Hifi Myths & Misconceptions - Hifi cables
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- Опубликовано: 30 июн 2024
- In this episode, I discuss the science and engineering relating to Hifi interconnects and speaker cables. Informed with facts you can make your own mind up if expensive cables are snake oil or worth the money. I also share my own subjective opinions and experiences with using cables at all sorts of price points in my Hifi systems.
I have a problem Tarun !
I'm in a quest for knowledge and understanding everything about our HiFi gear. I want to understand what does what and to what extend ? I want to know where is the value in a product ? What a component really do in a product ?
My goal is to buy at some point a big system but it's something a normal person can only do once. So i prefer to study a little bit before investing a lot. And it's fun.
I'm learning about speaker design, crossovers,... and i'm listening to a lot of speakers just to know how they sound.
I'm currently looking for new speakers (the audiophile bug) but all the speakers in my budget (1000-2000 euro) sound good but i dont think they are better than my elac debut 2 5.2 and triangle borea br02. I use them in a my bedroom (my favourite place to listen). The speakers are heavily modified : internal wire for atohm zef, binding post for pure copper, new crossovers with matching components (for the left and right speakers), caps, resistors and indoctors . I paid a lot of attention respecting the original design and i just bought better quality, better tolerance and mithycal better sounding (Jantzen superior z cap, mils resistors,..). All that to say my little speakers sound incredible ! After the right set up the imaging is killer on both.
The low end, the midrange, the highs everything has more layers.
I spent a lot of time listening to every change i made, piece by piece, just to know what does what ?
I did the same on my amp (Atoll In30) changed All the power supply caps for Audio Notes Kasei, Mundorf and Elna silmic II. I even changed the binding post and the little wires to connect them to the pc board. I felt the change. AMAZING !
But the biggest change happened after i added the audioquest powerquest in the mix. Everything plugged into the filter plugs even the amp. I think i understand what you was talking about in the linear power supply video. I thought i couldn't squeeze more performance out of my equipement but i discovered what people talk about when they say (grain in the sound).
Not the obvious one with bad equipement but the one introduce by electrical noise. The one that make the difference between what is perceived as analog or numeric ?
After that discovery i went all out and changed the power supply of my dacs, pre amp, fire tv, ethernet switch,... and they are all plugged in a second audioquest powerquest (and it's sounds better than just on the wall).
I think now i have a revealing little system. I swear i can hear the difference when i change ethernet cables.
(i left out the cables exploration, too long) but i know now how to season a system with them.
Now we can come to my problem Tarun : After all my trials and tribulations i feel like all the audiophile stuff about sound (imaging, soundstage, transparency, air,...) can be fixed quickly if you know what does what in a system and you can identify the problem by listening. But the sound of a speaker is the only thing that doesn't change even with the components. It can be more refine or change slightly the presentation of the frequencies but the speaker has it's sound. So what is it ? the cone material ? the driver ? the box ?....
There is no replacement for first hand listening sessions ?
Hi Yannick, you are doing exactly that right thing by reading as much as you can, exposing yourself to as much hifi as possible, experimenting to see what impact component changes make and judging by your own experiences. It is 100% the right approach and your passion and commitment is admirable. Keep going and I have no doubt you will be an authority on hifi.
I agree with you that the speaker and particularly how it is set up and interacts in your room is by far the biggest influence on the overall sound. Speakers have the biggest non-linearities, distortion, phase irregularities, dispersion anomalies, etc. of any component in your hifi chain. Get the speaker right and then the rest can follow. When it comes to what in a speaker makes the biggest influence on sound. I tend to agree with Andrew Jones (who designed your Elac) and Alan Shaw (designer of Harbeth) that it is probably the cone material. The reality is though that all the Thiele/Small parameters of a driver play an influence. Then you need to consider the behaviour of the drivers in the enclosure, the bass loading, cabinet resonances, edge diffraction issues, baffle step loss, etc.. The crossover plays its part as well. Even if the drivers have been chosen to work well together and the crossover has been designed correctly, capacitors and inductors by their nature are energy storing devices and will introduce phase irregularities.
You can see that the characteristics of a speaker are not down to one parameter but the complex interaction of several parameters. For example, it is easy to assume that all metal dome drivers are bright and that all soft dome drivers are rolled off. Although this can be a general characteristic, this simply isn’t the case. You can design a speaker with a metal dome driver to sound rolled off and also a soft dome driver to sound bright. If you are interested in the science and technology of loudspeaker design a good place to start is by reading Dr Floyd Toole’s book: The Acoustics and Psychoacoustics of Loudspeakers and Rooms. Thank you for the excellent question and giving me the chance to explain. 😉👍
Magnepans!
As Tarun has said, match your speakers to your room size and listening level that you use, same goes for the power amp!. Don't make the mistake of buying big and high power for the sake of it!, that is throwing money down the drain, and pretty well guaranteed that it will sound awful!. By all means buy the best that you can, within those parameter's and you will impress yourself with achieving audiophile quality!!!.
@@abritishaudiophile7314 Thanks for your answer. I'll continue my investigations. I ordered the book on amazon but i'm looking to find the translation in French my native langage for easier understanding. I'm sure i'll find what in need in it to start building new enclosure/cabinet for my speakers. I want to try that too just to ear the difference and build the best possible (no parrallel walls, stiff and thick to eliminate resonances,...). Thanks for the good advises and the good content. :)
Thank you David
I spent all my budget on just cables. Nothing else. No Equipment. Noise floor was incredible. Total silence. You could really 'hear the room'
🤣🤣🤣 thank you Ian
Ian Davis Good one. Did the cables reveal how crappy your room was?
@@cjpriustt no it has limited reflection in a a padded cell...
Nice one
@@ianpdavis you got your acoustic panels up that's good
I only recently came across your channel and I’m hooked, I can’t stop watching! Your way of speaking is very calming and easy to understand. Each video has given me something to think about as I try to plan putting a system together.
Thank you Benvos. Very kind of you to say and glad to be of some little help 😊👍👍
What a GREAT video on cables. I have been an audiophile for 40 years. I have had a large number of cables over the years ranging in cost from a little to a lot. This has been the most comprehensive and sensible explanation of cables that I have ever heard. I commend you for both the excellent delivery and content.
Thank you John. I appreciate you watching and your kind words of support 😉👍
John, you should watch the audioholics videos on speaker cables on RUclips.
As a marketing undergraduate we replicated a well known experiment using wine with labels covered but price information given to the subjects. Only one of more than a dozen subjects thought the three samples tasted the same. All others formed clear preferences, generally for either the most or least expensive wine. Amazingly, most defended their preferences even after being told that we had poured each sample from the same bottle, which we had done. The hifi world is full of convictions just as baseless.
I used to work as an RF engineer. Skin effect is irrelevant at audio frequencies! So long as you use quality connectors and shielded cable then the only other pertinent matters are the LCR characteristics of the cables. For competently designed active components and cables these should make little difference for typical values. For passive components like speakers and cartridges there can be some small audible effects but again this is wholly dependent on LCR and nothing to do with any of the high priced audio tom foolery. No need to spend more than a few pounds per metre to get any reasonable LCR you want. No-one can tell the difference between a £10k nordost and a starquad cable with neutriks at £30 in a blind test. The power of expectation and belief on perception explains the rest.
Thank you for watching and sharing 😉
@@abritishaudiophile7314 Such a diplomat! :)
these who tried to hear difference in double blind test could not actually hear them. Same goes for power conditioners and internet filters. But the audiophile industry is wary of upsetting their friend, even though many of them know the truth. As of our British Audiophile, I’m sure he is honest and really a heard these differences. The only problem is that he’s been tricked by his mind.
When I was younger we made a proper double blind smoke test, using relatively similar cigarettes brands, like Marlboro Gold & Red, Winston and Camel. None of the smokers could reliably recognize the brand they swore was their favorite in the test.
@@marcbungener1877 so... 3 euro RCA cable from local Lidl is as good as 40 euro Qed RCA cable?
@@raakareiska9804 I think we could be surprised, I still prefer well made good quality cable, especially if the incremental spend it 20 or 50 $. The sound might not be different but it doesn’t really matter. Spending 500 or more for RCA cable is pure waste. My dealer once sold me Cardas Cable, told me you can bring them back if you do not like them. I didn’t made a proper blind test because this requires people and my wife is not interested…but in my non blind test I could not hear a difference. However the expensive Cardas cable would sometime pick an interference than my well made 50.- cable would not. So I gave it back.
Another argument : go visit a professional recording studio where the music we listen is recorded and mixed ….and see what cables they are using. Sturdy good quality cables but not very expensive ones.
p.s. I have a quite revealing system with Wilson Audio loudspeakers and Bryston monoblocs. I just mention not to brag but because the narrative of the expensive cable community is « your system is not good enough ». Yesterday I came upon a post of someone proudly proclaiming his cables were 50% as expensive as his speakers but worth the cost. Did not bother do reply but found it quite sad.
Thanks for that perspective. One of the more balanced discussions I've seen. I especially appreciate the grounding in engineering with respect to electrical characteristics of the wire.
Indeed! I agree completely!
Probably one of if not the best practical tutorials on this hotly contested topic. Your science is solid and your introduction to the reality of this topic was brilliant. Love your channel! Thank you for sharing and best of luck on future videos
Hello again Tarun. For myself I use 12 GWA, solid core, Speaker wires and forget the rest of the B.S. No matter what I'm putting through to my Speakers, my personal ability to discern any gainful difference, beyond that, is absolutely negligible. I Love my Music, but I'm not a freaking snob. Thank You for what you put together here. You helped me a great deal. Cheers...
@@shineon7641 thank you. Great to learn about your experiences 😊👍
Just found your channel and loved the science. As a retired Headteacher I would give you a job teaching physics any day!! You have a lovely style and clarity in your thinking. Thank you.
Sorry I only just picked this up. Very kind and much appreciated 😊👍👍
Second time watching this video for a refresher course. Thank you so much for ‘Science Hour with A.B.T.’
Seriously, you have invested some time in preparing this and have packed a lot of info into this presentation. It is worth a revisit from time to time. Clear and concise. Thank you for the effort and resulting high quality info.
I like to experiment with cables. Upgrading kit, as you have noted, will produce more significant changes to a system than adding higher cost cables, generally speaking. Adding cables to my hi-fi inventory, however, provides a reasonably low cost method of pursuing this hobby. With a good selection of quality cables on hand I can tweak my systems between my more costly and less frequent component additions. Interconnects, power cords, speaker cables ... it’s fun to have a variety on hand to experiment with in different applications. Some can really help compensate for room deficiencies and when a rare new component is added, it is a kick to cycle through the cable collection to find the most complementary cable for the addition ... and to get a feel for how components and cables can complement or clash with the other variables in my listening environment.
Regardless, thank you again. Good stuff.
Thank you Greg. I appreciate you watching for a second time. You are right, there is quite a bit packed in there. Thank you for sharing your experiences. I really enjoyed reading about them 😊👍
Thanks for this highly informative & interesting
video.
Great Job!
By far the best review of this team I have come across! You take both science and subjectivity seriously and balance well. Bravo
Thank you Bjarne. That is what I am going for. Very king of you to say. Happy holidays to you and your loved ones 🥳👍👍
I’m a chartered engineer like you and that was well explained, factual and neutral. Good video.
Thank you Paul
Yep,
he has that a very nice job of pulling electrical Theory together, then also tying it to audio result
Lol, I first read "charlatan engineer"
Hahahahaha, so funny given the topic of speaker wires and all the controversy it creates
Excellent! Clearly explained theory combined with practical conclusions. This is just the combination other 'audiophile' channels lack and is precisely what's needed by those (like me) crossing this potentially expensive minefield!
Thank you William. Much appreciated 😊👍
Great video. Incredibly well explained and appreciate the history behind the technology.
Thank you for watching Ryan and taking the time to comment.
Thank you, Tarun. That was probably the most descriptive and easily understandable vid on cables I’ve seen to date. I’ve tried a fair amount of different speaker cables, and while I can hear slight differences between them, I prefer Canare 4S11 cable in my system. Interconnects are another story, and I find any cable around 100pf going from my turntable to phono pre works just fine (I happen to use Cardas w/a cotton dielectric). Anymore capacitance can be added via the phono pre or loading plugs. Other interconnects in my system, I find it best to DIY using a cable that actually gives you specs. Thanks again!
Hi Nick, thank you for watching and your support. I really enjoyed reading about your experiences 😊
Tarun that was the best and most comprehensible explanation of cables I have ever heard! Thank you for your accessible and common sense approach to this topic! It’s unfortunately all to rare.
Thank you Esten. That is very kind and much appreciated 😊👍👍
Skin effect starts at about 200KHz. Far beyond audio freq. As shown in graph at 8:37. Middle of the graph is 1000 000Hz (1 MHz). This is middle of the AM radio band. The horizontal scale is in KHz not Hz..
And inductance and capacitance doesn’t change with frequency, but the impedance does. (2*pi*f*l and 1/2*pi*f*c). (To be correct, the L and C will change a little due to the mechanical construction of a coil/cap, when used beyond the intended freq range)
Hi Eddy, you are right I could have used a better graph. Check out this research carried out legendary designer, Nelson Pass. It confirms skin effect at 1KHz.
www.passlabs.com/press/speaker-cables-science-or-snake-oil
@@abritishaudiophile7314 In the article the effect is 'claimed'to be the result of inductive and “skin effect”. However it does not provide any proof for that. Anything can be claimed to be the source, but claiming isn't proving. Their is absolutely no proof provided. It's quit the challenging read, but the wiki on skin-effect explains the phenomena in depth. And concluding from what is now known about the effect, is that it simply does not occur and therefore has no influence what so ever in speaker-cables used for transmitting audio.
I'm not stating that their is no perceivable difference in cables. However any difference occurring is simply not the result of skin-effect.
@@abritishaudiophile7314 Me too.. at 1.000kHz I have Visible SKIN EFFECTS.. all the hair tries to enter my skin..& @ 1.001234kHz dandruff starts flaking too..
It's real man.. SMOOTH & SOFT DANDRUFF
@@analoghardwaretops3976 😂
@@Rob-rg4oe You need to spend less time on AVS Forum.
This has actually changed my opinion on cables. Well done that man!
Keep pumping out the content: I foresee great things for this channel 👍
Thank you Anton. I really appreciate you taking the time to say that 😀
How? Did you think is was bull before and now you think expensive cables are better? If so, i dont understand . He said science says no difference in the cables. The only support for expensive cables is his claims of hearing a difference.
@@Cheetorblz There definitely are subtle differences between cables, but there inevitably comes a point where the differences are all in the head, not the ears..
Thanks for recognizing that something like this was overdue. An excellent overview of what is typically measurable and about how far that might take our current understanding of what is considered 'known' on the topic - all the basics covered in one, convenient resource. Great vid!
Thank you for watching and taking the time to comment John 🙏
Hi Tarun, this is the best video I've watched on cables and I agree with the technical aspects you covered. The biggest improvements I made to my audio system were related to the acoustic of the room (specifically in the 60-80 Hz frequency range in my room), the position of the speakers in that room and the location of my listening chair. I very much appreciate your approach: your explanations are clear and comprehensive. Greetings from Canada!
Hi Richard, thank you for watching and I greatly appreciate your supportive comments. I suspect we are very similarly minded audiophiles, judging by your comments and I hope you are staying safe in Canada.
Hi Tarun - this is a GREAT in-depth primer (or refresher) with absolutely top quality explanations of all the factors we know and love concerning cables! You did a stellar job in a delightfully relaxed and informative style backed up with helpful illustrations all along the way. I also appreciated your 'that's the theory, what do I think?' subjective round-up at the end. It's easy to get taken in by the snake oil, so staying down to earth in relation to total system cost is a wise tip. All the best from Switzerland, Rob
Thank you Rob. That is very kind of you to say. Wishing you and your loved ones a fabulous 2021 🥳👍
Best cable description I've seen. My background is very similar to yours: Electrical engineer, been in audio for 30+ years, tried lots of gear and cables. I have come to the very same conclusions: I hear differences, they are subtle (need to live with a cable for awhile and switch back). With speaker cables, I've always gone back to my old Audioquest Type4 (solid copper). I make my own interconnects and power cables. It's fun to experiment with configuration and dialectrics, but in the end there is no need to spend a lot of money. My theory is some of the differences heard are mainly due to cross-coupling between parallel conductors, and even between conductors and shields. Twisted is always better, in my opinion. Cheers!
Hi Randy, I have to say that I agree with every word of your comment. I can’t use twisted cables with my Exposure amps and I make my own Powercords as well. We must be kindred spirits 👍🏻
Another Type 4 fan here!
Hi ja son, I use a similar cable with my exposure amps 😉
@@abritishaudiophile7314 It would be great to connect with another electrical engineer and audiophile. Is there a way to email you or private message?
@@RandyNuss Hey, could you recommend a good budget twisted cable for connecting a phono preamp to an integrated amplifier?
hey Tarun. really enjoying the reviews. refreshing to get accuracy and fact. keep them coming.
Thank you Robert 😊👍
This was the most succinct explanation of inductance, capacitance and other properties that impact electron flow that I have come across - bravo!
Thank you my friend. Much appreciated 😊👍👍
Another excellent video Tarun. Best presentation on cables I vae seen or read anywhere. I see more than 4k subscribers! Well done. Some afiliated links to your recommendations would be helpful. A note on PTFE and TEFLON: that stuff should have been banned decades ago. I have stopped usimg products containing such chemicals 15 years ago. Do some research on it. A movie called Dark Waters came out on the subject. I highly recommend it.
Hi Tassos, thank you for your positive and constructive feedback. I will look into PTFE. I vaguely remember something about it being a carcinogen and we stopped buying Teflon coated pans.
Tarun, i have to say this is the BEST hifi cable explanation i have seen. period. Very well explained, crossing subjective and objective views with factual terms and not neglecting neither of the views. Also very good recomendation for begginers on when to invest on cables. Congrats!
Thank you Joao, I appreciate you taking the time to watch and for your support 😉
Great explanation on a tough subject. I find the better the system the more revealing it is. This then enables you to hear differences that cables can make.
Thank you!
Thank you for watching and sharing your experiences Robert 😊👍
Thank you for the master class on speaker wires. I’ve always used monster cables and wires but knowing the science behind the gauges and materials is very helpful.
Hi GS Bass, thank you for watching and commenting 😉
Thanks for a sane explanation. I've been an Audiophile and EE for longer than I care to admit. When it comes to speaker wire, I lean towards the "it's mostly snake oil" realm with some underlying caveats. Impedance is the sum of resistance and reactance. The resistance part is pretty easy to manage by changing gauge. The reactance part gets tricky, especially when you play games with the topology of the wires as you rightly pointed out. However, if the resistance is very low, then you will need a LOT of reactance to affect the sound in the frequencies we can hear. That said, when you do get a significant amount of reactance, then the wire becomes a transmission line. In this case, you'll have to manage other things like matching the impedance of the source and driver with the impedance of the destination. Otherwise you can get reflection and cancellations because of the mismatch. Some badly designed amps go all wonky (a technical term) when driving such a load. I've done several double-blind tests with various combinations of amps, speakers and speaker wires over the years. If you've got a good amp that is stable under various types of loads then all wires below a reasonable total; resistance become virtually indistinguishable.
So... What do I use for speaker wire? 12-gauge stranded low-voltage cabling used for outdoor lighting. This is lamp cord on steroids, having super-low resistance and the wires widely spaced to provide low reactance as well. I recently finished my first 500' roll I bought for 8 cents/foot in the 70s. My new roll was a whopping 12 cents/foot. My Pass Amplifier can drive just about any load without breaking a sweat, which is good as they drive the highly reactive load of my DIY hybrid electrostatic/transmission line woofer speakers.
Again, I commend your down-to-earth reporting of this highly polarizing topic.
Hi Gary, this is a tricky and divisive subject. My aim was to provide an objective overview and then share my own subjective experiences. Thank you for sharing your insights and experiences. I really enjoyed reading them.
Thanks for the tip I will look into that. I'm thinking since it's designed for outdoor the insulation will also be high quality.
@@stevengagnon4777 You're right that the insulation will last forever indoors. I've still got some runs from the roll I bought about 50 years ago and they look like new. Unfortunately, I've only seen it in black.☺
Finally a good video on cables, very good. This here shows a realistic view on cables, thumbs up!
Hi Wolfgang, thank you for watching and your positive feedback.
Wolfgang Pointner well said 👍🏾. My thoughts exactly.
Thanks Tarun, very helpful as always!
Thank you. This is a very useful summary and analysis of the topic. You really help the RUclips audiophile community to get to the next level. Can’t wait to hear and see more in your channel in the near future.
Thank you Ruben. I appreciate you watching and your kind words of support 😊
Thank you so much Tarun,what a service on what level.you ROCK
Thank you Reinhart. Very much appreciated 😊👍👍
There are precious few double blind tests of cables in Hi-Fi environments. There is a reason for that. My favorite is the blind A-B-C comparison of digital interconnects where a not-quite straightened metal coat hanger was used as an interconnect... and got praised for its audio quality. The amount of BS in Hi-Fi cables is astounding. Unless you have an extreme case 99,9% of audio enthusiasts and experts alike have no clue.
Every time I hear people talk about how they hear a difference, they never seem to mention any double blind (or even single blind) testing. We as humans are such irrational beings, that subjective opinions are not worth much from a scientific point of view. Caveat being you should always steer clear from the absolute thinnest of cables, we're still talking about electrical conductivity after all.
I would even state that the psychological factor is bigger than anything with things like cables. Good cheap cables plated in silver/gold/whathaveyou and sold as premium cables would actually subjectively sound better to almost everyone. You WANT to hear the difference, you want to HEAR your moneys worth.
@@leroy7647 Blind / double blind audio testing is not useful unless the differences are extreme. Auditory / echoic memory span is simply not long enough for any kind of comparison of subtleties.
@@tested211 What I, as a scientist, hear is "the difference is so small that you can't really do anything with it, yet the difference is big enough to merit spending lots of money because I know there is a difference."
Recently I went to my local audio shop. I asked for an amp recommendation, max 1000 euro. He recommended me a few and let me listen to a few. Once I mentioned my speakers he said I shouldn't really consider amps of that price, it would be a waste to pair it with my speakers. The argument was solely based on the price of the speakers. And of course was accompanied with non-rational arguments such as "it won't be able to keep the speakers under control". Ofcourse there was no argument along the lines of "I heard the difference based on a proper test".
To me the whole audiophile industry is so infected with subjective and biased opinions and assumptions based on hearsay, and not on observation and reason, it really isn't fun to discuss hifi anymore. I don't even know why I bother with this message honestly.
If it really was about subjective opinions it should be more about emotion; the actual music and what a nice listen someone had listening to some record. It would be less about optimizing each and every electron in the whole of electrical circuits of the setup. But I'm honestly afraid a lot of people have gone so far down the rabbit hole that it's more FOMO than anything else.
@@leroy7647 You don't sound much like a scientist...you've taken a statement and rather than addressing it directly, replied with a lot of assumed baggage. I hope you don't do that at work :D
@@tested211 Me taking a statement comes from being sent in the bush time after time when asking about observations and rational experiences. If time and time again the experts cannot persuade me rationally, then yes I am starting to draw my own conclusions. Don't worry about me being like this at work, as unlike with audio, there we actually rely on observations, which are actually observable by both experts and people new to the field.
A very informative, no superlatives, no BS, just science, expericence and subjective based opinion on cables! As a telecoms/communications engineer and self proclaimed audiophille, I welcomed a posting of this nature. It's about time an audio you tuber presented factual science along with there subjective opinion. Although I would be very grateful if you can provide a link to the source material you used and presented on screen Tarun. (No doubt somebody will tell me that somebody elese has been doing this for years, crack on then!) Well Done Tarun, good job and Thank You.
Hi Darren, thank you for watching and for taking the time to comment on the video. I used a bunch of articles and research to fact check the more technical aspects of the video. I didn’t keep a list but here are some useful and informative articles worth taking a look at...
www.empiricalaudio.com/computer-audio/technical-papers/myths-and-snake-oil
www.passlabs.com/press/speaker-cables-science-or-snake-oil
www.lectromec.com/unwanted-energy-storage/
Greetings Tarun - I love your approach to our sickness/obsession and really appreciated this particular video. Thanks to your speaker placement video I’ve just gone through the 45 minute exercise of releasing my B&W 802D4 “landing gear” (6 points on each speaker) to allow movement into the room. Keep the great content coming.
Thank you Mark. I appreciate your support 😊👍
@@abritishaudiophile7314 you deserve it! Also - you may want to experiment with your own audio recording. I get a good deal of room echo coming through. Your content is so excellent, the listener inherently expects great sound quality. Just a suggestion and cheers!
@@markwilliford7471 thank you. This is an early video shot on my iPad with no mic. Please let me know what you think of the latest one 😊👍
ruclips.net/video/IY2IehAvwio/видео.html
What a master class, Tarun! Thanks a lot for sharing you knowledge. It is always useful.
Thank you. I did a more recent video on cables that you may find interesting 😊👍
ruclips.net/video/J7Opv0Zx6Mc/видео.html
Can’t believe I’ve just spent 30 mins watching someone talking about audio cables. Riveting stuff I actually learned quite a lot. Brilliant!
Much appreciated. Thank you Dave 😊👍
It was awful.
I understood every word.
I didn't get into hifi to listen to non gibberish.
😁
@@julianshepherd2038 very funny 😂
The irony is that at 73, I wear two hearing aids. My hearing is heavily attenuated at the upper end of the frequency range so the superlatives of hi-fi are totally lost in me. 😟
@@daverawson123 I hope you are still enjoying listening to music even if the upper octaves are missing 😉👍
The best bang for the buck is to spend your money is by getting the best room treatment and making sure your speakers are set up properly.
I reckon that would cost me at least £50,000 :D
ROOM TREATMENT IS NUMBER 1. NO SYSTEM WILL NEVER SOUND CORRECT UNTIL THE ROOM HAS A FLAT FREQUENCY RESPONSE AS POSSIBLE.
@@thegroove2000 It's a little more than just the frequency response. There's also RT60 and that's something that is done that's going to be a little subjective since there is a range that is deemed "acceptable" for different types of usages. Example. For a control room, you would want more absorption and a lower RT60 compared to a home stereo room where people would typically want more diffusion and a little longer RT60 times.
In some cases, you may not necessarily want 'perfectly' flat, but at least something in the +/- 1 dB, plus it's pretty impossible to achieve a perfect room due to the floor and how it's difficult to treat the floor like you would the rest of the 5 walls in a room. :-)
In reality, most of us don't have the option to optimally place our speakers in a properly treated room because we listen in a room that also serves other functions for other people who would object to such optimization. In cases where neither speaker set-up nor room acoustics can be made even close to optimal, cables will make no difference at all. Spend the savings on nice gifts for those who grudgingly consent to coexist with your system.
and clean your ears 😄.
Tarun, thank you for an absolutely wonderful video, an absolute pleasure to watch ,really enjoyed it. Great to see someone actually attempt to correlate, explain and apply known scientific principles as to why people can potentially hear a difference between cables in their systems.
Sad to say their are far to many snobby and patronising know it all so called audiophiles in the comments sections here on RUclips and in other audiophile forums, that try to make out people who actually take the time to sit down and experiment with changing cables in their own systems, in their own homes, and can clearly hear a difference with their own ears are committing some kind of Heresy by stating so.
This was always going to be a controversial and potentially polarising topic gordyboy01. I hope most people see this as an opportunity to share their knowledge and experiences whilst respecting others that may have a different point of view. Thank you for watching and commenting. I really appreciate your support. 😊👍
Great video (as always), brave brave man mentioning the “no measurable differences don’t mean no differences” bit :) .
Thank you William. There is a fine line between brave and stupid. I am glad you said brave 😂
Blue Jeans Cable is my highest end choice. They source Belden cables for many of their offerings as well.
Hi Harry, I agree it is good stuff 👍🏻
Thank you Tarun. I always find intelligent discussions of this subject interesting. This is a very fruitful area for DIY in my opinion.
Hi GenWivern2, I agree. Thank you for watching.
Also meant to say, great videos. Really enjoyed them. Thanks for taking the time to make and post them.
Thank you for watching 😉
Many thanks for your balanced and professional presentation! As an engineer I fully agree with you and I hope people will use your good knowledge in this matter. It's the best I seen so far.
Thank you Johan, that is high praise indeed. Thank you for watching and taking the time to comment 😊
Thank you for another interesting video. I was an interconnect disbeliever until recently when I bought a pair of Chord RCA cables (cheap ones by their standards) and was amazed at the difference they made to streaming from my Yamaha DAC to my Audiolab Amp. How can simple short cables make so much difference? But I’m an interconnect believer now. I’d had a similar epiphany years ago about decent speaker cables so I shouldn’t have been so sceptical. Thanks again for your technical explanation though I think the crucial statement was that electrical engineers can’t yet measure the differences they hear!
Thank you for watching and sharing your experiences Andrew 😊👍
Andrew, I'm considering the Chord RCA interconnects in my system (Denafrips Pontus DAC to Willsenton R8 amp) . Did you use Clearway or C-Line?
They were C line
Placebo effect.
Fantastic video, finely a comprehensive and “sane” view on cables, good job 👍🏻
Thank you gryphongryph. I appreciate you taking the time to watch the video 😁
Well done synopsis on cabling/kit!
We have done some blind A/B with interconnects and speaker cable, and there were audible differences that everyone picked off each time.
A lot of it was very subtle, but a few things were glaring, and shocked us a bit.
I have been building my own cables forever, and it’s possible to have a pair of $200.00-$500.000+ cables for the cost of materials.
I skip adding rare tropical hardwood trim, gemstones, or any other eye candy.
Critical listening is a lot of fun, and so is simply enjoying a great performance.
Thanks again for taking the time!
Thank you 😊
Hi Tarun, I hope all is good with you and that the music is making you stronger. Thanks for your interesting and well informed videos. They are keeping me entertained during isolation.
I used to experiment with all sorts of different power leads, interconnects and speaker cables. Then I discovered the QED Reference series about 5 years ago and now my whole system is QED. They are not too expensive (£60 per interconnect if you shop round) and they make a notable improvement over every other cable I have tried (maybe 20). The same thing happened when I tried Kimber reference power leads. I buy them second hand for about £50 a go if I'm lucky. They were about £250 new !! Now I have 10 of them for my whole system and again they have improved it. More resolution, more transparency and a bit more 'air' around everything. My most recent addition was an iFi AC iPurifier which has really lowered my noise floor to a possibly unmeasureable value.
My best suggestion is to get a valve preamp. Nina Simone will make you cry. Happy listening from Derbyshire.
Hi Bongo, great to hear about your experiences and very sensible to buy cables second hand. I have an IFi AC iPurifier in my system as well and I have been very impressed with it. Micro details pop out more clearly, separation between instruments improves and the soundstage widens. Thank you for watching and sharing 😉
Great explanation. In my inexpensive system I’ve never noticed a lot of difference in sound with cables and stopped worrying about them. However I did buy a £80 star wired mains block at a Hi-Fi show and was amazed the difference it made to the sound .
Thank you Colin. Once again, you support of this channel does not go unnoticed or unappreciated.
2 problems with cables (outside of having proper cable gauge):
#1 if you're looking for truth, none of us knows what the original sound was so we have no reference on how it should sound.
#2 cables can sound different - so what are they doing? Ultimately, they are changing the frequency response. If you want to change frequency response, just buy an eq and be done with it.
Hi Alex, thank you for watching and sharing your opinions.
#1. DEAD ON. For instance the Rolling Stones or Led Zeppelin, mixed in some studio with who knows what kind of speakers and people are critiquing that sound now, when it was recorded on tape, With multiple tracks.
@@velkomilosevich6378 - Yes, But the biggest factors on the Recording would be; How many and Which Microphones ( the 'transducers' analogous to Our Speakers), Plus the Placement of 'said Microphones'. e.g. That why a concept of the original Bose Speaker ( '901') is so arbitrary; and most probably Very Wrong for Many, if Not Most recordings.
Excellent Video!! So as far as excluding the importance of proper speaker placement, the one single tweak that made the most audible difference was implementing Audioquest’s Silver Banana Terminators to my 12 gauge Copper speaker cables. While you had referenced Silver enhancing the upper frequencies, I found it to significantly affect the Lower frequencies!! It’s was shocking in fact. I do plan on changing out the binding post connectors which appear to be gold plated with silver spaded ones. Again this was as informative a video as there has been on the topic. And your last point you made was truly spot on as not every difference the Human ear can discern is always measurable!!! Wonderful!!
Thank you. Much appreciated 😊👍
Thank you. A no nonsense and honest approach which does not talk down to the viewer, doesn't shy away from "the science bit" and is not blatantly sponsored by or plugging a particular brand. Onl one question - do cables deteriorate over time? Although my hifi components have changed over time, I realised watching this that some of my cables are 30 years old!
Hi Arne, thank you for watching and your supportive comments. As long as you do not have exposed conductors, for example, bare speaker wire or damaged them in some way, there should be no noticeable deterioration in your cables over time 👍
All of these characteristics that you're talking about, Capacitive reactance, inductive reactance, resistance, magnetic coupling, are only factors to be considered at radio frequencies, not at audio frequencies, (
Yabba dabba doo! As an engineer, I have to agree with you. I carry rolls of 14AWG and 16AWG in my tool bag. I bought my sister a small stereo amp and speakers for her apartment, nothing “audiophile,” but didn’t get enough speaker cable. (I didn’t realize her apartment was that big.) I told her it would probably be better if she got some more 14AWG wire (for no real reason) but she got the much cheaper 16AWG. It probably didn’t make any difference for a twenty-foot run from a low power amp; she wasn’t building a sound system for a stadium.
Listening to audiophiles is more fun than watching people at Walmart. The huge market for inaudible music and amplifier and source technologies made obsolete in the last century is hilarious.
Thank you! Your comments and suggestions save me typing 😄. The snake oil salesmen started using the language of science to disguise their BS but guys like you make their pseudo science look feeble and inane.
@@strangelove9608 The dunning kruger effect is rampant on the internet. If more people were to take a course in electronics and learn about reactance in AC circuits and how they are affected by cabling, a lot of these mindless discussions would never take place. It's usually people who know the least who have the most to say on a number of topics. Cables make a huge difference at high frequencies (RF), and cable shielding makes a huge difference with very small signal levels like the audio input signal cables.. The quality of the shielding is important and the differences can be measured tangibly. The physics surrounding these things is well understood by electrical engineers and physicists because they spend a lot of time training and experimentation as well as application in these areas.
Curing cancer and going to the moon have nothing to do with it. There are some pretty decent cures that have been successful out there for cancer, and we've already been to the moon, it's costs a lot of money to go and there's no useful reason to go back, but again, those subjects are totally off topic regarding the effects that different cables have on power inputs and audio amplifier output speaker cables.
gauge size DOES make differences, I can hear and measure with my Radio shack sound meter in loudness and bass tightness when I use either 14 gauge speaker or 7 gauge power extension cord (12 gauge combine), even the length is 1 meter when I connect my subwoofer with the amplifier. I am sure my cheap 7 gauge cable will sound as good as most expensive audioquest speaker cables by blind test.
I can see behind you what you really need... You don't need more cables, you need a turntable! 👌
*Just a few points of interest:*
Another disadvantage of pure silver is that pure silver is very fragile due to metal fatigue.
The added capacitance of shielding can be a big issue with phono cables as well, because it adds capacitance to the capacitive loading on the (MM) cartridge.
When it comes to connecting cables to terminals: never just use soldering tin on the copper wire leads. Tin can oxidize and very slowly change shape when under pressure of the terminal like a binding post, reducing the contact pressure.
*And some questions:*
How about PSC+
Is that better than OFC?
But if I'm honest, you sound more like you're talking about long distance telecommunications and HF< applications... instead of audio equipment.
Hi Qorax, thank you for watching and sharing. You are not the first person to point out a lack of a turntable. My problem is that I am more of a track rather than entire album listener. I love that I have a 1000 of my favourite tracks arranged in playlists. I may look into getting into turntables in due course though. From what I can tell, PSC+ is Audioquest’s Perfect-Surface Copper technology. It is not something that I have really looked into so couldn’t tell you if it is genuine or marketing spin.
@@abritishaudiophile7314 Well... you don't really need to be "an entire album listener" to play records.
For example: I've got into vinyl because USB mixers were expensive (for a 12 years old) back when I started DJing, so I got myself a pair of old turntables and DJ vinyl to start out (but never really progressed to digital).
I still have a lot of DJ vinyl and those always have 1 to 4 tracks on a record, so I have no issues to play only part of an album or one specific track (those parts are called "album samplers").
Besides 12" DJ vinyl, there are also a lot of records that are 7" with a big center hole, those singles also have only one song a side.
The 7" singles are more common with pop, rock and more traditional music like jazz and blues, but you have to pay attention that you're not buying polystyrene instead of PVC singles.
Polystyrene wears out much more quickly and has a lot more surface noise.
Fortunately, this is only an issue with the 7" singles.
@@abritishaudiophile7314 That’s surprising-even shocking! Are your playlists in a lossless digital format, on hard solid state drives-or CD’s? Maybe you have a video about that?
Probably the best video about cables on this and neighbouring planets.
Thank you KebMo 😊👍👍
Lovely video, thanks Tarun! As always, I find that the people that have something to sell or those that have high levels of mental and financial investment in their purchase push the most woo. Keeping theory simple as possible (as you did very neatly here) and no simpler is key. Thank you.
Thank you Tristan 😊👍
In my experience as an audio engineer of more years than I care to admit I believe that if a cable makes a big difference then it says more about problems with your equipment. Poorly designed amplifiers are more likely to show a change in cables.
Hi Harry, thank you for watching and sharing 😊
Very true adequate gage is all that’s needed
Hi Harry. Can you please name an amp or two that are so well designed that cables won't make any difference? I would really like to test is myself 🙂
I have been a Radio Technician for many many years ... I have just learnt a lot ... thanks.
Thank you Dave. I appreciate you watching and commenting 😉👍
Tarun, again you did an excellent job here. This is well thought out and your reasons for choosing what to upgrade and when in order to get the most benefit from your system mirrors my own. I believe in always taking care of components first and never using a cable to make up for system shortfalls.
If you have to make a choice between a cable and the component, the component always comes first. When your system fits your budget and sound requirements, then and only then experimented with cables if you are trying to get that last 10 percent. It helps to have a local dealer that you have built up a relationship with so that you can experiment with different cables without the financial risk.
I had silver speaker cables on my speakers and went back to copper both solid core and the copper at this time is better and I have copper throughout the system except from the turntable to the phono preamp and from the phono preamp to the preamp, which are all silver, the highs and midrange are great and bass is un-effected. Great job here and your conclusion mimic my own, cables do make a difference, but going broke on them over component choices has diminishing returns. Your explanation is the best by far and you left the useless garbage out of it.
Excellent points Sid, and great advice. You are right, we both on exactly the same page here. Thank you for watching and sharing. Stay safe.
So I just subscribed. I was so impressed by your thorough explanation. Clear, concise, detailed, excellent! I have not purchased any new audio components and quite some time but revisiting some of the things that I used to read about has been quite enjoyable. Thanks so much for sharing cheers!
Thank you Muata. I appreciate you watching and your kind words of support 😊👍👍
@@abritishaudiophile7314 Absolutely! :)
Thanks you for going over the 'science' of cables, very useful. The one cable that I've been looking at making a pricey upgrade would be my USB cable from my computer to my integrated amp. I've been using an Audioquest Forest USB in my headphone rig for several years and noticed an increase (subjective) in detail and clarity over the 'included' USB cables I now have a drawer full. But this is the first time I'll be using a computer to play hi-res audio through my main stereo rig (via my Rotel A12 MkII) that's nestled into my home theater rig; TV, soundbar, the usual. I do have an iFi iPurifier3 on order to try out, but I'm wondering if an upgrade to an USB cable with a thicker silver plating would be beneficial? Your thoughts?
Thank you for sharing. I haven’t investigated USB cables yet. I use a Audioquest Pearl USB cable, inexpensive but well regarded 😊
Audioquest cables are snake oil, they makes claims that a solid cable is better than a multi strand because with a solid core, you eliminate strand jumping that affects the audio signal. Complete rubbish to get the money out of the gullibles pockets.
As Michael Fremer says, ‘everything makes a difference!’
He is a wise man 😊
Tarun you are the gift that keeps giving a sober view that makes a lot of sense thank you
Thank you Michael or is it Mr ADHD? Love the Avatar. Good to hear from you again😉
Once again an excellent post with great explanations. Whenever I have ever tried to explain info about cables the biggest issue that I have experienced is that people do not understand all of the vocabulary and general definitions. Thus they are 'lost' before I have really started. These days when asked for advice I simply say borrow and listen at home and buy the cable which sound you like the best and which offers you the best value. I want to thank you for your post as now when I'm asked I'm going to say watch Tarun's RUclips post...... Job done.
Thank you Paul, that is bet high praise indeed. Thank you for your continued support of this channel 😉
Good summary Tarun, matches my own experience pretty well.
I also find Van den Hul to be very smooth and rolled off compared to say a Nordost which is much brighter, particularly the cheaper models. If people can't hear the difference between these two cables then I think they are either too stubborn to be open to hearing differences , do not have great hearing or their system is not sufficiently high resolution. Cable manufacturers have lost so much credibility as there is a lot of expensive snake oil out there but I believe that some manufacturers try very hard to make their cables sound good. I wish that they would quote their capacitance, inductance, resistance in the specs so users could compare. Maybe the differences (some of us) hear are purely down to differences in those properties ? If a certain type of cable design is sufficient to make some amplifiers go unstable, surely there is sufficient difference between some cables to make an audible difference?
I think Null tests such as the very convincing one Ethan Weiner performs on his channel should surely pick up the differences between cables of polar opposite physical properties ? If they don't there must be something not being considered in the tests and are not being detected by the oscilloscope .
I have been fortunate to subjectively compare numerous cables A to B at home side by side and some sound different but quite a few sound absolutely the same to my ears. I don't go by price, in my last passive system I had Transparent reference cables as they sounded superior to everything else I have tried but I currently have active ATC speakers and I am running long lengths of cheap balanced Van damme microphone cable and I don't find using expensive cable makes any difference.
I also think that it is easy to be mislead performing subjective cable comparisons as there are a few pitfalls. 1) It is useless listening to a cable and then disconnecting it and connecting another one as the time and disruption it takes to do the swap is long enough to have forgotten the previous sound. Audio memory has been shown to be short and poor. 2)Just removing connectors and reconnecting them a few times makes quite an audible difference as it cleans the contacts. I always find a "disturbed" system sounds brighter until it has settled down again overnight. 3) Volumes must be very accurately matched between switching. It is very easy to be fooled by say, a balanced cable, as it is louder and often sounds better, however after careful volume matching the differences often vanish. 4) Interconnects are much easier to compare than speaker cables as you can do fast A to B comparisons by simply switching amplifier inputs. Immediate input switching between cables often makes imagined differences disappear . However some differences are more subtle than simple tonal changes and factors such as listener fatigue , size of image, image depth and soundstage sometimes aren't so obvious and can take hours or days to creep up on you.
Hi John, what a thorough and fantastic explanation! You should have done the video. My thoughts mirror yours precisely. Very few high end cable manufacturers do anything to restore their sullied reputation.The fact that many still do not publish even basic LCR specs, let alone dielectric constant, VP and other parameters is unforgivable. This just fuels the snake oil debate. The cost of some of these cables are quite frankly ridiculous and bare no resemblance to production costs. I know everyone has a right to earn a living but it is high time we weeded these kind of practices out of the industry.
I agree with you about null tests as well. We are still learning about the sophistication and complexity of our auditory system. Talk to any designer, Andrew Jones, Nelson Pass, John Curl, Bascom King, Paul Barton (need I go on...) and they will tell you that they exchange components in their designs that measure identically but sound different. They haven’t got any axe to grind and can’t all be wrong. Why would it not be entirely possible that some differences in cables can not be measured but can be heard? High end cable manufacturers just need to be honest and come clean, “our listening tests confirm that this product sounds better, but can not be supported by measurements.” May not be good marketing but would help to restore their reputation rather than perpetuating pseudo-science and BS.
I am also in agreement with you about AB testing. Auditory memory has been shown to be fallible and very short lived. Even just changing the order in which products are presented has been shown to have a bearing on the result. I believe the only way to evaluate cables or any component is to live with it in your system for some time. Give yourself some time to adjust to the sound and then over time you will start to get a general impression of the strengths and deficiencies in the sound and how engaging you find it to be. Once again John, thank you for your excellent observations.
Actually, yes, some companies CAN show measurements to prove there might be some audible differences. MIT probably does the most comprehensive measurements of cables. Whether or not you can hear a difference could be a variety of reasons. It could be the listener simply doesn't know what to listen for. The room has bad room acoustics and doesn't allow you to hear differences. It could be the type of recordings you listen to. It could be that the cables you are comparing are similar in sound quality. It could be the rest of equipment you have. so there really isn't one reason why one would not be able to hear the difference.
Could you point to this data? I've never seen any compelling research demonstrating this whatsoever. In fact, I've never even witnessed anyone doing a blind A/b test with any meaningful correlation.
@@michaelcorcoran8768 What do you feel is meaningful? The inherent problem with AB teats is that there are too many variables that make AB tests worthlesss.
But, here is a video of a AB test that was rather crude in execution, but out of the small sample of listeners, a couple of people successfully picked 5 out of 5 listenings. ruclips.net/video/HJGw8zwx-6g/видео.html
@@michaelcorcoran8768 I was explaining how AB test are inherently flawed. MIT’s measurements are objective measurements, and AB tests are subjective. Here’s a video explaining some of the ways MIt measures a cable to see measurable differences . ruclips.net/video/yK3WY2bNaqo/видео.html
Thank you for the in depth lesson. I really appreciate the science and you explained electrical better than some of my teachers when I was in electrical apprenticeship ! I am planning on getting a setup that I can stream music to watch concerts video at a higher volume from time to time. Thank you for your videos fred from USA
Thank you Fred. Much appreciated. I did a more recent video on cables that you may enjoy 😊
ruclips.net/video/J7Opv0Zx6Mc/видео.html
Outstanding video Tarun. Solid content which was well thought out and explained with accuracy and detail. Great delivery, excellent cadence too. Was very easy to follow. Well done brother.
Hi Shawn, thank you for watching and your kind words of support 😊
When you say "solid copper" ,is that opposed to (1) stranded copper or
(2) copper that is mixed with other materials or(3) something else ,thanks?
Hi Henry, as in not copper mixed with other materials. Stranded copper speaker cables are no problem at all.
I have found that cables made up of strands that are individually insulated do sound better than the standard multi-strand bundle, but the electrical properties will be different so you will have to decide.
USING >10AWG will NOT result in increased resistance at high frequencies. Please correct this. There is less benefit with larger gauges, but there is still benefit.
Great explanation of cables! Clear and concise! I am using flat, 3/4 Supra tinned with Cardas silver solder.
Thank you for watching JT 😊👍
Very good description and explanation Tarun! I think one reason some earnest people have pretty different results with speaker cables is there are multiple aspects of interactions between amplifier behavior with stray electrical fields, interference from digital and electrically noisy sources affecting the amplifier, and back EMF from speakers delayed in time affecting the amplifier. Those effects are sometimes fairly large. I have listened to many different cables with 6 different speaker systems, and 8 different amplifiers. Some of my amplifiers ARE hard to hear differences between cables, other amps seem to have greater, though still mostly subtle differences so this suggests some people may not see much sonic improvement between different mid-priced (US$100 to $1,000 per pair) cables. Since the cable is really one part of the amp-cable-speaker-cable-amp chain, some will have real differences, and others only minimal difference.
Hi Mike, I agree it is very system dependent for the reasons you have so well described 😉
Keep in mind, there is no right or wrong in this hobby... sometimes, we just love our gear ;)
Well said Chris
@@abritishaudiophile7314 Love your work !
Chris Batista absolutely correct, just like our wife’s.
I've tried many cables over many decades and they make a clear difference. Anyone stating otherwise hasn't done the experiment, has a low end system or bad hearing. The best ones I've heard to date are from Silnote.
Thank you for watching and sharing.
@alan easton it kind of depends on your setup, but in 98% of cases i would agree with you. at least if they use the correct sized copper cable. But i think alot of the sound difference comes to marketing placebo effect, and that changing to a new cable in theory could make a better connection on the terminal side. copper cables thats been untouched for a year or three could have started oxidizing a bit, so just the act of detaching and reattaching the cable could be just as effective as buying a new one.
If you think you hear the difference it doesn't automatically mean that it is there. Unfortunately we don't only hear with our ears but there are so many other aspects that are to be taken into account....
I mean, your hifi system also doesn't sound exactly the same every time you listen to it!
A very well ‘balanced’ review, with little ‘impedance’ or ‘distortion’ and virtually no ‘interference’. I have no ‘resistance’ to highly recommending your channel and I can state this without any ‘inductance’. Thanks,
Very clever Jerry. Thank you for watching 😊👍
Watt?! Ohm my goodness. I hope you will AC-cord me permittivity to signal my current alternating VU: otherwise I will suffer re-voltage.
Very comprehensive and clearly explained. Good job. I woiud say that it is worth mentioning that the better the system, the more likely you are to hear differences from higher end cables. Horses for courses. I have bought all used OCC cables (throughout my system - from Harmonic Technology, Wireworld and Atlas) and have never looked back....
Hi Alex, very savvy. Thank you for sharing 👍🏻
In my experience good cables help, but up to a point. They won't make or break any system. If you want drastically better sound, you need better speaker or amp. However, if you have a proper system, dont use cheap bulk cable. Buy something at least adequate. I use Kimber and Cardas. But not their top end cables. Too expensive.
エリック I’m running Kimber Kable 8VC to the speakers and Chord Rumour to the subs. I would like to try the 8TC or 12TC when I get a chance. Interconnects I have Kimber Kable Silver Streak inter and D60 digital which are both very detail. I recently purchased Chord company Shawline XLR and Clearway coax, so just running them in. With power cables I have Wireworld and Supra Cat8 for ethernet. I’m considering trying diy interconnects at the moment as I’ve just purchased my first soldering iron
Hi guys, good to hear from you. Thank you for watching and taking the time to share your experiences.
Tarun A British Audiophile thanks for the video, I was looking in to pro audio interconnect cable and RCAs yesterday to consider making a set
Dave G thanks for the tip, I’ll give them a go. Hopefully I’ll find a uk based dealer that stocks both
Judging by the amount of echo I can hear on this video, some room treatment might pay far bigger dividends than any other tweak.
Hi Chris, it’s the mic running through a 3.5 mm to USB C adapter that is the problem not the room but you’re not the first one to point this out and I’m sure not the last.
@@abritishaudiophile7314 definitely hearing room reflections that would be problematic in a studio control room for example , not related to your mic's signal path.
I would have to disagree with you but each to their own.
@@abritishaudiophile7314 I'm sorry but your room is full of hard surfaces and I can't quite get my head around the idea that an audio adapter would cause reverb on a recording?
Room acoustics is a very misunderstood topic. Don’t get me wrong, panels are beneficial if you know what you are doing but you can also get good results without them as long as your are able to make allowances. For examples, most well furnished living spaces have a perfectly acceptable RT60 time. Thank you for watching 😉
Great level headed approach to a controversial subject. Well analyzed and spoken!
You've been very modest with your approach to prices BTW.. I know people that have paid four figure amounts for speaker cables, absolutely insane!
Hi Arthur, thank you for watching and your positive feedback.
Another great video from a great channel... proceed with the excellent work !!
Thank you Chris. I appreciate your support 👍🏻
I have always found the power cables to be the most important cables in my system. I too favor solid copper and i never liked silver or silver plated copper cables.
Hi Calaf_72, it can be so system dependent, it is a bit of a minefield. Thank you for watching 🙂
Calaf_72 the Nordost Frey 2 with 18x22AWG silver plated solid cores works well with my tube amp to speed up the delivery to the Proacs. As Tarun said, it’s system dependent. I wouldn’t generalize cables too much.
@@cjpriustt I avoided naming specific brand names to avoid a cable "war".
Calaf_72 Me to!! I have had whole street dug and replaced kilometers of power lines from copper to pure silver. Also, I have made the direct connection from the street to my toroidal transformer, no sockets. Now I feel that airiness in the sound stage. Perfect!
@@mpelevic lol......it's amazing that people still believe the AC from their walls (turned to DC inside the gear) can somehow be manipulated by a 6 ft. cable.
Thanks again Tarun, that was an insightful video. Lots of information trickling down to the basics of what actually matters.
I've been absent for a while but this was good video to come back to.
I wish you'd also cover power cables, especially basic power chords to run our equipment alongside some affordable branding info.
Reason I ask is, a lot of us purchase used amplifiers/preamps/receivers etc. where the owners sell their equipment with old/worn out power chords that might pose a threat to the equipment we purchase. All that most of us need are a bunch of affordable trustworthy power chord suggestions to keep running our newly acquired(used) gear without the risk blowing them up shortly after.
Thanks in advance.
Cheerio.
Thank you Shazad, good to hear from you. A video on power cords coming soon.
Marvelous! Subscribed at minute 6 of the video. Looking forward to hear more!
Hi Natan, thank you for watching and I really appreciate your support 😁
Surely this is a spoof, it was full of technical errors - quite funny!
It's a tricky subject please
Enlighten us ....
Be careful though,
Some of us actually know why .
Your room sounds like my bathroom. Why don't you focus a little bit on the acoustics, those will change the sound almost more than the speakers themselves?
I like being married! Good enough for the late, great Art Dudley, good enough for me. Actually, it is pretty good in the sweet spot. Good sound 70% speaker set up, 20% treatment, 10% speakers.
@@abritishaudiophile7314 Thanks for your enjoyable video. You have a beautiful room and a nicely put together system. I must however agree with Arne on the very noticeable reverberation of sound in your room, in fact it was quite distracting at times. It will have a negative impact on the sound of your system unfortunately! I think we have all been guilty of ignoring room acoustics in the past, [ well I have certainly!] Appreciate you like being married though! Can I steer you towards looking at Denis Morecrofts DNM cables. He has a fantastic website on the design principles of his cables and why they are designed the way they are. They are [embarrassingly] affordable compared to most of the competition and very simply make the music in my system sound correct! Best wishes.
@@jcarter3562 Hi J Carter, Surprisingly, it isn’t the room. I shoot on my iPad Pro and Apple have removed the 3.5mm input on this generation - Ahhh!!! I had to use a 3.5mm to USB C adapter which added this horrible distortion. I recently got a USB C mic, which has improved the sound quality of my latest videos. Not perfect but better. Thank you for watching and putting up with the poor sound 😊
@@abritishaudiophile7314 Ah, yes, the SAF (Spousal Approval Factor). Almost as essential to listening enjoyment as the right gear.
Go shopping with your wife for a Turkish carpet (a 4x6, say), let her pick it out, and hang it on the wall.
What ever you do, don't ruin your tasteful period house by putting room treatments in! Can you imagine that lovely house with tonnes of foam panelling everywhere!
a great trueful account of speaker cables.everything you have said is very believable.the timing is very good too as this weekend ive been testing out 2 new speaker cables from audioquest. the robin hood and the william tell.both cost into the thousands.but both dont sound no different or better than my DIY van damme pro series cables.ive been thinking exactly the same as what you have just said on here.in fact ive been asking this question about cables for a long time now.after watching this vid i am in no doubt that these cables will be going back and ill spend my hard erned on a new preamp.im glad i came across this..many thanks
A reasonable perspective on the role and influence of cables in audio. Well explained. Refreshing and informative. Thank you. This positively influences my trust level in your other videos. Subscribed.
Thank you Granger. I appreciate your support 👍
I don't want to offend you, but listening to the sound of your video (very much reverb) and looking at your room it seems you did not invest in any room treatment for sound. Don't you think it would bring 1000 times more to do room treatment instead of hearing subtle, if even existing sound differences between cables?
Hi Josef, not offended at all. Good sound - 70% speaker positioning, 20% room treatment, 10% the speaker itself. Hopefully, I have got 80% of it right. The other 20% I won’t get past the wife!
@Stimpy&RenRemoving the wife also brings the noise floor down.
@@abritishaudiophile7314,
I have a similar problem with algebra, I think the formula is something close to... perfect sounding room, is inversely proportional to, happy wife room decor.
@@robertkruger8180,
Correct!
it worked for me!
But it was a very expensive upgrade.
It cost me 60% of everything I had :-)
A British Audiophile you’re so wrong 20% acoustics dude totally unsubbed you. You’re a nice dude , but completely oblivious about acoustics.,
I suggest you watch a couple of Ethan winer videos and fully comprehend how acoustics is the biggest conundrum in any setup !!
In the future move the mirror on the background, it looks like your wearing a crown.
I know. Some said golden horns 💆♂️
lol yes horns!!!
Another excellent video Tarun. Appreciate your scientific electrical explanations. Cables can make a difference, not so much the 'snake oil' claims but pure physics. I dramatically improved the sound on a Marantz SACD player by removing a Y split RCA Cable to Marantz amplifier and Sony AV amplifier, and replacing with a single reasonable quality direct cable between player and Marantz amplifier only. Even my wife who is not interested in HiFi could hear the difference: clarity, detail, less distortion, and dynamics.
Thank you. Great to learn about your experiences 😊👍
measurements please?
I usually don't comment on videos, but I will make exception on this one. Great job. Really good explanation of the matter. Thumbs up.
Thank tgerasimov. I appreciate you watching and taking the time to comment 😉👍
Here's something to think about: Have you ever removed a woofer, mid-range or tweeter speaker from one of your speaker cabinets and looked at the wiring INSIDE the cabinet, especially the wires running from the crossover network to the speakers themselves? I have, on many occasions! You may be shocked to learn that nine times out of ten - and this includes B&W, Klipsch, Bang & Olufsen, KEF, Audiovector, Paradigm and a heavenly host of very well known "higher-end" speaker brands - the internal wiring is between 16-18 gauge (American); that's 3-4 wire gauges SMALLER than most audiophiles run between their amp and their speakers! So, does it "improve" sound quality to run 8-10-gauge speaker cables into 16-18-gauge internal speaker wiring? NO, IT DOESN'T!!! To further drive my point home, a short anecdote: I once attended a VERY high-end audio convention in Dallas, Texas. While passing the McIntosh booth, I noticed that the brand representative had not finished setting up his demo-system. Upon inquiring why, he answered that he had failed to pack sufficiently long speaker cables for his chosen speaker separation width (he needed cables at least 5 meters long per-speaker). "No problem," he informed me with a smile, "I'll just run over to the local hardware store and buy a ten-meter-long 'orange' outdoor extension cord, cut it in half, strip off the ends of two of the internal many-stranded wires, attach the cables, and be ready to present fantastic sound in no time!" "What?!" I cried in horror, "NO high-end, bi-wired, carbon-fiber-coated OFC cables to demonstrate your first-class Type-A amplifiers???" "Listen, son," and he was at least 20 years my senior, at the time, "I've been an audio/electrical engineer for 30+ years, and ALL you need for great, crystal-clear sound is a WHOLE LOT of good quality copper, just like you'll find in any outdoor extension cable from your local hardware store." Well, who am I to argue with anyone so experienced and knowledgeable and completely honest about his trade... and who are YOU to argue?
Hi Michael, thank you for watching and sharing your experiences. I am not arguing 😉
The same with power cords. I have ripped al te rubbish out of my walls digged up everyting back to the power station. ......Let me tell you a secret; if you spend 1.000 $ £ or € on a cable of course it sounds better.
Double blind test with Lamp cord and the most expensive.
Thank you so much for taking the time and explain all the details of cable construction. Very useful information for all of us who are looking to get the best cables to match our system. Stay safe and looking forward to watch your next video
Thank you for watching Andrey and I appreciate you taking the time to comment 😉
Great video ! I’m bookmarking this video and will refer before upgrading my cables. Thanks 👍🏻
Thank you Young Padwan (great name) for watching and for expressing your support 😉
Ethan Weiner is the authority on this subject. The null test is infallible and proves there is no audible difference between cheap and expensive cables. The rest is flat earth style bullshit arguments.
the only difference is if the cables are poorly made. All u need is pure copper, the right gauge for the length and level of watts and good connection. The rest is BS
Hi, thank you for watching and commenting.
Yes agree completely
Interesting guide to speaker and interconnect cables. My system really came to life with upgraded power cables. Woven / screened with good quality connections. Also I use non switching faceplates from MK. It’s a relatively huge bang for buck upgrade.
Very interesting. Thank you for sharing 😊👍
Hi Tarun Thank you another great informative video. I’m waiting on HiDiamond 2 interconnects to be delivered and looking forward to to hearing how they perform on my recently upgraded Audia FL3S amp.
Hi Leonardo, thank you for watching and taking the time to comment. Please let me know how you get on with the interconnects 👍