Subwoofer Phase Setting: Which is best? 0? 180? (Subwoofer Setup Tip)
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- Опубликовано: 2 июл 2024
- This has been a requested topic from a few of my viewers. Vv Click "SHOW MORE" vV
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As I stated, this topic can be far more involved, or really simplified, but I tried to strike a balance. A 2 hour video would be overkill, but simply saying "leave it at 0" leaves too many questions about why.
Personally, I like to know why I'm doing something, rather than just following advice blindly.
Some exceptions to this would be people who don't have distance settings on their equipment, in which case the phase setting on your subwoofer can make a difference. Most AVR's designed for surround sound will have this setting though. With Denon, it's Setup/Speaker/ManualSetup/Distances
Here's the graph on Facebook showing the improvement from adding 4 feet to the post Audyssey subwoofer distance value:
subwoofer101...
**Current System setup below**
A "short list" of subwoofers I would actually buy: www.subwoofer101.com/best-subw...
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Here is the setup at the time of upload:
Amplifier Denon X6200W: amzn.to/2fbCbGx
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SVS Soundpath Subwoofer Isolation System: sub101.link/Isolation
Speaker wire:
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Subwoofer cable: sub101.link/RCA
LG 4K 3D that I replaced previous Vizio with a Square Trade type warranty. Love the LG, some issues aside. Going through Amazon means you can get a decently priced 5 year warranty (strongly recommend for TV's and AVR's)
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came for the title and stayed for the doggo
We have good doggo here.
He's the best woofer in the whole video
He's the only woofer that really matters.
There are two doggos! Dual woofers if you will.
Thank you for making this video, I have 3 subs in my room and the bass wasn't what I expected. Than after watching this video I started adjusting the phase on my sub that was the furthest away and WOW!!!! Bass came alive! Thank you
00:41 It's hilarious that right when you held your hands up...the dog moved. Awwwwwww
I'm actually looking for a video explanation about subwoofers in my car, but this video basically told me exactly what I was looking for. And also the fluffy pups!😂
I love your videos. The extra four feet advice was the most valuable piece of information I have gotten from any of the AVR videos I have ever seen.
Room dimensions play a major factor. 0deg with detected distance provided far less bass than 180 in my situation (20' x 30' room with 16' ceiling). But at 180deg seemed very boomy. Thank you for the suggestion of increasing sub distance from standard. It was the only way I could correct while keeping the sub in the front near the towers. I probably need 90deg, but have no way of setting to that phase
Room dimensions make a difference, but timing is the real issue.
I have packed a motorhome with a full surround system, and it sounds epic. Better than the house.
If you are looking for 90 degrees, I would suggest trying 2 feet of added distance. Or 6 feet.
Go with what sounds best, but when you adjust the distance value, you will find the spot where the bass opens up the most. (Fewest cancelations between subs and mains.)
I have 3 total subwoofers, two of them are in the midpoint of my room which is about 20 to 22 feet wide, and one of them is in the middle of that 20-22 feet. I set my phase out the two in the midpoint of my room to 0° and the one in the middle of the 20-22 feet part of the room to 180° phase. I don’t know if it’s technically right, but this has sounded the best and made for the smoothest bass response for my ears, and eliminates my dead spots. Very interesting!
The Dogs were thinking to themselves Who the Hell is he talking too lol ?? He's looking at me but I don't think he's talking to me.
The dog wanted to do Taxi Driver impression? "R U talkin to me???"
Hey man just found your channel and wanted to say THANK YOU! Took your recommendation on settings and it worked for my PB-2000s. Wish I found it sooner but just wanted to say thanks.
Could you pass those settings on to a fellow PB2000 owner :D I've watched some videos, but I didn't take notes like I should have.
@@jwgosla08 So all I did was up the distance setting in my AVR by 4 feet max. You have to play with it based on your room but the max I changed it was 4 feet. So lets say my AVR says the distance of my subwoofer is 9.2 feet. Then all you do is go into the speaker settings and up the DISTANCE to 13.2 feet. Like I said that's the max. I run a dual sub setup and this really helped me. Sometimes I will change it by 2 or 3 just to play around but 4 seems to be just right in my room. Good luck with it, seems to be quite the rabbit hole with getting subs tuned.
Thanks for the great video. I have question regarding my setup. I have denon AVR with 2 pre out for subwoofer. I’m planning to get one more subwoofer i have Klipsch R-115SW and the new one will be the same model. My question is shall i setup both subwoofers phase to 0 ? Both subwoofers will be in front of me. And one more thing shall I setup both subwoofers LOWPASS to LFE ? Thanks
I gotta thank you for pointing out that two different models of subs on one source can be suboptimal. I had an SB 2000 and an SB 1000 in my HT, assuming that they would play well together. I had never even bothered to do a sweep. After viewing one of your videos, I finally did do a frequency test. Holy smokes- there was a huge suckout at 50Hz - like 10dB or more down. I disconnected the SB-1000 and jacked up the volume on the 2000 about 3dB to compensate for the loss of the smaller sub. What a difference! I now get a nice even sweep through the entire range of the sub. My neighbor upstairs is finally justifiably upset with me and I had to turn it down lol. As they say, be careful what you wish for!
That seems like about phase, if the polarity Is flipped then it doesn’t null / no cancelation
@@chinmeysway one would assume that two subs from the same manufacturer would have identical phase, but who knows?
High pass filtering is critical if one can’t manage the crossover point perfectly. The latter is difficult if one can’t trust the manufacturer’s specs. I find that the port tuning frequency is a bugbear as the port (or passive radiator can react to frequencies well above what one would consider a good crossover point for their speakers. Im finding, to my chagrin, that the only way to avoid this problem is the set the crossover point higher than I would like. Consequently, I’m more and more leaning to shutting down the sub and trusting the speaker manufacturer. That doesn’t work for small mains, but my current speakers can go deep enough.
I really prefer acoustic suspension loudspeakers, but they are increasingly rare these days.
TBH, I’m finding the whole audiophile thing to be exhausting lately, just like politics. More and more, I now set it and try to forget it.
Hi Subwoofer101, great video & explanation. In my home theater set-up, I measured the distance of my speakers with a tape for accurate input. I've also put a couple extra feet to the subwoofer distance. I have a adjustable phase knob on my sub from 0 to 180 degrees. I never use this, just like you I left it on 0 degrees. I recently bought a turntable and some vinyl, and yesterday I finally bough a Blu ray player. Now, my set-up is complete. In the nearby future I'm gonna upgrade my front speakers. After that, the subwoofer. Would like to buy a SVS. I'm subscribed to your channel for a while and see a lot of video's. Also I've read reviews about SVS subwoofers. They are absolute the most valuable subwoofers. That's what I see on simply every review. Very good sound quality and a affordable price. The sub that I have in use now, is good but was more expense than a entry level SVS sub! I have one question: does SVS ship to Europe? That's the only thing I want to know. My decision is made! Friendly regards, Emiel
Emiel Bakhuis No SVS doesn’t ship directly to Europe. A couple of years ago L-Sound was their European dealer. Nowadays you can get their subs through Amazon or Dutch eshop Hificorner.nl
Paul V thanks, Paul! I'm going to check out the website you mentioned to see what hificorner.nl is selling regarding to SVS.
I appreciate, too a degree, what you are explaining. However the phrase "ignorance is bliss", has drifted into my thoughts. That dog is a perfect example. Thank You.
Do you have videos on setting the subwoofer level? When I set mine to 80db, (what my speakers are set too) they become boomy and way over powering. I have them about 10db lower than my speakers and they blend perfectly, if an explosion comes from one of my surrounds it's sounds like the bass is coming from that speaker.
It is time to revisit this and the “Sub Distance Hack” video. Things have changed now that all of SVS subs are using the app and phase can be adjusted one degree at a time. The question now is whether leave the Audyssey distances as it measures or set them to the actual physical distance and then use the phase adjustments for each sub? The sub phase is to be set to zero before running Audyssey. I like to set the sub volume at -15db on my PB1KP and go between -79 & -80db on the Audyssey scan. My volume on the sub bas to be increased to -12db to get there. After Audyssey runs, I bump up its result to the number of db it took to get to that 79/80 number. Generally, the AVR number is -4db. My second sub is a Polk PSW-505, it’s phase is set to ZERO.
I’m finding myself constantly playing with the phase on the SVS app. Now, I’m questioning the distance Vs phase adjustments. I’m not finding a definitive answer that satisfies my curiosity.
So I have the SVS SB 12-My receiver set it at 9.4 distance.Should I still add 4 ft to this.My sub is about 5 ft from my sitting position. Im thinking in terms of what you said about SVS subs with DSP that sets subs distance further.
simple and to the point without all the dizzy guess work thanks
Hi there, I need little help with the subwoofer settings. I have a Yamaha 583 receiver hooked up to Boston acoustics a 25 bookshelves and cs 225cll as center with bic America f12 subwoofer. Can you tell me the right settings for the receiver and the subwoofer. My room size 19x9x8 feet, should I change the sub trim volume on my receiver, if yes means to what level . I appreciate your help.
I use two SVS SB-3000 and one is in the back of the room and at least 20 feet away from MLP. When running Audessey, it sets the distance at 36.4 feet (accounting for DSP, etc.). However, whenever I get into the Distance screen, Audessey won't let me out of it saying that I have exceeded the allowable distance and I cannot move forward until I bring down SW2 to 26 or less feet. But by doing this, I will have messed up all timing. Any suggestions?
very cool info! i did not know abt the relation on distance to phase and how distance can be used to fine tune phase variances...it makes sense... thanks!
Wow, I finally get what that phase setting is for! So if I only have 1 sub, which I do, do I set it to 0?
The purpose of the phase control on the sub is to allow smooth low frequency integration with the mains (meaning no peaks or dips in frequency response around the crossover frequency). By artificially adding 4 feet to the distance of the subs you have essentially changed the "phase" relationship between the front speakers and the subs by 90 degrees at 70 Hz, which has a quarter wavelength of 4 feet. However, you have created a timing delay between the other speakers and your subs . You will likely achieve a more cohesive surround sound if you set the distances properly and change the phase control to 90 degrees....
My sub seems to fit better with my speakers and more in time/blend with 180, but it sounds more thin-ish?
Not sure if i need to move it or if this is fine.
In my case my active subwoofer (it's an Klipsch R120sw) has a static noise (like a humming noise) at 0° phase. In 180° it's gone. Could my amp be potentially broken?
I have 2 subs using a Y splitter into my receivers only Sub connection. My svs pb3000 is in the front and further away than my second sub which is an older SVS CS Ultra thats in the rear in the opposite kitty corner. I can only select distance for one sub. I am assuming I do the distance +4 from the front that is already furthest distance?
Hello, I have my sub Adam 10 "MK2 And ADAM S2V couple in my homestudy, the fact is that I have it in the center between my two monitors, under my desk, if I leave it with the 0 ° phase and with sonarworks, the graph gives me a + -3db waveform up and down, between 100 Hz and 28 Hz. And if I change it to phase 180 °, I have a +6 dbs rise in the graph, from 80 Hz at 28 Hz. No waveform, all this measured in the whole room The question is that with phase at 0 °, as the graph says, At ear, I perceive less serious, and with the phase at 180 ° I perceive more serious. My question is, which of the two configurations do you think would be in the correct phase? I'm lost.
Bought 2 monoprice m215s and they dont boom like they should. Using onkyo rz3100 hooked up lfe. Any suggestions? Factory resets and recalibrations have been done with each setting.
I'm still trying to wrap my brain around those two "16's" just sitting there like subwoofer gods! I would kill to have that in my home. Literally!
They are awesome. Not prison time awesome, but awesome nonetheless!!
FrakU2 Hahahahahaha...Don’t kill anybody literally!!! You won’t be able to take those subs with you to the PEN!!!
Those sub are way to huge for tiny room one would spend a life sentence in. However, if you could convince the WARDEN, I’m sure everyone will enjoy your life sentence, listening to your subs.
That’s my two cents.
SCOTT JOSEPH BRANDT both his subs fits in one of mine lol...
Big does not mean you cannot control it.
Hi, I've just bought a German subwoofer Mivoc Hype 10 G2. As far as I know, it has a cancellation after having made the parametric EQ with YPAO (Yamaha receiver) I have the following configuration: This software set a gain of -5,5 dB at the frequency of 62,5 HZ
and with a Q= 3,175
. There is a big gap with the shape of a V going down till those negative gain. Can anyone help me? Should I increase the distance (delay) in 4 dB? Maybe to change of phase from 0º to 180º? Changing the position of the subwoofer? Any tip will be welcome. Thanks in advance and greetings from Spain
Awesome dog and great information that's simplistic.
That dog is thinking not another video about these human subs bro lollllllllll
Thank you for these videos they are much appreciated!
I have dual subs but my receiver (AVR 3313CI) only shows 1 instead of 2. Is there a reason it doesn’t show a 2nd?
I like it when Matthew Mcconaughey explains subs.
Well alright, alright...😎
Thanks for the clarification on phasing. How are you connecting your dual subs to the AVR?
I have a Denon X3600H AVR and when I try to change the sub distance I get an error stating that the distance is invalid. What am I doing wrong?
Wow you explain that excellent I got the whole video in less than 5 minutes thanks guy you're the greatest
Bow wow!
This is an older video but I would like to add a few more things many people miss in the comments.
It's about timing with the main speakers period. Whether it be phase or group delay settings. The proper way to setting bass is with a "KICK DRUM" track from a good recording in TWO CHANNEL STEREO.
Assuming you've gone through the basic stuff such as placement, toe in, setting basic levels etc, dial in your bass distance with KICK DRUM. Once you've decided that the kick drum timing hits you square in the chest and is squared up with the timing of the front speakers, you've got it right. Movies will be accurate and perfect. All music will be accurate and you'll be surrounded by bass.
A bit late reaction.. But this is what i heard as well. About the speakers/subs canceling eachothers low frequency out. So you dont hear them. Makes sence since when i produced music and wanted to use an accapella... Just use an instrumental and full track, time them equally and switch the fase of the instrumental and mix the 2.. Leaving me with an accapella
You make it easy to understand 😎👍💯
I also use the distance setting to delay the mains relative to the sub. I do this by inverting the polarity of the main closest to the sub, with the other main disconnected, and use an SPL meter placed nearfield between the main and sub, to find the distance setting that is at least 1 cycle earlier than the mains and also produces the deepest null playing an 80hz sinewave (crossover). Once the speakers are reconnected in phase, the sound integrates beautifully and seamlessly. Even standing directly in front of the sub and nearest main, all of the bass appears to be coming from the main.
I'm trying to figure out if that's the long way to get to what I do with the Distance Hack.
What is your subwoofer distance with room correction, and then after your method? Interesting for sure.
After cal the distance is 17’ sub and 10’ mains. Manual distance is 23’ for sub. (Monolith 15)
How do you invert polarity a main. Do you just wire it bass awkwards?
Thanks for your explanation
thank you for this, I have two subs and I have them 180' out of phase and I'm not happy with the sound...
Thats why. Get them in phase with each other and crucially in phase with your stereo speakers.
I am looking to add two bookshelf speakers as my mains, what do you recommend and use.
I'm pretty impressed with the SVS line, and that's not just because I'm their first affiliate. I haven't really found any shortcomings aside from not coming in exotic wood finishes.
Here's an article on the process of how they design their speakers: sub101.link/PrimeDesign
sub101.link/PrimeBookPkg
sub101.link/UltraBook
Does it have to be 4 ft added could i add 2 or 3 ft ?
I simply came here looking for info on how to set the phase on my 2 subwoofers as I've heard that If you have a 2 sub setup you want to set one at 0 phase and the other at 180 phase(my subs only have 0 or 180) . I was just looking for that confirmation but what I got instead was just confusion!..lol!...I consider myself to be somewhat intelligent, but I have to tell you after watching this video twice . I'm now more confused as ever! Thanks!!! I'm just going to play with the phase switches and stick with whatever I perceive to sound better! Please dont get me wrong I'm not trying to sound rude but on this topic, this video is just confusing! Sorry! You've done a great job on other videos and I've learned alot! Hell,your the main reason I run two subs now! Thank you for that! Who knows maybe it's me!? I dunno but just call me "confused"!......lol!!!
One to 0 and the other one to 180?
That was a troll my dude
You have earned a subscriber
How about if you have one in the front corner and one in the back corner?
ed at svs told me: if the subs are near the speakers set the phase to zero....if they're much further away then that is when you wish to experiment with phase
I like to set it at 0 regardless and use the distance to adjust phase: ruclips.net/video/pVFxjhEc0X8/видео.html
Hi @Subwoofer 101, how do you get Subwoofer 1 and Subwoofer 2 to config separately in your Distance settings? I've got Denon's AVR-X2400H
model.
From what I’ve learned if your receiver while doing room correction does not tone each sub separately then there is no way to do it. If your receiver has only one sub input then it would be impossible if you split the rca signal. If it’s got two and only one signal while room correcting then it’s not a true dual sub receiver.
I just added a subwoofer to my system (2.1), in the beginning I thought I sound bad, but then I tried to press reserve (I didn't have a clue what it was), and my subwoofer now sounds much better? I don't understand anything
The last sentence is so true!
does the phase matters when i drive a single sub ?
I just called SVC and sure enough, they helped me even though I have none of their products.
Yeah they're great like that, and on top of it they really know their stuff!
Frankly, if I have questions about Denon or Marantz, I reach out to SVS.
Some truly brilliant people over there.
I'm guessing the guy practiced this episode a lot, that the doggos got tired of hearing him talk, and dozed off.....
Joking aside, this video is very helpful. I landed here searching for setting the phase of my car's trunk sub. Although this video didn't help me per se, it's still very informative and helping me understand the concept a lot better....
Do you understand the difference between phase adjustment and delay on the receiver? I don't believe you do based on what I have heard you saying in the video...
Setting up a sub is straightforward if you have access to Spotify on your system. You can also use this technique with two subs if you disconnect one, then do it with one, then the other.
1) Finalise where the sub is going to be placed. Ideally this should be in the middle of and equidistant to each stereo speaker and the same distance to you as the stereo speakers, but its not critical as low bass is not directional. Avoid placing the sub too far away from the main speakers though as the bass will sound detached and experiment with its positioning to get the taughtest and most articulate bass, not the most quantity. Corner placement might not be the best as it will tend to over emphasise some bass frequencies.
2) Download a SPL meter onto your tablet or phone. A digital readout rather than an analogue meter can be easier to read from a distance. You can purchase a sound pressure level meter if you want a more sensitive and accurate reading.
3) Place your device where your head would normally be in the listening position and switch on the app. Make sure the microphone on your device is unobstructed.
4) Play bass frequency test tones available on Spotify. 50HZ should be audible on most systems and do the job and turn up the volume a bit higher than normal listening level, but being careful not to blow your main stereo speakers.
5) Adjust the phase control on your sub so that the SPL meter achieves its maximum level.
6) Your sub should now be in phase with the bass speakers in your main stereo system.
7) Now adjust the crossover frequency of the sub so that it starts to kick in as the bass in your main speakers starts to roll off, then adjust the level of the sub so that you are not aware of the sub itself, but so that your main speakers sound like much bigger ones.
8) Repeat 7) again and again with a variety of music until you are satisfied that the amount and quality of the bass is just right, then leave it alone and enjoy your music.
You can make a note of the phase, crossover and level settings or mark the knobs with a dab of correction fluid on the knob and its scale so that if the settings ever get disturbed you can easily return to the optimum settings. Its important to remember that the acoustics of your room will also play a part. The above technique works for one bass frequency at one specific part of the room and music contains various bass frequencies of course but it is a good starting point. Certain frequencies will be reduced in loudness due to the dimensions of your room due to "Standing waves" which will cancel out or reduce sound pressure at certain low frequencies, and on the other hand, certain frequencies will be reinforced. Acoustics of rooms is a science in itself and nobody lives in an anechoic chamber. The main thing is to use the above method then experiment with sub placement and settings so that you get the best subjective result, then just enjoy the music.
thanks for the detailed explanation.
OMG that dog is in deep peaceful sleep!!
What happens if you have two subs in two different places, running off a y cable
For me, I have always rocked 180degrees on subs. Optimal or not, it feels much smoother and deeper like a cinema. I’ve tried feeakin everything and now 15 yrs later I got new subs. Tried 0degrees for once on both like the Hifi man said, and meh. changed both to 180 and oh my… 😮 what’s wrong with me😅 both in front like my old one
You're not wrong, you're already phase shifting by using 180 phase.
The problem is, when you set it to 180, you are "delaying" the bass.
So you're still getting the benefits of less cancellation, but in my opinion, setting the subs to 0 phase, and then adding 4 ft to the subwoofer distance after room calibration is better because you are putting the bass in the room "before" the mids and highs.
Because bass decays slower, I think advancing the bass instead of delaying the bass sounds cleaner.
When you add 4 ft, your AVR thinks your subwoofer is 4 feet further away than it actually is.
The distance setting in an AVR is basically just timing.
So to compensate for being 4 ft further away, it delays the other channels in relation to the subwoofer, so that the subwoofer gets the signal a few milliseconds before the other channels.
180 phase delays the subwoofer by a few milliseconds.
Both offset the timing enough to reduce cancellations between the subwoofer and the main speakers.
I just believe that because of slower bass decay, advancing sounds cleaner and more cohesive.
@@Subwoofer101 which sab to put Distance 4ft friend to the one that is closer than another???
So if my sub is next to my front channel it’s 0 phase?
THANK YOU SO MUCH, THIS IS SO HELPFUL
Thank you for your comment!
When you adjust distance you adjust all frequencies going to that speaker. When you adjust phase you only adjust for the frequencies near the crossover. Also, while the speaker may be 12' away as measured by Audessy, or some other sound alignment tool, that doesn't mean the phase will be correct for the band of frequencies you want maximized at a give position. You could have the distance perfect but 30hz is a longer wave length than 60hz so at the listening position you may be completely out of phase at 60hz but dead on for 30hz. That why you use the phase adjustment to maximize the frequencies at the crossover so your sub isn't out of phase and cancelling out bass from your main speakers. You can use distance to compensate for phase but a 20hz wave length is 56'. The wave length of 30hz is 37'. That's 20' of difference between those two frequencies alone. This is why you focus on the crossover point between your sub and main speakers. That is the spot that if your sub is out of phase with your mains you will have a dead spot.
The "Distance" setting is a function of delay, in a round about way. The AVR sets delay based on distance values.
Dead spots are more common with single subwoofers, MUCH less of an issue with matching duals. Not every sub has a variable phase, some are only 0 and 180. Adjusting distance allows more precise control in those cases.
Adjust it as you see fit of course, but altering the subwoofer distance setting has measurable results: facebook.com/subwoofer101/photos/rpp.1498339940466955/1758500291117584/?type=3&theater
Subwoofer 101 You missed my point though. Distance is simply measuring the physical distance from your sub to your main listening position. That has nothing to do with the length of a frequency and whether it peaks at the MLP. 80hz is much longer than the distance most subs are from the MLP so if your sub is 15ft from your couch but a crossover frequency is 25ft wavelength you can't rebuild your living room to 25ft.
Distance adjust timing so the sound from the sub hits your ears at the same time the sound from the other speakers do. Phase moves the wavelength so that at that distance the crossover frequency, or whichever your aligning to, also peaks at that distance. They are two separate adjustments.
Often, the phase switch is just a delay. But I'll play along. I've eliminated most of the cancellations using the distance setting. How should I have accomplished the same result without using the distance setting?
I know that the wavelength increases as the frequency drops, and basically fold up on themselves in an enclosed room, causing modes and nodes.
The answer isn't to modify the room to fit the physical wavelength, it's to run multiple subs to knock down the standing wave effect. It does a great job, and it's much easier than trying to calculate the changing wavelengths.
I don't think I missed your point, I just don't view wavelength as practically relevant. It's a fun fact, and absolutely true and fun to contemplate, but not something I need to think about when setting things up.
Adjusting the distance resolves the problem with far less mental gymnastics. Taking actual wavelength distance into account is overcomplicating the problem in my view.
You can also calculate the speed of sound by temperature and altitude, and calibrate sound based on the changing weather day to day, or even hour by hour. Factually, there will be a difference. Practically, all your doing is getting yourself closer to the insane asylum.
Great video. I don't mess with phase either.
I've noticed a big difference all around and not just with Bass when I turn on the Dynamic Eq on the Denon receiver.
I know you don't like the Dynamic Volume on, which I don't either, but what do you think of the Dynamic Eq?
I find I had to lower the bass settings on the subs and in Audussey a little to reduce some of the reverberations but I find it just to be all around dynamic.
Do you find it to be unnatural, overbearing..or do you like it?
+Johnny Blaze I do use Dynamic EQ. I also like the restore option on low; oddly enough, it's great with vinyl. That can depend on the source though, but I do like Dynamic EQ. I also like the "Flat" setting vs "Reference".
Thank you, Sir!
Can someone post a subwoofer measurement with the umik 1 and with the audyssey mic ? I am interested how much the Audyssey is off.
Thx
I'll try to remember to do that next time I have everything out.
Thx
Level isn't the problem. Calibration is here the question :)
Drivers go only 2 directions, back and forth, so just 0 and 180 make sense. What does the variable setting between those even do? I'm confused.
Could you please explain why you like using bookshelf speakers instead of tower speakers?
+Jaquay Lawson Both work quite well, I almost don't have a preference. That said, a Tower of the same caliber will give a more full sound. The Ultra Bookshelf speakers have a little more 'sparkle" to them than the Prime Towers, but it's a thin margin, I'm a big fan of the Prime Towers. If I had to choose between the two, it would probably come down to aesthetics. After I decide on a decent external amp, I'll probably move on to the Ultra Towers.
I went from towers to bookshelf speakers a year ago and don't ever see myself going back. A great bookshelf and great sub or two is just as good if not better than towers. A great bookshelf is also more affordable. I LOVE my system. Def Tech SM 65 LCR, SM 55 surrounds, PB-1000 sub. Its just amazing.
According to Dennis Foley for Acoustic Fields, you should never have your speakers on the floor and that includes floorstanding tower speakers and subwoofers. So on that note, I'm in the process of building some absorption platforms for my Klipsch F3 floorstanders and Klipsch SW-450 subwoofer. Personally, I could not visualize a home audio system without floorstanders/towers for listening to music or home theater system for movies. My system is set up as a 7.1 home theater. My Yamaha A/V receiver can also switch over to 2-channel stereo for music if I choose to do so, but I usually listen to music and watch movies both through 7.1 Enhanced mode.
Muchas gracias ....por compartir tus conocimientos nos ahorras mucho tiempo y dinero
Basically what I just heard was monkey around with sub placement and the phase settings until it sounds good to you and screw the rest.
Jamal Johnson lol yep but if you want to do it professionally then what he is saying is what you would do
So if my AVR sets my sub to -15 dB (which is the lowest setting), does that mean my sub gain volume is too high? Also can I set the AVR at LFE+main even though I have small front speakers? I like the added bass by the subs when listening in 2.0 channel stereo for music.
Nice explanation. 🐕 chilling😎
+nmarkose Thanks!
Great vid. Question:
My denon only comes with bronze audyessey, which only accounts for one sub for the gain and distance.
I do have dual subs though. The back of my receiver has dual outputs. Should I be using the RCA Y ADAPTER to both of the subs?
Currently I notice a 5 db loss or gain by flipping the the phase knob 0 to 180 or vise versa. Not sure I'm understanding how all this works
My subs are one in the front corner and one in the opposite rear corner. Measurement wise physically I've set both of the subs equidistant from one another.
Any input would be awesome thanks
Check out my "Distance hack" and my phase videos. Essentially, distance is a way to adjust phase, but with more control.
As far as the y splitter vs both outputs, it can be a roll of the dice. The outputs should be identical, but some people notice improvement using a splitter. Trust your ears above all else.
I see you reference Audyssey, does adding 4 feet also work for the Yamaha's YPAO?
I imagine it should. Give it a go and see if you notice a difference.
Yes, it worked for me with the RX-V635 YPAO and 500w JBL sealed sub
How do you set the phase of 4 subs in each corner of the room?!
I guess you need a Phd to find out.
So if i flip the phase on one of my subs to 180 and i gain 3db on my spl, can i assume audyssey is getting the distance wrong on my subs?
ASSume away!
I have dual subs. The rear sub is 0° and the front sub is 0°. When I set the front sub to 180° bass sound a bit louder. With the front sub at 180°, when I set the rear sub to 180° the bass sound a bit louder again. Is that how I should set it for best audio?
Set them both to zero phase, then add 4 feet to the room correction value on your AVR.
Similar to what you are experiencing, a phase shift, but the timing is more advantageous.
By using 180 phase, you are basically delaying the bass.
By adding 4 feet to the distance, you're populating the room with bass before mids and highs.
Bass has a slower decay, so it will sound better advanced rather than delayed.
@@Subwoofer101 with both the subs are set to 180° the overall bass sounds louder than when they are at 0°. By reverting back to 0° and adding 4 feet will that add back a more bass?
@@Subwoofer101 so I actually tried doing a test tone and infact using a decimal app on my phone placed at the main listening position it is lounder when the front sub is 0° and rear sub is 180°. Will it be better to then redo and auto calibration with the subs at this current phase settings?
I thought only class D amplified woofers have DSPs? A and A/B shouldn't.... or am I wrong?
What mic and software do you use to graph your Audio response?
I don't have a mic or soft ware.
You got four woofers pretty sweet
Do you think that if I measure the samps accurately at the listening position and put the metre's in the amplifier, I won't have the right bass???
Only switch phase to 180 if the sub is inverted backwards in the box
Thanks!
HOW do jou do that with yer thumb???
What bookshelf speakers have you got there?
It's in the description, a bit of the way down, but they are SVS Ultra Bookshelf.
12:52 Siiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiick 😎😎😎
It's basically my opener for all videos now.
Good info for the issue.
Also you are correct that SVS is a great company with lots of knowledge to give. Ed Mullen and many others have been a huge help when I have a question.
I am Running dual PC2000s soon to be quad 2000s.
Love the dogs.
+Mark Nelson Yeah, SVS has always been super responsive and spot on when it comes to audio. Very helpful.
Quad 2000's are great, just don't try mixing wired with wireless like I did. Wired is the way to go if you can.
Yes wired will be the method of wiring the subs. Ed Warned me of that very issue too.
Christmas will be filled with some clean fun bass to enjoy.
Keep up the good work I enjoy your videos.
Quick question. What if audyssey already measured my sub 20 feet away and its only 10-11 feet away. You still add 4 feet?
What's farther, Chicago or by train?
@@mr.blackhawk142 definitely train.
I realized this was a side effect of having a wireless sub, and I would assume his logic still applies. But I hated that sub anyway. Dual pb1000s incoming.
If a sub is set to 180 when base hits does the woofer go in or out
First impulse would be "in", but I wouldn't get lost in that.
180 switch could be seen as a simple delay, which is why I recommend using distance instead of the 180 degree phase switch. More precise control.
Where a 180 degree phase switch is like reducing the subwoofer distance value (timing), adding to the distance value sends the bass signal into the room a little sooner than the rest of the speakers. You can't do that with a phase switch.
Once the signal leaves the AVR, the only timing effect you can have is a delay. That's why doing it in the AVR (using distance settings) is the best way to go, in my opinion.
base hits??? This aint baseball...Spanky!
Dogs for sound absorption is quite the innovation
DSP variable phase 0 to 180 in 5 degree steps.
Too bad SVS doesn't just have the RCA at full range and instead is 80hz fixed and above. I've noticed some subs from other brands the rca out is just a pass through so you can connect one sub to the next and so on...
The dog overdosed on bass
is there a reason why you don't have a separate amp? i know a lot of people use separate amps. what is you thoughts on separate amps?
I'm a big proponent of buying AVR's that will allow for external amplification. I just haven't put a priority on getting an external amp, but I intend to.
It doesn’t seem like you’re really going into topic of phase. Delay can affect phase alignment (which you are talking about mostly), but if you’re talking about phase - that you admit you don’t mess with - then you’d be going over how sound waves involve cancellation and this is why two subs can null out. If you’re subs were in phase then it’s likely you’d not need to timing trick, pretty sure.
I started out to learn about phase, but then, just watched your dogs...
I"m confused. So is phasing delays?
If I have any understanding it might be similar to reversing the positive and negative leads making the sub move more inward instead of out. In SOME setups, this supposedly sounds better.
I was told if the subwoofer is in front of you set it at 0, and if it’s behind you set it at 180.
It's more complicated than that. It's better to focus on the timing aspect, in my opinion.
Of course, just flipping the phase switch and going with the setting that sounds better in your main listening position works too.
You get more control if you focus on the subwoofer distance setting, if your AVR has it.
Sure a lot of foggy sub info out there, wow. I'm thinking there's no perfect , no matter how much $ we spend. Enjoy the music.
That is incorrect the thing about the sub it design to play low frequency so it is less likely to beam. However it is about compressing air. So of it behind you and the speaker is facing away then it is 180 degrees of phase if it behind you and it is facing you ot should be set a 0 degree.
@@LividLeon dude subs don't have to be facing any direction they are non directional you are dead wrong on that one man
@@Crazytownmetal6 does that include front-facing subs?
What are the dogs named
I want to know why ...pioneer doesn't make a proper 12inch home subwoofer avaliable on the market?
Have to say amazing video. Wanted to ask you I have two subwoofers. When I do room correction what volume should I leave the woofers on.
Thanks! Check out my Gain Hack videos, but if you have Audyssey XT32, instead of 75 dB during subwoofer level matching, try 83 to 85. Of course it depends which subs and AVR you have, but you can get more oomph that way.
@@Subwoofer101 thanks for fast reply I have 2 jbl es150p and pioneer sc lx 501. I am new at this got a good deal and now trying to figure it out as I go.
Nice Woofers.
They have more bass than the average woofer....but that also means more hair in the vacuum. 😂