One cable, two SSDs: the first Pi 5 PoE HAT
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- Опубликовано: 2 июн 2024
- Waveshare beat Raspberry Pi to the punch with a PoE HAT capable of providing enough power to the Pi for overclocking, SSDs, USB, and more.
This video explores the HAT, installation, case fitment, and how well it works.
Mentioned in this video:
- Waveshare PoE HAT (F) for Pi 5: amzn.to/48ln4Q9
- Pimoroni NVMe BASE for Pi 5: shop.pimoroni.com/products/nv...
- Kioxia XG6 NVMe SSD: amzn.to/484IbpB
- PoE Injector: amzn.to/3wcQ1jv
- Guide for Cloning microSD to NVMe SSD: www.jeffgeerling.com/blog/202...
Support me on Patreon: / geerlingguy
Sponsor me on GitHub: github.com/sponsors/geerlingguy
Merch: redshirtjeff.com
2nd Channel: / geerlingengineering
Contents:
00:00 - What is Power over Ethernet?
00:47 - The only PoE HAT for Pi 5 (so far)
02:04 - Assembly - heatsink, fan, case compatibility
03:42 - First boot and fan performance
04:42 - One NVMe SSD
06:13 - Managed PoE+ Switch power draw
06:57 - Two NVMe SSDs (USB + PCIe)
08:17 - Other HATs? 
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Drawer labeled “Drawer”.
You kill me Jeff. Now it needs a label pointing to the label, that says “Drawer Label”.
Hehe
To quote "Did you know *everything* in his apartment has a label on it. Including his label-maker which has a label that says 'label-maker'. ... "
It reminds me of one of the first King of the Hill episodes where Hank, after catching bobby smoking, ends up addicted again himself. During withdraws he starts labeling everything in his office, including labeling the label maker.
@@TheEulerID If your first label isn't "cat" or "dog" or "label maker" what are you even doing?! Oh yeah "spouse" works too.
I bought the Pi 5 + PoE HAT + NVMe Base thanks to this video, cheers! The lack of a proper enclosure inspired me to learn to design a custom case for it in Fusion 360. It took a lot longer than I expected going in (3 days 😅) and I'm at version 68 now, but I learned a ton and I'm really happy with the result!
My goals were:
- A perfect fit for the Pi 5 + Waveshare PoE HAT + Pimoroni NVMe base stack
- No taking apart the stack to mount it, just slot it right in and have the case hold it in place
- 75x75mm VESA mounting points so you can mount the case anywhere: a TV, a monitor, wall, etc.
- Plenty of ventilation
- Hexagons. Because they're the bestagons.
I've also created a 75x75mm VESA to DIN rail adapter to mount the Pi sideways, sized to perfectly center this case on the rail to take up the least amount of horizontal space in my utility closet. I plan on eventually getting another two of these Pi stacks to put on the rail next to the first so I can have my own PoE powered, SSD-booted cluster to run Kubernetes on 😄
I've published the 3D model for the custom case for free on MakerWorld, and it's also CC-BY-NC-SA licensed so feel free to remix it!
makerworld.com/en/models/413567#profileId-315577
The print profile I used is included, so if you have a Bambu Lab printer you can print one with a couple clicks.
I recommend PETG in general (sturdier than PLA) and I used white Creality PETG myself at 0.2mm layer height.
If you don't have a 3D printer, there are plenty of online services and local enthusiasts who could print it for you. Check out /r/3Dprintmything.
This was my most complex design to date, so I'm looking forward to any feedback or remixes from the community!
Full disclosure: the model is completely free to download, but the download count stats do support me through MakerWorld's points system.
Honestly, "black magic" is a pretty apt description of PoE. The latest PoE++ specification supports pushing up to 99.9W down 100m of Cat5 cable, which means that even after all the transport losses, the end device still can negotiate to draw up to 71.3W. Additionally, the PoE++ specification supports up to 10GBASE-T speeds, i.e., 10 Gbps Ethernet. If that's not black magic, I don't know what is. (Well, except USB-PD now supporting up to 240W. That's just nuts.)
I was always curious about a PoE pi's power draw. The fact that it idles at 4 watts and stays below 10 watts under load is mind blowing. 15 years ago we were running 100W light bulbs in every lamp in the house. Now we can power 10 mini computers with less power consumption. I feel a lot better about having half a dozen pi running all the time doing various home automation and network storage.
Yeah not only that, but 10 Watts for a computer that's pumping through more data than an old 300W PC from just 10-15 years ago! Efficiency is wild these days.
anyway, we'll all come to the Framework... or to a mini PC... when the requests grow. Mini PCs can run on 8 watts and up to 65 watts... perhaps it is worth using a type-c cable somewhere...? poe+ - only 30
@@Empty_Vima There's POE++ with 75W, but yeah. Pi 5 should abide USB-PD standards and not just get everything from 5V
I don't want a PoE hat. I want a hat that says I subbed to Jeff Geerling.
Same
@@the_block-99 he #red your mind
Red shirt Jeff watches over you
Sounds like someone wants a free hat. Flattery will get you everywhere.😅
Why not both?
I have a PI cluster with 4xPI5-8gb with these PoE hats. I’m very satisfied with it.
Very nice! Though I'm sure some people will be amazed you found four Pi 5s!
(I have noticed more availability this month so far, though... at least one place in the US has stock any given day)
@@JeffGeerling It took me a few months, but then I had four. I saw the PoE hats a few weeks ago. Now I have to decide whether to use Docker Swarm or K3S for my cluster. I was inspired by your PI cluster videos but then the PI's were no longer available. But now the party can begin!
As of this moment Digikey has thousands of them in stock. @@JeffGeerling
@@JeffGeerling in the UK we can order an unlimited amount pretty much. I checked and I can buy 577 8GB models
I currently have 8 in my basket considering if I *really* need them, as I already have 8 Pi 4s
Not sure why my comment was deleted, maybe I was a bit ambiguous. I was just saying that in the UK when considering buying 8Ø 8GB Pi 5s (I didn't buy any as I already have 8× Pi 4s) I checked to see how many I could buy and I was able to buy 577. There didn't seem to be any limits per person
I have a pi4 4GB on POE, and its powering a 5TB 2.5" spinning metal hard drive for "offsite" backups (the woodshed is at least out of the house) Works great.
PoE machines are getting really capable nowadays. There was even a PoE mini-PC with the Intel N100 chip from Minisforum at CES that's supposed to be releasing soon.
I run a cluster of 8 raspberry pi4s using Poe in a cluster rack. My favourite twist is I used pxe boot off Synology. It means all the pi does in provide computer and ram. I manage the pxe configs and Poe power cycles using some neat scripts so I can assign hosts to slots and reboot etc
very nice, what do you run/use on the cluster? kubernetes?
@@ikaros4203 a couple of pi holes, asterisk pbx running about 30 Cisco phones, home assistant, homebridge and some cctv relays.
Cool.
@@ikaros4203 Generally on a Pi cluster, you run MicroK8s or K3s.
I was thinking about buying this same exact hat setup. Now I’m convinced. That tip about upping USB wattage is ace. Thank you!
I'm glad to see the OpenSUSE shirt!
yeah.. I'm distracted by openSuSE shirt.. 😅
This is exactly the setup I was looking for.
Fantastic video, I've been waiting for the official PoE hat forever
I want that nvme hat. Not for the cable, but because it has no LEDs. I hate the LEDs, blinking, all night. Waveshare's poe hats are the best, and historically have been the best.
Thanks Jeff, nice to see the PoE in play, will consider!
Thank you for the video. This is something I was looking for.
It's nice that they added a 12V header in case you want to run a 12V fan (like a noctua) instead of a 5V one.
Thanks, Jeff! My pi5 hat will arrive in a few days, can't wait!
Wonderful! Been looking for a Pi 5 POE solution, and validation that it works -- ordered 2, and they will arrive when I have some time to work with them. Thank you for the very good evaluation!
Awesome work as always.
Fascinating and informative, as always - many thanks
Jeff, i don't have much input here cause my skills range from mildly below the level in your videos to significantly below lol
But, that said, I do wanna say, I just love seeing your messages in reply to people. Genuine, thoughtful responses and discussion. At a channel your size, that's almost unheard of! I hope it doesn't take too much out of you 💜 I'm sure it can be exhausting. But it's appreciated by at least one :]
The YT community is the main reason to make videos here. Missing out on that aspect of RUclips would be such a waste! Thanks :)
Oh, and those little feet are awesome, thanks Pimoroni, PineBerry, please add that to your kit .
Another great video, Jeff. I'm running my Pi5 with the Pimoroni NVME board, the cable is fiddly I found it easiest to connect it to the Nvme board then the Pi and then put the stand-offs in. But I do need the PoE Hat next
Been waiting for this the man delivers!!!
Looking forward to the comparison, especially the powerdraw.
Would be interesting to see both poe hats doing the same tasks and a comparison between the powerdraw.
If one had less powerdraw, it would mean it was more efficient and thus made less heat..
Although a great idea for running a Pi without using a power cube and routing a power cable, I find that PoE hats only run for so long before the fan starts getting noisy and eventually slows down or gives out entirely and I had to replace the fan every few months or so. I've never had a fan run longer than 4 months before having to replace it.
I ran my Pi's vertically and horizontally in my rack as well as in an acrylic case vertically mounted to the back of a monitor, but eventually experienced the same issue each time.
I ended up redoing most of my Pi's as either VMs and one or two on NUCs or other SFF computers.
I made my own POE pcb :)
Finally! I hope this fits in my rack mount
Gotta love waveshare!
I'm running a Pi 4 with a PoE hat as the main system for my All Sky Camera. All Sky Camera is a system designed to photograph the night sky, take pictures every 60 seconds, create time lapses, and more. I have a ZWO ASI178mc color CCD camera plugged into USB 3.0 port. Plus a temperature activated 12V dew heater (a custom printed circuit board with a bunch of resistors) to generate heat to melt ice and keep the acrylic dome clear, runs off the PoE hat 12V header that you pointed out in the video. Works great. Not sure I'll upgrade to a Pi 5 as this setup works fine. But yeah amazing to be able to do all of this from a Pi and PoE.
I know the first thing i thought about when i seen the title 😂🤦♂️
Good to see solid LRF support for the nVME Base!
I just got my 5 pi5 yesterday!!!! Time to play!!!
PoE! Thanks for the video. You covered everything I would have tested once I reached the "upgrade existing tech" portion of my home lab budget this year. Thank you!
I'm just now getting my Pi5 backorder. This looks great, but given the supply uncertainty for Pi5s I think I'm gonna be looking more at the Pi4 hats for my current projects.
For the usb3-nvme i'd go for a usb3-hub in between and grab power from another usb2.0 port for it. Helps those little contacts to less voltage drop and heat/load in the RPi
Needless to say, loving your OpenSUSE t jeff! :)
I run 4x Pi 4-4GB with Waveshare POE Hat (E) models. They're running into my Unifi UDM Pro SE. I control the POE ports from Home Assistant, and built out a control panel in the HA interface so I can toggle on the ports to boot up my RPis. This is the best solution I could find, since they can't do Wake on LAN.
Seeing the PoE usage really drives home how much power the pi5 uses. While it's technically still not much power usage that's a bigger number than I expected when I'm building an offgrid power system.
PoE hats are really the only way to run a Pi cluster. Otherwise, it's just a mess of cables everywhere. Glad to see 3rd parties taking care of this since Raspberry Pi is so slow to get things out.
Crazy that it's taking this long for an official PoE and M.2 HAT from Raspberry Pi themselves. What else are their hardware eng team working on thats causing the delay...
We're all waiting for the DVD logo to hit the exact corner
Rumor has it that April 2024-ish is when we might expect to see it. I’m curious how well it does for power efficiency (more for PoE power ranges than PoE+), especially compared to the other hats coming out now.
It's about the market..... POE hat is going to sell a few thousand is all...
When ur building a company to sell, a few thousand aint gonna add millions or billions to the sale price
Oh boy that title, references LOL
Another nice video!
Being an SBC weirdo is the best part! I have 3 GNSS PPS Pi NTP servers (2 Zero 2W and 1 Pi5B 4GB).
I would love to have a PoE HAT with SSD on one hat. Perfect for rack mount servers.
Thanks 👍
Thanks Jeff for another great video! Would you consider to do a review on Vivid Unit? It has PoE built-in, seems too good to be true for such a compact device.
A quick question can you remove the fan and plug in the three wire fan into the header on he pi then it would control the fan speed.
Yes; though I haven't found a good 4-pin to 3-pin or 4-pin adapter to go from the tiny Pi fan header yet.
Early gang! its a good day when Jeff has uploaded 😁
Thanks for the video as I was debating buying these over waiting for the RPi official ones. I cloned the exact previous setup you had. I grabbed the HP version of the same switch. I wonder if the NVMe HAT you used + the PoE hat will fit in the 3D printed rack.
Hey man, love your videos! Would you every do a 19" rack mount review for the pis? Looking for one myself and seem to have difficulties coming up a solution that fits for me...
POE all the things!
I want a water cooled PI 5! 8GB running on a ssd!
Any chance you could let me know how well the Pi5 with both hats fits into the 3d printed 6 bay rack? That is what I am building this spring.
Great and thorough testing of POE near power source. But, what could one actually do with it? Given your office cabling could you run Pi at remote corner of office? Could the office corner Pi run a room temperature sensor or a Pi camera? Or perhaps both for a science experiment monitoring a small seedling? You have demonstrated that it does improve the cabling at the rack. And that a managed POE switch is useful. Would a Ubiquiti Dream Router POE work as a POE power supply?
Yeah I have a UDM SE which powers a Pi sitting on top of it in a rack, then also one ~20m away in the garden running BirdNET, getting power to that location would have been a massive pain, but easy to run a bit of Cat6.
I have been considering adding a Pi-based PoE cam to my NVR system using a Pi running far from the network closet, but that project has to wait a bit for now.
Great video! I am looking for a hat for my pi 4. I plan to add an external ssd over usb. I watched your other video about the official poe+ hat. What do you recommend for my use case? Thank you much.
Why didn’t Red Shirt Jeff trim away a bit of the case and make it fit?
I was just asking for something like this!! Now I have to update to RPi 5? lol
And Jeff, were you able to use the 1U rack mount with both PoE and nvme HATs?
No, right now I haven't found a good solution for the 'Bottom' HATs and rackmount designs that exist right now.
There are some DIN rail mounts that are compatible, though you might have to supply your own screws.
@@JeffGeerlingWhat DIN rail mounts or DIN rail cases do you recommend for Raspberry Pi 5 (with and without HAT's)? Just found some for Raspberry Pi 4. Not sure if they are working.
Cool! Does the power clip when it plays Doom?
I love watching your insightful videos. My first project with my pi 5 was to add a 7 inch screen and a m.2 nvme hat. I wanted to trying setting up retropi on it but got a couple errors when finishing the manual install instruction that is on the retropi site. When rebooted I just get the login prompt for the pi. I tried xstart command and startx command. not sure which one is correct. either way I could not get the retropi to work. Any suggestions?
have you seen the geekworm x1004 hat+ dual m.2?
I’ve seen it. Can’t boot from it, but it’s a cool option.
I'm trying to set up a fan-less pi5 with an nvme drive, but I need it to run on a 'C' connection, without the wall-wart. Don't know if it will, but that's my aim... I'm shooting for a draw of about 6 watts?
Linux, with VDE in a dosbox, for word processing; that's my aim.
Can you tell us all chip markings on that poe hat? Im intrested in chips that are next to transformer and under it
does the rack at 3:42 fit the bottom board for the SSD along with the POE hat?
Can you fit both the PoE hat and the NVMe hat into a rack mount enclosure?
I have those same PoE hats on the way, but they barely fit into my rack enclosure, and I've love to run NVMe as well.
Hi Jeff, I am s great fan of yours and request you to make some videos on some other boards instead please. We want some alternatives here now since, I don't see the foundation to be heading the same direction as before. Regards
Hey Jeff, Did you by any chance have a case for this setup? Have the NVME Base and the PoE Hat. Cant seem to find a case for it
I'm also searching for a case to fit that setup. Did you already find any @serdalo5035?
Anyone noticed that there's no thermal pad for the memory on the official Pi5 active cooler? Favors the wifi module. Interesting.
One problem some of these third-party hats have is a lack of isolation. Did you try connecting the PoE powered Pi to a monitor with HDMI?
This one has a nice wide empty space in the PCB between the power input side and the rest of the board-it seems to follow the proper design guidelines at least, but I didn't do any specific testing for it.
Have you tried using F2FS on your SSD? I'm curious if that would make it any faster. Also, try using FDE since the new Pi has AES acceleration.
Hi Jeff,
Is there a case available for this configuration you think?
I’ll wait for your comparison with RPi’s own PoE Hat.
how do i update the config file to not halt on power like you did but I am running HAOS on the PI? Can I do it remotely?
Yes, Blackmagic has some PoE gear
Blackmagic makes some amazing gear... wish I could afford more for my studio :D
6:20 Professor Farnsworth: “And here’s where I keep assorted lengths of wire.”
Heh if only every desk and every room had a patch cable organizer... :D
PoE hat could be use in combo with the Geekworm Raspberry Pi 5 UPS (X1202) or Geekworm X-UPS1 12V/5V?
Around 10W at max in your setup? So good to go with standard POE 802.3af?
Damn you Jeff, you have cost me so much money. The power of marketing’. You show stuff and I’m like oh ya i need that and proceed to order. I have so much stuff just lying around now. I blame you Jeff lol. Love the videos and all the information
Oopsie, sorry about that!
@@JeffGeerling all good I just have to find more hiding spots from my wife. you're the best
I'd really like to test PoE on Pi5 8Gb using a PCIe nvme drive hat and running a local LLM at full CPU.
What is that rack you are using to hold your spare patch cables? Genius!
That's a patch cable holder I think it's from Gatorworks? They are popular in audio for patch cables but they work well for most any type!
Thanks! You're the man. @@JeffGeerling
Speaking of Waveshare, I have Waveshare UPS Hat version (D) on RPI 4. If I run command "dmesg", I see a lot of "hwmon hwmon1: Undervoltage detected!".
Do you happen to know why that's happening?
I use the RPI 4 for Home Assistant with SSD connected in USB, along with a ZigBee coordinator on USB and an air-mouse connected as well in USB.
I do not get only one thing. Why this PoE hat does not have 3 wires. PWM fan would be a nice thing to have that could be controlled via some Python 3 script.
Or have the fan able to plug into the Pi's built-in fan header, that would be quite nice!
@@JeffGeerlingI agree, but I suppose that this is more complicated than 3 wires. Besides Waveshare already has similar hats for Raspberry Pi that work with PWM fan. But maybe they were afraid that someone could overheat Raspberry Pi 5 , or the radiator is to thin and it requires a fan working with full speed? I do not know this. I am wondering will Noctua NF-A4x10 fit; it has dimensions 32x32 mm (for screw holes). I think Noctua should think about quiet PWM fans for Raspberry 5. I am sure that such quality fans would be a nice deal towards people interested in not only Raspberry Pi but other IoT devices.
What is the best POE hat for the PI4?
Well, one thing that seems clear: With short decent Ethernet cables PoE never should be a problem.
But it could become an issue when using 5 to 10 meters already, especially if the cables aren't the best quality.
"Plug n' play" local LLM via a PoE HAT and a M.2 or USB Coral TPU?
Question: the 12v pins are for powering an external 3.5" hard drive?
Could be used for that, but you'd have to use a drive that only runs on 12V power (some do, some don't)-it's more for specific accessories that run off 12v.
Do you know of any case that will support both the ssd and Poe adapter
Is it possible to use this in addition to the USB-C power supply? Mainly as a redundancy measure.
But is the RPi5 not getting close to the price of an Intel Nuc (with vPro), and the Nuc can be powered using an POE splitter.
I really hope official pi hat fits the case… and is released soon
What was that cool program you were running to monitor disk I/O?
iotop - one of the many wonderful *top family, like atop, htop, iftop... :)
My concern is the GPIO header pins sticking out the top, and figuring a case it'll all fit into... After my Google searches led me to this particular hat still being apparently the only one available, I searched RUclips and ended up here. Could I just cut those pins off flush with the top of the board?
This like a network attach storage sulution? They work reliably?
Buy a hat and make one 👌
Can the Pi wear the PoE hat backwards, like the cool kids? 😊 Great video, a wealth of knowledge. Keep it up! My pi5 is running pihole, home assistant, UniFi network, a NAS, and a few other services. Using the pineberry pi NVME base. One video that would be helpful to the community (perhaps you’ve done it already) is a compatibility test on which NVME drives work with which NVME hats/bases. With Pineberry Pi, I couldn’t use WD Black SN850 series, I had to resort to some off brand NVME device. Don’t remember the name.
Yeah, the hard thing is even with the same NVMe SSD, sometimes the controllers can be different depending on which batch you buy!
There are some people who have been testing various SSDs on various HATs (I have only tested about 5 so far), and you can follow along on my Pi PCIe website - the GitHub issues have testing info.
That Squier get played from time to time ?
Not anymore-I was learning guitar, but have given up and the Squier is now in the hands of someone who plays a lot more guitar and is teaching his daughters.
Jeff, may i ask you: what product/type of these slim patch cables are you using? Many thanks - Alexander
Those are I think Monoprice slim patch cables
Is there a case to fit the pi5 with Poe hot and nvme base?
I have added a Pimoroni NVMe drive kit. I noticed the Pi 5 CPU temperature has increased (+10 degrees C) possibly conducting additional heat from the bottom NVMe board. I recently watched your video on the Pi Camera module 3 Wide Angle. The camera does make excellent photos, but I can not get the VLC Media Player to play any of the videos produced unless I use terminal command ffplay *.h264 or *.mjpeg. I think maybe VLC needs to be configured in a special way. The Pi 5 is 8g with the Pimoroni -NVMe board added. I have not been able to solve this issue. If you know the answer, please let me know. Thanks..............
So wondering if the $ spent on the active coolers will be down the drain.. if POE hat's won't go on with the active cooler already installed :(
This has happened to me on 2 ocassions -- you want to buy a case that fits all your boards... And the case comes with its own cooler.
You buy a cooler for your board, and nothing else fits anymore.
I'm hopeful (and I think this is the goal) that Raspberry Pi's own HATs will work with the Active Cooler + official case. We'll see!
Seams that pmic_read_adc is not avaibale in last version od piOS. Any similar command?