Thank you so much for dropping by! Glad it was helpful for you. There will be more to come when I can finally get myself to sit down and edit. Stay tuned and happy trails!
Thank you for doing this level analysis and comparison. You're doing more to explain the jackets' performance and their differences than the brand companies themselves!
As a confused Western Australian (10C is too cold for me) I have been caught out about layering too many times. In that light, I provided great entertainment to some Americans when I hiked in Antarctica. So, thanks for this comprehensive package about layering.
The reason companies are now putting the tightening face adjustment cords inside the hood, is because they got a lot of feedback from users complaining about them hitting them in the face when the wind is blowing hard at the summit.
@@Djdrunkdad That’s true. But probably best to make any larger adjustments before encountering gnarly conditions(?) That way any finer adjustments shouldn’t be so difficult nor take too long(?)🤔
Absolute legend. So informative and had all the jackets I was considering and of course plenty more I had no clue about. Huge thanks all the way from the UK!
So stoked that you made this video. There aren't enough belay parka/heavy weight parka review comparison videos/blogs out there. So freakin' thorough! I've been trying to decide on a ski touring transition/winter camping parka for PNW ski touring missions (the tri-fecta of balancing weight, weather resistance and warmth) and you nailed it reviewing the DAS Parka, Nilas. Would love to hear your thoughts on the Rab Mythic Ultra jacket.
Thanks so much for the feedback! I think I probably could have made this video an hour shorter....but I didn't want to cut any corners. Yeah I really love the DAS and the Nilas. The RAB Mythic Ultra looks like it really breaks all of the rules. I'd love to get my hands on one. A sub 20oz heavyweight parka is a rare thing and the 900fp down will be incredibly packable. RAB does immaculate work however I do question the longevity of the TILT fabric. I red in a few places that Titanium coated nylon fibers can increase fabric longevity by 300-400%, now, that is titanium dioxide coated fibers, which I am not sure are the same as the TILT fabric. That said, time will tell how well this fabric holds up. The 10D fabric will be fragile but for winter alpine missions, it should be mighty nice. The hybrid baffle/stitch through structure is very intriguing from a mobility standpoint. This looks like an absolutely killer parka. Review coming soon perhaps? Stay tuned.
Agree with comments here that this is the best video on this subject I've seen. Absolutely right about internal hood adjustments - who wants to open a jacket to do that? I had a shell waterproof with internal adjustments - I just stopped using it in the end.
Fantastic! I live in Japan near a Mont-Bell superstore and every time I go there I get lost in the variety of choices. After watching this I'm definitely ready to make smart choices on my next bit of gear for the upcoming cold season.
LLBean does great down jackets.. I have some newer technical down but I always go with my basic LLBean Down jacket I got in 2010 for like $70. Its warmer than my $200 EMS feather jacket lol.
To me, a hooded jacket without hood adjustment is almost useless - in fact it is a deal breaker. I went with the new Patagonia Down Hooded Sweater, but had I seen this video I might have opted for the Anti-Freeze. Thank you for taking the time to make this video.
Patagonia has a good return and warranty policy. You might be able to return it for something more ideal. The antifreeze is quite a bit more jacket than the Patagonia hooded down sweater, however.
That's a superb review, you related really well to real world mountain activities. Here in the UK, down jackets have become the norm for staying warm (shopping, dog walking, going to school etc.). When I started out, you only had a down jacket if you were a gnarly mountaineer climbing, trekking and camping in winter. They were seen as a badge of honour - the more holes and soot marks from your MSR stove the better!
Well, I just got the Montane Anti Freeze XT, thanks to your advice mainly around fit. Rab Electron slightly tight in M but L too baggy! This jacket should be really cost effective because it is light enough to be carried on backpacking trips for most months of the year outside of high summer; in deep cold winter I can layer an old super light down gilet to mimic a heavier jacket's warmth. Hey, keep up the great work. Cheers!
@@davidporter2828 Love it! Thanks for commenting. I'm sure somebody else will read this and take away some good insight. I was toasty warm with the antifreeze in sub 20's earlier this month. Had to take it off and use it as a pillow in my sleeping bag.
@@Legionnaire7777 it has kept me warm in the crazy winter weather I have encountered in Canada for my Christmas visit! My only slight concern is the face fabric is fragile, I'll need to be careful in and around camp.
Great video though I would argue that the warmest jacket is the PHD Omega Down Jacket which with the 950 fill option is rated at a remarkable -74.2°F and weighing a giant 51 oz and full water proof.
Yeah I've been wanting to get my hands on some PHD gear. What's the fill weight on the Omega? That much 950fp must be insane. This video isn't meant to be an exhaustive list of all parkas or the warmest parkas. But your comment here only makes this video a better resource for people for looking for the right gear so thanks for dropping by!
@@diwoodoesthings8288 I totally understand, I have not been able to get any fill weights on PHD down clothing, their synthetic jackets are listed with full weights though, i’d love to see people cover their products, especially due to the lack of information besides their own videos, and the fact that they cost an outrageous amount. Thanks for that speedy reply.
@@LocalConArtist Yeah dude. Mountain Equipment makes an excellent product. The Trango is not a spec sheet killer by any means but it will likely outlast any other parka on this wall. The durability is outstanding at a very acceptable weight. Durability is one of those metrics you can't really quantify, nor do many companies really promote that aspect much these days. Durability means less future sales. But it is such a great value for the end user. Another cool feature of the Trango is the offset baffle design (also used in the Patagonia Alploft Parka) which provides amazing warmth with less stitching/material. Pretty cool. I just bought one for my partner. On sale for $135. Can't beat that.
@@diwoodoesthings8288 I payed a similar price and would happily do it again, though I wish that a higher quality down was available and maybe putting the Brest pockets behind the insulation, aside from that it is an outstanding garment.
You’re 100% right! Most down jacket comparisons and best of lists only focused on light / ultra light jacket. Those don’t do much good here close to the arctics 😂
I just stumbled on your channel and, so far, it was the best as far as reviewing and trying on the different jackets/parkas and the feeling of layering them with other layers. Kudos! I enjoyed and learned a lot.
Firstly -- this is absolutley awesome. What an incredible amount of information you've offered. Totally honest, concise. Dude, I wish you'd make more videos. Now... for a newbie, can you let me know which of these would work if you were caught in a rainstorm? I'm surprised how often the waterproofing isn't discussed. What am I missing?
Thanks man! More videos on the way when I can get to it. Insulation products like these are made for below freezing temps and are not meant for keeping you dry. They are meant for keeping you warm. The most water resistant option of these would be either the RAB Xenon or the Patagonia DAS Parka. These are both synthetic insulation products which perform better in wet environments because down (feathers) lose their loft when they get wet. Like soggy cereal. A Gore Tex rain shell is what you want for keeping you dry in a rain storm. I recommend having a rain shell and a separate insulating layer which you can stack if it is wet and cold or wear separately in different conditions. Much more versatile. The shell layers in this video are for rain/ precipitation protection. A good rain shell I would recommend would be an Arcteryx Alpha SL or if a Patagonia Torrent Shell. The Black Diamond Stormline Stretch or Mountain Hardwear Stretch Ozonic are good options as well. Look into 3L gore Tex or Polartec Neo Shell products. (Stay away from gore Tex paclite products). They do make all-in-one waterproof insulation layers for things like resort skiing or casual urban use but these don’t offer the ability to layer. If you are hiking in a rain storm, you don’t want much insulation, just rain protection so you can stay dry but not overheat. Layering Basics: It is best to have your base layer (like under armor or a sun hoody), an insulating layer, and a rain shell. Lots of people also like to have a light fleece like a Mountain Hardwear Airmesh or Patagonia R1 as well. This is a bonus layer referred to as an active insulation layer because it breathes to dump excess heat but offers some warmth and can be worn under a bigger insulation layer when it’s really cold. Hope this helps!
@@diwoodoesthings8288 Again, this is great info. I guess I've been trying too hard for a "heavy jacket and t-shirt" wet or dry solution. Years ago, I bought a Patagonia Infurno Jacket (that seems to no longer be made) and would always end up cold but dry. It's hard to believe that the lighter weight puffers end up being warmer than a heavy bulky coat like this when paired with a proper shell. I've just never experimented enough and spent too much time miserable! The funny thing is that I have quite a few of the items you describe, I've just been using them wrongly! I only use my Torrentshell for running in the rain, but clearly it needs to be paired with a proper puffer for bomb proof capanbilities. Please keep making more videos. I'd love to hear your thoughts on ski/snowboard gear, hiking shoes, etc... This is great stuff! Thanks again!!!
@@Froggywentcourtin Loft is very important for warmth. The insulation in the jacket is designed to create a layer of air between you and the outside that is warmed by your body. A separate shell can help trap that air in and prevent wind from blowing through the insulation. This really increases the warmth. But the layering concept allows you to dial in your temp when moving or sitting still. Just make sure the shell is large enough that it doesn't squeeze and compress the insulation which will actually make you colder and restrict movement/blood flow. I am working on more videos. Standby!
@@diwoodoesthings8288 A few more questions because you clearly know your stuff... I have a Patagonia Powder Bowl Jacket, which they call a hard shell. If I have one of the jackets above (such as the Mountain Hardware Down Jacket or Down Parka) and am skiing snowing 10-15 degree Jackson Hole, when would I layer the Powder Bowl or is it just not needed if I go with an R1 underlayer and Down Parka? [feel free to address in a separate video for us newbies] Can you confirm the exact name of the Mountain Hardwear Down Jacket that you like? They seem to have a lot of variants like Deloro or Direct North. Same question, DAS Parka (which seems to now be a DAS Light Insulated Hoody and may be something different entirely)? Is the Rab Electron that your reference, the Rab Electron Pro? It's nuts that you made this video so recently and all the product names keep bouncing around.
@@Froggywentcourtin The Powder Bowl is a hard shell jacket (not insulated). I prefer to layer a fleece (R1) and a synthetic midlayer under a hard shell. I typically reserve down layers as an outermost layer. That would be optimal. That said, layering a sweater weight down jacket (3oz of down or less) under the shell is perfectly fine. But sweat/moisture buildup could reduce the insulating qualities and leave you with a soggy down jacket. Synthetic manages the moisture better. I’ll do a layering video when I can get to it. But remember fleece and down layers are for staying warm, shells are for staying dry and keeping the elements out. I would wear a shell and fleece/ midlayer for skiing. A down parka/jacket is really static activities like when you get to camp or hanging around town when it’s cold. I really like the Mountain hardwear Phantom Jacket (not the belay parka, see my other video) as an insulating layer for backpacking. If I were to go with a hard shell for skiing I would go with the Exposure/2 gore Tex pro. For rain shell I would look at the MH Stretch Ozonic. The Patagonia DAS parka is their warmest synthetic layer for belaying and ice climbing. They made a baby brother to it called the DAS Light which is a great puffy for hiking in cold/wet places. The Rab Electron Pro is an updated version of the Electron I review. Very minor differences. Basically the same jacket. Products change slightly every season. “Product lifecycle”
Thanks, Diwoo, such a great video summarizing all the parkas. I didn't buy the BD Stance Belay Parka for myself, but my mom's boyfriend works outdoors in the winter, and I brought it for him because it is made with such a tough material. He loves it. I own the Arc'teryx FIrebee and Westcomb Himilaya. I should really get a synthetic belay jacket in case I am working in near-freezing temperatures. Your video is extremely useful, thank you.
It really fills that niche very well. Much warmer than the typical 3 season puffies but not nearly as bulky as a full on parka. Thanks for dropping by!
Thank you for taking the time to review and compare these jackets. I am planning a trip/tour of Canada for a month starting November and I am looking purchasing the right jacket that's not going to break the bank but will keep me warm.
Great reviews! Looking forward to more in depth reviews in the future. Enjoy your detailed pro/cons of each jacket. I went with the Rab Electron (before seeing your video), at one size up. While Rab's website calls the Electron a "regular" fit, I can't imagine when they refer to a slim fit how truly slim fit tight it really is.
Thanks for the feedback! It is absolutely an athletic fit but Rab products just run small. Loved everything about that jacket. Just wish it was a size larger
Yes, for UK conditions those two or the Patagonia Das Light would be preferable to anything with down fill. I've got my eye on the Rab Generator Alpine with its perfect feature set for static warmth when high moorland and mountain walking in the UK, where cold and wet conditions are commonplace.
Im looking to purchase the absolute zero soon, I already own the phantom parka which is definitely a warm jacket but as a landscape photographer who regularly sits in one spot for hours on mountaintops before sunrise im convinced i need an absolute zero, the northeast mountains of the usa are no joke when it comes to cold especially the Adirondacks and white mountains
It does get extremely cold here in the Whites. Would also point you toward a Feathered Friends Khumbu or a PHD parka for your use case. But an Absolute Zero would definitely keep you warm. Another option might be the MHW Phantom Zero. More of a casual style piece but super burly and warm.
I have two down "tops". First is an Eddie Bauer First Ascent down sweater good for 20 F. If I'm layered and moving. The other is an Everest res, Eddie Bauer's FIRST ASCENT Peak XV (the original name for Everest). It's good to -30 F. and too warm for all but the coldest skiing weather but good for camp use when winter camping. I NEED A MEDIUM WEIGHT BAFFLED PARKA.
The Peak XV is an awesome heavyweight piece! My ice climbing friend has one and loves it. The Montbell Alpine Down Parka is awesome as a medium weight, baffled down Parka. Extremely Warm and only 16oz with 7oz of down fill. But check out options from Montane, Rab or Mountain Hardwear as well.
@@diwoodoesthings8288 can't pick just one...but I love a Bergans parka and the Arcteryx Nuclei for different reasons. I own a couple different Outdoor Research jackets and mid layers for splitboarding.
Hey man, wonderful video! I love the time you take with all your reviews. They are much better than most out there and have been a resource to me. Just wondering what year model your MHW phantom is? I can't seem to find that same jacket. It appears the new models are a different design.
Hey, yes the phantom has changed. This was the 20/21 model I believe. They changed the colors and now they don’t make it anymore. You now have a choice between the Phantom Alpine and the Phantom Belay Parka.
That was the goal! In all my research, I realized there was nothing out there to give a good frame of reference for winter parkas. I know I wasn't the only one wishing so here it is!
Nice and long video men, very informative. I think you may have a problem with to many down jackets over there xD, here is the thing, i have kind of a similar problem with the gear, my girl almost going to throw me out of the house for it. Cheers.
My problem is not having too many jackets. My problem is not having enough space for all of them XD Thanks dude! I hope everything works out with your "it's me or the gear" situation
@@diwoodoesthings8288 May i suggest some interesting pieces for your "next buys" list: - Patagonia Grade VII, best belay parka ever period, Try to get a hand on the lastest 2022 version have revised shoulder baffles, color blue and black, not the best color but i guarantee you will want to sell all the other jackets xD (i had in the past Montane alpine 850, TNF L6, and a Rab Positron) - TNF 50/50 AMK L3, it is a midlayer, 1000FP down, a little bit hard to find and expensive, but a unique piece of gear, in the sense that its one of the few down midlayer that can breathe, it has a non AMK jacket version who is less expensive and esier to find too.
@@artysa.blackwood4261 it just so happens that a Grade VII fell into my posession along with an Alpine 850. Very excited about these pieces. Both new. The Grade VII is the old shoulder baffle design but they are hard to find these days. I will likely put out another video like this in the near future.
Wow,it took you long enough to get there...I really like Patagonia products..but for more pockets,I would go with the Bearskin tactical and then a Down mid layer and then the shell DAS parka...why??? I have a 1974 NorthFace 800 Down that has NO outer protection at minus Ten the wind 😂 enter with out ring the door bell..So I ware a gore tec shell rain trench coat overlay.works great in Chicago and Taos ski valley....but things for all your inputs.
Hi and thanks for your great work👏🏻👏🏻 Would like to know what do you think about the discontinued patagonia grade 7 and also the simond makalu jacket (retail price 150€) Thx again and keep it up👍🏻
The Grade VII is an incredible piece. Hard to find in a good size/color but worth the hunt if you can get it at a good price (under $600). Otherwize, look at a Rab Positron for that level of warmth. I have not used the Simond Makalu. However with 236g of 800fp down, it will be a nice warm jacket for MOST applications. Anything in the alps or lower 48. Simond is part of Decathalon which makes a good value product. Many will outperform it but not at the pricepoint.
I have an issue where I just always buy Patagonia even though I spend like days worth of hours researching every brand. It's an issue and I need to snap out of it. It's the quality yeah.. but that warranty is impossible to beat. Ive changed a 11 year old H2NO jacket for a brand new one.. I was just asking if I could pay to repair lol.
The Positron Pro really intrigues me because it has over 2oz more down fill than the Resolute while only weighing .4oz more. Though it has a large internal chest pocket, I don't believe the Positron has internal dump pockets. The Resolute does. I have heard that the stitch through baffling lets some wind through, while allowing more mobility, it sortof negates the extra down fill. I would take a good long look at the Montane Resolute over the Positron. Because of these two features. But overall, people really like the Positron and it is tried and true. I would opt for the Montane Resolute for the dump pocket.
You mentioned the old Patagonia Fitzroy being in the same category as the Nilas I’m curious as to which version you’re referring to? Great video by the way!
The Fitz Roy Parka used to have 227g (8oz) of 800fp down in a boxwall construction. The new Fitz Roy Hoody is stitch through and has way less down fill. The old Fitz Roy is discontinued and is a highly sought after as a rare but incredible piece of gear. Sort of a blend of features and materials between the Chonos and Nilas really. But several ounces lighter than either. Thanks for the question and feedback!
I have had the chance to try on the BD Vision Parka and it is a nice piece. Very light weight at about 20oz with 209g of 800 fill down. Though for the price I would probably opt for the Mountain Hardwear Phantom Parka as it is fully baffled in the sleeves and torso. It also has more down 215+g of 800 fill down clocking in at around 20oz. The stitch-through construction of the Vision Parka is a big oversight in my opinion. You'll get a warmer parka for less $ with the Phantom Parka.
which model is the montane, because it looks like the old resolute and is different from the new antifreeze or antifreeze xt, none of the latter have an exterior or interior mesh pocket
Come with me to a mom store in Nepal she has a template for every brand and logo in the world. I bought 2 cheap canvas tote bag but I had them stenciled with North face prominently on them. She offered me other templates like pentagonia or LL bean but I chose north face for the irony of that being on simple tote bags
Hello there! Eventually a review with detailed size help! So thank you so much. I really hesitate between the Rab Electron pro and the montane anti freeze. Would you be so kind as to tell me what size did you pick for the Montane. We are the same height but I'm thicker than you. My problem with the rab is the same as yours. I have to take a L but the sleeves are too long, so are the total lenght. Do you find the Montane has a larger cut and has some room for a medium fleece inside?
Hey thanks for dropping by! I wear a medium with the antifreeze and I was able to layer a Patagonia Nano Air under it quite nicely. It has more girth than the Rab Electron. With my 40” chest and 32” waist, the fit is great. You might be able to fit a light fleece under it if you are wider than me. More than a 42” chest and 34” waist and I would look at a large. But you can see the torso length is quite generous here.
Hey thanks for dropping by! I wear a medium with the antifreeze and I was able to layer a Patagonia Nano Air under it quite nicely. It has more girth than the Rab Electron. With my 40” chest and 32” waist, the fit is great. You might be able to fit a light fleece under it if you are wider than me. More than a 42” chest and 34” waist and I would look at a large. But you can see the torso length is quite generous here.
Hey thanks for the feedback! Here is a link to a basic google doc with the information i collected. Not as robust as rokslide, reddit or mountain project, but here it is docs.google.com/document/d/11RGdmKWgb7TFMvhFlQShSq6yHtV8G22P8KNLka96XFM/edit?usp=share_link
Amazing how few brands bother to mention how much down is actually in their jacket. They'll say "900 fill power down!" but forget to mention that there's only 4 ounces of it. I bought a Montane apex jacket because it has 18 ounces of down - insanely warm. Seems like you get far better value with the outdoor expedition brands than with the fashion-oriented brands.
Down traps air. Fill POWER = how much air per gram. Fill weight = How many grams of Down. 2 gram of fill WEIGHT 500 fill power Is the same warmth as 1 gram fill weight 1000 fill power. Its just twice the weight. DOWN is rarely a Belay jacket. Look at Synthetic such as Mountain Equipment Citadel ( or Fitzroy) or DAS Parka Belay is a jacket to keep you warm stood still at the bottom of a climb whilst your partner climbs. It goes OVER your other clothes including shell. For ‘normal’ ( non climbing) use a parka such as TNF mcmurdo.
Hey man incredible video and so informative, I’m UK based so synthetic is the one for me just wondering if you have any other recommendations on synthetic heavy weight as I’d be using it for belay jacket for Scottish winter. Been told loads about the patagucci DAS, Mountain Equipment Citadel also the Arcteryx nuclei sv. I only ask as I swear by patagucci for all my kit but I also have used the montane kit cheers for this and stay safe out there. Reece.
What’s up dude! Thanks so much. I really like the DAS because of its packability. If you already rock Pata for most of your kit, it would be a classy addition. The nuclei sv will be warmer. The citadel will also be a super heavyweight and warm option. If you’re not traveling super far distances, look toward a heavier warmer option like the last two. If you wanna be a steeze machine that’s fast and light, go with the DAS
What size is the Nilas parka that you're wearing? I'm about 189cm 73kg (lanky) and was looking at the Nilas, not for layering over absolutely everything, but some basic cold weather layers. Would you recommend L or M? Asking because I found the L on sale haha.
Yes its on sale at an amazing price. I would say a large would work great for you length-wise. M and the sleeves would be too short. This thing is built to layer in the torso. You will be able to layer a fleece, mid layer and shell underneath
What size are you ? Im wondering as im going to get the same green Montbell Japan but not sure what size as i usually go for medium in for example north face jackets.
Size up at least one size with Montbell. I wear a medium in most things and the large a just slightly too short in the torso for me. I got a japanese version of the Permafrost in an XL and it fits better, a little on the big size but slightly too big is better than slightly too small with parkas like this.
Thank you so much! I get cold super easily(short+skinny), but love being outside all winter as well as summer. I have been researching expedition parkas but it is surprisingly hard to find info on them, even harder to find a used one. Any advise on finding something in the sub $300 range? Use: Ice fishing and overnight snow shoe trips, temps 32-0F but I run about 20F colder than the average male when I stop moving. Would I be better off with a lightweight down jacket layered under a sized up midweight jacket? Any insights are greatly appreciated🙏
Facebook Marketplace and geartrade.com are solid resources. A synthetic midlayer under a mid-heavyweight parka is a good way to go. For example, I used my Patagonia NanoAir under my Montane Antifreeze in sub 20's and was super comfortable, almost too warm. Layering provides a huge range of comfort in different temps so yeah I highly recommend. Though I would go with a synthetic midlayer under your down for moisture management.
Hi. interested in buying the mont bell alpine down parka and was wondering what to do sizing wise as i can only find it available in japanese sizing. how tall are you and did you buy it in us sizing or japanese sizing? I'm 5'8 and wondering whether or not the japanese large would be big enough. not intending to do too much layering with it. what size do you think would be best? many thanks
Hey there, this was a size large in Japanese sizing. I got rid of this parka because the torso length was too short. I am 5'7" with a 17" torso, 40" chest and 22" pit to pit. If I were you, I would go with a Japanese XL. You will have room to layer underneath. It will not be a super close fit and may even be a bit too broad in the torso unless you are close to 200lb. Hope this helps!
Very informative video. Have you tried/ looked at the Arc'teryx Nuclei SV at all? Can't quite decide between that and the DAS for a belay, touring, and all-around cold weather jacket. I think synthetic is the way to go as a fellow Vermonter.
I have not tried the Nuclei SV but I’d love to. It is very similarly priced with the DAS. The DAS has 133g/m2 insulation throughout with and and extra 40g/m2 in certain areas (I think the front back and shoulders. It weighs in at under 20oz. The Nuclei SV uses double stack 90g/m2 with single stack under the arms. It weighs 21.2oz. So marginally heavier but I think it is going to be warmer. A bit burlier face fabric too. I can’t imagine you’d be disappointed with either. It will probably come down to fit. I think they might stock the SV at REI in Williston but I’m not sure. But I can see myself using the DAS more than just about any other piece of gear I have this winter.
I actually found a review that mentions how the Nuclei SV “outperforms the DAS Parka for a hundred bucks less” www.thealpinestart.com/2021/11/18/arcteryx-nuclei-sv-review-vs-dually/ Here is a Reddit thread comparing the two. The DAS is much more packable. www.reddit.com/r/Mountaineering/comments/rmn1yv/arcteryx_nuclei_sv_or_patagonia_das_parka/
My wife has the Nuclei SV. She raves about it being an absolute furnace. It feels very high quality, seems cheaper than it should be for an Arcteryx product in my opinion. I love that it’s synthetic as well, makes it super versatile
@@ahone2520 That's great info! I think if you're doing shorter treks to ice routes, etc, the Nuclei SV is the move. But for longer distance treks where packability is paramount, the DAS might be a better option. Either way, you'll be warm. The DAS layers exceptionally well so there is that consideration as well. How does the Nuclei SV layer?
@@diwoodoesthings8288 I wouldn’t be able to compare it to the DAS (having not tried it myself), but it is definitely built to layer, and the loft appears substantial. I am not sure how well it would pack though, so that’s a great point. The value is what caught my eye.
Nilas on sale on Mountain Hardwear website for $219. Size L, XL as of 8/12/23 www.mountainhardwear.com/p/mens-nilas-jacket-1939301.html?dwvar_1939301_color=842&dwvar_1939301_size=L&&mid=paidsearch&eid=Google+AdWords+US&nid=16979019828&oid=&did=&s_kwcid=AL!3937!3!!!!x!!&gclid=CjwKCAjw29ymBhAKEiwAHJbJ8qdFQX0Z4S4SIDa-1Du2ecDfQfwSsqeaLIlL6BGMcRRmV5s1raoZWxoCnfgQAvD_BwE
@@neaklaus52 of course. Whether by them having one parka for all of their varied uses; buying the biggest, most expensive jacket they could find; or by misjudging the weather conditions, it’s rare to be truly optimized. I would say I most often see an over-gunned jacket at the resort or in the city. Most often someone wants to throw a bunch of cash at a big flashy jacket that they don’t actually need. You might throw me into this category, but then again, that’s how/why I made this video 😎
I wore my Nilas on Mount Washington in the spring when I expected colder weather. Ended up only being low teens and moderate wind so I left my parka unzipped the whole time with an alpha fleece and Squamish wind shell underneath when camping up high.
I would consult with your guide company about your parka selection. Many recommend a minimum of 250g of 800fp down which equates to 7054cuin of down. The Paiyu/Trango has 269g of 700fp down which equates to 6641cuin of down. The offset/reflective baffle construction does increase the effective warmth of the parka. I think if you size appropriately (size up) to layer a 60g synthetic + 100g synthetic insulation mid layer and fleece underneath, the Trango - now called the Paiyu - may be sufficient for that peak. But standalone, the Trango/Paiyu might be a bit too light for that peak. I would consult with the Mountain Equipment Product Team before purchasing for that Peak. Call The Gear Doc in North Conway, New Hampshire. He sells Mountain Equipment parkas and will be able to steer you in the right direction. +1 603-662-4690.
My version is an older version with 850fp down and a different cut. There was a newer 800fp model that they discontinued this year for the new Phantom Belay parka. You can still find the nilas on ebay and FB Marketplace somewhat regularly if you check now and again.
Hey again. I am wondering if your Montbell Alpine Down Parka is the US version in large or the Japanese version in large? I looking to get that since I found a good deal and am looking for something light but that can layer over midlayers and a shell. I typically wear a US medium. What version and size would you recommend to layer over everything? Thank you!
I think I had the Japanese large. I wear a medium in most things but montbell seems to run small consistently, even in American/Euro sizes. I would size up.
i got the ghost whisperer 2, but after seeing it i realize it's very thin and i'm worried i won't do well on an upcoming shasta climb. I think i need to return it and get something warmer for 15-30F
The ghost whisperer is really for warm months when it gets cool in the evening. Get something with 5+oz of down in it for shasta. Make sure you can layer it. Look at the montane antifreeze or Rab electron.
stacking DAS light hoodie makes up for a true belay parka? I was reading Colin Haley layering article on it. Its 600 grams of total insulation and its fine by the kirkpatrick standard but its confusing me a lot when there is so much stuff about it.
I have found that stacking my RAB Xenon with another synthetic layer makes for quite the warm combination. Part of this is because the space/air in between the layers also acts as a zone of warm air which increases the warmth beyond what either piece can do alone. The sum is greater than the parts. BUT, in extremely cold temps, you will want a true parka to layer over your mid layers
Is the ECWCS level 7 similar in warmth to the Black Diamond Belay Parka? Which of these down parkas that you have are equivalent in warmth to the above two synthetic parkas?
Great question. The ECWCS LVL 7 and BD Belay Parka share a lot of the same DNA. I would argue the Belay parka might even be a bit warmer. The MH Nilas parka and Montane Chonos are extremely warm, 6000m parkas. The Mountain Equipment Trango is a close down equivalent to the BD Belay Parka.
great video thanks for chapters. I've been doing a lot of research into what jacket I want to get and I am pretty sure I want to get a synthetic parka. mainly because I don't ever want to be worried about it getting wet. In your experience, are there any synthetic parkas you know of that are just about as warm and almost as light (could be brought on a plane and not take up whole suitcase) as similar down products? thx for the video liked and subbed
You're welcome! I made this video because I was in the same boat, trying to figure out which parka to buy. The DAS parka is probably your best bet on packability. Another option would be finding an older RAB Xenon and layering with another synthetic midlayer But it is definitely not built for for super cold. Somebody else mentioned the Mountain Equipment Fitzroy which is about 4oz heavier. The DAS should fit the bill
The Orange Montane Antifreeze is a size medium. It’s an athletic fit so it is a bit snug with a midlayer on. Very form fitting. This parka is great for about 20°-32°F static. Quite a bit colder for active use 5°F or so. It is stitch through so not great for deep winter static use The grey Montane Chonos is a large to accommodate additional layers and cover down to my thighs. This parka will keep you warm well below 0°F
I have the Nilas from 2014 and it didn't come with the bottom zipper, great jacket, but I wouldn't use it as a belay jacket, My Sub Zero from MHW does, even my hooded Phantom jacket has it. I have the MHW Quasar synthetic insulated jacket in both Medium and in Large that I normally wear from MHW, the medium fits like an athletic cut large, where the large is like a baggy Xlarge for me. I had to keep in mind that it is supposed to fit large, but I love the jacket so much that I wanted it in the smaller size to fit like a normal jacket. The Quasar is waterproof so it can do double duty in keeping you warm and dry. I feel like MHW has moved away from really awesome technical items like what they came up with working with Uli Steck. I also feel that way about Salomon in recent years, their really cool S/Lab stuff isn't coming back and what they have left is really lackluster. I called to ask a question about a MHW size and was blown away by the imbeciles they have working their customer support, they have no clue about the products because they don't wear the clothes or do any outdoor activities related to the clothes they sell, to be brutally honest, they have hired customer service reps who have crossed the southern border and English is their second language, It has pushed me away from buying any future technical clothing from them, I will not buy from a company that has employees who haven't a clue about the products and how to use them. That is them selling out and just resting on their brand name to keep them afloat. I would much rather buy something from Rab, Mammut , or any of the other companies that actually have climbers giving input and working for them in house.
Thanks for dropping by! I have had similar impressions of MHW of late. Same experiences with customer service. I am always looking for older models from them. My Nilas is an older model with 850fp down instead of the current 800fp. Since they sold to columbia, they are more focused on bottom line than on the end consumer performance. Some items like the airmesh are really cool, but in general, they are drifting. Even their product pages have incorrect specs listed.... It's good to vocalize these things because if we don't hold companies accountable, they would stay true to what they do. Happy trails!
@@diwoodoesthings8288 I appreciate your reply. I am a gear whore too. I love climbing gear and clothing. I was able to climb for a month and a half in the Alps in 2017. Being based out of the Chamonix area and getting to climb with the European climbers, being able to go into the massive mountaineering shops both in Chamonix and the valleys below blew my mind in how light the gear the europeans use is compared to what most American climbers use. I thought I was on the cutting edge of gear that I could buy in the States, once I got there, I felt like there was so much more selection and the entire thought process of climbing fast and light I had had to be rethought again. I will say that many of the climbers I did meet were interested in the gear I had brought with me. The Ascensionist 45 pack from Patagonia, and the MHW gear/clothing I was using. Climbing in Europe was a great experience for me, though, I have been criticized being back home and being told my gear is too light to be safe by the guides I know and have run across while up on the mountain.
The Mountain Hardwear Phantom Alpine has the roomiest cut for layering. It is definitely the most equipped for higher alpine pursuits. The Rab Electron is incredibly packable but has an athletic fit making it really hard to layer. Despite its materials, construction and packability, I would consider it a much more casual piece. The Montane Antifreeze is a highly engineered parka that layers better than the Electron but not as well as the Phantom Alpine. I also noticed cold spots between the baffles which reduced performance on its most important metric. If they made the Antifreeze with box baffles and kept the same amount of down, it would be a home run. That said, it is a great winter jacket for ski touring and mild winter camping if you have a midlayer underneath.
heyy man nice vid. What do you think of the montane resolute jacket? is it warm enough to make expeditions on the 6000 Himalayan or for example on the Aconcagua? or is it warm enough for the cold -25°C Norwegian winter? I don't know why but to me it doesn't seem as puffy as the chonos, thanks so much
At 250g (8.8oz) of 800 down fill, this should be enough to insulate you down to -25c. With a good baselayer and midlayer. One thing I would make sure of is fit. If you get a size too small, you wont be able to layer. If too big, then too much air drafts will enter from the lower hem. One thing that is different on the resolute from the Chonos is the sleeves. The Chonos has fully baffled sleeves, whereas the Resolute has stitch-through sleeves. This will make it less ideal for 6,000m peaks. Here are some options worth considering: Mountain Hardwear Nilas Mountain Equipment K7 and the Gasherbrum. Montbell Permafrost Rab Positron Feathered Friends Helios You will want 250g+ of 800 fill down My version of the Nilas is 850 fill with 215g. Higher fill power requires slightly less fill weight for the same insulating value. But look at fill weight over fill power for really high peaks.
@@diwoodoesthings8288 thank you man, this is the best answer you could give me, yeah I am looking for a jacket that is good for both mountain and city use, probably i'll go with the positron. anyway I appreciated the answer, cheers from Italy
Does is drive you crazy when the Outerwear Companies confuse jackets and Parkas? Either for Belaying or otherwise? I have seen some outerwear that is called a parka, when it is obviously more of a jacket than a parka?
The technical definition for parka is a large wind proof jacket with a hood meant to be worn in cold weather. So they are technically not wrong, but it is confusing when shopping.
Is there a packable jacket you'd recommend that would be warm even if soaked through and freezing / bad weather. I'm basically looking for something for hiking, light mountaineering that is as bomb proof as possible. Is the DAS too much jacket?
The DAS would be my first recommendation. My second recommendation would be to go with a RAB Xenon and pair it with another synthetic mid layer. This gives you a modular system where you have the added breathable warmth of the mid layer (like the Patagonia Nano Air) combined with the windproof atmos fabric of the Xenon. I love that combo and will likely use that a lot this year. I am 5'7" 175lb and wear a medium Nano Air and pair it with a large Rab Xenon and it is a match made in heaven. Incredibly warm as well.
@@diwoodoesthings8288 I appreciate you taking time to recommend things. As luck would have it I just picked up a nano-air for 50% off so I’ll check out both options.
The Phantom Parka is lighter at around 21oz. It has a softer 20D Diamond Fuse Pertex face fabric and no jersey cuffs. Its an awesome piece. The Nilas version I have is the older 850 fill option that weighs about 27oz. The newer version has 800 fill and is around 31oz. It has a much more rugged Airshield face fabric (which is a 2 layer 15D fabric). If you're going for ultralight that will be thrown on over a base layer or light fleece, go with the Phantom Its a better belay parka. If you're looking for a more durable summit parka that will fit over more layers, go with the Nilas. I would have included the Phantom in this video but I don't have that parka any more. Strongly considering re-purchasing.
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This is an absolutely outstanding video. The time and effort put into this is just incredible. Thank you man. Keep up the superb work
Thanks homie!! Trying to get more videos out the door. Stay tuned!
Simply the most complete video about parkas and insulating jackets there is on youtube
This comment brings a tear to my eye. Thank you 🙏🏻🤘🏼
This is the best jacket/parka video on You Tube. One of the most thorough gear videos I’ve ever seen, thanks
Thank you so much for dropping by! Glad it was helpful for you. There will be more to come when I can finally get myself to sit down and edit. Stay tuned and happy trails!
Thank you for doing this level analysis and comparison. You're doing more to explain the jackets' performance and their differences than the brand companies themselves!
Yeah, I'm trying to fill in the information gaps out there on tis particular topic. Thanks for dropping by! I appreciate the feedback.
As a confused Western Australian (10C is too cold for me) I have been caught out about layering too many times. In that light, I provided great entertainment to some Americans when I hiked in Antarctica. So, thanks for this comprehensive package about layering.
www.mountainhardwear.com/p/mens-nilas-jacket-1939301.html?dwvar_1939301_color=004&bc_pid=MTkzOTMwMTAwNA%3D%3D&MHW_US_PriceDropWeekly&mid=em&eid=RTM&nid=MHW_US_PriceDropWeekly&obem=5xQAHbm9Z_oyHYWN65GOaHO00vb4sRfh5G8561KRoPk%3D&bc_lcid=t5477399566770176lw5116676101660672
Nilas is on sale currently for $329
The reason companies are now putting the tightening face adjustment cords inside the hood, is because they got a lot of feedback from users complaining about them hitting them in the face when the wind is blowing hard at the summit.
yeah that makes sense. not a perfect solution but thats why we have options.
I don’t know about you guys but when I have layers on and it’s cold, it’s annoying trying to find the cords let alone doing it with gloves on
@@Djdrunkdad
That’s true. But probably best to make any larger adjustments before encountering gnarly conditions(?) That way any finer adjustments shouldn’t be so difficult nor take too long(?)🤔
Absolute legend. So informative and had all the jackets I was considering and of course plenty more I had no clue about. Huge thanks all the way from the UK!
So stoked that you made this video. There aren't enough belay parka/heavy weight parka review comparison videos/blogs out there. So freakin' thorough! I've been trying to decide on a ski touring transition/winter camping parka for PNW ski touring missions (the tri-fecta of balancing weight, weather resistance and warmth) and you nailed it reviewing the DAS Parka, Nilas. Would love to hear your thoughts on the Rab Mythic Ultra jacket.
Thanks so much for the feedback! I think I probably could have made this video an hour shorter....but I didn't want to cut any corners. Yeah I really love the DAS and the Nilas. The RAB Mythic Ultra looks like it really breaks all of the rules. I'd love to get my hands on one. A sub 20oz heavyweight parka is a rare thing and the 900fp down will be incredibly packable. RAB does immaculate work however I do question the longevity of the TILT fabric. I red in a few places that Titanium coated nylon fibers can increase fabric longevity by 300-400%, now, that is titanium dioxide coated fibers, which I am not sure are the same as the TILT fabric. That said, time will tell how well this fabric holds up. The 10D fabric will be fragile but for winter alpine missions, it should be mighty nice. The hybrid baffle/stitch through structure is very intriguing from a mobility standpoint. This looks like an absolutely killer parka. Review coming soon perhaps? Stay tuned.
Agree with comments here that this is the best video on this subject I've seen. Absolutely right about internal hood adjustments - who wants to open a jacket to do that? I had a shell waterproof with internal adjustments - I just stopped using it in the end.
Thanks so much! Yeah, I like as little fidgeting as possible when making adjustments.
Fantastic! I live in Japan near a Mont-Bell superstore and every time I go there I get lost in the variety of choices. After watching this I'm definitely ready to make smart choices on my next bit of gear for the upcoming cold season.
Love to hear it! Definitely envious. I may have to make the pilgrimage to that store. Let me know what you end up getting!
LLBean does great down jackets.. I have some newer technical down but I always go with my basic LLBean Down jacket I got in 2010 for like $70. Its warmer than my $200 EMS feather jacket lol.
To me, a hooded jacket without hood adjustment is almost useless - in fact it is a deal breaker. I went with the new Patagonia Down Hooded Sweater, but had I seen this video I might have opted for the Anti-Freeze. Thank you for taking the time to make this video.
Patagonia has a good return and warranty policy. You might be able to return it for something more ideal. The antifreeze is quite a bit more jacket than the Patagonia hooded down sweater, however.
I'm not into belaying, but this research and review is great for me. Thank you!
That’s what it’s here for! Glad you enjoyed it
Awesome reviews and comparisons. Thanks for doing this 👍
@@jameschan1334 sure thing! Hoping to have another one out soon!
That's a superb review, you related really well to real world mountain activities. Here in the UK, down jackets have become the norm for staying warm (shopping, dog walking, going to school etc.).
When I started out, you only had a down jacket if you were a gnarly mountaineer climbing, trekking and camping in winter. They were seen as a badge of honour - the more holes and soot marks from your MSR stove the better!
Love that! I am always paranoid to get holes but you are so right. Tenacious tape is a badge of honor. Thanks for dropping by!
Well, I just got the Montane Anti Freeze XT, thanks to your advice mainly around fit. Rab Electron slightly tight in M but L too baggy!
This jacket should be really cost effective because it is light enough to be carried on backpacking trips for most months of the year outside of high summer; in deep cold winter I can layer an old super light down gilet to mimic a heavier jacket's warmth.
Hey, keep up the great work. Cheers!
@@davidporter2828 Love it! Thanks for commenting. I'm sure somebody else will read this and take away some good insight. I was toasty warm with the antifreeze in sub 20's earlier this month. Had to take it off and use it as a pillow in my sleeping bag.
@@davidporter2828 Excellent choice I was going to get the same jacket but ended up getting a Rab infinity jacket the fit is excellent too.
@@Legionnaire7777 it has kept me warm in the crazy winter weather I have encountered in Canada for my Christmas visit! My only slight concern is the face fabric is fragile, I'll need to be careful in and around camp.
This video is great. I literally was looking for a video like this last year.
Thanks dude! More to come soon!
Heading to Ouray. Needed advice. This was perfect Sunday evening viewing. Patagonia DAS. Thank you.
My go to jackets are from Eddie Bauer because they are on sale 30% off sometimes 😂. The EB Xv goes up against many that are more expensive 😊
EB makes an awesomely durable and versatile product. A few of my friends who are UL nerds still love their EB down jackets.
Excellent video, I had been waiting for a similar one about parkas for a long time, congratulations
Great video though I would argue that the warmest jacket is the PHD Omega Down Jacket which with the 950 fill option is rated at a remarkable -74.2°F and weighing a giant 51 oz and full water proof.
Yeah I've been wanting to get my hands on some PHD gear. What's the fill weight on the Omega? That much 950fp must be insane.
This video isn't meant to be an exhaustive list of all parkas or the warmest parkas. But your comment here only makes this video a better resource for people for looking for the right gear so thanks for dropping by!
@@diwoodoesthings8288 I totally understand, I have not been able to get any fill weights on PHD down clothing, their synthetic jackets are listed with full weights though, i’d love to see people cover their products, especially due to the lack of information besides their own videos, and the fact that they cost an outrageous amount. Thanks for that speedy reply.
Also, I’m happy to see someone else using the trango From Mountain equipment
@@LocalConArtist Yeah dude. Mountain Equipment makes an excellent product. The Trango is not a spec sheet killer by any means but it will likely outlast any other parka on this wall. The durability is outstanding at a very acceptable weight. Durability is one of those metrics you can't really quantify, nor do many companies really promote that aspect much these days. Durability means less future sales. But it is such a great value for the end user.
Another cool feature of the Trango is the offset baffle design (also used in the Patagonia Alploft Parka) which provides amazing warmth with less stitching/material. Pretty cool.
I just bought one for my partner. On sale for $135. Can't beat that.
@@diwoodoesthings8288 I payed a similar price and would happily do it again, though I wish that a higher quality down was available and maybe putting the Brest pockets behind the insulation, aside from that it is an outstanding garment.
Super helpful and covered all of the bases
The absolute best review on RUclips. Much thanks for your time and knowledge of the products!
Thanks for all the great info. From Essex Junction, VT. 😊
Hey neighbor! thanks for popping by. You visit the new OGE in Essex yet?
@@diwoodoesthings8288 ~ Hey, no I haven’t. I hope to check it out this weekend.
Best jacket review I've seen on you tube. Deep detail, just how I like my reviews.
You’re 100% right! Most down jacket comparisons and best of lists only focused on light / ultra light jacket. Those don’t do much good here close to the arctics 😂
Great video. It took forever to find synthetic parkas. I have the patagonia DAS. I like its little packing bag.
I found my favorite channel! I LOVE jackets!!
That warms my heart
I just stumbled on your channel and, so far, it was the best as far as reviewing and trying on the different jackets/parkas and the feeling of layering them with other layers. Kudos! I enjoyed and learned a lot.
Thanks for dropping by and “reviewing my review!” I’ll try to have more up soon
Ive got he Montane Apex 8000, use it for urban wear in denmark, I swear it is the down jacket to rule them all!
Firstly -- this is absolutley awesome. What an incredible amount of information you've offered. Totally honest, concise. Dude, I wish you'd make more videos.
Now... for a newbie, can you let me know which of these would work if you were caught in a rainstorm? I'm surprised how often the waterproofing isn't discussed. What am I missing?
Thanks man! More videos on the way when I can get to it.
Insulation products like these are made for below freezing temps and are not meant for keeping you dry. They are meant for keeping you warm.
The most water resistant option of these would be either the RAB Xenon or the Patagonia DAS Parka. These are both synthetic insulation products which perform better in wet environments because down (feathers) lose their loft when they get wet. Like soggy cereal.
A Gore Tex rain shell is what you want for keeping you dry in a rain storm. I recommend having a rain shell and a separate insulating layer which you can stack if it is wet and cold or wear separately in different conditions. Much more versatile.
The shell layers in this video are for rain/ precipitation protection.
A good rain shell I would recommend would be an Arcteryx Alpha SL or if a Patagonia Torrent Shell. The Black Diamond Stormline Stretch or Mountain Hardwear Stretch Ozonic are good options as well. Look into 3L gore Tex or Polartec Neo Shell products. (Stay away from gore Tex paclite products).
They do make all-in-one waterproof insulation layers for things like resort skiing or casual urban use but these don’t offer the ability to layer. If you are hiking in a rain storm, you don’t want much insulation, just rain protection so you can stay dry but not overheat.
Layering Basics:
It is best to have your base layer (like under armor or a sun hoody), an insulating layer, and a rain shell. Lots of people also like to have a light fleece like a Mountain Hardwear Airmesh or Patagonia R1 as well. This is a bonus layer referred to as an active insulation layer because it breathes to dump excess heat but offers some warmth and can be worn under a bigger insulation layer when it’s really cold.
Hope this helps!
@@diwoodoesthings8288
Again, this is great info. I guess I've been trying too hard for a "heavy jacket and t-shirt" wet or dry solution. Years ago, I bought a Patagonia Infurno Jacket (that seems to no longer be made) and would always end up cold but dry. It's hard to believe that the lighter weight puffers end up being warmer than a heavy bulky coat like this when paired with a proper shell. I've just never experimented enough and spent too much time miserable!
The funny thing is that I have quite a few of the items you describe, I've just been using them wrongly! I only use my Torrentshell for running in the rain, but clearly it needs to be paired with a proper puffer for bomb proof capanbilities.
Please keep making more videos. I'd love to hear your thoughts on ski/snowboard gear, hiking shoes, etc... This is great stuff!
Thanks again!!!
@@Froggywentcourtin Loft is very important for warmth. The insulation in the jacket is designed to create a layer of air between you and the outside that is warmed by your body. A separate shell can help trap that air in and prevent wind from blowing through the insulation. This really increases the warmth. But the layering concept allows you to dial in your temp when moving or sitting still.
Just make sure the shell is large enough that it doesn't squeeze and compress the insulation which will actually make you colder and restrict movement/blood flow.
I am working on more videos. Standby!
@@diwoodoesthings8288 A few more questions because you clearly know your stuff...
I have a Patagonia Powder Bowl Jacket, which they call a hard shell. If I have one of the jackets above (such as the Mountain Hardware Down Jacket or Down Parka) and am skiing snowing 10-15 degree Jackson Hole, when would I layer the Powder Bowl or is it just not needed if I go with an R1 underlayer and Down Parka? [feel free to address in a separate video for us newbies]
Can you confirm the exact name of the Mountain Hardwear Down Jacket that you like? They seem to have a lot of variants like Deloro or Direct North.
Same question, DAS Parka (which seems to now be a DAS Light Insulated Hoody and may be something different entirely)?
Is the Rab Electron that your reference, the Rab Electron Pro?
It's nuts that you made this video so recently and all the product names keep bouncing around.
@@Froggywentcourtin The Powder Bowl is a hard shell jacket (not insulated). I prefer to layer a fleece (R1) and a synthetic midlayer under a hard shell. I typically reserve down layers as an outermost layer. That would be optimal. That said, layering a sweater weight down jacket (3oz of down or less) under the shell is perfectly fine. But sweat/moisture buildup could reduce the insulating qualities and leave you with a soggy down jacket. Synthetic manages the moisture better. I’ll do a layering video when I can get to it. But remember fleece and down layers are for staying warm, shells are for staying dry and keeping the elements out.
I would wear a shell and fleece/ midlayer for skiing. A down parka/jacket is really static activities like when you get to camp or hanging around town when it’s cold.
I really like the Mountain hardwear Phantom Jacket (not the belay parka, see my other video) as an insulating layer for backpacking. If I were to go with a hard shell for skiing I would go with the Exposure/2 gore Tex pro. For rain shell I would look at the MH Stretch Ozonic.
The Patagonia DAS parka is their warmest synthetic layer for belaying and ice climbing. They made a baby brother to it called the DAS Light which is a great puffy for hiking in cold/wet places.
The Rab Electron Pro is an updated version of the Electron I review. Very minor differences. Basically the same jacket.
Products change slightly every season. “Product lifecycle”
Amazing! Very well done! Thank you very much! Highly appreciated!
I appreciate the feedback! It was a fun video to make!
Outstanding, comprehensive video. I was looking at the Electron Pro, but now I'm leaning toward the Montane Anti-freeze XT. Very helpful information!
I would highly recommend! Dump pockets are very handy
Great video, very thorough, this will help me with my jacket problem.
No such thing as a jacket problem. Only jacket opportunities hahaha
Thanks, Diwoo, such a great video summarizing all the parkas. I didn't buy the BD Stance Belay Parka for myself, but my mom's boyfriend works outdoors in the winter, and I brought it for him because it is made with such a tough material. He loves it. I own the Arc'teryx FIrebee and Westcomb Himilaya. I should really get a synthetic belay jacket in case I am working in near-freezing temperatures.
Your video is extremely useful, thank you.
Love it! Thanks for the feedback. Glad it could fill in some gaps!
Great content. Belay jackets are very hard to get good comparisons and reviews on since they are a bit of a niche product.
Exactly! They one reason why I made this video. Need more info out there besides marketing copy on product pages.
Just scored a brand new with Tags final version of the Nilas, this 15D air shield is wild, feels like a 40d fabric. def my favorite piece of gear now
It’s a stellar piece of gear. Nothing else like it. The fabric is insane
Best review out there, cheers from Argentina
Thanks for dropping by!! 🙏
Awesome! I got the antifreeze and use it as my super mid layer. So so good.
It really fills that niche very well. Much warmer than the typical 3 season puffies but not nearly as bulky as a full on parka. Thanks for dropping by!
Thank you for taking the time to review and compare these jackets. I am planning a trip/tour of Canada for a month starting November and I am looking purchasing the right jacket that's not going to break the bank but will keep me warm.
One nice thing about the Nilas Down Jacket is that the thumb cuffs help eliminate the gap between the mitt and the cuffs.
I absolutely love this feature. Not having to worry about Velcro on the wrists is so nice and it retains so much warmth
@@diwoodoesthings8288 I wish more companies would add this feature to their jackets and parkas.
Any down from Mountain Equipment will beat any mainstream brands 😉 great review D
Thanks dude! Mountain equipment makes a fine product. I’d never steer someone away from them.
Thanks for helping me choose the Nilas jacket! Very informative video.
Glad this video helped!! It is an unbelievable piece of equipment. Checks all of the boxes.
Great reviews! Looking forward to more in depth reviews in the future. Enjoy your detailed pro/cons of each jacket. I went with the Rab Electron (before seeing your video), at one size up. While Rab's website calls the Electron a "regular" fit, I can't imagine when they refer to a slim fit how truly slim fit tight it really is.
Thanks for the feedback! It is absolutely an athletic fit but Rab products just run small. Loved everything about that jacket. Just wish it was a size larger
For ultimate protection I'd go with the Rab Generator Alpine and the Fitzroy by Mountain Equipment. Absolutely bomb proof in the worst weather! 💪🏼
Thanks for dropping by! I haven't had the chance to try those pieces so thanks for adding them to the list for people to check out!
Yes, for UK conditions those two or the Patagonia Das Light would be preferable to anything with down fill. I've got my eye on the Rab Generator Alpine with its perfect feature set for static warmth when high moorland and mountain walking in the UK, where cold and wet conditions are commonplace.
Absolutely outstanding review. Love that Montane and Rab parkas.
Thanks so much! I may be doing another one soon
Im looking to purchase the absolute zero soon, I already own the phantom parka which is definitely a warm jacket but as a landscape photographer who regularly sits in one spot for hours on mountaintops before sunrise im convinced i need an absolute zero, the northeast mountains of the usa are no joke when it comes to cold especially the Adirondacks and white mountains
It does get extremely cold here in the Whites. Would also point you toward a Feathered Friends Khumbu or a PHD parka for your use case. But an Absolute Zero would definitely keep you warm. Another option might be the MHW Phantom Zero. More of a casual style piece but super burly and warm.
I have two down "tops". First is an Eddie Bauer First Ascent down sweater good for 20 F. If I'm layered and moving.
The other is an Everest res, Eddie Bauer's FIRST ASCENT Peak XV (the original name for Everest). It's good to -30 F. and too warm for all but the coldest skiing weather but good for camp use when winter camping. I NEED A MEDIUM WEIGHT BAFFLED PARKA.
The Peak XV is an awesome heavyweight piece! My ice climbing friend has one and loves it. The Montbell Alpine Down Parka is awesome as a medium weight, baffled down Parka. Extremely Warm and only 16oz with 7oz of down fill. But check out options from Montane, Rab or Mountain Hardwear as well.
Great Job! Very detailed! I learned a ton.
Thanks! Hope it helped!
Truly excellent video - thank you for the knowledge share! Also...now I don't feel so bad about my own rather large jacket quiver..lol.
Happy to put the info out there! Thanks for the feedback. What’s your favorite in your collection?
@@diwoodoesthings8288 can't pick just one...but I love a Bergans parka and the Arcteryx Nuclei for different reasons. I own a couple different Outdoor Research jackets and mid layers for splitboarding.
Hey man, wonderful video! I love the time you take with all your reviews. They are much better than most out there and have been a resource to me. Just wondering what year model your MHW phantom is? I can't seem to find that same jacket. It appears the new models are a different design.
Hey, yes the phantom has changed. This was the 20/21 model I believe. They changed the colors and now they don’t make it anymore. You now have a choice between the Phantom Alpine and the Phantom Belay Parka.
Thank you so much for this video! So informative
Thanks for dropping by!
0:25 "i definitely dont need this many jackets"
i feel personally attacked
WhTCHU GONNa do bOUT iT 😜
Very thorough. Only video like this
That was the goal! In all my research, I realized there was nothing out there to give a good frame of reference for winter parkas. I know I wasn't the only one wishing so here it is!
Nice and long video men, very informative.
I think you may have a problem with to many down jackets over there xD, here is the thing, i have kind of a similar problem with the gear, my girl almost going to throw me out of the house for it.
Cheers.
My problem is not having too many jackets. My problem is not having enough space for all of them XD
Thanks dude! I hope everything works out with your "it's me or the gear" situation
@@diwoodoesthings8288 May i suggest some interesting pieces for your "next buys" list:
- Patagonia Grade VII, best belay parka ever period, Try to get a hand on the lastest 2022 version have revised shoulder baffles, color blue and black, not the best color but i guarantee you will want to sell all the other jackets xD (i had in the past Montane alpine 850, TNF L6, and a Rab Positron)
- TNF 50/50 AMK L3, it is a midlayer, 1000FP down, a little bit hard to find and expensive, but a unique piece of gear, in the sense that its one of the few down midlayer that can breathe, it has a non AMK jacket version who is less expensive and esier to find too.
@@artysa.blackwood4261 it just so happens that a Grade VII fell into my posession along with an Alpine 850. Very excited about these pieces. Both new. The Grade VII is the old shoulder baffle design but they are hard to find these days. I will likely put out another video like this in the near future.
Wow,it took you long enough to get there...I really like Patagonia products..but for more pockets,I would go with the Bearskin tactical and then a Down mid layer and then the shell DAS parka...why??? I have a 1974 NorthFace 800 Down that has NO outer protection at minus Ten the wind 😂 enter with out ring the door bell..So I ware a gore tec shell rain trench coat overlay.works great in Chicago and Taos ski valley....but things for all your inputs.
Thank you from St Albans VT!
Good n you?
Hi and thanks for your great work👏🏻👏🏻
Would like to know what do you think about the discontinued patagonia grade 7 and also the simond makalu jacket (retail price 150€) Thx again and keep it up👍🏻
The Grade VII is an incredible piece. Hard to find in a good size/color but worth the hunt if you can get it at a good price (under $600). Otherwize, look at a Rab Positron for that level of warmth. I have not used the Simond Makalu. However with 236g of 800fp down, it will be a nice warm jacket for MOST applications. Anything in the alps or lower 48. Simond is part of Decathalon which makes a good value product. Many will outperform it but not at the pricepoint.
Pretty sure the makalu use 700 cuin down but for the price is a no brainer like you said.Thank you so much!🏔❤️
I have an issue where I just always buy Patagonia even though I spend like days worth of hours researching every brand. It's an issue and I need to snap out of it. It's the quality yeah.. but that warranty is impossible to beat. Ive changed a 11 year old H2NO jacket for a brand new one.. I was just asking if I could pay to repair lol.
Amazing video dude!
Thanks homie!
Thanks for your passionate expertise. I'm on the fence between the Resolute and the Rab Positron Pro. What are your thoughts? Thanks again.
The Positron Pro really intrigues me because it has over 2oz more down fill than the Resolute while only weighing .4oz more. Though it has a large internal chest pocket, I don't believe the Positron has internal dump pockets. The Resolute does. I have heard that the stitch through baffling lets some wind through, while allowing more mobility, it sortof negates the extra down fill. I would take a good long look at the Montane Resolute over the Positron. Because of these two features. But overall, people really like the Positron and it is tried and true. I would opt for the Montane Resolute for the dump pocket.
@@diwoodoesthings8288 Thank You! Another insightful response. Can"t wait to see more.
You mentioned the old Patagonia Fitzroy being in the same category as the Nilas I’m curious as to which version you’re referring to? Great video by the way!
The Fitz Roy Parka used to have 227g (8oz) of 800fp down in a boxwall construction. The new Fitz Roy Hoody is stitch through and has way less down fill. The old Fitz Roy is discontinued and is a highly sought after as a rare but incredible piece of gear. Sort of a blend of features and materials between the Chonos and Nilas really. But several ounces lighter than either.
Thanks for the question and feedback!
Great video! You really don't see a lot of good in-depth videos like this. What's your take on the Black Diamond Vision parka?
I have had the chance to try on the BD Vision Parka and it is a nice piece. Very light weight at about 20oz with 209g of 800 fill down. Though for the price I would probably opt for the Mountain Hardwear Phantom Parka as it is fully baffled in the sleeves and torso. It also has more down 215+g of 800 fill down clocking in at around 20oz. The stitch-through construction of the Vision Parka is a big oversight in my opinion. You'll get a warmer parka for less $ with the Phantom Parka.
Valandre and Crux are brands that deserve to be mentioned.
Thanks for pointing those brands out! Valandre makes some mighty fine equipment
agreed - outstanding presentation
which model is the montane, because it looks like the old resolute and is different from the new antifreeze or antifreeze xt, none of the latter have an exterior or interior mesh pocket
Montane Chonos- Discontinued, no drop pocket
Montane Antifreeze-Discontinued, drop pocket
Come with me to a mom store in Nepal she has a template for every brand and logo in the world. I bought 2 cheap canvas tote bag but I had them stenciled with North face prominently on them. She offered me other templates like pentagonia or LL bean but I chose north face for the irony of that being on simple tote bags
Hello there! Eventually a review with detailed size help! So thank you so much. I really hesitate between the Rab Electron pro and the montane anti freeze. Would you be so kind as to tell me what size did you pick for the Montane. We are the same height but I'm thicker than you. My problem with the rab is the same as yours. I have to take a L but the sleeves are too long, so are the total lenght. Do you find the Montane has a larger cut and has some room for a medium fleece inside?
Hey thanks for dropping by! I wear a medium with the antifreeze and I was able to layer a Patagonia Nano Air under it quite nicely. It has more girth than the Rab Electron. With my 40” chest and 32” waist, the fit is great. You might be able to fit a light fleece under it if you are wider than me. More than a 42” chest and 34” waist and I would look at a large. But you can see the torso length is quite generous here.
Hey thanks for dropping by! I wear a medium with the antifreeze and I was able to layer a Patagonia Nano Air under it quite nicely. It has more girth than the Rab Electron. With my 40” chest and 32” waist, the fit is great. You might be able to fit a light fleece under it if you are wider than me. More than a 42” chest and 34” waist and I would look at a large. But you can see the torso length is quite generous here.
@@diwoodoesthings8288 thanks a lot. I'm going to check the length of the sleeves in L. Your review is top notch 😉
Gearheads and maximisers like me were drooling over this video. Any chance you have a spreadsheet with all the specs, notes etc?
Hey thanks for the feedback! Here is a link to a basic google doc with the information i collected. Not as robust as rokslide, reddit or mountain project, but here it is docs.google.com/document/d/11RGdmKWgb7TFMvhFlQShSq6yHtV8G22P8KNLka96XFM/edit?usp=share_link
Amazing how few brands bother to mention how much down is actually in their jacket. They'll say "900 fill power down!" but forget to mention that there's only 4 ounces of it. I bought a Montane apex jacket because it has 18 ounces of down - insanely warm. Seems like you get far better value with the outdoor expedition brands than with the fashion-oriented brands.
Down traps air.
Fill POWER = how much air per gram.
Fill weight = How many grams of Down.
2 gram of fill WEIGHT 500 fill power
Is the same warmth as 1 gram fill weight 1000 fill power.
Its just twice the weight.
DOWN is rarely a Belay jacket. Look at Synthetic such as Mountain Equipment Citadel ( or Fitzroy) or DAS Parka
Belay is a jacket to keep you warm stood still at the bottom of a climb whilst your partner climbs. It goes OVER your other clothes including shell.
For ‘normal’ ( non climbing) use a parka such as TNF mcmurdo.
Great input! Thanks for sharing
Awesomely helpful video!
Hey man incredible video and so informative, I’m UK based so synthetic is the one for me just wondering if you have any other recommendations on synthetic heavy weight as I’d be using it for belay jacket for Scottish winter. Been told loads about the patagucci DAS, Mountain Equipment Citadel also the Arcteryx nuclei sv. I only ask as I swear by patagucci for all my kit but I also have used the montane kit cheers for this and stay safe out there.
Reece.
What’s up dude! Thanks so much. I really like the DAS because of its packability. If you already rock Pata for most of your kit, it would be a classy addition. The nuclei sv will be warmer. The citadel will also be a super heavyweight and warm option. If you’re not traveling super far distances, look toward a heavier warmer option like the last two. If you wanna be a steeze machine that’s fast and light, go with the DAS
What size is the Nilas parka that you're wearing? I'm about 189cm 73kg (lanky) and was looking at the Nilas, not for layering over absolutely everything, but some basic cold weather layers. Would you recommend L or M? Asking because I found the L on sale haha.
Yes its on sale at an amazing price. I would say a large would work great for you length-wise. M and the sleeves would be too short. This thing is built to layer in the torso. You will be able to layer a fleece, mid layer and shell underneath
Дуже гарне відео! все детально розказано!
Привіт з України!
What size are you ? Im wondering as im going to get the same green Montbell Japan but not sure what size as i usually go for medium in for example north face jackets.
Size up at least one size with Montbell. I wear a medium in most things and the large a just slightly too short in the torso for me. I got a japanese version of the Permafrost in an XL and it fits better, a little on the big size but slightly too big is better than slightly too small with parkas like this.
thanks for the video still useful in 2024
Thank you so much! I get cold super easily(short+skinny), but love being outside all winter as well as summer. I have been researching expedition parkas but it is surprisingly hard to find info on them, even harder to find a used one. Any advise on finding something in the sub $300 range? Use: Ice fishing and overnight snow shoe trips, temps 32-0F but I run about 20F colder than the average male when I stop moving. Would I be better off with a lightweight down jacket layered under a sized up midweight jacket? Any insights are greatly appreciated🙏
Facebook Marketplace and geartrade.com are solid resources. A synthetic midlayer under a mid-heavyweight parka is a good way to go. For example, I used my Patagonia NanoAir under my Montane Antifreeze in sub 20's and was super comfortable, almost too warm. Layering provides a huge range of comfort in different temps so yeah I highly recommend. Though I would go with a synthetic midlayer under your down for moisture management.
Hi. interested in buying the mont bell alpine down parka and was wondering what to do sizing wise as i can only find it available in japanese sizing. how tall are you and did you buy it in us sizing or japanese sizing? I'm 5'8 and wondering whether or not the japanese large would be big enough. not intending to do too much layering with it. what size do you think would be best? many thanks
Hey there, this was a size large in Japanese sizing. I got rid of this parka because the torso length was too short. I am 5'7" with a 17" torso, 40" chest and 22" pit to pit. If I were you, I would go with a Japanese XL. You will have room to layer underneath. It will not be a super close fit and may even be a bit too broad in the torso unless you are close to 200lb. Hope this helps!
@@diwoodoesthings8288 Thanks very much this is very helpful.
Very informative video. Have you tried/ looked at the Arc'teryx Nuclei SV at all? Can't quite decide between that and the DAS for a belay, touring, and all-around cold weather jacket. I think synthetic is the way to go as a fellow Vermonter.
I have not tried the Nuclei SV but I’d love to. It is very similarly priced with the DAS. The DAS has 133g/m2 insulation throughout with and and extra 40g/m2 in certain areas (I think the front back and shoulders. It weighs in at under 20oz. The Nuclei SV uses double stack 90g/m2 with single stack under the arms. It weighs 21.2oz. So marginally heavier but I think it is going to be warmer. A bit burlier face fabric too. I can’t imagine you’d be disappointed with either. It will probably come down to fit. I think they might stock the SV at REI in Williston but I’m not sure. But I can see myself using the DAS more than just about any other piece of gear I have this winter.
I actually found a review that mentions how the Nuclei SV “outperforms the DAS Parka for a hundred bucks less” www.thealpinestart.com/2021/11/18/arcteryx-nuclei-sv-review-vs-dually/
Here is a Reddit thread comparing the two. The DAS is much more packable. www.reddit.com/r/Mountaineering/comments/rmn1yv/arcteryx_nuclei_sv_or_patagonia_das_parka/
My wife has the Nuclei SV. She raves about it being an absolute furnace. It feels very high quality, seems cheaper than it should be for an Arcteryx product in my opinion.
I love that it’s synthetic as well, makes it super versatile
@@ahone2520 That's great info! I think if you're doing shorter treks to ice routes, etc, the Nuclei SV is the move. But for longer distance treks where packability is paramount, the DAS might be a better option. Either way, you'll be warm. The DAS layers exceptionally well so there is that consideration as well. How does the Nuclei SV layer?
@@diwoodoesthings8288 I wouldn’t be able to compare it to the DAS (having not tried it myself), but it is definitely built to layer, and the loft appears substantial. I am not sure how well it would pack though, so that’s a great point. The value is what caught my eye.
Nilas on sale on Mountain Hardwear website for $219. Size L, XL as of 8/12/23
www.mountainhardwear.com/p/mens-nilas-jacket-1939301.html?dwvar_1939301_color=842&dwvar_1939301_size=L&&mid=paidsearch&eid=Google+AdWords+US&nid=16979019828&oid=&did=&s_kwcid=AL!3937!3!!!!x!!&gclid=CjwKCAjw29ymBhAKEiwAHJbJ8qdFQX0Z4S4SIDa-1Du2ecDfQfwSsqeaLIlL6BGMcRRmV5s1raoZWxoCnfgQAvD_BwE
Have you ever seen anyone wearing one of these parkas in a situation where the parka was massive "overkill" for the weather?
@@neaklaus52 of course. Whether by them having one parka for all of their varied uses; buying the biggest, most expensive jacket they could find; or by misjudging the weather conditions, it’s rare to be truly optimized. I would say I most often see an over-gunned jacket at the resort or in the city. Most often someone wants to throw a bunch of cash at a big flashy jacket that they don’t actually need. You might throw me into this category, but then again, that’s how/why I made this video 😎
I wore my Nilas on Mount Washington in the spring when I expected colder weather. Ended up only being low teens and moderate wind so I left my parka unzipped the whole time with an alpha fleece and Squamish wind shell underneath when camping up high.
Do you think the Trango would be sufficient for Aconcagua?
I would consult with your guide company about your parka selection. Many recommend a minimum of 250g of 800fp down which equates to 7054cuin of down. The Paiyu/Trango has 269g of 700fp down which equates to 6641cuin of down. The offset/reflective baffle construction does increase the effective warmth of the parka.
I think if you size appropriately (size up) to layer a 60g synthetic + 100g synthetic insulation mid layer and fleece underneath, the Trango - now called the Paiyu - may be sufficient for that peak. But standalone, the Trango/Paiyu might be a bit too light for that peak. I would consult with the Mountain Equipment Product Team before purchasing for that Peak. Call The Gear Doc in North Conway, New Hampshire. He sells Mountain Equipment parkas and will be able to steer you in the right direction. +1 603-662-4690.
IS there an updated version of the nilas? It seems like it got discontinued?
My version is an older version with 850fp down and a different cut. There was a newer 800fp model that they discontinued this year for the new Phantom Belay parka. You can still find the nilas on ebay and FB Marketplace somewhat regularly if you check now and again.
Hey again. I am wondering if your Montbell Alpine Down Parka is the US version in large or the Japanese version in large? I looking to get that since I found a good deal and am looking for something light but that can layer over midlayers and a shell. I typically wear a US medium. What version and size would you recommend to layer over everything? Thank you!
I think I had the Japanese large. I wear a medium in most things but montbell seems to run small consistently, even in American/Euro sizes. I would size up.
i got the ghost whisperer 2, but after seeing it i realize it's very thin and i'm worried i won't do well on an upcoming shasta climb. I think i need to return it and get something warmer for 15-30F
The ghost whisperer is really for warm months when it gets cool in the evening. Get something with 5+oz of down in it for shasta. Make sure you can layer it. Look at the montane antifreeze or Rab electron.
@@diwoodoesthings8288 thank you so much for the quick response and the recommendation!
Is it Mountain Hardwearvor Mountain Equipment? The first one featured on the heavyweights. Thanks
Mountain Equipment. Sorry I missed editing that part. Good catch!
Great video! What size is the Montbell Alpine Down Parka (green)?
Thanks!
This particular example is a US/EU size large (Japan XL). I am 5'7" with a 17" torso, 40" chest, 22" pit to pit. Hope this helps!
I typically wear a size medium for brands like Mountain Hardwear, Arc'teryx, Patagonia. Had to size up to Large for Rab and Montbell.
stacking DAS light hoodie makes up for a true belay parka? I was reading Colin Haley layering article on it. Its 600 grams of total insulation and its fine by the kirkpatrick standard but its confusing me a lot when there is so much stuff about it.
I have found that stacking my RAB Xenon with another synthetic layer makes for quite the warm combination. Part of this is because the space/air in between the layers also acts as a zone of warm air which increases the warmth beyond what either piece can do alone. The sum is greater than the parts. BUT, in extremely cold temps, you will want a true parka to layer over your mid layers
Is the ECWCS level 7 similar in warmth to the Black Diamond Belay Parka?
Which of these down parkas that you have are equivalent in warmth to the above two synthetic parkas?
Great question. The ECWCS LVL 7 and BD Belay Parka share a lot of the same DNA. I would argue the Belay parka might even be a bit warmer. The MH Nilas parka and Montane Chonos are extremely warm, 6000m parkas. The Mountain Equipment Trango is a close down equivalent to the BD Belay Parka.
great video thanks for chapters. I've been doing a lot of research into what jacket I want to get and I am pretty sure I want to get a synthetic parka. mainly because I don't ever want to be worried about it getting wet. In your experience, are there any synthetic parkas you know of that are just about as warm and almost as light (could be brought on a plane and not take up whole suitcase) as similar down products? thx for the video liked and subbed
You're welcome! I made this video because I was in the same boat, trying to figure out which parka to buy. The DAS parka is probably your best bet on packability. Another option would be finding an older RAB Xenon and layering with another synthetic midlayer But it is definitely not built for for super cold. Somebody else mentioned the Mountain Equipment Fitzroy which is about 4oz heavier. The DAS should fit the bill
@@diwoodoesthings8288 Thanks a ton!
Great review 👍 Appreciated
40% off on Patagonia DAS parka right now on Patagonia’s site and backcountry
Oooooo BUY BUY BUY
I’m bullish on the DAS
I really like the montane one.. Which is your weight and what size are you wearing?
The Orange Montane Antifreeze is a size medium. It’s an athletic fit so it is a bit snug with a midlayer on. Very form fitting. This parka is great for about 20°-32°F static. Quite a bit colder for active use 5°F or so. It is stitch through so not great for deep winter static use
The grey Montane Chonos is a large to accommodate additional layers and cover down to my thighs. This parka will keep you warm well below 0°F
I have the Nilas from 2014 and it didn't come with the bottom zipper, great jacket, but I wouldn't use it as a belay jacket, My Sub Zero from MHW does, even my hooded Phantom jacket has it. I have the MHW Quasar synthetic insulated jacket in both Medium and in Large that I normally wear from MHW, the medium fits like an athletic cut large, where the large is like a baggy Xlarge for me. I had to keep in mind that it is supposed to fit large, but I love the jacket so much that I wanted it in the smaller size to fit like a normal jacket. The Quasar is waterproof so it can do double duty in keeping you warm and dry. I feel like MHW has moved away from really awesome technical items like what they came up with working with Uli Steck. I also feel that way about Salomon in recent years, their really cool S/Lab stuff isn't coming back and what they have left is really lackluster. I called to ask a question about a MHW size and was blown away by the imbeciles they have working their customer support, they have no clue about the products because they don't wear the clothes or do any outdoor activities related to the clothes they sell, to be brutally honest, they have hired customer service reps who have crossed the southern border and English is their second language, It has pushed me away from buying any future technical clothing from them, I will not buy from a company that has employees who haven't a clue about the products and how to use them. That is them selling out and just resting on their brand name to keep them afloat. I would much rather buy something from Rab, Mammut , or any of the other companies that actually have climbers giving input and working for them in house.
Thanks for dropping by! I have had similar impressions of MHW of late. Same experiences with customer service. I am always looking for older models from them. My Nilas is an older model with 850fp down instead of the current 800fp. Since they sold to columbia, they are more focused on bottom line than on the end consumer performance. Some items like the airmesh are really cool, but in general, they are drifting. Even their product pages have incorrect specs listed.... It's good to vocalize these things because if we don't hold companies accountable, they would stay true to what they do. Happy trails!
@@diwoodoesthings8288 I appreciate your reply. I am a gear whore too. I love climbing gear and clothing.
I was able to climb for a month and a half in the Alps in 2017. Being based out of the Chamonix area and getting to climb with the European climbers, being able to go into the massive mountaineering shops both in Chamonix and the valleys below blew my mind in how light the gear the europeans use is compared to what most American climbers use. I thought I was on the cutting edge of gear that I could buy in the States, once I got there, I felt like there was so much more selection and the entire thought process of climbing fast and light I had had to be rethought again. I will say that many of the climbers I did meet were interested in the gear I had brought with me.
The Ascensionist 45 pack from Patagonia, and the MHW gear/clothing I was using.
Climbing in Europe was a great experience for me, though, I have been criticized being back home and being told my gear is too light to be safe by the guides I know and have run across while up on the mountain.
How would you rate the Mountain Hardwear Phantom Alpine Hooded Jacket vs the Rab Electron and Montane Antifreeze?
The Mountain Hardwear Phantom Alpine has the roomiest cut for layering. It is definitely the most equipped for higher alpine pursuits. The Rab Electron is incredibly packable but has an athletic fit making it really hard to layer. Despite its materials, construction and packability, I would consider it a much more casual piece. The Montane Antifreeze is a highly engineered parka that layers better than the Electron but not as well as the Phantom Alpine. I also noticed cold spots between the baffles which reduced performance on its most important metric. If they made the Antifreeze with box baffles and kept the same amount of down, it would be a home run. That said, it is a great winter jacket for ski touring and mild winter camping if you have a midlayer underneath.
Great video.
0 degrees standing still for the DAS as in F? or celsius
Farenheit. Although I would maybe modify this and say 10-15 degrees F static unless well layered.
heyy man nice vid. What do you think of the montane resolute jacket? is it warm enough to make expeditions on the 6000 Himalayan or for example on the Aconcagua? or is it warm enough for the cold -25°C Norwegian winter? I don't know why but to me it doesn't seem as puffy as the chonos, thanks so much
At 250g (8.8oz) of 800 down fill, this should be enough to insulate you down to -25c. With a good baselayer and midlayer. One thing I would make sure of is fit. If you get a size too small, you wont be able to layer. If too big, then too much air drafts will enter from the lower hem. One thing that is different on the resolute from the Chonos is the sleeves. The Chonos has fully baffled sleeves, whereas the Resolute has stitch-through sleeves. This will make it less ideal for 6,000m peaks. Here are some options worth considering:
Mountain Hardwear Nilas
Mountain Equipment K7 and the Gasherbrum.
Montbell Permafrost
Rab Positron
Feathered Friends Helios
You will want 250g+ of 800 fill down
My version of the Nilas is 850 fill with 215g.
Higher fill power requires slightly less fill weight for the same insulating value. But look at fill weight over fill power for really high peaks.
@@diwoodoesthings8288 thank you man, this is the best answer you could give me, yeah I am looking for a jacket that is good for both mountain and city use, probably i'll go with the positron. anyway I appreciated the answer, cheers from Italy
Does is drive you crazy when the Outerwear Companies confuse jackets and Parkas? Either for Belaying or otherwise? I have seen some outerwear that is called a parka, when it is obviously more of a jacket than a parka?
The technical definition for parka is a large wind proof jacket with a hood meant to be worn in cold weather. So they are technically not wrong, but it is confusing when shopping.
Is there a packable jacket you'd recommend that would be warm even if soaked through and freezing / bad weather. I'm basically looking for something for hiking, light mountaineering that is as bomb proof as possible. Is the DAS too much jacket?
The DAS would be my first recommendation. My second recommendation would be to go with a RAB Xenon and pair it with another synthetic mid layer. This gives you a modular system where you have the added breathable warmth of the mid layer (like the Patagonia Nano Air) combined with the windproof atmos fabric of the Xenon. I love that combo and will likely use that a lot this year. I am 5'7" 175lb and wear a medium Nano Air and pair it with a large Rab Xenon and it is a match made in heaven. Incredibly warm as well.
@@diwoodoesthings8288 I appreciate you taking time to recommend things. As luck would have it I just picked up a nano-air for 50% off so I’ll check out both options.
@@Smashycrashy Big score! Great move
What's the difference between Phantom Parka and Nilas? I watched your another video. I'm now deciding to pick one of them, but I'm kinda confused now.
The Phantom Parka is lighter at around 21oz. It has a softer 20D Diamond Fuse Pertex face fabric and no jersey cuffs. Its an awesome piece.
The Nilas version I have is the older 850 fill option that weighs about 27oz. The newer version has 800 fill and is around 31oz. It has a much more rugged Airshield face fabric (which is a 2 layer 15D fabric).
If you're going for ultralight that will be thrown on over a base layer or light fleece, go with the Phantom Its a better belay parka. If you're looking for a more durable summit parka that will fit over more layers, go with the Nilas. I would have included the Phantom in this video but I don't have that parka any more. Strongly considering re-purchasing.