Paradigm Altering Political Theory w/ Dr. Andrew Willard Jones
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- Опубликовано: 5 сен 2024
- Liberalism is failing. Instead of making us more free, we are becoming more isolated from what makes us most human: from community, family, and friendship. Debates between progressives and conservatives continue to no end, but things only seem to get worse. In this episode of Pints with Aquinas, Dr. Andrew Willard Jones presents a paradigm shift for politics. Against the story of secularism, where politics and religion are separate realms, Andrew argues that Christ came to save all that is human: politics, economics, business-all of it. Instead of fighting over a failing liberalism, Andrew shows us why (and how) we should redeem politics by building families and communities of Christian love.
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Andrew's Links:
Politics of Tyranny: • The Politics of Tyranny
NewPolity Articles: newpolity.com/...
"Before Church and State": newpolity.com/...
"The Two Cities": newpolity.com/...
NewPolity Conference: newpolity.com/...
Chapters:
00:00 Intro
0:29: Grading
10:17: Failures of Hedonism
20:29: Nietzscheanism
30:46: Christians Societies
41:42: The Myth of Primordial Chaos
52:21: What is Liberalism
1:03:09: Why Right Liberals are wrong
1:13:58: The Myth of the un attached Individual Actor
1:24:34: The Common Good and Happiness
1:35:22: The System inherent contradictions
1:45:40: The Origins of Totalitarianism
1:55:57: The Steubenville Experiment
2:06:26: What is modernity?
Thank You for 500k! Don't forget to subscribe for the next chapter of Pints if you haven't already!
Here is The True Savior
HalleluYAH translates “Praise ye YaH”
YaH is The Heavenly Father
YaH arrives via the TENT OF MEETING
YaH was Who they Crucified for our sins
YaH was Crucified on an Almond TREE
- Ancient Semitic Cuneiform of Moshe (Moses)
- Isa Scroll (The Original Isaiah)
Isaiah 42:8
"I am YaH; that is my Name! I will not yield my glory to another or my praise to idols.”
Isaiah 43:11
“I am YAH, and there is no other Savior but Me.”
Isaiah 45:5
“I am YaH, and there is none else.”
I’m glad you spelled out liberalism because it’s so normative in the American order that few people perceive it. It’s the water we swim in. “Conservatives” are conserving liberalism.
This needs to be a billboard! I still catch myself. And anytime I share New Polity stuff I have to write a short novel explaining that they don’t mean “democrats” when they say “liberals.”
I agree. There are two good books I've read: Conservatism - Hazony. I was worried it would be another book about 'Liberal conservatism'; it's not. He talks about how in the 1950's the historical foundation of America was 'reinterpreted' from the Anglo Tradition to enlightenment rationality (liberalism). The second book is: Revolution and Counterrevolution - Plinio Correa de Oliveira. It's a good book where he talks about the semi-counterrevolutionary. This book has, in my opinion, aged well. It seems more true and obvious today than when he wrote it in the 60's.
Solid choices.@@ndenman420
@@ndenman420Hazony is wrong. The Anglo tradition IS liberalism. That’s who Locke was. He’s twisting the truth to try and wave the Stars and Stripes. Sadly America was founded on bad principles
His book "Before Church and State" is absolutely critical. Highly highly recommend it to everyone. It wipes out the distortion of reality that Liberalism imposes on the epoch of the Middle Ages.
Sold.
Completely agree. Changed the way I thought about the human social order and now I'm trying to build something like that where I live.
Matt’s humility on display here is so unique in our culture and so good. Asking when you don’t understand or need it repeated instead of just nodding your head and moving on is so uncommon, thank you Matt
It's what makes him such a good interviewer. He's the everyman.
@@gregcooper3773 That's exactly what it is. He's an Everyman.
And before anyone says he's too successful and pious to be an Everyman--that's what an Everyman is meant to be! He shouldn't be an evil loser!
I love that Dr Jones follows every unbelievably profound statement with a jolly chuckle. What a brilliant man
Yeah, not very Scandinavian after all!
Brilliant. This might be my personal fav Pints interview ever. So glad to learn about Dr. Jones.
I'm another Masters in Catholic Studies student at Franciscan online! I highly recommend and you'll get to take (at least) 3 courses from the brilliant Dr. Jones! I highly recommend the program. You'll take courses in literature, philosophy, Church history, and religion. One class I took was on Science and the Church...awesome, too. Most of the courses are electives, so you can tailor it to your interests! I'm a changed person having taking this program. All you need is a bachelor's degree, it's pretty easy to apply. The courses are all online and they're in 8 week sessions, which makes it nice. I graduate in May!
I absolutely love Dr. Jones. He is a genius! And the belly laugh! It makes me smile every time!
Thank you for sharing. I have been interested in learning more about my faith. I would love to do this program.
Why Dr. Andrew Willard Jones' reflexive laughter is endearing and not annoying is a mystery.
Give a little grace - it's probably just nerves
One of the best times of my life was working for Dr. Jones. Listen to this man!
If I was ever going to go back to school, I would go back to specifically study under him.
Been praying for this one for a while! I’ve taken several classes with Dr. Jones and come away from each class saying the same thing I did throughout this podcast “that is so obviously true! How have I never seen this before?” Such a subtle and profound thinker. God Bless you both!
I think that it's wonderful that Dr. Jones students are excited to listen ho him on this podcast.
You can hear that he is well respected!
With that said, I am now looking forward to listening to what Dr. Jones has to say!
God bless! 🙏
Hearing Matt being mind blown every two minutes is hilarious! Dr. Jones is the best!
I cannot wait to listen to this! SO grateful to have had Dr Jones as a teacher. I highly encourage people to check out Franciscan's masters program in Catholic Studies. It's a wonderful opportunity to view our history (and our place within it) through a clearer, more truly Catholic lens.
I don't have $80,000 for a bourgeois quest of mental self stroking.
I couldn't second this more thoroughly. Fantastic professor that brought a very unique and fascinating view of our history that changed my worldview within Catholicism.
I have never studied at Franciscan. But since I found new polity, I have felt like he has taught me too
This is one of the best interviews I’ve seen on this show. This is the brain crunching philosophy I came for! Gonna buy both of his books
I agree 100%.
Another vote for favorite interview. I wish it had been one of the marathon 4-5 hour episodes. I love New Polity but I have trouble wrapping my head around it and communicating it to others. This was extremely approachable.
I would love to see a conversation between Jordan Peterson and Dr Jones
I’m not sure those two COULD have a conversation.
@@bethmcmullan7686both would have to be willing to not interrupt, and give space to the other
@@MaryJones-rx3myWhere is that? I can't find it!
@@MaryJones-rx3my Rip!
Whaaaaattt!!?? I think I may have actually prayed for this to happen in the past. Can't wait!
I've been curious to get his work on Before Church & State. Looking forward to this.
His conversion story was amazing! He explained grace freely given by God so brilliantly. This was so interesting and very beautifully explained! Really great listen.
There's a somewhat common joke in the Diocese of Lansing that Hillsdale is our only Catholic college now. It is not Catholic at all in name or goal. But it's a powerhouse of conversions
Go to campus, there is a strong Catholic presence and many more devote Christians.
I can attest to this having met mannnny Hillsdale graduates who converted to Catholicism at school or in the years closely following..
@@bluecomb5376 I am one of them lol
Nice! I worked with many at the Great Hearts schools in Arizona. Some of the coolest converts I know!@@erikhalvorson4408
Shoutout to the diocese of Lansing!
Great job Dr. Jones! He's a fantastic professor--learned so much from his classes.
Hey Dr. Jones, you didn’t tell your class you’d be on PwA! So cool, can’t wait to listen!
I'm not sure whether he likes attention or public speaking less.😅
I always love when you have on the New Polity guys
Feeling the love.
I didn’t know this existed. I just discovered (and subscribed) to the @NewPolityPodcast
(Thanks to the comment from that account itself above haha)
What an amazing interview this is what the Lord has slowly put in my soul as I came back to the Church. Take care of me , then my spouse & my children, then my parish community and keep an eye on the government because good people in good families under God will take care of themselves and each other. I needed this interview well done Pints with Aquinas!!!! Dr. Jones your brilliant God bless you all!
One of the best PWA episodes. Thank you!
This podcast came out at the perfect time for me, I'm just now getting into the Catholic political program (Rerum Novarum, Familism, Corporatism etc,)
Thank you :)
Thank you. Very informative! Definitely among the top Pints I have seen.
One thing about Matt that often goes unnoticed is how critical of an interviewer he can be. He doesn't pull punches when probing the ideas of his guests and there are definitely a couple moments where Dr Jones is on the backfoot (probably the wrong wording since that sounds very adversarial but you get the idea). There are other episodes where it happens too. Love Dr Jones, some incredible points about contract theory which I'll definitely remember, and a great interviewer in Matt!
Fantastically powerful in clarifying so much of the turmoil we’re experiencing in our country now. Thank you!!!
I have had a similar intellectual journey through the Austrian Economics world into the Catholic Church as a convert. My plan is to start reading somethings by Dr. Jones to sort through what that journey really consisted of and what crossover remains in our worldviews.
Dr. Jones should share what he knows about the deeper side of the Austrian Econ world that verges into Anarchism and then necessarily reverts into localism, religion, tradition, subsidiarity, monarchism, etc. Why is that? Why are so many libertarians converting to Orthodoxy or Catholicism? There is a deeper reason than one might assume. Something prepared the way for these converts...myself included.
Austrian economics is teleological at its base. Humans act, meaning that they engage in the purposeful use of means to achieve ends. That everything has a final cause (purpose, end) is how many ancient and medieval philosophers saw things (Aristotle, Aquinas, etc). Modern philosophy embraced Hume and removed teleology, in order to move away from the conclusions of metaphysics. Which would generally lead one to God, the natural order, and thus the older faiths you mention. Backdrop of the Protestant Reformation to this as well.
I have never felt more disappointment when coming to this channel than I have now. I read the title, was immediately and thoroughly intrigued and after several seconds madly trying to press ‘play’ only to finally realize this content won’t even premiere for 21 hours. I’m disappointed I missed the little details in my excitement.😢😅😂
Almost had me there lol
"I'm going to learn a lot from the 2nd or 3rd listen". I already have it saved to my playlist to listen again.
The man with the best guffaw in the Catholic world
Truly a great laugh
Great job dealing with his laugh Thursday !
You da man.
Love his laugh but where & when the bursts happen are strange
@@dannereading9584 That's the beauty in it!
I personally-embrace the Subsidiarity principle formulated by the Catholic Church, in that human-matters ought to be handled by the smallest, or least centralized competent authority instead of a higher and/or more distant one, whenever possible. This means children should be educated and supervised by their parents, extended families, family friends whenever possible.
Aligned with the principle of subsidiarity is the social concept of Distributism that views both laissez-faire capitalism & state socialism as flawed -- and exploitative. The concept favors small independent craftsmen and producers; and if that is not possible, economic mechanisms such as cooperatives and member-owned mutual organizations as well as small to medium enterprises.
Pope Leo XIII's 1891 encyclical, Rerum novarum, advocated distributism. Its conceptual roots can be traced to Catholic theologians such as Thomas Aquinas and Augustine of Hippo. The term "localism" economic/social is gaining traction.
I think the Latin Rite needs to do some PR when it comes to this concept of subsidiarity! I always thought that Catholics just had the Pope, and then whatever he would say was like God’s word, and I never knew how much local authority there was! It’s really more “bottom up” than “top down” in many ways, but because the Pope is the one on tv, no one has any idea how it really works!
2:45 Fradd and I are on the same page. I unironically think pajama pants in public should be a criminal offense
One of the best interviews on this show. Have you had the chance to speak with Patrick Deneen ? “why liberalism failed”? This talk reminded me of that book.
OK, now Dr. Jones needs to come back and talk about Louis IX.
I’m looking forward to reading “The Two Cities” - this was a great conversation!
It really is a great book
I have been discerning hard if I want to use the rest of my benefits and get a Masters from Franciscan University. After listening to this, I think I just might be enrolling in the Catholic Studies MA.
That is profound “Christendom created modernity” 😢 I trust my Lord Jesus Christ, His Church will triumph!
Really wish to see Tom Woods on Pints With Aquinas.
This was awesome.So much to think about. Loved watching Matt's enthusiasm too. May we all go and love our families well and rebuild our society.
🤯 and yet makes SO much sense!
If I could thumbs up this episode a 100 times, I would. Truly excellent, thank you.
I like the idea of dressing up for class and showing respect for the work in which one is engaged. But I LOATHE, truly loathe, the type of professor that Dr. Jones mentioned he had in school- the one who calls out people in shorts etc. The very first rule of etiquette is that you NEVER, EVER point out someone’s faults, mistakes, or ignorance. You ALWAYS save face. When a person doesn’t save face for others, that’s a sign they are Cal from “Titanic.” Don’t get in a boat with a guy like that- he’ll throw you out because underneath his suit he’s just a feckless, critical ninny.
From the ashes the phoenix will rise. What’s being born is brilliant.
This is the sort of things people need to hear to wake up and realize what the problems actually are
THIS
Thanks for this great conversation! I have been blessed by Andrew's work, and it is great to hear how his story led to his academic pursuits!
2:08:55 seriously you keep making Steubenville sound more & more appealing.
Dr. Jones is the 🐐
This is such a great conversation, that really breaks down the root philosophical implications of the word "liberal"! I personally can fully relate to Andrew's accurate assessment of the flaws of libertarianism, and thus why I find it sooo frustrating when right wing activists poo poo "social justice" progressive liberals so hard, making the term "liberal" pejorative, when often they themselves fail to see their own version of free market liberalism has formed their criticism of those other liberals who are taking the modernist experiment to its logical conclusion. Honestly, we are living in such a divided world, headed towards civil war domestically and towards a global war internationally due to the hardened hearts of hyper individualistic versions of liberal political ideologies. Duh, the only way to bridge this great divide is too foster more mutually loving relationships, or as Jesus Christ commands us, "Love your enemies"!
The most wonderful part of this interview is the growth of the conversation from the beginning all the way to the end. At the end of that conversation, much of which is pretty dire since it is brining forward immoral globalization or COVID crackdowns, it emerges that the ideologies that fail in an accurate anthropology cannot ultimately succeed because human nature cannot be overcome. 1:52:00. Extremely hopeful!
I loved this interview so much! It put words to so many things I’ve been feeling/sensing but was unable to articulate.
So excited about this. Dr. Jones is brilliant!
You guys need to run Steubenville, make away get some virtuous foot prints underway, you already have powerful relationship, elevate! Excelsior!
Taking graphic design in college was a huge eye opener in understanding manipulation of the population historically and presently. In some ways useful when comes to entrepreneurship but I also felt dirty at the same time learning the ins and outs on how to create emotion by simple use of composition, color, shape, and line.
1:04:50 very interesting on liberalism and patriotism. I'd be curious to hear Dr. Jones' take on "bioleninism" (not sure if it's an academic term, but new right political theorists use it fairly frequently). Communist states would elevate/patronize the lowest people of society (with no family, church, community), thus garnering loyalty from them to the regime unconditionally, not dissimilar from what many American leftists are doing now (heightening the familyless, family-destroying gender ideologues, giving them power and, in turn, receiving unquestioning loyalty to the regime). Notice how "regime" and "country" aren't necessarily equated, as these regime-zealots aren't necessarily patriotic and are, in fact, hostile to those who are. The converse is also true - you see the "patriots" deeply, deeply skeptical of the regime (referring to it as the "deep state", which they've been mocked for doing).
Great episode for explaining the current political foundations and how the results are so nonsensical.
This is the best Pints interview aside from Marc Barnes. New Polity is insanely interesting.
Made my brain do a lot of stretching and work to soak this in!!
Thanks!!❤
I know the good Doctor is critical of liberalism as a project, but the American constitutional system (a product thereof) is compatible with subsidiarity IMO. All it would seem to take is a reordering of priority (I.e., the job of the federal govt is to protect and facilitate the state assemblies, the job of the state assemblies is to protect and facilitate local communities, etc.).
In communist Cuba gathering, outside government authority is also illegal - a neighbor can call the police and say there is a suspicious activity in any given house and the state police will come.
An all time great PWA episode!
The podcast "finished like a raid"!?!?I want more!😊
‼️‼️‼️ whose idea was the little tiny picture of Supreme Dear Leader at about 1:07!?!?!?! Please tell me I will name my next child after you 😆🙌😂
I was wondering about the little corner ‘glide by’ of make America great again president, as well!
Biden’s destroying so much.
Why are there no serious libertarian/anarchist discussions with the New Polity crowd.
Hearing Tom Woods or Dave Smith (with his spiritual faults) discuss it with someone from new polity would be great.
I believe I’ve read something on the the New Polity website that was critical of libertarianism. I’d have to search for it, but I’m almost certain they have addressed it before.
I'd love an episode where we can ask Aquinas "what do you think of Rush Limbaugh?"
If you appreciate this talk and are critical of modernity, you might find James C. Scott's book “Seeing Like a State” intriguing. While it's not a Christian book, it offers a compelling critique of top-down modernity, slicing through its complexities with remarkable clarity, much like a hot knife through butter.
One of my fav profs at Franciscan
So incredibly helpful thank you!
This would've been an infinitely more interesting discussion had they discussed mimetic theory. Rene Girard, who coined the term, was a devout Catholic and his ideas are criminally underrated and not nearly as widespread as they should be among Catholics and other Christians.
My bittersweet comment in response to the invitation to help build community, move to Steubenville: "I tried, but no job offers there." 😢😅😂
Yeah, you kind of have to work remote and bring the economy with you.
@@cactoidjim1477 or land the St. Paul's Center job you applied for. 🤣😂😜
MOOGOOGAIPAN.....There. Do I win a typewriter now? 😂
In all seriousness, great podcast!
I had a graduate professor who claimed to use "the stair-method" to grade essays... throw all the essay booklets in the air. If it lands on the top step - A, the second - B, and so forth... Very nice guy... really loved his job. 😅
Great conversation!
I feel this convos should’ve lasted longer than Seamus’ (f/ freedomtoons) convos… 😩🥰
Being from a place where summer temperatures can get to 120 degrees, I will pass on wearing a suit any time I can. Shorts and a t-shirt are fine for the mundane things in your life.
I gave the 1.1 K like on this video EXCACTLY!! YESSSS!!
I’m gonna need a short to share! I suggest around 1:07 😁
Hey everyone. Does anyone know if there is a good way to contact Pints directly? Libertarianism has come up on a few episodes now and this is truly a terrible and incorrect identification of what Libertarianism is. I feel they really need a Catholic libertarian on the show to explain the views of both the party and the political theory
Libertarianism and Catholicism are incompatible.
@El-Harto ahah, “blatantly”, how so
@El-Harto I haven’t read Tom Woods book but I have watched his special of the same name on EWTN multiple times. I like Tom Woods, but he’s really the only libertarian I can stand. Both Ed Feser and Seamus Coughlin both talk about being libertarian and having to switch to Catholic Social Teaching (while still having heavy free market leanings).
Ultimately you have to ask yourself, are you going to follow God or your pet economic theory.
I work for the United States Department of Defense. The United Department of Defense is broken probably beyond repair. There are a lot of people who would not be able to say that.
Yeah, it seems a collapse is imminent. People seem to be pretty discombobulated with everything that’s happening and everything that has happened the past few years. Our system seems to be an ouroboros right now and who knows what the end of that is..
@@josiahalexander5697Had to look that word up, ouroboros. Thanks for using it
Anyone know what is going to happen with the show when Matt goes to Europe? Love this show, so curious what they are going to do.
He's in Europe now, these are pre recorded.
Aha, he is in Austria now. These episodes are prerecorded. ❤
18:22 The will to power must be why Jesus really pushes his followers to GIVE UP power while sharing the gospel… it demonstrates that power is not the reason for our holding out the life of Christ as a THE Way to live
Also, for good measure:
"...whenever the legislators endeavour to take away and destroy the property of the people, or to reduce them to slavery under arbitrary power, they put themselves into a state of war with the people, who are thereupon absolved from any farther obedience, and are left to the common refuge which God hath provided for all men against force and violence." - Locke's 2nd Treatise
The above is just a taste. Dr. Jones has mischaracterized Locke's position (I'll assume not deliberately, but it's a pretty big mistake to make on accident) on property and rights being "owned and managed" by the government (time stamp 53:00 - 53:20).
He has also terribly mischaracterized liberalism in general. No liberal would say that they see oppression where the state doesn't have authority. A progressive might say that, but progressives aren't very liberal anymore, if you haven't noticed. A whole branch of classical liberalism is dedicated to protecting and understanding the importance of centers of power and institutions that exist independently of the state, such as families, the workplace/professional connections, churches, friends, communities, etc. Jones has taken the most extreme portions of John Stuart Mill and projected it onto all of liberalism. Locke and Burke and Smith were not Mill. The American Founders were not Mill. This whole episode is a mess.
I had a professor who would stop students and pull up their pants if they were sagging. He was hilarious!
Note to self, don’t take a class run by Matt Fradd, lol
Trying to enforce any dress code that is not already enforced by the university at large seems like a good way to end up before a disciplinary board
1:05:34 I wonder how much this guy has read of the Austrian School. I am not an expert on it either, but I've never read any of them saying what he is saying about profit. They are not people with a monomaniacal focus on maximizing dollar profit. They write about psychic profit too, and how people value leisure to focus on other areas of life.
I want his laugh
Excellent guest! Liberalism and the neoliberal oligarchs need to be getting this type of attention. ANTIFA aren't commies as much as they're liberals role-playing (LARPing) as commies.
1:43:10 I’m sorry but the Christian position does require higher orders to be built. But it relies on the highest order. The other positions on offer rely on intermediates…therefore asking them for far more than they’re capable of delivering.
James Lindsay has a great podcast called New discourses that deals with what this all really is at its core which is Gnostic Marxism.
1:40:00 in it gets to the beauty of it all!
I never did like the enlightenment political thinkers. It always struck me that they must not ever have had a mother or raised a child. Their legacy remains in those who, in all of the issues of our time, assume the autonomous adult as the basis of all moral decision-making.
WILLLLLLLARD!!!
If you're getting 50 papers on the same prompt, you're doing it wrong. Assign something that requires the students to write about something that every student has to come up something different. It's only essay exams that require the same prompts. Term essays need to be more creatively considered or the teacher's boredom and annoyance becomes an obstacle to giving fair grades. Twenty-five years teaching writing and literature in a teachers' college speaking here. Give students options and flexibility in aspects of the assignment.
The obvious counter for objective morality being able to be based on self interest is Genghis Khan.
1:54:35 Not bizarre at all. The emperors knew how the Republic fell and they came to power. Look at the famous letter to Pliny that mentions Christians. Trajan’s attitude was ‘meh, Christians are only a problem if they make a nuisance. But these people trying to form a volunteer for brigade? They’re the real threat!’
What a wonderfully joyful laugh he has