Of course the horse deserved to come down. The four horse became steppy but never went off stride in front of Charlie. Brett reacted late and had to check before pulling three wide causing the incident. Had he moved wide a spilt second earlier there is no incident. It looked like Charlie may have hit the wheel of the four horse as he pulled three wide making him go off stride.
@@geedavia1785 I have re-watched the race numerous times... I BELIEVE and I FEEL that Charlie was to the outside and CLEAR of the #6 BEFORE the 6 broke... (there seemed to me a bit of contact between Brett Miller's head and the #6 horse's head as they both moved into the 3-wide position... and THEN, the 6 horse broke, and then, Charlie took a bad step just after that...) Clearly, this is a judgement call... If, in fact, the 6 hit the wheel of Brett's bike to cause the break, then YOU have a valid point, and, Brett would have known immediately if that was true...
Bulldog Hanover would have crushed this field in a laugher by I'm guessing 5 or 6 lengths under a hand drive. The Chinese should pay $350,000 U.S. to the owner Jack Darling because of Covid-19. The Bulldog will murder all these same horses in the North America Cup this September 11th at Woodbine racetrack in Toronto, Canada.
All I know is I've been picking them like the second coming of Nostradamus at Woodbine and Mohawk since they put in the slot machines. Before the slot machines nothin' but after megabucks. This is betting the races in Canada on this side of the border not on the U.S. side where the payouts are higher. Known as the master of the maidens I've broken the bank with all these maiden races since racing resumed after Covid-19. Maybe I can post my selections for Mohawk here as the jerk on Woodbine replays always takes down my selections. I've made a living betting horses since I was 16, 46 years ago. No one on Earth would have picked Bulldog Hanover to win the North America Cup after just his 4th race as a two year old and being out of a lesser sire like Shadow Play. I was one race away from being crowned Nostradamus 2021. Told the owner to get Randy Waples to drive him in the final. Nothing else I could do but Randy did drive the horse as a two year old.
@@harnessracingfans1000 Will do but I have to know the track bias before I can post picks as the bias can be strongly on the front end or coming from the back. I could put in the picks and revise them before the race if the track bias is different. Example the 2nd race at Mohawk yesterday the bias was all on the closers after the first race thus Young who has been driving better easily defeated the 1 to 5 shot in the 2nd race.
At the 6:16 mark the four pulls the plugs. Just before that the nine was starting to pull to the outside. When the 4 pulled the plugs the horse kind of took a step to the inside. Why the 9 didn't go around when he pulled out the first time I don't know. But the 6 ran over the 9. The 9's driver never threw his head back into the 4 or anything like that. Complete disgrace to pull the 9 down. Especially in a race of this magnitude
2 years to late but it’s still not official. Thanks for posting this race. . It’s answered more questions. Congrats to mark and dr Ian Moore classy interview as usual. 😎
@@harnessracingfans1000 he’s a commissioner at a racetrack in Indy I knew his wife I was about 12 working with my dad ray harrison who was a trainer for David I’m punkin be blessed
I had Rocky and he was loaded behind Charlie May. The four became a bit steppy on the turn, however, Brett reacted late and had to check before pulling three wide causing the incident.
Absolutely, Charlie May deserved to be disqualified. The horse driven by Yannick Gingras slowed and became rough gaited but never went off stride or veered from his lane so no foul was incurred. The incident happened when Brett Miller pulled his horse to go three wide but hit the wheel of the 4 horse and went off stride causing interference with Rocky Road Hanover racing behind Charlie May. Charlie quickly recovered but the damage was done as Rocky was left with no shot. Had Brett pulled a split second earlier there is no incident. The whole incident was sparked by Yannick slowing but that is not a foul.
did you all know the presiding judge's wife works for a staking company that staked two other horses in the race? from the lawsuit"Finally, I ALSO CONCUDE that the decision of the track side judges, of which Peter Koch was one of three members, and which was not overturned by the Commission was fatally flawed due to a conflict of interest that existed on the part of Mr. Koch himself. Mr. Koch, who served as the presiding judge that day, is married to a woman who is part of a staking company, which staked two other horses in the same race as Charlie May. Though he stated during his testimony that he was unaware of this situation until after the race dispute was decided, it strains credibility and common sense that he was completely unaware her company had an interest in other horses who were racing that day. Once the outcome of the race was called into question, the proper course of action should have been for Mr. Koch to recuse himself as a race judge. He chose not to, and as a result, while I am unable to completely disregard his expert and factual testimony, I DO CONCLUDE that he could have and should have known that recusal in this situation was the only proper course of action for him, and as such, his credibility as a witness must be called into question, regardless of and especially due to his years of experience in the industry. Simply put: He should have stepped aside. (emphasis added)"
Still can't see where 9 went wrong. Imagine how much this gelding took from stud book values in this race.And judges now can expect a handsome kick back.Shocking
Harness racing is so corrupt now I have been in the sport over 40 years and now you have trainers getting away with positive test I guess it is who you are . It is bad in Ohio with Ohio golden boy because of who his dad was , everyone knows he is using sinthedic EPO where hoping they start cleaning Ohio up next .
Warkenten didn't even realize that horses scattered around the final turn, nor did the telecasters. Horse racing sucks. The two biggest racest of the day in the throughbreds and harness both resulted in DQ's, with horses falling down or scattered, and with not a single announcer or commentator recognizing what was going on until many minutes latere. Lol. You cannot make this up. Such losers.
@@MN-fc5so I'll help with your argument. Meadlowlands Pace. Race caller Ken Warkentin was focusing on the lead four horses making the turn into the stretch he so missed the breaking horse which was in the back of the pack. Since the incident occurred among the backmarkers, both Dave Brower and Dave Little believed the breaker was no immediate factor into the finish. TVG.com Haskell: All the commentators saw and called the incident. No one hid anything from the public.
@@rendragmedia Commentators in the Haskell never mentioned the possibility of a DQ and interviewed the trainer and owner of the horse taken down without even asking the question on the telecast about the possibility of a DQ, a DQ that ended up being the quickest takedown in racing history. Brower and Little never even mentioned the possibility that there was even going to be an inquiry for many minutes. They had no clue until they were told that the judges were looking into things. Comical stuff all around. The Haskell announcer did in fact mention that a horse was down...lol. Of course he did as it was the middle horse of a three horse drive to the wire with yards to the finish. But everyone else had no clue about anything at all.
@@tomdallas3690 I will give you these points. TVG's Dave Weaver, who was making Pace card picks during the Del Mar telecast, immediately thought an inquiry would be needed. Secondly, I've seen TV talent focus on the unofficial winner, which can mean any other scenario would be cast aside or outright ignored.
Dave Little picked Charlie May so finding out about the incident had to hurt, especially when they replayed the race, he must have known the horse was coming down. The Dave’s follow these horses intimately all season long and to pick the winner of The Meadowlands Pace is a feather in the cap, but to not cash is painful to say the least.
Exactly because the horse is a pig! The Bulldog crushed him last year and this year in The North America Cup Lawless Shadow will be looking about 5 or 6 lengths straight in the distance watching Bulldog Hanover cross the finish line in a romp in The North America Cup.
Bulldog Hanover would have crushed this field in a laugher by I'm guessing 5 or 6 lengths under a hand drive. The Chinese should pay $350,000 U.S. to the owner Jack Darling because of Covid-19. The Bulldog will murder all these same horses in the North America Cup this September 11th at Woodbine racetrack in Toronto, Canada
@@M2BzombieBait Why'd I tell all you morons? The Bulldog just crushed your Lawless Shadow in the $159,600 OSS Gold Final At Woodbine tonight. The Bulldog parked the entire mile on purpose just to show how great he is and what he'll do to these pigs this September 11th at the North America Cup
I enjoy watching the races. The Meadowlands does a Great job with its social network. You shoe Great racing, Love watching the drivers and horses. Love Micd up, good group of people.
More b.s.... they should NEVER have taken down the WINNER...
Of course the horse deserved to come down. The four horse became steppy but never went off stride in front of Charlie. Brett reacted late and had to check before pulling three wide causing the incident. Had he moved wide a spilt second earlier there is no incident. It looked like Charlie may have hit the wheel of the four horse as he pulled three wide making him go off stride.
He knocked the 6 off stride...
Go rewatch the race.
@@geedavia1785 I have re-watched the race numerous times... I BELIEVE and I FEEL that Charlie was to the outside and CLEAR of the #6 BEFORE the 6 broke... (there seemed to me a bit of contact between Brett Miller's head and the #6 horse's head as they both moved into the 3-wide position... and THEN, the 6 horse broke, and then, Charlie took a bad step just after that...)
Clearly, this is a judgement call... If, in fact, the 6 hit the wheel of Brett's bike to cause the break, then YOU have a valid point, and, Brett would have known immediately if that was true...
@@geedavia1785 stop and look at 7;27 and7:28... freeze at both...
They had to give it to Lawless Shadow because Serge Savard owns him and also owns Shadow Play.
Will never like horses getting moved up in Huge races. Charlie didnt even hit the horse in the face...the best horse ( C.M. ) won.
Bulldog Hanover would have crushed this field in a laugher by I'm guessing 5 or 6 lengths under a hand drive. The Chinese should pay $350,000 U.S. to the owner Jack Darling because of Covid-19. The Bulldog will murder all these same horses in the North America Cup this September 11th at Woodbine racetrack in Toronto, Canada.
Tough call. Don't forget to join our Harness racing newsletter bit.ly/2X8MRIq .
That 9 shoildnt have been pulled down..The 4 made a bad step..What was suppose to do?
All I know is I've been picking them like the second coming of Nostradamus at Woodbine and Mohawk since they put in the slot machines. Before the slot machines nothin' but after megabucks. This is betting the races in Canada on this side of the border not on the U.S. side where the payouts are higher. Known as the master of the maidens I've broken the bank with all these maiden races since racing resumed after Covid-19. Maybe I can post my selections for Mohawk here as the jerk on Woodbine replays always takes down my selections. I've made a living betting horses since I was 16, 46 years ago. No one on Earth would have picked Bulldog Hanover to win the North America Cup after just his 4th race as a two year old and being out of a lesser sire like Shadow Play. I was one race away from being crowned Nostradamus 2021. Told the owner to get Randy Waples to drive him in the final. Nothing else I could do but Randy did drive the horse as a two year old.
If you want to post some plays etc.. I am starting a website for harness racing so send me an email at wilsoncole81@gmail.com
@@harnessracingfans1000 Will do but I have to know the track bias before I can post picks as the bias can be strongly on the front end or coming from the back. I could put in the picks and revise them before the race if the track bias is different. Example the 2nd race at Mohawk yesterday the bias was all on the closers after the first race thus Young who has been driving better easily defeated the 1 to 5 shot in the 2nd race.
Ya Canada got off with all that doping horses allard 😂😂 was sending dope their and the garbage judges do nothing
At the 6:16 mark the four pulls the plugs. Just before that the nine was starting to pull to the outside. When the 4 pulled the plugs the horse kind of took a step to the inside. Why the 9 didn't go around when he pulled out the first time I don't know. But the 6 ran over the 9. The 9's driver never threw his head back into the 4 or anything like that. Complete disgrace to pull the 9 down. Especially in a race of this magnitude
The #9 Horse should have never been taken down, they did it because the horse was from Ohio I think.
2 years to late but it’s still not official. Thanks for posting this race. . It’s answered more questions. Congrats to mark and dr Ian Moore classy interview as usual. 😎
I was a licensed groom in Chicago at 14 my dada’s a trainer he worked for Dave Magee he was the top driver I love this
Magee,Paisley, Busse,Banks, Curran-a great time
wow that's awesome!
What ever happened to Dave Magee
@@harnessracingfans1000 he’s a commissioner at a racetrack in Indy I knew his wife I was about 12 working with my dad ray harrison who was a trainer for David I’m punkin be blessed
@@jamesgould1627 Stanley Scott and Dwight banks I was kid and watched them all do it what memories
I had Rocky and he was loaded behind Charlie May. The four became a bit steppy on the turn, however, Brett reacted late and had to check before pulling three wide causing the incident.
Should Charlie May been taken down?
Absolutely, Charlie May deserved to be disqualified. The horse driven by Yannick Gingras slowed and became rough gaited but never went off stride or veered from his lane so no foul was incurred. The incident happened when Brett Miller pulled his horse to go three wide but hit the wheel of the 4 horse and went off stride causing interference with Rocky Road Hanover racing behind Charlie May. Charlie quickly recovered but the damage was done as Rocky was left with no shot. Had Brett pulled a split second earlier there is no incident. The whole incident was sparked by Yannick slowing but that is not a foul.
did you all know the presiding judge's wife works for a staking company that staked two other horses in the race? from the lawsuit"Finally, I ALSO CONCUDE that the decision of the track side judges, of which
Peter Koch was one of three members, and which was not overturned by the Commission
was fatally flawed due to a conflict of interest that existed on the part of Mr. Koch himself.
Mr. Koch, who served as the presiding judge that day, is married to a woman who is part
of a staking company, which staked two other horses in the same race as Charlie May.
Though he stated during his testimony that he was unaware of this situation until after the
race dispute was decided, it strains credibility and common sense that he was completely
unaware her company had an interest in other horses who were racing that day. Once
the outcome of the race was called into question, the proper course of action should have
been for Mr. Koch to recuse himself as a race judge. He chose not to, and as a result,
while I am unable to completely disregard his expert and factual testimony, I DO
CONCLUDE that he could have and should have known that recusal in this situation was
the only proper course of action for him, and as such, his credibility as a witness must be
called into question, regardless of and especially due to his years of experience in the
industry. Simply put: He should have stepped aside. (emphasis added)"
Meadowlands announcing crew is best in the business
You bet
4 broke first,then the 9.. there was no interference please open your eyes all!
Totally agree.
Still can't see where 9 went wrong.
Imagine how much this gelding took from stud book values in this race.And judges now can expect a handsome kick back.Shocking
Doc moore, great trainer, congrats.
Thank you kindly
Harness racing is so corrupt now I have been in the sport over 40 years and now you have trainers getting away with positive test I guess it is who you are . It is bad in Ohio with Ohio golden boy because of who his dad was , everyone knows he is using sinthedic EPO where hoping they start cleaning Ohio up next .
Sorry to hear that. I know it was bad back in the day.
It's still bad@@harnessracingfans1000
Mark actually has a triple:
Little Brown Jug (2006, Mr. Feelgood)
Meadowlands Pace
Gold Cup & Saucer (multiple times)
Not bad at all. Congratulations!
Don't forget the NORTH AMERICA CUP!
Sportswriter
He didnt win The Pace.
@@itsredbowtieofficially, according to the judges, he did. That's what counts, not what you or I think.
@@dantesindori3756 I'll look it up, thanks.
Warkenten didn't even realize that horses scattered around the final turn, nor did the telecasters. Horse racing sucks. The two biggest racest of the day in the throughbreds and harness both resulted in DQ's, with horses falling down or scattered, and with not a single announcer or commentator recognizing what was going on until many minutes latere. Lol. You cannot make this up. Such losers.
lol.. you have no concept of racing. Its you that sucks. stop saying things you know nothing about.. Crybaby
@@MN-fc5so I'll help with your argument. Meadlowlands Pace. Race caller Ken Warkentin was focusing on the lead four horses making the turn into the stretch he so missed the breaking horse which was in the back of the pack. Since the incident occurred among the backmarkers, both Dave Brower and Dave Little believed the breaker was no immediate factor into the finish. TVG.com Haskell: All the commentators saw and called the incident. No one hid anything from the public.
you are so right about that
@@rendragmedia Commentators in the Haskell never mentioned the possibility of a DQ and interviewed the trainer and owner of the horse taken down without even asking the question on the telecast about the possibility of a DQ, a DQ that ended up being the quickest takedown in racing history. Brower and Little never even mentioned the possibility that there was even going to be an inquiry for many minutes. They had no clue until they were told that the judges were looking into things. Comical stuff all around. The Haskell announcer did in fact mention that a horse was down...lol. Of course he did as it was the middle horse of a three horse drive to the wire with yards to the finish. But everyone else had no clue about anything at all.
@@tomdallas3690 I will give you these points. TVG's Dave Weaver, who was making Pace card picks during the Del Mar telecast, immediately thought an inquiry would be needed. Secondly, I've seen TV talent focus on the unofficial winner, which can mean any other scenario would be cast aside or outright ignored.
MANAGER MUST BE SELECTED TO HARNESS HALL OF FAME FACT MANAGER
😀
Miller Light Budweiser
Most justifiable
😃😀
Had to pause this to say - all blue n white no 5 I think - exceptional
yes ok
4 Got steppy first, tough call
Yes it was.
Dave Brower and Dave Little were declaring Charlie May the winner as if nothing happened at the top of the stretch
Little did they know there was a sham robbery by the judges about to take place.
Dave Little picked Charlie May so finding out about the incident had to hurt, especially when they replayed the race, he must have known the horse was coming down. The Dave’s follow these horses intimately all season long and to pick the winner of The Meadowlands Pace is a feather in the cap, but to not cash is painful to say the least.
yes that is true!
Totally agree with you.
Took him down because the horse from Ohio I think hah ha
Homefield Advantage Gratifying
Yes totally agree there
Lawless shadow will not be first or second in any of big races he is in for rest of the year against top colts in country..
Exactly because the horse is a pig! The Bulldog crushed him last year and this year in The North America Cup Lawless Shadow will be looking about 5 or 6 lengths straight in the distance watching Bulldog Hanover cross the finish line in a romp in The North America Cup.
We will see.
Let's see what happens the rest of the year
Here we are in Dec and lawless did nothing text of year .A few of these colts if brought back to race in 2022 will be fun to watch .ABB Hanover,ect
Bulldog Hanover would have crushed this field in a laugher by I'm guessing 5 or 6 lengths under a hand drive. The Chinese should pay $350,000 U.S. to the owner Jack Darling because of Covid-19. The Bulldog will murder all these same horses in the North America Cup this September 11th at Woodbine racetrack in Toronto, Canada
Charlie May comes out of the 9 hole, makes a break and then wins in 48:3 last quarter in 27 flat on a good track but sure, he gets beat by 5.
@@M2BzombieBait Why'd I tell all you morons? The Bulldog just crushed your Lawless Shadow in the $159,600 OSS Gold Final At Woodbine tonight. The Bulldog parked the entire mile on purpose just to show how great he is and what he'll do to these pigs this September 11th at the North America Cup
How did he do on September 11th ?
Charlie May love that horse! haha
Don't forget to join our Harness racing newsletter bit.ly/2X8MRIq .
Poor Don Tiger. From 350K to zero in 2 minutes. That's just brutal to have to absorb.
😀😃😆
Imo the most important pacing event in the u.s
Brett got fucking robbed.
I enjoy watching the races. The Meadowlands does a Great job with its social network. You shoe Great racing, Love watching the drivers and horses. Love Micd up, good group of people.
Mochas rase
😃😀
#5 made the race exciting made an awsome move
yes he did, to bad for the winner.
Gold Cup and Saucer and the Meadowlands Pace..
Yes. 😃😆
9 *INTERFERED* with the 6. Knocked the 6-off stride.
Y'all need to rewatch the race.
4 horse got steppy and backed into Charlie May! Should not have been disqualified! Rip off!
You need to rewatch the race.
#4 bad steps when he pulled plugs caused the whole chain reaction!
Bad call by judges.
Hard call.