Bad Line Distributions & Filler Members
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- Опубликовано: 9 июн 2024
- Welcome to Season 3 of Kpop Cancelled, and our 2nd halloween episode where we decided to dress up as BLACKPINK while discussing filler members, visual members, and horrible line distributions in K-pop!
˚ · . TIMESTAMPS . · ˚
0:00 our costumes!
2:39 Filler Members
6:24 the point of Kpop leaders?
10:55 equal line distributions is ruining discographies
23:59 Main vs Lead?
42:57 continued
27:02 companies shouldn’t shy away from units within a group
31:37 the WORST line distribution
39:04 positions in groups
45:20 nothing wrong with members who are only pretty
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ANGELINA'S IG » / moluccensis
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#KPOP #KPOPCANCELLED #BLACKPINK 
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Ok, best part of my day was listening to Lisa and Rosé have a whole argument about the difference between 'main' and 'lead' vocalist 😂
ok but who was right??? lol
Rosé obviously 👀
@@moluccensis I agree 100% with Audrey, but since both of us don't have English as our first language, I'll give you the benefit of the doubt just because of that lol
I think lead is just a way of saying your great but the main is best vocalist of group. In my opinion if San wasn’t in ATEEZ he would fit as a main vocalist in any other group, but because Jongho exist he gets second best AKA Lead Vocalist.
@@tanyaragan724I feel that about many lead vocals like in Red Velvet we know Wendy is on a whole another level, but Seulgi is also main vocalist level and Seulgi could easily be main vocal in many other groups. So main vocal is the best vocal and lead is the next best vocal. If the group has a very strong main vocal, then the lead vocal can get kind of overshadowed because of how good the main vocal is.
Main is a higher post than the lead. Based on what I can see, the main are usually assigned the high notes and ad libs, while the lead takes center stage for the melody. As for dancers, the main usually handles choreography or gets the solo, the lead takes center during group dance breaks. For raps, the main is the better rapper followed by the lead.
i think of it as like “main” positions are so good that they stand out from the group, where “lead” positions are “leading” the rest of the group i.e. lead dancers setting the style for group dances or lead vocalists setting the tone for the song
Leaders actually do have responsibilities for the group. While it's probably not mentioned as much now, leaders actually do have quite a bit of responsibility compared to other members along with more communication with staff, company people and making sure group members are accounted for, etc. They also can in some cases be held responsible for members being late to schedules, behavior, scandals, etc.
Yes Watching Sera in the 9Muses documentary really opened my eyes to what the leader role entails.
The leaders are basically the delegates of the group. On the groups behalf it’s on the leader to negotiate with the company for any reason’s necessary and to also take the accountability for the whole group if there are mistakes or incidents. They will take the blame if the company finds any “faults” with the group.
I’m so surprised they don’t get this , I feel like anyone who’s worked a job , been in a club , even been in a friend group understands why a leader is important. Even in a group without a leader an unofficial leader will often form . You often see the leaders of groups checking to make sure everyone is comfortable and accounted for and that’s just in public behind the scenes they do a lot more.
The cons and responsibilities seem to far outweigh the benefits lmao. You can be very popular and successful without being the group leader, I don’t understand the benefit of it.
@gummy5862 most leaders don't necessarily choose that role. It is assigned to them by the company and typically most often one of the oldest members (by age or trainee time) is assigned as leader.
About leaders. Don't know how it is in kpop groups, but as a former rhythmic gymnast, our leader was responsible for our group's practice routine. Like, you know, a coach sees our performance, says what we should work on and then the leader is the one making sure we do good. She was also navigating the logistics between us and the coach, because it's easier to communicate with one person instead of 5. I'm pretty sure leaders in kpop also have some kind of responsibilities but those are mainly behind the scene so you won't even know
This reminds me of how we see taeyong lead dance practices and make sure everyone is in sync etc it’s like he’s responsible for making sure they execute the choreo they’re given
I am fine with unequal line distributions. But what I am not fine with is having least lines but also the least screentime. Loona comes in mind with Gowon and Vivi barely treated like a member. What sucks about least screentime is you get lesser chances of being liked by people since you are least noticeable.
The screen time thing is definitely just based on looks. I mean if you’re the least attractive member, you’re the least likely to be stanned regardless.
Bad Line Distributions are OK?
@@gummy5862that is not always true like Jin hardly has 2 second screentime in Not Today and Jin is BTS’s visual.
One thing i dont agree with the video is thta they say "producers give more lines to those that sound good" which is not actually true. When you tjink about twice, producers tend to give Mina, Sana and Even Chaeyoung and Tzuyu sometimes more lines than Jeongyeon, when Jeongyeon's lines would sound betger than these other members
The interesting thing about Loossemble is iirc it’s basically all the members who had the least lines in loona’s discog, and it’s kinda cool getting to hear them shine even though it’s of course bittersweet to have them broken up like this 😢
The Twilight comparison for lead and main was pretty good, bella is the main character we see the story from her point of view, edward is the lead character not just the second main character with her, he has a big role but a step behind her, it can't be without him but he is not the main
leaders have alot of responsibilities, not just starting the group introduction. they are representatives for the whole group to pitch an idea that comes up from the groups to the company and stuff of that like.
With the leader thing, they are the voice for the group regarding company issues and certain topics. Going to one person is easier than going to each member. They are also in charge of making sure the group is ready and together when they have schedules. Many leaders have spoken about how managing the members at the dorms is where a majority of the work goes
THE WIGS OMFG
I'm loving the costumes, that hair colour and style was made for you Angelina!!
thank you so much! 💕
I think for why leaders exist and what they do, it's the same reason sports teams have captains. It's someone that's in charge that's a part of the team, so they can represent the members when dealing with management and also be more attuned to how best to support members than a trainer/coach who spends less time with the members.
One example could be RM from bts. You can see him lead the group in interviews, make sure everyone gets a chance to talk, or when hybe was wanting to do nfts. RM made an entire presentation on why nfts were bad and why bts wish to be excluded from it. So he really takes charge of the whole group and what happens with them.
32:06 the same thing with Beomgyu and Happily Ever After rn 🥲
the WOST line distribution in K-POP
I get what Angelina means by Main and Lead being the same because the words itself don't make sense because Lead and Main are actually synonymous.
However, I also understand Audrey saying they are different. Because in Kpop, main and lead are different. Basically Main is above Lead, and Lead is above Sub. Sub is usually just there to give everyone a vocalist position because technically they all are vocalists.
Sub-Dancer is the only one that doesn't exist because in a group, they need to be synchronized so usually majority are great dancers.
Ok so as a listener to kpop for about 15 years + you have to understand that the contracts can be different !
- For instance in the 2nd gen group Secret, Hyo Sung once said that she was less paid than the other 2 singing members because she didn’t sing the chorus.
- the visual (usually an aspire actor/tress) usually is here to have deals and is often the center. The pb is that this member is mostly to have endorsements so some groups devide those profits while other don’t split individual revenues.
- the same when a member is on hiatus/illness : some group still split revenue some others don’t
- the same for foreigners. CLC’s sorn admit that Thai/foreigner member are less paid than the Korean members because of various details (so this is the same for Lisa in BP, maybe explaining why YGE tries to give her more money upfront to renew her contract)
And for the line distribution… sometimes the company reduces lines for a member as a punishment also... u did something wrong (dating, anything against the rules) so they punish u by reducing your exposure and by extension your individual future career (the center position is a lot about competition in a lot of groups)
When i got into kpop, i was really confused at first, about the main and lead thing, cuz for me those words mean the same, but after some time i understood that in kpop is different. Main is higher than lead. For example, in bp, lisa is main dancer, cuz she is the best dancer in the group, and rose is lead, since she is also a good dancer/performer, but not considered as good as lisa. This might seem unnecessary in small groups, but i think in bigger groups is good to have these, cuz some members talent could be appreciated even if they're still not considered the best. Take for example twice, jihyo is the main vocalist, but nayeon and jongyeon are also good vocalist, so they are given the lead vocalist positions
For tittle track, bc Felix's voice often only used on killer part it start to sound predictable, so they start to mixed it up since Maniac
People always say their song sound the same, but when skz actively change their song structure they also didn't like it lol
And why they start to did it since maniac bc Felix finally comfortable with his singing voice, that's why Chan start to give singing part to Felix
Angelina the costumes are everything and the red hair on you is TOO GOOD
Mains perform the main part, the killer part, leads think of them as physically leading them to the main person. Sort of like a narrator and a main character I guess. Their definitely different.
Leaders also have a lot of responsibility. They are what keeps a group together and is the bridge between the group and the company. Also, if they see a member lacking, they are the ones to make sure it's all ok. They are the glue that hold a group together. Groups that do not have a leader ae Black Pink, you can really tell by how it feels like you are watching 4 soloists versus a unit if that makes sense.
i'm in love with your costumes! you both look amazing and i immediately recognized it. love it!
thank you so much! and i'm so glad you did haha
7:23 Leader isn't just a made up rol, at least some of them are the spokesperson for the group when they have to communicate with the company, like some sort of intermediary. They have extra work.
I think Suho and RM complained about it in a show years ago and I remember TXT's Soobin complaining because he's shy and he has to be the voice of the members when they need to talk to the company.
I think Leaders are different from company to company and group to group. Like Namjoon, Scoups, Hongjong, Chan, Soji of EXID, and Jihyo, I see vastly different than like Yujin of IVE, Chaewon, Taeyoung(NCT), or really any end of 4th/5th Gen bg. Some I just feel like are given the title for fandom purposes, and I don’t see many of them would shake things up at the agency for their group. Maybe because of hierarchy systems in Kr some step up more. TLDR I think it can be clear that some become Leaders because they just ARE and some are Leaders because they were assigned it/most capable to take on some extra responsibility. It’s just a position for some groups/companies and that’s fine
Yunho is not just a main dancer, but he's a dance leader of ATEEZ, and all members acknowledge that - he helps everyone a ton when they practice choreographies and they say his technicality is the best, he learns the quickest and helps other members to get the moves right. They released a video of them preparing Crazy Form choreo and we can see how Yunho is obviously leading the practice when the choreographer is not there. Wooyoung and Mingi are the main dancers officially, they get center positions in the dance breaks along with Yunho or solo dances for their parts (Mingi specifically). But other members improved immensely and probably got close to the main dancer position, especially San and Yeosang, but not officially yet.
How has Angelina been involved with Kpop since second gen and not learned the difference between Main and Lead positions yet? Too cute. 😂
Not sure abt cute but it was a choice
OMG THE WIGS! Immediately clicked. These fits are amazing 😆❤
thank youuuu! 💕💕
The main character is the character that the story focuses on while the lead or second lead is the person that will help the main protagonist and is a love interest. A main vocalist is the main show vocally in a group and the lead is a support to them in a way
Almost everyone who debuts is attractive, so using pretty privilege to excuse the over-exposure of certain members just because they’re your personal favorite is unfair, makes no sense and hinders people from picking their own favorites organically. Chan from Stray Kids is a lot of fan’s favourite based solely on his personality, but a big part of that is sharing his personality online. If a member is rarely shown, how could they possibly appeal to fans? Take Liz from IVE, coz they clearly have some kind of allergy to showing her face in MVs. In Kitsch, she had barely any lines and was shown for 6 seconds. In I Am, she had the most lines and was shown for 10 seconds, while the person who got the least lines had the second most screen time. Pretty privilege isn’t a good excuse here, since Liz is extremely cute (she reminds so much of beloved actress Park Bo-Young), so how does this make sense? Because Wony happens to be cuter, it’s okay to use Liz’s voice the most while pretending she doesn’t exist? I’ll never cosign that as being okay. What I will cosign are those amazing costumes! The wigs are everything, except for the bangs, sorry but blunt bangs are a no - in future, I recommend a wig with feathered bangs
Main Vocalists are basically the better vocalists and usually are also ones with more lines. Lead Vocalists are also very good vocalists but not as good as the main vocalists and may usually have less lines but still lots of singing lines. This also goes for Main and Lead rapper.
Also, the main positions are designated so the other members know whose lead to follow. For example Jhope with dancing, he was the one keeping the member's performances in line BECAUSE he has that position
nowadays most groups with fewer members dont really have official leaders (aespa, bp, newjeans etc), whereas groups with more members will usually have one which i think makes sense. more members means more opinions to be considerate of which can easily cause disagreements which in turn will strain their relationships. i imagine it's already complicated for groups of various ages and trainee durations to argue/fight, not only do they need to consider the age hierarchy but also the whole job hierarchy. like who's more experienced and been under the company (including training) longer etc.
a leader is really just a mediator and team representative who's responsible for things managers can't really do for them, like gathering all members for practices
Omfg Angelina looks amazing with that hair no cap😮 truly believe bangs suit everyone
MAIN IS MORE THAN LEAD IN KPOP, its that simple
Miracle in december was the perfect example for subunit songs but all members still participate in mv
happy halloween from fat lisa and french canadian rosé! 🎃
BLACKPINK Halloween Costumes!
I get the concept of leader for (G)I-dle since Soyeon has overseen so much of their music but it seems less clear to me for other groups.
I have to say that haircolor and the bangs look so good on you, Angelina!
Please that hair color and cut looks SO GOOD. You should experiment more in daily life because the Rose wig is just a great costume while the Lisa wig with makeup is such a great style and fits you so much
Audrey: *says literally anything*
Angelina: I get that but also no
lol
i am actually waiting for your MAMA predictions
Oh you ATE with the visuals
For SKZ case,
Chan, Changbin and Han is a different case cuz as what you said they're the producers of skz but splitting wise its the same. They have same contracts "prolly" cuz they're in the same group but their royalties? They can now directly receive it from KOMCA as they are now members of the association.
Leaders - leaders are the one's who unites, disciplines and make the group organize. If the members have concerns, the leader will gather that informations and he will be the one to tell the manager or the higher ups about it. The leader holds a very big responsibility tbh. If a leader is not doing his responsibility, expect that the group will be in chaos and bad articles spread left and right. Hence companies usually assigned the eldest or the one who is responsible. Chan was picked cuz he has more experience, he is the eldest an he can definitely handle the group.
Dance Leader - Lee Know is chosen by Chan to be the dancer leader of skz. You might be wondering "what's the difference of a dance leader to a lead dancer?" Its different cux first, Chan chose lino cuz he is the professional dancer of skz. He has more background in dance hence his 11 years of him as a professional dancer. Chan chose him cuz of his knowledge, skills and technicalities. Lino is also a got the experience of a choreographer (he went to college to be a choreographer). The second point is the dance leader aka lino is the one who leads the practices, he teaches and points out choreographies that needs improvements and rendition. If the kids have concerns, lino will help and guide them. Another thing is he is the fastest to learn choreographies in skz, he first learns the choreo then after mastering, he then teaches the kids the choreo.
One thing chan chose him cuz if chan is not present in group activities, lino will be in charge in leading the group. He is the dance leader and co-leader of chan in skz.
4:50 Actually, Crayon Pop's ChoA once mentioned in a Reaction Video to an old Crayon Pop Song (I think it was FM, but I'm not sure...) that she got payed for singing the Chorus specifically, so Members do get payed differently at least in some Companies actually
Angelina (Lisa ver.) and Audrey (Rose ver.) are something I didn't think I needed. Y'all looks so good!!@
i'm happy Shuhua get more lines, i remember she had just one line before or sang just lalala part. Maybe because she wasn't fluent in korean before but i like to hear her voice and she get more line and screentime
the bangs and ginger hair is life changing, it’s incredible
OMG ANGELINAAA THAT HAIR COLOUR LOOKS SO GOOD ON YOU
I feel like the only issue that artists themselves might have with having a small amount of lines is the branding of it. Idols that get more lines are most of the time the more “popular” members among the crowd, so in turn they get more outside of the group. Like brand deals, advertising, variety shows, and more. In turn, they would get more money. So I think for idols not getting that “limelight,” they’re missing out on more money options and popularity.
OMG THESE OUTFITS ARE ICONIC
I feel like asking what’s the point of a leader is asking why have a manager or a supervisor . I mean look at JB who got the rights for GOT7 name. I believe this is why leaders change sometimes in a group because a certain member will get overwhelmed with the responsibilities.
The thing is if a company wants a 8 member group but find less than 8 that are the talent they want to, I really think they will pick sone just for the visuals or a certain gimik to then have the desired member number
It’s not about paying them per seconds of lines they have but it is about more lines = more screen time = more opportunities for them which leads to the prospect of their career. I am fine with unequal distribution but if one member have 4-10 secs speaking lines and the rest have 25s plus is ridiculous.
Omggg y'all look stunning ❤❤❤
I dont get main and lead with a lot of groups like Jennie is the main rapper but lisa raps the most
In Stray Kids Han and Changbin DO have more lines in the songs they produced 😂However for Bangchan it's the opposite, he always gives the spotlight to others
Your discussion about being heartbroken over not getting to sing the best part of a song you wrote is basicslly the entire story of the song "Bridge Over Troubled Water" by Simon & Garfunkel, which ultimately resulted in the group's demise.
I love the way you dress up haha It's so fun to see you in different styles 😊
The leader position basically is the one who takes the blame for everything that the members do because they sort of manage them in a way. They are the one(s) that make the group make it or break it by assuring that everyone feels and is safe, everyone follows the rules, does what's necessary etc... and if someone messes up, netizens and the company blame them most of the time and trash them, treats them as bad leader etc... they are the pillar of the group. The one they can rely on. The one that rallies the group if tension forms etc... the parent (LITERALLY) of the group no matter if they are the oldest or not, they are there to assure that everyone works perfectly with each other with no bullying, hate etc... and maybe with love, laughter etc... they make important decisions sometimes if the companies allow them to be in a position where they can choose what to do or not, like participating in something like Queendom or Kingdom, when to do a comeback etc... if a member feels homesick, they assure that this particular member is ok. They tend to not let anyone be left out to. Like if someone is a lone wolf, they make them participate etc... they solve problems within the group if some have unresolved issues between them... etc... at least this is how I see the leader position. They are not perfect but they are there to put stability and a sense of parenthood in a group to make it work. Idk if I am clear 😭. This is why sometimes it's stressful etc... imo
"Main" and "lead" in common English usage mean the same thing, like Angelina said. In kpop however main vocalist is above lead vocalist, which doesn't make sense to me. Like why can't the "lead vocalist" be a regular "vocalist" lol. Just another kpop thing.
There is a clear hierarchy in K-pop groups in terms of Main -> Lead -> Sub-/no prefix. In Twice for example, Jihyo is the main vocalist and Nayeon is a lead vocalist. Whilst Nayeon typically starts the song, Jihyo has more high notes, complex parts, sings live, etc. Often the main vocalist has a standout vocal ability, eg Wendy in RV, Miyeon/Minnie in G-idle. Similarly, the main rapper and main dancer are standout in their ability. Eg Momo as the main dancer in Twice, Soyeon main rapper in G-idle. They also tend to have solos.
All members are important, but I think these titles come into play when assigning parts in a song.
I think 4th gen groups may be moving away from the rigidity of this structure, but it definitely exists.
Yes! Maddox is totally on Ateez tracks. It's not just one song. Thank you for acknowledging it!
Ok so the problem is clearly that Main means almost the same thing as Lead but Main Vocalist and Lead Vocalist are actually completely different. Main vocalist is your usual high note belter for smaller groups and for bigger groups you usually have two, one for high notes and one with still very impressive vocals that gets about the same lines. Meanwhile lead is completely different since while you still get important parts you get way less of them. In a general Kpop song I’d say Main gets Verse+Prechorus-Chorus+Bridge, while lead gets Prechorus+Chorus and maybe a verse if it’s a smaller group. Here’s some clear examples to explain.
Blackpink: Rose is main, Jisoo and Jennie are lead
Twice: Jihyo is main, Jeongyeon is lead (im not sure if nayeon is lead or main)
Nmixx: Haewon and Lily are main, Sullyoon is lead
Kep1er: Chaehyun and Youngeun are main, Yujin and Dayeon are lead (Yeseo is lead too kind of?)
Of course not every group has official position so it can be a bit subjective but yeah it makes sense, just think of lead as a good vocalist who simply isn’t on the level of the best one in the group
Angelinaaa you are so pretty and that hair color suit you so good
Ok... 4:39 I literally had this EXACT same thought the other day. I'm also team "sometimes certain voices wouldn't be best"
Angelina, I get what you mean as far as outside of kpop, main and lead are interchangeable, but in kpop… main is considered the best or most skilled in whatever category and will typically get the most difficult parts of the performance. Lead is second best and will also get some of the more difficult parts. Sub is typically where everyone else falls and are the people who are the least skilled in those areas in the group.
You look stunningg
31:45 yeah they always had vocal and RaplLine Songs from the very beginning in Albums, Like the 4 chyphers (and Intro and outro of for example skool Luv affairs in 2014) up until 2016 and the corosponding vocal Line songs and then on map of the Soul 7 with ugh and Zero o' clock and in between the subunits in multiple albums
main/lead etc etc could also be more for the group members itself , to cause less tension among the group perhaps?
In terms of "Main" "Lead" "Sub" I think it was WAY more prevalent during, 2nd and 3rd gen because during the debut of most of the those groups you could be debuted in a group if you were REALLY good at least one thing, Dance, Vocal, or Rap. Rappers and Vocalists had to be able to follow the group in terms of dance and Dancers had to be able to be sing or rap. That would be the times when groups would be split into their positions based on their talent in that one area. Of course as the group gets better with experience over time.
Take Exo as an example, three main vocalists in the group, Baekhyun, DO, and Chen, all very strong vocalist, often give the main parts of songs, higher/ longer held notes, often put in sub units together. Three main dancers, Lay, Kai, Sehun, in terms of styles very different, but all incredibly talented at dancing and were marketed that way, often received little to no lines in either rap or vocal depending on the song. Chen as well as Chanyeol (Main Rapper) and Suho (Leader) have talked in the past how they were the worst dancers in the group, but their other skills got them into the group.
Now today with 4th gen groups, it almost seems arbitrary to have positions except for things like Leader, Main rapper, Main Vocal, Main Dancer because most of the other members are AT THE LEAST good at dance and then either singing or rapping. I think The Boys is a great example for this, all the members of The Boyz are great at dancing, but they have three main vocals, Sangyeon, Kevin, and New, two main dancers Juyeon and Q, and one main rapper Sunwoo, (according to profiles). All 11 members are incredible dancers, but when it comes to technique, detail, and performance Juyeon and Q often become the teachers of the other members.
By this last comment, like said positions are used by fan to criticized others positions members: Visual members are needed and they are talented! Visual position is heavy to carry and leader is also even more heavy to bear, visual members are the one who are the most hated as most popular too specially in girlsgroup. Visual are the face of the group and yes when we see a mv, visual is important like center position
not the hala hala sample in jersey shore 💀
Ateez Song on Jersey Shore?
Ngl, i saw the thumbnail and I was so confused on who you guys were supposed to be until I heard Angelina’s amazing cover
COSTUMES ON POINT 🙌🏼
the lead vocal usually starts the song and sings the 2 verse of the chorus the main vocalist sings mostly somewhere in the song and sings the first part in the chorus
“Main” and “Lead” 100% mean the same thing in normal English, but the kpop hierarchy system just kinda co-opted the words and had them mean slightly different things. So, in the kpop-specific meaning of the terms: main is the highest position, lead is the next step down. Whatever, I guess. 🤷♀️
First video and i like it❤😂
Heyyy angelina... I would really like to hear u guys talk about seventeen on these topics ❤ the outfits tho 😸
I agree with Angelina on this one. Lead and main sound like the same thing to me. I don't understand the difference. Maybe it's bc in English lead and main have very similar meanings. Main means, "to be the chief or highest ranking role of a group", mainly used as an adjective. Whereas lead means, "to be the head of something in a leadership role", which can also be used as an adjective. So having them be different distinct roles, with titles like, "main dancer" and "lead dancer" for example, sounds very confusing to a native English speaker. Please reply and let me know the difference in a clear and distinct way if you can. I honestly want to know the difference if there really is one.
Heated discussion, misunderstandings based on semantics, love to see it! 42:35 death by exasperation. :D
EXID used to frequently have its b-sides include only the members that were relevant to the specific song. A vocal song would not have a rap, and they wouldn't have the rapper in it. A rap song might not have vocalists in it, etc.
The gloves SENT me 🤣
i'm ok with not equal if all members have a moment of screentime and lines, not just 1 line like Kep1er. I like to not have main, lead vocalist range like Newjeans too
but new jeans hanni and danielle sing that line not just 1 persons lol
FIGHTING OVER Lines in a Song
Angelina looks stunning 😍
You guys look so pretty ?!! omg
I'm so glad you mentioned Spring Day. There's a reason I hate that song and Armys who always gaslight us j-hope fans trying to convince us that he has lines when in reality he has zero.
Lets be honest with line distribution it should be quite equal (within the discography or album) or reflect the positions
Agree if you count the whole discography, but not equal seconds per song. It’s also not a big deal if Distribution varies from comeback to comeback.
Naaaaur the angelina your outfit slayssssss the hair?????
i understand main dancer but there is no need to have a lead dancer truly 😭
Just companies and their obsession with ranking their members so they know who are the best vs the not so greats 🙄
especially in 4th gen
same with vocalists, in some groups the lead vocalists are better than the main lol, or the lead isnt better but gets the most lines so the main vs lead issue is useless
The chokehold that KSHMR samples have on the KPOP industry and music industry as a whole should be a video on it‘s on.
I literally have never understood the difference between Lead and Main in any of the "roles" at all. The best i understand is that one is in charge of high notes but the other might have more parts, but that's still irrelevant to me.
The one about having a beautiful line in a song that u can't perform... this happened with mingyu and scoups lol ..scoups really loves mingyus part in shadow(i mean no wonder that part has its own fandom) so mingyu let scoups sing it in one of their performances. This is just one example.. i have seventeen exchange parts ...including having part switch versions for some songs and unit switches in caratland performances..but even on stage they do exchange parts sometimes. Thats actually very good to do i think.
I don’t follow who in a group is “main” or “lead” vocal or how that plays out in line distributions, but I think that you could impose a hierarchy as follows: “Lead” vocal implies a #1 position (what do you think of when someone is called a “leader” or “leading contender” - we think of 1 person at the front of the pack). So, I would think that the lead singer is considered the #1 singer for the group (however you measure that - killing parts, most lines, etc). “Main” vocal characterizes tier 2 - strong singer, but perhaps fewer lines than the lead. Are there groups where 1 or 2 members are designated as just “vocal” - if so, then I would consider “vocal” to be tier 3
Hair color so pretty!
You guys ate these costumes ngl
love the outfits please do it more often lol
I agree that lead and main mean the same thing. Bella is the lead of Twilight. It's a leading role. She's also the main character.
The confusion seems to be that we consider the words "main" and "lead" interchangeable in English, but they are not used the same way in the K-pop industry. We must consider that they are using these words as loanwords; and therefore, the meaning can change from English to Korean. Similar to how we use the word "schedule" differently. In English, a "schedule" refers to a list of events meant to happen at specific times and/or in a specific order. Whereas in Korean, a "schedule" can refer to an individual work commitment or appointment. Basically in K-pop, "main" and "lead" mean different things. They use "main" to be the highest in the hierarchy, followed by "lead" and then "sub."
In terms of main vocalists, they are usually the most technically proficient singers and have the most challenging singing parts. Since we were talking about ATEEZ a lot. I'll bring up Jongho. He is very clearly the main vocalist. He even introduces himself as the main vocalist and his group members refer to him as such. They give him the most high notes and vocally challenging parts. Depending on the size of the group, you can have multiple main vocalists. For example, Seventeen has two main vocalists: DK and Seungkwan. And they are usually introduced as such.
Lead vocalists come next and also very good singers. They usually get a lot of lines, but they are not as challenging as the main ones. In ATEEZ, this is definitely San, and arguably Yunho and Seonghwa, as well. Also to follow up on the SVT example, the remaining three members of the vocal unit (Jeonghan, Joshua, and Woozi) would all then be lead vocals. SVT doesn't really use this term much as everyone is usually referred to as part of their unit/team if they are not the group leader (S.Coups) or unit leader (S.Coups, Woozi, and Hoshi).
Lastly, we have sub-vocalists who sing smaller parts and usually have relatively simple lines. Sometimes rappers may be sub-vocalists. J-Hope of BTS definitely fits into this category: a main rapper who is also a sub-vocalist.
Also, depending on the group, the leaders do a lot of work behind the scenes. They often work as a representative for the group to the company, liaising between the two entities and advocating on behalf of their members. There's a great example of S.Coups of SVT talking to the CEO of Pledis (I don't know what video it's from, but it's used in almost every SVT guide I can think of). He is seen talking to the CEO about recent changes Pledis made and the CEO is basically saying, you fought hard for those things and I gave you everything you asked for. S. Coups is also shown talking about how he's had to go against the company sometimes to advocate for his members. Also, group leaders may often be responsible for mediating conflicts between the members, making sure everybody is prompt and ready for their schedules, as well as following the company rules. These latter things seem to be more necessary in the early years of a group's career when the members are usually much younger.
I'm now realizing that I've written a whole essay.
TL:DR: Main and lead are not interchangeable in K-pop. Main has a higher ranking that lead. A leader's job requires a lot of work behind the scenes to keep the members and company on the same page and to make sure their team works well together.
I can't speak for what it means in kpop, but in film the main character and the lead character are ALMOST synonymous. But the word "lead" is typically used when there are several important characters, whereas main character is typically only one person. For example, "Bella Swan is the main character and female lead of Twilight, Edward Cullen is the male lead of Twilight, and Jacob is the second male lead."
if you look up the positions its always made up, like if you actually take the time to like watch a few videos of said group you'll see who they think/ are the actual positions of the group, for example; txt, if you look up their positions its the same bs but when you watch a few videos you get the roles like soobin is the leader, sub vocal. yeonjun is the main rapper/dancer/sub vocal, beomgyu is the center/vocalist/dancer, taeyun is the main vocalist, while kai is the lead vocalist. and i also do think leaders have a big position in the group as they are the ones to do alot of the heavy work with the members and over all everyone
I know EXO have talked about Chen getting a lot of money for him doing background vocals and other SM groups too, so I do believe artist get income for what they add to the song beyond just their normal lines.
speaking of blackpink, have u heard that YG is supposedly releasing contract renewal info in November, assumebly to go along with the (theoretical) babymonster debut? maybe ahyeon will debut as part of blackpink lol
tbh, if the group has multiple main dancers and main vocals, and lead dancers etc, what's even the point of having a hierarchy of roles... ^^"
In my opinion the "main' position usually is given to the member, who is the best at something, meanwhile the "lead" s would have a unique voice for example. A good example is Yuqi and Miyeon in G-Idle. Yuqi has a unique voice, which is used a lot, while Miyeon is the most sayable member with well trained voice.
Another good example is SNSD, Tayeon and Jessica were hitting the high notes, but like Tiffany also got a lot lines as a lead vocalist.
I would say its the same logic as visuals and face of the groups, while the visual is the most conventionally attractive, face of the group can have unique visuals, which will make them popular, like Karina and Winter.