Belguim Burgundy Tree is just Science Fiction by this point So lemme get this straight, a Walloon guy (French guy) Supports the Flemish (Dutch speakers), makes dutch the official language???? And then Restores Burgundy A HISTORICALLY FRENCH/LATIN SPEAKING NATION?????? AND THEN RESTORES THE *ROMAN PROVINCE OF BELGICA* WITH DUTCH A GERMANIC LANGUAGE STILL BEING THE ONLY OFFICIAL ONE???? WTH
Really good thoughts. As a paradox developer I would feel silly after hearing your excellent ideas and letting all these chances for these alternate timelines slip. Keep up the good work :)
Answering your first point regarding the alt history of germany, i believe that the devs allowing us to start the civil war as soon as the game starts can be historically credible since the game begins right before the remilitarization of the Rhineland which was seen as a very dangerous and frankly stupid act for many generals and officers in the Wermacht .Because if the entente powers had chosen to intervene (which they were fully in the capacity to) Germany would have been crushed in weeks. Although this event presents itself as a less blatant opportunity for a coup than the Oster Conspiracy it make some sense. And of course this decision was also made with a gameplay focus since Germany is the “main country” and has to get back on its feet fast to go to war in 1939/1940.
Not to mention the fact that a lot of people probably just don't want to play as the Nazis but still want to play as Germany (me; I deliberately held off playing as Germany until I had ahistorical content for it. While I *have* played as historical Germany, it's a lot less fun to think about my conquests in those runs).
honestly PDX should just let the Hoi4 devs make a ww1 era game cuz based on the ahistorical branches that they've been making that are basically ww1 LARP that must be what they want to do
I love WW1 but the game would be boring as hell, cuz eastern front-easy conquest, Western front-staring contest, but it definitely would sell, maybe they could make the time tick by faster, buut WW1 was short, Only 4 years
There are HOI4 mods with very long periods before (or even total lack of) world war, but they generally have to include economy minigames and geopolitical proxy fighting in order to be playable and some people just do not enjoy that sort of game. I think starting HOI4 in 1933 would have been the best option to give players a slightly extended build-up while not overstaying its welcome or necessitating new geopolitical interaction mechanics.
for the encription, la resistance adds that. I guess the idea is that other countries "just" didn’t focus on encryption in the spy agency enough fully agree on the mines though. special project would be fitting, especially as germany didn’t research a lot of other (non-submarine) naval special projects
Honestly i wouldnt be agaisnt them creating a 1930 stardate. the best part of the game is the buildup tbh. the actual war can become a slog. but yeah it would make the alt histroy stuff far more viable. also the german civil war needs far more build up. like have hitler assasinated by the army and that causes a chain of reactions. and then perhaps as the military junta you could free political prisioners to fight with you such as democrats and leftists
The issue with your peace offers idea is that *several dozen* were send by Hitler. They got ignored. Same issue with Himmler trying to broker a deal. They didn't even want to deal with the rogue Wehrmacht officers wanting to depose Hitler, much less someone from his inner circle. The allies wanted "Prussia" gone. And the Wehrmacht was littered with generals coming from the Prussian nobility. With a lot of the same Prussian nobility wanting to do away with Hitler. As for why they wanted Prussia gone? Because Prussia managed to modernize without liberalizing. And that was anathema to the liberal democracies of the world, like the UK, France, USA etc.The so-called enlightened absolutism. And this legacy continued to exist post ww1, but got killed in ww2 with the giving of territory to poland and denazification not just targeting nazi ideology but Prussian cultural values as well, which had been purposefully conflated with nazism. Funnily enough, Hitler wanted to do away with the prussian legacy of Germany as well. He believed in a pan-german unity, with people rising from the low ranks of society everywhere in germany, not just from the low nobility of prussia. That is one of the reasons Rommel was so highly praised and propagandized within germany (and in the allies), he came from modern-day Baden-Württemberg, from a middle class family. Ie not of noble blood and not prussian.
There's a military dictatorship alternative to the kaiser, this COULD have happened since the people around Stauffenberg planned to cause a state of emergency in which the military should have total control over politics (von Witzleben would have been the supreme commander and he was an accomplice who could then negotiate a peace deal and return the country back to democracy). It's not quite the original concept but something like a military government was possible. But I agree that most of the "spicy fun" was over in 36. Politically Germany was much more interesting when the communists were still strong or even when there was some opposition within the Nazi party itself (Ernst Rohm, Gregor Strasser)
The Stauffenberg conspiracy was hopelessly naive at best, evil at worst. They legitimately believed that they could negotiate with the Allies, but the Allies already decided a year earlier to not accept any negotiations from any Axis power. So the only thing Stauffenberg would have achieved was a civil war and hastened defeat of Germany, which in practice likely would have meant that the Americans would've gone through with the Morgenthau plan, looting the nation of anything of value and deliberately starving the population in a sort of twisted Allied version of Generalplan Ost
My thoughts are that diplomacy in hoi4 is not up to snuff. In Vic and Eu diplomacy is dynamic. The ai doesn’t do things because it feels like it should, or wants to, it does things because historical focus is on and it’s following the focus path. It’s told, “you need to let Germany do these things then you guarantee Poland. If the ai could be dynamic and make decisions on its own it would be more immersive and more in depth. You then could send a peace deal to the UK and the ai could decide if it wants to continue the fight. Alliances and who the ai wants to work with could be more practical instead of “well fascist uk path focus tree has ally Italy so we can only do that.
12:29 This really isn't true and there are half a dozen videos explaining why. Everyone on the war cabinet (minus Halifax) was in favour of continuing the war, including Chamberlain, and Halifax would either be forced by them to refuse surrender OR be put off by the terms of such a deal. PERSONALLY, I agree with the white peace idea but think it should be dependent on British casualties so far or something else whoch would actually affect the cabinet.
The reason the Axis has so many buffs is because the allies have the USA lol in late game the USA and the USSR become unbeatable, so to balance the game out they give the Axis ahistorical buffs, even with all the buffs once the USA get involved and the USSR loses it's debuffs from the purge the game is usually over
People complained about the balance of power being a thing for Italy iirc. Also paradox just adds isolated mechanics left and right. The game is a mess.
You spit historical misinformation here. Nobody on the war council wanted to actually accept the German offers of peace that they had so far proposed, the argument was over whether peace talks should be held at all.
I also completely agree with you, the game isnt balanced well. USA and Uk and tbh all the allies need love. democracy in general needs love too. i dont think paradox love the nazis but it is undeniable how powerful the nazi larp is. and also i get not wanting to gameify the holocaust but nazism is truly an evil ideology and in the game it does unintentially glorify it by not speaking of the horrors that it caused. the ideology is built on oppression and extermination and non of that is really mentioned. same with stalin tbh like he did a lot of horrible things but at least with stalin in the game you get the sense of his paranoia and the massive purges he did. hitler also did a lot of purges. where is the event where rommel is shot in the back of the head on hitlers orders, or where many miltary men plot against you and are subsquinetly purged.
to be fair, starting out of the civil war, tsarist supporters still existed, who helped germany in the war. and as you pointed out, germany also did a lot of purges. which I think means that against spy agency actions like prepare collaboration government, spread ideology and the propaganda one that decreases stability, the purge mechanic should be a general mechanic for all countries to counteract that. I think Stalins concerns about the white army that went in hiding were valid, yet the methods of the bolsheviks were oftentimes misdirected or ineffective (reminder of the CIA document stating that "Even in Stalin‘s time there was collective leadership. The Western idea of a dictator within the Communist setup is exaggerated. Misunderstandings on that subject are caused by lack of comprehension of the real nature and organization of the Communist power structure. Stalin, although holding wide powers, was merely the captain of a team and it seems obvious that Krushev will be the new captain.") keep in mind that the knowledge of hindsight is an unrealistic aspect of hoi4 politicians and military high command at that time didn’t have access to
Belguim Burgundy Tree is just Science Fiction by this point
So lemme get this straight, a Walloon guy (French guy) Supports the Flemish (Dutch speakers), makes dutch the official language???? And then Restores Burgundy A HISTORICALLY FRENCH/LATIN SPEAKING NATION?????? AND THEN RESTORES THE *ROMAN PROVINCE OF BELGICA* WITH DUTCH A GERMANIC LANGUAGE STILL BEING THE ONLY OFFICIAL ONE???? WTH
yes
I think they should have made the magnetic mines a special research and also buff the hell out of them to make them worth it
Really good thoughts.
As a paradox developer I would feel silly after hearing your excellent ideas and letting all these chances for these alternate timelines slip.
Keep up the good work :)
Me too my dad is also the CEO of Microsoft
Answering your first point regarding the alt history of germany, i believe that the devs allowing us to start the civil war as soon as the game starts can be historically credible since the game begins right before the remilitarization of the Rhineland which was seen as a very dangerous and frankly stupid act for many generals and officers in the Wermacht .Because if the entente powers had chosen to intervene (which they were fully in the capacity to) Germany would have been crushed in weeks. Although this event presents itself as a less blatant opportunity for a coup than the Oster Conspiracy it make some sense.
And of course this decision was also made with a gameplay focus since Germany is the “main country” and has to get back on its feet fast to go to war in 1939/1940.
Not to mention the fact that a lot of people probably just don't want to play as the Nazis but still want to play as Germany (me; I deliberately held off playing as Germany until I had ahistorical content for it. While I *have* played as historical Germany, it's a lot less fun to think about my conquests in those runs).
honestly PDX should just let the Hoi4 devs make a ww1 era game cuz based on the ahistorical branches that they've been making that are basically ww1 LARP that must be what they want to do
true tbh
I love WW1 but the game would be boring as hell, cuz eastern front-easy conquest, Western front-staring contest, but it definitely would sell, maybe they could make the time tick by faster, buut WW1 was short, Only 4 years
HOI really should've started in 1932
Imagine the late game lag starting at 1939
id honestly i would say even 1930. 1936 was defo a mistake tho. the best part of the game is the build up phase
@@SchmandlineCrewthis would require paradox to have a better engine that isn't so laggy as the game rolls on.
Without expanded inner politics global mechanics (a stretched focus tree wont solve the problem), an extended build up phase sounds like hell.
There are HOI4 mods with very long periods before (or even total lack of) world war, but they generally have to include economy minigames and geopolitical proxy fighting in order to be playable and some people just do not enjoy that sort of game. I think starting HOI4 in 1933 would have been the best option to give players a slightly extended build-up while not overstaying its welcome or necessitating new geopolitical interaction mechanics.
for the encription, la resistance adds that. I guess the idea is that other countries "just" didn’t focus on encryption in the spy agency enough
fully agree on the mines though. special project would be fitting, especially as germany didn’t research a lot of other (non-submarine) naval special projects
Honestly i wouldnt be agaisnt them creating a 1930 stardate. the best part of the game is the buildup tbh. the actual war can become a slog. but yeah it would make the alt histroy stuff far more viable. also the german civil war needs far more build up. like have hitler assasinated by the army and that causes a chain of reactions. and then perhaps as the military junta you could free political prisioners to fight with you such as democrats and leftists
Might be a good idea for a DLC.
The issue with your peace offers idea is that *several dozen* were send by Hitler. They got ignored.
Same issue with Himmler trying to broker a deal. They didn't even want to deal with the rogue Wehrmacht officers wanting to depose Hitler, much less someone from his inner circle. The allies wanted "Prussia" gone. And the Wehrmacht was littered with generals coming from the Prussian nobility. With a lot of the same Prussian nobility wanting to do away with Hitler.
As for why they wanted Prussia gone? Because Prussia managed to modernize without liberalizing. And that was anathema to the liberal democracies of the world, like the UK, France, USA etc.The so-called enlightened absolutism. And this legacy continued to exist post ww1, but got killed in ww2 with the giving of territory to poland and denazification not just targeting nazi ideology but Prussian cultural values as well, which had been purposefully conflated with nazism.
Funnily enough, Hitler wanted to do away with the prussian legacy of Germany as well. He believed in a pan-german unity, with people rising from the low ranks of society everywhere in germany, not just from the low nobility of prussia. That is one of the reasons Rommel was so highly praised and propagandized within germany (and in the allies), he came from modern-day Baden-Württemberg, from a middle class family. Ie not of noble blood and not prussian.
I had heard that this patch was going to add the anglo-german alliance. I was lied to, I cried.
There's a military dictatorship alternative to the kaiser, this COULD have happened since the people around Stauffenberg planned to cause a state of emergency in which the military should have total control over politics (von Witzleben would have been the supreme commander and he was an accomplice who could then negotiate a peace deal and return the country back to democracy). It's not quite the original concept but something like a military government was possible.
But I agree that most of the "spicy fun" was over in 36. Politically Germany was much more interesting when the communists were still strong or even when there was some opposition within the Nazi party itself (Ernst Rohm, Gregor Strasser)
The Stauffenberg conspiracy was hopelessly naive at best, evil at worst. They legitimately believed that they could negotiate with the Allies, but the Allies already decided a year earlier to not accept any negotiations from any Axis power. So the only thing Stauffenberg would have achieved was a civil war and hastened defeat of Germany, which in practice likely would have meant that the Americans would've gone through with the Morgenthau plan, looting the nation of anything of value and deliberately starving the population in a sort of twisted Allied version of Generalplan Ost
Some really nice points... I like how you mentioned MINES lol. Some really nice lore
My thoughts are that diplomacy in hoi4 is not up to snuff. In Vic and Eu diplomacy is dynamic. The ai doesn’t do things because it feels like it should, or wants to, it does things because historical focus is on and it’s following the focus path. It’s told, “you need to let Germany do these things then you guarantee Poland. If the ai could be dynamic and make decisions on its own it would be more immersive and more in depth. You then could send a peace deal to the UK and the ai could decide if it wants to continue the fight. Alliances and who the ai wants to work with could be more practical instead of “well fascist uk path focus tree has ally Italy so we can only do that.
12:29 This really isn't true and there are half a dozen videos explaining why. Everyone on the war cabinet (minus Halifax) was in favour of continuing the war, including Chamberlain, and Halifax would either be forced by them to refuse surrender OR be put off by the terms of such a deal.
PERSONALLY, I agree with the white peace idea but think it should be dependent on British casualties so far or something else whoch would actually affect the cabinet.
The reason the Axis has so many buffs is because the allies have the USA lol in late game the USA and the USSR become unbeatable, so to balance the game out they give the Axis ahistorical buffs, even with all the buffs once the USA get involved and the USSR loses it's debuffs from the purge the game is usually over
People complained about the balance of power being a thing for Italy iirc.
Also paradox just adds isolated mechanics left and right. The game is a mess.
I thought there is such decision with Halifax in power? Was it some mod?..
Halifax can power if WW2 doesn’t start in time.
You spit historical misinformation here. Nobody on the war council wanted to actually accept the German offers of peace that they had so far proposed, the argument was over whether peace talks should be held at all.
I also completely agree with you, the game isnt balanced well. USA and Uk and tbh all the allies need love. democracy in general needs love too. i dont think paradox love the nazis but it is undeniable how powerful the nazi larp is. and also i get not wanting to gameify the holocaust but nazism is truly an evil ideology and in the game it does unintentially glorify it by not speaking of the horrors that it caused. the ideology is built on oppression and extermination and non of that is really mentioned. same with stalin tbh like he did a lot of horrible things but at least with stalin in the game you get the sense of his paranoia and the massive purges he did. hitler also did a lot of purges. where is the event where rommel is shot in the back of the head on hitlers orders, or where many miltary men plot against you and are subsquinetly purged.
to be fair, starting out of the civil war, tsarist supporters still existed, who helped germany in the war. and as you pointed out, germany also did a lot of purges. which I think means that against spy agency actions like prepare collaboration government, spread ideology and the propaganda one that decreases stability, the purge mechanic should be a general mechanic for all countries to counteract that. I think Stalins concerns about the white army that went in hiding were valid, yet the methods of the bolsheviks were oftentimes misdirected or ineffective (reminder of the CIA document stating that "Even in Stalin‘s time there was collective leadership. The Western idea of a dictator within the Communist setup is exaggerated. Misunderstandings on that subject are caused by lack of comprehension of the real nature and organization of the Communist power structure. Stalin, although holding wide powers, was merely the captain of a team and it seems obvious that Krushev will be the new captain.") keep in mind that the knowledge of hindsight is an unrealistic aspect of hoi4 politicians and military high command at that time didn’t have access to
neat video, cool stuff.
Nice video❤️
fdr is not a popular president lol
He was popular enough to win 3 terms in row lmao
@sejozwak 4 times actually, he just died very early on in his fourth term.
@@carthagegamingstudios I thought he died late into third
He won in 32, 36, 40, and 44
@@sejozwak he is not popular today because people know see he was a socialist, you commie bootlicker.