This is a Safe Place
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- Опубликовано: 3 июл 2024
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Four walls and a door, enough to keep the scary world out.
Until the scary things start living with you.
Then you're trapped.
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no way skillshare
by the way, the talebots are planning to overthrow you
THE RISE OF THE TALEBOTS @@therealorangemangoes
Thanks
What's odd is how the villagers hate their family. Not just the suspected murderer, but their family. Her whole family got murdered, but they jeer at Mary and sing cruel nursery rhymes about her and her family. She did nothing wrong, in fact, she was a victim, yet they look at her like she's a monster because she was related to someone who may have tried to kill her and their entire family.
I'm not sure what seems odd about this. It's just the way people behave...
It's natural for small town people to do this. What's a threat to one family is a threat to the whole community, so they must alienate the family dealing with the threat to protect themselves. Weird as it sounds, it's based on instinct.
Wierd to me too but then I lived in the middle of nowhere, if anything I was the outcast lol.
And then people wonder why I can't human properly around others despite attempts at practice for three decades. It's so easy for them XD
Maybe they know something about Merricat.
@@Vinemaple Just because society normalized something doesn't mean it makes sense.
how is it that a robot has more empathetic feeling than your average youtuber. talebot, you speak for me
When it comes to Jackson's domestic horror, I have an affinity for "The Summer People" -- Coming from a rural coastal place, I know a lot about Summer People...
Same here. Except the Summer People now live here year-round, many of them, and they don't mix in or change. It gives me the creeps when I go to the store and don't meet or even see anyone I know. And it's getting too expensive for ordinary people to live here.
I've read that the reveal that Mary Cat is the poisoner and functionally villain of the story ( with secondary antagonist being Cousin Edward) is an act of breaking the readers heart. I remember being a bit disappointed in the whole story personally
The novel itself may be different, but from Talebot's summary, Mary Cat seemed the obvious suspect. That may be one reason the solution to the mystery is a trivial part of the story.
Question: What would you have preferred the reveal to be?
One thing I would like to point out regarding "We Have Always Lived in the Castle" is the theme of preservation. It's right there in the title, and throughout the book, the phrase "we have always..." is repeated. Merricat's magic rituals are a way of preserving the stasis around the house, using objects she preserved from her family. She's attached to her sister Constance, who may very well be emblematic of the concept of "constance." She acts childish, despite being 18. It's possible she killed her family as a way of preserving the house and her relationship to Constance, as suggested in the video, but it may very well also be her way of preserving the family as well.
I honestly really like the "draw during the video" idea, ive seen it and its really cool
I love it, and I have been encouraging Abby (the artist) to give us more. I may be wrong, but I think it speeds up the videomaking process, by allowing one drawing to be on-screen for much longer.
Is Constance truly happy, or is she just deluding herself because the reality of their situation is too much for her to handle... EXACTLY like Mary?
Food for thought.
"We aleays lived in the castle" is INSANE, the sign of a declining mind, slowly descending into madness
Insanity lends itself well to fiction
I don't know this story, but I'll have to look into it. In a lot of ways, it makes me think of my dear, sweet mother, who passed away back in 2020. She was the one who really got me into stories and writing in the first place. Great stuff, y'all. Much love.
Talefoundry. I have had a hard time lately. My mental health needs to be cared for and my motivation has been shot. Your videos remind me of the inspiration, joy and creativity that exists among us. You help me daydream and bring to life worlds I never thought I could dream of. You give me new books and stories to explore. Thank you, I cannot explain in words how much of an understatement that is, but thank you.
I find your takes on human frailty refreshing
Can we just appreciate how much the visuals have improved over time? The drawings of the sisters were so awesome
I've read a ton of Jackson's works and i love her writing a ton, I'm so happy you decided to cover her stuff
I havent read this story, yet, but based off of the retelling in this, I think a big theme is the concept of 'the norm might not be the best path for everyone' or 'what is expected to be good, wont always make everyone happy'. The sisters went from a life that was planned out, they were to grow up, get married, give children to their husbands and be an object in a pretty house. Then they become the witches of the town. They are called killers. They are hated. And then they lose their house and eventually the people of the town leave offerings for them, like they are spirits to be appeased. And in the end, they are happy. The culture of the time was so set in stone. As a woman, you had your life planned out and you were to be happy with it. You were expected to be happy with it. But this, this is such a deviation from that path, and yet they are happy.
Other than the family murders, Im happy for them. And if this reflects the feelings of the author, I am so sad for her. This whole story could be seen as something she would have rather gone though if she could. How she would have been happier in a burnt down house, alone with only 1 person, but that one person truly loves you, and she would have been happier there than where she ended up, the idyllic 50's house wife.
And honestly, same. I would rather be alone, in a burnt down hovel, given offerings as if I am an angry god, than to be under the yoke of expectations that pruned away all that I am and could have been.
Dont murder anyone, but definitely seek a path that brings you joy in the face of expectation and conformity. There is nothing wrong with the standard, but if that standard expects you to deform yourself to fit it? Screw it, be a witch in the woods. At least you'd be free to be you.
Ew. completely disagree. She isn't "called" a killer, she *is one.* and she treats her older sister like a child. IF anything, it is the younger sister who traps her older sister and treats her like an object. She is possessive, abusive, selfish, and cruel! This story (since the only objective worth of any story is the impact it has on the reader) is to warn people against abusing your loved ones! The little sister is disgusting! This story DOESN:T give any empathy for people like her!
Although, if you would rather be alone, (and as you mentioned: "angry" ...huh i wonder why?) then it's your life! At least you would choose that life, instead of being forced into it by Marry Cat. IF anything Mary Cat is the abusive symbol of the author's horrible husband.
and "they" aren't happy. only Marry Cat is... ofc her older sister says "I'm happy"
because she has been sheltered and objectified by her younger sister and doesn't know any better. the older sister has no agency and the whole story comes off as very misogynistic.
@@user-ec6vf7zq9j understandable. My only interaction with this story is this video, so I might be misinterpreting it. Its a bad outcome in a bad situation that 2 broken people are trying to find happiness. Its not ideal. Or healthy in anyway. I know I was looking at it with rose tinted glasses. I don't condone killing or manipulation of others. But in this story, in fiction, I think there is some room for a little unearned positivity about the stories outcome, as long as you know that the bad actions of the fictional characters shouldn't be replicated in real life.
If these people were real? Oof, they wouldn't be on my list of "top 20 people to model your life after", but the desperation of wanting to escape the trappings of forced expectation is a concept that can be understandable, even emulated, as long as you know how to translate those feelings appropriately into the real world.
The fact that you have to add "don't murder anyone" proves that you're already looking at this the wrong way. Murder can be a moral act in a story if it serves a symbolic purpose but the obvious idea behind the story is that Merrycat is taking over rulership in the patriarchal system of their family for the exact same reason as that system was kept alive in the first place: possessiveness and conservatism.
@@yggdrasil2 I ment "dont murder anyone" in real life. Im all for murder in stories, I just think, with exception to extreme circumstances of self-defense and the defense of others, people shouldn't kill other people in real life.
Murder in a story? All for it. I see the importance of it. Im a horror fan and have come to terms with the inevitability of dying eventually and made peace with that because of death and murder in stories. But to kill someone, a real person, for some semblance of control or show of will-power, I don't think thats an okay thing to do in real life.
We should 100% take the lessons from stories, but need to learn how to translate those lessons healthily to real life. Murder shouldn't be apart of that translation.
Thank you so much for covering Shirley Jackson! I've always wondered what else she wrote...
I do think I'm going to have to push back a little, bit, Talebot, on the idea that Mary Cat and Constance are free from the Patriarchy while shutting themselves up in their house. The text of the novel may support you, but at a glance, the women are still housebound, caregivers, and have no other opportunities, not even marriage, not any more. True, within their home they make their own decisions, but otherwise, it seems a relatively meager form of liberation. Even Mary Cat's self-appointed role as town witch is following a traditional cultural path.
Correction: Mary-Cat seems to make her own decisions. SHE is the new patriarch of the house.
Kind of weird that this topic would pop up on Tale Foundry as I just recently started reading “We Have Always Lived in the Castle.”
I first read 'We Have Always Lived in the Castle' when I was around 21 or 22, and after seeing the mostly-accurate movie adaptation (they made Charles an attempted rapist at the end, probably just to make Merricat look better by comparison), it solidified a suspicion I'd had when I read the story: What if Constance's lack of discipline towards Merricat - feeding her whenever she asks for meals, letting her do whatever she wants, never scolding her, never punishing her, never telling her to do much more than wash her hands before eating - isn't just because of her kind and complacent nature. Constance was groomed by their parents to be a picture-perfect housewife, but that's not all. My head-canon is that Constance lets Merricat run wild because, in part, she's *afraid* of her. Remember, Merricat had been sent up to her room without dinner that night, so we can assume that punishment was the straw that broke the camel's back. So, Constance knows that Merricat is willing to respond to discipline with murder. So, on some level, she lets her little sister walk all over her because she's afraid that, should she displease Merricat in any way, Merricat will kill her, too.
Merricat is the ultimate abuser in this situation. Manipulating everything, even killing family, just so Constantine can never leave. She claims to be protecting her, but it sounds like Constantine would have thrived as a wife.
@@therancidpizzabox2977 well, yes. Though in either case, she’d have lived under someone’s thumb. If her parents had lived, she’d have been married off to a man from a similar background as her. She may have had to do less housework, instead hiring on a servant or two, but she still would have been expected to serve him. Here, she serves her sister.
I agree that Merricat is abusive. I would just like to point out that, even if she’d never killed their parents, Constance wouldn’t have been truly free.
@@alicenolfi2095 can you elaborate on what you mean by truly free? Because I don’t see working for a boss all day being truly free either. Seems to me that everyone serves someone and the best you can do is choose/hope that the one over you is a good person
@@therancidpizzabox2977by ‘truly free’, I mean free enough to choose her life. Free enough to choose her husband, maybe. Free enough to choose whether or not she’d rather grab whatever money she can carry and simply run away. Free enough to choose her fate instead of having it thrust upon her.
worth noting: magical thinking is a manifestation of OCD. To me, describing it as such makes the whole thing feel more grounded, which, naturally, really helps with domestic horror
I have just realized something strange. When first i've seen you, this channel was... Smaller, more petite, endearing in a strange, evedently genuine way. Now, the channel is much bigger, making animations, live dravs, a ton of effects, and i just ache to see what more you all could add to the channel. It seems like its a transation time beetween a indie project and a comunication giant. It just seems the best time to document your growth, but not the best in total, its the best of time to follow you, but there is a melancholy for better time yet to come, thath stings even more for the near certainty thath you all will improve.
In regards to something you said towards the end, I don't think it's all that worthwhile to wonder what more she may have done if she hadn't been stuck to her housewife role. Her writing (and the same for any author) would be shaped by her life circumstances and experiences, for good and bad.
I read this story completely differently. It didnt feel to me as though they were both happy to escape society. To me it seemed as though Constance had a desire to be part of society but that Merrikat was holding her hostage, whether from fear thar she would end up like the rest of her family or because she didn't think Merrikat could live without her. She was the one that let Charles in and though I didn't like him at all, it seemed like Constance was beginning to stand up to Merrikat after he arrived and had finally begun to move past her family's deaths only to return to catering to Merrikat after she'd set the house on fire. If you were to liken it to the authors life it would feel to me more like someone wanting to be part of the world but being held back by their anxiety. I'll admit, mine may be a more surface level read.
I compare Shirley Jackson to Ursula le Guin. Both women were housewives that only wrote when the chores were done. Jackson was sad, Ursula was serene and joyful. Le Guin's husband loved and respected her. Le Guin's mother adored her and supported her emotionally. I think you can see the difference.
Ooh I love “We Have Always Lived in the Castle.” Shirley Jackson was amazing
I’ve been waiting for thisssss
I love domestic horror, this is what a lot of my shirt stories are about
When I first saw the thumbnail I expected this to be about "House of Leaves" but I'm pleasantly surprised by the actual topic of the video
Oh now i see
"In the psychology of the modern civilized human being, it is difficult to overstate the significance of the house."
In a paradoxical way the title is more disturbing than if it stated the oposite
What a weird interpretation of a woman who murders a family member and then holds the surviving members, and the rest of the town, hostage in their fear of her.
I can’t imagine how you got there.
YES AUTHOR SELF REPORT SO HARD IN THEIR WORK 🗿🤞
3:07 no one can save me! The damage is done!
Great video as always! I think any of Wildbow’s works would be great for a video:
Worm - a deconstruction of the superhero genre
Pact / Pale - Why it would suck to live in a supernatural fantasy/horror setting
Twig - A lesson in biopunk
After reading the comment section, I genuinely find it horrifying that despite two clear murders with no remorse just a favorable narrative is making ppl look at her as the wronged victim and not the monster she is. Honestly the villagers are actually more humane than her.
the intro music is so heart touching that i almost feel it. wery cool one.
it seems a bit ironic that Merrikat sought to escape the traditional housewife role, but essentially imprisoned Constance into a sort of traditional housewife role to her, refusing to let her go just like a jealous husband might refuse to let his wife go to college or get a job.
This is completely unrelated to the video and I know you don't read manga or watch anime very often but after watching a bunch of your videos I think you would really like Monster by Naoki Urasawa I'd love to see what you think about it if you do read or watch it😄
This was a great video! Shirley Jackson's The Lottery was assigned reading when I was in high school and the story has stayed with me to this day because of how chilling it was. And also of course because of Mrs. Jackson's incredible writing! Now I want to read this story!
Great video! And I love the animations ❤
This is my favorite yet.
I remember having to analyse this book for high school. Thanks for resurfacing the trauma :) Good to see what an actual master of literature makes the of the symbolism and ideologies in the novel!
This may sound silly, but Zatura actually really freaked me out as a kid in the sense that the familiar environment was the only environment period. The only other movie that made me feel like this was Skinamarink
I have a lot of respect for TaleFoundry so I’ll be writing my notification below
attention go watch mrpancake4343, don’t forget to tell him who sent you
Attention Mr Pancake4343 is awesome, if you watch him make sure to comment who sent u there (me)
I'd like to believe Joyce Carol Oates took over the mantle when Jackson died...I love her stories too
Easily my favorite book as a kid. Haven't gotten around to the film yet, but it's on my list.
Even before watching this, it seems like this place is not a safe place
Shirley Jackson, for all the praise she receives (and rightly so), doesn't get the praise she truly deserves.
If ya'll want to experience one of the best things ever, David Warner did an audiobook of The Haunting Of Hill House and it's, legit, incredible.
OMG I own We Have Always Lived in the Castle! I recognized the intro immediately, it's such a wonderful book & has such a unique concept. I'm glad you made a video centering around it & domestic horror in general, it's a very underutilized idea :)
i like the speedpaint style
I like the speed paints!
Great video 👍
How writing can make ya feel for a murderer.
Thank you for introducing me to another book and author. I requested the book from the library. This is the third book I have found through your recent videos. Thank you for your wonderful channel!
This was very interesting
I thought this was house of leaves for a good minute
this is my first time seeing the new intro and it is SO COOL!!!
Shirley Jackson’s one of those authors that makes me feel Sympathetic for them and Intrigues me.
i would love to listen to a podcast or audiobook from you
Spooky.
Finally, a book I’ve actually read!!!!
Yay,
A Shirley Jackson themed episode!😯😃
Oh this is really intresting i haven't thought about this type of horror apoliges for the deseption jon but i wanted to make sure you started reading
As an "apologist" for traditional life, I must say that it wasn't the domestic life that drove her crazy, it was the abuse. Even in a"wife's place is in the kitchen" culture, abuse is unacceptable. If your spouse doesn't enjoy their role, something is wrong. And anyone who drives their spouse to death - whether through induced health problems or straight up suicide - is worse than one who straight up murders them outright. Which is already one of the worst possible things you can do.
@@MMumbles... Oh, you're the worst
couldn't have said it better myself! I agree with you taitano! This story feels like a social commentary on how easy it is to abuse people we love.
The domestic life she was forced into by societal pressure put her in the position to be abused like that.
@@Glichyy Just being forced into it is abuse.
So, genuine question: say your married sister comes to you and tells you that she does not enjoy most domestic tasks. She wants to have time for activities she does enjoy, but her husband will not accomodate that because these tasks are designated for the wife. What advice would you give her?
This is the issue with "traditional" marriage (which isn't really as traditional as people like to claim it is). Not everyone is ever going to fit into their assigned role, and there is no room left for them to operate outside of it. Women aren't naturally predisposed to like domestic tasks, and men aren't naturally predisposed for public life. If the culture leaves no room for them to exist outside their assigned roles, isn't abuse in one direction or the other inevitable?
Oh. I watched this on Nebula. Nice 👍🏾
One of the best domestic horror novels I've read in ages is "Sinister House" by Leland Hall. It was, as far as I can tell, one of the only books they wrote and it's fucking phenomenal. It's about a family who moves into the suburbs and get caught up in the strange, supernatural goings on with their neighbors that culminates in one of the freakiest scenes I've encounters in a dog's age. I've been recommending it to everyone I know who's into that particular genre. There's also a lot of commentary on what we call toxic masculinity today going on between certain characters which was super rare for horror written in the mid-thirties.
Thanks!
I feel like you’d be really interested in “tuck everlasting”
This is a great video I love it :)
Posted 20 minutes ago??? Wow! I'm early for once.
Its like if Wednesday Adams wasn't having any fun
Fr
...you mean, like the ORIGINAL Wednesday Addams?
The moment I saw the house I thought you are going to talk about the house.wmd mod in Doom which by the way was inspired by a book called the House of Leaves. I hope you review that book someday too.
One of these days, I'm actually going to read this book.
It's very short, most readers could easily finish it in a day.
I'm listening.
i love your videos
I've never read the book but I watched the movie. Its been a while tho but I remember finding it very intresting
Great novel!
I feel like we'd been here already
I bought this a few months ago because I thought the title sounded Poesque but was told it wasn't what I thought so I put it aside. I'll have to add it to Mt. Toberead.
Yay! An episode on Shirley Jackson! I’ve been waiting for this one. Also, it’s driving me nuts. What’s the name and artist of the song during your sponsor segment. I can’t tell if it’s by Boards of Canada, Zero 7, or Air, but I feel like I’ve heard it before.
Make a video about "Slay the princes"
I dont know if you've covered it yet but if you haven't i would love to see a video about AM, the ai that gained sentience in i have no mouth and i must scream by harlan ellison
For anime fans I do believe if you need a literary representation of a yandere here you go
I've read this book
Don’t tell the Brackens about this house
I had to scroll way too far for this
I didn't know what i was expecting from the video titled "This is a safe place" with "domestic horror" labelled in the background, but seeing We Have Always Lived in The Castle was a nice surprise
i think i have dementia
i think i have dementia
i think i have dementia
i think i have dementia
i think i have dementia
i think i have dementia
.aitnemed evah I kniht I
"I went and chopped down my first tree. It was oak wood, so nothing too special."
@@catbatrat1760 can you beat minecraft with dementia?
@@therealorangemangoes YES! I was hoping someone would get the reference! :D I'm not sure if it counts as "obscure" or not, so I didn't have my hopes too high, lol.
I wonder if this book was an influence on such films as "Practical Magic," which deals with an socially outcast family of witches implicated in their various husbands' deaths, or George Romero's "Season of the Witch," in which a woman feeling oppressed by the patriarchy finds liberation through practicing witchcraft and causing the death of her husband.
So. I ve been thinking. The reason why so many man abandon their families is similar.
Dealing with family is a similar suffering to some of them. Its not something that they want to deal with and it akes a toll on their physical and mental health.
True. But it doesn’t justify them leaving.
Wow
some of my fave passages in 'we have always lived in the castle' :
' Merricat, said Connie, would you like a cup of tea? Oh no, said Merricat, you'll poison me.
Merricat, said Connie, would you like to go to sleep? Down in the boneyard ten feet deep! ' (a classic)
' I could not breathe; I was tied with wire, and my head was huge and going to explode'
'I had buried all my baby teeth as they came out one by one and perhaps someday they would grow as dragons'
'I thought of using 'digitalis' as my third magic word, but it was too easy for someone to say, '
'Jonas found me after a while and we lay there together, protected from the rain by the trees crowding overhead, dim and rich in the kind of knowing, possessive way trees have of pressing closer'
"I have decided to ask you please to go away." "All right," he said. "You asked me."
"Please will you go away? "No," he said.
I could not think of anything further to say.'
'I was thinking that being a demon and a ghost must be very difficult, even for Charles'
I have so many more but I won't spam lol. Love this channel.
9th non-rain world video since rain world stream. Almost 2 months!
Tale Foundry had a little bit more black dye in stock than usual when they came up with this recent video.
I don't like this story, however...
It reminds us on how important it is to allow our loved one's their own agency and to NEVER abuse them. (I'm talking about Mary Cat btw, *she* is the rotten husband symbol of the story)
❤
👾
Hey Tale Foundry. I've been following your channel for a bit (sorry for the late subscription). I have a book coming out in about 3-5 months, and it's a Horror/Psychology book that I'd think you and your friendly humans might enjoy. I'm not going to spoil it but I can say it's going to be good. The name of the book is The Forget Child. When it comes out I hope you and your humans like it.
Domestic horror is an amazing genre - i absolutely love hearing these stories. Mostly because it reminds me of stories i hear from my friends. I know a lot of people who live in their own domestic horror stories, which aligns with the themes seen in this story. The sins of a family member tainting the entire household, the very superstitious beliefs, the delusions, ect. This genre creeps me out a lot, but finding those hidden themes is definitely worth it. Thank you tale foundry for exploring this genre!
Hang on, this is the very story that my english teacher got me to study early in the year
NO. no empathy for Marry Cat. She ruined her sister's life and is very possessive and self-absorbed!