The Commodore MAX was not VIC-20 technology. The MAX was basically a C64 with only 2KB of RAM and a membrane keyboard. It has the C64’s SID, VIC II and 6510 CPU.
What was amazing about this is that it was released in 1990, and would have clearly been much cheaper to produce than the already very old C64 (minus the keyboard etc.) What they really should have done is release a cart-only Amiga 500+ / 600 system with some new exclusive games. That would have been able to compete much better with the Genesis / SNES around that time, have a good library of OCS/ECS games, and still fairly cheap to produce. It also would have filled the gap for a while until the release of CD32 and A1200 in 1992/1993. Hell, it would have even been a fair bit cheaper to produce than the CDTV in 1990, which never did too well (partly due to the older tech, and the relatively high price of £500 upwards.)
Amiga already had an enormous library of games on floppy at this time, while C64 at least had some games on cartridge. Making an Amiga to use cartridges would not have gone down well for all the same reasons it made no sense to make a keyboard-less C64. To do cartridges means designing the cartridge system, and ensuring people don't try to use cartridges not made for the system - remember the Amiga has nothing in common with the C64 - and that would've made it much more expensive to develop than just repackaging the C64
How many kidneys did you have sell to buy this dude? :D I can remember Woolworths in Hastings selling them off for £15 each. But I went and bought a Catwoman poster instead >.>
+Larry Bundy Jr Woah Mr. Bundy Jr. An honour.... To be honest, I think you made the right decision with the Catwoman poster XD As for this little beast, I've just sold it again on ebay... I needed the kidney back
Nostalgia Nerd Lol, no worries dude I just subbed to you too! Well I hope you managed to get a solid gold kidney from the inflating prices it goes for online! I've been after a CDTV for years too, they were around £50 when I first started bidding, now they're going for £150 >.>
+Larry Bundy Jr subbed as well?? *explodes*... I got a little more than I paid for it, to be honest as it does nothing better than a c64, it probably would have just collected dust. Yeah, CDTVs are an expensive beast. But definitely a necessity. I mean an Amiga that looks like a VCR..... can you get any more 90s??
+Nostalgia Nerd You can mod them to work as a C64, but the things are so rare, that it's just easier/wiser to get a normal C64 for £30 off eBay. The odd thing about the CDTV is half of that case is empty too!
A small note, the Cheetah Annihilator joystick which came with the GS was a two button stick not a one button, use it on a C64 or C64C etc it's a single button stick, use it on a C64GS it's a two button stick. The base button acts as the second button, though it only emulates a press of the space bar if I remember right. (My best mate had one and used to borrow my cartridges.) test it on Robocop 2, I think that was one of the few games which used this feature.
Another great vid! It's such a shame that Commodore was managed into the ground. The Pet had more power than the competing Apple][. The Amiga was so much more powerful than the contemporary Mac. If they hadn't done stupid products like this they could have transitioned the 64 users to the Amiga. I wish I was on my Amiga Air laptop and cPhone.
Nope, PET was text-mode only with two non-redefinable character sets and monochrome output. For comparison, Apple II supported 6 colours in hi-res bitmap mode and 15 colours in lo-res, being miles ahead of PET.
I always think that what would have happened if commodore had acted as an direct competitor to Apple. The actuality could be very different, and things like the CDTV and the CD32 could have never existed.
The GS was totally dumb, I mean the motherboard still has tape/disk/keyboard ports underneath the case BUT it was the big software houses who railroaded the not too bright marketing people at Commodore into making a cartridge based C64 with no tape/disk ports otherwise they said they would no longer release any C64 games on tape or disk either. Secondly the Commodore MAX is basically a 5k Commodore 64 (has the same VIC II and SID chips and the same architecture almost). Finally Commodore actually stopped producing in house software around 1986 and the last game they did was an Amiga 1000 game (mind something or other) so of course there hadn't been ANY Commodore branded software for either C64 or Amiga lines for years before the C64GS was launched, which as I said was the idea of the greedy software houses who said too much piracy was losing them millions. I think you need to redo this video with the correct facts ;)
Gonna go out on a limb here - I loved the Cheetah Annihilator joystick! My C64C came with one bundled in 1992. Obviously it broke very quickly like all the others did, Commodore replaced it under warranty with 'Cheetah Exterminator' (similar design in a black case but without the trigger button or sculpted stick) which I hated. I got my dad to phone them and ask for another Annihilator and the response was that it was discontinued (but for some reason they sent another Exterminator!). This led to me writing an impassioned letter when they finally found another Annihilator for me...which broke like the first one, but by then it was out of warranty. When it came to replacing it again (going out on more of a limb here) I also hated the much raved about Zip Stick and was taken out to find a joystick I did like. Don't remember what model I got but it was a beautiful red micro switched joystick with a trigger button like the Annihilator and auto fire which still works perfectly to this day.
Thrilled that you added the bit about the actual source of the machine's damage. I spent half the video horrified. Now it makes sense. ;D Great stuff, as always.
Between this (the most pointless device ever released) the Amstrad GX4000 and the Atari XE, Atari were the only ones who did this right. Yes, it was a console, but it was fully compatible with the computer it was based on and you could get a keyboard for it (or more accurately, you could buy the Deluxe Pack that came with the keyboard) I actually wanted an XE growing up just for that USP.
They would have been more successful I think if they'd allowed access to the tape and expansion ports, as well as a way of controlling the tape games using something such as a keyboard. Then they would have had a... C64.
The Commodore 64 GS was essentially a Commodore 64C with the cartridge port on the top, but all the ports were actually inside. Unfortunately, the joystick wasn’t designed very well and were prone to breakdowns. Making matters worse, certain games did require a keyboard which the system lacked. With the price of the system a little high, you could still get a Commodore 64C for much less. The CPU was a MOS 6510 which gave the Commodore 64 bank switching ability. Sadly, this system couldn’t complete with the likes of Nintendo and Sega. Commodore went bankrupt on April 29, 1994. A sad end for a company that made the world’s best selling home computer.
Hey dude, what's with the negativity regarding International Soccer? It was an incredible game for its time and remains exceedingly playable today, especially the two-player mode. In addition, it remains unmatched by any similar games developed for the ZX and CPC machines. A modicum of respect, at the very least, is entirely appropriate :)
Not 6502 it's a 6510, pointing to the 64 legged PLA++ creature when saying it's a VIC-II is already pointed out. There's no RGB out, just chroma+luma or the combination of them: composite apart from RF. S-video is also chroma+luma but these machines have a stronger chroma signal which may or may not cause problems if hooked directly to s-video input.
Between this and the cd32, Commodore deserved to fail after burning so many consumers. Sega did the same thing with their mega/genesis cd. I was furious when I got one and they stopped making games about a year or so later. Maybe Nintendo is going down the same road with the Switch. Who knows. It's alot less likely really.
I don't think Commodore burned anyone with the CD32, it was a reasonably decent system (certainly not "next gen") but software was coming fast for it even if it was only minor (if any) upgraded Amiga computer software. Now had you said the CDTV I would agree it was a resounding failure.
@@daishi5571 They certainly burned the CD32 owner who wrote into Amiga Format and asked David Pleasance why an RGB port had been omitted (only the French model had RGB enabled) to which he of course received a predictably bullshit answer from Pleasance that was revealing of the insane philosophy at Commodore and why they went bust.
Good video but the C64 never had an RGB out. It was always composite video. Interestingly, the port to connect a disk drive has been removed but it looks like you'd only need to solder a new DIN connect onto the motherboard because the tracks and sockets are still present...
is it possible to hack a keyboard into a C64GS? (i.e by soldering connections in) or is the board completely lacking non-joystick based input ability on the board itself? Because if someone could re-enable all normal C64 functions on this thing and maybe hack it to take modern keyboards, I could see this actually being useful. (of course, you'd probably destroy a few dozen C64s or GS's trying to get the mod to work, but you win some, you lose some.
it is possible there is a video on utube somewhere of an old vic 20 retro fitted with one of these boards, making a fully working c64, it also has an sd card adapter and a switchable c64/vic20 rom set(larger modern eprom). old commadore stuff is very hackable, you just have to be aware that c16 and plus4 are not interchangeable with vic20/c64/c128. c16 and plus4 periferals can be used on either c16 or plus4, but the stuff meant for vic20 c64 and c128 can only be used on those machines. c16 was built with different connectors to vic20/c64, when they made the plus4 it was based on the c16 so uses its periferals.
Old comment, I know, but from what I understand, Commodore actually removed the motherboards from the unsold inventory (which was something like 90% of units manufactured) and put them into standard C64 cases for their final sell-out.
At least in Amstrad's defence, when they released the GX4000 they didn't already have a much more advanced system on the market. What was Commodore's excuse? Why not shove the A500 in a shoe box and call that a games console instead?
dreamkatcha That would have been an idea 1000X times better. Their high end "Games Console" offering was the Amiga 600..... Which was really just a smaller Amiga 500... Makes you wonder why the went bust!! XD I think they wanted to appeal to the cheaper markets, but the Master System was still cheaper than than the GS, and had a shed load of decent games. Go figure.
True, the 600 didn't offer any sort of advancement over the 500, but it was the first Amiga in my family that was all mine, mine, mine (I had to share the 500 with a ham-fisted older brother who would spend eons bashing away at the most infuriatingly obstinate games imaginable. I couldn't get near half the time). Commodore didn't put that on the poster funnily enough. Maybe the GS had a lot to do with Commodore wanting to claim their share of each and every market whether it moved the technology on or not. It could have been that they thought people who were tied to the brand through blind loyalty would buy anything with their stamp on it assuming an option was available rather than going to a competitor. Kids aren't the most objective consumers after all. Once you've led the Speccy army into battle, you aren't likely to buy an Amstrad even if it's far superior. Once people were invested in the cheapy model there may have been a later transition up the hierarchy. This would of course entail Commodore playing the long game, which is something they weren't really known for. Who knows? I always wanted a SNES or a Megadrive, but after the A600 it was actually the CD32 I was realistically thinking of buying because I believed in the community and the brand and had absorbed the magazine hype. That said, I didn't actually own one until this year. I think the fact that a couple of cartridge console games would set you back the same price you paid for the system played its part too.
Nostalgia Nerd Don't make too fun of the Amiga 600, it has the hard disk slot and can be expanded to unbelievably heights. #Amiga600DefenseForce #Amiga600bestamiga
That's a really interesting concept. An Amiga GS with Turrican as its flagship game wouldld have been a smash hit back in 1990 and had been a serious competitor to the Mega Drive and the SNES. The A500 catalogue is considered as one of the best that it arrived to a domestic computer, and migrate that game library to a console it could have been great.
Because they are ridiculously cheap. I often buy Ensure drinks by the case and because it's quite a heavy package the average postage is about £15. Hermes will deliver the same package for £8. I used to deliver for Fedex/Business Post and got a decent wage for it, Hermes must pay their couriers shit money and that's why they treat your parcels like crap.
nice video,... thank you.. a little mistake,.. you don´t show at time 08:45 the VIC ,.. this is PLA and other in one Chip,.. the VIC-Chip ist left with 8565 Greetings..
Similar to what Commodore 64 and Amstrad, Atari got in on it with a console version of it's 8-Bit computer line as well. I forget the name of it right now but it's out there. That one did have an expansion keyboard for those games that require it.
Strangely enough I reckon the C64 GS could have actually found a market. Namely, a British market. Firstly, they needed to find a way of cutting the retail price in half. They sold for £100 in 1990, and that was not a tempting offer. Now, with a £50 price tag, what would it need to be to start shifting these things off the shelf? I reckon it needed to ditch the cartridges and replace it with a stylish on board turbo cassette drive. Yup, I did say that. The C64 GS was trading as a stripped down C64, so it needed to strip away the weakest aspects and retain the strongest. Floppy disks were a good aspect of the C64, but the uptake had been poor in the UK and the all-round costs involved would have burdened the GS far too much. And cartridge uptake on the C64 was barely existent at all. But cassettes were extremely cheap and extremely popular for being so. Every man and his dog had a massive stash of C64 tapes knocking around the house, so offer a cheap machine with a fast loading speed and I'm confident there would have been a fair few people willing to take one. In addition, it would have been compulsory to slip in a miniature keyboard just to make the thing usable. Just a little device, similar to a TV remote would have sufficed for this particular system. And maybe, build cost permitting, expansion ports to add cartridge and disks as an option, for those wanting a setup equal to that of a... erm... C64. Bottom line is, this wasn't ever going to be a SNES killer. It could only command a budget system market. And its biggest rival would be an actual C64, which a vast amount of people already owned and were readily available on the second hand market for decent prices, usually with a mega ton of games thrown in for good measure. In short, Commodore could never have had the entire cake with this system, but a nice little slice could have been quite appetizing.
It's the Commodore 64 (11:06), but lower-budgeted (0:23), missing half the features (6:08), is downward compatible with a large number of C64 software (4:36), only supports joystick controllers (4:56), and lacks a keyboard (5:12) & expansion capabilities (7:41).
The 64gs might have been a success had it been released 85-86 timeframe as the nes was taking off in north America. Even 86-88. But 1990!? Even Atari did the xegs in 87, and I scratched my head over that one when released, having an St since 85 already.
Had that exact Joystick-model bundled with my C64G. That was a ready to use bundle, including a matching 1541 and a multi game cartridge from C=UK,which I got around 1994.
just stumbled across you rather interesting channel. I remember the day my dad bought the cgs and well we had already a c64. good move dad. unfortunately we never could have predicted the ridiculous price they are going for these days. and had long ago practically given the dam thing away years ago. but I still have a 64 though :)
certainly a strange decision. Commodore could have easily upgraded the C64 with a better CPU (like almost every other 6502 based home computer), better gfx, more sprites and it would be competed with the NES and Sega. Simply making better use of the C128 would have been a good start.
How much is a boxed one worth? Still have mine. I remember one birthday I received Robocop , was so excited, didn’t work 😂 Gutted isn’t the word so returned it for Myth. Best game ever was Last Ninja Remix.. music was pretty epic too.. but impossible to complete with that piece of junk joystick. I think I ended up using my master system 2 controller with the C64
Not that it would have overcome other issues, like the hardware's age, but if Comedore had foreseen the keyboard issuethey could have added a couple buttons or a circuit board to combine several keyboard keys into one button to get around the problem. But the added cost may have made things worse.
I would like to ask "what for"? They had Amiga in the year of release (1990) this C64GS. Totally stupid and wasted decision to pick something more for C64.
Let's take motherboard of the most successful 8-bit computer, and see had bad we can screw it !!! What the hell they where smoking? No wonder why Amiga 1000 project (which they bought btw) couldn't save them. They where doing with it basically the same what they did with Commodore C64, reinventing again and again while the rest of the world was moving on.
The Commodore Max was better off... while its success was meager, it did result in the creation of the C64. (why else would the C64 have a MAX-compatibility mode?)
Doesn't really make any sense to play Captain Hindsight and give advice to 1990 Commodore how they should do things, one it's already happened, two, this thing is obviously a product of surplus C64 components the company had to do something with other than throwing in the trash and they went the games console route with zero experience... or care really.
I remember thinking at the time, what idiot thought a "console" that looked worse graphically than a NES and MS, was going to compete with a SNES and MD, why didn't they make an Amiga powered console instead.
You are fake news. On the joystick supplied with the 64GS, fire button and the button on the base do two different things, so it is in fact a TWO button controller!! Apologies accepted.
I worked in small computer shop when it came out and scratched my head thinking why the hell. Pay another £29 and just get a mega drive lol.which was cutting edge 16bit technology not 8 year old 8 bit technology
that Terminator game that wouldn't work on the console. Did it work on the Commodore computer? Or was it unplayable on either machine? Did you pick one up. That was broken for the video or did you quite literally for whatever reason break the machine while filming the video ?
Why release a C64 console in 1990? An Amiga console would have been so much better! Well it seems like a good idea but then there is the CD32 which failed so maybe not. Maybe it would have been best for them to just stay out of the console market.
So if some hobbyist with a soldering iron and some hardware at their disposal decides to be bored one day, perhaps they could come up with a C64 system that has a "tower" ... the "tower" being the GS itself and a seperate keyboard, holes drilled out for the cassette datacorder, and "Simon's Basic" plugged into the GS. :)
Me too, 'specially if Simon's Basic or even a machine code monitor/assembler cartridge can over-ride the basic-in-rom lock-out. It would be a first to my knowledge if anyone went ahead and did it.
i think computers today r fradgile and expensive,there is never a day the pc dosent take the piss along with the search results,i think they should re introduce the 8 bit beast because of the durabilaity ,reliabilaty and the simplicty of the format u need a bottom line and today there iks not 1 i pad,iphone ,mac,linux,win 7,8,9,10,ect oh dont forget andriod, i abosutly hate spending my time configuring software to go,in the begining u would put in a cassette and there was no looking back,its about the fasion of 8 bit pixelated charchiters ,,people never get board of them,16 bit is shit in comparison because of the cartoon reality thats fakedt, its about useing bytes economicaly and effecaintly,modern computers r not needed at present
why do i feel like someone at commodore should have suggested that there be a wired external keyboard sold separately if they had too? were they really that lost and dumb without Jack tramiel Really?? LMAO
I only have positive things to say about those old companies. None of them wanted to lose money. They all wanted to do the right thing. Their mistakes, they had their reasons. I'm sure they'd do things differently if given the chance.
while shite as a machine in its own right, they are very useful as a source of original components for vic20 c64 etc, that smashed one would be a great candidate for bringing a long dead c64 back to life.
Ok... Some people it cares about the hammer smash in the 64GS because is a collection piece but, I think that worth it because that useless "console" deserved it.
Wouldn't mind mind owning one of these for the sake of it - not like I could make good use of it here in the States, let alone if I was in the UK, but I do like the look of the thing.
the first model c64 was better then the second model you're showing in the video. sound chip was way better. i owned 4 c64 when i was a kid. i had to as a former c64 scener ... lol
TBH I think this system should've released in a time frame of 1985-1987 So it could be a formidable opponent to the NES an Master System thus selling more
I first tout that you greatly did had fotoshopped that hamer smash on the c64gs but so you own 2 of these. Well how dumb could commodore to keep the expansion and printer port while covering them? Same thing nintendo did with the supergameboy,covering the link port. So what commodore just did was just recycling those remained motherboards from their c64 and put then into a c64gs case. Was there really no keyboard input to save it from it's doom?or was there a keyboard wich connects to the controller port as an alternative of a keyboard? I readed that there was a windowing feature to compensate for the lack of keyboard but no software used it.
+johneygd Yes, the BIOS had "Windowing" capability, but it wasn't used, mainly because the C64 didn't have it, and the games needed to run on both *facepalm*
ok, so we need to come up with a new cia chip that has a bluetooth connection and can integrate a HID keyboard. and of course integrate a stereo sid chip
Oh Man.... you got me BIG time! I was SOOOOOOO going to trash you , unsubscribe and send you to hell x 100000. I couldn't believe what you did. So glad I watched till the end, really let me off the proverbial hook. 5 stars dude. You SOOO got me... You'da'mayen.
I don't remember that system at all. I know a couple of people who got the GX4000 for Christmas when I got my Master System. I have 22 of the original 24 Mean Machines magazines and I don't think they ever mentioned it. They did review GX4000 for a short time. At least Amstrad had the good grace to add a second fire button to their console and new technology. The 64GS begs the question: Why not just buy the C64 computer? But at least the GX had a few games tailored to it.
Just found your channel - Great work! Had a soft spot for the GS, even though I never owned one! Maybe because it was doomed from the start, I’m not sure. I had a C64C around the same time and did have a few cart games, due to the GS hitting the shops. As for the bundled joysticks, the base fire button was independent to the others so you did have two fire buttons as such. Even though it was functionless 99% of the time, So they were even more useless! On occasion though the button did have a use - The one that comes to mind would be operating the tank controls in Battle Command.
+MaximumRD Not the first. I remember using a 'Commodore joystick' that was made by Commodore for the Vic=20. That triangular handled piece of crap was lucky to last a week, the metal contacts would split. Atari joysticks all the way :)
Dam, great channel, I'll fav you on facebook/twitter, but your way beyond hte limits I impose for a video shoutout lol. Yup, never use my hermes, they are shite!!
Thank you my friend! Appreciated! I've started doing ultra packing for all carriers now, drop it from chest height kind of testing. it's the only way to be sure :D
+Kinetic Power If you would have watched the end, you'd have seen that he has 2 64GS systems, one of which was smashed by the postal service Hermes in transit.
It would be interesting to see an Amiga CD32 review sometime. I have one myself but due to buying a new house and renovating it, I haven't had a chance to build up a considerable library for it yet.
Hah a system I have never even seen in real life, though funny this might of been the original idea of turning a computer into a console. If it had been an upgrade, added better graphics, was well bundled with some killer titles and even lower priced it MIGHT of had a go.
MaximumRD Yeah, possibly. Although it would still have been competing with the Mega Drive AND the Master System/NES (which were both cheaper than the GS by a fair margin), at launch! I think they were clutching at some pretty short straws.
![Cody Johnson - I'm Gonna Love You (with Carrie Underwood) [Official Music Video]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/yy9PuYMU29g/mqdefault.jpg)
The Commodore MAX was not VIC-20 technology. The MAX was basically a C64 with only 2KB of RAM and a membrane keyboard. It has the C64’s SID, VIC II and 6510 CPU.
What was amazing about this is that it was released in 1990, and would have clearly been much cheaper to produce than the already very old C64 (minus the keyboard etc.)
What they really should have done is release a cart-only Amiga 500+ / 600 system with some new exclusive games. That would have been able to compete much better with the Genesis / SNES around that time, have a good library of OCS/ECS games, and still fairly cheap to produce.
It also would have filled the gap for a while until the release of CD32 and A1200 in 1992/1993.
Hell, it would have even been a fair bit cheaper to produce than the CDTV in 1990, which never did too well (partly due to the older tech, and the relatively high price of £500 upwards.)
Wow, that would have been a increible concept. Now you made me dream about an Amiga GS with Turrican as its flagship title.
They could have beaten sega to market as well, with a butload of titles on launch. Things would have looked a lot different back then.
It was 1990. This console looked like Atari 7800 8bit graphics yikes.. wonder why they didn't go along with the time "16bit" ?
Amiga already had an enormous library of games on floppy at this time, while C64 at least had some games on cartridge. Making an Amiga to use cartridges would not have gone down well for all the same reasons it made no sense to make a keyboard-less C64. To do cartridges means designing the cartridge system, and ensuring people don't try to use cartridges not made for the system - remember the Amiga has nothing in common with the C64 - and that would've made it much more expensive to develop than just repackaging the C64
How many kidneys did you have sell to buy this dude? :D
I can remember Woolworths in Hastings selling them off for £15 each. But I went and bought a Catwoman poster instead >.>
+Larry Bundy Jr Woah Mr. Bundy Jr. An honour.... To be honest, I think you made the right decision with the Catwoman poster XD As for this little beast, I've just sold it again on ebay... I needed the kidney back
Nostalgia Nerd
Lol, no worries dude I just subbed to you too!
Well I hope you managed to get a solid gold kidney from the inflating prices it goes for online!
I've been after a CDTV for years too, they were around £50 when I first started bidding, now they're going for £150 >.>
+Larry Bundy Jr subbed as well?? *explodes*... I got a little more than I paid for it, to be honest as it does nothing better than a c64, it probably would have just collected dust.
Yeah, CDTVs are an expensive beast. But definitely a necessity. I mean an Amiga that looks like a VCR..... can you get any more 90s??
+Nostalgia Nerd You can mod them to work as a C64, but the things are so rare, that it's just easier/wiser to get a normal C64 for £30 off eBay.
The odd thing about the CDTV is half of that case is empty too!
+Larry Bundy Jr the bigger the case, the better the product. 90s logic, right? XD
glad you told us you didnt smash that thing, i was sitting here getting pissed. now im just angry at the shipping guys
+jecuce Hahahah. I'd never smash something so beautiful
+jecuce I've heard so many stories about MyHermes. Why do people still use them? No other alternatives in the UK?
MyHermes ? idk what that is
oh nvm i googled it. idk about UK :) im in sweden
***** Cheap and easy I guess. I actually use them for sending stuff, but I package like it's about to go through WW3
A small note, the Cheetah Annihilator joystick which came with the GS was a two button stick not a one button, use it on a C64 or C64C etc it's a single button stick, use it on a C64GS it's a two button stick. The base button acts as the second button, though it only emulates a press of the space bar if I remember right. (My best mate had one and used to borrow my cartridges.) test it on Robocop 2, I think that was one of the few games which used this feature.
Another great vid! It's such a shame that Commodore was managed into the ground. The Pet had more power than the competing Apple][. The Amiga was so much more powerful than the contemporary Mac. If they hadn't done stupid products like this they could have transitioned the 64 users to the Amiga. I wish I was on my Amiga Air laptop and cPhone.
Andrew Mondt was the pet able to handle graphics
Nope, PET was text-mode only with two non-redefinable character sets and monochrome output. For comparison, Apple II supported 6 colours in hi-res bitmap mode and 15 colours in lo-res, being miles ahead of PET.
I always think that what would have happened if commodore had acted as an direct competitor to Apple. The actuality could be very different, and things like the CDTV and the CD32 could have never existed.
PS. now thanks to you I want a cPhone LMAO
Sorry to get all adenoidy, but the C64 didnt have a 6502 CPU, it used a 6510 CPU which was a derivative of the 6502 that had some I/O stuff added!
The GS was totally dumb, I mean the motherboard still has tape/disk/keyboard ports underneath the case BUT it was the big software houses who railroaded the not too bright marketing people at Commodore into making a cartridge based C64 with no tape/disk ports otherwise they said they would no longer release any C64 games on tape or disk either. Secondly the Commodore MAX is basically a 5k Commodore 64 (has the same VIC II and SID chips and the same architecture almost). Finally Commodore actually stopped producing in house software around 1986 and the last game they did was an Amiga 1000 game (mind something or other) so of course there hadn't been ANY Commodore branded software for either C64 or Amiga lines for years before the C64GS was launched, which as I said was the idea of the greedy software houses who said too much piracy was losing them millions. I think you need to redo this video with the correct facts ;)
I'm consistently amazed that you don't have more subscribers. Your videos are top-notch. Nice job!
Gonna go out on a limb here - I loved the Cheetah Annihilator joystick! My C64C came with one bundled in 1992. Obviously it broke very quickly like all the others did, Commodore replaced it under warranty with 'Cheetah Exterminator' (similar design in a black case but without the trigger button or sculpted stick) which I hated. I got my dad to phone them and ask for another Annihilator and the response was that it was discontinued (but for some reason they sent another Exterminator!). This led to me writing an impassioned letter when they finally found another Annihilator for me...which broke like the first one, but by then it was out of warranty. When it came to replacing it again (going out on more of a limb here) I also hated the much raved about Zip Stick and was taken out to find a joystick I did like. Don't remember what model I got but it was a beautiful red micro switched joystick with a trigger button like the Annihilator and auto fire which still works perfectly to this day.
Thrilled that you added the bit about the actual source of the machine's damage. I spent half the video horrified. Now it makes sense. ;D Great stuff, as always.
Between this (the most pointless device ever released) the Amstrad GX4000 and the Atari XE, Atari were the only ones who did this right. Yes, it was a console, but it was fully compatible with the computer it was based on and you could get a keyboard for it (or more accurately, you could buy the Deluxe Pack that came with the keyboard)
I actually wanted an XE growing up just for that USP.
Both Amstrad and Commodore do full fails.
Atari literally maked another version of their computer but marketed as a console.
They could have sold the keyboard as an add-on, like the Sega Dreamcast, for example.
They would have been more successful I think if they'd allowed access to the tape and expansion ports, as well as a way of controlling the tape games using something such as a keyboard. Then they would have had a... C64.
Nice video. I had a C64. Looking back, it's a wonder Commodore, Atari and Sega lasted as log as they did with their hardware decisions.
If you glue that broken one back together it would still sell well I imagine.
The Commodore 64 GS was essentially a Commodore 64C with the cartridge port on the top, but all the ports were actually inside. Unfortunately, the joystick wasn’t designed very well and were prone to breakdowns. Making matters worse, certain games did require a keyboard which the system lacked. With the price of the system a little high, you could still get a Commodore 64C for much less. The CPU was a MOS 6510 which gave the Commodore 64 bank switching ability. Sadly, this system couldn’t complete with the likes of Nintendo and Sega. Commodore went bankrupt on April 29, 1994. A sad end for a company that made the world’s best selling home computer.
Hey dude, what's with the negativity regarding International Soccer? It was an incredible game for its time and remains exceedingly playable today, especially the two-player mode. In addition, it remains unmatched by any similar games developed for the ZX and CPC machines. A modicum of respect, at the very least, is entirely appropriate :)
Not 6502 it's a 6510, pointing to the 64 legged PLA++ creature when saying it's a VIC-II is already pointed out. There's no RGB out, just chroma+luma or the combination of them: composite apart from RF. S-video is also chroma+luma but these machines have a stronger chroma signal which may or may not cause problems if hooked directly to s-video input.
Great job on the video. Lots of great info and entertaining stories. Can't believe the Terminator 2 one! Jeeze!
The Guru Meditation Thanks! I know, right? You can't make it up
It would be fun to pop the GS's rom into a regular C64, and see if it would work, course you would loose the keyboard function. xD
Between this and the cd32, Commodore deserved to fail after burning so many consumers. Sega did the same thing with their mega/genesis cd. I was furious when I got one and they stopped making games about a year or so later. Maybe Nintendo is going down the same road with the Switch. Who knows. It's alot less likely really.
I don't think Commodore burned anyone with the CD32, it was a reasonably decent system (certainly not "next gen") but software was coming fast for it even if it was only minor (if any) upgraded Amiga computer software. Now had you said the CDTV I would agree it was a resounding failure.
@@daishi5571 They certainly burned the CD32 owner who wrote into Amiga Format and asked David Pleasance why an RGB port had been omitted (only the French model had RGB enabled) to which he of course received a predictably bullshit answer from Pleasance that was revealing of the insane philosophy at Commodore and why they went bust.
@@captaincorleone7088 what issue of AF? I would like to read it.
@@daishi5571 I'll look for the issue number and get back to you. This was decades ago but that letter and the response were unforgettable.
@@captaincorleone7088 Thank you, I did take a look to see if I could find something but without knowing what i'm looking at I may skip over it.
Good video but the C64 never had an RGB out. It was always composite video. Interestingly, the port to connect a disk drive has been removed but it looks like you'd only need to solder a new DIN connect onto the motherboard because the tracks and sockets are still present...
Dude
2000 units
And you fucking shatter the casing
Why?
I've only just noticed you use a Sword of Omens to point out the gubbins. Brilliant.
I like how the keyboard pin header is just casually not there, despite the holes being in place. :D
is it possible to hack a keyboard into a C64GS? (i.e by soldering connections in) or is the board completely lacking non-joystick based input ability on the board itself?
Because if someone could re-enable all normal C64 functions on this thing and maybe hack it to take modern keyboards, I could see this actually being useful. (of course, you'd probably destroy a few dozen C64s or GS's trying to get the mod to work, but you win some, you lose some.
it is possible there is a video on utube somewhere of an old vic 20 retro fitted with one of these boards, making a fully working c64, it also has an sd card adapter and a switchable c64/vic20 rom set(larger modern eprom).
old commadore stuff is very hackable, you just have to be aware that c16 and plus4 are not interchangeable with vic20/c64/c128.
c16 and plus4 periferals can be used on either c16 or plus4, but the stuff meant for vic20 c64 and c128 can only be used on those machines.
c16 was built with different connectors to vic20/c64, when they made the plus4 it was based on the c16 so uses its periferals.
Old comment, I know, but from what I understand, Commodore actually removed the motherboards from the unsold inventory (which was something like 90% of units manufactured) and put them into standard C64 cases for their final sell-out.
At least in Amstrad's defence, when they released the GX4000 they didn't already have a much more advanced system on the market. What was Commodore's excuse? Why not shove the A500 in a shoe box and call that a games console instead?
dreamkatcha That would have been an idea 1000X times better. Their high end "Games Console" offering was the Amiga 600..... Which was really just a smaller Amiga 500... Makes you wonder why the went bust!! XD I think they wanted to appeal to the cheaper markets, but the Master System was still cheaper than than the GS, and had a shed load of decent games. Go figure.
True, the 600 didn't offer any sort of advancement over the 500, but it was the first Amiga in my family that was all mine, mine, mine (I had to share the 500 with a ham-fisted older brother who would spend eons bashing away at the most infuriatingly obstinate games imaginable. I couldn't get near half the time). Commodore didn't put that on the poster funnily enough.
Maybe the GS had a lot to do with Commodore wanting to claim their share of each and every market whether it moved the technology on or not. It could have been that they thought people who were tied to the brand through blind loyalty would buy anything with their stamp on it assuming an option was available rather than going to a competitor. Kids aren't the most objective consumers after all. Once you've led the Speccy army into battle, you aren't likely to buy an Amstrad even if it's far superior.
Once people were invested in the cheapy model there may have been a later transition up the hierarchy. This would of course entail Commodore playing the long game, which is something they weren't really known for. Who knows?
I always wanted a SNES or a Megadrive, but after the A600 it was actually the CD32 I was realistically thinking of buying because I believed in the community and the brand and had absorbed the magazine hype. That said, I didn't actually own one until this year. I think the fact that a couple of cartridge console games would set you back the same price you paid for the system played its part too.
Nostalgia Nerd Don't make too fun of the Amiga 600, it has the hard disk slot and can be expanded to unbelievably heights. #Amiga600DefenseForce #Amiga600bestamiga
That is an awesome idea
That's a really interesting concept. An Amiga GS with Turrican as its flagship game wouldld have been a smash hit back in 1990 and had been a serious competitor to the Mega Drive and the SNES. The A500 catalogue is considered as one of the best that it arrived to a domestic computer, and migrate that game library to a console it could have been great.
You were talking about VIC II but shown the Sharp PLA+color RAM on the board :D
The moment Commodore jumped the shark :( We all knew it, we just didn't want to admit it at the time.
I no longer live in the UK, and have only heard of this company twice, but HOW DOES MY HERMES STILL STAY IN BUSINESS???
Because they are ridiculously cheap. I often buy Ensure drinks by the case and because it's quite a heavy package the average postage is about £15. Hermes will deliver the same package for £8. I used to deliver for Fedex/Business Post and got a decent wage for it, Hermes must pay their couriers shit money and that's why they treat your parcels like crap.
Wait, change of plan Vladimir, he didn't really do it. Call off the air strikes! What's that, you've already hit the big red button?
nice video,... thank you..
a little mistake,.. you don´t show at time 08:45 the VIC ,.. this is PLA and other in one Chip,..
the VIC-Chip ist left with 8565
Greetings..
Similar to what Commodore 64 and Amstrad, Atari got in on it with a console version of it's 8-Bit computer line as well. I forget the name of it right now but it's out there. That one did have an expansion keyboard for those games that require it.
@@EberKlaushartinger Yep, that's it! Thank goodness they gave it a keyboard expansion.
Amazing videos. You guys sure do produced some funky stuff. If you get a moment check out our channel too
oh....my.....god NNNNNOOOOOOO!!!!!! LJN!! RUN FOR YOUR LIVESSSSSS!!!!!!! AAAAHHHHHH !!!!!
"rocks back in forth in the corner" the horror.............the horror o.o
Strangely enough I reckon the C64 GS could have actually found a market. Namely, a British market. Firstly, they needed to find a way of cutting the retail price in half. They sold for £100 in 1990, and that was not a tempting offer.
Now, with a £50 price tag, what would it need to be to start shifting these things off the shelf? I reckon it needed to ditch the cartridges and replace it with a stylish on board turbo cassette drive. Yup, I did say that. The C64 GS was trading as a stripped down C64, so it needed to strip away the weakest aspects and retain the strongest. Floppy disks were a good aspect of the C64, but the uptake had been poor in the UK and the all-round costs involved would have burdened the GS far too much. And cartridge uptake on the C64 was barely existent at all. But cassettes were extremely cheap and extremely popular for being so. Every man and his dog had a massive stash of C64 tapes knocking around the house, so offer a cheap machine with a fast loading speed and I'm confident there would have been a fair few people willing to take one.
In addition, it would have been compulsory to slip in a miniature keyboard just to make the thing usable. Just a little device, similar to a TV remote would have sufficed for this particular system. And maybe, build cost permitting, expansion ports to add cartridge and disks as an option, for those wanting a setup equal to that of a... erm... C64.
Bottom line is, this wasn't ever going to be a SNES killer. It could only command a budget system market. And its biggest rival would be an actual C64, which a vast amount of people already owned and were readily available on the second hand market for decent prices, usually with a mega ton of games thrown in for good measure. In short, Commodore could never have had the entire cake with this system, but a nice little slice could have been quite appetizing.
Hah I am guessing your machine had a stunt double ;)
MaximumRD Nooooo, I don't know what you mean ;)
It's the Commodore 64 (11:06), but lower-budgeted (0:23), missing half the features (6:08), is downward compatible with a large number of C64 software (4:36), only supports joystick controllers (4:56), and lacks a keyboard (5:12) & expansion capabilities (7:41).
sounds like a bad idea for Commodore... The best part was that it was an actual computer. If I want a console that I would buy a console.
This was always pointless considering the Commodore 64 could play cartridges.
I heard it being called a "Whale Egg", and that's not a bad description.
The 64gs might have been a success had it been released 85-86 timeframe as the nes was taking off in north America. Even 86-88. But 1990!?
Even Atari did the xegs in 87, and I scratched my head over that one when released, having an St since 85 already.
6:20 Wow, an LJN game so bad that it wouldn’t even play. AVGN should review it.
Had that exact Joystick-model bundled with my C64G. That was a ready to use bundle, including a matching 1541 and a multi game cartridge from C=UK,which I got around 1994.
just stumbled across you rather interesting channel. I remember the day my dad bought the cgs and well we had already a c64. good move dad. unfortunately we never could have predicted the ridiculous price they are going for these days. and had long ago practically given the dam thing away years ago. but I still have a 64 though :)
certainly a strange decision. Commodore could have easily upgraded the C64 with a better CPU (like almost every other 6502 based home computer), better gfx, more sprites and it would be competed with the NES and Sega.
Simply making better use of the C128 would have been a good start.
How much is a boxed one worth? Still have mine. I remember one birthday I received Robocop , was so excited, didn’t work 😂 Gutted isn’t the word so returned it for Myth. Best game ever was Last Ninja Remix.. music was pretty epic too.. but impossible to complete with that piece of junk joystick. I think I ended up using my master system 2 controller with the C64
saying "games system/console" instead of "game system/console" should be a worldwide thing
Not that it would have overcome other issues, like the hardware's age, but if Comedore had foreseen the keyboard issuethey could have added a couple buttons or a circuit board to combine several keyboard keys into one button to get around the problem. But the added cost may have made things worse.
I would like to ask "what for"? They had Amiga in the year of release (1990) this C64GS. Totally stupid and wasted decision to pick something more for C64.
Let's take motherboard of the most successful 8-bit computer, and see had bad we can screw it !!! What the hell they where smoking?
No wonder why Amiga 1000 project (which they bought btw) couldn't save them. They where doing with it basically the same what they did with Commodore C64, reinventing again and again while the rest of the world was moving on.
The Commodore Max was better off... while its success was meager, it did result in the creation of the C64. (why else would the C64 have a MAX-compatibility mode?)
My first console was the Atari 2600. After I received the Atari Computer, I never looked back upon consoles.
There's an exhibition about Ocean Games at the Manchester Science Museum at the moment. I guess it'll be there all summer.
Kee Lo Oooh. Cool! I may have to check that out
Sexyp
Doesn't really make any sense to play Captain Hindsight and give advice to 1990 Commodore how they should do things, one it's already happened, two, this thing is obviously a product of surplus C64 components the company had to do something with other than throwing in the trash and they went the games console route with zero experience... or care really.
I remember thinking at the time, what idiot thought a "console" that looked worse graphically than a NES and MS, was going to compete with a SNES and MD, why didn't they make an Amiga powered console instead.
Obviously an attempt to copy the atari xegs from coupe years earlier. But the xegs included a keyboard!
You are wrong cheetah anhilator joystick had two *different* buttons :) two FIRE A in stick and FIRE B in base :)
You are fake news. On the joystick supplied with the 64GS, fire button and the button on the base do two different things, so it is in fact a TWO button controller!! Apologies accepted.
Which is worse: Amiga CD32 without a dave game option or C64 without a keyboard? 😂
Such a bad time to release a console based on old tech.
I worked in small computer shop when it came out and scratched my head thinking why the hell. Pay another £29 and just get a mega drive lol.which was cutting edge 16bit technology not 8 year old 8 bit technology
that Terminator game that wouldn't work on the console. Did it work on the Commodore computer? Or was it unplayable on either machine? Did you pick one up. That was broken for the video or did you quite literally for whatever reason break the machine while filming the video ?
Why release a C64 console in 1990? An Amiga console would have been so much better! Well it seems like a good idea but then there is the CD32 which failed so maybe not. Maybe it would have been best for them to just stay out of the console market.
So if some hobbyist with a soldering iron and some hardware at their disposal decides to be bored one day, perhaps they could come up with a C64 system that has a "tower" ... the "tower" being the GS itself and a seperate keyboard, holes drilled out for the cassette datacorder, and "Simon's Basic" plugged into the GS. :)
+joe morris Sounds like a solid plan to me
Me too, 'specially if Simon's Basic or even a machine code monitor/assembler cartridge can over-ride the basic-in-rom lock-out. It would be a first to my knowledge if anyone went ahead and did it.
it would be a waste of time to chop a keyboard from a C64 and try to link to a C64GS :) get a C64 without chopping and losing anything, yup.
Mark D people do mod C64GS into normal Commodore 64s. You can find RUclips videos of it and even buy kits to make it easier.
So if u collect pay £200+ for a c64 with a 'plain beige top' or £100 or less for a normal c64 with kboard and access to basic.
i think computers today r fradgile and expensive,there is never a day the pc dosent take the piss along with the search results,i think they should re introduce the 8 bit beast because of the durabilaity ,reliabilaty and the simplicty of the format u need a bottom line and today there iks not 1 i pad,iphone ,mac,linux,win 7,8,9,10,ect oh dont forget andriod, i abosutly hate spending my time configuring software to go,in the begining u would put in a cassette and there was no looking back,its about the fasion of 8 bit pixelated charchiters ,,people never get board of them,16 bit is shit in comparison because of the cartoon reality thats fakedt, its about useing bytes economicaly and effecaintly,modern computers r not needed at present
why do i feel like someone at commodore should have suggested that there be a wired external keyboard sold separately if they had too? were they really that lost and dumb without Jack tramiel Really?? LMAO
I only have positive things to say about those old companies. None of them wanted to lose money. They all wanted to do the right thing. Their mistakes, they had their reasons. I'm sure they'd do things differently if given the chance.
wow this guy has no vlue, C64 does not habe RGB and when talking about VIC-II he points at the PLA
while shite as a machine in its own right, they are very useful as a source of original components for vic20 c64 etc, that smashed one would be a great candidate for bringing a long dead c64 back to life.
I got one for £5 from a car boot sale, only to nick it's SID and 6502 to fix a faulty C64 I picked up
Ok... Some people it cares about the hammer smash in the 64GS because is a collection piece but, I think that worth it because that useless "console" deserved it.
Wouldn't mind mind owning one of these for the sake of it - not like I could make good use of it here in the States, let alone if I was in the UK, but I do like the look of the thing.
the first model c64 was better then the second model you're showing in the video. sound chip was way better. i owned 4 c64 when i was a kid. i had to as a former c64 scener ... lol
Oh you sneaky bugger. Glad you put the bit in about NOT smashing it.
TBH I think this system should've released in a time frame of 1985-1987 So it could be a formidable opponent to the NES an Master System thus selling more
Chipzel soundtrack, or is it LUKHASH?
Looking at this and then the CD32, its obvious that Commodore wasn't able to learn from mistakes.
Sebenarnya itu bukan tutupnya computer tanpa monitor/keyboard
Please don't bash International Football. I loved that game.... even if the football sounded like it was made of lead!
He taken the grift my guardians step father the Wayne sewell stolen the money u give me the $3000
I’m poor had my Superman uniform taken my body stomach tsken
I first tout that you greatly did had fotoshopped that hamer smash on the c64gs but so you own 2 of these.
Well how dumb could commodore to keep the expansion and printer port while covering them? Same thing nintendo did with the supergameboy,covering the link port.
So what commodore just did was just recycling those remained motherboards from their c64 and put then into a c64gs case.
Was there really no keyboard input to save it from it's doom?or was there a keyboard wich connects to the controller port as an alternative of a keyboard? I readed that there was a windowing feature to compensate for the lack of keyboard but no software used it.
+johneygd Yes, the BIOS had "Windowing" capability, but it wasn't used, mainly because the C64 didn't have it, and the games needed to run on both *facepalm*
Wurde glaube ich nur auf der Insel verkauft. Auf dem europäischen Festland glaube ich nicht. Der GS ist mir zwar auch bekannt.
ok, so we need to come up with a new cia chip that has a bluetooth connection and can integrate a HID keyboard. and of course integrate a stereo sid chip
Oh Man.... you got me BIG time! I was SOOOOOOO going to trash you , unsubscribe and send you to hell x 100000. I couldn't believe what you did. So glad I watched till the end, really let me off the proverbial hook. 5 stars dude. You SOOO got me... You'da'mayen.
It's really stupid to break this Commodore !!!
I don't remember that system at all. I know a couple of people who got the GX4000 for Christmas when I got my Master System. I have 22 of the original 24 Mean Machines magazines and I don't think they ever mentioned it. They did review GX4000 for a short time. At least Amstrad had the good grace to add a second fire button to their console and new technology. The 64GS begs the question: Why not just buy the C64 computer? But at least the GX had a few games tailored to it.
LOL glad you explained you didnt use the hammer for real😅
Just found your channel - Great work! Had a soft spot for the GS, even though I never owned one! Maybe because it was doomed from the start, I’m not sure. I had a C64C around the same time and did have a few cart games, due to the GS hitting the shops. As for the bundled joysticks, the base fire button was independent to the others so you did have two fire buttons as such. Even though it was functionless 99% of the time, So they were even more useless! On occasion though the button did have a use - The one that comes to mind would be operating the tank controls in Battle Command.
+Aled Grav I definitely think there's something appealing about "doomed" machines. Not entirely sure what. But something
So was this the start of Commodore shipping with bad controllers? The CD32 default pad was crap as well!
MaximumRD haaa, you have a good point there!
+MaximumRD Not the first. I remember using a 'Commodore joystick' that was made by Commodore for the Vic=20. That triangular handled piece of crap was lucky to last a week, the metal contacts would split. Atari joysticks all the way :)
Dam, great channel, I'll fav you on facebook/twitter, but your way beyond hte limits I impose for a video shoutout lol. Yup, never use my hermes, they are shite!!
Thank you my friend! Appreciated! I've started doing ultra packing for all carriers now, drop it from chest height kind of testing. it's the only way to be sure :D
+Nostalgia Nerd why would you destroy such a rare machine?
+Kinetic Power If you would have watched the end, you'd have seen that he has 2 64GS systems, one of which was smashed by the postal service Hermes in transit.
+Nostalgia Nerd take off n' nuk'em from space. it's the only way to be sure!
Sucide time power of attorney and more Fushion dragon ball a training not for me
It would be interesting to see an Amiga CD32 review sometime. I have one myself but due to buying a new house and renovating it, I haven't had a chance to build up a considerable library for it yet.
Richard Troupe No problem. Here you go ;) ruclips.net/video/rgKfVgftX7c/видео.html
The LCD computer would have been better.
Ok like and positive comment speedrun Great vid!
Hah a system I have never even seen in real life, though funny this might of been the original idea of turning a computer into a console. If it had been an upgrade, added better graphics, was well bundled with some killer titles and even lower priced it MIGHT of had a go.
MaximumRD Yeah, possibly. Although it would still have been competing with the Mega Drive AND the Master System/NES (which were both cheaper than the GS by a fair margin), at launch! I think they were clutching at some pretty short straws.
Nostalgia Nerd True enough.
MaximumRD Would defintely have had a better chance than the lack luster thing they released though XD
Whats the name of the game at 2:04, spent hours playing it!!...
wow I thought this came out to battle the SMS and NES. To launch this to battle the SNES and mega drive was more than stupid by commodore. lol
do not destroy your systems with a hammer
just donate them to a not stupid collector