this man is the sloppy of SBCs. I love it and im here for it. I have a 350 vortec OBS truck i wanted to LS swap, but seeing the digleball and budget 350 builds maDe me realize i dont have to swap shit.
Hey man I really appreciate your videos. Seems most guys are posting 10k$ builds and trying to use the wow factor as click bait. You do a fantastic job of explaining everything and showing realistic builds for the regular guys budget. Pretty awesome to have a set up for 1500-2000 bucks that will mop the floor with most other street cars. I have an 82 trans am and been kicking around different ideas of what to do with it and you have answered that question. Since watching your videos I have bought 3 L31’s for this project and future projects. Thank you for showing realistic builds and putting smiles on faces of normal guys like me.
Thats exactly what im trying to do with my channel. Im building realistic combinations that the average guy can afford. Making HP isn't hard if you have lots of money, making HP is hard on a budget. I really do appreciate comments like this, thank you. Email me pcperformance1@outlook.com if you would like a new cutters performance sticker (no charge)
Hey man, i basically followed this build to a T in my 97' k2500, and it absolutely rips. Thank you for the in depth videos, and im glad you know more than me haha.
I just finished this same basic combo but I used a set of AFR full CNC heads vs the vortec units. What an absolute BEAST of an engine! Thanks for all the killer data and listing out the details of these builds. 💪💯💪
I took my L31 lifters apart and cleaned everything. Pretty easy to do and gives you a good sense of confidence after. Obviously couldn't take the rollers apart but they worked smoothly.
Another excellent tutorial. I thought I was the only one being cheap by cutting down the wheel for a balancer spacer. By the way the summit brand sbc bearings are king also and are very nicely priced. I am currently doing a engine using the summit 8801 cam. This cheap combination requires a 350 block with a very good bore and summit 4” bore 383 pistons ( 377 ci ) $159 per set. Crank is a low dollar cast pro comp that came with a set of cheap forged rods. Scat would be better but this is Australia and good stuff can be expensive. I can balance the pistons and rods myself but the crank balance is close to $400 here. I am using a milder cam to keep the revs down because of the external balance. I will probably use the vortec heads modified as you have shown us. I was in the US recently and got the pistons, cam , and two sets of summit beehives ( no retainers at the time)several sets of summit bearings. I also bought four sets of engine tech rings per your advice that they are actually Hastings. $50 a set ( au $75 ) instead of the usual $200 + a set for Hastings here. I was sweating going through customs but they weren’t too worried. The intake is a Chinese rpm copy I can get locally for $200 au and are a nice casting.I am hoping for 400 hp and a good torque number. I am aiming for a $3000 au all up price ( I live in hope ).Thank you for all the great advice and do keep it up please.
Yes that would be awesome I have a budget of 2000 for my 400 sync I want to use the stock heads I also have vortex heads could you send a parts list inplane on using stock bearings in the block they are in excellent shape as well as the piston rings
Great video sir! Great that you explain what you used, why, the part numbers and prices. This way of presenting the information allows the backyard novice engine builder the best opportunity for success.
I have a couple 400 short blocks that I wanted to bore .010 over and run with Vortec’s and 5.7PM rods and KN pistons. I’d like to run a roller, should be a pretty potent motor. Right now just have to push a couple LS’s out of the way.
Would love to see a 400 build. I have one in a Chevelle with heavily worked 041X heads that did 445HP and 499TQ on the dyno with an Isky 280 Mega flat tappet. Lots of fun with the Autogear Muncie M22Z. Big torque available with the 400 and lots of guys say they overheat but they don’t with a proper cooling setup.
found your videos not to long ago and they are informative and easy to watch. Keep it up. After this video I'm wondering if I add the Summit cam how much HP my vortec engine might. Had some flow work done on the heads, (062, 906) flow test @ 500 Intake 232 Exh 164, LT1 exhaust manifold, sniper EFI. The long block was from Jeg's. It was tested at 315hp 402tq by the machine shop without any tuning. I love this motor in my Ford hot rod.
The high rpm motor would be great for us street stock guys The base motor is great Finally someone makes a video about part numbers and pricing at the time… Everyone builds their motors but never talk true costs
I really enjoy building the average mans engine with true HP/tq numbers. These days, most guys can't afford a $10k plus engine but still deserve to be out there making power and having fun. I appreciate the support 🙏
Bad ass parts list I have a 2000 350 vortec 4 bolt main .. I want keep all stock just cam it up n convert to carb I’m going to look into the parts u mention … thanx
Great RUclips channel! You mentioned a video you were going to make regarding installing a steel timing chain cover on a 880 Vortec block have been unable to find it on your Channel
Man ! Did you time this just right for me I happen to be building a truck motor for my little truck An El Camino With some stiff stuff under it I think it'll be enough HP to piss some of these high dollar rollers off Thanks
Great info Pat, I'm going with +.050 keepers, Summit 1.6 non self aligning rockers, Comp 787-16 retainers, adjustable guide plates and ARP studs. I've not accurately measured the installed height yet, but its very close to 1.800". As per usual I'm waiting on parts before I can continue the build. Looking forward to more interesting and useful content. :-)
I built a really decent 355 Chevy back in 07 with #062 L31 vortec heads 0.015 gaskets 9.78:1 comp. With LS 6 valve springs comp cams 1.52 self aligning rockers , Rhoads lifters , Crower ultra beast # 15917 cam , 474int., 498exh. Dur. 214,224 @0.50 , edelbrock RPM airgap , HOLLEY 4779-S 750CFM carb , and 1 inch carb spacer , 1 7/8 headers H pipe 2.5" chamber mufflers, vehicle 87' Monte SS , precision industries 2500rpm stall in a TH200R4 transgo shift kit, Ford 9" 4.11 gears Hotchkiss Control arms ,this car ran consistently @ high 11's low 12's , I miss the car and really wish i never sold her ,VORTECS ARE KING FOR THE STOCK CHEVY HEAD💪👍
@@cuttersperformance just what I learned at an engine shop I worked at in the 90s , L31 vortecs #061,#062,#906 on the flow bench , had weak exhaust flow characteristics, so I think they run better with a duel pattern cam ,then a single pattern in some engines , just my thoughts , please keep up your content, I appreciate your knowledge I've learned alot from you Thank You 👍
Great video's I went out and got a L31 I guess R motor from a one ton 4x4. Four bolt motor, think I read somewhere these have a forged crank? I got lucky and had a guy swamp me some parts for some Vortech heads and ended up with that cam! Following your build to a T for my 2nd gen Z28 manual trans.
Did you ever make a video on how to reuse the stock balancer? Is that only because you changed out the stock timing cover? I'm slightly confused! Thanks in advance for any information you can give me!
I'd like to see the summit 1103 cam on the Dyno. I couldn't find a video with HP numbers or any forums. It's got about the same specs as the l82 cam or any other rv cam. which is the 350/350 HP cam I think. I installed this cam a while back it's alright on the torque. Was gonna go with the summit 1785 cam but the 106 lobe separation stopped me.
I'm glad I saw this before I messed up. I've got a similar build. I'm running the cloyes double roller and a milodon steal cover. I was about to install stock balencer. I don't have access to a lathe. What do I do? Buy a balencer for an old style block like the timing cover?
Newbie budget build question .If the summit cam is used . Can the stock vortec rocker arms be used ? or roller tip rocker arms is a must have . thanks .
I got an 880 short block, I believe cam is comp 288hr, promaxx 195cc heads, 1.5 jegs roller rockers, single plane intake. 400 turbo transmission I think it’s a good start to put in a 76 Pontiac Grand Prix
Yo I love your vids can I run that summit cam you mentioned on a fresh crate 880 stock block just add the cam to it or do I need a new timing chain and change the valve springs to and is that summit cam a roller or hydraulic cam then I need to change my lifters and push rods to
I’ve spent the last 3 months building an 880 block to your exact parts list and using the 8802 cam! Motors getting dropped in this weekend . Ordered a 2200 stall converter hopefully enough
What pick up tube did you use for the hv oil pump? I’m having trouble locating the correct one since there are so many. Thanks for the vids I’ve watched all the ones going back to porting stock vortecs. You should throw a set of those on and see what the numbers are.
I just used a stock style 3/4 pickup from an L31. Set the height and tig welded to the pump. The heads were mildly ported (mostly exhaust side) on this L31 bidget build. Im assuming that was a big reason it made more power than expected
Love this series of videos. Awesome work! I'm starting a rebuild on L31 880 block with vortec heads. Current was setup for Spider EFI and considering a setup like this but with an alternate intake and EFI. If you have suggestion on EFI / intake setup for something like that please let me know your thoughts. Thanks and keep up the great work!
Also need to figure out how all this works with current 1999 engine module / electronics. Maybe that needs to be completely deleted. Learning so please forgive my ignorance.
found Chevy and Hotrod magazines from the early to mid 2000s. long story short, i coped an engine build with aluminum VT heads, i did some head work knocking off the ruff areas and increasing the left. i used single relief valves clearance pistons when the book used dual. book said 425, but i never dyno'd it
Enginetech is some good stuff. I've used a couple of their rebuild kits and was really impressed with the parts I got in the kits and the engines are still running strong. Where can I get one of those hats?
In my area the Vortec 350's are hard to find and start at $600. Also, how about a recommendation for a budget set of aftermarket iron Vortec heads for those that might be wary of the stock heads cracking. The Summit branded Vortecs maybe? Love this series of videos!
Thanks for posting these video's they are very informative, I have a set of 062 heads and installed ls springs with 174003-3 retainers and +30 keepers, the question i have is can i grind down the self aligning washers or tops of the keepers to make clearance between the keepers and roller rockers? My intake valve stem stick out is about .0645" and i have about a .010" gap between the roller and valve stem because the self aligning washers are hitting the keepers, i did order a different set of rockers to see if clearances are better.
@@cuttersperformanceI'm sure you've found the old Motortrend engine build article from 2004 called 'Chevrolet 406 CI Engine Build - Impersonator II 525 lb-ft and 490 hp From an 87-Octane 406'. I've yet to see a RUclipsr duplicate this.
Cool Video, I actually have the LT4 hot cam and the GM performance 1.6 aluminum rockers, been sitting on the shelf for years, not going to use them on my current build, they will wait for another build.
So im not seeing anyone asking, but what is the idle like with the LT4 hotcam or 8802 summit cam with a carb? Ive searched RUclips and keep finding different sounding engines, not sure if some are fuel injection and some carbs, or if idles are set different or what. Ive got a L31 crate motor in my 55 chevy and outside of carb issues it runs decent, but its a hot rod and id like a little chop at idle, nothing crazy cause id like to keep power brakes, stock or stockish torque converter etc. So my thought is to go with the 8802 but dont know what to expect sound wise, no since in doing a cam swap and changing head springs for the same idle, although top end performance would probably be a lot better.
A stroker version would be a good level 4, since there are a bunch of interesting bottom end changes to think about. 400 SBC I'm not so interested in, I don't see many available.
what if a guy wants to run the stock fuel injection? i have a 2000 5.7 with the spider injection that i'd like to get a little more power out of when its time to rebuild. Probably .030 over, some head port and polish but not interested in going back to a carb.
The single roller is a better timing chain than a double roller. There was a shim that was sold by IIRC ATI that was used with their LT1 balancer. It is the correct width to shim the balancer. Then again I would only run a SFI balancer on a performance build. Full roller is also a better rocker, really no reason to run a roller tip only. They make stamped steel self aligning 1.6s that works with a combination as well as those roller tips would. Full roller added 10 ft/lbs across the board on my old LT4 Hotcam L31.
First let me say I really appreciate your time and effort doing all these videos , I've learned so much and saved alot of money thanks to you. I'm going to use the Summit cam you suggested. You said you could use the stock rockers , would it be worth it to purchase a set of Scorpion 1.5 roller rockers? Also I have a Chev. Perf. 350/357 hp. crate motor with the hyd. roller cam, Vortec heads and just wanted to double check that using the stock pistons and pushrods were okay to use as is ? Since my engine is the same as the one you built I just wanted to verify that the piston to valve clearance was good to go. Thanks again for everything.
Thank you I appreciate the support! What summit cam part# are you referring to? The reason I ask is that you can not use the stock rocker arms on a Lt4 hotcam or similar. On this L31 budget build, I used a set of PRW roller tip rocker arms. The stock rocker arms should not be used over .480 lift
Yeah, you can use that cam with beehives with .030 offset retainers like I did with the similar Lt4 hotcam. But you cannot use the stock rocker arms, you can use the a 1.5 ratio (stock ratio) using an aftermarket rocker arm
With using the stock pistons and push rods was the piston to valve clearance okay? sorry for all the questions just getting all the parts and just wanted to make sure. Thanks for all your help.@@cuttersperformance
For a little more power, would it be worth it to replace the pistons with flap tops? There are stock replacement cast pistons with a 1.56 compression height available for a resonable price. With these pistons, steel shim head gaskets and the stock deck height, the quench is around .040. Compression ratio would be around 10.25.
I'm thinking the efficient vortec chamber combined with a tight quench would create good turbulence. If so, the engine may be able make power with less timing and be less fuel sensitive?
@heavyg7105 yeah but also the weight and gearing of the vehicle its going into plays a big factor. Im sure this cam would be fine with 10.5:1 tuned properly with 91+ octane and a light vehicle
I do have a base motor, but I'm at loss as to what to do to it on account I don't know what's in it. I got an awesome deal on a vortec 350 magnum marine motor with 450 hrs on it. I've bin pulling my hair out trying to figure out what's in this thing without tearing it apart. Do you have any experience with using a marine motor as a base for a build? The balancer doesn't need any modification as it dose not have a crank sensor and sits further back than an automotive balance plus the plastic timing cover has the hole for the sensor hole is plugged as part of the plastic casting. The problem with Mercruiser is its hard to find specs for anything like the cam the heads all they list is parts # and you just replace it. I do know its a four bolt main block I suspect it may also have 202 heads. 2000 Mercruiser 350 magnum (carbed) was going to put it in my truck but i think this would make a killer street rod motor.What do you think? keep the videos coming 👍👍
11:38 one of the reasons why I went with the lunati voodoo 270 roller. They have a pressed and pended Iron distributor gear so no need to run one of those ridiculously overpriced $100 distributor gears. The voodoo has identical valve timing to the hot cam but with voodoo lobes, more lift and ground 6° advanced but of course you can retard it so not a big deal.
In previous video you mentioned you didn't use a carb spacer and would go over that in a later video. Did I miss that video or have you not gone over that yet?
I have a very similar setup to this with the 8802 cam. What did you set your initial timing to? How about total? Did you set the initial with the vacuum advance hooked up? Thanks!
They didn't use crack rods in sbc until the LS series. The vortec L31 rods are Powdered Metal but they are not cracked. Ive had many sets resized, just like a regular SBC rod. But as a side note LS Cracked rods can also be resized but the ID of the rod is made larger and a larger OD bearing is used , rather than grinder the caps and restoring the ID of the rod.
Thanks for the reply .So i'm in the process in building L31 and hopefully I can squezze 400 hundred hp and torque out of it . And you are correct no about the rods being none cracked rods ..I was going to replace the rod bolts with ARP bolts because it's insurance to me but my machinest said the factory bolts can handle 500 hp's. I wonder how much distortion if any if I did them myself ? .I really do not have much choice on who does my machine work and their 30 miles away. The block will be 040 over it's been there for over a month. Anyway thanks again for the reply have a great weekend .ltr.
I just ordered my rebuild kit with the 1094 Head gaskets and the Sum 8802 cam. I’m doing the beehive spring upgrade but the ports are staying stock. How much of a loss in HP do you think it’ll be? Still over 400hp I hope.
Hi Pat. Will be doing my vortec heads to your spec. I have the pre 96 standard block with solid flat tappets and would like to use the standard vortec 1.5 rockers. Could you please suggest a cam? Thanks Kyle South Africa
That summit 8802 it takes a melonized gear? I contacted them about a cam i bought a Summit SUM-1227 for a older gen1 non roller block. They cant seem to tell me what gear to use, they keep saying a carbon/poly gear or bronze. This is for a street/strip car i dont want to be buying a new distributor gear every 10k miles. I was told the billets are 5150 steel and howards said i can run one of their Steel distributor gears if this is true. Any info u have would be apprecated.. Thanks
Hi Pat. Is it necessary to have the big ends of the rods resized with the ARP rod bolts already installed? I saw a video where the guy had the big ends resized and then installed the ARP hardware afterwards and it pushed everything out of round. I asked my machinist to resize the rods back to factory spec but he doesn’t have the ARP hardware. Is this a big deal in your opinion?
Yes, it's absolutely nessasary to resize the rods when arp bolts are added. The clamping force is different, and your rod end will be oval. If you have already got your rods resized with the factory bolts, then I would just leave them at this hp/rpm level. As long as the stock bolts haven't been over torqued they will be fine. I add arp bolts for extra reassurance, but it's not always nessasary. An engine that sees north of 6k rpm it's a good idea
What is the highest static compression ratio are you comfortable running on a daily pump gas street engine with iron heads and if you did have an engine with a high compression ratio you wanted to run on pump gas what changes to the cam would you look for to lower the dynamic CR? Higher Duration? Tighter LSA? Different ICL? Or all...
Ive done just over 11:1 vith vortecs and pump gas. Im actually doing another one on the dyno coming up. I want to try to max it out on VP race gas concentrate fuel and then run in on High octane pump gas to see power differences with tuning. Tight quench, large cams and light vehicles make a big difference
Will this vortec head set up work on a 91’ 350 tbi , I have a truck with a crate engine from gm with only 10k on it just looking for a economical way to get it making power , it’s for my son so I don’t want to go crazy at this point maybe 350-400 hp, what would u recommend ? Thanks
My son and I built a motor almost identical but we used the 8802 summit cam. He bought a factory reconditioned 4779 Holley 750. I’m having trouble getting the jetting figured out. Plugs are black. Any tips would be much appreciated! Awesome video watch all of them almost as soon as you drop them.
@@cuttersperformance I say stock crank, stock short rods with good bolts and flat top pistons!!! Maybe some cleaned up Vortec heads? Solid flat tappet? Won't be 87 octane but would probably make great power on a decent budget!!!
Hey man I just have a question. I used +30 keepers on my valves and it brought my installed height too where I needed it. But I don’t have much valve tip only about 10 thousand clearance between the prw 1.6 rocker and the retainer. Is this enough? Or is there a minimum amount of clearance between the rocker and retainer?
this man is the sloppy of SBCs. I love it and im here for it. I have a 350 vortec OBS truck i wanted to LS swap, but seeing the digleball and budget 350 builds maDe me realize i dont have to swap shit.
Thanks man, appreciate the support
Hey man I really appreciate your videos. Seems most guys are posting 10k$ builds and trying to use the wow factor as click bait. You do a fantastic job of explaining everything and showing realistic builds for the regular guys budget. Pretty awesome to have a set up for 1500-2000 bucks that will mop the floor with most other street cars. I have an 82 trans am and been kicking around different ideas of what to do with it and you have answered that question. Since watching your videos I have bought 3 L31’s for this project and future projects. Thank you for showing realistic builds and putting smiles on faces of normal guys like me.
Thats exactly what im trying to do with my channel. Im building realistic combinations that the average guy can afford. Making HP isn't hard if you have lots of money, making HP is hard on a budget. I really do appreciate comments like this, thank you. Email me pcperformance1@outlook.com if you would like a new cutters performance sticker (no charge)
I absolutely will.
Hey man, i basically followed this build to a T in my 97' k2500, and it absolutely rips. Thank you for the in depth videos, and im glad you know more than me haha.
That's awesome man glad to hear that! if you have instagram, send me some videos or pics, I'd love to see. Cutter_performance on insta
I have this exact engine setup in a 86:astrovan with 88 700r4 and 410 posi 20mpg low 12s with loaded minivan...a blast to drive very cheap build ...
I just finished this same basic combo but I used a set of AFR full CNC heads vs the vortec units. What an absolute BEAST of an engine! Thanks for all the killer data and listing out the details of these builds. 💪💯💪
Love AFR should have bought them years ago Tony Mamo became famous and price doubled still the King SBC
L31 vortec is a gold mine for any hotrod . Simple changes it is a reliable potent engine. Just bought a new L31 from GM. Cam swap and spring change .
Appreciate ur work for supporting us poor boys
I took my L31 lifters apart and cleaned everything. Pretty easy to do and gives you a good sense of confidence after. Obviously couldn't take the rollers apart but they worked smoothly.
Nicely done!
400 would be awesome! I have a complete 400 sitting on the the stand with a set of vortec heads to go on it, so hell yeah!
Another excellent tutorial. I thought I was the only one being cheap by cutting down the wheel for a balancer spacer. By the way the summit brand sbc bearings are king also and are very nicely priced. I am currently doing a engine using the summit 8801 cam. This cheap combination requires a 350 block with a very good bore and summit 4” bore 383 pistons ( 377 ci ) $159 per set. Crank is a low dollar cast pro comp that came with a set of cheap forged rods. Scat would be better but this is Australia and good stuff can be expensive. I can balance the pistons and rods myself but the crank balance is close to $400 here. I am using a milder cam to keep the revs down because of the external balance. I will probably use the vortec heads modified as you have shown us. I was in the US recently and got the pistons, cam , and two sets of summit beehives ( no retainers at the time)several sets of summit bearings. I also bought four sets of engine tech rings per your advice that they are actually Hastings. $50 a set ( au $75 ) instead of the usual $200 + a set for Hastings here. I was sweating going through customs but they weren’t too worried. The intake is a Chinese rpm copy I can get locally for $200 au and are a nice casting.I am hoping for 400 hp and a good torque number. I am aiming for a $3000 au all up price ( I live in hope ).Thank you for all the great advice and do keep it up please.
Smuggling engine parts haha love it
he sweats smuggling engine bearings 😂..
would never make it in my shoes
Link to the video for cutting down the oil slinger for a spacer??
I COULDNT LOVE ALL YOUR VIDEOS ANY MORE THAN I DO- BUT THIS ONE IVE WATCHED 6 times, just to brain burn it in!!!!
THANKS PAT!!!!
YOU ARE THE GOAT!!!
Thanks Dave! 🙌
400 engine would be cool
Yes please
planning on doing Suarez build but with 406sbc
Yes that would be awesome I have a budget of 2000 for my 400 sync I want to use the stock heads I also have vortex heads could you send a parts list inplane on using stock bearings in the block they are in excellent shape as well as the piston rings
Great build! I love the way you give all the part numbers and explain why you choose them looking forward to more testing and builds!
The amount of info you share is awesome man. Keep it up.
I appreciate that!
Great video sir! Great that you explain what you used, why, the part numbers and prices. This way of presenting the information allows the backyard novice engine builder the best opportunity for success.
Thank man, I really appreciate the positive feeback
I have a couple 400 short blocks that I wanted to bore .010 over and run with Vortec’s and 5.7PM rods and KN pistons. I’d like to run a roller, should be a pretty potent motor. Right now just have to push a couple LS’s out of the way.
I say do a 400 build l love the 400 i have one in my 67 camaro its like a big block with out the weight again nice job Pat 👍
I think a 87 octane 400 torque monster would be cool
Did you use some kind of shim in place of the reluctor wheel?
Would love to see a 400 build. I have one in a Chevelle with heavily worked 041X heads that did 445HP and 499TQ on the dyno with an Isky 280 Mega flat tappet. Lots of fun with the Autogear Muncie M22Z. Big torque available with the 400 and lots of guys say they overheat but they don’t with a proper cooling setup.
I have an M22Z in my car. Has the stock 2:73 rear right now but looking to upgrade. What rear gear ratio are you running and do you like it?
i think stick with the 350 builds to compare apples with apples,
Great job Pat......Thanks
Thanks for the info I appreciate all the combos you put together, has helped me a lot with projects
Thank you, Glad to hear that
fixing to build one for my 89 s-10 should be fun thanks for all the helpful information
found your videos not to long ago and they are informative and easy to watch. Keep it up. After this video I'm wondering if I add the Summit cam how much HP my vortec engine might. Had some flow work done on the heads, (062, 906) flow test @ 500 Intake 232 Exh 164, LT1 exhaust manifold, sniper EFI. The long block was from Jeg's. It was tested at 315hp 402tq by the machine shop without any tuning. I love this motor in my Ford hot rod.
Great content as always Pat. You just had to put those teaser parts over there on the side. Anxiously waiting for the next video.
The high rpm motor would be great for us street stock guys
The base motor is great
Finally someone makes a video about part numbers and pricing at the time…
Everyone builds their motors but never talk true costs
I really enjoy building the average mans engine with true HP/tq numbers. These days, most guys can't afford a $10k plus engine but still deserve to be out there making power and having fun. I appreciate the support 🙏
350 vortecs are so slept on! im pretty sure this would make quite a few ls swappers mad
I'm buying them when ever I find them now!
Bad ass parts list I have a 2000 350 vortec 4 bolt main .. I want keep all stock just cam it up n convert to carb I’m going to look into the parts u mention … thanx
Great RUclips channel! You mentioned a video you were going to make regarding installing a steel timing chain cover on a 880 Vortec block have been unable to find it on your Channel
Yeah I will have a video on that coming up, my shop is currently emptied out for renos. Once its back up and running more vortec videos coming up!
Man !
Did you time this just right for me I happen to be building a truck motor for my little truck An El Camino With some stiff stuff under it
I think it'll be enough HP to piss some of these high dollar rollers off
Thanks
Great info Pat, I'm going with +.050 keepers, Summit 1.6 non self aligning rockers, Comp 787-16 retainers, adjustable guide plates and ARP studs. I've not accurately measured the installed height yet, but its very close to 1.800". As per usual I'm waiting on parts before I can continue the build. Looking forward to more interesting and useful content. :-)
The ultimate setup! Very nice 👌
@@cuttersperformancehow much $ to get you to port a set of vortec heads ?
I built a really decent 355 Chevy back in 07 with #062 L31 vortec heads 0.015 gaskets 9.78:1 comp. With LS 6 valve springs comp cams 1.52 self aligning rockers , Rhoads lifters , Crower ultra beast # 15917 cam , 474int., 498exh. Dur. 214,224 @0.50 , edelbrock RPM airgap , HOLLEY 4779-S 750CFM carb , and 1 inch carb spacer , 1 7/8 headers H pipe 2.5" chamber mufflers, vehicle 87' Monte SS , precision industries 2500rpm stall in a TH200R4 transgo shift kit, Ford 9" 4.11 gears Hotchkiss Control arms ,this car ran consistently @ high 11's low 12's , I miss the car and really wish i never sold her ,VORTECS ARE KING FOR THE STOCK CHEVY HEAD💪👍
Sounds like a sweet combo!
@@cuttersperformance just what I learned at an engine shop I worked at in the 90s , L31 vortecs #061,#062,#906 on the flow bench , had weak exhaust flow characteristics, so I think they run better with a duel pattern cam ,then a single pattern in some engines , just my thoughts , please keep up your content, I appreciate your knowledge I've learned alot from you Thank You 👍
i have a set of 906 casting vortec heads im pairing with the 8802 cam soon. should make around 10.5 to 1 compression
How did it go?
Great video's I went out and got a L31 I guess R motor from a one ton 4x4. Four bolt motor, think I read somewhere these have a forged crank? I got lucky and had a guy swamp me some parts for some Vortech heads and ended up with that cam! Following your build to a T for my 2nd gen Z28 manual trans.
Great build! Thanks for all the details.
You did a good job Pat!! Very good series.
Thank you. I appreciate that!
Did you ever make a video on how to reuse the stock balancer? Is that only because you changed out the stock timing cover? I'm slightly confused! Thanks in advance for any information you can give me!
I'd like to see the summit 1103 cam on the Dyno.
I couldn't find a video with HP numbers or any forums. It's got about the same specs as the l82 cam or any other rv cam. which is the 350/350 HP cam I think.
I installed this cam a while back it's alright on the torque. Was gonna go with the summit 1785 cam but the 106 lobe separation stopped me.
I'm glad I saw this before I messed up. I've got a similar build. I'm running the cloyes double roller and a milodon steal cover. I was about to install stock balencer. I don't have access to a lathe. What do I do? Buy a balencer for an old style block like the timing cover?
You can use a pre vortec balancer
@@cuttersperformance thank you.
Newbie budget build question .If the summit cam is used . Can the stock vortec rocker arms be used ? or roller tip rocker arms is a must have . thanks .
I got an 880 short block, I believe cam is comp 288hr, promaxx 195cc heads, 1.5 jegs roller rockers, single plane intake. 400 turbo transmission
I think it’s a good start to put in a 76 Pontiac Grand Prix
Really good start!
Yo I love your vids can I run that summit cam you mentioned on a fresh crate 880 stock block just add the cam to it or do I need a new timing chain and change the valve springs to and is that summit cam a roller or hydraulic cam then I need to change my lifters and push rods to
I’ve spent the last 3 months building an 880 block to your exact parts list and using the 8802 cam! Motors getting dropped in this weekend . Ordered a 2200 stall converter hopefully enough
Awesome man! Let me know how it works out
In the right car this is a LS Hunter.
How did it go?
What pick up tube did you use for the hv oil pump? I’m having trouble locating the correct one since there are so many. Thanks for the vids I’ve watched all the ones going back to porting stock vortecs. You should throw a set of those on and see what the numbers are.
I just used a stock style 3/4 pickup from an L31. Set the height and tig welded to the pump. The heads were mildly ported (mostly exhaust side) on this L31 bidget build. Im assuming that was a big reason it made more power than expected
Love this series of videos. Awesome work! I'm starting a rebuild on L31 880 block with vortec heads. Current was setup for Spider EFI and considering a setup like this but with an alternate intake and EFI. If you have suggestion on EFI / intake setup for something like that please let me know your thoughts. Thanks and keep up the great work!
Also need to figure out how all this works with current 1999 engine module / electronics. Maybe that needs to be completely deleted. Learning so please forgive my ignorance.
found Chevy and Hotrod magazines from the early to mid 2000s. long story short, i coped an engine build with aluminum VT heads, i did some head work knocking off the ruff areas and increasing the left. i used single relief valves clearance pistons when the book used dual. book said 425, but i never dyno'd it
Would a Windsor build b an option? 😊
Awesome as usual. Cant wait to see whats next
Thanks Jerry!
Enginetech is some good stuff. I've used a couple of their rebuild kits and was really impressed with the parts I got in the kits and the engines are still running strong. Where can I get one of those hats?
In my area the Vortec 350's are hard to find and start at $600.
Also, how about a recommendation for a budget set of aftermarket iron Vortec heads for those that might be wary of the stock heads cracking. The Summit branded Vortecs maybe?
Love this series of videos!
EQ or the summits (dart heads)
Wow my budget is $2500 and you're almost $1000 dollars below that thanks for the part list im definitely copying this build for my IROC
Great video and the explanation, Pat! Where would you recommend us buying those stock size GM cam- and crankshaft bearings?
Enginetech
Thanks for posting these video's they are very informative, I have a set of 062 heads and installed ls springs with 174003-3 retainers and +30 keepers, the question i have is can i grind down the self aligning washers or tops of the keepers to make clearance between the keepers and roller rockers? My intake valve stem stick out is about .0645" and i have about a .010" gap between the roller and valve stem because the self aligning washers are hitting the keepers, i did order a different set of rockers to see if clearances are better.
I have ground down the centering nibs on roller tip rocker arm for clearance. You only need about .040" to safely center it on the valve tip
Was wondering if I used flat top pistons (SUM-17351C-00) with the Summit Cam if there’s enough Piston to Valve clearance?
definately do the 400 with vortecs 😀
Im thinking a 87 octane Torque monster build 🤔
@@cuttersperformanceI'm sure you've found the old Motortrend engine build article from 2004 called 'Chevrolet 406 CI Engine Build - Impersonator II
525 lb-ft and 490 hp From an 87-Octane 406'. I've yet to see a RUclipsr duplicate this.
Cool Video, I actually have the LT4 hot cam and the GM performance 1.6 aluminum rockers, been sitting on the shelf for years, not going to use them on my current build, they will wait for another build.
outstanding! budget and horse power..🙂
Hey Pat, did you ever post the Vortec timing cover vid?
So im not seeing anyone asking, but what is the idle like with the LT4 hotcam or 8802 summit cam with a carb? Ive searched RUclips and keep finding different sounding engines, not sure if some are fuel injection and some carbs, or if idles are set different or what. Ive got a L31 crate motor in my 55 chevy and outside of carb issues it runs decent, but its a hot rod and id like a little chop at idle, nothing crazy cause id like to keep power brakes, stock or stockish torque converter etc. So my thought is to go with the 8802 but dont know what to expect sound wise, no since in doing a cam swap and changing head springs for the same idle, although top end performance would probably be a lot better.
Mild idle with abit of chop, like 15+ vac on a lower compression 350 like this L31
Did you do any porting to the heads?
not boring fantastic build it shows spending lots of money may not be wise 400 hp is nothing to laugh at if it will hook up on the street 😁thanks.
Thanks for your knowledge and info!
A stroker version would be a good level 4, since there are a bunch of interesting bottom end changes to think about. 400 SBC I'm not so interested in, I don't see many available.
what if a guy wants to run the stock fuel injection? i have a 2000 5.7 with the spider injection that i'd like to get a little more power out of when its time to rebuild. Probably .030 over, some head port and polish but not interested in going back to a carb.
The single roller is a better timing chain than a double roller. There was a shim that was sold by IIRC ATI that was used with their LT1 balancer. It is the correct width to shim the balancer. Then again I would only run a SFI balancer on a performance build. Full roller is also a better rocker, really no reason to run a roller tip only. They make stamped steel self aligning 1.6s that works with a combination as well as those roller tips would. Full roller added 10 ft/lbs across the board on my old LT4 Hotcam L31.
Is there a link to the video for the regulator ring mod?? Ty
Great videos champ. 👌
First let me say I really appreciate your time and effort doing all these videos , I've learned so much and saved alot of money thanks to you. I'm going to use the Summit cam you suggested. You said you could use the stock rockers , would it be worth it to purchase a set of Scorpion 1.5 roller rockers? Also I have a Chev. Perf. 350/357 hp. crate motor with the hyd. roller cam, Vortec heads and just wanted to double check that using the stock pistons and pushrods were okay to use as is ? Since my engine is the same as the one you built I just wanted to verify that the piston to valve clearance was good to go. Thanks again for everything.
Thank you I appreciate the support! What summit cam part# are you referring to? The reason I ask is that you can not use the stock rocker arms on a Lt4 hotcam or similar. On this L31 budget build, I used a set of PRW roller tip rocker arms. The stock rocker arms should not be used over .480 lift
Thanks for the fast reply. That was the Summit 8802 using 1.5 rockers and + .030 keepers@@cuttersperformance
Yeah, you can use that cam with beehives with .030 offset retainers like I did with the similar Lt4 hotcam. But you cannot use the stock rocker arms, you can use the a 1.5 ratio (stock ratio) using an aftermarket rocker arm
With using the stock pistons and push rods was the piston to valve clearance okay? sorry for all the questions just getting all the parts and just wanted to make sure. Thanks for all your help.@@cuttersperformance
@user-nk2ov7so7l yeah it has lots of clearance with the stock pistons and the LT4 hotcam
For a little more power, would it be worth it to replace the pistons with flap tops? There are stock replacement cast pistons with a 1.56 compression height available for a resonable price. With these pistons, steel shim head gaskets and the stock deck height, the quench is around .040. Compression ratio would be around 10.25.
Compression always makes power but at the risk of fuel sensitivity with a mild cam
I'm thinking the efficient vortec chamber combined with a tight quench would create good turbulence. If so, the engine may be able make power with less timing and be less fuel sensitive?
@heavyg7105 yeah but also the weight and gearing of the vehicle its going into plays a big factor. Im sure this cam would be fine with 10.5:1 tuned properly with 91+ octane and a light vehicle
I do have a base motor, but I'm at loss as to what to do to it on account I don't know what's in it. I got an awesome deal on a vortec 350 magnum marine motor with 450 hrs on it. I've bin pulling my hair out trying to figure out what's in this thing without tearing it apart. Do you have any experience with using a marine motor as a base for a build? The balancer doesn't need any modification as it dose not have a crank sensor and sits further back than an automotive balance plus the plastic timing cover has the hole for the sensor hole is plugged as part of the plastic casting. The problem with Mercruiser is its hard to find specs for anything like the cam the heads all they list is parts # and you just replace it. I do know its a four bolt main block I suspect it may also have 202 heads. 2000 Mercruiser 350 magnum (carbed) was going to put it in my truck but i think this would make a killer street rod motor.What do you think?
keep the videos coming 👍👍
11:38 one of the reasons why I went with the lunati voodoo 270 roller. They have a pressed and pended Iron distributor gear so no need to run one of those ridiculously overpriced $100 distributor gears. The voodoo has identical valve timing to the hot cam but with voodoo lobes, more lift and ground 6° advanced but of course you can retard it so not a big deal.
What would be the cam equivalent to a roller cam? Disadvantages?
It has been years since a 400 SBC with Vortec heads was done. PLEASE DO THIS!
In previous video you mentioned you didn't use a carb spacer and would go over that in a later video. Did I miss that video or have you not gone over that yet?
No that video is coming up next. Very good info if you are running a dual plane
Did you have to use a gasket for the oil filter adapter ?
No I never do
Great job 👍🇦🇺
Would any head work need to be done using a summit 8800 cam with 1.6 rockers. .480 lift?
Very informative. Thank you.
very helpful, thanks a lot man
Glad to help!
What aftermarket head u recommend one or two step above the vortec head
Afr Enforcers is the best "budget" head that I've used so far
Are the Summit retainers Sum-174003-3 equivalent to the 787 retainers?
Yes
I am thinking about building an exact duplicate with the summit roller cam. I am curious if this will be good for my daily driver work truck?
Yeah, i run something very similar in my shop truck
@@cuttersperformance does yours have an auto trans? If so, do you run a stock torque convertor?
I have a very similar setup to this with the 8802 cam. What did you set your initial timing to? How about total? Did you set the initial with the vacuum advance hooked up? Thanks!
How do you resize a powdered connecting rod ..the vortec has cracked rods ..my machine shop told me it shouldn't and wouldn't attemp it
They didn't use crack rods in sbc until the LS series. The vortec L31 rods are Powdered Metal but they are not cracked. Ive had many sets resized, just like a regular SBC rod. But as a side note LS Cracked rods can also be resized but the ID of the rod is made larger and a larger OD bearing is used , rather than grinder the caps and restoring the ID of the rod.
Thanks for the reply .So i'm in the process in building L31 and hopefully I can squezze 400 hundred hp and torque out of it . And you are correct no about the rods being none cracked rods ..I was going to replace the rod bolts with ARP bolts because it's insurance to me but my machinest said the factory bolts can handle 500 hp's. I wonder how much distortion if any if I did them myself ? .I really do not have much choice on who does my machine work and their 30 miles away. The block will be 040 over it's been there for over a month. Anyway thanks again for the reply have a great weekend .ltr.
I just ordered my rebuild kit with the 1094 Head gaskets and the Sum 8802 cam. I’m doing the beehive spring upgrade but the ports are staying stock. How much of a loss in HP do you think it’ll be? Still over 400hp I hope.
Hi Pat. Will be doing my vortec heads to your spec.
I have the pre 96 standard block with solid flat tappets and would like to use the standard vortec 1.5 rockers. Could you please suggest a cam?
Thanks
Kyle
South Africa
That summit 8802 it takes a melonized gear? I contacted them about a cam i bought a Summit SUM-1227 for a older gen1 non roller block. They cant seem to tell me what gear to use, they keep saying a carbon/poly gear or bronze. This is for a street/strip car i dont want to be buying a new distributor gear every 10k miles. I was told the billets are 5150 steel and howards said i can run one of their Steel distributor gears if this is true. Any info u have would be apprecated.. Thanks
It needs a melonized gear
So this means we CAN go over 500 lift with a stock vortec head? Just upgrade valve springs and good to go?
Check out this video
ruclips.net/video/UZosxGQyGMs/видео.html
Gonna go with Jegs carb instead to save $350 but would you say that summit cam is daily friendly? If not what would you recommend?
Very daily friendly, i run something similar in my shop truck
Have you ever put 305 vortec heads on a 327
No I haven't, been trying to find decent 327 for vortec build
What cam would you put in a vortec engine if all you did was put another cam in? And what kind of power would you guess it to make?
Hi Pat. Is it necessary to have the big ends of the rods resized with the ARP rod bolts already installed? I saw a video where the guy had the big ends resized and then installed the ARP hardware afterwards and it pushed everything out of round. I asked my machinist to resize the rods back to factory spec but he doesn’t have the ARP hardware. Is this a big deal in your opinion?
Yes, it's absolutely nessasary to resize the rods when arp bolts are added. The clamping force is different, and your rod end will be oval. If you have already got your rods resized with the factory bolts, then I would just leave them at this hp/rpm level. As long as the stock bolts haven't been over torqued they will be fine. I add arp bolts for extra reassurance, but it's not always nessasary. An engine that sees north of 6k rpm it's a good idea
@@cuttersperformance thank you Pat!
I need 4 of those
What is the highest static compression ratio are you comfortable running on a daily pump gas street engine with iron heads and if you did have an engine with a high compression ratio you wanted to run on pump gas what changes to the cam would you look for to lower the dynamic CR? Higher Duration? Tighter LSA? Different ICL? Or all...
Ive done just over 11:1 vith vortecs and pump gas. Im actually doing another one on the dyno coming up. I want to try to max it out on VP race gas concentrate fuel and then run in on High octane pump gas to see power differences with tuning. Tight quench, large cams and light vehicles make a big difference
Will this vortec head set up work on a 91’ 350 tbi , I have a truck with a crate engine from gm with only 10k on it just looking for a economical way to get it making power , it’s for my son so I don’t want to go crazy at this point maybe 350-400 hp, what would u recommend ? Thanks
What’s the part number for the single plane intake
My son and I built a motor almost identical but we used the 8802 summit cam.
He bought a factory reconditioned 4779 Holley 750. I’m having trouble getting the jetting figured out. Plugs are black. Any tips would be much appreciated!
Awesome video watch all of them almost as soon as you drop them.
Could you borrow a 650 from someone just to see how your engine reacts?
I'm betting the smaller carb would be fine.
its should run pretty well with a 650 to 750 carb. With this intake 750 carb with no spacer 68 front jets/ 80 rears with 34 deg total timing
@@cuttersperformance Thank you!!!
what about pinning the rocker studs instead of doing screw in
Yeah you can do that
Yes, absolutely do a sb400
High torque 87 octane combo is what im thinking
@@cuttersperformance I say stock crank, stock short rods with good bolts and flat top pistons!!!
Maybe some cleaned up Vortec heads?
Solid flat tappet?
Won't be 87 octane but would probably make great power on a decent budget!!!
Hey man I just have a question. I used +30 keepers on my valves and it brought my installed height too where I needed it. But I don’t have much valve tip only about 10 thousand clearance between the prw 1.6 rocker and the retainer. Is this enough? Or is there a minimum amount of clearance between the rocker and retainer?
When will the balancer mod video be out? 7:22
Its coming up, i had to take a break for filming to do a shop reno that took longer than expected. Videos coming soon
@cuttersperformance Thanks for the update and renos normal take longer than we always think 😅
@shotgunmaster39 man 100% and more money too haha way she goes
How's the shop renos coming it's been a while lol, waiting on the balancer video @@cuttersperformance
I have a stock 97 4bolt with 75000 and going to put it in my 57 chevy. What small cap distributor do you recommend? Ps like your videos very helpful