UNVENTED CYLINDERS FOR HOT WATER - Plumbing Tips
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- Опубликовано: 29 июл 2017
- This video is all about Hot Water Unvented cylinders for your hot taps. We review the Range Tribune from Kingspan, which is pre plumbed, show you why to install one, what each pipe does and just generally how they work. In the UK you need a G3 ticket to install a cylinder and be a competent person...so no idiots trying this please! Mainly to help apprentices!
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Can you do a video on how to cut copper pipe in really tight places . Or hard to get to
(Scottish Accent) I have got to say laddy those full bore big handle valves are a thing of beauty and should be the only valves available.
Your technical work and knowledge of the systems and planning is absolutely 1st class. I'm not a plumber and so was lost half way through there.
The big G is no doubt proud as punch laddy.
love the edits on these videos mate you put a lot of effort into it! Also a plumber myself and its entertaining to watch!
Cheers Lewis! No worries!
Great video's bud, very informative and always a pleasure to watch. Newly qualified and learning myself, they are a great help.
hello mate, great video. plumber for 30 years now and think your explanation really well done. i to have gone over to pre plumbed cylinders and of course system boilers. the brasso was really good, shows pride in the job. of course most of that install will be covered with lagging, but still a great tip. the reason why i wanted to leave a comment was on the use of plastic for the d2 discharge pipe. i was recently told by a well known unvented cylinder company that they no longer would allow the use of plastic unless: you clip the pipe every 300mm, installed id labels to the waste pipe on its entire length stating its being used for a discharge. leave access points to check the previous. if you didn't it would invalidate the guarantee. never seen a label but i got the jist of the conversation. mind you i think i am right in saying that one litre of water heated to 100 degrees centigrade expands 1200 times. when tnt expands/eplodes it expands 1400 times, so it puts what we fit in context.
Love the video, it's one that I will use over and over until I'm completely happy with the way it works. Really good for rewind and watch again,,,, and again,,,,,, and again. Brill advice with Brasso, that's my next purchase.
A work of art! Thanks for the excellent video James.
No worries Waka!
Absolutely brilliant video, thank you VERY much for making this, loved it :)
Second video of the day to help me understand these setups. You clearly enjoy what you do and you get loads of detail into your videos. Great work!
Jason with a fancy footwork.. brilliant and incisive.
Thanks for sharing this useful video. I have done a fair amount of plumbing and am looking to install one of these via building control notice.
Hope you enjoyed people! Loved fitting the pre plumbed side of it. Quality!
plumberparts
Great video mate.👍 Nice shorts too.😁
Sweet That's good to know makes pipe up systems easier always find it a pain to do it the other way. Also loving the pipe cleaning trick that will save me some time normally use cleaning pads takes ages. 👍
Started watching this guys video absolutely brilliant and very informative and entertaining great stuff! Going to have a look at his shop if tools are as good as presentation I'm buying!!
Another great video, great plumbing
Perfect video! Thank you!
Beautiful job!
loved the video good work james.
Cheers dude!
Cool video . Thanks man !
Quality work as always.
Thank K!
Brilliant videos! Just had a unvented cylinder fitted but can't work out why I have a 2 port valve on the boiler flow to pump but then a 3 port valve ?
Good job & good knowledge I will get from u.
Legend mate. Wow what a video
as a 21 year Navy man I can honestly I've used probably about 30 litres of brasso... lots of brass on ships and looks special when polished.
Love the brasso trick! Always used wire wool but even that patinas eventually!! Any lagging on the 1st metre James? Love the videos
Thanks for your videos on unvented cylinders and water softeners - I have an unvented and am considering getting a softener, but want to check first whether the softener could reduce the pressure and/or flow and affect the unvented?
Hi James great stuff on your channel 👍
I have a new unvented cylinder installation my first …
Do you have any info for me regarding balanced cold water connection.. any schematic drawings???
Awesome video !
Thanks dude!
Thanks for your amazing video. Please can you confirm whether the unvented indirect cylinder needs to be housed together with the boiler Or they can be installed separately?
Hello there james, loving the videos, been watching your videos for ages now. Keep up the good work.
On question, if you have a pre-plumb cylinder what type of boiler would you install ???
System OR heat only
A system boiler has a pumb and expansion vessel which you now don't need?
Excellent vid. How come the hot water and heating come off the same pipe? I thought the heating loop would have inhibitor in and doesnt connect to the hot water. Sorry I'm new spark and trying to learn some of this!
Прекрасная работа-Nice Job)))
Thanks!
Always great videos and that brasso 😍👊🏼
Cheers dude!
A plumber put one of these in for a customer i am building a en suite for but i see he left the cold for the Kitchen sink and bathroom coming from the mains which seems daft as the hot comes from the Un vented tank so it will not be as balanced as it could be . I have a Therm stat Mixer shower to put in and was just checking the correct way and your diagram tallys up nicely with the Caleffi comb valve which is ready to take the cold feed and the i can tap into the hot and the mixer will work lovely jubly, Great video upload, now to take apart the airing cupboard shelving so i can get at the piping ...
So long as he has used a pressure reducing valve on the cold mains it shouldn't be a problem most plumbers would use cold mains for all cold outlets if the pressure is good enough but a lot of plumbers also just stick with a cold water storage tank if pressure isn't to good.
James do you install additional pressure reducing valve before the multifunctional block I've seen alot that have them
Loving those floaty Friday clips at 6 mins bud haha nice video great review cheers bud
You got me!
Hi James, A technical question if I may: My vented system Y Plan replaced with an unvented cylinder and S-Plan, but the heating side has been left in place with the original F and E for the rad circuit! Is this allowed?
Hi, what was the size of the cupboard that the tank went into? Thanks
I’m planning to use these cylinders with Vaillant 637
Will it work on that ?
Thanks
can we see you pressure testing a new install
Great video.very tidy work nice to see.have you uses joule pre plumb cylinder?
No mate, and thanks!
Nice work. " Ya Canny Push your Granny Off The Bus" in Scottish twang :)
Thanks?! Cheers dude!
Love your videos keep them coming
Ps what make of a tile bit do u use any make I use at the min I only get 2/3 holes thanks
Mate, they're all crap! Try using a masonry bit with water, on a slow rotation and without hammer on!
Great video brasso is the way forward
Expansion vessel on the heating side as well as he cold main?
good information
CHEERS!
Great plumbing as usual and yes some people are very gifted at what they do ! Why is there water dripping from my light fitting ?? Need to watch a tad more videos !!
RUN! 😂
No mention of the safety aspects ie. Safety vent pipe which is the most important aspect to consider with unvented.
My new build has a condensate pump fitted on the D2 pipe, is this permitted? MI & G3 specs dont even mention this scenario.
An intetesting video👍
Can you fit a megaflo using a traditional boiler? Understand that the feed for the radiators wouldn't intersect the same here, mainly just using one of these for hot water, would we then ignore the part that involves the loop for the radiators here?
Nice install mate ... hows the knees after ur career so far ? Been in the job only 10 years and my knees are shot
Boring I know but, Part L of the building regs states that ALL HW pipes connected to the cylinder must be insulated for at least 1m in length, or until they become concealed/exit the room. Don't wish to dull down the Brasso party, but maybe save that for the cold pipes?
Also I notice that the Hot/cold pipes were sometimes quite close together, so might be difficult to insulate. Apart from that, great video :)
Do the floor boards need to be reinforced?
Is the better than a mega flow tank?
hi buddy i have 2 boilers and 3 tanks similar... its a hotel i am running. the problem now is the water coming from the showers is not consistently hot / mixed. the temperature fluctuates highly from hot to cold. the water temperature in the shower is not stable. what could be the problem and where could it be ...... in the tanks or the boilers..??? we recently had the gas renewal certifications where the people did the boilers and told is working fine. please share yr expertise and experiences. thanks
Hi mate where are you located in Uk ,
Can you plz fit mega & new boiler for me in Birmingham
How do you replace an immersion heater on a king span aerocyl
Brilliant vid. Now proud owner of brasso
Good man!
Brasso. Works well. great video as ever but now you have to lag all the pipework 1 meter within the cylinder cupboard . Bpec.
Not sure if I got this right, but unvented cylinders can come from suppliers ready plumbed for an extra £100+ if you ask for this add-on???
What part of Australia are you from fella, sounds like Brisbane.
Phwoar do love a good unvented cylinder install! Not sure about that integrated expansion vessel! If it pops is that part serviceable or new cylinder time?
Zed Man hi Zed. It's not an integral vessel as such. Rather it's an air bubble resting at top part of the cylinder to take the expansion, which sometimes can pop but is easily recharged by a heating engineer without any parts required. hope this helps.
James Cole thanks for clearing that up!
Some system use a venturi to auto top up the air in the bubble if some is lost too. Mental!
6:48 can you screw into the Cylinder with a pipe clamp??
Surely it's great having an expansion vassal built in cylinder but if it fails you have change the whole cylinder? or is there a way out of that.
If the air pocket inside has failed you can drain the cylinder down and refill it to allow air to get trapped in the top for expansion again. Failing that, you can fit an external expansion vessel onto the cold feed to the cylinder
Impressive , how do you flush the flux from the pipes once they are connected?
Fill up and drain down normally
Hey mate, how do you do your pressure testes? I use 3bar of air with a speedfit cap one end, and pressure gauge/air valve other end.
Are you using water and Rothy pump, or AIR?
Cheers dude
Hi Rob, I use air mate just so if I have a leak I don't get water everywhere and therefore the butt of everyones jokes on site!
plumberparts
Sweet.
I've been installing the Megaflow system fits for 4-5yrs now, way quicker that way for install, and again like yours, it comes with loop, primary exp, and quality pump and zone valves. No brainer really if you add up the cost of all the parts, plus your time to pipe it all up.
Exactly mate!
They told me I need to be G3 Registered before I can attempt this installation. Its a 1 day course in Leeds
Hi Mate
Does that hasn’t got pump it self ?
Just wondering why would you need an extra pump ?
Thanks
Underfloor heating requires its own pump.
Hello mate quick question the way you have pipe this up are you not at risk of reverse circulation when calling for hot water. As you haven't followed the 3 tee rule. Or dose the 3 tee rule not apply any more as it a pain to pipe up having the cylinder last tee back to the boiler. Be good to know make my life easier thanks
It's never been a problem for me and the system is running like a dream at the mo...love it!
GHP Services exactly what I thought... hes got the cyl return then the rad return then the ufloor return... just asking for rads to warm up in the summer...🙄
@@jeremywestern7067 can you explain your comment please
Duh
Elizabeth Sim ALL rad returns and underfloor returns MUST join together and form one pipe before connecting to the cylinder return before heading back to the boiler... this plumbers customers prob get a couple of warm rads in the summer which they simply turn off but doesn’t make it right...
Hi
How comes this pre plumbed cylinder comes with a pump? Normally on system boilers the pump is integral to the boiler?
Thanks
If you get a heat only boiler (no pump)
Can you use a regular boiler with these or a system boiler?
You can use a system boiler or a heat only boiler
Love the videos. Not a plumber but I have a quick question about hot water cylinders. Lots of installations seem to have a gate valve installed close to the cylinder, between the flow and return pipes. What is the purpose of this valve? Should it be open, opened a little or closed? Can't find anything about it online and am wondering if it might have something to do with the fact that my hot water takes an age to heat up. I can't ask my plumber as unfortunately I'm going to this great guy's funeral on Tuesday. :-(
Between the flow and return pipes, do you mean a separate pipe in between the flow and return or literally a valve on the flow/return pipe? A common place for a gate valve near the cylinder is the cold feed to the cylinder to isolate it for maintenance
@@daleprosser350 Hi Dale, literally a pipe connecting flow and return on cylinder with a gate valve in the middle. I closed all flow would go through cylinder coil, if open some flow would go through this coil "bypass"?
Martin
is it the same kingspan as the kingspan that make highly flammable insulation
No mate. Check the link and look at the EU ratings test on their products....perhaps a little research!
images1.kingspanpanels.co.uk/file/asset/12705/original/UK%20&%20Ireland%20Product%20Selector_2016_KIP_UK.pdf
I have a megaflow cylinder similar to this. Appears it came pre plumbed. The return from the cylinder is also used for the returns from the radiators (they are plumbed closer to the boiler in the return). The rads appear to have reverse flow and heat when the HW is running. Is this as described plumbed incorrectly?
If the heating pipes are connected to the boiler return AFTER the how water cylinder is connected to it, when your hot water is turned on, the water may flow to radiators on its way back because they are teed in after the cylinder. The hot water cylinder coil return should always be the last tee going back to the boiler
Can you get pre-piped thermal stores?
I'm sure some companies must make them...
I would like to replace a fortic cylinder with an indirect unvented cylinder. I would like to keep the CH setup as is with the cold feed tank in the loft and the system at the same pressure (worried about leaks). Is this possible? I'd get a suitably qualified plumber to do all the work but I'd like to understand what is possible. Thanks
Why would you need the cold water tank, if you want an unvented system they are fed from the mains as long as your pressure is good you would only need a unvented cylinder seeing as you can only install one if you have good pressure or it wouldn't work properly/efficiently.
@@masterchaz100 he is on about using the cistern in the attic to fill the heating circuit
Can someone please tell me if the MEGAFLO ECO Direct Unvented Hot Water Cylinder if fitted will require an overflow outlet. This is required to be fitted in place of one cylinder that is slowly giving way from the base and leaking. On another property a pump fitted to the cylinder makes a lot of noise and sometimes does not cut off for quite a bit longer after the use of the facilities. I have changed the pumps three times but the noise persists. I also need to replace that hot water cylinder so that the occupants can have quiet living. Both the cylinders and the bath rooms are on the same floor of these one bed room flats. I have spoken to many plumbers but cannot get a right answer, Some want to make a lot of alterations that might require me to move out the occupants and deface the internal of the property. Can any one offer advice or recommend something that would not require alterations to the property. Any feed back will be very much appreciated.
Can you fit magnetic filter on this system? Where is the best place if I don't have space on boiler
Cylinder cupboard
Try and get it on the return to the boiler so it’s the last component on the way back to catch any magnetite
One thing I don't find very clear on these kinds of systems (not a plumber btw, just an end user thinking about getting an unvented cylinder) , is the return from the rads separated from the hot water that goes to the shower and taps,? I don't want to be washing myself in recycled radiator water.
😂😂😂😂😂
The nasty boiler/radiator water and your domestic hot water never mix! :)
@@Y34HN0 I would have thought so, but whenever I look at plumbing diagrams, it looks like they do.
It works like this:
Sitting inside your cylinder there will be a massive coil (basically one long spring shaped pipe with no breaks in it) made of highly heat-conductive metal, usually copper or stainless steel. On the side of your cylinder, this coil will have a flow and return connection from your boiler, completely separate from the inlet and outlet connections for your safe drinkable water.
When needed, the heated water from your boiler is pumped through this coil inside the tank. The heated boiler water running through the coil heats the coil up. The boiler water is in contact with the inside of the coil, which heats up the coil, the outside of which is in contact with your safe drinkable water inside your cylinder.
That way, the two different waters never mix. The heat is transferred from the nasty boiler water to the safe tank water as it runs through the highly conductive foil.
The water in the tank is heated 'indirectly' , which is why they're called indirect cylinders. :)
Here's a video showing what the coil inside of an indirect tank looks like: ruclips.net/video/rsxmlqX_OMM/видео.html - In that video, it's a twin-coil tank instead of a normal single-coil tank so it's slightly different, but it's otherwise exactly what you'd see. Hope it helps. Sorry if that was a lot to read.
What if the internal expansion vessel fails? tank replacement? Looks sealed - though maybe the top actually comes off?
Top comes off , the vessel is sat on top. Just make sure you allow extra head room above the installation to allow you to replace it.
Or you can cut in an external expansion vessel
Brasso! Legendary tip! I'm going to rename my business to "Bling bling plumbing"
Cheers mate!
The old adage....never fill-up on a Friday!!
Holy shit - Brasso! I'd be interested to see their sales figures, after this video (shot on iMax, right?), goes viral ;D. I know I just added some to my shopping.
Do it! You'll never look back!
How long is the life of the tank. Nightmare and expensive if needs to be changed
What advice would you give someone who's starting a plumbing course in college. (1st level which is basic knowledge)
How did it work out
silly question but why does the cylinder have a pump if the boiler has one anyway?
If you get a heat only boiler, it doesn’t contain a pump, it literally just heats up water
Superman speed
If only they were all this quick!
An unvented cylinder needs a G3 certified man to install and service once a year. The service costs. This is because unvented cylinders have the potential *explode,* and occasionally do. DHW only, *low pressure,* thermal store cylinders deliver high pressure mains hot water. No need for a specialist man to install or the annual service charge.
G3 pal
*Open vented* thermal stores *do not* require a G3 certified man to install. Anyone can install them. They do do not require an annual service charge. G3 is for pressurised vessels above 15 litres capacity.
No, G3 is for unvented
Hi guys , I'm in need of some help. I've searched and searched online. But it seems nobody has the same problem that I have. I have hot water flowing from the upstairs bathtub tap. But no hot water from the kitchen tap. I have good water flow on both taps. But slightly better on the tap in the bathtub. Any help would be greatly appreciated.
Was it the Solenoid?
My water is boiling. How can I turn it down please ??
Thermostat either on your cylinder or on the boiler
tundish???? you cant see it releasing, also the outlet must also be nopticable should it discharge
Its not speeded up, he actually works that fast
You should be a rocket scientist and do the plumbing on a new engine for the Americans now the Russians have stopped selling them rockets so they can't reach the International Space Station!
If I did I doubt we'd reach the local petrol station.....let alone a space one!
My mate rob is biggest man in the gas industry and he says your yellow shorts match you plumbing #plummerprat