while the machine is not in use.
It is also quite common here for plastic tubs to be welded instead of bolted together, especially on the cheaper machines, and sometimes the spider is riveted to the drum, at least your Samsung wasn't.
I believe detecting if the load is out of balance is usually done by monitoring the back emf from the motor.
They're all like that.. Kenmore, Samsung, LG ETC ETC... I Just got done fixing our Kenmore Elite (same as LG), the support bracket was corroded to the point of it breaking on all 3 legs... it's poorly cast aluminum too.
I replaced both bearings and the support bracket. When I got the new bracket.. I cleaned it real good, picked up a can of plasti-dip and coated it with about 5 - 6 coats (except for the shaft of course), making sure to get all crevices and holes coated, and inside of bolt holes coated. Hopefully this will help it last longer...
I just had this aswell. the 24 month warranty expired 6 months ago and I cant even use the washer anymore due to there being a leak. Samsung was going to charge me 200 dollars to fix it, for a machine that costed 600.
This is called A SPIDER ARM AND THE METAL IS aluminum/ All front load washer use aluminum spider arm to hold the drum. The soap is what eat the aluminum. Never Never fill the soap holder up to the fill line. 1 or 2 tablespoon of he soap only.
are there any front load washers that do not use this low grade spider bracket?
It's not the soap..As Phil mentioned, it's a result of corrosion from dis-similar metals in an electrolyte solution. Look up Galvanic Corrosion. The only way to fix this is to replace the aluminum (if that's what it is) with a metal with higher electrode potential, OR stick with stainless steel to match the drum. The other method would be to attach a sacrificial anode with lower electrode potential than the steel such as magnesium or zinc, and replace it regularly - See Cathodic Protection . Hope this helps!
Shaun Hammer no, it's from using to much soap through the years and not running a tub clean cycle every 40 loads with tub clean detergent. I'm a trained and certified appliance repair Technician and I see this all the time after about the 2 year mark.
Jim W. Yes it is. Are you a trained and certified appliance repair Technician?
Been using my Samsung front loader steam washer for over 6 years. Do at least 20 loads a week. We do have soft water system and am careful to not overload or use too much soap. No problems and machine does excellent job.
OK...I immediately knew when I saw the inner tub caked with funk that this machine was abused... when I say abused I'm talking they probably used cold water only...overloaded the machine, used too little or too much soap, probably didn't leave the door open to dry out...My Duet front load washer from 2005 has an aluminum spider and it's approaching 19 years old.... I can't say 100% but I'm willing to bet this happened because of user error... Just don't overload them, use occasionally hot water washes and leave the door slightly opened...I've never had mold or bad smells and I think this has kept my spider from deteriorating.
Thank you so much for this. I do have the front load so now I will purchase a warranty! Will not buy it again. Great video !
Our Samsung front load only lasted 6 YEARS. We had a set of Whirlpools that are still going strong at our rental house for 13 years.
Same thing happened to us but they were kenmores made by Samsung so we bought 2 new fro t load maytags direct drive with 10 year parts and labour warrantee and we also bought the whirlpool stackable ventless ensemble for one of our rental units and they seem fine. It says made in Italy so hopefully that means that they are good
@@legacyturbo8485 whirlpool is direct drive motor?
Shoaib Ali lets put it this way ....!!!!! Whirlpool is garbage
Shoaib Ali no if’s not Maytag is direct drive motor ..!!!! Samsung is garbage
Great video, now I'm much more confident about design quality of my samsung mobile and TV :D
I’m a repair tech I’ve done so many of these Jobs and everyone of them I dread
You sound like you know your stuff very articulate and knowledgeable!
This is called Galvanic corrosion. The Mrs bought one of these Samsung sets--Washer and Dryer in about 2010 from a former major department store chain. The washer never spun the clothes enough to squeeze any water out of them and the washer took forever to finish a wash. We returned them a couple weeks later. The store gave us a hard time including a robocall every morning at 8am for weeks. Shortly after, we bought a Speed Queen set (Back to top loading) elsewhere which has been trouble free through 2020. We never shopped at "S" after that and now they closed almost all their nationwide stores in the US by 2019. Their troubled era was news for quite awhile. At one time, their own "K" brand was considered a leading appliance by many Americans. The bigger they are...the harder...
I'm so glad I held on to my old school regular washer. The thing is about 30 years old, washes clothes beautifully and actually fills all the way up with water! My daughter had one of the low water top load washers and the clothes didn't even get all the way wet sometimes because it wont use enough water. They have to keep buying a new one every few years because they break and the repairman says it's the same price to repair it as it is to buy a new one. Most people are not mechanically inclined to be able to rebuild it like in this video so she bought an old washer from a neighbor at a garage sale and the thing is in perfect condition and is built like a tank and has been going for years now. Sometimes the old ways are still the best ways.
Yeah mine , from 99 , just got opened up because the belt failed . No mess inside , no leak marks , bearings are pretty good . I have seen a comunist made automated washing machine still alive (but barely) in 2015 . These new appliances are a shame .
What would really have been interesting would have been a teardown of other machines so we could see how this part compares from brand to brand.
The amount of corrosion would be a function of water quality more than the chosen metals in the machine. My guess is that this machine was used in a home with a water softener. Water softeners replace calcium/magnesium with salt which will accelerate corrosion. In my case, I bought a samsung washer in 2005 and it is still running today. Probably because it spent most of its life running on naturally soft water.
detergents are made with salt
no this is caused by electrolysis and detergent.
My Samsung front load washer has malfunctioned which is only six years old. I got it exchanged for a LG front load washer. Seems almost every Samsung FL washer has the same problem.
I had exact same problem recently. after watching a few youtube videos. I ordered a new "spider" for $122, a new ball bearing kit for $22. Clean the machine. Installed them on. Now my Samsung washer work like brand new. Easy fix
As others said here, planned obsolescence.
Other manufacturers use a plastic housing for the center ball bearing to get a similar obsolescence effect.
Sorry had the same machine 6 years and I took mine apart last night, tooks NOTHING like that, You clearly didn't run the cleaning programme or use it properly
Cant help but wonder why someone would take apart a perfectly good washer.
It's a machine..
All mechanical machines break down from wear eventually from friction alone. No cleaning cycles is going to stop galvonic corrosion. He was 100% right in the fact they knowingly assembled metals that would cause galvonic corrosion. Planned obsolescence at its finest.
We suspect this is exactly the problem we are having right now in March, 2021.
I wonder how much the cost difference would be to use stainless for the bracket vice whatever metal they used. I guess that is why some people things use to be made to last and not built to fail.
Well remember the GM ignition key module that killed people and caused car accidents .The cost to change the unit would have been .12 cents . I imagine this washer bracket would be maybe $15.00 to $20.00 more but the bean-counters won . Time to fire some bean-counters and hire some qualified engineers .
I used to work at a company that made electronic equipment. We had one engineer that used to walk around the office going "cheap, cheap, cheap...now it's so cheap, cheap, cheap it doesn't work anymore". Your analysis of this problem is absolutely correct. It's the main reason why I don't work as an engineer anymore. I got tired of having to work all night fixing these types of problems while the managers, accountants and stockholders were all at home in bed with their wives.
Nice that you don't know how to spell "Cheap"!!?
@ Mark W - It was meant to mimic a bird going "cheep, cheep, cheep". But I changed it just to make you happy.
Joe Vignolo Poor, Mark. Love his heart!
Sacrificial Anodes are highly active metals that are used to prevent a less active material surface from corroding. Sacrificial Anodes are created from a metal alloy with a more negative electrochemical potential than the other metal it will be used to protect. The sacrificial anode will be consumed in place of the metal it is protecting, which is why it is referred to as a "sacrificial" anode.
No idea how this got into my recommended videos but I learned something!
I run a full cycle of CLR in mine periodically.
I would say stay away from Samsung wash machines/dryers in general. I bought brand new washer and dryer, both Samsung a little over a year ago. I have been disappointed with things not working correctly already. The load sensor in the washer and moisture sensor in the dryer are both glitchy with once to twice a week use.
GE does the same thing even in there top load washers. Retired sears appliance technician.
@@dorothylouisegage5286 Kenmore is a solid brand
Only Whirlpool and Whirlpool based Kenmore and others that are Whirlpool based that are Timer Switch Only Excluding Oasis/Calypso/Cabrio is all I will get. I was a Tech myself. The Belt driven "New World" Kenmore/Whirlpools and Whirlpool based models with the brown shift actuator without the spider drive block were good despite having rods (easy to swap gear case). I would definitely get a surge arrestor and a battery backup with ripple correction though due to the boards...
Kenmore is without a doubt one of the best. I have a 1200 watt microwave from 2010 and she’s been thru tons of moves including being in the back of my truck from az to pa 3 times.
All brands do the same
I worked for GE for many years. I could write a book on the appliance issues alone. It's complicated and no way to explain it here. All I can say is do research before you buy anything. It may be that NO ONE is making the quality product you are looking for. There are reasons for that, and it's not just planned obsolescence. To put it simple, a great washer can be designed and built, but no one would buy it because it would not compete well in the marketplace. Sad, but not enough people will pay for quality to justify the companies designing and building products like that. Even if YOU are willing to pay extra, few people are. So the companies don't do it.
For example, check out Heartland refrigerators. You pay a premium for those fridges, but not because they are actually better. They're not. What you are paying for is the design, style and appearance. They're beautiful, but inside there's nothing special.
Holy moly. I was looking to buy. Thank you, I'll stick with my top loader which refuses to die.
Philip, thanks for the video, even if wiggling all OVER the place. As a guy who sells lots by video (eg- VHS tapes asent to customers all over 30 years ago), puh-leeez put your cell phone or camera on a tripod.... and keep it steady on EACH view. Also the "bracket" hodling the drum is called the "Spider Arm" Also- why not say "zinc alloy" instead of 'material' - so KNOW it can NOT be welded! You are right, it seems planned obsolecence! Anyway, thanks a lot. They could easily make this out of corrosion proof SS sheet, such as 404, if not 302 or 304 Stainless steel, just like the drum is. A $100,000 die to form the reinforcing grooves, ridges, and bending, may by amoritized over 100,000 machines. So add a $1 to the cost. We just paid a Samsung "Authorized repair" $150 for the ESTIMATE, quote being $500 to repair it!.
I have a Whirlpool Duet Front Load washer from 2008 with a similar problem. It looks like many of these appliances have identical parts and design. The metals are in a perfect environment to cause this corrosion. My washer has a ground wire bolted to the bearing housing to prevent the galvanic process, which helps, but does not prevent this entirely. Overloading or letting the machine run off-balance eventually breaks the legs of the spider. In my case, the drum continued to turn after the leg broke, which then allowed the stainless steel basket to rub and melt a groove in the plastic outer tub, opening a catastrophic leak. I learned 3 lessons: Keep a fairly light load. Beware of too much soap. Make absolutely certain to empty pockets. (coins between the basket and drum will work like a 3000 RPM can opener.
One other note - these older machines were bad, but the new ones are much worse. Manufacturers now "weld" the 2 halves of the plastic outer drums together (vs. the flange clips or bolts used in the past) so you can't DIY change the bearings/seals anymore.
Right on about the dissimilar metal. Was about to buy a Samsung washer. Do you know if they have fixed this problem in 2019?
buy Speed Queen TC5
i work for an authorized Bosch repair shop, we repair Bosch, Siemens, Neff and Gaggenau products.
Some later models we happen to repair for damaged drums fails exactly like in the video. Funny thing is that when these things gets discussed during training courses we've been instructed it's an accidental customer fault using aggressive products, and so we tell customers.
This kind of stuff is so disgusting, i also do electronics as hobbist and i realized how much the authorized services are scammy. We are pretty much forced to replace expensive boards that could be repaired, sometimes DESIGNED to be repaired but you're not instructed to (and technically, not even allowed to) as they may simply have blown SMD fuses that you can replace...
Did they tell you to advise clients to use a real hotwash once in a while,like advised in operators manual,to washout unresolved detergents and softeners??sleeping in training?
So we are bathing our clothes in high contents of corroded metal?
Pretty much, the spyder gear that drives the drum will eventually turn into powder
Yep.
Ive gone through 6 different sets in about 10 years.
Finally bought a speed queen. Best dang washer and dryer yet
A speed queen???
A speed queen??? @hey_youtube Im_back
Seems like all front loaders have one problem or another. I just did the tub bearings on a 10 year old Maytag, and while the bearing job wasn't too bad the outer tub had stress cracks that caused water leaks. They want $700 for that part so I went at it with my Dremel tool then filled up the cracks with JB weld. BTW, the bottom of the washer cabinet has no drain holes so that's VERY rusty from he water sitting there. We'll see if that steel lasts as long as my JB Weld repair in a few years!
rupe53 actually front load is better and more efficient most industrial washers are front load but they are stainless steel throughout so there is no corrosion
@@nightmareinaction629… and that's the main reason most people buy them. OTOH, considering they costs about twice that of a conventional top loader and last half as long before a major repair, one has to wonder if any $$ is actually saved. Anyone care to crunch those numbers over a 10 or 20 year lifespan? What I do know from actual testing is they do use less electricity, because they don't constantly change direction.
I've been told by numerous people to stay away from Samsung washers/dryers in general. They are junk and the customer service is a joke. On top of that, most of them are bought at big box stores like Lowe's, Home Depot, Best Buy, etc....and the guys that install them are not the best at installing them say compared to my local appliance store.
You must like LG washers, huh?
Engineered to fail so you buy another one or have to pay for a costly repair.
Will Warden or take care of the unit like it says in the owners manual.
How would you take care of a unit with a major flaw in its design????????
or sell it after 2 years and move on to something newer
Why would any manufacturer want to make something to last forever they would soon go out of business
samsung made that for a reason $$$. thanks for the upload i whas looking for a new washing machine .
We bought a Samsung front loading washing machine in 2009 when we moved into our new house. We were a family of 5 (three sons) with a sixth person, my sister-in-law, living with us to make 6 people. Seven years later, in 2016, I replaced this part as it had disintegrated. The job wasn't fun, but with a few hand tools and RUclips I was able to replace it myself. This last year I had to replace it again which means that the part replaced in 2016 failed in about the same 7 year period.
Some might consider this horrible, however, this is the ONLY problem that we've had with this washer, so we are not at all dissatisfied with it given the amount of use it gets.
I should also point out that we have a well, with pretty hard water.
Hope someone finds this helpful.
I have had this washer for 9 years. Always provide maintenance on the unit. It just started leaking last night. When I turned it on it's side I noticed what looked like a thin rock that had came through the plastic tub on the bottom. I thought maybe my kids had rocks in their pockets. This video explains what happened. The bracket started braking apart. The inner drum must have caught the metal piece and pushed it through the plastic tub. So the cause of my leaking washer is the bracket is following apart internally. Thanks for saving me the time and money of taking this apart and buying a new plastic tub. Any recommendations on another front load washer brand?
My parents have the same washer, have never had any problems with it, except for with the tenant that broke the door handle. She was promptly evicted.
every one that i have seen that corrodes, is about 6-10 years old.
I have Samsung washer since 2001 and it still runs as smoothly as in 2001. So may be the new models are badly engineered.
No its because of stupid people like the "doofus" that made this video. They insist on using way too much detergent. The same machine would have lasted 8 years or so (about the maximum life)
In response to the person who calls himself "broccolibeef", sorry to inform you but you're wrong in your analysis about using too much soap. in fact I've used under the amount that was suggested.
As I pointed out in the video this type of damage is caused by corrosion. Corrosion happens when you have two dissimilar metals attached to one another. it's an electrolysis process whereby the anode attacks the cathode or vice versa (I can't remember which one is the strongest one). this reaction is accelerated through electrolytes and in this case soapy water. however the amount of soap in the water is not really factor here. has one person had pointed out earlier post that he sees this problem amongst people who have drilled Wells. this is an indication of a high mineral content which would accelerate the anode cathode process. of course this would depend the type of mineral in the water. as I pointed out in the video since the spider bracket which is most likely some type of zinc alloy product, was bolted to a stainless steel drum creates two very dissimilar metal reaction. and where corrosion would still happen to non-ferrous metals even if they were manufacturer of the same material the corrosion process would be much slower. however in this case the metals are so different the corrosion process it's much quicker.
BTW my career field title in the Air Force was "Corrosion Control"
But then I probably don't know what I'm talking about and somebody with a name like broccolibeef has a more intellectual insight into this type of problem.
I think the spider assembly is made of cast aluminum in most front loaders. You could replace it, but just getting to the spider is very labor intensive and not worth it. They make it out of cast aluminum because it costs less than stainless steel. It's called planned obsolescence.
Any Korean/ Chinese Brand will find such ways to do cost cuttings. That is one reason why Japanese and German products are usually costlier than these. Brands that I avoid: Samsung, LG(Both Korean) any Chinese Brand. Brands I trust: All Japanese Brands, Bosch, Siemens, Indesit, Braun, US Brands as well. This is my opinion, might not be right for everyone though.
Sorry, US manufacturers use SAME aluminum spider
Folks quite bickering about the cause! We had ours suffer exactly same fate. I was a professional sailor in US Navy. This is bi-metallic galvanic corrosion. It has nothing to do with using this or that soap, too much soap, water softener, wrong soap, blah blah blah! Google a picture of zinc anodes on a hull before they are replaced (entire anode corrodes not just contact points).....look exactly the same as these crappy cheap spider arms! There is current moving through that arm...stray current to ground, has dis-similar metal....you could run nothing but water through these machines and the spiders would corrode every time. The drum and spider should be the same material, period. I opted to throw the machine out to a recycler who did the repair and resold the machine. We went back in time and purchased a top load with direct drive. That was our longest running machine before the front loader at ~ 10+ years. Now we have a new one and despite some more noise on the drive, it washes WAY better than the front loader ever did. All the promise of saving money for less water and soap usage means nothing when the stupid machine is dead 4 years after purchase! Good riddance front loaders! BTW, there are a couple of brands from Europe that actually use steel spider, but they are hard to source and VERY expensive....
Mario D you are right about any type of water however certain types will corrode quicker. It's all about the electrolyte ability to move that current as stated earlier in the video. I did miss speak in the video, this is not a zinc alloy product but a cast aluminum product again bolted to stainless steel two very dissimilar metals
Were you fresh water Navy? Salt water is a great electrolyte that will attach almost any pair of dissimilar metals.
If the dissimilar metals was the problem, the corrosion would be at the metal interface. It is not, therefore the corrosion is chemical in nature, not electrolytic
The aluminum is just plain incompatible with the service. It is known to corrode rapidly in hot alkaline water, and all laundry detergents are alkaline. The cleaning pucks contain percarbonate and sodium carbonate so they are strongly alkaline and oxidizing, as is regular hypochlorite bleach. The part seems to fail at a stressed location- the joint between the arm and the round portion of the casting where the shaft attaches. While a galvanic driving force definitely exists and likely doesn't help, I'm pretty confident that even if you were to electrically isolate the drum from the arm, the spider arm would still corrode freely.
Funny, my front-loader is 15 years old and still working without a single repair needed except me personally opening it up to wash away the gunk accumulated by washing detergents in the thin inlet tube and once realigning the belt since it fell off.
Learn to buy good washing machines or learn to pay the idiot tax.
This is an informative video. I had one of these Samsung washers. It had a balance issue where the washer made loud banging sounds as it walked across my laundry room. Samsung sent a rep to resolve the problem. He made a few visits to figure out the problem to no avail. The retailer took both W&D back. How could Samsung engineers NOT know about dissimilar metals that create corrosion? Btw, It’s made in China.
For many reasons I'm done with high priced washers! I just bought a $400 Amana HE top load and couldnt be happier, it washes the clothes better than my last 2 " high quality " washers that both lasted under 3 years.
The transmission will fail in about 2-3 years. I know I work on many different brands and models. Sears appliance tech
@@sidneyducote7329 That's a 20 dollar belt , no ? My budget 99 indesit just breaked it's belt in 2021 (that's why i'm on ytb watching washing machines being dismantled ). It's still good inside , no leaks , no bad bearings , 30 years of weekly service . I have seen a communist made machine surviving 30 years , in a sorrow shape but functional . These new devices are a shame .
Had ours for 12+ years. No Major problems works fine and does a superb job getting the clothes CLEAN.
My Samsung front loader just started smoking on the spin cycle, I mean serious rubber smelling smoke. Undoubtedly the spider bracket shown in this video gave way and the unit is rubbing against the rubber seals. Won't buy another.
Meh. My Samsung frontload is coming up on 10 years. I have yet to make a repair.
you are lucky. I actually have removed the lid screws so I can pull it off easy for the frequent repairs.
its coming !
I have had mine coming up on 10 years as well I am going to have shock absorbers replaced soon that’s it..
Andrew Kelsey you got lucky.
Totally agree never had an issue with our one, best machine we ever owned and even when it dies in years to come will just go and buy another Samsung one
Excellent description of the intentional use of dissimilar metals. As I recall in the 1980's this EXACT problem caused the engine to fall off a DC 10 airliner in Chicago killing all and some one the ground. This should be a recall!
Sure there's a galvanic process that takes place, but just like in electrical installations you're likely not going to see conductors and terminations completely eaten away beyond the actual splice points when dissimilar metals are used without any anti-oxidation products. If it's all cruddy looking then IDK what that's from. If the frames start to wiggle from the fasteners then that seems like the result of the galvanic reaction going too far.