I used it for five years until the Moorgate train crash - I ran for that train and missed it luckily - I got the next one and sat in darkness for nearly two hours before we had to walk back through the train and the tunnels to Moorgate and walked past the crash site !!!! It was one of the most horrible experiences of my life !!!!!
I hope someone preserves a class 313. They served the capitol and surrounding towns well for over 40 years. One of BRs less glamorous, but certainly most durable and efficient designs.
There's a nice original BR liveried unit currently plying the Coastway routes out of Brighton mostly to Seaford. Its doors are the wrong colour though and no BR double arrows but nice to see. Glad they replaced the old seats!
Drayton Park station should be upgraded/rebuilt to help with the crowds at Arsenal FCs Emirates Stadium. Alleviate the pressure on Holloway Road/Arsenal/Finsbury Park/Highbury & Islington.
The class 313s are still running on the Coastway services heading east and west on stopping services from Brighton if, for some inexplicable reason, you still want to ride on them 😎
I accidentally got on a train at Moorgate from this hidden platform two years ago and it felt like I shouldn't have been there... the platform was wrong, the stock was different, and the signage wasn't the same as everywhere else. Moorgate is an odd station in general; it's harbouring all sorts of bits from the past.
Including an extension to Lothbury that was started but wasn't finished, if you look into the stub tunnel on platform 8 the tunnelling shield got stuck and so they left it there. This would have been such a short extension from Moorgate that when the front end a full length train (6 cars) reached the start of the platforms at the new Lothbury terminus the rear would still have been in Moorgate station. Also while it was a Tube line trains requiring heavy maintenance were hauled by battery locomotives from Drayton Park to East Finchley depot. Fair enough, you might think. No. This meant hauling them over BR tracks along the (non electrified) former Northern heights line through the tunnels at Highgate High Level, which was meant to become a part of the extended Northern Line to Bushey Heath had WW2 not happened. The other end of the tunnel at Highgate marks the boundary of the depot.
Just to correct you, the ramps built to take track did have track on them, pre British Rail days. If stock on the NCL needed to go to Acton works, then the stock would be hauled by one, or two LU battery locos to Finsbury Park via the ramps. The ensemble would then work to Kings Cross and go onto the widened lines, via York Road. There used to be a connection between the widened lines and the Met at Farringdon; the ensemble would use that to transfer from BR to LUL, and then go on the circle, and district, round to Acton Works. When the NCL was transferred to BR in 1975, ready for services running in October 1976, the Farringdon connection was obsolete, and was removed at the time York Road closed, in 1978.
I used to pick up a Great Northern Line train at Highbury and Islington out of rush hour and it really was odd walking for ever down passingways then sitting on an empty badly lit platform with the only noise coming from the tunnels as a train approached. You could hear and feel them coming for a long time - they fit snugly in the tunnels! Then a dirty graffiti covered old train came in. Also nearly empty. Thankfully quite well lit. The lighting on the platform has improved since then, and the new trains have taken away a lot of that charm (if that is the word).
THIS IS SO FREAKING COOL! I stumbled upon this line a few years ago and was oddly charmed by it, but had no idea about the history or anything. Its really quaint and charming 😊
When I was younger me & my mum would go to finsbury Park to get afro Caribbean hair products and using the NCL was the quickest way to get there from Liverpool St. Used to call it British Rail Underground when I was younger
stumbled across this channel 7 days ago and i am hooked the quality is outstanding along with the brilliant voiceover and music and it even has its own little references like everything is related to the northen city line :D you should defiantly collab with geoff marshall
I love this little line. In my eighties London spotting trips I always rode this from Moorgate to Finsbury Park for its unique atmosphere. Switching from 750 VDC to 25kVAC at Drayton Park was fascinating. This video encapsulates the atmosphere very well indeed. Old Street was my favourite stop. Not quite as eerie as Essex Road but still deserted enough to have an atmosphere all of its own.
I travelled on the Northern City line in the 1950s and it was weird. There was almost nobody around in off peak time. The stations were really dimly lit and had these odd nameboards with red diamonds instead of the usual LT roundels. I think they went back to the time of the Metropolitan ownership. Also the tunnels were larger than normal Tube ones because of an early plan to run trains through from the Great Northern which of course happened years later. They used Tube sized trains then and there was an eerie hollow rumble for ages before the train arrived. It was so spooky you could imagine a thriller being set there - in black and white.
I spend a year living in Newington Green a d working in Hertford just as the trains started to change. Those old trains were the worst I rode anywhere in the UK
Very good video. And the Great Northern Class 717s are now in service as these have replaced the Class 313 on the Moorgate Line and Hertford Loop Line. Why not do a video of the Class 717 and also do a video of London Overground Class 710s.
Having been born in the early 60's, I was fortunate enough to get to ride the Northern City Line (or Northern Line Highbury Branch as it was then) in the year or two before the handover to the National Rail Network (or BR!!) a couple of times, once in each direction between Drayton Park and Moorgate. Off--peak, it was just as quiet and eerie, but the trains were Northern Line red 1938 Stock, and all the platforms were decked out in LT roundel signage. The tiles on the sub surface station platforms when you filmed have only been there since the mid-80's, in 1975 they were all done out in these yellowy orange tiles, which were just covered over by the 80's ones. I see they've now given way to a third generation of tiles in the National Rail era for the line, a 3rd attempt to displace the spooky atmosphere...to not much avail though!!
I used to commute on this line in the early 90s from Alexandra Palace to Moorgate. The charming thing I liked was that Moorgate had platform guards. When the train was ready to leave, the guard would give two long blasts on his pocket whistle and shout "ALL ABOARD!" down the platform; just like a 'real' mainline terminus.
I’ve used this line for years from Palmers Green and believe me the old trains were filthy rattlers by the end. The only quirk you missed was the train switching from overhead power to track at Drayton Park with a familiar clunk.
Stumbled across this line absolutely plastered at 11am when I was going to Ally Pally - I ended up in black out and genuinely thought I’d imagined it the next day. I love everything about it.
That's the line decorated! Prior to sectorisation, all BR signs were black lettering on a slightly off-white background. And that was it - no symbols, no arrows, nothing - Just the plain dull red or navy painted tunnel skirting and the bar of black-lettering on the plainest background imaginable. I've a feel the entrance to Essex Road may have had some even earlier signage somewhere - two-tone turquoise mosaic tiles or something of that ilk - it felt like it belonged in another city, never mind railway. In other words - if you think it's bad now, it used to be a whole lot worse...!! Coupled to that, there were no Oystercards, no Travelcards, no London rail-rover tickets - just expensive single and return fares on what was basically a token service on a token railway fragment that had every reason to feel like a morgue, what with the Moorgate disaster still fresh in everyone's memory. It should be said, most of the Southern suburban network looked and felt much the same during the working day for much the same reasons - no to mention the various fragments that became known as the North London Line; and the handful of peak time services running in and out of the glorious dereliction that was Broad Street station. If anything - Dalston Junction was even worse!! From 1977 it was of course part of a national railway system that still hoped to close much of its remaining network - having lost two-thirds of it just ten years before. This was the era of sparse, uneven handfuls of trains running over main lines that were just crying out for even a regular service, never mind a frequent one; hence the most interesting thing to those of us visiting London from elsewhere in the UK was that these commuter railways had any sort of daytime service at all! It's funny to hear you talk of the 1980s as if they were in some past era: what you're looking at is yesterday's future!
It was certainly a contrast going from the Victoria Line platforms to the BR ones. A real gem in the early 80s was the enamel Victoria Line route map that had Fleet Line as the interchange at Green Park!
I have travelled on this line from Moorgate to Drayton Park when it was LT Northern Line. This was when you could travel in BR diesel hauled (Class 31) suburban stock (or Cravens/Class 101 DMU) to Moorgate via Kings Cross. I used to commute on this service from Brookmans Park. The Northern Line extension was then shut for a few years as you say in the late 1970’s. This was to allow the LT track to be lowered to allow Class 313 EMU’s to run through LT tunnels and the creation of the link to be between Drayton Park and Finsbury Park. The Class 313’s that ran on the line were unique at the time because they ran on both 25K overhead and 450V LT third rail power (the return being through the tracks). This was the time that the Great Northern line was electrified.
There's still the crumbling 'Great Northern Electrics' signage tucked away above the Arsenal Shop outside Finsbury Park Stn as a legacy to this line's past too.........
My favourite story from the Northern City Line is the one from 2013 about the hole in the northbound tunnel 400m after Old Street Station. A building contractor was erecting a new building which was much taller than the previous building on that site. Taller buildings require deeper foundations. The developer had checked with London Underground and Crossrail whether there were any tunnels nearby. If the tunnel was still part of the Northern Line this would have triggered alarm bells. No-one thought to ask Network Rail whether they had a tunnel locally. The first four bore holes for the foundations went smoothly but the fifth one was a problem. The augur bit hit something hard about 13 meters down and then, when it drilled through this, suddenly there was no resistance. Meanwhile, down below just before the augur broke through, a train went underneath. The driver noticed water gushing from the ceiling of the tunnel and thought it was odd as this section is normally dry. This was reported to the signaller who advised the next (empty) train to proceed along the tunnel slowly and check for problems. The driver of this second train discovered big pieces of the augur bit, gravel and other debris blocking the track. There was also a cascade of groundwater as the drill had passed through a water/gravel layer on the way down. If the first driver had not reported the water it could have been dangerous. The mess took a week to clear up and the architect had to re-design the foundations. For a more complete view see the official report: www.gov.uk/raib-reports/penetration-and-obstruction-of-a-tunnel-between-old-street-and-essex-road-stations-london
I think a similar thing happened when they were digging the foundations for the "Eurostar" curve at Battersea, they approached Thames Water who said "nope nothing of ours here" without checking about the new London Water Ring Main, I think it was breached and filled with several tons of pressurised concrete!
Great vid guys. I left school and joined the Railways as an Apprentice Electrical and Mechanical Fitter working on the 313 EMUs at Hornsy back in 1981. I left the Railways in 1987 to take up a career in telecommunications. This brought back some fond memories and a bit sad to hear that the 313s have now been replaced. Fitting to have 313064 on film, if I remember correctly Hornsy had 313001 through to 313064. Remember also doing a tunnel inspection as part of my training, which was bloody creepy.
I remember as a teenager travelling on the DMU's that ran into King's X from Herford North, then a few years later as an apprentice draughstman working in Tottenham Court Road, I commuted on the shiny new EMU's changing at Highbury & Islington for the Victoria line, fond memories? You've got to be kidding, 90% of my apprentice pittance went on my annual season ticket!
Loved watching this thank you , brings back so many memories especially that gap between platforms at Highbury & Islington where you can jump off the Victoria line train going to Kings Cross and board this train if you want to get off at Old Street etc thus saving yourself one stop plus the complicated changeover . That’s exactly what I used to do back in 76/77 when I got my first job working in Old Street after leaving school . As the Victoria line train came in you would look through the gap and very often see the Moorgate bound train coming in at the same time . Then you would hop off quickly to catch it before the doors shut and it pulled away . Sometimes you would still get off if it wasn’t there as often you would just see it pull in seconds after you had stayed on and left on the Kings Cross train . Then sometimes you would be disappointed as it had already gone and you would have to wait up to 5 or 6 minutes for the next one . During this time you might see another two trains pull in behind the one you had just got off as the Victoria line trains were more frequent , but still it was worth waiting to save that extra stop plus the long haul changeover at Kings Cross. I must admit it was pretty deserted even back then when I used it although it had only just opened in 1976 . The platform , seats and tunnel was brand spanking new and everything sparkling clean , I remember it so well as it felt so unusual at the time . I presume it got busier after I stopped using it in the late summer of 77. Happy memories for me though . One thing I was disappointed in , I hate to say it was seeing the 1980s signage as that looks new to me . I remember the old original plain black lettering signage from the 70s although on this particular line that was brand new then of course . I remember I used to love getting into the station at Old Street on the journey home as that had a small parade of shops there with a record store which I used to go into every Friday on payday and buy myself a new LP as a treat . Either Leonard Cohen or Queen usually . Happy memories , thanks again for jogging them .
To add to my previous comment about Essex Road, there are no indicator boards on the platform so you just have to wait and hope for the best which was slightly unnerving. The only way to tell that a train is coming is feeling the moving air that got stronger as a train was approaching. Quite a relief.
John doesn't look remarkably different from George Anderson Jnr. - Shakatak's bassist from the mid 1980's - present. That's my age given away in one hit. I was born a lot earlier than 1979.
I used to take a ride on this line between Moorgate and Finsbury Park whenever I was on a spotting trip in London during the 1980's. It had the same eerie atmosphere back then as well. Essex Road Station in particular was notable for being desolate at all times. I can't remember where exactly but the 313 EMUs switch from 750v DC third rail to 25kV AC overhead when the line comes to the surface.
A few points. Before and after Highbury and islington, the northbound line diverges from the original route to allow cross platform connections with the Victoria line. You can see the point where it diverges. At Finsbury Park, the original platforms are the southbound Piccadilly and Victoria lines. They diverted the southbound Piccadilly line for cross platform interchanges. If you travel south on the Piccadilly line, you can see the point where the line diverges from the original route as the tunnel for a short section widens.
Nearly ten years ago I needed to get from Waterloo to Archway, and being foolish as I was I consulted Google Maps for directions. Rather than suggesting I do the sensible thing and just take the northern line there it instead had me take a route that took me via this line. Was such a weird feeling finding this station but I loved it in a strange way. Really happy to see you made this video.
Excuse me? Hello? Did you get permission for that? LOL that one thing that haunts me from Moorgate, but this was a lovely video to watch, really did enjoyed this.
I used to ride on this line every time I took a spotting trip into London during the 1980's. I always found Old Street very eerie but somehow that made it charming in its own right.
I went on this 3 days ago (June 22). Much of the NSE branding has been covered up - except the far side signs at Essex Road. Also if you look at the top of the escalators down to the platforms at Moorgate, there is still a sign to the left pointing you to the Thameslink platforms.
When I was at uni I lived in potter's bar and would use this line everyday to get to Highbury! Glad they've finally replaced the trains as it felt like they were going to break every journey!
I finally got around to travelling on this line a couple of years ago. There is now a plan for this to become part of London Overground by 2022 www.ianvisits.co.uk/blog/2020/06/23/tfl-step-closer-to-takeover-of-great-northern-line-into-moorgate/
@@HeyItsAJOmega Yes, from what I can gather the Waterloo & City picked up its "drain" tag as it frequently used to flood, often forcing the service to close as it got too bad. The problems have largely been overcome now, but the rather unaffectionate nickname remains to this day in some circles!
I worked not far from Moorgate station at the time and remember the terrible crash. That morning I had taken the tube from Turnpike Lane into town and changed at King's Cross and got off at Bank. I had used Moorgate many time before.
This was fantastic. It felt like I was taking a personal tour of the train line. I had hoped to do one of the tours the Underground puts on every once in a while when I was in London but I never had the funds or time for it. I can't wait to see more videos in this series! Loved all of it!
4:30 even if you exclude the Island Line, the 313s were not the oldest EMUs in the UK. They are not even the oldest serving Finsbury Park. The rolling stock on the Piccadilly Line is older.
I can remember all these stocks when new...well, maybe not the Island Line ...it's also interesting that 313's are currently still running on the South Coast to destinations including Portsmouth, and until recently, examples of their predecessors on the Northern City Line were still running just across the Solent...
Nice video! :-) I knew about the Northern City Line before, but this video gave me much more information about it. I like the editing style of the video and it reminds me of Geoff Marshall. I hope you don't copy his style at all ;-) I've also tried to do this kind of videos (but in my hometown in Germany and in German) and I know, that the editing may be hard. I hope you keep going with this series. Good luck and have fun with filming and editing the videos for this series, Tobi
@@HeyItsAJOmega The only things that were missing was more cutaway shots (i.e. every time you tell us what can be seen over your shoulder or "over there" - show us, don't just tell us!) and a few maps or historical photos when you're explaining how things fit in to the bigger picture, or used to. But a great tribute to his style nonetheless!
Great video! It reminds me of the Neibourhood Watch area signs that are still being produced on new materials, but retaining the 1970's artwork, including a now anachronistic man with Mutton Chops (maybe Mutton Chops are a Hipster Thing now, but I know these signs amused me in the 00's with their not updated imagery, as I remember seeing them as a kid in the 80's).
I was just thinking the same. I was in Liverpool 5 years ago and remembered that there is a good little subway line that runs trains very similar to the ones in this video. 👍
Good video. Also nice to know that the Northern City Line passenger counts have increased significantly over the last decade. Q: with all of the new development in the area, do you think Poole Street would be a good location to build an infill station?
Yes, there's a weekend service on the Finsbury Park to Moorgate section again for the first time in many years...since around 1987 they were all diverted into King's Cross at weekends..
Retirement !, is that a euphanism for being shoved in a hellish siding and brutally, torched and cut up...seriousl, very much enjoyed this video..I detested the 313s when they were new and hated NSE livery..bring back the 4SUBs and 2BILs, oh and 4CORs..6PANs and 5BELs, etc, etc
I only know two other places 313s run.On the West Coastway line and the Rast Coastway line Also,I think these are now the oldest EMUs in Britan as the 483s/1938 stock has been replaced
I visited Essex Road today. I was the only person on the platform going South to Moorgate. The NSE station signs are still there on the opposite side of the platforms. It's the most eerie and sinister station I've ever visited. Old Street looked much the same. To add to the odd feeling, the train came in on the same platform as the train in the Moorgate tube disaster. To get to the Northern Line, it feels like a secret passage with a spiral staircase. A person on the platform was a bit shocked when I appeared from out of nowhere! All that said, Essex Road appealed because of the atmosphere it exudes. Nowhere like it!
Is it just me or are the new class 717s the ugliest trains ever? I don't like mainline trains without yellow fronts and these just look like they haven't gone into the paint shop yet!
about 2 and a half coaches length, then bricked up. I remember the Northern line train that tried to make it but didn't. The third coach was half in the tunnel, but had ridden up the second, killing some people. That's how I know it's bricked up 2 ½ coach lengths into it. Can still picture the photo from the news in my mind.
Oh yes! I believe Jon mentioned this in the original filming but maybe it got edited out. But that's correct, the old centre power rail is still in situ!
@@HeyItsAJOmega So it used to be 4th-rail, and then switched to 3rd-rail, but the trains must change to pantograph somewhere in mid-flight if it continues beyond Finsbury Park?
That was a good video, this line is very creepy, but i like it. It is great to see NR modernise it though, but those NSE signs should be saved, as with the sign that has North London Link on it, another throwback to the 70s.
Agreed! I think a lot of the NSE signs are covered over for the moment - if you look closely on the new signs, you can see the old NSE lettering and that underneath. So hopefully one day those NSE signs can be saved. :)
Took this line when i went Arsenal like a year back cause basically no other line was running Drayton Park isnt open on match day also i think they have replaced the trains now with a modified Thameslink train
They have, yes, the new 717 trains are in service. And it feels so weird that Drayton Park is so close to the Emirates but you can't actually get there on matchdays as it's so small!
The whole Thameslink core from Blackfriars to St Pancras is basically a National Rail tube, it even has automatic train operation and doors that open regardless of whether you press the buttons
So pleased I got the personal tour version of this video! I love a creepy, quiet underground space. Fantastic video. I'm going to share it with all my friends. :D (Also, you really bring out my inner train nerd, AJ.)
@@HeyItsAJOmega For sure!! At the time the TOC was WAGN (Welwyn And Great Northern?) which did sound like Wagon on the automated announcements. 313's were painted in kind of Battleship Grey I think.
@@gazbrucia1654 West Anglia Great Northern - included the Cambridge/Hertford East/Enfield/Liverpool St lines as well as Letchworth/Stevenage/WGC/Hertford North lines.
It's actually the Island Line we're talking about! It was meant semi-jokingly, as the Island Line actually used refurbished old Tube trains rather than full standard gauge EMUs. And since this video has been made, both the Class 313s seen in this video *and* those old Tube trains on the Island Line have been retired!
Superb video! Can't wait for hopefully many more in the series especially if they're all as good as this one! Got notification set! Great work, well done sir!
I used it for five years until the Moorgate train crash - I ran for that train and missed it luckily - I got the next one and sat in darkness for nearly two hours before we had to walk back through the train and the tunnels to Moorgate and walked past the crash site !!!! It was one of the most horrible experiences of my life !!!!!
I hope someone preserves a class 313. They served the capitol and surrounding towns well for over 40 years. One of BRs less glamorous, but certainly most durable and efficient designs.
There's a nice original BR liveried unit currently plying the Coastway routes out of Brighton mostly to Seaford. Its doors are the wrong colour though and no BR double arrows but nice to see. Glad they replaced the old seats!
Prefer 317s, at least they have toilets lol
Grimpeurs du Sud on pc?
I wouldn't miss them. They were noisy, dirty, uncomfortable and draughty. And why the Thameslink ones all smell faintly of human shit?
Great Northern treated them like shit but southern treated them ok they look like a train built in the 1990s (313)
Thanks for this, i love the secret history of this line.
I will forever love our jamming to the Drayton Park PA
Absolute highlight of the video xD
Drayton Park station should be upgraded/rebuilt to help with the crowds at Arsenal FCs Emirates Stadium.
Alleviate the pressure on Holloway Road/Arsenal/Finsbury Park/Highbury & Islington.
Awesome video.
Thank you!!
Is LU underground zone oyster valid on this line ?
I would like to visit it.
I believe it is. I used to use this line in the 1980's using a standard LT off peak travel card.
yeah it's part of the oyster network. so no issues there
Subscribed. 👍
RIP the Class 313 on Northern City Line
The class 313s are still running on the Coastway services heading east and west on stopping services from Brighton if, for some inexplicable reason, you still want to ride on them 😎
I accidentally got on a train at Moorgate from this hidden platform two years ago and it felt like I shouldn't have been there... the platform was wrong, the stock was different, and the signage wasn't the same as everywhere else. Moorgate is an odd station in general; it's harbouring all sorts of bits from the past.
Including an extension to Lothbury that was started but wasn't finished, if you look into the stub tunnel on platform 8 the tunnelling shield got stuck and so they left it there. This would have been such a short extension from Moorgate that when the front end a full length train (6 cars) reached the start of the platforms at the new Lothbury terminus the rear would still have been in Moorgate station. Also while it was a Tube line trains requiring heavy maintenance were hauled by battery locomotives from Drayton Park to East Finchley depot. Fair enough, you might think.
No. This meant hauling them over BR tracks along the (non electrified) former Northern heights line through the tunnels at Highgate High Level, which was meant to become a part of the extended Northern Line to Bushey Heath had WW2 not happened. The other end of the tunnel at Highgate marks the boundary of the depot.
The garbage bag fluttering in the wind...reminds me of someone.
Heehee, might have been a little nod to a big inspiration for this show 😊
Same level of quality. Well done
@@mikegillard7283 Very big complement, thank you :)
AJCantFail You're very welcome, already seen the next. Keep it going.
Theresa May?
awesome video ! you should talk with the people from the Londonist for a feature or something. great work !
Haha! Thank you very much 😊
Just to correct you, the ramps built to take track did have track on them, pre British Rail days. If stock on the NCL needed to go to Acton works, then the stock would be hauled by one, or two LU battery locos to Finsbury Park via the ramps. The ensemble would then work to Kings Cross and go onto the widened lines, via York Road. There used to be a connection between the widened lines and the Met at Farringdon; the ensemble would use that to transfer from BR to LUL, and then go on the circle, and district, round to Acton Works. When the NCL was transferred to BR in 1975, ready for services running in October 1976, the Farringdon connection was obsolete, and was removed at the time York Road closed, in 1978.
I used to pick up a Great Northern Line train at Highbury and Islington out of rush hour and it really was odd walking for ever down passingways then sitting on an empty badly lit platform with the only noise coming from the tunnels as a train approached. You could hear and feel them coming for a long time - they fit snugly in the tunnels! Then a dirty graffiti covered old train came in. Also nearly empty. Thankfully quite well lit.
The lighting on the platform has improved since then, and the new trains have taken away a lot of that charm (if that is the word).
THIS IS SO FREAKING COOL! I stumbled upon this line a few years ago and was oddly charmed by it, but had no idea about the history or anything. Its really quaint and charming 😊
It really is! I first found it one night when I was at Old Street station coming home from a press event. I legit couldnt believe what Id found!
When I was younger me & my mum would go to finsbury Park to get afro Caribbean hair products and using the NCL was the quickest way to get there from Liverpool St.
Used to call it British Rail Underground when I was younger
@@JRJUK That's actually a good way of referring to it, it's the British Rail Underground line all in one :P
stumbled across this channel 7 days ago and i am hooked the quality is outstanding along with the brilliant voiceover and music and it even has its own little references like everything is related to the northen city line :D
you should defiantly collab with geoff marshall
Thank you!! That's very kind of you. And that would be amazing :)
I love this little line. In my eighties London spotting trips I always rode this from Moorgate to Finsbury Park for its unique atmosphere. Switching from 750 VDC to 25kVAC at Drayton Park was fascinating. This video encapsulates the atmosphere very well indeed. Old Street was my favourite stop. Not quite as eerie as Essex Road but still deserted enough to have an atmosphere all of its own.
I travelled on the Northern City line in the 1950s and it was weird. There was almost nobody around in off peak time. The stations were really dimly lit and had these odd nameboards with red diamonds instead of the usual LT roundels. I think they went back to the time of the Metropolitan ownership. Also the tunnels were larger than normal Tube ones because of an early plan to run trains through from the Great Northern which of course happened years later. They used Tube sized trains then and there was an eerie hollow rumble for ages before the train arrived. It was so spooky you could imagine a thriller being set there - in black and white.
I remember when the 313 units were brand new!
Sadly .. so do I :)
@@julianlockwood3040 And me 😢
I spend a year living in Newington Green a d working in Hertford just as the trains started to change. Those old trains were the worst I rode anywhere in the UK
Very good video. And the Great Northern Class 717s are now in service as these have replaced the Class 313 on the Moorgate Line and Hertford Loop Line. Why not do a video of the Class 717 and also do a video of London Overground Class 710s.
Yes, this is out of date, I live on Gordon Hill, and regularly use this line from Gordon Hill station (I stopped when convd -19 broke out)
Having been born in the early 60's, I was fortunate enough to get to ride the Northern City Line (or Northern Line Highbury Branch as it was then) in the year or two before the handover to the National Rail Network (or BR!!) a couple of times, once in each direction between Drayton Park and Moorgate. Off--peak, it was just as quiet and eerie, but the trains were Northern Line red 1938 Stock, and all the platforms were decked out in LT roundel signage. The tiles on the sub surface station platforms when you filmed have only been there since the mid-80's, in 1975 they were all done out in these yellowy orange tiles, which were just covered over by the 80's ones. I see they've now given way to a third generation of tiles in the National Rail era for the line, a 3rd attempt to displace the spooky atmosphere...to not much avail though!!
I used to commute on this line in the early 90s from Alexandra Palace to Moorgate. The charming thing I liked was that Moorgate had platform guards. When the train was ready to leave, the guard would give two long blasts on his pocket whistle and shout "ALL ABOARD!" down the platform; just like a 'real' mainline terminus.
Haha! Excellent, I like the sound of it :)
I’ve used this line for years from Palmers Green and believe me the old trains were filthy rattlers by the end. The only quirk you missed was the train switching from overhead power to track at Drayton Park with a familiar clunk.
Yeah, that was interesting to watch - especially when the lights in the carriages dimmed for a moment when the power switched over!
Stumbled across this line absolutely plastered at 11am when I was going to Ally Pally - I ended up in black out and genuinely thought I’d imagined it the next day. I love everything about it.
I used to find the platforms quite scary because I always felt like I'd walked the wrong way and ended up in an abandoned bit of tunnel.
That's the line decorated! Prior to sectorisation, all BR signs were black lettering on a slightly off-white background. And that was it - no symbols, no arrows, nothing - Just the plain dull red or navy painted tunnel skirting and the bar of black-lettering on the plainest background imaginable. I've a feel the entrance to Essex Road may have had some even earlier signage somewhere - two-tone turquoise mosaic tiles or something of that ilk - it felt like it belonged in another city, never mind railway. In other words - if you think it's bad now, it used to be a whole lot worse...!! Coupled to that, there were no Oystercards, no Travelcards, no London rail-rover tickets - just expensive single and return fares on what was basically a token service on a token railway fragment that had every reason to feel like a morgue, what with the Moorgate disaster still fresh in everyone's memory. It should be said, most of the Southern suburban network looked and felt much the same during the working day for much the same reasons - no to mention the various fragments that became known as the North London Line; and the handful of peak time services running in and out of the glorious dereliction that was Broad Street station. If anything - Dalston Junction was even worse!! From 1977 it was of course part of a national railway system that still hoped to close much of its remaining network - having lost two-thirds of it just ten years before. This was the era of sparse, uneven handfuls of trains running over main lines that were just crying out for even a regular service, never mind a frequent one; hence the most interesting thing to those of us visiting London from elsewhere in the UK was that these commuter railways had any sort of daytime service at all! It's funny to hear you talk of the 1980s as if they were in some past era: what you're looking at is yesterday's future!
It was certainly a contrast going from the Victoria Line platforms to the BR ones. A real gem in the early 80s was the enamel Victoria Line route map that had Fleet Line as the interchange at Green Park!
I've lived in London mostof my life and I didn't know about this line or it's history (apart from Moorgate of course). Thank you
I have travelled on this line from Moorgate to Drayton Park when it was LT Northern Line. This was when you could travel in BR diesel hauled (Class 31) suburban stock (or Cravens/Class 101 DMU) to Moorgate via Kings Cross. I used to commute on this service from Brookmans Park. The Northern Line extension was then shut for a few years as you say in the late 1970’s. This was to allow the LT track to be lowered to allow Class 313 EMU’s to run through LT tunnels and the creation of the link to be between Drayton Park and Finsbury Park. The Class 313’s that ran on the line were unique at the time because they ran on both 25K overhead and 450V LT third rail power (the return being through the tracks). This was the time that the Great Northern line was electrified.
There's still the crumbling 'Great Northern Electrics' signage tucked away above the Arsenal Shop outside Finsbury Park Stn as a legacy to this line's past too.........
Oh great spot! I'll see if I can spot it next time I pass through :)
My favourite story from the Northern City Line is the one from 2013 about the hole in the northbound tunnel 400m after Old Street Station.
A building contractor was erecting a new building which was much taller than the previous building on that site. Taller buildings require deeper foundations.
The developer had checked with London Underground and Crossrail whether there were any tunnels nearby. If the tunnel was still part of the Northern Line this would have triggered alarm bells. No-one thought to ask Network Rail whether they had a tunnel locally.
The first four bore holes for the foundations went smoothly but the fifth one was a problem. The augur bit hit something hard about 13 meters down and then, when it drilled through this, suddenly there was no resistance.
Meanwhile, down below just before the augur broke through, a train went underneath. The driver noticed water gushing from the ceiling of the tunnel and thought it was odd as this section is normally dry. This was reported to the signaller who advised the next (empty) train to proceed along the tunnel slowly and check for problems.
The driver of this second train discovered big pieces of the augur bit, gravel and other debris blocking the track. There was also a cascade of groundwater as the drill had passed through a water/gravel layer on the way down.
If the first driver had not reported the water it could have been dangerous.
The mess took a week to clear up and the architect had to re-design the foundations.
For a more complete view see the official report:
www.gov.uk/raib-reports/penetration-and-obstruction-of-a-tunnel-between-old-street-and-essex-road-stations-london
Bloody hell! When the planning permission was being assessed that should have been on the checklist: any tunnels/pipes below the site.
I think a similar thing happened when they were digging the foundations for the "Eurostar" curve at Battersea, they approached Thames Water who said "nope nothing of ours here" without checking about the new London Water Ring Main, I think it was breached and filled with several tons of pressurised concrete!
Wonder if that was a wahmenz architect?
Great vid guys. I left school and joined the Railways as an Apprentice Electrical and Mechanical Fitter working on the 313 EMUs at Hornsy back in 1981. I left the Railways in 1987 to take up a career in telecommunications. This brought back some fond memories and a bit sad to hear that the 313s have now been replaced. Fitting to have 313064 on film, if I remember correctly Hornsy had 313001 through to 313064. Remember also doing a tunnel inspection as part of my training, which was bloody creepy.
I remember as a teenager travelling on the DMU's that ran into King's X from Herford North, then a few years later as an apprentice draughstman working in Tottenham Court Road, I commuted on the shiny new EMU's changing at Highbury & Islington for the Victoria line, fond memories? You've got to be kidding, 90% of my apprentice pittance went on my annual season ticket!
Loved watching this thank you , brings back so many memories especially that gap between platforms at Highbury & Islington where you can jump off the Victoria line train going to Kings Cross and board this train if you want to get off at Old Street etc thus saving yourself one stop plus the complicated changeover . That’s exactly what I used to do back in 76/77 when I got my first job working in Old Street after leaving school . As the Victoria line train came in you would look through the gap and very often see the Moorgate bound train coming in at the same time . Then you would hop off quickly to catch it before the doors shut and it pulled away . Sometimes you would still get off if it wasn’t there as often you would just see it pull in seconds after you had stayed on and left on the Kings Cross train . Then sometimes you would be disappointed as it had already gone and you would have to wait up to 5 or 6 minutes for the next one . During this time you might see another two trains pull in behind the one you had just got off as the Victoria line trains were more frequent , but still it was worth waiting to save that extra stop plus the long haul changeover at Kings Cross. I must admit it was pretty deserted even back then when I used it although it had only just opened in 1976 . The platform , seats and tunnel was brand spanking new and everything sparkling clean , I remember it so well as it felt so unusual at the time . I presume it got busier after I stopped using it in the late summer of 77. Happy memories for me though . One thing I was disappointed in , I hate to say it was seeing the 1980s signage as that looks new to me . I remember the old original plain black lettering signage from the 70s although on this particular line that was brand new then of course . I remember I used to love getting into the station at Old Street on the journey home as that had a small parade of shops there with a record store which I used to go into every Friday on payday and buy myself a new LP as a treat . Either Leonard Cohen or Queen usually . Happy memories , thanks again for jogging them .
oh heck!!! The last time I went down there, the NSE signs were NEW!
They removed the NSE signage & replaced it (why Great Northern)
To add to my previous comment about Essex Road, there are no indicator boards on the platform so you just have to wait and hope for the best which was slightly unnerving. The only way to tell that a train is coming is feeling the moving air that got stronger as a train was approaching. Quite a relief.
Really interesting! I love the Underground (probably because I don't live in London) and the whole thing fascinates me. Love stuff like this video.
John doesn't look remarkably different from George Anderson Jnr. - Shakatak's bassist from the mid 1980's - present. That's my age given away in one hit. I was born a lot earlier than 1979.
3:22 cheeky blowing bin Geofference.. or is it? I don't know who came first!
Haha! He definitely came before me xD and Geofference is genius!
I used to take a ride on this line between Moorgate and Finsbury Park whenever I was on a spotting trip in London during the 1980's. It had the same eerie atmosphere back then as well. Essex Road Station in particular was notable for being desolate at all times. I can't remember where exactly but the 313 EMUs switch from 750v DC third rail to 25kV AC overhead when the line comes to the surface.
The changeover is at Drayton Park I think.
@@barrydwyerthanks for clarity. That sounds exactly correct. I loved that little section from Moorgate to Finsbury Park.
A few points. Before and after Highbury and islington, the northbound line diverges from the original route to allow cross platform connections with the Victoria line. You can see the point where it diverges.
At Finsbury Park, the original platforms are the southbound Piccadilly and Victoria lines. They diverted the southbound Piccadilly line for cross platform interchanges. If you travel south on the Piccadilly line, you can see the point where the line diverges from the original route as the tunnel for a short section widens.
Wow I had no idea this line even existed!
Nearly ten years ago I needed to get from Waterloo to Archway, and being foolish as I was I consulted Google Maps for directions. Rather than suggesting I do the sensible thing and just take the northern line there it instead had me take a route that took me via this line. Was such a weird feeling finding this station but I loved it in a strange way. Really happy to see you made this video.
Excuse me? Hello? Did you get permission for that? LOL that one thing that haunts me from Moorgate, but this was a lovely video to watch, really did enjoyed this.
Haha! Thank you! Yeah, you've gotta be careful sometimes to not catch staffers on a bad day xD
I have no context and this makes no sense. Everyone isn’t a tube nerd.
Not the oldest units.. Check Merseyrail out.. Have to do it quick though as the trains will be upgraded soon.
Been to the old street station station and felt the same, something very eery about it.
I used to ride on this line every time I took a spotting trip into London during the 1980's. I always found Old Street very eerie but somehow that made it charming in its own right.
Do they still have Tunnel Telephone wires? The Tube removed them a few years ago, but maybe this Network Rail line has not
Absolutely fascinating! I'd love to learn more about railways more than I do, so will be following this series that already is brilliant!
Ahhhh thank you!! Thats the exact aim of this series 😊
I went on this 3 days ago (June 22). Much of the NSE branding has been covered up - except the far side signs at Essex Road. Also if you look at the top of the escalators down to the platforms at Moorgate, there is still a sign to the left pointing you to the Thameslink platforms.
Oooh, I'll keep an eye out for that sign next time I'm at Moorgate!
Fyi merseyrail are running facelifted emus from the 1960s
When I was at uni I lived in potter's bar and would use this line everyday to get to Highbury! Glad they've finally replaced the trains as it felt like they were going to break every journey!
I finally got around to travelling on this line a couple of years ago. There is now a plan for this to become part of London Overground by 2022 www.ianvisits.co.uk/blog/2020/06/23/tfl-step-closer-to-takeover-of-great-northern-line-into-moorgate/
Oooh! That's exciting - the NCL back into London Transport operation once again!
The whole line smells damp doesn’t it. But I love it! Great job giving it a showcase
Haha! It actually kinda does! No idea why the W&C Line is nicknamed The Drain when this actually smells like one! xD And thank you!
@@HeyItsAJOmega Yes, from what I can gather the Waterloo & City picked up its "drain" tag as it frequently used to flood, often forcing the service to close as it got too bad. The problems have largely been overcome now, but the rather unaffectionate nickname remains to this day in some circles!
I worked not far from Moorgate station at the time and remember the terrible crash. That morning I had taken the tube from Turnpike Lane into town and changed at King's Cross and got off at Bank. I had used Moorgate many time before.
Woof. Wild how things work right? Must've been horrible to experience all of that in real time.
3:23 - Is that a shout-out to Geoff Marshall?
This was fantastic. It felt like I was taking a personal tour of the train line. I had hoped to do one of the tours the Underground puts on every once in a while when I was in London but I never had the funds or time for it. I can't wait to see more videos in this series! Loved all of it!
Awww thank you so much!! Yeah I've seen the Hidden London tours and I can't wait to try one of those for myself :)
4:30 even if you exclude the Island Line, the 313s were not the oldest EMUs in the UK. They are not even the oldest serving Finsbury Park. The rolling stock on the Piccadilly Line is older.
Should've been more specific - I meant the oldest EMUs operating on the National Rail network on the UK mainland. Close enough. xD
I can remember all these stocks when new...well, maybe not the Island Line ...it's also interesting that 313's are currently still running on the South Coast to destinations including Portsmouth, and until recently, examples of their predecessors on the Northern City Line were still running just across the Solent...
Nice video! :-)
I knew about the Northern City Line before, but this video gave me much more information about it.
I like the editing style of the video and it reminds me of Geoff Marshall. I hope you don't copy his style at all ;-)
I've also tried to do this kind of videos (but in my hometown in Germany and in German) and I know, that the editing may be hard. I hope you keep going with this series.
Good luck and have fun with filming and editing the videos for this series,
Tobi
Thank you so much! Yeah, Geoff is basically the inspiration for this series, and one of my favourite RUclipsrs 😊
@@HeyItsAJOmega The only things that were missing was more cutaway shots (i.e. every time you tell us what can be seen over your shoulder or "over there" - show us, don't just tell us!) and a few maps or historical photos when you're explaining how things fit in to the bigger picture, or used to. But a great tribute to his style nonetheless!
Great video! It reminds me of the Neibourhood Watch area signs that are still being produced on new materials, but retaining the 1970's artwork, including a now anachronistic man with Mutton Chops (maybe Mutton Chops are a Hipster Thing now, but I know these signs amused me in the 00's with their not updated imagery, as I remember seeing them as a kid in the 80's).
Thanks guys, very interesting and nice to see a couple of younger people still taking an interest.
Another fine piece of videography AJ, will you be covering the other 'oddity' line
from Romford to Upminster via Emerson Park
These trains look like Merseyrail lol
I was just thinking the same. I was in Liverpool 5 years ago and remembered that there is a good little subway line that runs trains very similar to the ones in this video. 👍
Good video. Also nice to know that the Northern City Line passenger counts have increased significantly over the last decade. Q: with all of the new development in the area, do you think Poole Street would be a good location to build an infill station?
Yes, there's a weekend service on the Finsbury Park to Moorgate section again for the first time in many years...since around 1987 they were all diverted into King's Cross at weekends..
Retirement !, is that a euphanism for being shoved in a hellish siding and brutally, torched and cut up...seriousl, very much enjoyed this video..I detested the 313s when they were new and hated NSE livery..bring back the 4SUBs and 2BILs, oh and 4CORs..6PANs and 5BELs, etc, etc
I only know two other places 313s run.On the West Coastway line and the Rast Coastway line Also,I think these are now the oldest EMUs in Britan as the 483s/1938 stock has been replaced
I visited Essex Road today. I was the only person on the platform going South to Moorgate. The NSE station signs are still there on the opposite side of the platforms. It's the most eerie and sinister station I've ever visited. Old Street looked much the same. To add to the odd feeling, the train came in on the same platform as the train in the Moorgate tube disaster. To get to the Northern Line, it feels like a secret passage with a spiral staircase. A person on the platform was a bit shocked when I appeared from out of nowhere!
All that said, Essex Road appealed because of the atmosphere it exudes. Nowhere like it!
Missed the Greathead Tunnelling Shield still in situ visible from Platform 10 at Moorgate!
I love Old Street. I was a spotter in the early eighties. Wonderful line. My go to
Didn't its connection at Highbury & Islington count as a National Rail interchange?
Or certainly when it was the Broad Street line passing through.
Is it just me or are the new class 717s the ugliest trains ever? I don't like mainline trains without yellow fronts and these just look like they haven't gone into the paint shop yet!
Superb work sir! Really engaging and fun content!
Even the Moorgate terminal was ethereal and almost dream like outside of rush hour.
It was not an accident, remains cause unknown; as we were taught when education meant something, an incident.
You forgot the tunnels continue from Moorgate
about 2 and a half coaches length, then bricked up. I remember the Northern line train that tried to make it but didn't. The third coach was half in the tunnel, but had ridden up the second, killing some people. That's how I know it's bricked up 2 ½ coach lengths into it. Can still picture the photo from the news in my mind.
Now we have a channel that's a mix of team bombersports & Geoff Marshal.
Team GeoffSports? xD
Too much talking heads.... and nothing on the old trains.
Great video! Also love the music - reminded me of The Crying Game lol.
You missed out that the centre juice rail is still extant on the track bed as well!
Oh yes! I believe Jon mentioned this in the original filming but maybe it got edited out. But that's correct, the old centre power rail is still in situ!
@@HeyItsAJOmega So it used to be 4th-rail, and then switched to 3rd-rail, but the trains must change to pantograph somewhere in mid-flight if it continues beyond Finsbury Park?
@@georgebattrick2365 Yes they change power system at Drayton Park. You can hear it happening. I guess they got off the train so did not realise it.
Loved it! I'm lucky to have been a NCL regular over the 1990s and 2000s.
5:48 What about City Thameslink?!
These two presenters are great.
Thank you! :)
Awesome, awesome, awesome. Did I mention this is awesome?
Great and informative video. The amount of times I’ve been to London and never visited this line is insane. Thanks for sharing =)
Thank you!! It's such a hidden gem of a line :)
That was a good video, this line is very creepy, but i like it. It is great to see NR modernise it though, but those NSE signs should be saved, as with the sign that has North London Link on it, another throwback to the 70s.
Agreed! I think a lot of the NSE signs are covered over for the moment - if you look closely on the new signs, you can see the old NSE lettering and that underneath. So hopefully one day those NSE signs can be saved. :)
@@HeyItsAJOmega Wait, the Network SouthEast Signs are still present on platform level? I forgot where I left that screwdriver kit-
Took this line when i went Arsenal like a year back cause basically no other line was running Drayton Park isnt open on match day also i think they have replaced the trains now with a modified Thameslink train
They have, yes, the new 717 trains are in service. And it feels so weird that Drayton Park is so close to the Emirates but you can't actually get there on matchdays as it's so small!
5:52 City Thameslink?
Why is this line so less used?
It was extremely busy in the rush hours pre-pandemic!
The island line has trains from 1980
Isn't City Thameslink also a sub-surface national rail line in London that isn't a Tube station? Great video and thanks for posting it.
The whole Thameslink core from Blackfriars to St Pancras is basically a National Rail tube, it even has automatic train operation and doors that open regardless of whether you press the buttons
Only sub surface not shared with an underground station? How about City Thameslink?
Deep-level sub surface station! Gotta be specific with these things. xD
The oldest emu now is the 1972 stock
Old street is not a roundabout anymore lol
So pleased I got the personal tour version of this video! I love a creepy, quiet underground space. Fantastic video. I'm going to share it with all my friends. :D (Also, you really bring out my inner train nerd, AJ.)
Yay! Mission accomplished, I want EVERYONE TO BE TRAIN NERDS *evil laugh*
Wow. I lived in WGC in late 90s it looked knackered then!!!
Haha! So it's been a while since it was shown any love?
@@HeyItsAJOmega For sure!! At the time the TOC was WAGN (Welwyn And Great Northern?) which did sound like Wagon on the automated announcements. 313's were painted in kind of Battleship Grey I think.
@@gazbrucia1654 West Anglia Great Northern - included the Cambridge/Hertford East/Enfield/Liverpool St lines as well as Letchworth/Stevenage/WGC/Hertford North lines.
Such a shame that the signs, the trains, the tiles are all gone
At 4 minutes 26 , What is the Iron Line and why doesn't it count? Please enlighten me Thanks
It's actually the Island Line we're talking about! It was meant semi-jokingly, as the Island Line actually used refurbished old Tube trains rather than full standard gauge EMUs. And since this video has been made, both the Class 313s seen in this video *and* those old Tube trains on the Island Line have been retired!
Such a shame that after all this time the NSE is being removed and the 313s are going
Also the clip at 10:16 is being played in reverse
I was wondering if anyone would spot the reverse clip. ;)
Only just been recommended your videos. Some great content
Superb video! Can't wait for hopefully many more in the series especially if they're all as good as this one! Got notification set! Great work, well done sir!
Thank you! Hope they can all live up to this standard :D