Agree. It was neat to hear the personnel side in that decision process. I feel for Fields. Even when he plays well he’s surrounded by coaching that can’t manage games & makes bad decisions. Where a QB ends up is so important for development.
They didn’t like Mahommes or Watson because they didn’t think off script ability doesn’t transfer to nfl. When you have a bad line and bad plays, sounds like off script thinking would help.
That’s because until recently they all wanted Brady and manning guys who’d check into the perfect and deliver a pinpoint ball. They didn’t want a farve a Vick a rothlessberger because the success of the play relied to much on the qb improvising or taking risks instead running the OCs plays
@@JJ-zr6fuif you didn’t want a running qb, that’s back from the 90s. It not a recent thing to want one now when you have Mcnabb, Wilson, Big Ben and even rodgers can run. You want a qb that can run to extend and throw which Watson and Mahommes can do. Fields and trubisky college highlights showed they didn’t have accuracy. Wr we’re wide open and in fields case, his wr had to make major adjustments
This interview was amazing!! It left me wanting more. Big respect to Josh for allowing us Bear fans a chance to get a glimpse behind the curtain. He was very transparent and honest about some of his miscalculations.
Josh Lucas and Ryan Pace are the worst General Managers in Chicago Bears history. Two giant misses with the most important position on the field. This interview made me feel worse, not better.
This was a really insightful interview. One of the best I've heard of and Josh really simplified it down for us non-football experts. The part about having fluid intelligence over pre-game and book intelligence so to speak was very telling. It's clear that Mahomes has fluid intelligence to be able to improvise and think on his feet while Mitch and Justin not so much. I enjoyed the in depth detail about the scouting and draft process they went through when going with Mitch and Justin. It doesn't change the fact that they made the wrong decision by drafting Trubisky over Mahomes but enjoyed the insight from someone who had first hand knowledge
Love the interview but the drafting Trubisky over Mahomes/Watson part was quite cringey. He knows he can’t just say, we picked the one we’d want as our son in law/the one that we related to the most 😂
@@jahitrotter4734 Yea, he kind of made it seem like Trubisky's in person dinner put him over the top and that Mahomes seemed a little jittery and anxious in his dinner with the reps. On one hand, he said that it's not advisable to trust a QB who has only had 1 or 2 yrs of starting in college and that's exactly what they did with Trubisky...ugh...
Mitch and Justin are both able to read a defense well enough to drop and run. Both of them have actually showed talent in passing, but people won't hear that because apparently no one understands how a team works let alone context.
@bodvarson1933 The nfl can scheme against one trick pony’s at qb. Fields can only threaten you as a runner so they scheme for it and he becomes one the worst qbs in the nfl.
Not sure that it’s scouting rather than what they’re told to look for when scouting. All of these guys ignore Patrick Mahomes because they’ve been told to find the next Kirk Cousins. A game truly driven by players has been taken over by coaches & execs who “fake until they make it.” They utter the magic buzzwords to get hired & direct a staff in a direction that most execs don’t truly understand. There’s another good interview about the minute details of plays that Fields is running. It appears that the Bears are running some plays that were customized/adjusted by others for very specific situations that don’t apply to the Bears. But “fake it until you make it” coaches don’t realize they’re running it the wrong way so Fields has no chance of executing those plays unless he makes his own adjustments. The best coaches in the history of this game going back to Paul Brown & Vince Lombardi were TEACHERS. Today there’s a bunch of Madden players so the gap widens & the guys like Justin Fields are sacrificed & pushed into playing parts trying to get drafted high instead of falling to good teams like Dan Marino in 1983 going next to last to a Super Bowl team. These colleges need to have ppl help these kids look out for themselves when they declare for the draft. Instead, being drafted high by a trash team plays in to promoting the college & the player gets thrown under the bus if he can’t overcome the vultures trying to keep their jobs.
That is one of the most insightful sports interviews I've ever listened to. I could have listened to Josh Lucas being interviewed like this for 3 hours. And I'm not even a Bears fan.
The Bears looked at what Deshawn did to Bama's pro talent defense and said "2nd round"!!!😂😂😂 Then they looked at Mitchs mediocre college tenure and said "trade up"😂😂😂
@VoidSurfer9 I cared when they got Mack. All they needed was Robbie Gould to win the super bowl. But I haven’t really cared since fangio left. Fields was a bust that’s why he fell.
The Mitch trubisky trade deserves a 30 for 30 documentary lol this guy literally said college experience is invaluable but then they drafted the qb with the least experience in Mitch 😂😂😂
Fantastic transparency! More should folks should do this as it will help with understanding why they did what they did for whatever the case maybe. Great work here.
Man this is horrible. I can’t believe the nfl thought Mitch was it. Granted it was the brown and bears but still crazy these back office people loved him.
@@newnewjohnson4776 bruh what? The Ryan Pace era was masterclass in failure at QB. This is a front office that paid Mike Glennon a three year 45mil deal to start 4 games, and it only gets worse there.
This interview is both fascinating and sad. I like Lucas, very personable and articulate. Just sad at the state of the franchise and our GM got to pick 2 QBs.
Love the interview but the drafting Trubisky over Mahomes/Watson part was quite cringey. He knows he can’t just say, we picked the one we’d want as our son in law/the one that we related to the most 😂🙄
This interview was great but it also revealed a flawed that they're not very good at scouting either. I would like to know what top or 1st round picks that he was apart of that panned out through out his career of scouting? So far we know of 0-2.
The fact that they seriously thought Watson was gonna be a 2nd round pick speaks VOLUMES about their ability to analyze QBs. All you had to do was watch the 2 National Title games against Bama to know that he was the real deal. Still angers me endlessly to this day.
@@stevehannah how I was high on Mahomes NYGs wanted to trade up for him but he was raw he’s an outlier Watson is too he plays very reckless passing and running the eye test is important but banking on outliers is hard when your head is on the line Manziel beat up on Bama
Watson doesn't matter anymore. He would've done the same thing here that he did in Houston and then everyone would've been talking about how we should've drafted Mahomes over Watson. Watson is a headcase. The key issue is Mahomes being passed over, not Watson
Thank you for pressing him on the decision to draft Mitch, and the thought process behind the decision... There was nothing about Mitch that screamed #3 Overall Pick. Then to TRADE UP to #2 was absolutely insane! Ryan Pace let some randoms rumors spook him, and he promptly set the franchise back... Take Pat Mahomes out the picture, Watson was the no brainer QB choice at that time in history. Not Mitch!!
@670theScore Just wanted to chime in like most and say this interview is hands down one of the best ever on the Score. Instant classic. Things most fans wanted to hear and rarely do from behind the curtain.
The damn QB position… Who the hell really knows. It’s also why I love this sport, it’s such an incredibly difficult position. What a quality conversation this was.
10:53 - This is what pissed me off about the Pace/Nagy era, they never had a back up plan! How on earth would you think that Andy Dalton would get through an entire season healthy with a Bottom 5 OLine? Why would you NOT have a base package for Justin ready to go just in case? If I remember correctly, Nagy barely gave him reps in the preseason, then gave him an open playbook on his FIRST GAME! They never had a Plan B, C, D with player personnel, no game plan adjustments, nothing!!
It's so strange, right. I'm trying to analyze the answer and I believe the Bears a) thought Mitch was clearly better than Mahomes (despite less experience?) and b) felt that missing out on Mitch at 2 would mean "sure we'll take Patrick but not at 3 because he's not going in the top 10 ..... meaning they somehow thought "Patrick would be there mid 1st round" or whatever. So wild lol
As a lifelong Bears fan, this interview is so painful to hear. Write down who you think we should draft on draft day (and speculate who’ll be gone without discussing) and this is used to make a decision? I’ll be submitting my resume immediately.
This was just one exercise, one data point. Shouldn’t a GM want the input of his team? Do you know if other teams do anything similar? Things can change very quickly on draft day…….
@@scooter5940 How About you first hire the persistent, GM and the coach the bears hired the coach first second the GM and then the persistent that’s what bad organizations due! Again coaches players and GM’s come and go but what remains the same is the bears bad organization!
god this is incredible. I wish we could get more former high-ups from the Bears organization to do interviews like these. Ideally so they can point out all the flaws within the organization so that maybe one day they actually change things based off feedback to get better
Great interview, but it isnt a smoking gun that these two players are bad. The amount of context we have for how poorly the team was run on the coaching level is damning against any attempt to lynch them. Remember that Mitch popped off in 2018, before other positions took a steep decline. Fields was rated top 5 in qbr last season for the last half while making baller throws and it wasnt just running that got him there. People who understand very little about the game will always jump to attack the quarterback first. Bills fans were going to hang Josh Allen for how bad he looked. Now hes a top 5 qb. Turn your tiny brains on and think through the context.
This is AMAZING… the very end about Justin is 1000% true. I have gone back and watched a bunch of games…he’s not the same player anymore. He needs to find his swag FAST!
I just remember screaming at my tv when they took Trubisky over Watson or Mahomes. Dude started 1 year for a bad college team. Unacceptable and unforgivable.
Chiefs traded up from 27 to 10 to get Mahomes and he had been Brett Veach's focus for a long time. Obviously the Chiefs knew something that wasn't that hard to figure out.
Well if you watch the Kansas City play. 80% of what they do is off script, Pat rarely plays within the offense. Travis Kelce has ran an actual route in the playroom in years and Tyreek didn't either. If you look at the all 22 on pat he misses wide open recievers all the time in the structure of the play. Same a Watson one reason why he struggling in Cleveland, I believe he will get better but he never played on script. Bill O'brien was perfect with watson. This is why I don't think Caleb Williams will be good with chicago if you don't get a play caller like that. Please tell me the last time he played on script?
That's why I don't buy it when people say "nobody knew Mahomes would be that good"..... Apparently SOMEBODY knew. Dude was doing video game numbers at Texas tech. Any NFL staff not investigating that was derelict in their duty.
@BigBrotherMotown Yep this is why Andy Reid might be considered betterthan belichek after he retires. Because bill rode Brady and got lucky Brady was Brady. But andy was successful at Philly then was a winner at KC and despite having a top 10 qb traded up to get mahomes and knew exactly what to do with him.
@@oshae248nice try. Mahomes off script playmaking is certainly what makes him generational, but he very much runs that offense from the pocket efficiently. If you look at the numbers his production off the charts on both holding the ball less than 2.5 seconds AND over 5 seconds. Josh Lucas got a lot wrong as an evaluator but he's right about unicorn
Im sorry but if Mahomes came to Chicago, he would not be the guy that we know of now. He’d be a great talent, but he wasn’t going to get the high level coaching and had the opportunity to sit and learn behind a good veteran qb in Chicago that he got in KC. John Fox wasn’t a qb guru and Mike Glennon wasn’t a qb that had a lot of experience and success in the NFL.
The Bears had a top 10 defense throughout most of Trubisky's tenure. We didn't need Mahomes to come here and become "KC Mahomes", Mahomes with our defense wouldn't have needed to carry the team and an above average version of Mahomes is all we would have needed to make thr Bears a perennial playoff team. 60-70% of Mahomes' potential is better than 100% of Trubisky. The dude was a 3 year starter with a 5,000 yard season at Texas Tech. He would be better than Mitch in ANY circumstance including the Bears.
@@Harun-cd6jz in 18, they probably beat the Eagles with Mahomes. I still think the bears would’ve regressed in 19 with Mahomes. Nagys offense was figured out by the end of 2018. And the bears problems on the o line started getting bad in 2019. Mahomes would’ve been running for his life like he did in the Super Bowl Vs Tampa.
Totally disagree with this thinking. A great player will be great no matter where they go. Mitch and Fields u have to Totally design a generic offense because their lack of talent as a q.b.
@@jayboek2854 systems and coaching matter. Alex Smith was a bust until Jim Harbaugh got to the 49ers. Then he went to play for Andy Reid in KC and put up big numbers for many years. Andy Reid turned Michael Vick into a good passer. Randell Cunningham struggled in Jon Grudens offense, got injured because they asked him to play from the pocket, then when he went to the Vikings, he found a system that fit him and he put up big numbers there. Steve Young was a bust in Tampa but Bill Walsh coached him up and he got to sit behind Joe Montana. We see it today with Geno Smith in Seattle. Talent does matter, but Mahomes has gave Andy Reid and Alex Smith all the credit for coaching him into the player that he is today. The most important free agent to a team is the head coach, then your o line coach. The team is a reflection of the head coach and qb, and the o line coach knows what the offense is capable of running. So the o line coach and OC should always be on the same page.
Love the interview but the drafting Trubisky over Mahomes/Watson part was quite cringey. He knows he can’t just say, we picked the one we’d want as our son in law/the one that we related to the most 😂😮💨
@@electric8668exactly that’s what made that part so hard to watch, because you know he’s bullshitting saying everything BUT what was actually behind it
I don't hear any of the Monday morning quarterbacks addressing the elephant in the room: the fact that the fan base and local sports media screamed for Fields to replace Andy Dalton. How might Fields's career arc have been different if Nagy and Pace had stuck to their guns and allowed him to learn behind an established QB?
I really loved Brock Purdy… And I even told the Bears in my mock draft, that they should drop some in the sixth or seventh round… I thought it would be a great back up or starting quarterback… Rosen spectacular but he’s plays intelligent football and he makes good throws… so in the next year I kept telling him about the Bears again just thinking it would be a great idea to have them in Chicago but anyway we should get a whole new coaching system if they don’t return next year
Bears fans should watch Caleb Williams against Notre Dame. * He shows you how any quarterback plays when pressure is getting to him, and receivers are being contested not allowed to run freely all over the field. Shalom
Listening to the rationale of choosing Trubisky over Watson is fascinating. That Lucas' concerns about Watson's penchant for going "off-script" at times (ala Brett Favre) makes me appreciate how much better the Packers are at evaluating QBs.
A room full of guys like this Josh explains exactly why we are where we are. Horrible judges of talent. I don’t mean that rudely just matter of factly.
I think maybe scouts need to start looking at players like Purdy instead of disqualifying them because of competition level, team profile, or combine stats. Seems that offense type and reps should be weighed more heavily on the analysis.
I agree. I wonder if Bagent could end up being a bit like Purdy. While it is D2, he had 5 years starting experience. He's basically the same age as Justin even.
Problem is they overwhelmingly value potential and upside over floor. Brock always had a high floor but he was seen as a low ceiling guy. The polar opposite of Trey Lance. One had an extensive body of work but that also hurt him because it was thought as that’s all there is to him while the other barely played a full season of college football but checked all the measurable
@Christian-eq6pq when has raw high upside been worth the pick? Lance? Fields? Mahomes wasn’t in the same category as those two either he was a three year starter he was the reason his team was even competitive. If you’re going to take high upside they also need to have that other stuff.
so, what I am hearing is that the talent evaluators of Chicago are notoriously bad. Listening to him tells me why the Bears have not been successful. How do you say that about Watson? In what realm is Trubisky better than him? And if Justin did not have the experience, why draft him? None of this makes sense.
Real talk, Patrick Mahomes was a three year starter with a 5,000 yard season at Texas Tech and that was still not enough for him to get drafted over Trubisky who had 13 starts. Deshaun Watson showed his talent against Alabama, played tougher competition, and was a mutil year starter and that wasn't enough for him to go over Trubisky? Watson played in the same conference as Trubisky which means Trubisky wasn't even the best QB in the ACC, yet they still took him over Watson?? These dudes are idiots.
@@Harun-cd6jz TBF, Watson was a sure bet, but Mahomes wasn't. He played in a college specialist system in a conference that hasn't played defense since the 70s. He could have become Mahomes... or one of the other 41 QBs who threw for like 8000 yards and 75 TDs a season in the Air Raid but can't actually play at the NFL level. To be certain, the Bears would have ruined Mahomes too.
I wonder if the Bill Polian interview on the ESPN a few days ahead of the draft had anything to do with the Bears moving up to take Mitch Trubisky? Because during the interview they asked him on his philosophy on drafting and he responds was, if you believe in a guy? You just have to, go get him! And the Bears did! But he used that statement more than a few times during the interview!
I wanted Deshaun and was so surprised they paid so much to move up one spot. They fact that they wrote off DeShaun before the draft even started was absurd.
This is so trivial. These scouts get paid so much to do what any person can do. You just need the eye for talent. The numbers are always extremely deceptive. It shouldn't be like buying a used car
So basically its hard getting picks correct. Many busted picks by all teams but best to sit a QB and have them learn but coaches get pressured to put them in by either the GM or owner.
Hearing Josh speak let's me know why the bears have been so inept at picking qbs "we don't really take anything away from those dinners " than why have them? Clearly those dinners had some effect Mahomes being "jittery" was held against him along with his play style now look at the bears an absolute dumpster fire. Good for Mahomes I do think if the bears drafted him his career would have nose dived just look how terrible they are at what they do.
While Patrick Mahomes and Watson still on the board, I wanna know what was said to convince Bears GM to move up a spot to draft Trubisky... what was the details that said, yep, he's our QB....
I am so tired of “former” unemployed staff giving “insight” and being treated as “experts” on the failures, inconsistency, or whatever popular catchphrase is the flavor of the day, about Justin Fields. Watch ACTUAL former players, coaches, and personnel that are unbiased……from WINNING franchises….breakdown the films from his games,….and a common theme arises…. “the play/routes called against the defensive alignment has very little chance for success and isn’t the best play to exploit the defensive coverage. Luke Getsy is trying everything that worked for a hall of fame qb as if it was his play design or play calling that led to success. Aaron Rogers was successful DESPITE Getsy’s play calling or design. Fields isn’t a HALL OF FAME QB!!! Everyone is trying to use him as a scapegoat. It’s despicable and on par for one of the modern day worst franchises. What an absolute embarrassment and joke of a franchise…..to ruin top draft QB after top draft QB. YOU’RE THE PROBLEM!!!! If we were to calculate the odds of one franchise having as many first round busts as the Bears have, it would be probably be so far improbable, that it would be in the statistical category of impossibility. (signed, life long Bears fan).
Some times you hit and you miss..qb is the hardest position to figure it out. So many factors for the qb to be success or not. Have a plan and milestone for a rookie qb.
But every common fan of football knew Mitch was a bust. I thought fields would be a bust too but other people had thought otherwise. At the end of the day you look at the two and there’s no realistic reason why they’ll succeed except they’ll get experience. Watson you knew was a gamer he shredded the best defense at the time in bama twice when bama didn’t allow you to get them twice in back to back season. Mahomes had the arm talent to hit anything from anywhere. Max jones could run an offense and find open guys Lance had no reason he had little to know college experience but looked good against d3 players and had a strong not a good arm just strong
@@JJ-zr6fu if that is the case with common fans. the owner and gm can just go ask a common fan to draft a qb and run their scouting department. No body know how these qb would turned out.
Our worst fears realized. The sky could be falling with franchise QBs, but the Bears will go out of their way to find the one bust of them all. Insanity
Incredible interview. Whoever put this interview together deserves a lot of praise.
Unlike the interviewee
Agree. It was neat to hear the personnel side in that decision process. I feel for Fields. Even when he plays well he’s surrounded by coaching that can’t manage games & makes bad decisions. Where a QB ends up is so important for development.
This was a fantastic interview and Josh was an excellent guest props to him for answering really difficult questions.
They didn’t like Mahommes or Watson because they didn’t think off script ability doesn’t transfer to nfl. When you have a bad line and bad plays, sounds like off script thinking would help.
That’s because until recently they all wanted Brady and manning guys who’d check into the perfect and deliver a pinpoint ball.
They didn’t want a farve a Vick a rothlessberger because the success of the play relied to much on the qb improvising or taking risks instead running the OCs plays
Except he can't read well and makes bad decisions. It'd help if he wasn't bad at those things.
@@JJ-zr6fuif you didn’t want a running qb, that’s back from the 90s. It not a recent thing to want one now when you have Mcnabb, Wilson, Big Ben and even rodgers can run. You want a qb that can run to extend and throw which Watson and Mahommes can do. Fields and trubisky college highlights showed they didn’t have accuracy. Wr we’re wide open and in fields case, his wr had to make major adjustments
This interview was amazing!! It left me wanting more. Big respect to Josh for allowing us Bear fans a chance to get a glimpse behind the curtain. He was very transparent and honest about some of his miscalculations.
Isn't he just admitting that he's incompetent?
His answer on Watson was horrible. Watson was by far a better prospect by all the metrics he highlighted and they didn’t even consider him.
Josh definitely gave clarity for why we’ve been so bad for so long. His breakdown of picking QBs was insane. So much wrong with everything.
Josh Lucas and Ryan Pace are the worst General Managers in Chicago Bears history. Two giant misses with the most important position on the field. This interview made me feel worse, not better.
@@JJ-zr6fuAnd what exactly has Watson done in his "stellar" NFL career? 😂
This is the most fascinating and insightful interview I've seen. Love this! Need have Josh Lucas on more!
This was a really insightful interview. One of the best I've heard of and Josh really simplified it down for us non-football experts. The part about having fluid intelligence over pre-game and book intelligence so to speak was very telling. It's clear that Mahomes has fluid intelligence to be able to improvise and think on his feet while Mitch and Justin not so much. I enjoyed the in depth detail about the scouting and draft process they went through when going with Mitch and Justin. It doesn't change the fact that they made the wrong decision by drafting Trubisky over Mahomes but enjoyed the insight from someone who had first hand knowledge
Love the interview but the drafting Trubisky over Mahomes/Watson part was quite cringey. He knows he can’t just say, we picked the one we’d want as our son in law/the one that we related to the most 😂
@@jahitrotter4734 Yea, he kind of made it seem like Trubisky's in person dinner put him over the top and that Mahomes seemed a little jittery and anxious in his dinner with the reps. On one hand, he said that it's not advisable to trust a QB who has only had 1 or 2 yrs of starting in college and that's exactly what they did with Trubisky...ugh...
If Browns personnel department goes with who they wanted in Trubisky at #1, we would have had Mahomes at 2 or 3. I need a drink....
Mitch and Justin are both able to read a defense well enough to drop and run. Both of them have actually showed talent in passing, but people won't hear that because apparently no one understands how a team works let alone context.
@bodvarson1933 The nfl can scheme against one trick pony’s at qb. Fields can only threaten you as a runner so they scheme for it and he becomes one the worst qbs in the nfl.
This is literally one of the most insightful and interesting interviews I’ve ever heard. We NEVER get anything like this.
What Josh is telling us is that the Bears scouting department sucks.
Results are there and have been for years
Exactly. Makes sense that their picks always suck
Facts - it clearly says Sir your staff is highly inept and has no plan to develop or draft qbs
Not sure that it’s scouting rather than what they’re told to look for when scouting. All of these guys ignore Patrick Mahomes because they’ve been told to find the next Kirk Cousins.
A game truly driven by players has been taken over by coaches & execs who “fake until they make it.” They utter the magic buzzwords to get hired & direct a staff in a direction that most execs don’t truly understand. There’s another good interview about the minute details of plays that Fields is running. It appears that the Bears are running some plays that were customized/adjusted by others for very specific situations that don’t apply to the Bears. But “fake it until you make it” coaches don’t realize they’re running it the wrong way so Fields has no chance of executing those plays unless he makes his own adjustments. The best coaches in the history of this game going back to Paul Brown & Vince Lombardi were TEACHERS. Today there’s a bunch of Madden players so the gap widens & the guys like Justin Fields are sacrificed & pushed into playing parts trying to get drafted high instead of falling to good teams like Dan Marino in 1983 going next to last to a Super Bowl team. These colleges need to have ppl help these kids look out for themselves when they declare for the draft. Instead, being drafted high by a trash team plays in to promoting the college & the player gets thrown under the bus if he can’t overcome the vultures trying to keep their jobs.
Facts
This conversation could have been 28 hours long and I would have listened to every second. Really enthralling stuff.
Best half hour I have seen on youtube. Why don't we see more truth like this.
That is one of the most insightful sports interviews I've ever listened to. I could have listened to Josh Lucas being interviewed like this for 3 hours. And I'm not even a Bears fan.
If only we all had as much insight and perspective on how to draft the worst players available
The Bears looked at what Deshawn did to Bama's pro talent defense and said "2nd round"!!!😂😂😂
Then they looked at Mitchs mediocre college tenure and said "trade up"😂😂😂
I gave up as a Bears fan that night. I can't care until these losers sell the team
@VoidSurfer9 I cared when they got Mack. All they needed was Robbie Gould to win the super bowl. But I haven’t really cared since fangio left. Fields was a bust that’s why he fell.
At least we don't spend too much time during the season bc it is end within 3-6 wks. 😅 damn
This is one of the best NFL interviews ever recorded. Well done.
The Mitch trubisky trade deserves a 30 for 30 documentary lol this guy literally said college experience is invaluable but then they drafted the qb with the least experience in Mitch 😂😂😂
Wow. I respect him for doing this interview
The signing of Mitch with both Mahomes and Watson available to pick took this franchise back a decade
It sent us into another dimension. 😢
I agree should have taken Patrick or Watson just say ya'll got it wrong
..
We should exile this guy out of IL.
@@Mylefthook he said we should get rid of fields. go figure
Bears fans needed this!!
Fantastic transparency! More should folks should do this as it will help with understanding why they did what they did for whatever the case maybe. Great work here.
I'm not a Bears fan and it was a fantastic interview. Love the honesty and humility of Josh Lucas.
Basically we’re looking into the thought process of a franchise thats never had a 4k yard passer
Yup
Then why you here
@@EviIM0nk3y everyone loves a good train wreck
Man this is horrible. I can’t believe the nfl thought Mitch was it. Granted it was the brown and bears but still crazy these back office people loved him.
@@newnewjohnson4776 bruh what? The Ryan Pace era was masterclass in failure at QB. This is a front office that paid Mike Glennon a three year 45mil deal to start 4 games, and it only gets worse there.
This interview is both fascinating and sad. I like Lucas, very personable and articulate. Just sad at the state of the franchise and our GM got to pick 2 QBs.
Josh Is outstanding ! He makes a lot of sense to me,. Great guest & glad he is allowed to talk....
Josh Lucas is the man. We have been craving this insight and genuinely appreciate his candor. Phenomenal interview.
He's the man that has guaranteed football misery for Chicago fans for the last 7 years... totally rockin'
@@VoidSurfer9exactly
The man? Must be a Packers fan lol
Love the interview but the drafting Trubisky over Mahomes/Watson part was quite cringey. He knows he can’t just say, we picked the one we’d want as our son in law/the one that we related to the most 😂🙄
This was excellent! Fascinating. Loved every minute
This is going to go down as an all-time great 670 interview
This interview was great but it also revealed a flawed that they're not very good at scouting either. I would like to know what top or 1st round picks that he was apart of that panned out through out his career of scouting? So far we know of 0-2.
Was he there for Kevin white?
The fact that they seriously thought Watson was gonna be a 2nd round pick speaks VOLUMES about their ability to analyze QBs. All you had to do was watch the 2 National Title games against Bama to know that he was the real deal. Still angers me endlessly to this day.
It’s not that simple did you watch
A simpleton could tell Watson was going to be good after watching him in college.
@@stevehannah how I was high on Mahomes NYGs wanted to trade up for him but he was raw he’s an outlier Watson is too he plays very reckless passing and running the eye test is important but banking on outliers is hard when your head is on the line Manziel beat up on Bama
Watson doesn't matter anymore. He would've done the same thing here that he did in Houston and then everyone would've been talking about how we should've drafted Mahomes over Watson. Watson is a headcase. The key issue is Mahomes being passed over, not Watson
That’s not what he said. He said he talked to others and they came back with a 2nd round grade based on their intangibles and measured categories
Thank you for pressing him on the decision to draft Mitch, and the thought process behind the decision... There was nothing about Mitch that screamed #3 Overall Pick. Then to TRADE UP to #2 was absolutely insane! Ryan Pace let some randoms rumors spook him, and he promptly set the franchise back... Take Pat Mahomes out the picture, Watson was the no brainer QB choice at that time in history. Not Mitch!!
This is a legendary interview !
he gives a great perspective sounds like our management scouts are truly the problem who continue to fumble the ball crazy…
Amazing interview. Gotta get Josh on again.
@670theScore Just wanted to chime in like most and say this interview is hands down one of the best ever on the Score. Instant classic. Things most fans wanted to hear and rarely do from behind the curtain.
The damn QB position…
Who the hell really knows. It’s also why I love this sport, it’s such an incredibly difficult position. What a quality conversation this was.
as a packers fan this is comedy gold i could watch stuff like this all day
This was awesome! A rare look behind the curtain.
This was some great stuff. Fascinating and honest.
Wow this was gold. Please more of this!!!
Lucus talked about QB reps are important, but selected Trubisky over Mahomes or Watson.
this is what doesn't add up
Never seen anything like this. Crazy interview!
10:53 - This is what pissed me off about the Pace/Nagy era, they never had a back up plan! How on earth would you think that Andy Dalton would get through an entire season healthy with a Bottom 5 OLine? Why would you NOT have a base package for Justin ready to go just in case? If I remember correctly, Nagy barely gave him reps in the preseason, then gave him an open playbook on his FIRST GAME! They never had a Plan B, C, D with player personnel, no game plan adjustments, nothing!!
Dude that question about trading up from 3 to 2 and not being okay with Mahomes was a phenomenal question.
It's so strange, right. I'm trying to analyze the answer and I believe the Bears a) thought Mitch was clearly better than Mahomes (despite less experience?) and b) felt that missing out on Mitch at 2 would mean "sure we'll take Patrick but not at 3 because he's not going in the top 10 ..... meaning they somehow thought "Patrick would be there mid 1st round" or whatever. So wild lol
Josh Lucas is here to educate us. Great interview!
As a lifelong Bears fan, this interview is so painful to hear. Write down who you think we should draft on draft day (and speculate who’ll be gone without discussing) and this is used to make a decision? I’ll be submitting my resume immediately.
Exactly you know who makes decisions like that BAB ORGANIZATIONS!
Yeah the way he made it seem like it came down to other stuff and not this dinner, and walked it back. Wanted to throw my phone.
This was just one exercise, one data point. Shouldn’t a GM want the input of his team? Do you know if other teams do anything similar? Things can change very quickly on draft day…….
@@scooter5940 How About you first hire the persistent, GM and the coach the bears hired the coach first second the GM and then the persistent that’s what bad organizations due! Again coaches players and GM’s come and go but what remains the same is the bears bad organization!
Absolutely GOLD interview. Hopefully you guys pin this one.
So many questions answered! amazing interview
Terrific interview. What might have been.
This is the best interview/video I have ever seen
Hello little brother! I'm very proud of what you have accomplished in your life. I love you!
god this is incredible. I wish we could get more former high-ups from the Bears organization to do interviews like these. Ideally so they can point out all the flaws within the organization so that maybe one day they actually change things based off feedback to get better
Great interview, but it isnt a smoking gun that these two players are bad. The amount of context we have for how poorly the team was run on the coaching level is damning against any attempt to lynch them. Remember that Mitch popped off in 2018, before other positions took a steep decline. Fields was rated top 5 in qbr last season for the last half while making baller throws and it wasnt just running that got him there. People who understand very little about the game will always jump to attack the quarterback first. Bills fans were going to hang Josh Allen for how bad he looked. Now hes a top 5 qb. Turn your tiny brains on and think through the context.
This is AMAZING… the very end about Justin is 1000% true. I have gone back and watched a bunch of games…he’s not the same player anymore. He needs to find his swag FAST!
As a twenty plus year score listener this is one of the best segments .
I just remember screaming at my tv when they took Trubisky over Watson or Mahomes. Dude started 1 year for a bad college team. Unacceptable and unforgivable.
This is so painful to watch imagining there was a scenario we took mahomes
@23:55.... Mahomes had Andy Reid. There's no way that can compare to the Bears coahing. C'mon.
Great segment!
Chiefs traded up from 27 to 10 to get Mahomes and he had been Brett Veach's focus for a long time. Obviously the Chiefs knew something that wasn't that hard to figure out.
Well if you watch the Kansas City play. 80% of what they do is off script, Pat rarely plays within the offense. Travis Kelce has ran an actual route in the playroom in years and Tyreek didn't either. If you look at the all 22 on pat he misses wide open recievers all the time in the structure of the play. Same a Watson one reason why he struggling in Cleveland, I believe he will get better but he never played on script. Bill O'brien was perfect with watson. This is why I don't think Caleb Williams will be good with chicago if you don't get a play caller like that. Please tell me the last time he played on script?
Mahomes was also given a god level team. You dont have Mahomes as we know him if taken by Chicago
That's why I don't buy it when people say "nobody knew Mahomes would be that good"..... Apparently SOMEBODY knew. Dude was doing video game numbers at Texas tech. Any NFL staff not investigating that was derelict in their duty.
@BigBrotherMotown Yep this is why Andy Reid might be considered betterthan belichek after he retires. Because bill rode Brady and got lucky Brady was Brady.
But andy was successful at Philly then was a winner at KC and despite having a top 10 qb traded up to get mahomes and knew exactly what to do with him.
@@oshae248nice try. Mahomes off script playmaking is certainly what makes him generational, but he very much runs that offense from the pocket efficiently. If you look at the numbers his production off the charts on both holding the ball less than 2.5 seconds AND over 5 seconds. Josh Lucas got a lot wrong as an evaluator but he's right about unicorn
Im sorry but if Mahomes came to Chicago, he would not be the guy that we know of now. He’d be a great talent, but he wasn’t going to get the high level coaching and had the opportunity to sit and learn behind a good veteran qb in Chicago that he got in KC. John Fox wasn’t a qb guru and Mike Glennon wasn’t a qb that had a lot of experience and success in the NFL.
The Bears had a top 10 defense throughout most of Trubisky's tenure. We didn't need Mahomes to come here and become "KC Mahomes", Mahomes with our defense wouldn't have needed to carry the team and an above average version of Mahomes is all we would have needed to make thr Bears a perennial playoff team.
60-70% of Mahomes' potential is better than 100% of Trubisky.
The dude was a 3 year starter with a 5,000 yard season at Texas Tech. He would be better than Mitch in ANY circumstance including the Bears.
@@Harun-cd6jz in 18, they probably beat the Eagles with Mahomes. I still think the bears would’ve regressed in 19 with Mahomes. Nagys offense was figured out by the end of 2018. And the bears problems on the o line started getting bad in 2019. Mahomes would’ve been running for his life like he did in the Super Bowl Vs Tampa.
Pat Mahomes would have ended up exactly like FIELDS. No infrastructure and Matt Nagy.
Totally disagree with this thinking. A great player will be great no matter where they go. Mitch and Fields u have to Totally design a generic offense because their lack of talent as a q.b.
@@jayboek2854 systems and coaching matter. Alex Smith was a bust until Jim Harbaugh got to the 49ers. Then he went to play for Andy Reid in KC and put up big numbers for many years. Andy Reid turned Michael Vick into a good passer. Randell Cunningham struggled in Jon Grudens offense, got injured because they asked him to play from the pocket, then when he went to the Vikings, he found a system that fit him and he put up big numbers there. Steve Young was a bust in Tampa but Bill Walsh coached him up and he got to sit behind Joe Montana. We see it today with Geno Smith in Seattle. Talent does matter, but Mahomes has gave Andy Reid and Alex Smith all the credit for coaching him into the player that he is today. The most important free agent to a team is the head coach, then your o line coach. The team is a reflection of the head coach and qb, and the o line coach knows what the offense is capable of running. So the o line coach and OC should always be on the same page.
This was a great segment.
They didnt want Patrick Mahomes to be the face of the Bears. The fact it never dawned on them to talk to Watson is crazy. That staff sucked.
Race was behind drafting Trubisky over Watson or Mahomes.
Love the interview but the drafting Trubisky over Mahomes/Watson part was quite cringey. He knows he can’t just say, we picked the one we’d want as our son in law/the one that we related to the most 😂😮💨
Unbelievably crazy.
@@electric8668exactly that’s what made that part so hard to watch, because you know he’s bullshitting saying everything BUT what was actually behind it
@@electric8668we have a black qb right now, race did not play a factor
I don't hear any of the Monday morning quarterbacks addressing the elephant in the room: the fact that the fan base and local sports media screamed for Fields to replace Andy Dalton. How might Fields's career arc have been different if Nagy and Pace had stuck to their guns and allowed him to learn behind an established QB?
Exceptional content.
Terrific insight. Two swings and miss
I really loved Brock Purdy… And I even told the Bears in my mock draft, that they should drop some in the sixth or seventh round… I thought it would be a great back up or starting quarterback… Rosen spectacular but he’s plays intelligent football and he makes good throws… so in the next year I kept telling him about the Bears again just thinking it would be a great idea to have them in Chicago but anyway we should get a whole new coaching system if they don’t return next year
Isn't Brock Purdy a Big XII QB as well? I know not in 2016 I get that. Was Dalton and TCU still Mountain West back then? Food for thought.
Baker was as well he was drafted first overall the year before. The big 12 qb narrative is a dumb one
In reality the nfl had to adjust to the qbs colleges were producing
Bears fans should watch Caleb Williams against Notre Dame.
* He shows you how any quarterback plays when pressure is getting to him, and receivers are being contested not allowed to run freely all over the field.
Shalom
Listening to the rationale of choosing Trubisky over Watson is fascinating.
That Lucas' concerns about Watson's penchant for going "off-script" at times (ala Brett Favre) makes me appreciate how much better the Packers are at evaluating QBs.
Loved the interview
A room full of guys like this Josh explains exactly why we are where we are. Horrible judges of talent. I don’t mean that rudely just matter of factly.
I think maybe scouts need to start looking at players like Purdy instead of disqualifying them because of competition level, team profile, or combine stats.
Seems that offense type and reps should be weighed more heavily on the analysis.
I agree.
I wonder if Bagent could end up being a bit like Purdy. While it is D2, he had 5 years starting experience. He's basically the same age as Justin even.
Problem is they overwhelmingly value potential and upside over floor. Brock always had a high floor but he was seen as a low ceiling guy. The polar opposite of Trey Lance. One had an extensive body of work but that also hurt him because it was thought as that’s all there is to him while the other barely played a full season of college football but checked all the measurable
@Christian-eq6pq when has raw high upside been worth the pick? Lance? Fields? Mahomes wasn’t in the same category as those two either he was a three year starter he was the reason his team was even competitive.
If you’re going to take high upside they also need to have that other stuff.
so, what I am hearing is that the talent evaluators of Chicago are notoriously bad. Listening to him tells me why the Bears have not been successful. How do you say that about Watson? In what realm is Trubisky better than him? And if Justin did not have the experience, why draft him? None of this makes sense.
There's a reason why this guy is talking on the radio and not in an organization.
I still hope he makes it.
Bear down!!!
Makes.... what?
great insight! thanks 670!
Mitch was better than people think. He went 25-13 in his last 3 years and 2 playoff appearances. Fields is 2-25 so far
Josh’s revisionist history & gaslighting of the fans is quite remarkable
Forreal 😂
It's like watching a serial killer documentary
Real talk, Patrick Mahomes was a three year starter with a 5,000 yard season at Texas Tech and that was still not enough for him to get drafted over Trubisky who had 13 starts.
Deshaun Watson showed his talent against Alabama, played tougher competition, and was a mutil year starter and that wasn't enough for him to go over Trubisky? Watson played in the same conference as Trubisky which means Trubisky wasn't even the best QB in the ACC, yet they still took him over Watson??
These dudes are idiots.
@@Harun-cd6jzbut Mahomes & Watson aren’t white frat boys so they didn’t meet that regimes qualifications
@@Harun-cd6jz TBF, Watson was a sure bet, but Mahomes wasn't. He played in a college specialist system in a conference that hasn't played defense since the 70s. He could have become Mahomes... or one of the other 41 QBs who threw for like 8000 yards and 75 TDs a season in the Air Raid but can't actually play at the NFL level. To be certain, the Bears would have ruined Mahomes too.
AMAZING interview
He said, “we knew we had two things coming in front of us…” @4:37
The fact this man can be bullish on why they traded up for Mitch because they liked Mitch SO MUCH more than Mahomes and Watson
His answer on Watson was not a good one. Watson was a better prospect than fields by all the characteristics he laid out.
I wanna know how much they paying this man for this interview
I wonder if the Bill Polian interview on the ESPN a few days ahead of the draft had anything to do with the Bears moving up to take Mitch Trubisky? Because during the interview they asked him on his philosophy on drafting and he responds was, if you believe in a guy? You just have to, go get him! And the Bears did! But he used that statement more than a few times during the interview!
If they had traded up and gotten mahomes or Watson they’d be praised for it. It only doesn’t make sense when Mitch was the pick
This is awesome. Man I wanted Mahomes so bad back then.
I wanted Deshaun and was so surprised they paid so much to move up one spot. They fact that they wrote off DeShaun before the draft even started was absurd.
This is so trivial. These scouts get paid so much to do what any person can do. You just need the eye for talent. The numbers are always extremely deceptive. It shouldn't be like buying a used car
Incredible stuff right here
So basically its hard getting picks correct. Many busted picks by all teams but best to sit a QB and have them learn but coaches get pressured to put them in by either the GM or owner.
Now I see why the Bears wiff on QBs so much. With this knowledge about the organization, we will never get a great QB.
This dude basically just said they watched the college tape and wholeheartedly thought trubisky was a better qb than Watson wtf
That’s what you got from this?
Hearing Josh speak let's me know why the bears have been so inept at picking qbs "we don't really take anything away from those dinners " than why have them? Clearly those dinners had some effect Mahomes being "jittery" was held against him along with his play style now look at the bears an absolute dumpster fire. Good for Mahomes I do think if the bears drafted him his career would have nose dived just look how terrible they are at what they do.
While Patrick Mahomes and Watson still on the board, I wanna know what was said to convince Bears GM to move up a spot to draft Trubisky... what was the details that said, yep, he's our QB....
My god, they shouldve just stayed put at #3 and "settled" for Mahomes if someone took Mitch at #2
Listening to this interview I do understand why pace was given such a long leash, his plan was ever evolving at least
To pass on Maholmes was the dumbest move the bears ever made. Then to trade up 1 pick for mitch 🤣🤣🤣 no wonder you where all fired🤣🤣🤣
I am so tired of “former” unemployed staff giving “insight” and being treated as “experts” on the failures, inconsistency, or whatever popular catchphrase is the flavor of the day, about Justin Fields. Watch ACTUAL former players, coaches, and personnel that are unbiased……from WINNING franchises….breakdown the films from his games,….and a common theme arises…. “the play/routes called against the defensive alignment has very little chance for success and isn’t the best play to exploit the defensive coverage. Luke Getsy is trying everything that worked for a hall of fame qb as if it was his play design or play calling that led to success. Aaron Rogers was successful DESPITE Getsy’s play calling or design. Fields isn’t a HALL OF FAME QB!!! Everyone is trying to use him as a scapegoat. It’s despicable and on par for one of the modern day worst franchises. What an absolute embarrassment and joke of a franchise…..to ruin top draft QB after top draft QB. YOU’RE THE PROBLEM!!!! If we were to calculate the odds of one franchise having as many first round busts as the Bears have, it would be probably be so far improbable, that it would be in the statistical category of impossibility. (signed, life long Bears fan).
All time for Danny. In his element 100%
Some times you hit and you miss..qb is the hardest position to figure it out. So many factors for the qb to be success or not. Have a plan and milestone for a rookie qb.
But every common fan of football knew Mitch was a bust. I thought fields would be a bust too but other people had thought otherwise. At the end of the day you look at the two and there’s no realistic reason why they’ll succeed except they’ll get experience.
Watson you knew was a gamer he shredded the best defense at the time in bama twice when bama didn’t allow you to get them twice in back to back season.
Mahomes had the arm talent to hit anything from anywhere.
Max jones could run an offense and find open guys
Lance had no reason he had little to know college experience but looked good against d3 players and had a strong not a good arm just strong
@@JJ-zr6fu if that is the case with common fans. the owner and gm can just go ask a common fan to draft a qb and run their scouting department. No body know how these qb would turned out.
Our worst fears realized. The sky could be falling with franchise QBs, but the Bears will go out of their way to find the one bust of them all.
Insanity
Good piece! Start Tyson Bagent. He had enough reps in college.
20:19 quick shift of eyes that they got played by 49ers. No doubt