Very informative regarding grinds and edge retention. I’ve converted all of my convex edges to flat or V grinds. Thank you for confirming my suspicions. Dr Dave
This is eye-opening for two reasons. 1) It means if I reprofile my current Strongarm (420HC) I can improve edge retention by a good 50%. 2) For a few bucks more I can also get a huge jump in retention with the BDZ1 version. Can't lose!
Charles Collier - i wouldnt exactly call either a "huge jump" in retention. the only real advantage to either steel is its ease of sharpening in the field. id rather have ANY other steel and other knife because of it though.
I figured the bdz1 would do better, but I don't know much about the steel so I thought it would have been higher. Either way, I'm probably just gunna stick with my 420HC strongarm, not a big enough increase to warrent buying another one in my opinion.
I really enjoy all the work you put in to testing, as I sit at the table eating a sandwich! Seems to me a blade w/ edge holding properties w/ at least 150-200 passes would be more useful in da bush! Just wondering. For years I was pretty low tech, using a buck 110. Now I carry and fish w/ a Para 3 Blurple 110V. Now that holds an edge like a champ. I cleaned 24 trout/bass last weekend, here in Alaska and the edge is still like a razor at 20 degrees. Just saying for me 110v is great.
Fairly new subscriber and haven't commented until now I guess. I just watched your "philosophy" video. I enjoy your reviewing style and honest opinion. Haven't been able to find too many reviewers I enjoy. I'm subscribed to most of the larger knife channels nick shabazz, nutnfancy, apostlep, etc. I enjoy the outlook you have as well. Figured I'd give my opinion and rant my appreciation a little
This is common manufacturing issue with some makers. I think it has to do with the method they use for putting an edge bevel on not accounting for the upswept tip. I have a Viper Odino (with the really heavily upswept point) where the edge bevel was almost nonexistent on the tip. Some of my Ontario fixed blades suffer from the same issue as well.
49Giants I feel like it's a misapplication of machining techniques that work fine on knives without so much belly at the tip. Also, quite frankly, we are talking about Gerber here. Yes, the strongarm is clearly a great knife, but shitty quality control has been a hallmark of that company for a decade at least.
Good on you. for a first time purchase the bdz-1 over the original. Great comparison I have the Fine edge Prodigy. and has served me well. instead of the Original Strongarm. With the harder steel. and better edge retention would be well worth the Purchase now. for the Strong arm. Although would require better sharpening equipment in the Field. softer steel is easier to make sharp even if it doesn't stay sharp as long. Harder steel more time to maintain therefore more restrictions as too application of Work and stress.
As far as i know the black coating is an oxide so you will have to sand it off. From my experience with epoxy stripers it will melt the plastic handle.
Well one things for sure, you definitely make a case for a Lansky v grind over convex. I would like to see another Kobun test with the v ground Lansky edge, or any Cold Steel aus 8. I was quite turned off to Aus 8 after seeing your tests.
Wait... I've been working on my BDZ-1 with the Lansky for a good hour to get it from the factory 40 deg. to a 20 deg. profile. Using the red course stone with plenty of oil. It's taking FOREVER just to get the profile changed! What am I doing wrong???
Now you should test their toughness. Edge retention is nice, but a folder with more expensive steel will outcut both easily. It's their toughness that should matter here. Do a "Joe X test" between the two.
Mine has a thinner saber thickness than both my 420 strongarm and prodigy's. It does come with a small v grind but definitely a different saber thickness, I love it with wood it's a big difference for me. Mainly what I've noticed is that the 420 gets little dings and rolls after a day out needing a quick ceramic rod but the BDZ1 just a nice strop and she's good. Your test is right on the money with my experience, THANKYOU FOR DOING A PROPER TEST. I seen a comment on a certain somebody's page saying this test doesn't matter with fixed blades, he pretty much stuck a nose up in the air toward your direction crapping on your whole process. I'm not sure if he meant to sound like a douche but it did. I unsubscribed I'm done with certain folks, plus 5 minutes of batoning a stick and making feathersticks is getting beyond boring. guess what everybody ....your $60 Strongarm and $75 (USA sorry bud) Garberg, can do everything that their $250 knife can. Am I bitter NO, awake YES... are expensive knives cool HECK YEAH! but you are not some infomercial you're a true fan and lover of blades😉 Please do what ya do and keep advancing, you're hilarious laid back and you are not trying to sale us stuff or looking for free stuff by making 5 minute batoning reruns. Hope ya don't think I'm being a negative Nelly ....I'm just tired of certain things. I had Lilly call me a" lousy sexes" for saying Big Boys in a comment that I was obviously meaning GROWN UPS😒 Yep after years subbed there I unsubbed ....ugh! I have no reason to watch someone pound a knife though rocks cause they want more drive by clickbait #s Its just the truth. RUclips survival channels like that are not going to last anymore .....,or will they😕
yeah there are some intense cats around YT land! I try and be nice as I can be! Who was it, out of interest? I know my tests are a little obtuse for some folks but all I ask is if they dont like em to leave em!
oh wait I reread it properly, if it was just a rando commenter, no worries at all! I get pleant of those! Would be curious if other youtubers were baggin me lol
Cedric & Ada Gear and Outdoors Honestly it was Living Survival, he wasn't being direct and most likely wasn't being hateful. BUT its like he was talking down to you, I'm not trying start stuff at all....I personally am just making changes esp with who I sub to and really paying more attention to what I get out of watching their channels. Many knife channels give us nothing esp certain "survival bushcraft" stuff. I've learned a ton of stuff in the last 5 years about knives mainly from using them, I'm done watching rehashed feathersticking infomercials. I really like Ben he seems like a nice guy, I just see a pattern with some of these big channels that have become way to commercialized. Its like everyone is racing to get a knife with their logo on the side, so to do so ya gotta pump out 100 feather stick vids and get 10000 likes. I think your test is very important, when I pay $150+ for a knife that says CPM 3V it better be CPM 3V and no amount of feathersticking is gonna prove that, but your actual WORK.....LITERALLY SWEATING does this. I'm very thankful for channels like yours....But like I said he probably didn't say anything that many would call wrong, mainly its the big picture for me.....I see the whole forest not just the tree.
Airik1111 oh yeah - nah I saw that. Hes cool, I kinda got what he was sayin. Its not super important to a lot of folks how much their edges last with the fixed blades. I remember thinking ‘oh yeah thats me lol’
Thanks again for another great video!Work sharp sales pitch is that Convex edges last longer, are more robust. I am continuously seeing that the V grind last longer in your testing. Do you think that is because of the more refined edge you get from the Lansky? What’s your thoughts? Do you think the work sharp Ken onion edition would produce an edge closer to Lansky? Also I’m curious about the difference between the Tormek edge and the Lansky edge?
Well... I was sort of interested in the BDZ1 version, hoping for numbers close to BD1... But I rather just get something in 14c28n, with a better edge geometry. Ps, just checked Your earlier Strongarm result, that was 48, so nice and consisntent data, love it!
May I ask where did you get the BDZ in Australia? and for how much? It's beautiful and IMO well worth the bit more you pay for it. At least from what I can see in Amazon.
mountainhobo they would both be okay for field use I reckon. The BDZ1 needed a little longer to get the convex curve off, but not a huge amount and nowhere near a powder steel like M4 or S30V
mountainhobo from what I've understood it's better to have a flat secondary bevel, in this case the lansky system for "in field" touch up. I own a work sharp and put most my edges on it. A work sharp creates a secondary convex grind, this can make the edge stronger but harder to sharpen if you're away from the device not unless you carry a leather strop. Either way is fine just depends on the edge retention and what you're using your knife for.
I might have missed something - you said you sharpened them to 20 deg first time, and then 20 deg in the second round. What was the difference that improved their performance so significantly in the second round?
mountainhobo the worksharp edge convexes over - its a bit more round. The V edge with the lansky is a little more acute and seems to get better results.
You are measuring a level of sharpness at the end by cutting the paper. The v edge increases its initial sharpness so it has a head start kind of. Pete if you see this maybe try initial sharpness test by cutting through some consistent material on a scale.
really different grinds, I reckon the strongarm would feel like a splitting wedge after using the hollow ground 119! The 420 would likely be better in the buck one too, as my experieneces seem to show
.45 is rather low in carbon yes. They don't break that easy. That's an advantage in some uses. Like breaking open windows/doors with it. I don't need a knife for that. Some might ?
Another informative review. I have and use both of those sharpeners. Love the work sharp for its convenience but when I really want to put a crazy sharp edge on something, the lansky is my go to. I usually finish the edge off on a loaded strop for the win.
You should get the KME. Its a Lamborghini where as the lansky is a 95' civic lol. Diamonds last a thousand times longer as well...And you can get chosera stones for it! She strops up to .1m
Very informative review. And your commenters below are among the most knowledgeable of knife review enthusiasts. My only complaint is that you don't hold still when your speaking and holding the knives. You're nervous and fidgety. And you're jingling and jangling the knives like you're on cocaine.
Would love to see a strongarm in S30V.
JeepJeep234 no
JeepJeep234 that would be awesome but also expensive
Something tougher would be ideal. Like 3V or A2
not at all 420hc is way better for this knife!
I’d buy that for a dollar 🤣🤣
The uncoated Gerber Strongman looks nice with that gray handle. They work fine on Deer dressing in the field.
Very informative regarding grinds and edge retention. I’ve converted all of my convex edges to flat or V grinds. Thank you for confirming my suspicions. Dr Dave
This is eye-opening for two reasons. 1) It means if I reprofile my current Strongarm (420HC) I can improve edge retention by a good 50%. 2) For a few bucks more I can also get a huge jump in retention with the BDZ1 version. Can't lose!
Charles Collier - i wouldnt exactly call either a "huge jump" in retention.
the only real advantage to either steel is its ease of sharpening in the field.
id rather have ANY other steel and other knife because of it though.
Thanks for the awesome tests. I just bought the strongarm in bdz1 liking it so far.
Thanks, just ordered one in 420, since the price of the BDZ1 blades has doubled.
I have been eye balling the grey strongarm for a while now.
I have the original version, just like a prodigy just a better handle and sheath. Good knives, their stupid tough.
I figured the bdz1 would do better, but I don't know much about the steel so I thought it would have been higher. Either way, I'm probably just gunna stick with my 420HC strongarm, not a big enough increase to warrent buying another one in my opinion.
Never heard of the BDZ1
I really enjoy all the work you put in to testing, as I sit at the table eating a sandwich! Seems to me a blade w/ edge holding properties w/ at least 150-200 passes would be more useful in da bush! Just wondering. For years I was pretty low tech, using a buck 110. Now I carry and fish w/ a Para 3 Blurple 110V. Now that holds an edge like a champ. I cleaned 24 trout/bass last weekend, here in Alaska and the edge is still like a razor at 20 degrees. Just saying for me 110v is great.
Congratulation, another informative and well made video. Greetings from Italy.
Great video and I love the tunes, felt like mega man was being played in the background.
You know he is a gamer using FF sound tracks!
I knew there'd be no surprises in this video, was fun to watch anyways.
One option Gerber could add is a hammer pommel instead of the striker one.
Fairly new subscriber and haven't commented until now I guess. I just watched your "philosophy" video. I enjoy your reviewing style and honest opinion. Haven't been able to find too many reviewers I enjoy. I'm subscribed to most of the larger knife channels nick shabazz, nutnfancy, apostlep, etc. I enjoy the outlook you have as well. Figured I'd give my opinion and rant my appreciation a little
Great video. I got the bdz1 strongarm, but the bevel was really wide at the tip. I haven’t seen another with the bevel so jacked up.
The one I received had a wide tip also.
Boogieman007 : well I feel better now. Thanks for sharing my friend
This is common manufacturing issue with some makers. I think it has to do with the method they use for putting an edge bevel on not accounting for the upswept tip. I have a Viper Odino (with the really heavily upswept point) where the edge bevel was almost nonexistent on the tip. Some of my Ontario fixed blades suffer from the same issue as well.
Brad Hutchison yeah I have a griptilian that has the same problem. I wonder why most knives look fine, then you get some that have a wide tip bevel?
49Giants I feel like it's a misapplication of machining techniques that work fine on knives without so much belly at the tip. Also, quite frankly, we are talking about Gerber here. Yes, the strongarm is clearly a great knife, but shitty quality control has been a hallmark of that company for a decade at least.
Good on you. for a first time purchase the bdz-1 over the original. Great comparison I have the Fine edge Prodigy. and has served me well. instead of the Original Strongarm. With the harder steel. and better edge retention would be well worth the Purchase now. for the Strong arm. Although would require better sharpening equipment in the Field. softer steel is easier to make sharp even if it doesn't stay sharp as long. Harder steel more time to maintain therefore more restrictions as too application of Work and stress.
As far as i know the black coating is an oxide so you will have to sand it off. From my experience with epoxy stripers it will melt the plastic handle.
MickyMouseLimited
Thanks for mentioning that. I would have ended up melting the handle.
No problem.
Can't wait for the stainless test!
Well one things for sure, you definitely make a case for a Lansky v grind over convex. I would like to see another Kobun test with the v ground Lansky edge, or any Cold Steel aus 8. I was quite turned off to Aus 8 after seeing your tests.
I know this is old video but where in Australia can you buy one in BDZ1.
Damn,that music made me think I was watching love boat
love the choice of music
Wait... I've been working on my BDZ-1 with the Lansky for a good hour to get it from the factory 40 deg. to a 20 deg. profile. Using the red course stone with plenty of oil. It's taking FOREVER just to get the profile changed! What am I doing wrong???
Sriracha HOT - use diamond.
the edge is thick and theres a lot of material to remove going to 20° per side. xtra course diamond will go much faster.
Now you should test their toughness.
Edge retention is nice, but a folder with more expensive steel will outcut both easily.
It's their toughness that should matter here.
Do a "Joe X test" between the two.
Mine has a thinner saber thickness than both my 420 strongarm and prodigy's. It does come with a small v grind but definitely a different saber thickness, I love it with wood it's a big difference for me. Mainly what I've noticed is that the 420 gets little dings and rolls after a day out needing a quick ceramic rod but the BDZ1 just a nice strop and she's good.
Your test is right on the money with my experience, THANKYOU FOR DOING A PROPER TEST.
I seen a comment on a certain somebody's page saying this test doesn't matter with fixed blades, he pretty much stuck a nose up in the air toward your direction crapping on your whole process. I'm not sure if he meant to sound like a douche but it did.
I unsubscribed I'm done with certain folks, plus 5 minutes of batoning a stick and making feathersticks is getting beyond boring. guess what everybody ....your $60 Strongarm and $75 (USA sorry bud) Garberg, can do everything that their $250 knife can.
Am I bitter NO, awake YES... are expensive knives cool HECK YEAH! but you are not some infomercial you're a true fan and lover of blades😉
Please do what ya do and keep advancing, you're hilarious laid back and you are not trying to sale us stuff or looking for free stuff by making 5 minute batoning reruns.
Hope ya don't think I'm being a negative Nelly ....I'm just tired of certain things. I had Lilly call me a" lousy sexes" for saying Big Boys in a comment that I was obviously meaning GROWN UPS😒 Yep after years subbed there I unsubbed ....ugh! I have no reason to watch someone pound a knife though rocks cause they want more drive by clickbait #s Its just the truth. RUclips survival channels like that are not going to last anymore .....,or will they😕
yeah there are some intense cats around YT land! I try and be nice as I can be!
Who was it, out of interest? I know my tests are a little obtuse for some folks but all I ask is if they dont like em to leave em!
oh wait I reread it properly, if it was just a rando commenter, no worries at all! I get pleant of those! Would be curious if other youtubers were baggin me lol
Cedric & Ada Gear and Outdoors Honestly it was Living Survival, he wasn't being direct and most likely wasn't being hateful. BUT its like he was talking down to you, I'm not trying start stuff at all....I personally am just making changes esp with who I sub to and really paying more attention to what I get out of watching their channels.
Many knife channels give us nothing esp certain "survival bushcraft" stuff. I've learned a ton of stuff in the last 5 years about knives mainly from using them, I'm done watching rehashed feathersticking infomercials. I really like Ben he seems like a nice guy, I just see a pattern with some of these big channels that have become way to commercialized. Its like everyone is racing to get a knife with their logo on the side, so to do so ya gotta pump out 100 feather stick vids and get 10000 likes.
I think your test is very important, when I pay $150+ for a knife that says CPM 3V it better be CPM 3V and no amount of feathersticking is gonna prove that, but your actual WORK.....LITERALLY SWEATING does this.
I'm very thankful for channels like yours....But like I said he probably didn't say anything that many would call wrong, mainly its the big picture for me.....I see the whole forest not just the tree.
Airik1111 oh yeah - nah I saw that. Hes cool, I kinda got what he was sayin. Its not super important to a lot of folks how much their edges last with the fixed blades. I remember thinking ‘oh yeah thats me lol’
Both are great knifes. I'll take one of each haha! I've got the 420 but two good knifes are better than one.
Exactly
Thanks again for another great video!Work sharp sales pitch is that Convex edges last longer, are more robust. I am continuously seeing that the V grind last longer in your testing. Do you think that is because of the more refined edge you get from the Lansky? What’s your thoughts? Do you think the work sharp Ken onion edition would produce an edge closer to Lansky? Also I’m curious about the difference between the Tormek edge and the Lansky edge?
Where can I get the BDZ1 version?
Stupid question but what song is this ?
Would love to see you put the BDZ1 through the same punishment you put the 420HC through. Drive it into a tree and stand on it!
Hey, Pete. Which version of "Blinded by Light" is this? If that is indeed the piece. I want. I need.
Well... I was sort of interested in the BDZ1 version, hoping for numbers close to BD1... But I rather just get something in 14c28n, with a better edge geometry.
Ps, just checked Your earlier Strongarm result, that was 48, so nice and consisntent data, love it!
What brand and model is your sharpener?
Strongarm is reported to have a blade of 4.8 inches. Can you tell me the exact length of the cutting edge?
May I ask where did you get the BDZ in Australia? and for how much? It's beautiful and IMO well worth the bit more you pay for it. At least from what I can see in Amazon.
How does the sharpening compare?
where do you get that sharpener?
you ever find out? I want one too lol
Have to come up with a toughness test. Maybe drop on to metal edge use microscope to measure?
How long does it take to sharpen one vs. the other? Does one require more specialized tools to sharpen vs. the other? For field use it might matter.
mountainhobo they would both be okay for field use I reckon. The BDZ1 needed a little longer to get the convex curve off, but not a huge amount and nowhere near a powder steel like M4 or S30V
mountainhobo from what I've understood it's better to have a flat secondary bevel, in this case the lansky system for "in field" touch up. I own a work sharp and put most my edges on it. A work sharp creates a secondary convex grind, this can make the edge stronger but harder to sharpen if you're away from the device not unless you carry a leather strop. Either way is fine just depends on the edge retention and what you're using your knife for.
mr774porkchop i can definitely see the benefit in a small micro so you can easier keep a working edge from a pocketstone in field, for sure
The handle on the Strongarm seems awkward. In your opinion how comfortable or discomforting is the handle?
Strongarm handle works great. I have used it on a whitetail and two black bears.
Good Job Mate !
I might have missed something - you said you sharpened them to 20 deg first time, and then 20 deg in the second round. What was the difference that improved their performance so significantly in the second round?
mountainhobo the worksharp edge convexes over - its a bit more round. The V edge with the lansky is a little more acute and seems to get better results.
Yes, the difference was significant. Thanks.
You are measuring a level of sharpness at the end by cutting the paper. The v edge increases its initial sharpness so it has a head start kind of. Pete if you see this maybe try initial sharpness test by cutting through some consistent material on a scale.
So HIGH CARBON has less carbon than the other one?
Would my Gerber Prodigy hold up against a Strong arm, since it’s the same 420HC full tang?
I say it would be close or about the same
If i cant sharpen on a stone...i dont need that steel...but iam old...any replys?
you can sharpen anything on a stone, 420 is especially easy
So yeah. Useful comparison.
Nice test mate. If you decide to do an attribute test, I'll look forward to it (drunk grammar)
Have you ever seen a kangaroo? :) Nice test again pete!
Would you say buck 119 with 420hc or Gerber strong arm 420hc?
really different grinds, I reckon the strongarm would feel like a splitting wedge after using the hollow ground 119! The 420 would likely be better in the buck one too, as my experieneces seem to show
Rob Martin I snapped a 119 and my strongarm has held up for a year now
Ricky Bullington gerber is mostly trash but buck is the same
dont strip for corrsion testing. and toughness with out "destructive testing" might be hard to pull off.
Thank Joe X for doing that for us.
And the Strongarm 420HC came out extremely good.
For the love of all things good will you lansky aus 8 !!! Please x
My Al Mar Falcon doesnt fit on the lansky, but theres a couple SOGs I’ve been looking for that should do the trick
It's amazing what just a bit more carbon can do.. :)
.45 is rather low in carbon yes. They don't break that easy. That's an advantage in some uses.
Like breaking open windows/doors with it.
I don't need a knife for that. Some might ?
Very cool bro.
👍😎👍
Another informative review. I have and use both of those sharpeners. Love the work sharp for its convenience but when I really want to put a crazy sharp edge on something, the lansky is my go to. I usually finish the edge off on a loaded strop for the win.
Don't worry, I won't tell Square Enix.
Good video 📹 👍
Nice final fantasy theme song.
You should get the KME. Its a Lamborghini where as the lansky is a 95' civic lol. Diamonds last a thousand times longer as well...And you can get chosera stones for it! She strops up to .1m
Just proves lansky for the win!!! Lol I still dont like my worksharp knife n took very much it just eats steel n does not leave as fine an edge....
hey buddy where the dancing girls at and whats with all that rope seems pretty freaky to an old guy like me
labour in u.s?
don't hesitate to buy then
Pretty good
They both suck. Come on Gerber you give us this great carry system for poor steel.
Very informative review. And your commenters below are among the most knowledgeable of knife review enthusiasts.
My only complaint is that you don't hold still when your speaking and holding the knives. You're nervous and fidgety. And you're jingling and jangling the knives like you're on cocaine.
👍👍👍
Forget the music. None of you RUclipsrs know how to find the right music or to modulate it so that it does not drown out speech.
I was watching this and thought of you ruclips.net/video/VEaV_8bzuDQ/видео.html
Best Wishes from Bonnie Scotland !!!
Less gabering more cutting.
less negativity, more contribution