@@mnfaditya2166 I know its a real old comment, but for anyone seeing this video with the same question (or if you're still wondering). Some kind of Thiele Small parameter test device like the DATS system by Dayton should do the job to get you the numbers you need. Dd is always measured as the diameter of the cone including 1/3 of the surround on each side
I can’t wait to start building my box. Was happy to actually find the TS parameters for 2 older subs I have (MB Quart PWD-304)... I searched the internet tirelessly only to come up w/ a small portion of the information needed. Now I’m looking for part 2 or how to create a sealed/vented box. Thanks 🙏🏿
does the order of input mather that much if you can not input x max first and after the mms? I do get the spl Qms Qes Qts Sd Rms Cms Bl Vas and Efficiency ratings. thank you for your video
I entered all specs and when I click save I get a error message stating parameters error. I don’t know what I’m doing wrong if I’m following instructions
Thanks alot for the great tutorial but I am unable to locate the pro vversion of this only the free version with optional donation through the facebook link to the linearteam link.
Will do! BTW I posted a link to your channel on a slack group dedicated to diy speaker building diyspeakerbuilding.signup.team/ check it out. I think you would make a good fit!
merci,svp jai un haut parleur de 30w,8ohm.c'est les 2 données là seulement j'ai lu sur l'emant. comment je peux calculer l'air de mon coffret(enceinte) à confectionner à l'aide de winISD?
hello 123Toid ... need information regarding sony 1-505-302-11, Sony 1-505-228-11, sony 1-505-309-11 speaker specification. plz help me I want to make a custom soundbar with these speakers and sony hcd-h881 amplifier. Thank you
hello can you help me with the measurements for a closed box for media with the B&C 10MD26 8Ω speaker since I speak Spanish and I don't understand the video by language
For closed and ported box i found Box-Port Design 2.2 much simpler, faster and easier, specially for active 3D box design as you are changing variables. Later on you can move all this information to another software for future tuning with more variables.
Hm, i understand anything, thx for that first, but i have a problem. the problem is, that my woofer "DD Audio 712 D2 - 12" " dont have like mms, cms etc. on a website, there are just very less woofers with all the needed parameters, so i just fil in what i have
@@Toid oh, good to know, i have a T/S, Pe, Fs etc. in fact im just missing MMS and CMS, but WinISD still worked and now i make an 3D modell of the woofer and tommorow i start to build it
Isn't the created Speaker data somewhat useless since it creates a perfect flat linear graph, it seems unlikely that it is representative of what the graph should really be.
Its linear like that because the box, vent/port, and signal data has not been entered yet. The curve starts out basically with a ridiculous sized box at 1W
I am not sure which version you are talking about, but I used this version: www.amazon.com/SA-15-D2-Sundown-Audio-Subwoofer/dp/B00EVYTAMU Enter in all your known values and it should auto calculate SD - it did for me. Just input all you MMS, CMS, BL, LE and everything else you know at the bottom. Then go up to the top and enter the numbers 1 at a time until it auto calculates everything else. It should work perfectly. It autocalculated an SD of 337.7 cm squared. I would not input that, let winISD auto calculate it or you could fail driver integrity check.
Ok, sweet. Thank you. I got the specs off the main sundownaudio website. I just input it all and saw that it did calculate it for me, thank you very much for the help!
Also +123Toid do I put Znom so what the sub is specified as "DVC 4 ohms", so coils I would set it to 2 and then Znom would be 4, and connectivity would be parallel since i'm going to wire each sub parallel for a final 1 ohm impedance at the amp?
What if when entering the custom driver parameters the auto calculated numbers don't match the listed parameters from the manufacturer? This happened to me on the Dayton PS95-8. Just makes me worry that I'm not getting accurate data for that speaker.
As long as you put them in the order I showed, the numbers will come up very close to the published specs on Dayton. This is due to WInISD using algorithms to figure out data. If you tried to fill them in with Daytons spes, it actually would not work. This is one of the things people worry about, but with how close they are, they will not affect the projections. So don't worry, you will be getting accurate data.
The other areas I'm spacing on are what volume and frequency to use for the box, and i think my curve on the Transfer Function Magnitude is off. it ramps up to 1.843dB/68.36Hz, then falls to -0.073dB/92.36Hz, then back up to 1.162dB/178.19Hz. Everything I've seen seems to imply that the arc should be consistent, and then flat line as much as possible, but mine is wavy. I think I've done something wrong.
You haven't done anything wrong. That is exactly what I get when i input that driver, using a ported arrangement. This is just how this speaker responds. If you look at my ported video, it shows a similar (not as bad as the Dayton PS95-8) response. This really is due to the speaker. You get a much flatter response going sealed, but won't get anywhere near the low end range. But just to make you feel better, the way the Dayton PS95-8 is not abnormal for a speaker. There are many that respond this way. On a final note you could try a 0.135 cubic foot box with a tuning of 80hz *which makes the curve flatter). This will make everything from 80hz to about 200hz have a +2db increase. In other words, you will get a little more out of the bass region. Just remember WinISD will give you what it thinks is the best response, you can always mess with the cubic feet and the tuning frequency to get teh response you want
Say you've gotten you're desired response but it doesn't work with your box design. Can you have a box chambered with in a box? Also, is there a rule of thumb with finding smaller full range drivers that react better than the PS95-8? Thanks for the advice, I'm trying to learn all I can.
I'm not sure what you mean. Can you be more specific about the chambered box within a box? As far as the second part of the question, I'd say a lot of people like the Dayton ND90-8 speakers. Most people use them in something like Paul Carmody's Sprite build. My next build will be using these speakers along with a passive radiator (making the box smaller). I plan to show the plans in my next video, which should come in the next few days.
my qes for the skar ZVX-15v2 is 16.x lol wtf it should only be .56. not to mention Cms doesnt work. it wont let me input anything. keeps changing back to 0.0 instead of 0.03
@@Toid Thank you very much for your reply. I'm trying to build a box for a Dayton RSS315HFA8 12" Reference HF Subwoofer 8 Ohm, with the box tuned to 20Hz (4 cubic feet). In the System Input Power field I entered 400(w). I used the HP filter option (20Hz) to get rid of the dangerous cone excursion, but the rear port air velocity is off the chart...literally. Do you have any suggestions? Thank you for your time.
@@richardt2353 my friend and I used the 15-in ho version of that subwoofer and you can see the box that we built here: ruclips.net/video/MNUPbqy_PdM/видео.html we ended up using three long slot ports to get Port velocity down. Maybe that'll help you with your.
@@Toid I think I made a mistake getting this subwoofer. There seems to be no way to alleviate the outrageous post velocity numbers by tinkering with the port(s). Would I be better off making a sealed cabinet for this sub?
@@richardt2353 if you put some of your graphs on the forum, we can take a look at it and give you some ideas of what we might suggest you do. www.toidsdiyaudio.com
oof, my sub(a $100 japanese nakamichi sub) has a really badly written manual. some of the specs(Mms) are missing and some of them don't seem to make any sense? my Sd says "50.2m M" lmao what does that unit even mean, and my Cms says "176M/N" which doesn't seem to be a real number considering it looks 1,760,000 times bigger than the number yours gave
Well that depends. You can put four separate enclosures right next to each other or when you go through when is d and select the number of drivers, just put four instead of one
If it doesn't have mms, just input all the data it does have and mms should auto calculate. Be careful putting in your q values. Put them in one at a time as some will auto calculate for you. If you put them all in, you may receive an error.
I'm trying to calculate a box for some bookshelf speakers I'm building, using the Dayton nd140 8 ohm drivers but for some reason whenever i enter Mms and Cms it auto calculates Fs to 1.88 hz wich is obviously not correct, and if I correct it to what Dayton audio says(59.2hz) I try to save the driver file but the error pops up. If i don't correct the Fs, the driver saves without any issues only with an fs of 1.88 what could be the cause of this and what can I do to fix it?
It sounds like you have either you MMS on Kg instead of grams or your CMS is not on mm/N in the program. Just click on the Kg to change it to grams and input your new value and same for CMS. I did just input both CMS and MMS in WInISD and it derived 56.61hz.
@@Toid I watched, but I don't really see what why it works. Is it the magic order in which the parameters are entered? If this is the case, how do you know the order?
@@itekani it has to do with how it auto calculates the values. Unless you put them in any order as long as you delete, some of the values the computer wants to auto calculating you put in.
Sd is the SIZE diameter of the cone area. Sometimes it’s not listed. Use Google For example: a 12 inch woofers cone area is approximately 11 inches across. 11 diameter inches = 121 square inches. Make sure the little thing next the Sd box says “sq in.” Enter 121 in the Sd box Without an Sd parameter you can’t get accurate graphs. For example: cone excursion. This dude spent 10 seconds on Sd. SMH
This video is my goto whenever building a box. A must have in my opinion!
1. Xmax 4:44
2. Pe (Watts RMS) 3:37
3. VoiceCoils 6:21
4. Mms 6:53
5. Cms 7:11
6. Re 7:19
7. BL 7:29
skip Dd, Le 7:40
8. Sd 7:44
9. Qms 8:30
10. Znom 8:44
11. dimensions (opcional)
optional* lol
How to local driver low price no technical data sheed in speaker?no information in speaker
@@mnfaditya2166 I know its a real old comment, but for anyone seeing this video with the same question (or if you're still wondering). Some kind of Thiele Small parameter test device like the DATS system by Dayton should do the job to get you the numbers you need. Dd is always measured as the diameter of the cone including 1/3 of the surround on each side
My info sheet doesnt list re
I can’t wait to start building my box. Was happy to actually find the TS parameters for 2 older subs I have (MB Quart PWD-304)... I searched the internet tirelessly only to come up w/ a small portion of the information needed. Now I’m looking for part 2 or how to create a sealed/vented box. Thanks 🙏🏿
This video was absolutely helpful I really appreciate it. Keep them coming as I am new builder, lol.
This vid was very helpful and straight forward.
Thank you helped me alot :) cant wait to see other videos
Video was a lot of help, thank you.
👍🏻👏🏻👏🏻✌🏻✌🏻
does the order of input mather that much if you can not input x max first and after the mms? I do get the spl Qms Qes Qts Sd Rms Cms Bl Vas and Efficiency ratings. thank you for your video
Nice totorial. But is the nominal impedance really 4 ohm if the voicecoils is parallell? Then it should be 1 ohm. or?
Yea he should of hit series but doesnt affect the plot graph only the impedance chart
I’m getting an error. Division by zero. Every time I try to open a new driver that I have saved
I entered all specs and when I click save I get a error message stating parameters error. I don’t know what I’m doing wrong if I’m following instructions
Good Video. Please help. How to calculate box for 3 way driver (say Woofer, Mid range, Tweeter) speaker box.
Very nice. Thank you for making this. It really helped me.
You're welcome! I'm really glad to hear it helped.
Thanks alot for the great tutorial but I am unable to locate the pro vversion of this only the free version with optional donation through the facebook link to the linearteam link.
Awesome thanks for this! Love the channel by the way.
You're welcome. I'm glad you like the channel. if you ever have any ideas on how to make it better. I'm all ears :)
Will do! BTW I posted a link to your channel on a slack group dedicated to diy speaker building diyspeakerbuilding.signup.team/ check it out. I think you would make a good fit!
+theredman101 thanks! I'll definitely check it out
Hey Toids, what about Znom for a DVC sub with 8 ohm each VC? Still 4 ohm or we have to add the voicecoils in series and yields 16 ohm?
Thanks man!
Can u do a video with an avatar svl1547 2 of them ported box?
the speaker i bought doesn't inform the CMS, can i just skip that?
Thanks for this !
herrtuug you're welcome
merci,svp jai un haut parleur de 30w,8ohm.c'est les 2 données là seulement j'ai lu sur l'emant. comment je peux calculer l'air de mon coffret(enceinte) à confectionner à l'aide de winISD?
hi been running this program anyway i could runs some numbers by you and see what you think its a sub box for 3 18s thanks
hello 123Toid ... need information regarding sony 1-505-302-11, Sony 1-505-228-11, sony 1-505-309-11 speaker specification. plz help me I want to make a custom soundbar with these speakers and sony hcd-h881 amplifier. Thank you
my win isd is just white with a excel looking sheet. no black background with green squares like yours
hi 123Toid great video! but i need some help with my type of subwoofer. i have a visatron WS-20 E and i can not finde the xmax data on it.
have no x max for my speakers also. Gladen zero pro
how to change the font size in Winisd ? totally not suited for HD pc displays
hello can you help me with the measurements for a closed box for media with the B&C 10MD26 8Ω speaker since I speak Spanish and I don't understand the video by language
For closed and ported box i found Box-Port Design 2.2 much simpler, faster and easier, specially for active 3D box design as you are changing variables. Later on you can move all this information to another software for future tuning with more variables.
Hm, i understand anything, thx for that first, but i have a problem. the problem is, that my woofer "DD Audio 712 D2 - 12" " dont have like mms, cms etc. on a website, there are just very less woofers with all the needed parameters, so i just fil in what i have
You can just fill in the q parameters as well as x-max if you have to
@@Toid oh, good to know, i have a T/S, Pe, Fs etc. in fact im just missing MMS and CMS, but WinISD still worked and now i make an 3D modell of the woofer and tommorow i start to build it
Isn't the created Speaker data somewhat useless since it creates a perfect flat linear graph, it seems unlikely that it is representative of what the graph should really be.
Its linear like that because the box, vent/port, and signal data has not been entered yet. The curve starts out basically with a ridiculous sized box at 1W
What if the sub you are looking at doesn't have SD? specifically the one i'm looking at is the car audio, sundown audio sa-15. very minimal specs
I am not sure which version you are talking about, but I used this version: www.amazon.com/SA-15-D2-Sundown-Audio-Subwoofer/dp/B00EVYTAMU Enter in all your known values and it should auto calculate SD - it did for me. Just input all you MMS, CMS, BL, LE and everything else you know at the bottom. Then go up to the top and enter the numbers 1 at a time until it auto calculates everything else. It should work perfectly. It autocalculated an SD of 337.7 cm squared. I would not input that, let winISD auto calculate it or you could fail driver integrity check.
Ok, sweet. Thank you. I got the specs off the main sundownaudio website. I just input it all and saw that it did calculate it for me, thank you very much for the help!
+123Toid I must have done something wrong, I'm using the dvc dual 4 ohm model. It calculated SD to be 792 cm Squared? That doesn't sound right
Also +123Toid do I put Znom so what the sub is specified as "DVC 4 ohms", so coils I would set it to 2 and then Znom would be 4, and connectivity would be parallel since i'm going to wire each sub parallel for a final 1 ohm impedance at the amp?
i usually email the manufacturer, you can also call and they will hook you up with a spec sheet... good luck my fellow base head ;)
What if when entering the custom driver parameters the auto calculated numbers don't match the listed parameters from the manufacturer? This happened to me on the Dayton PS95-8. Just makes me worry that I'm not getting accurate data for that speaker.
As long as you put them in the order I showed, the numbers will come up very close to the published specs on Dayton. This is due to WInISD using algorithms to figure out data. If you tried to fill them in with Daytons spes, it actually would not work. This is one of the things people worry about, but with how close they are, they will not affect the projections. So don't worry, you will be getting accurate data.
The other areas I'm spacing on are what volume and frequency to use for the box, and i think my curve on the Transfer Function Magnitude is off. it ramps up to 1.843dB/68.36Hz, then falls to -0.073dB/92.36Hz, then back up to 1.162dB/178.19Hz. Everything I've seen seems to imply that the arc should be consistent, and then flat line as much as possible, but mine is wavy. I think I've done something wrong.
You haven't done anything wrong. That is exactly what I get when i input that driver, using a ported arrangement. This is just how this speaker responds. If you look at my ported video, it shows a similar (not as bad as the Dayton PS95-8) response. This really is due to the speaker. You get a much flatter response going sealed, but won't get anywhere near the low end range. But just to make you feel better, the way the Dayton PS95-8 is not abnormal for a speaker. There are many that respond this way. On a final note you could try a 0.135 cubic foot box with a tuning of 80hz *which makes the curve flatter). This will make everything from 80hz to about 200hz have a +2db increase. In other words, you will get a little more out of the bass region.
Just remember WinISD will give you what it thinks is the best response, you can always mess with the cubic feet and the tuning frequency to get teh response you want
Say you've gotten you're desired response but it doesn't work with your box design.
Can you have a box chambered with in a box?
Also, is there a rule of thumb with finding smaller full range drivers that react better than the PS95-8?
Thanks for the advice, I'm trying to learn all I can.
I'm not sure what you mean. Can you be more specific about the chambered box within a box? As far as the second part of the question, I'd say a lot of people like the Dayton ND90-8 speakers. Most people use them in something like Paul Carmody's Sprite build. My next build will be using these speakers along with a passive radiator (making the box smaller). I plan to show the plans in my next video, which should come in the next few days.
my qes for the skar ZVX-15v2 is 16.x lol wtf it should only be .56. not to mention Cms doesnt work. it wont let me input anything. keeps changing back to 0.0 instead of 0.03
Can someone tell me why my rear air velocity graph goes off of the chart when I enter in the System Input Power (Signal tab)?
Their port is too small and you probably don't have a high pass on
@@Toid Thank you very much for your reply. I'm trying to build a box for a Dayton RSS315HFA8 12" Reference HF Subwoofer 8 Ohm, with the box tuned to 20Hz (4 cubic feet). In the System Input Power field I entered 400(w). I used the HP filter option (20Hz) to get rid of the dangerous cone excursion, but the rear port air velocity is off the chart...literally. Do you have any suggestions? Thank you for your time.
@@richardt2353 my friend and I used the 15-in ho version of that subwoofer and you can see the box that we built here: ruclips.net/video/MNUPbqy_PdM/видео.html we ended up using three long slot ports to get Port velocity down. Maybe that'll help you with your.
@@Toid I think I made a mistake getting this subwoofer. There seems to be no way to alleviate the outrageous post velocity numbers by tinkering with the port(s). Would I be better off making a sealed cabinet for this sub?
@@richardt2353 if you put some of your graphs on the forum, we can take a look at it and give you some ideas of what we might suggest you do. www.toidsdiyaudio.com
oof, my sub(a $100 japanese nakamichi sub) has a really badly written manual. some of the specs(Mms) are missing and some of them don't seem to make any sense? my Sd says "50.2m M" lmao what does that unit even mean, and my Cms says "176M/N" which doesn't seem to be a real number considering it looks 1,760,000 times bigger than the number yours gave
What if I wanna add more than 1 sub? I am trying to figure out a box for 4 DC Audio XL 10"
Well that depends. You can put four separate enclosures right next to each other or when you go through when is d and select the number of drivers, just put four instead of one
I am using NVX VCW124 and they dont have MMs Listed anywhere...:(
If it doesn't have mms, just input all the data it does have and mms should auto calculate. Be careful putting in your q values. Put them in one at a time as some will auto calculate for you. If you put them all in, you may receive an error.
i cant find sd for my driver
I'm trying to calculate a box for some bookshelf speakers I'm building, using the Dayton nd140 8 ohm drivers but for some reason whenever i enter Mms and Cms it auto calculates Fs to 1.88 hz wich is obviously not correct, and if I correct it to what Dayton audio says(59.2hz) I try to save the driver file but the error pops up. If i don't correct the Fs, the driver saves without any issues only with an fs of 1.88 what could be the cause of this and what can I do to fix it?
It sounds like you have either you MMS on Kg instead of grams or your CMS is not on mm/N in the program. Just click on the Kg to change it to grams and input your new value and same for CMS. I did just input both CMS and MMS in WInISD and it derived 56.61hz.
123Toid when you put the box dimension of cuft. its the internal box dimension (Net Volume) or its the (Gross Volume) Outside of box?
Great question. This is internal box volume. The gross volume will be dependent on the size of the material and the amount of bracing you use.
So what is really the secret to not getting an error after inputting the parameters?
The video explains it
@@Toid I watched, but I don't really see what why it works. Is it the magic order in which the parameters are entered? If this is the case, how do you know the order?
@@itekani it has to do with how it auto calculates the values. Unless you put them in any order as long as you delete, some of the values the computer wants to auto calculating you put in.
Terrible UX design... 😄
You wrote Sd wrong, 1,219 instead of 1219,0
The voicecoils parralell?? They should be in series...
I did try do not work, also the driver comes on not in the list. strange behavior.
Sd is the SIZE diameter of the cone area. Sometimes it’s not listed. Use Google
For example: a 12 inch woofers cone area is approximately 11 inches across. 11 diameter inches = 121 square inches.
Make sure the little thing next the Sd box says “sq in.”
Enter 121 in the Sd box
Without an Sd parameter you can’t get accurate graphs. For example: cone excursion.
This dude spent 10 seconds on Sd. SMH
Sd is the Surface of driver.