Oh what an amazing documentary. I have watched and read everything I can find on this topic. So happy this was put on here. Thank you 🙏 as a trauma therapist that works on the Veterans Crisis and Suicide Hot Line at the VA. I have to say that the things that were seen and done on the Western Front would have molded a mind of trauma and the very fact that if you stare into the abyss too long it will stare back into you. Meaning risks for combat veterans are not the same for reg ppl. The brain is wired differently. Sorry for the long post.
@@trentcruise3084 Thank you for your kind words. It is an absolute honor to work with and help what I consider to be a nation's greatest jewels our men and women, in both active duty and combat vets.
That was a wonderful comment. I for one, would have been quite happy with an even longer post. These men must have been so altered and desensitized to human trauma and suffering, I can imagine the magnitude of this experience might be one of the few things that could distance them from that history and let them feel again.
I was in the Kathmandu airport and Met Conrad, we sat next to each other and he told me what happened. This was like in the stone age of email and internet so it was like I heard what would take a few months to hit the media of the Discovery.
My mother and I found out a long time friend of ours in the Quaker community was the daughter of George Mallory, Claire Milliken, after Mallory's body was found and the world news beat a path to her door. It was surreal. Before her death I asked her if finding her father gave her closure. She basically answered me by saying when she heard how he was found, with broken ankle (or was it leg?), hands outstretched obviously in agony, she felt a great sorrow and retroactive worry about how long he had suffered. And she had been a mountain-climber herself, her two sons were climbers and her husband died in a climbing accident. She let me know that her great regret was that she didn't have the opportunity to grow up with her father in her life, rather than growing up with a memory of a great mountaineer. I believe she was only about three years old when he vanished on Everest.
Sadly, by quenching our thirst for clarity on the mystery of her father and Sandy Irvine summiting first in 1924, we re-opened her wounds. Thank you for making her and her family real. She sounds like she was a tremendous person in her own right and was lucky to have a good friend who loved her to share her with us.
The Millikan-Mallory family connection is astonishing. Before learning of it (Conrad Anker/David Roberts ‘The Lost Explorer’) I had already developed independent interests in George Mallory and Robert A. Millikan. I have an extensive interest in philosophy of science. Millikan’s ingenious ‘oil-drop’ experiments, resulting in a definitive determination of the value of the unitary electric charge, is a dramatic study in its own right. That Mallory and Irvine may have summitted what is among the most prominent of observable phenomena is as humbling a feat before Nature as Millikan’s exploration into the nigh unobservable.
Davis Wade. His style, love and mastery of spoken word adds another dimension to the story which is already epic. People like him are a reminder why for thousands of years we gathered around fire listening and learning. Learning about people spoken of here - "heros" - who dared to leap into the unknown and open new horizons. Thank you
This is really cool, I was in Nepal trekking Annaupurna may 1999, and sure enough I was in the KAT airport , here come these men in Fancy North Face gear, Duffle bags, cameras, Conrad and I cracked a Beer and he informed me of what he found, how cool!
Every story we read about Mount Everest are interesting especially those 1921, 22 and the epic 1924 conquest of Everest as they had to walk for weeks to get to their fiest base camp at the foot of Mount Everest. Their clothing, their climbing equipment and rations were somewhat basic to what climbers need today. We take off our Hats to those early "Men of Men" who put Mount Everest on the list of, The Mountain to Climb, Mallory & Irvine's Mountain.
Initially my expectation of this video were disappointed but by the end I found myself moved and Wade Davies summation moved me almost to tears - Mr Davis sir may it not be so...
I'm totally obsessed with Mallory and Irvine!!! They are my heros and why I climb. Never did Everest but was always my dream. I would climb the North side. I just wish we could find Sandy's body!
And now sadly, we know that the '75 Chinese expedition that Phanthog was a part of found Sandy and his camera, took the camera, and then concealed ever finding him at 8200M because they botched trying to develop the film.
@@kippamipSeveral published statements from accomplished Chinese climbers who have multiple everest summits under their belt, in addition to the actual person that took the camera off his body.
The words of Wade Davis describing these men had me spellbound. I believe him. Giants of men like this won't be found again. Not entirely accurate but it went something like this. "They'll get up in the morning and collect a butterfly for the British Museum. Then they'll paint a watercolour of the mountain before lunch. Over lunch they'll discuss Keynes. Then they'll assault the North Col or go over the top of the trenches at 4pm."
Fascinating documentary. My respects to all mountaineers, climbers and trekkers. Love to see those vintage photographs George Mallory and team. I too laughed at Conrad Anker with period clothing and his friends re-creating 1922-24 scenes very brave men. Tea anyone :) Wow! so that is how Mt Everest got it's name (1862 Colonel Sir George Everest) learned something new. R.I.P. all those men and women that the majestic mountain has claimed.
Maybe, but probably not. The camera footage they released publicly makes it seem like they respected Mallorys corpse. Their desire to collect artifacts on his person. Didn't account for something(summit rock sample) they should've sought in that search which would've cemented if they sumitted. Instead they completely unearthed him to search his person. In turn, absolutely destroyed the possibility of understanding if they summited without finding Irving's body and potential camera film.
@ Nick Raschke . I DOUBT VERY MUCH THAT MALLORY WOULD LOVE THAT HIS BODY WAS CRUSHED BY THEM LIKE IT WAS . THE PHOTOS ARE VERY SAD TO LOOK AT . IF THE PICTURES ARE REAL AND THEY SEEM TO BE. THE ROCKS NEVER SHOULD HAVE BEEN PUT ON HIM. I CAN NOT STAND THEM.
Having read Wade Davis's book, the subject of Mallory and Irvine has fascinated me ever since. This presentation skates over a number of factors that should have been explored further. George Finch who was on the 1922 expedition and achieved the altitude record was at the time one of the world's leading experts on oxygen deprivation hence his reliance on bottled oxygen and the ease with which he made his climb was noted at the time. Mallory was not in favour of using oxygen until he saw what Finch achieved and became a reluctant convert. However, Finch was denied a place on the '24 expedition because he had undertaken a paid lecture tour in Europe which the Everest Committee who organised these expeditions thought smacked of the action of someone who was not a gentleman. Mallory did not like Finch (it appeared he had something against colonials) but he appeared to recognise those who could assist him. With no disrespect to Irvine, Finch and Mallory would have been a stronger team in '24. The other factor not mentioned was that Mallory knew his attempt was very late in the climbing season and had been advised not to make the attempt due to deteriorating weather. In addition, his absent-mindedness had caused him to forget sleeping bags for the Sherpas who as a result were not able to assist any further and in fact led to the death of one of them. Incidentally, I highly recommend Davis's book on the subject of these 3 expeditions, "Into The Silence".
bro please do some more research into it their book is riddled with factual inaccuracies and outright lies. their argument isn't even internally consistent
@@baileyayyy5085 Are you referring to Davis's book or another. I don't understand when you refer to "their argument" when in Davis's case he was the only author.
@@peterlovett5841 I'm referring to the lost explorer which contradicts itself repeatedly and was created by both. Davis's take changed multiple times (from before the book) based on what his peers were saying and its pretty obvious to me that the main 'researchers' on this case are colluding to make each other look good. Among other things, they are factually inaccurate about several key points of their assessment including the weather, oxygen supply, and 'missing' cook stove which can be easily disproven by very basic fact checking. Their theory cannot provide a reasonable timeline which corroborates indisputable facts. David has plenty of good analysis in the book but their take on Malory is completely outrageous even if he didn't summit and has misinformed a ton of people. Not trying to be an asshole but this is really frustrating to me given how widespread very basic inaccuracies have become.
@@baileyayyy5085 Okay, "The Lost Explorer" was written by Conrad Anker and David Roberts and I haven't read that so unaware of the arguments they make. What Davis's opinion was before he wrote his book I do not know; his book was my introduction to the whole subject apart from the basic background information. I am not accusing you of anything and if I give that impression then I apologise. There are now so many theories out there about what happened to Mallory and Irvine (including conspiracy stuff about stolen bodies) that I doubt the truth will ever be known. I would rather think that both bodies lie in peace on the mountain.
This story always fascinates me. The detailed back story on these men was very helpful to understand the drive and grit it would take to climb that incredible mountain in the 1920’s. There certainly sounds like a lot of controversy surrounding the actions of Conrad and team in their treatment of Mallory’s body. I think you have to step back and appreciate their motivation to perform a bit of truth seeking and difficulty of a mountainside autopsy at that altitude. This find was an incredible stroke of luck and sounded like Conrad’s search method and actions should be applauded, not criticized. Their mission was to find Mallory and or Irvine and they accomplished their difficult goal. The bonus was being reminded of the human hell those WW1 vets went through 1914-1919, and what brave and interesting men they truly were. Thank you for the share. I would have liked to hear the Q&A though? Is it available Mr Snow?
Yes, that somewhat naive approach ... and obviously the dry weather conditions of 1999, very little snow. When it was snowy in 2007, he wasn't able to find the place again even though having the GPS coordinates at hand, even though he had personally discovered it.
That's because he had been an accomplished rock climbing expert at that point, which is frankly much more valued in the mountaineering community than high altitude climbing (for comparison, Messner was also an accomplished rock climber before he got his toes amputated and thus losing a good part of this mobility that he "had to give up the more demanding rock climbing to turn to high mountain climbing", then of course he became the first man to summit Everest without Os after switching his focus to this "less technically demanding" endeavor), plus by 1999 "never climbed Everest" doesn't really mean anything in the eyes of expert mountaineers one way or another, since the commercialisation of Everest has helped amateur climbers summitting this once sacred and horrid mountain in droves, as records of following years would show, so long as you have $60k to shell out and you can walk, people over 80 yo, blind people, people with prosthetic legs, etc can all summit Everest. And Mallory was also a skillful rock climber, so the assumption here is that great men think alike, therefore Anker was able to retrace the way Mallory would have climbed as a rock climber (albeit a reckless one, since Mallory did say in order to be the first to summit Everest it's totally worth it to lose some fingers or toes) to finally locate him.
An amazingly uplifting and inspiring perspective from the point of view of the subjects and their historical perspective, which is very telling about the nature of the two speakers also! Thanks for sharing this....
This was very interesting. I've been watching everything about Everest on YT. The algorithm sent me here after visiting Tom Pollard of the Everest Mystery channel. Thanks for posting this video.
40.00 - Conrad says Obell is pointing to the point he last saw Mallory. This is a lie, it's from Messner's book on Everest and climbing, in which Messner captions the photo 'Obell pointing to the location of Mallory's axe'. Be wary of such errors and those who make them....
Given the evidence available and the amount of discussion seen and heard, on the ďisappèarance of Mallory and Irvine, I believe that they did reach the Everest summit, before falling to their death. Àlso, I have always been ďeeply interested in the terrible experiences endured by our youth during the Great War. Ì can well recommend the leading books and audio books mentioned here. My own book, a novel set during that period tells of two of the 250,000 boys who raised their age, to get to the Western Front many were killed or horribly wounded. So thanks for posting this, and to all involved. Jack.
With all the accolades presented about the mountain explorers and their tenacity and perseverance of that time, why would anyone doubt that Mallory and/or Ervine summited Everest on that fateful day? Wade Davis certainly describes them as super human against all odds.
Makes death sound like a punishment or expense of life. To me death is an inevitable consequence of life - the conscious reality of the second law of thermodynamics and the arrow of time. A sublime example of a natural process.
the price of unforgiven sin is death. or, the wages of sin is death. Thank God almighty for his son jesus upon which we can unburden our sorrow, helplessness and loneliness
@@sarki1723 We all die - no exceptions. Even Jesus died. God's capacity for forgiveness and love is infinite so there can be no unforgiven sin. God is not male, doens't have sons.
@@PetraKann …but God will send you to a firey pit to burn in torment and anguish forever if you’re not the kind of person he likes. Clearly God is a psychopath
I wish they had left Mallory's body alone instead of picking his pockets and stuffing him under rocks. As he lay on the exposed face of Everest, he was perfectly preserved, sacrilege!
Outside magazine's cover photo showed Mallory propped up and sitting up when they discovered him. It was very macabre. I delivered that issue in the mail in 1999.
Why does everyone assume M & I attempted the ridge route (2nd step). Norton had only 4 days prior reached 28,200 feet in altitude going up the Great Couloir and he wasn’t on O’s surely Mallory with that insight would have attempted the same route and bypassed the steps? Similar to Messner in 80.
What a terrible example of selling one's soul to toe the publishing co. line by abandoning the authors' real beliefs, opinions and doing a total 180 on prior documented and recorded beliefs and findings in order to produce a complete book of mis-truths, half truths and blatant lies. This is so sad. I count dozens of the authors back peddling and seemingly forgetting prior interviews and writings where they expoused essentially the opposite of their "conclusions" reached in this work of total fiction. They sold out. Check out Michael Tracy's channel for a full explanation of my post. I don't have the stomach to even call out all the lies, post-truth spin and the mountain of factual errors (read "lies"). Davis is particularly disappointing as he once seemed to be a truth teller and wasn't afraid to go in front of a camera and tell it.
Seeing how Mallory and Irvine climbed makes today's climbers look like sissies. It's just not the same. They were truly heros whether they made it or not.
I have always believed that Odell's version of events was completely unreliable. Odell had so many versions of what he saw ( or didn't see ) right up until the time he passed away. Opinions, we are all entitled to our opinions ,, I've studied the subject of Mallory and Irvine for a number of years and I firmly believe that taking all the factors involved they ( both or singularly ) did not summit Everest. If we take one of Odell's versions, he saw upwards at 8,000 two figures at the base of Step Two. That was around 12.50 pm. a storm developed and lasted for about two hours. Mallory and Irvine were never seen again, look at their circumstances up there. Their gear offered them little protection, they were enveloped in a severe storm, the temperature was freezing and their oxygen supply was depleted. The Second Step is formidable to say the least, forty meters high and the final five meters is vertical, a difficult ascent in good weather. I firmly agree with many opinions, if they failed to ascend the Second Step then there was no opportunity of reaching the summit whatsoever.
I'd argue their clothes were woollen and not the thin rubbish clothes are made from today. Real wool can protect you from freezing temperatures. They couldn't have made it wearing suits made in China. Jmo
@@snorkielou4289 working while wet is one of the best things about wool. Their gear was a lot better than people today think, but people still choose modern gear for a reason
Sure they could, today's climbers are way more technically skilled, better conditioned, the routes are well-known and they have accurate weather forecast.
Anker at 40’37 asserts that Odell is pointing “to the last place he saw Mallory”, which is completely inconsistent with Odell’s written version in which he famously stated to have seen Mallory and Irvine on the “the last step but one from the base of the final pyramid". Norton achieved the then altitude record just a few days before Mallory and Irvine via the Great/Norton Colouir route. Anker - like many others, subscribe to the NE Ridge route via the 2nd step. There is plenty of evidence that supports an alternative ascent as Messner did years later. For alternative theories see Michael Tracy’s excellent research on YT.
Ugh. Read The Lost Explorer. Anker very logically explains precisely why they couldn't have reached the top, using only the available evidence discovered after finding Mallory's body. People who still think he reached the top are simply engaging in wishful thinking.
@@BS2Dos Those other theories are wishful thinking. Mallory had no frostbite on his hands or face. That means in order for him to have gotten to the top they'd have had to climb at an astonishingly faster pace, with no fixed ropes and without being properly hydrated, than Anker and his partner made in their ascent in 99, to say nothing of how the equipment and protective gear they had in 1924 paled in comparison to what they had in 99.
@@SECRETARIATguy224 Why would Mallory have contemplated an alternative route via the NE ridge when there is no evidence that supports that such a route was ever considered? Why would Mallory ignore the success Norton had achieved a day earlier via the colouir route and in the process, attaining a new altitude record? It’s inconceivable that Mallory would have elected to take a new route via the NE ridge on his last ascent given Norton’s success 24-hours earlier.
@@BS2Dos You're ignoring the evidence. The timeline established means that if they went the route you're suggesting, they'd have had to climb at a superhuman rate OR they'd have had to camp out at such a high altitude that Mallory would've _had_ to have gotten frostbite on his hands and face. He didn't have any frostbite at all, so therefore they couldn't have camped.
I wonder if his watch crystal popped off from pressure differential. If it was well sealed it would have more pressure inside than the ambient pressure on the mountain top. They may have had oxygen deficiency due to regulating valve failure on way down and suffered from lack of dexterity due to starvation for the brain oxygen on way down. Becoming more vulnerable to a trip and fall and decrease in decision making ability. One thing is for sure the mountain claimed them for her own and she didn’t let them come home. When you think about it that is one mighty impressive monument she provided for them.
I've been thinking the same for the last few months. And if it was moved (thrown, damaged before being thrown, etc.) it would completely erase any present 'understanding' of what really happened.
dont forget all of the forces of nature's elements that have acted on his body; - also, he likely fell a great distance and there is no way of knowing how it impacted his body (his foot); all the years of being acted upon by the elements. there are lots of believable explanations.
A lot are still being ploughed up or found when drainage ditches etc are being dug. I have found bones of soldiers in the fields. Those soldiers are those of the missing. German soldiers were also buried or left. Some graves were later lost due to further battles where shelling destroyed them.
Why would you think that? Did birds ever fly to the moon? Did Penguins climb Mt. Vinson? Or waddle to the South Pole? Did George Washington ever climb Mt. Washington? Did Christofer Columbus discover Columbia? Did someone from Wales invent Whales?
They need to look on the other side of the mountain for Irvine- when they got to the top they did a high five and knocked each other off opposite sides.
One fact that is continually overlooked is that everyone takes a FLAG to place on the summit of Everest. No flag was found on the body of George Mallory, so the logical fact is that if no Union Flag of the UK is discovered on the body of Andrew Irvine (from Birkenhead, Wirral - Roads near to Prenton Park, where Tranmere Rovers have played from 1921 to date, are named Everest, Mallory and Irvine in honour), then it really must be accepted that they both reached the summit..
There's no record he took a flag; not everyone takes one. He SAID he was taking a picture of his wife, but he was notoriously and chronically forgetful, so there's debate over whether he remembered to actually take it. In the end, nobody knows. But yeah, absolutely no record of there being any intent to leave a flag.
@@FabricofTime his daughter said he also wanted to leave a letter from his wife Ruth. Other letters were found on his body but not one from Ruth. This doesn't prove he summited but I like to believe they did.
Jon Krakauer, who in his book blamed everything on Rob Hall's team, whereas all the people who died, other than Rob Hall himself, were on Krakauer's team, while Krakauer himself was hiding from the all the rescue attempts in his tent. Great way to be a hero, Krakauer. Go write another book.
Have to say, I have extreme doubt that Edmund Hillary was actually the first to deserve credit for summiting first. Apparently, Tenzing is worshipped in Nepal for being first. PLUS---- it was a huge team of Nepalese climbers that made that even remotely possible, but never got the credit. SURE!! SIR Edmund Hillary made it first for the media after the "Sherpas" set the ropes for him and hauled all his gear!! As IF.
It was at the end of British colonial rule over India. Every Indian or Nepalese wanted to prove that they were as good as the British. I don't think Tenzing was the first (nor do I think it matters), he never said so himself but I understand the sentiment of local people who worshiped him as a hero. Also, I agree that the expedition would've had zero chance of success without local porters because even getting to the base of Everest with all the supplies was a huge problem. But we need to acknowledge that it was the British who scouted the mountain for possible routes, came up with a strategy, invented the gear and developed mountaineering techniques. It was also them who determined that Everest is actually the highest mountain.
@@jimhere1 .....nobody cares if every single one of those dudes was gay - not sure why they insisted on making it such an integral part of the story.......what difference does it make if they were gay or straight?.....they made this story into brokeback mountain, when it should have been about Mallory and Irvine.
the cooker rolled out of Camp 5 not Camp 6 (high camp) so it would have been replaced...hard to take everything Akers says at face value when he uses false facts to advance his narrative.
Oh what an amazing documentary. I have watched and read everything I can find on this topic. So happy this was put on here. Thank you 🙏 as a trauma therapist that works on the Veterans Crisis and Suicide Hot Line at the VA. I have to say that the things that were seen and done on the Western Front would have molded a mind of trauma and the very fact that if you stare into the abyss too long it will stare back into you. Meaning risks for combat veterans are not the same for reg ppl. The brain is wired differently. Sorry for the long post.
@@trentcruise3084 Thank you for your kind words. It is an absolute honor to work with and help what I consider to be a nation's greatest jewels our men and women, in both active duty and combat vets.
That was a wonderful comment. I for one, would have been quite happy with an even longer post. These men must have been so altered and desensitized to human trauma and suffering, I can imagine the magnitude of this experience might be one of the few things that could distance them from that history and let them feel again.
Lllll9llll
Didn't we lose our last few wars, despite the unlimited expenses?@@tequilasunrise7950
I was in the Kathmandu airport and Met Conrad, we sat next to each other and he told me what happened. This was like in the stone age of email and internet so it was like I heard what would take a few months to hit the media of the Discovery.
My mother and I found out a long time friend of ours in the Quaker community was the daughter of George Mallory, Claire Milliken, after Mallory's body was found and the world news beat a path to her door.
It was surreal. Before her death I asked her if finding her father gave her closure. She basically answered me by saying when she heard how he was found, with broken ankle (or was it leg?), hands outstretched obviously in agony, she felt a great sorrow and retroactive worry about how long he had suffered. And she had been a mountain-climber herself, her two sons were climbers and her husband died in a climbing accident.
She let me know that her great regret was that she didn't have the opportunity to grow up with her father in her life, rather than growing up with a memory of a great mountaineer. I believe she was only about three years old when he vanished on Everest.
This is an amazing story. Thank You for sharing! Did you know she was Mallory's daughter before his body was found?
Best story in the whole comment section.
conrad told me that it was a fall downward because of the broken bones,
Sadly, by quenching our thirst for clarity on the mystery of her father and Sandy Irvine summiting first in 1924, we re-opened her wounds. Thank you for making her and her family real. She sounds like she was a tremendous person in her own right and was lucky to have a good friend who loved her to share her with us.
The Millikan-Mallory family connection is astonishing. Before learning of it (Conrad Anker/David Roberts ‘The Lost Explorer’) I had already developed independent interests in George Mallory and Robert A. Millikan. I have an extensive interest in philosophy of science. Millikan’s ingenious ‘oil-drop’ experiments, resulting in a definitive determination of the value of the unitary electric charge, is a dramatic study in its own right.
That Mallory and Irvine may have summitted what is among the most prominent of observable phenomena is as humbling a feat before Nature as Millikan’s exploration into the nigh unobservable.
Thank you, David Snow. This was great story after a long day. Good fortune to you
Davis Wade. His style, love and mastery of spoken word adds another dimension to the story which is already epic.
People like him are a reminder why for thousands of years we gathered around fire listening and learning. Learning about people spoken of here - "heros" - who dared to leap into the unknown and open new horizons.
Thank you
This is really cool, I was in Nepal trekking Annaupurna may 1999, and sure enough I was in the KAT airport , here come these men in Fancy North Face gear, Duffle bags, cameras, Conrad and I cracked a Beer and he informed me of what he found, how cool!
Every story we read about Mount Everest are interesting especially those 1921, 22 and the epic 1924 conquest of Everest as they had to walk for weeks to get to their fiest base camp at the foot of Mount Everest. Their clothing, their climbing equipment and rations were somewhat basic to what climbers need today. We take off our Hats to those early "Men of Men" who put Mount Everest on the list of, The Mountain to Climb, Mallory & Irvine's Mountain.
Initially my expectation of this video were disappointed but by the end I found myself moved and Wade Davies summation moved me almost to tears - Mr Davis sir may it not be so...
I'm totally obsessed with Mallory and Irvine!!! They are my heros and why I climb. Never did Everest but was always my dream. I would climb the North side. I just wish we could find Sandy's body!
And now sadly, we know that the '75 Chinese expedition that Phanthog was a part of found Sandy and his camera, took the camera, and then concealed ever finding him at 8200M because they botched trying to develop the film.
@@RobWaters Where's your evidence to support that?
Do you write comic books in crayon?@@RobWaters
@@kippamipSeveral published statements from accomplished Chinese climbers who have multiple everest summits under their belt, in addition to the actual person that took the camera off his body.
@@lf67hh28 link to these statements please.
The words of Wade Davis describing these men had me spellbound. I believe him. Giants of men like this won't be found again. Not entirely accurate but it went something like this. "They'll get up in the morning and collect a butterfly for the British Museum. Then they'll paint a watercolour of the mountain before lunch. Over lunch they'll discuss Keynes. Then they'll assault the North Col or go over the top of the trenches at 4pm."
They Don't Make Em Like That Anymore
Song by Jason Blaine
This is so interesting. I had no idea of all of this. Thank you
Wade Davis's "Into the Silence" is astonishingly beautiful.
Well, the combination of both socio-historical and moutianeering perspectives made this talk exceptionally interesting and entertaining to follow.
Fascinating documentary. My respects to all mountaineers, climbers and trekkers. Love to see those vintage photographs George Mallory and team. I too laughed at Conrad Anker with period clothing and his friends re-creating 1922-24 scenes very brave men. Tea anyone :) Wow! so that is how Mt Everest got it's name (1862 Colonel Sir George Everest) learned something new. R.I.P. all those men and women that the majestic mountain has claimed.
Still astounded by the discovery of Mallorys body. What an achievement. Mallory would love it I suspect.
Maybe, but probably not. The camera footage they released publicly makes it seem like they respected Mallorys corpse. Their desire to collect artifacts on his person. Didn't account for something(summit rock sample) they should've sought in that search which would've cemented if they sumitted. Instead they completely unearthed him to search his person. In turn, absolutely destroyed the possibility of understanding if they summited without finding Irving's body and potential camera film.
@ Nick Raschke . I DOUBT VERY MUCH THAT MALLORY WOULD LOVE THAT HIS BODY WAS CRUSHED BY THEM LIKE IT WAS . THE PHOTOS ARE VERY SAD TO LOOK AT . IF THE PICTURES ARE REAL AND THEY SEEM TO BE. THE ROCKS NEVER SHOULD HAVE BEEN PUT ON HIM. I CAN NOT STAND THEM.
@@laurieannrogan1317 caps lock!
I know he wouldn’t approve of that.
He wouldn't like the fact that the birds up there pecked his eyeballs out of their sockets! They probably pecked his puffy pecker as well. LOL :-)
@@nickraschke4737 that was funny! Caps lock. Mallory would NOT approve!
Having read Wade Davis's book, the subject of Mallory and Irvine has fascinated me ever since. This presentation skates over a number of factors that should have been explored further. George Finch who was on the 1922 expedition and achieved the altitude record was at the time one of the world's leading experts on oxygen deprivation hence his reliance on bottled oxygen and the ease with which he made his climb was noted at the time. Mallory was not in favour of using oxygen until he saw what Finch achieved and became a reluctant convert. However, Finch was denied a place on the '24 expedition because he had undertaken a paid lecture tour in Europe which the Everest Committee who organised these expeditions thought smacked of the action of someone who was not a gentleman. Mallory did not like Finch (it appeared he had something against colonials) but he appeared to recognise those who could assist him. With no disrespect to Irvine, Finch and Mallory would have been a stronger team in '24. The other factor not mentioned was that Mallory knew his attempt was very late in the climbing season and had been advised not to make the attempt due to deteriorating weather. In addition, his absent-mindedness had caused him to forget sleeping bags for the Sherpas who as a result were not able to assist any further and in fact led to the death of one of them. Incidentally, I highly recommend Davis's book on the subject of these 3 expeditions, "Into The Silence".
Thanks, that's interesting! I'll look up this book
bro please do some more research into it their book is riddled with factual inaccuracies and outright lies. their argument isn't even internally consistent
@@baileyayyy5085 Are you referring to Davis's book or another. I don't understand when you refer to "their argument" when in Davis's case he was the only author.
@@peterlovett5841 I'm referring to the lost explorer which contradicts itself repeatedly and was created by both. Davis's take changed multiple times (from before the book) based on what his peers were saying and its pretty obvious to me that the main 'researchers' on this case are colluding to make each other look good. Among other things, they are factually inaccurate about several key points of their assessment including the weather, oxygen supply, and 'missing' cook stove which can be easily disproven by very basic fact checking. Their theory cannot provide a reasonable timeline which corroborates indisputable facts. David has plenty of good analysis in the book but their take on Malory is completely outrageous even if he didn't summit and has misinformed a ton of people. Not trying to be an asshole but this is really frustrating to me given how widespread very basic inaccuracies have become.
@@baileyayyy5085 Okay, "The Lost Explorer" was written by Conrad Anker and David Roberts and I haven't read that so unaware of the arguments they make. What Davis's opinion was before he wrote his book I do not know; his book was my introduction to the whole subject apart from the basic background information. I am not accusing you of anything and if I give that impression then I apologise. There are now so many theories out there about what happened to Mallory and Irvine (including conspiracy stuff about stolen bodies) that I doubt the truth will ever be known. I would rather think that both bodies lie in peace on the mountain.
This story always fascinates me. The detailed back story on these men was very helpful to understand the drive and grit it would take to climb that incredible mountain in the 1920’s. There certainly sounds like a lot of controversy surrounding the actions of Conrad and team in their treatment of Mallory’s body. I think you have to step back and appreciate their motivation to perform a bit of truth seeking and difficulty of a mountainside autopsy at that altitude. This find was an incredible stroke of luck and sounded like Conrad’s search method and actions should be applauded, not criticized. Their mission was to find Mallory and or Irvine and they accomplished their difficult goal. The bonus was being reminded of the human hell those WW1 vets went through 1914-1919, and what brave and interesting men they truly were. Thank you for the share. I would have liked to hear the Q&A though? Is it available Mr Snow?
Thanks David for putting up this awesome presentation
Conrad never climbed Everest before and he finds Mallory. Astounding.
A fresh set of eyes and completely new perspective. The naive wonderment played a part in it, IMO.
Yes, that somewhat naive approach ... and obviously the dry weather conditions of 1999, very little snow. When it was snowy in 2007, he wasn't able to find the place again even though having the GPS coordinates at hand, even though he had personally discovered it.
Conrad Anker is so accomplished that he comes across a little awkward. It must be a struggle to properly articulate so many climbing experiences.
That's because he had been an accomplished rock climbing expert at that point, which is frankly much more valued in the mountaineering community than high altitude climbing (for comparison, Messner was also an accomplished rock climber before he got his toes amputated and thus losing a good part of this mobility that he "had to give up the more demanding rock climbing to turn to high mountain climbing", then of course he became the first man to summit Everest without Os after switching his focus to this "less technically demanding" endeavor), plus by 1999 "never climbed Everest" doesn't really mean anything in the eyes of expert mountaineers one way or another, since the commercialisation of Everest has helped amateur climbers summitting this once sacred and horrid mountain in droves, as records of following years would show, so long as you have $60k to shell out and you can walk, people over 80 yo, blind people, people with prosthetic legs, etc can all summit Everest. And Mallory was also a skillful rock climber, so the assumption here is that great men think alike, therefore Anker was able to retrace the way Mallory would have climbed as a rock climber (albeit a reckless one, since Mallory did say in order to be the first to summit Everest it's totally worth it to lose some fingers or toes) to finally locate him.
its a usa thing, they think mallory was from usa..like the titanic
An amazingly uplifting and inspiring perspective from the point of view of the subjects and their historical perspective, which is very telling about the nature of the two speakers also! Thanks for sharing this....
Well said!
This was very interesting. I've been watching everything about Everest on YT.
The algorithm sent me here after visiting Tom Pollard of the Everest Mystery channel. Thanks for posting this video.
Me too
40.00 - Conrad says Obell is pointing to the point he last saw Mallory. This is a lie, it's from Messner's book on Everest and climbing, in which Messner captions the photo 'Obell pointing to the location of Mallory's axe'. Be wary of such errors and those who make them....
Fantastically interesting and enlightening...thank you Mr Snow
Glad you enjoyed it
Wonderful thanks for sharing this. What a time, light up your pipe and just head up.
The back stories sound crazier than the Everest assent!
Given the evidence available and the amount of discussion seen and heard, on the ďisappèarance of Mallory and Irvine, I believe that they did reach the Everest summit, before falling to their death.
Àlso, I have always been ďeeply interested in the terrible experiences endured by our youth during the Great War. Ì can well recommend the leading books and audio books mentioned here.
My own book, a novel set during that period tells of two of the 250,000 boys who raised their age, to get to the Western Front many were killed or horribly wounded.
So thanks for posting this, and to all involved. Jack.
What a fantastic video. Thanks for uploading!
Glad you enjoyed it!
With all the accolades presented about the mountain explorers and their tenacity and perseverance of that time, why would anyone doubt that Mallory and/or Ervine summited Everest on that fateful day? Wade Davis certainly describes them as super human against all odds.
This was awesome
Great video, loved the quote from Odell “ the price of life is a death.”
Makes death sound like a punishment or expense of life.
To me death is an inevitable consequence of life - the conscious reality of the second law of thermodynamics and the arrow of time. A sublime example of a natural process.
the price of unforgiven sin is death. or, the wages of sin is death. Thank God almighty for his son jesus upon which we can unburden our sorrow, helplessness and loneliness
@@sarki1723 We all die - no exceptions. Even Jesus died.
God's capacity for forgiveness and love is infinite so there can be no unforgiven sin.
God is not male, doens't have sons.
@@PetraKann So did you get your point of view direct from God. Or it’s your own idea ??
@@PetraKann …but God will send you to a firey pit to burn in torment and anguish forever if you’re not the kind of person he likes. Clearly God is a psychopath
Excellent insight into finding him exactly where he was seen last .. a shame they were lost .
But amazing to find them.
Well done and thank you
such Hero’s: all of them regardless of anything
Absolutely obsessed about climbers, particularly those of yesteryear. Read everything I can about them. Great talk, thank you!
Right, today's climbers are sissies in comparison.
4:40 He mentions Jimmy Chin who was just part of finding Irvine recently.
Wow. If this story isn't the basis for a motion picture, drama, then I'll eat my laptop.
Beautiful speech at the end .
I wish they had left Mallory's body alone instead of picking his pockets and stuffing him under rocks. As he lay on the exposed face of Everest, he was perfectly preserved, sacrilege!
Great presentation. Though Noel Odell wasn't the last surviving member of the 24 expedition Team...John Noel was...he died in 1989.
Outside magazine's cover photo showed Mallory propped up and sitting up when they discovered him. It was very macabre. I delivered that issue in the mail in 1999.
Nonsense he was on his front in the same position he died i
Why does everyone assume M & I attempted the ridge route (2nd step). Norton had only 4 days prior reached 28,200 feet in altitude going up the Great Couloir and he wasn’t on O’s surely Mallory with that insight would have attempted the same route and bypassed the steps? Similar to Messner in 80.
Because they have a book to sell
The reason is very simple: the timeline makes that completely impossible.
Odell said so
People with young children should not put themselves in the death zone...ever
I knew a couple who would not fly on the same plane when the children were young. Back when planes crashed regularly
Thank you for this entertaining, informative video. I enjoyed it very much.
Thank you so much
Just here following the news that Irvine was found.
What a terrible example of selling one's soul to toe the publishing co. line by abandoning the authors' real beliefs, opinions and doing a total 180 on prior documented and recorded beliefs and findings in order to produce a complete book of mis-truths, half truths and blatant lies. This is so sad. I count dozens of the authors back peddling and seemingly forgetting prior interviews and writings where they expoused essentially the opposite of their "conclusions" reached in this work of total fiction. They sold out. Check out Michael Tracy's channel for a full explanation of my post. I don't have the stomach to even call out all the lies, post-truth spin and the mountain of factual errors (read "lies"). Davis is particularly disappointing as he once seemed to be a truth teller and wasn't afraid to go in front of a camera and tell it.
Ba-Zing! Nailed it. Well said, Jeremy. It needed saying.
Very interesting and thanks.
Seeing how Mallory and Irvine climbed makes today's climbers look like sissies. It's just not the same. They were truly heros whether they made it or not.
They made it.
Agree!
Excellent.
There are 300 bodies on the mountain. I'm sure they all had a good time.
A lot of people are keeping a awful lot to themselves on this subject I feel
The whole 2019 attempt seems shrouded in mystery….
58:47 inspiring speech. Worth listening.
WOW ! I'll buy the book, just knowing that you care enough about the sherpas!
Well he died doing what he lived for so leave him there bless his soul
I knew all along where Mallory was. I just chose to keep it to myself. :-)
Great presentation!!
I have always believed that Odell's version of events was completely unreliable. Odell had so many versions of what he saw ( or didn't see ) right up until the time he passed away. Opinions, we are all entitled to our opinions ,, I've studied the subject of Mallory and Irvine for a number of years and I firmly believe that taking all the factors involved they ( both or singularly ) did not summit Everest.
If we take one of Odell's versions, he saw upwards at 8,000 two figures at the base of Step Two. That was around 12.50 pm. a storm developed and lasted for about two hours. Mallory and Irvine were never seen again, look at their circumstances up there. Their gear offered them little protection, they were enveloped in a severe storm, the temperature was freezing and their oxygen supply was depleted.
The Second Step is formidable to say the least, forty meters high and the final five meters is vertical, a difficult ascent in good weather. I firmly agree with many opinions, if they failed to ascend the Second Step then there was no opportunity of reaching the summit whatsoever.
It's not up to you.
Wade Davis - The worlds foremost Kelsey Grammer lookalike especially when he's wearing glasses
I'd argue their clothes were woollen and not the thin rubbish clothes are made from today. Real wool can protect you from freezing temperatures. They couldn't have made it wearing suits made in China. Jmo
I want to agree with you, but I doubt wet wool is good wear.
@@snorkielou4289 working while wet is one of the best things about wool. Their gear was a lot better than people today think, but people still choose modern gear for a reason
and wool is the only clothing that still retains warmth when wet...
@@dopeoplereally3972 Strangely, many of them still wear merino wool as their first layer, even under the modern high tech fabrics.
Mountain sheep still wear wool, as do their babies. And they don't use stoves or sleep in tents, or even wear boots. Good climbers.
Im wondering if anyone today could climb Everest using the same gear and clothing that George and Sandy used...?
Sure they could, today's climbers are way more technically skilled, better conditioned, the routes are well-known and they have accurate weather forecast.
A russian climber reached the summit shirtless.
My thought Exactly.
@@ajseven53 he climbed to 24000 but he did not summit
Anker at 40’37 asserts that Odell is pointing “to the last place he saw Mallory”, which is completely inconsistent with Odell’s written version in which he famously stated to have seen Mallory and Irvine on the “the last step but one from the base of the final pyramid".
Norton achieved the then altitude record just a few days before Mallory and Irvine via the Great/Norton Colouir route. Anker - like many others, subscribe to the NE Ridge route via the 2nd step. There is plenty of evidence that supports an alternative ascent as Messner did years later. For alternative theories see Michael Tracy’s excellent research on YT.
Ugh. Read The Lost Explorer. Anker very logically explains precisely why they couldn't have reached the top, using only the available evidence discovered after finding Mallory's body. People who still think he reached the top are simply engaging in wishful thinking.
@@SECRETARIATguy224 And those who dismiss any ascent other than via the NE ridge are deluded.
Conrad Anker offers ‘a’ theory. There are others.
@@BS2Dos Those other theories are wishful thinking. Mallory had no frostbite on his hands or face. That means in order for him to have gotten to the top they'd have had to climb at an astonishingly faster pace, with no fixed ropes and without being properly hydrated, than Anker and his partner made in their ascent in 99, to say nothing of how the equipment and protective gear they had in 1924 paled in comparison to what they had in 99.
@@SECRETARIATguy224 Why would Mallory have contemplated an alternative route via the NE ridge when there is no evidence that supports that such a route was ever considered? Why would Mallory ignore the success Norton had achieved a day earlier via the colouir route and in the process, attaining a new altitude record?
It’s inconceivable that Mallory would have elected to take a new route via the NE ridge on his last ascent given Norton’s success 24-hours earlier.
@@BS2Dos You're ignoring the evidence. The timeline established means that if they went the route you're suggesting, they'd have had to climb at a superhuman rate OR they'd have had to camp out at such a high altitude that Mallory would've _had_ to have gotten frostbite on his hands and face. He didn't have any frostbite at all, so therefore they couldn't have camped.
EXCELLENT!!
I wonder if his watch crystal popped off from pressure differential.
If it was well sealed it would have more pressure inside than the ambient pressure on the mountain top.
They may have had oxygen deficiency due to regulating valve failure on way down and suffered from lack of dexterity due to starvation for the brain oxygen on way down.
Becoming more vulnerable to a trip and fall and decrease in decision making ability.
One thing is for sure the mountain claimed them for her own and she didn’t let them come home.
When you think about it that is one mighty impressive monument she provided for them.
Just watched "Torn" jeez that was emotional...
Amazing video 👍🏻
Glad you liked it
Might be a good book but this guy belongs behind a typewriter not a microphone. Hard to listen to this apart from Anker’s bits.
I’ve always wondered how Mallory lost his left boot on his fall? Was this boot found and bought down?
I've been thinking the same for the last few months. And if it was moved (thrown, damaged before being thrown, etc.) it would completely erase any present 'understanding' of what really happened.
dont forget all of the forces of nature's elements that have acted on his body; - also, he likely fell a great distance and there is no way of knowing how it impacted his body (his foot); all the years of being acted upon by the elements. there are lots of believable explanations.
If you Google it, one of Mallory's boots, plus part of the other one, and part of the rope that was on his body, are in a museum now.
🇨🇦 They Don't Make Em Like That Anymore
Song by Jason Blaine
I have no idea why there is so much info on there sexual preferences but i guess they just wanted to be thorough.
The bodies of British soldiers weren’t cremated. They were either quickly buried or left due to shell fire.
A lot are still being ploughed up or found when drainage ditches etc are being dug. I have found bones of soldiers in the fields. Those soldiers are those of the missing. German soldiers were also buried or left. Some graves were later lost due to further battles where shelling destroyed them.
I have to believe that Sherpas were the first people to Summit Everest.
You would think
Why would you think that? Did birds ever fly to the moon? Did Penguins climb Mt. Vinson? Or waddle to the South Pole? Did George Washington ever climb Mt. Washington? Did Christofer Columbus discover Columbia? Did someone from Wales invent Whales?
Cheers
It’s there
i really feel like they both made it.
Maybe Irvine was seen (from a drone)in 2019 but have not been able to get to him due to the Chinese restrictions.
They need to look on the other side of the mountain for Irvine- when they got to the top they did a high five and knocked each other off opposite sides.
Wasn't the Canadian Edward Oliver Wheeler? I thought Arthur was his father (and not part of the 1920's expeditions).
People always TALK about how the Sherpas are so poorly compensated but, never do anything about it.
Did you hear the part of the talk when they discussed the climbing center set up by Anker, in order to get funding for Sherpas?
With all due respect they didn’t have to climb the second step. They took the easier route and traversed to right.
I really hope you are speaking from experience. I have none but research.
i would imagine they would have taken a similar route to norton and messner and by passed the second step
Yes they traversed below the second step to the couloir. Mallory stated many times that attempting the ridge route wasn’t an option
I'm convinced they made it 😐
33:30 not sure what that had to do with anything.
Seems weird
One fact that is continually overlooked is that everyone takes a FLAG to place on the summit of Everest. No flag was found on the body of George Mallory, so the logical fact is that if no Union Flag of the UK is discovered on the body of Andrew Irvine (from Birkenhead, Wirral - Roads near to Prenton Park, where Tranmere Rovers have played from 1921 to date, are named Everest, Mallory and Irvine in honour), then it really must be accepted that they both reached the summit..
There's no record he took a flag; not everyone takes one. He SAID he was taking a picture of his wife, but he was notoriously and chronically forgetful, so there's debate over whether he remembered to actually take it. In the end, nobody knows. But yeah, absolutely no record of there being any intent to leave a flag.
@@FabricofTime his daughter said he also wanted to leave a letter from his wife Ruth. Other letters were found on his body but not one from Ruth. This doesn't prove he summited but I like to believe they did.
First speaker sounded absolutely horrible - completely blown out.
Why not tweak it at the time? Jeez!
The great Arthur Kellas? Who’s he? At least call him Alexander or Alec.
Like a women giving birth to a placenta -- Canadian Cringe factor
Didn’t the Chinese find Mallory back in 1975?..
@jacobjones5269: They found a body (unidentified) but they didn't report it until much later.
Just as well the Tibetans did not prevent the rest of the world from climbing Everest, for religious or sacred reasons.
The fascination with their sexuality is what interesting here
many South Africans died in both and Korea. just saying: RIP
Yes they sure did. Im a white Aussie and my grandfather fought in ww2. He explained to us of ww1.
who cares?
Longest sentence I've ever heard in my life
Jon Krakauer, who in his book blamed everything on Rob Hall's team, whereas all the people who died, other than Rob Hall himself, were on Krakauer's team, while Krakauer himself was hiding from the all the rescue attempts in his tent. Great way to be a hero, Krakauer. Go write another book.
Now, if we could only get them to be honest about the whole thing that would be great!
Have to say, I have extreme doubt that Edmund Hillary was actually the first to deserve credit for summiting first. Apparently, Tenzing is worshipped in Nepal for being first. PLUS---- it was a huge team of Nepalese climbers that made that even remotely possible, but never got the credit. SURE!! SIR Edmund Hillary made it first for the media after the "Sherpas" set the ropes for him and hauled all his gear!! As IF.
It was at the end of British colonial rule over India. Every Indian or Nepalese wanted to prove that they were as good as the British. I don't think Tenzing was the first (nor do I think it matters), he never said so himself but I understand the sentiment of local people who worshiped him as a hero. Also, I agree that the expedition would've had zero chance of success without local porters because even getting to the base of Everest with all the supplies was a huge problem. But we need to acknowledge that it was the British who scouted the mountain for possible routes, came up with a strategy, invented the gear and developed mountaineering techniques. It was also them who determined that Everest is actually the highest mountain.
Hillary never said that he or Tenzing were first - they did it together - if he didn't Tenzing's name wouldn't be as well known as his.
That's not true. He's climbed numerous times.
Mfer’s were climbing Everest in a smoking jacket. 😭😂
The amount of time given to speculating about sex and sexuality in this talk seems out of place and agenda driven.
they might wanna' consider renaming Everest brokeback mountain.....good god man.
Homophobe much?
@@jimhere1 Ad hominem much?
@@jimhere1 .....nobody cares if every single one of those dudes was gay - not sure why they insisted on making it such an integral part of the story.......what difference does it make if they were gay or straight?.....they made this story into brokeback mountain, when it should have been about Mallory and Irvine.
@@jimhere1gayboi jim in the house.
the cooker rolled out of Camp 5 not Camp 6 (high camp) so it would have been replaced...hard to take everything Akers says at face value when he uses false facts to advance his narrative.
Anker is too certain of Mallory's route. As if no possibility existed that another route may have been attempted by Mallory and Irvine.
Did you read his book? The reason he's certain of that route is because the timeline means he _had_ to have taken it.
that guy needs an oxygen apparatus
I'm your head board.. umm.
Deagol