Charlotte is one of the wisest characters in the show. She represents everything Bojack lacks, which is to sacrifices fleeting whims for the good of her long-term commitments with her family. It's not an easy choice, but is its the best on for most people.
I dont think Charlotte's that wise, she moved in a man who she hadn't spoken to in decades with her young vulnerable children and her shaky marriage. But I'm happy she woke up when she saw that was happening between Bojack and her daughter.
I'd say it's more that she knows what she really wants and can see what will provide that for her and her family. She also has basic empathy and wouldn't want to hurt her current husband more than necessary, even if their marriage isn't ideal. If Bojack was a good person, stable, and genuinely loved her I think they definitely would've gotten together eventually. But he's selfish and would never in a million years want to *settle down* with her. That's really the crux of it. She knows she wants stability, a good marriage and a good life for her kids. Bojack provides none of this. Add in the fact that he almost took advantage of her young, impressionable daughter, yeah that was the last straw. She saw the huge red flags and ran, just like she should have.
She called Bojack a coward. Clearly she was wrong, as he did make a move. She just went after the first opportunity that came along, and Bojack should have bailed, except he still liked her.. People mistake her stagnant, dare I say 'boring' life for happiness. I think Waxman called this one wrong.
The reason why they would never use Charlotte as a main character is because she doesn't want drama. People who seek drama or crave the attention like many problematic characters in the show, they'll never be as happy as her.
I see it more like Charlotte already completed her arc. She has completed her arc even before the end of season 2. Bojack, other main characters are flawed and didn't finish their arc yet so that's the way it is.
The family of a man who molested my children less than 6 call justice drama. Some people can handle the responsibilities of moving forward through hell with their head up, some fall to the occasion. When people say "drama" I think they have a hard time differentiating falsehoods and reality because emotion is healthy and cathartic if you're not hurting anyone. When I sing or speak I'm told to shut up. I sing and speak for my children because we're all happier. I was rebellious for speaking anything. The cause was freedom of speech. Within evangelical families even those who denounced Christian denominations, women are treated like dogs. Property. My mom called me a delusional lying bad girl and threatened child welfare against me because her father and mine inappropriately touched me when I was younger than 11. It stopped around 11
right!!! I originally thought that was just how the characters looked while being kissed whether they were into it or not but comparing charlottes face to dianes while bojack tried to kiss her.. there is a big difference
@@Mortablunt I agree. But, she still made the right decision. She has a husband, two children, an established life, her own local small business, etc. She's _happy._ Even if she saw Bojack as "the one who got away", she isn't going to throw all of that out for him. Besides, the fact that HE'S so eager for her to do that, callously disregarding her entire family and saying "only they matter", galvanizes that fact even before he did what he did to Penny.
OF course Bojack picks short term happiness; it's not because he's a coward, it's because he doesn't see himself living a long or happy life. Why plan for a future that won't exist?
I think that... To not try, sacrifice, even where there's a possibility for failure is the cowardly move. To only do things that are certain and concrete is cowardly. It's cowardly to refuse to recognize that there is a chance for change and it can happen. There just needs a lot of work
This is a great point - you could also extrapolate that since he came from a very unhappy family, the idea that happiness is a long-term prospect is kind of alien to him. So that would make him inclined to jump on opportunities that offer imminent happiness. Additionally, you could think that as someone who "everything good, I learned from television", Bojack would be inclined to make choices that a sitcom writing team would use to milk drama IRL.
I’ve always thought that Charlotte symbolizes that first love we’ve all had. The first person we’ve truly felt something for, whether it be as a kid with a schoolyard crush or in high school admiring the popular person or just someone you never had the courage to ask out. So over time you compartmentalize them and turn them into a static object, a what if frozen in time that you think about every now and then. And then one day you encounter them or see them on social media, as an actual person in a relationship or even married with kids, and realize that they’re not that idea anymore, and perhaps they never were. You weren’t in love with someone, you were in love with your idealized version of them.
In retrospect it's quite sad how Charlotte managed to build a good and simple life for herself and her family without Bojack being anywhere near, only to let him in again decades later for a brief stay which unbeknownst to her would cause irreversible damage upon the entire family and seemingly perfect life she worked so hard to achieve
They bravery of her taking a stand to protect her life really does show in comparison to other characters through the series. Bojack hurts just about everyone at some point and they all take their time to cut him out or don’t cut him out at all. Hollyhock struggles with borderline PTSD about her drugging but doesn’t cut Bojack out for years, Todd gets his rock opera and several major jobs ruined before moving away from Bojack and Diane even stays in touch after moving to Chicago. But Charlotte knows what she needs and knows to take a stand. And how strong she is when she does it gives me chills. “If you are not out of my driveway in 30 minutes I am calling the police. And if you ever try to contact me or my family again, I will fucking kill you.”
traxfish Not really. His point, which he explicitly states at the end, was that Bojack was offering her something good aka short term happiness. I mean didn't it strike you as odd that Charlotte practically begged Bojack to stay when he was about to leave with the 'Escape From LA'? Charlotte clearly enjoyed Bojack's company (for reasons I won't delve into for now) and for 2 months he made her and her family very happy. I believe there are others reasons why she said he made her sad, but as far as we know before the kiss Bojack made Charlotte pretty happy in the 2 months he lived with her. Its also pretty evident that she enjoyed the kiss (short term happiness). Bojack makes Charlotte happy, but he crossed a boundary that threatened her long term happiness (her family and the life she built). And she wasn't willing to lose her long term happiness for the short-lived and unstable happiness that Bojack had to offer.
@@xcaluhbration The problem is from how she acted before...she never seemed genuine as a friend. She literally called Bojack a coward for no real reason.
This just made her my favorite character in the show. So many people are willing to sacrifice long term fulfillment for instant gratification. They see happiness as this endless journey of taking the most imminently pleasing options at the expense of their long term goals and the important people in their lives. There's a reason she's living the life Bojack dreams about while he simply cannot. She makes it about her choices, he makes it about her.
After she says, “I don’t care where you go bojack, I just can’t have you here,” she says, “you make me too sad.” I think that line ties together this point really well and it kinda just struck me as something significant.
Is mr peanut butter happy or pretending to be happy? His happiness depends a great deal on ridiculous amounts of optimism and adamantly refusing to dig beneath the surface of anything. His living is very superficial
Lorrie hes happy i dont think he pretends to be happy. Reasons why is because welp his character is based off of a dog. Like when his wife was “out of the country” and saw her at a restaurant, he didnt get mad he just let it slide. Because he loves her or just didnt want her to go away, like a dog would when its owner comes home they get happy. Mr peanut butter doesnt seem like the type of character to hide emotions cause he has shown anger toward other characters so why would he show sadness? Thats my perspective on it and would be happy to see what yours is.
Ghost Girl he once said that the secret to life is to occupy yourself with meaningless things until you die. He allowed Diane to return, not because he loved her, but because he has angst about addressing any issue below the surface. As I said, he lives very superficially. He grew up on a very privileged island where the world was presented to him (and other inhabitants) very optimistically and any problems were probably hidden from them in order not to ruin the illusion of perfection. This has made him incapable of handling issues that run deep, so instead he slaps a happy face on it and refuses to look beneath the surface. He is incapable of empathy (not like a psychopath but like someone who is so privileged that he’s never had to put himself in another person’s shoes) several examples are when he keeps making grand gestures that Diane doesn’t like and then getting angry at her for not appreciating the grand gestures she didn’t even ask him for. He simply couldn’t understand why someone else might not like the things he likes and he’s unwilling to put himself in the person’s shoes and figure it out because that would require a level of introspection and self awareness that he doesn’t have. Because of his inability for introspection and personal growth, his wives always mature and leave him behind. Instead of learning from his multiple divorces, he ignores the problem and simply jumps into the next marriage with an even younger wife so he never has to mature. Okay, that was a Lot but anyway, that’s my take on Mr. Peanut Butter. He’s a nice guy but ultimately superficial, lacks self-awareness, immature to the point of gullibility, a lot of fake optimism which sometimes comes across as naïveté.
Lorrie i like this alot it makes alot of sense. But when it comes down to it, he is happy but he doesn’t know how to make the people around him happy. Like you said lack of putting himself in other peoples perspective. So yes I do believe your outlook but i also think he is happy and not miserable like bojack or Diane. Thanks
I think Mr.P symbolizes toxic positivity. So in a way, I think he's truly happy but he's also the archetype of many people who always preach happiness as a shield for their inter turmoil, and refusal to work through things that bother them psychologically.
The biggest proof of his hiden unhappiness is when Captain confesses he has a twisted spleen Any inconvenience Mister Peanutbutter had he managed to get over super quick because everything he has, his house his career, even his romantic companions are things he believes he can just replace, but when he is faced with the posibility of losing his brother he cant do that, because he only has one brother.So he falls into depression
I'm about 95% sure that Charlotte didn't call Bojack a coward, it was Bojack adding that in his head because he blames himself for not making a move on her!
Interesting take. However, I think the show makes clear when reality and imagination are being blurred. Charlotte actually calling him a coward (in reality vs. in BoJack's head) helps provide a catalyst for the transformation of BoJack into the completely self-centered s.o.b. Charlotte called him a coward while BoJack was still young and hopeful. His mother had messed him up, but he was now free of her, pursuing his dream in LA. He wasn't drinking yet. Wasn't jaded yet. He was kind of naive. I think Charlotte was a little bummed BoJack never hit on her and kind of wanted to needle him for it now that it was too late. So she brought his attention to what could have been. As for BoJack, her calling him a coward probably stayed with him. And probably helped fuel a lot of the the terrible things he did, especially with women.
I like this theory, but I also think that it didn't just happen in Bojack's head. The show does tend to be clear about whether something has actually happened, except for crazy drug trip episodes and the like - in which case though, we know to question reality in those episodes
The irony is, that there is an episode, where Bojack tells a story about a coffee cup misplaced in a horsin' around scene and it's gone in the next. A fan has the theory that the show tries to make the point that memory is subjective and no one has the full picture on what actually happend. Bojack does not have the heart to tell him that it was just a lazy guy on set who forgot his cup in the cup. This is literally the same thing :)
I used to live in Hollywood and even had a few high profile acting and dancing jobs. I eventually got out and moved to Seattle, but I kept in touch with a lot of my friends in the industry; some even made it pretty big. But none of them are truly happy. Hollywood has a way of sucking the life out of you in a way I can't explain. Bojack Horseman is the best show I've ever seen that explains it.
The fact that he slept with his showbiz daughter already made you feel like he'd go this low. But everytime you want him to not do anything stupid until he does
traxfish No, it wasn't really Ralph's fault the relationship ended. Princess Carolyn didn't want to admit to him, more importantly herself, that she's not superwoman and can't do everything by herself. To me, she sees it as a weakness and doesn't want to be seen as less than what she is just because she's incapable of having children.
Lol, I do wonder what Vincent's up to since being a business manager for PB Livin'. Would be hilarious if he's still going around in that coat pretending to be one person, just out of habit. Maybe even owns an actual business factory by now. Ha!
@@punkuke How? As soon as he found he said he was sorry and they could try again when she was ready? I could see how his proposal to look at other options could be seen as insensitive due to the timing and way suggested it, but he genuinely cared. It was just bad timing. Princess Carolyn was drunk and upset and she brought her other miscarriages at the wrong time. I cannot remember if she ever apologized for that outburst
I'm sad that Bojack scarred that family, while watching the last season, you can see that Penny doesn't even want to go to her house anymore and that her relationship with Charlotte is not the same. She resents her for bringing Bojack into their lives. Charlotte might have been the happiest character but not after Bojack.
Wonderful analysis! I think Charlotte, as Princess Caroryn, is an adult representation. Nevertheless, she is one who found happiness in a family and now lives a joyful life. She knows what she wants and even treats Bojack if he ever came near her family again, because she knows his default behavior "making people miserable" in any way. In fact, I believe when she says that he has to go because she feels sad around him, it is more like "I think about different possibilities and start questioning my happiness" than he is making her sad with any of his attitudes. In my opinion, this is a thought only a reasonable grown-up person would have, not letting possibilities overcloud the reality she already has, in which she considers herself happy enough. Every major interaction in Bojack Horseman is a opportunity to think about our own lives and non-reasonable thoughts and attitudes we may have on a daily basis. That's why this show is so deep and works even better being a cartoon: the truth in it is so big that every other aspect (script, character actions, ambience, characters' looks, etc.) shoud walk away from reality for it to work even better. Keep up the videos!
love your last point about how presenting this show as an animation lets us experience the existentialism thrown out at us more authentically, despite it sounding possibly counter-intuitive
I hope that the opening scene of season 6 is Charlotte watching the submarine episode of philbert and when the scene with bojack and the girl comes on she slowly realizes the parallel between that scene and what happened with penny. That would make me squirm
Oh man i would love to see this. What if S6 is it, and Charlotte kills bojack. He wants to die anyway, and I think if anyone is more deserving of ending it all for him it would be her.
My take away from Bojack Horseman is that it is okay to cut toxic people out of your lives. Sometimes you have to focus on your own happiness even if that means having to cut out people that you once carried about or still care about.
4:28 It's more than that. Charlotte has the good sense to see the longer term consequences of short term actions, and BoJack just sadly does not, especially at that point in the series. And this applies no matter how brave or cowardly either character is.
Impulsiveness is the downfall of many of people. I'm honestly not sure if Bojack's problem is as much cowardice as lack of patience or possibly laziness. You're definitely right about his choices, though. He often choose the temporary fix (if that's even appropriate) than the long term one. What makes it even sadder is how often Bojack contemplates his actions. I'd argue he thinks too much about his past choices and not enough about his future ones, but I'm not sure if that's right either. Luckily, I think he's done pretty well in the most recent season. Now Charlotte on the other hand, I'm not so sure if her story is settled. As the old saying goes, count no man (or deer... gazelle?) as happy until they are in the ground. Will her days truly be happy with her decisions? While they appear correct so far. Will suppressing her urges lead to regrets? Is her life really where she wants it to be, or is it just okay? Lol, I don't know. I just enjoy playing devil's advocate and casting the occasional pebble into stagnant water. Good video.
Charlotte wants stability. She wants to be happy on her terms which happen to include having a family, but I dare say if her husband were to cheat, she would throw him out of her life forever. She wants to feel good and may entertain alternatives to her current life, but not if it is going to threaten what she builds. She builds happiness and it would take heaven and earth to move her. My curiosity is what if tragedy struck and she lost her family to a freak accident. How would she react then to sudden change through nobody's fault save for a twist of fate?
Instrumentality1000 meh not really. She chose her life with her family over Bojack, despite how tempting he would be. Isn’t that a testament to her satisfaction with her current life? Also, I feel like Charlotte’s the type to be able to work through rocky shit like cheating and the stuff with Bojack and penny if it came to light. After all, she’s willing to make the sacrifices and changes necessary for such events. The only thing I’d see threatening this is like tragedy or if her family aren’t willing to do the same for her.
@@raquelirizarry9432 She'd obviously be devastated, but it wouldn't be through any decision she made. And I agree with you on the cheating husband thing. She's smart to choose her family and the happiness she's built for herself, but that doesn't mean she's willing to let herself be walked all over.
I have actually experienced temporary happiness once in my life. A few years ago, my friend had confessed to me, I was so happy that I decided to date him right away. Our relationship was a long distance one and we never video called which I see now as a red flag. He would talk to me for half the year and then disappear for half a year. Two years of this and some therapy roll by and I finally decide to break it off, I was done being treated like some throwaway girl. I was happy temporarily because I thought ‘ a guy loves me! ‘ so temporary happiness is a huge temptation....
0:46 Mr Peanutbutter being happy is debatable. Until the end of season 6 he's pretty much incapable of being alone which is why he's been married three times. He also has something of a nihilistic view of life calling the universe a "cruel uncaring void" and saying the only way to deal with this is to busy yourself with unimportant nonsense until you die. It's also clear that his outward positivity isn't 100% genuine as he acts oblivious to Bojack not liking him but later reveals he knows full well that Bojack doesn't like him and doesn't understand why.
I really do feel like this show it just ends with him dying in his later years(mind that he is already in his mid 50's now) that focuses with more on of loss and regret and in what he thinks he could've done to have been of a better as a person. As son, a brother/ father figure, a lover and a friend. That no matter how lucky or unfortunate you had it in this life, it just all ends the same
@@davidahlstrom588 I don't. I'm glad it ended the way it did. Bojack was a depressing show a lot of the time, but there was always a lot of emphasis on confronting the bad and at the same time making an effort to fix things and fix yourself and be better next time. Killing off Bojack would have been the easy way out. Instead they made him live and face his decisions with an ending that hinted at room for growth and positive change. Way more thematic imo.
I would love to see your updated view on Charlotte now that the show has ended. I understood why she was trying to protect her daughter, but I was very shocked at how much she pushed to get her to hold back the truth (initially) about what happened with Bojack. A part of me definitely feels like it's guilt, but another part feels like it's her just trying to keep the family together.
She might feared that telling the true could damage her family, after all the one who tried to sleep with her daughter is not other than a celebrity. Do you know how many paparazzis could atract just for that juicy story? In a small town they could have being known as "the family who's daughter nearly got assault by Bojack", is something that could destroy their lives.
It wasn't about protecting Bojack, but protecting Penny. Charlotte knows that with Bojack being so high profile and the sheer invasiveness of reporters, that Penny would likely be further traumatized. You SAW how ruthless and insufferable Paige Sinclair was. Charlotte had a good point. She didn't flat out forbid her daughter from coming forward, just that she should really, really think about the long term consequences of doing so.
Crazy, right? I've stopped trying to sell it to others. Not many buyers. Interesting thing coming up though: Netflix has syndicated BoJack to Comedy Central. First time Netflix has ever syndicated a show. That could mainstream it a bit.
She's one of my fav chars. I see a big part of her character as an inspiration. Charlotte is capable of being satisfacted with what she got in her life and is willing to sacrifice short-term happiness for the sake of long-term happiness. Not to mention she's so cute with her big eyes.
I agree with the Charlotte being the happiest in the show statement. I don't understand when people say it's peanut butter, the whole point of peanut butter is that he isn't happy with his life, he just ignores and denies everything that makes him unhappy, uts why he hasn't matured for DECADES, we see it in the episode where for once he actually reflects on his life and his previous relationships to find that they failed because he refused to pay attention or think about anything other than immediate happiness. It's another reason I dislike when people put Diane down for their relationship ending, saying they'd love a supportive husband like pb but he isn't supportive, he's positive but that's it, he wasn't supportive when she was going through hard emotional times and didn't bother to communicate with her cause that's what he does, he just ignores anything difficult or upsetting and is confused by people (like diane) who don't do that.
When it comes to bojack and Charlotte I’m glad she chose her family over him because in life you have to make hard choices, maybe bojack felt happy around her that doesn’t change the fact they barely knew each other, she created a happy life for herself and didn’t want to throw that away which makes complete sense. I still believe bojack was never gonna have sex with Charlottes daughter but knowing bojack I could see him just doing it anyway.
Bojack is so selfish, he’s willing to ruin his friend’s life, family, and drag her into his miserable life. He wants happiness and he believes Charlotte will make him happy. Charlotte is happy because she doesn’t do whatever she wants no matter the consequences. She recognizes that happiness comes with a price and is willing to pay that price (getting rid of Bojack). If she did go with him, she’d lose her husband, her kids would hate her, and she’d be a miserable drunk like Bojack
Disciplined delay of gratification over short-term, short-sighted instant gratification is a major key to long-term, sustainable growth, success and prosperity in the ways that matter most.
Well on my opinion Charlotte represents an option B on Bojack's life choises, a life with her instead of the fame and the money, I think that we all had options B at some point and some times we wonder about what could have been, only that in this case Charlotte is not hipotetical she is a real person, but the life with her is not, on my opinion there is where all conflic comes from, yea I would like to see albin and the chipmunks tackling something like that.
Understanding what is and isn't beneficial towards you achieving the kind of life that makes you happy is a painful process of growing up that characters like Bojack don't achieve because just as you said they don't see the bigger picture. And also because he doesn't understand what happiness is, it's not a fleeting moment, it's reward for hard work. I find myself confronted with this daily, decisions are difficult but in the long-run the uphill battle is rewarding and I see many friends and acquaintances not understanding this...
I think you are right, Bojack doesn't know what happiness is. As Shady said in the video, he just goes for cheap pleasures (alcohol, drugs, sex) that make him temporarily happy. He doesn't know how to deal with his feelings, or have positive relationships and as a result he is like a traveller lost in a forest without a map. He knows he wants to be free and happy, but he doesn't know how to get there.
She DID want Bojack. That's the problem. Charlotte showed a lot of signs of being interested in Bojack, both in the past and now. It's because she wants Bojack that she had to get rid of him. The kiss was confirmation of her want for him and if she let it continue, she would've threatened everything she had just to pursue a relationship with a guy she knew years ago.
Jess Late I beg to differ.I mean your obversation is right to the end of season 3. Bojack especially in season 3 more than before pushes to the edge. He sleeps with emliy ,knowing it'll hurt Todd ,he tries to numb the pain with drugs and he drags Sarah Lynn with him, which not only demolishes her own success of being sober but inevitable leads to her death. Bojack goes with the cheap solutions to numb his pain and destroys his own relationships ,everyone at the end of season 3 abandons him ,except mr.peanutbutter and diane. Even commiting suicide would have been the easy soulution, killing his pain literally ,if his still existing will to life hadn't intervened ,at least I think that's what the horses represented. So, after reaching his breaking point he actively achieves to overcome it to a larger extend. Eddie helped him to overcome his grief for Sarah and he actually can build a friendship with him,I'd argue that it's not Bojack's fault it had ended, because in the end Eddie couldn't move on. Bojack like Shady pointed out celebrates Sarah's life instead of grieving. Back in Hollywoo ,he actually apopogizes to Todd and means it,he's rewarded with him opening up to Bojack and having a better relationship with him. He comforts Diane,befriends mr.peanutbutter more than ever,is there for Princess Caroline when she needs it,even helping her out with Filbert ,which I don't think he would have done before. Fair enough it's with Hollyhawk he can accomplish all that,he learned from his mistakes with Sarah and is an acceptable father figure for her,even with him doing selfless good deeds for her he is rewarded with a trusting sister/brother relationship. In my opinion he is on a good path of finding real happiness.
Shady Doorags deadass confused so does she even love her husband? And if she doesn’t (since she showed interest in Bojack) then how is she happy living a lie?
Jayden Hutchinson Yes, Charlotte loves her husband but she is still interested in Bojack. A Person can be interested/ be in love/etc with more than one Person. She's not living a lie. Both Bojack and Kyle make her happy, but the happiness they bring her are not compatible with each other. Charlotte had to choose and she's chose her husband and family over Bojack.
I loved your analasys of this character. I was always a little confused by some of her actions/words but the way you've explained it cleared things up really well!
Bojack is a snake. He goes to his friends house and then tries to date her when she has a husband and kids. Then when he rejects her, he almost sleeps with her daughter.
Yeah and many times when you really love someone and you are with them for a long time, you may find yourself liking someone else, but that is so temporary liking or even infatuation is something that many experience while being in a relationship, but loving someone is completely different and it's a part of the risk, happiness and love is not for cowards.
I don't think Charlotte is a defender of her happiness, I think that she is a defender of morality. She have the moral responsibly of taking care of her family and doing the right thing. She eve did the moral thing when Bojack came around and took care of him. But as soon as Bojack did threatened her morality by temping her to cheat on her husband she cut him out. She did the moral thing to protect herself and her family. Bojack, on the other hand, constantly makes the immoral choice. It was when he made morally improper advances on Charlotte that caused her to cut him out. Had he just done the right thing and set boundaries for himself Bojack probably could have stayed and he would certainly left on good terms be a happier, better person. But he acted immorally and suffered the just consequences. Charlotte acts morally as her happiness is a byproduct of that good behavior. Bojack often makes immoral choices and his misery is a byproduct of his bad behavior. I think the lesson here is to be a good person and do good things. If you do, you are certain to find happiness.
No, Bojack made her sad because Charlotte had to choose between long term happines with her family or short term happines with Bojack, and that's what made her sad, not Bojack himself
BoJack's words are verbatim that of a cliche love story. He doesn't know; has never known real love. So he sees the happiness that he didn't take, the literal boat he missed belongs to um.. her husband. Present BoJack wants happiness at any cost but to do that he needs to love himself. Instead, he bases love on what he's known all his life. The same way Bea feels like she missed the goat in what should've been a cliche youth rebellions love story. Reaching, some part of BoJack inherently knows what went wrong and he think the only way to escape failed love is to get "good" love, the love he's known on stage his whole life, parasocial or dramatized when true love is gradual and needs trust.
Charlotte has something going on for her (her family and her life with them) and values that. Bojack seems to clings to any momentary glimmer of happiness he can find because he's so lost that he doesn't think he has anything worth building long term. He's not actively trying to be awful but he's so messed up that he causes unintentional grief for people like here with Charlotte.
CPTSD often stunts emotional development. Bo is still stuck in the 14 year old dopamine junkie mindset, so he can't see past his opportunistic manipulation. He has yet to figure out that real happiness is a full time job and a lifelong project, not something that is grabbed on the fly. With our hyper individualistic, instant gratification culture I suppose CPTSD is not necessary to miss that point.
Don't forget BPD. Bojack to me is the embodiment of Bordeline personality disorder, probably because as someone who relates to alot of the symptoms I self project onto him alot lol
I would argue it has less to do with her being brave (not a coward) and more to do with she looks at the bigger picture, but Bojack is living for the moment
I always felt this episode was pretty unfair to Bojack, and Charlotte plays a major part in that. As pointed out, in their past, Charlotte called Bojack a coward for not pursuing her romantically. Later, when she sees him at Herb's funeral and invites him to see her sometime, she makes no mention of being married. Its like she's setting him up to fail. What happens next? Well, when he visits and discovers that she is married, he makes his comical attempt at cover it up and tries to leave with what little dignity he has...but Charlotte doesn't let him! She invites him to stay indefinitely. Bojack, damaged as he is, sees this as salvation rather than the emotional trap that is being laid for him. You can blame Bojack for making poor decisions, but what is Charlotte's excuse? Why does she want this older, apparently good-looking movie star living with her and her family? Its one thing to keep in touch, but having another man living at her house seems fraught with potential problems. Finally, on the fateful night, Charlotte cozies up to Bojack, and after a heart-to-heart, willingly kisses him and clearly enjoys it. BJ's confusion and desire to see this kiss to its reasonable conclusion are pretty understandable. Its Charlotte who set this up, and then, after giving Bojack a taste of what he clearly was wanting, denies him completely, and insists that he leaves. The "knew each other for five minutes" line is pretty harsh, considering that they spent the last two months together. These things are also Charlotte's decisions, and while it may have led to her having a happy life, they seemed to selfishly deny Bojack of his.
Jason Seipler I like that. Also you can say that Bojacks habit of momentary happiness is due to the fact that he thinks that once somthing leaves it leaves for good and he doesn't want the regret of being a coward and letting it go by.
Yeah it definitely was mixed messaging. Stuff that you interpret wrong when you have feelings for someone, much less when you're damaged. She prolly didn't see it from her end because she THOUGHT she had moved on, but you can see that she is tempted so you know she hasn't. She just makes the right choice for her life anyways at the moment of the kiss. Bojack was kind of put in a situation that made him much less able to cope despite him trying to get out of it. There are normal people that get confused by situations like that, much less someone as damaged as Bojack.
Because she's "human". She might be happy but she still has feelings. She got caught in the moment, quickly realized what was happening, and then stepped back because it would destroy everything in her life that was making her happy. Being in a happy life/relationship doesn't mean you're never tempted by other things and people fuck this up all the time. But she shows her maturity and experience in recognizing what was happening quickly and then making the call she needed to. As an aside, her feelings for him she still had prolly affected how she talked to him via Freudian slips as well as her recommending he stay. But she prolly didn't realize the extent until that exact moment when she realized she was fucking up. She's not innocent, but she made the right choice when she became aware of the situation. Feelings are super messy and even the best of us make mistakes in that. Now the real interesting question is "What exactly did she tell her husband?" THAT, more than anything, will show where she stands. But we don't know that as of season 4. It'd be a magnificently tragic train wreck if it came back to haunt Bojack in season 5 or 6 though if she told the husband, the husband lost trust in her, and they broke up. Right after some point where Bojack elt happyish she or the daughter angrily calls Bojack blaming him for everything tearing his world to pieces again . They prolly at least considered that.
Drabswim. First of all, he hadn't travelled ages to see her. She lives two states over, so...... I wouldn't qualify a two day drive as "coming all that way". But I agree with you. Charlotte's invitation to stay was likely just a formality. It was BoJack that took it as indefinite, since he was in such a bad place. I don't think Charlotte was setting him up or even keeping Bojack around for herself I think she thought she was helping an old friend who was having a hard time, nothing more.
That advice in that "don't do that" joke is actually pretty shitty. Doing something normal shouldn't hurt to the point you avoid that normal thing and if it does, it needs to be fixed and worked on.
Except that what is considered "normal" is a matter of perspective. Bojack was doing the thing that was causing him pain because he believed it was the normal thing to do but to someone like Charlotte, those kinds of actions aren't normal. If it indeed is about doing something normal that hurts, than it's a message to Bojack that he needs to reconsider what a normal action is.
The tricky thing about this show is that everyone has something wrong with them, even if you don’t notice it at first. In fact i would very much argue that Bojack almost seems to have the least wrong with him, he just sees himself as so fucked while everyone else decides to live in peaceful bliss. The thing about Charolette is that you can clearly tell she still has some deeply rooted feelings for him. I’m sure she wonders the same things bojack does except opposite (what would’ve been if she had stayed vs leaving). Charlotte seems to be one of those people who does what she thinks she should rather than doing what would actually make her(more) happy
I actually disagree with your last line . I would replace the "more" with "momentary gush of pleasure" which many people confuse with the eureka happiness moment. She was real..didn't see the world in rosetinted glass. She saw that moment as just what it was..it was not real feeling..it was just a "what if". For her it was real happiness she had built for herself vs a what if. I dont think she has a problem..at least in this case.
I love characters like Charlotte and Hollyhock but it’s a shame that BoJack ruined those relationships ((in a way)), but honestly I think it says a lot about BoJack and even more about those characters, this is an insanely clever show.
Charolette is an interesting character and was a good friend to Bojack. One of the things i like about her besides her happy personality and being a good mother is she married a human dude which is quite refreshing because there's too many human females with furry, xeno and mutant males in mainstream already (I.E. Wolf Children or Roger Rabbit or Gargoyles's Goliath and Eliza to Biker Mice from Mars's Vinnie and Charlene etc.) as it's getting quite boring when i find the reverse much fresher like Hatton Slayden's amazing artworks to Margaret's parents on Regular Show getting rid of the dumb double standard that "only human women are ok to be with nonhuman people", i mean if Minerva Mink dated a human guy in the upcoming animaniacs reboot as one of her dates that be cute. Yes Bojack should had said no to her daughter when she was seducing him, he knew he was too old for her but he shouldn't tried to do that.
and suddenly i feel like i should stop talking to my best friend, because i have feelings for her and she doesn't and is actively trying to be with other ppl...
@@Johnlindsey289 says the guy with the mothafuckin ROBOCOP avatar! I just finished playing the arcade game on my retropie arcade the other day. Best accomplishment of the week. I spent so many quarters playing as a kid on that game...
Wwwaaiiitt...... but Charlotte also made some shitty choices. Which mother, in her right mind, lets, and I quote, "someone (50 year old dude) who you knew for 5 minutes 30 years ago" who you know is a coward and has some dark issues, stay to live in your driveway, and let him go to prom with a 17 year old girl? She might be braver, she might be healthier, even saner, but she made a supper shitty choice. Not saying BoJack is a saint, but we can't ignore Charlotte's part in the whole situation.
I got the impression that she had mostly positive feelings for Bojack. She remembers the sweet, hopeful, somewhat responsible, albeit flawed man in his early 20s. The way she asked about if he would have asked her out; she probably had feelings for him. So she saw an old friend who she had mostly positive feelings about who clearly needed some time away from his current lifestyle, so she let him stay for a bit. And he did blend in well for quite some time and was an asset of sorts. Then things got weird...
It becomes much more apparent in season 6. Penny wanted to give her side of the story to the reporters, something that would probably allow her to fully move past her trauma and turn it into something she could use to bring attention to the bad things Bojack had done. But Charlotte didn’t want her to. At first it seemed like it was because she cared about Penny and didn’t want her to revisit the events of the prom night, but it becomes clear that she doesn’t want Penny to say anything because she didn’t want the fact she kissed Bojack to get out, which could’ve ruined her marriage. Penny’s attempt to heal threatened Charlotte’s happiness, and thus she talks her out of it. This is where her desire for happiness becomes toxic. She puts her own happiness above the happiness of her own daughter, knowing full well that she is still suffering.
yasbutterfly Y Penny didn’t know the Charlotte kissed Bojack, but it might’ve gotten out during Bojack’s interview if Penny told her story to the reporters. Bojack did admit to a lot of stuff during the follow up interview (for example, having sex with Sarah Lynn), and while Bojack might not have admitted to it, Charlotte didn’t want to take that chance.
yasbutterfly Y Doesn’t matter, there was still a chance he could have and that would have been enough of a reason for Charlotte to stop Penny from helping in the case.
@@sambarham8887 fair enough. Honestly your comment was kind of an eye-opener Like "wait WHAT?!" Cos I didn't even think that charlotte might've not want penny to out her story to the reporters for her own sake and not her daughter. That might even be why she didn't just call the cops on bojack when he almost had sex with penny
It’s so nice to finally see human male and anthro female couples in mainstream at last outside internet artworks like hattonslayden’s amazing sci-fi and fantasy illustrations of human guys with alien and furry females. Regular Show has Margaret’s parents being a bird woman and human man and this also has a Judah and Princess Carolyn. So tired of always human women x anthro male (ala any beauty and the beast or the parents in wolf children or roger and Jessica or Howard the duck and Beverly in Marvel comics etc) as they are getting rid of that sexist old double standard “only human women are ok to be with nonhuman folk”. I mean there’s guys out there who fantasize about furry gals like Rebecca Cunningham, Lola bunny, Minerva mink on animaniacs, Felicia, Callie Briggs etc
@@Johnlindsey289 Hah hah, yeah the only other anthro mixed family that's daring like you say is the anthro deer mother in that one Orangina commercial who has two human children who had taught her children how to eat Orangina cereal without spoons. Ofcourse it's possible she just adopted those kids and no human father was ever in the picture to begin with. It remains a mystery. But to be fair Belle doesn't end up with Beast because he has to turn back into a generic human. It's just not really allowed for humans to spend their happily ever after with any non-humans/anthros. But any movie or cartoon that DOES will certainly have more imagination and will probably be better written because thinking outside of the little race-supremacist box requires a capable, independent, functional brain! And I'll have to check out hattonslayden. Not sure i know the artist.
@@Johnlindsey289 I didn't watch enough Regular Show to see Margaret's parents so I think that's cool she has a human parent in the mix! Wolf Children is a great and beautiful movie but that would have been REALLY interesting, and probably even more sexy if it had been a human man with a werewolf lady instead. Would have been a VERY different dynamic! We can only hope such couples lead to braver writers trying out more anthro human couples. But really, furry writers are just going to have to get good at animating and voice casting their own cartoons and 3d animations since I don't expect to see anything decent ever come out of Hollywood. Bojack Horseman and Regular Show were just flukes as far as Hollywood writing goes. But then, Vivienne Madrano/Vivziepop tried to have human anthro couples with her Zoophobia comic (she got closer to it) and do mini-cartoons about that but she got WAY too many people screaming at her in public calling her nasty names, seeing it as human and animal relationships instead. Even though Vivienne is massively successful with Helluva Boss she still has to live in fear of all the people who want to skin her alive for daring to have anthros get close to humans. It's tough to break through this kind of boundary, it's going to require a whole new generation of furry writers and animators with a more accepting public to get such relationships into cartoons and movies as a serious thing. Edit: I just looked up hattonslayden and yeah I know his art! Always fun to look at! Would be awesome if he got his own 3d animation/Source filmmaker projects going and hired voice actors from his circle to make his own media.
Omg!! CAN SOMEONE ANYONE REALIZE MR.PEANUTBUTTER IS A FACE OF DEPRESSION!! THE SHOW EVEN NOTICES THAT NO O ENIS NOTICING AND SPELLS IT OUT!! JUST DEPRESSION!! Mr.Peanutbutter IS NOT HAPPY. THAT WAS HIS ARC!
Hey, I just been working on my self mental health recently…and one of my toxic ex contacts me out of the blue. I blocked him right away cuz I remembered 3 years ago the depressed me watching this video telling myself I want to be like Charlotte! Have health boundaries are sooo important !
Charlotte is one of the wisest characters in the show. She represents everything Bojack lacks, which is to sacrifices fleeting whims for the good of her long-term commitments with her family. It's not an easy choice, but is its the best on for most people.
Good personality too
I dont think Charlotte's that wise, she moved in a man who she hadn't spoken to in decades with her young vulnerable children and her shaky marriage. But I'm happy she woke up when she saw that was happening between Bojack and her daughter.
I'd say it's more that she knows what she really wants and can see what will provide that for her and her family. She also has basic empathy and wouldn't want to hurt her current husband more than necessary, even if their marriage isn't ideal. If Bojack was a good person, stable, and genuinely loved her I think they definitely would've gotten together eventually. But he's selfish and would never in a million years want to *settle down* with her. That's really the crux of it. She knows she wants stability, a good marriage and a good life for her kids. Bojack provides none of this. Add in the fact that he almost took advantage of her young, impressionable daughter, yeah that was the last straw. She saw the huge red flags and ran, just like she should have.
She called Bojack a coward. Clearly she was wrong, as he did make a move. She just went after the first opportunity that came along, and Bojack should have bailed, except he still liked her.. People mistake her stagnant, dare I say 'boring' life for happiness. I think Waxman called this one wrong.
@@supadupahilton6848 a boring life is better than a life of drama anyday
The reason why they would never use Charlotte as a main character is because she doesn't want drama. People who seek drama or crave the attention like many problematic characters in the show, they'll never be as happy as her.
I see it more like Charlotte already completed her arc.
She has completed her arc even before the end of season 2. Bojack, other main characters are flawed and didn't finish their arc yet so that's the way it is.
Princess Carolynn lol
The show litterly takes place in LA. That makes so much sense
The family of a man who molested my children less than 6 call justice drama. Some people can handle the responsibilities of moving forward through hell with their head up, some fall to the occasion. When people say "drama" I think they have a hard time differentiating falsehoods and reality because emotion is healthy and cathartic if you're not hurting anyone. When I sing or speak I'm told to shut up. I sing and speak for my children because we're all happier. I was rebellious for speaking anything. The cause was freedom of speech. Within evangelical families even those who denounced Christian denominations, women are treated like dogs. Property. My mom called me a delusional lying bad girl and threatened child welfare against me because her father and mine inappropriately touched me when I was younger than 11. It stopped around 11
She kissed him lol
What makes me the most sad is seeing that Charlotte clearly showed interest in kissing him, but has immediate regret.
That is sad.
right!!! I originally thought that was just how the characters looked while being kissed whether they were into it or not but comparing charlottes face to dianes while bojack tried to kiss her.. there is a big difference
@@user-qm8gt8lf7l Yeah like Charlotte allowed Bojack to kiss her and she let out little hum. Diane pushed him away immediately.
@@user-qm8gt8lf7l The way Charlotte moaned when kissed means she really wanted it for a very long time.
@@Mortablunt I agree. But, she still made the right decision. She has a husband, two children, an established life, her own local small business, etc. She's _happy._ Even if she saw Bojack as "the one who got away", she isn't going to throw all of that out for him. Besides, the fact that HE'S so eager for her to do that, callously disregarding her entire family and saying "only they matter", galvanizes that fact even before he did what he did to Penny.
OF course Bojack picks short term happiness; it's not because he's a coward, it's because he doesn't see himself living a long or happy life. Why plan for a future that won't exist?
I think that... To not try, sacrifice, even where there's a possibility for failure is the cowardly move. To only do things that are certain and concrete is cowardly. It's cowardly to refuse to recognize that there is a chance for change and it can happen. There just needs a lot of work
@@martinsmartini44 Yes, I suppose both can be true. He’s a coward for picking what is ‘easy’ even when it hurts people
Oof
I think he just wants it now,instantaneously
This is a great point - you could also extrapolate that since he came from a very unhappy family, the idea that happiness is a long-term prospect is kind of alien to him. So that would make him inclined to jump on opportunities that offer imminent happiness.
Additionally, you could think that as someone who "everything good, I learned from television", Bojack would be inclined to make choices that a sitcom writing team would use to milk drama IRL.
Thank you very much I needed this. "Temporary happiness" is a big temptation.
Pat Thetic i love you
Such happiness is truly fleeting.
happiness is temporary, always has been
@@InternationalDonDadda exactly. There's a movie they see in 500 days of summer that shows this. There's no happily ever after
I’ve always thought that Charlotte symbolizes that first love we’ve all had. The first person we’ve truly felt something for, whether it be as a kid with a schoolyard crush or in high school admiring the popular person or just someone you never had the courage to ask out. So over time you compartmentalize them and turn them into a static object, a what if frozen in time that you think about every now and then. And then one day you encounter them or see them on social media, as an actual person in a relationship or even married with kids, and realize that they’re not that idea anymore, and perhaps they never were. You weren’t in love with someone, you were in love with your idealized version of them.
i like to say " in lust"
Disse tudo
In retrospect it's quite sad how Charlotte managed to build a good and simple life for herself and her family without Bojack being anywhere near, only to let him in again decades later for a brief stay which unbeknownst to her would cause irreversible damage upon the entire family and seemingly perfect life she worked so hard to achieve
If that's the case, then god thats a damn good reason to hate bojack.
They bravery of her taking a stand to protect her life really does show in comparison to other characters through the series. Bojack hurts just about everyone at some point and they all take their time to cut him out or don’t cut him out at all. Hollyhock struggles with borderline PTSD about her drugging but doesn’t cut Bojack out for years, Todd gets his rock opera and several major jobs ruined before moving away from Bojack and Diane even stays in touch after moving to Chicago. But Charlotte knows what she needs and knows to take a stand. And how strong she is when she does it gives me chills.
“If you are not out of my driveway in 30 minutes I am calling the police. And if you ever try to contact me or my family again, I will fucking kill you.”
tbf the drugging of hollyhock wasn't bojack's fault, that was his mom
@@SegaJennesiss goes to show how fucked up their family is.
@@SegaJennesiss I would argue that bojack was responsible
@@momin9739 how so?
@@momin9739 How can he be responsible about something he didn't know
You cut out the "You make me sad" line at the end that reinforces your entire point.
traxfish Not really. His point, which he explicitly states at the end, was that Bojack was offering her something good aka short term happiness. I mean didn't it strike you as odd that Charlotte practically begged Bojack to stay when he was about to leave with the 'Escape From LA'? Charlotte clearly enjoyed Bojack's company (for reasons I won't delve into for now) and for 2 months he made her and her family very happy. I believe there are others reasons why she said he made her sad, but as far as we know before the kiss Bojack made Charlotte pretty happy in the 2 months he lived with her. Its also pretty evident that she enjoyed the kiss (short term happiness). Bojack makes Charlotte happy, but he crossed a boundary that threatened her long term happiness (her family and the life she built). And she wasn't willing to lose her long term happiness for the short-lived and unstable happiness that Bojack had to offer.
@@campayne3338 now i'm curious, why does Charlotte enjoy Bojack's company?
@@alexnikos8961 ever try to reconnect with old friends? At least that's the best way I can think to explain why I think she does.
@@xcaluhbration oh okay, that makes sense
@@xcaluhbration The problem is from how she acted before...she never seemed genuine as a friend. She literally called Bojack a coward for no real reason.
Oof this is so sad, Alexa play bojack opening scene
Woop woop wapp woop woop woop ~ *Saxophone noises*
Back in the 90s...
Randy Richmond III i was in a very famous tv show... :((
Not sad enough now, Alexa play Mr. Blue.
This just made her my favorite character in the show. So many people are willing to sacrifice long term fulfillment for instant gratification. They see happiness as this endless journey of taking the most imminently pleasing options at the expense of their long term goals and the important people in their lives. There's a reason she's living the life Bojack dreams about while he simply cannot. She makes it about her choices, he makes it about her.
She makes it about her choices, he makes it about himself.
well spoken！
After she says, “I don’t care where you go bojack, I just can’t have you here,” she says, “you make me too sad.” I think that line ties together this point really well and it kinda just struck me as something significant.
Is mr peanut butter happy or pretending to be happy? His happiness depends a great deal on ridiculous amounts of optimism and adamantly refusing to dig beneath the surface of anything. His living is very superficial
Lorrie hes happy i dont think he pretends to be happy. Reasons why is because welp his character is based off of a dog. Like when his wife was “out of the country” and saw her at a restaurant, he didnt get mad he just let it slide. Because he loves her or just didnt want her to go away, like a dog would when its owner comes home they get happy. Mr peanut butter doesnt seem like the type of character to hide emotions cause he has shown anger toward other characters so why would he show sadness? Thats my perspective on it and would be happy to see what yours is.
Ghost Girl he once said that the secret to life is to occupy yourself with meaningless things until you die. He allowed Diane to return, not because he loved her, but because he has angst about addressing any issue below the surface. As I said, he lives very superficially. He grew up on a very privileged island where the world was presented to him (and other inhabitants) very optimistically and any problems were probably hidden from them in order not to ruin the illusion of perfection. This has made him incapable of handling issues that run deep, so instead he slaps a happy face on it and refuses to look beneath the surface. He is incapable of empathy (not like a psychopath but like someone who is so privileged that he’s never had to put himself in another person’s shoes) several examples are when he keeps making grand gestures that Diane doesn’t like and then getting angry at her for not appreciating the grand gestures she didn’t even ask him for. He simply couldn’t understand why someone else might not like the things he likes and he’s unwilling to put himself in the person’s shoes and figure it out because that would require a level of introspection and self awareness that he doesn’t have. Because of his inability for introspection and personal growth, his wives always mature and leave him behind. Instead of learning from his multiple divorces, he ignores the problem and simply jumps into the next marriage with an even younger wife so he never has to mature.
Okay, that was a Lot but anyway, that’s my take on Mr. Peanut Butter. He’s a nice guy but ultimately superficial, lacks self-awareness, immature to the point of gullibility, a lot of fake optimism which sometimes comes across as naïveté.
Lorrie i like this alot it makes alot of sense. But when it comes down to it, he is happy but he doesn’t know how to make the people around him happy. Like you said lack of putting himself in other peoples perspective. So yes I do believe your outlook but i also think he is happy and not miserable like bojack or Diane. Thanks
I think Mr.P symbolizes toxic positivity. So in a way, I think he's truly happy but he's also the archetype of many people who always preach happiness as a shield for their inter turmoil, and refusal to work through things that bother them psychologically.
The biggest proof of his hiden unhappiness is when Captain confesses he has a twisted spleen
Any inconvenience Mister Peanutbutter had he managed to get over super quick because everything he has, his house his career, even his romantic companions are things he believes he can just replace, but when he is faced with the posibility of losing his brother he cant do that, because he only has one brother.So he falls into depression
I'm about 95% sure that Charlotte didn't call Bojack a coward, it was Bojack adding that in his head because he blames himself for not making a move on her!
Huh, that could actually be true! Knowing Bojack and all
That WAS such a strangely blunt thing to say to somebody ...
Interesting take. However, I think the show makes clear when reality and imagination are being blurred.
Charlotte actually calling him a coward (in reality vs. in BoJack's head) helps provide a catalyst for the transformation of BoJack into the completely self-centered s.o.b.
Charlotte called him a coward while BoJack was still young and hopeful. His mother had messed him up, but he was now free of her, pursuing his dream in LA. He wasn't drinking yet. Wasn't jaded yet. He was kind of naive.
I think Charlotte was a little bummed BoJack never hit on her and kind of wanted to needle him for it now that it was too late. So she brought his attention to what could have been.
As for BoJack, her calling him a coward probably stayed with him. And probably helped fuel a lot of the the terrible things he did, especially with women.
I like this theory, but I also think that it didn't just happen in Bojack's head. The show does tend to be clear about whether something has actually happened, except for crazy drug trip episodes and the like - in which case though, we know to question reality in those episodes
The irony is, that there is an episode, where Bojack tells a story about a coffee cup misplaced in a horsin' around scene and it's gone in the next. A fan has the theory that the show tries to make the point that memory is subjective and no one has the full picture on what actually happend. Bojack does not have the heart to tell him that it was just a lazy guy on set who forgot his cup in the cup. This is literally the same thing :)
I wouldn't have cut out the "you make me too sad" part of what Charlotte said, I think it sums up the video perfectly!
was thinking the same thing.
Goddamn it, that line cuts so deep with me
I had a little of this
1:00 Charlotte is not wealthy or famous but she is happy, while BoJack is wealthy and famous but not happy. That's a good point.
Todd? Think of him
I used to live in Hollywood and even had a few high profile acting and dancing jobs. I eventually got out and moved to Seattle, but I kept in touch with a lot of my friends in the industry; some even made it pretty big. But none of them are truly happy. Hollywood has a way of sucking the life out of you in a way I can't explain. Bojack Horseman is the best show I've ever seen that explains it.
The fact that he slept with his showbiz daughter already made you feel like he'd go this low. But everytime you want him to not do anything stupid until he does
Not gonna lie that episode had me in an emotional roller coaster.
Been waiting for a Charlotte centered episode from you. Very well done, cant wait for more especially when Season 5 comes out.
Hope we see a cameo of her later the series.
YES! I NEED THAT!
Great video.
Can we talk about PC's choice in men? Bojack, Vincent Adultman, Ralph....I have A LOT of opinions.
Ralph seemed pretty solid unless there's a perspective I'm missing.
traxfish No, it wasn't really Ralph's fault the relationship ended. Princess Carolyn didn't want to admit to him, more importantly herself, that she's not superwoman and can't do everything by herself. To me, she sees it as a weakness and doesn't want to be seen as less than what she is just because she's incapable of having children.
Lol, I do wonder what Vincent's up to since being a business manager for PB Livin'. Would be hilarious if he's still going around in that coat pretending to be one person, just out of habit. Maybe even owns an actual business factory by now. Ha!
@@traxfish Except Ralph was a pretty big jackass about PC's miscarriage.
@@punkuke
How? As soon as he found he said he was sorry and they could try again when she was ready? I could see how his proposal to look at other options could be seen as insensitive due to the timing and way suggested it, but he genuinely cared. It was just bad timing. Princess Carolyn was drunk and upset and she brought her other miscarriages at the wrong time.
I cannot remember if she ever apologized for that outburst
I can only hope that BoJack doesn't shoot himself in the foot with Hollyhock.
Well fuck.
@@wackmidi who is it?
InfamousTranquility Nobody yet, but Hollyhock is on the verge of knowing what shit went down in NM. I think she’s gonna say it in Part 2
oh boy wait until you watch season 5
This comment did not age well
I'm sad that Bojack scarred that family, while watching the last season, you can see that Penny doesn't even want to go to her house anymore and that her relationship with Charlotte is not the same. She resents her for bringing Bojack into their lives. Charlotte might have been the happiest character but not after Bojack.
Wonderful analysis! I think Charlotte, as Princess Caroryn, is an adult representation. Nevertheless, she is one who found happiness in a family and now lives a joyful life. She knows what she wants and even treats Bojack if he ever came near her family again, because she knows his default behavior "making people miserable" in any way. In fact, I believe when she says that he has to go because she feels sad around him, it is more like "I think about different possibilities and start questioning my happiness" than he is making her sad with any of his attitudes.
In my opinion, this is a thought only a reasonable grown-up person would have, not letting possibilities overcloud the reality she already has, in which she considers herself happy enough.
Every major interaction in Bojack Horseman is a opportunity to think about our own lives and non-reasonable thoughts and attitudes we may have on a daily basis. That's why this show is so deep and works even better being a cartoon: the truth in it is so big that every other aspect (script, character actions, ambience, characters' looks, etc.) shoud walk away from reality for it to work even better.
Keep up the videos!
love your last point about how presenting this show as an animation lets us experience the existentialism thrown out at us more authentically, despite it sounding possibly counter-intuitive
I hope that the opening scene of season 6 is Charlotte watching the submarine episode of philbert and when the scene with bojack and the girl comes on she slowly realizes the parallel between that scene and what happened with penny. That would make me squirm
While that would be brilliant, I do think that Charlotte would go out of her way to avoid anything to do with Bojack
Oh man i would love to see this. What if S6 is it, and Charlotte kills bojack. He wants to die anyway, and I think if anyone is more deserving of ending it all for him it would be her.
@Instrumentality1000if that comes back in part 2 bojack is fucked
@@tranquilfox2703 well... what do you think now?
My take away from Bojack Horseman is that it is okay to cut toxic people out of your lives. Sometimes you have to focus on your own happiness even if that means having to cut out people that you once carried about or still care about.
I know how it feels
4:28 It's more than that. Charlotte has the good sense to see the longer term consequences of short term actions, and BoJack just sadly does not, especially at that point in the series. And this applies no matter how brave or cowardly either character is.
"Stop saying I act like Bojack Horseman. He's dumb, and he's a coward. And I'm NOT. A coward!"
Impulsiveness is the downfall of many of people. I'm honestly not sure if Bojack's problem is as much cowardice as lack of patience or possibly laziness. You're definitely right about his choices, though. He often choose the temporary fix (if that's even appropriate) than the long term one. What makes it even sadder is how often Bojack contemplates his actions. I'd argue he thinks too much about his past choices and not enough about his future ones, but I'm not sure if that's right either. Luckily, I think he's done pretty well in the most recent season.
Now Charlotte on the other hand, I'm not so sure if her story is settled. As the old saying goes, count no man (or deer... gazelle?) as happy until they are in the ground. Will her days truly be happy with her decisions? While they appear correct so far. Will suppressing her urges lead to regrets? Is her life really where she wants it to be, or is it just okay? Lol, I don't know. I just enjoy playing devil's advocate and casting the occasional pebble into stagnant water.
Good video.
Charlotte wants stability. She wants to be happy on her terms which happen to include having a family, but I dare say if her husband were to cheat, she would throw him out of her life forever. She wants to feel good and may entertain alternatives to her current life, but not if it is going to threaten what she builds. She builds happiness and it would take heaven and earth to move her. My curiosity is what if tragedy struck and she lost her family to a freak accident. How would she react then to sudden change through nobody's fault save for a twist of fate?
Raquel Irizarry Interesting...
@@raquelirizarry9432 I think this is a good interpretation
Instrumentality1000 meh not really. She chose her life with her family over Bojack, despite how tempting he would be. Isn’t that a testament to her satisfaction with her current life?
Also, I feel like Charlotte’s the type to be able to work through rocky shit like cheating and the stuff with Bojack and penny if it came to light. After all, she’s willing to make the sacrifices and changes necessary for such events. The only thing I’d see threatening this is like tragedy or if her family aren’t willing to do the same for her.
@@raquelirizarry9432 She'd obviously be devastated, but it wouldn't be through any decision she made. And I agree with you on the cheating husband thing. She's smart to choose her family and the happiness she's built for herself, but that doesn't mean she's willing to let herself be walked all over.
Its incredibly strong of her to put down the boundaries then and there with people she's close to.
I have actually experienced temporary happiness once in my life. A few years ago, my friend had confessed to me, I was so happy that I decided to date him right away. Our relationship was a long distance one and we never video called which I see now as a red flag. He would talk to me for half the year and then disappear for half a year. Two years of this and some therapy roll by and I finally decide to break it off, I was done being treated like some throwaway girl. I was happy temporarily because I thought ‘ a guy loves me! ‘ so temporary happiness is a huge temptation....
0:46 Mr Peanutbutter being happy is debatable. Until the end of season 6 he's pretty much incapable of being alone which is why he's been married three times. He also has something of a nihilistic view of life calling the universe a "cruel uncaring void" and saying the only way to deal with this is to busy yourself with unimportant nonsense until you die. It's also clear that his outward positivity isn't 100% genuine as he acts oblivious to Bojack not liking him but later reveals he knows full well that Bojack doesn't like him and doesn't understand why.
I really do feel like this show it just ends with him dying in his later years(mind that he is already in his mid 50's now) that focuses with more on of loss and regret and in what he thinks he could've done to have been of a better as a person. As son, a brother/ father figure, a lover and a friend. That no matter how lucky or unfortunate you had it in this life, it just all ends the same
at this point i would actually be disappointed if it doesnt end with him dying.
I wish that was what happened
@@davidahlstrom588 I don't. I'm glad it ended the way it did. Bojack was a depressing show a lot of the time, but there was always a lot of emphasis on confronting the bad and at the same time making an effort to fix things and fix yourself and be better next time. Killing off Bojack would have been the easy way out. Instead they made him live and face his decisions with an ending that hinted at room for growth and positive change. Way more thematic imo.
@@SneezyReviews Yhea I suppose you're right, I just wish Bojack dies hapoy when he does go
Little did you know it would end with Diane and Bojack on a rooftop, staring at the stars.
This channel is far to underrated
Excellent video. I never knew why I liked Charlotte's character so much and her interactions with Bojack, but I think this nails it on the head
this episode is unconfortable and sad, but i can't stop laughing when the kyle and the kids theme is playing!!
Sounds like an 80s sitcom theme
It's the best and funniest part, and ironically just as sad.
Legitimately such a catchy song
I would love to see your updated view on Charlotte now that the show has ended. I understood why she was trying to protect her daughter, but I was very shocked at how much she pushed to get her to hold back the truth (initially) about what happened with Bojack. A part of me definitely feels like it's guilt, but another part feels like it's her just trying to keep the family together.
She might feared that telling the true could damage her family, after all the one who tried to sleep with her daughter is not other than a celebrity. Do you know how many paparazzis could atract just for that juicy story? In a small town they could have being known as "the family who's daughter nearly got assault by Bojack", is something that could destroy their lives.
It wasn't about protecting Bojack, but protecting Penny. Charlotte knows that with Bojack being so high profile and the sheer invasiveness of reporters, that Penny would likely be further traumatized. You SAW how ruthless and insufferable Paige Sinclair was. Charlotte had a good point. She didn't flat out forbid her daughter from coming forward, just that she should really, really think about the long term consequences of doing so.
I love this show. People keep sleeping on it despite how much I RAVE about it. It's truly a show of self reflection. Keep these vids comin!!
Crazy, right? I've stopped trying to sell it to others. Not many buyers.
Interesting thing coming up though: Netflix has syndicated BoJack to Comedy Central. First time Netflix has ever syndicated a show. That could mainstream it a bit.
She's one of my fav chars. I see a big part of her character as an inspiration. Charlotte is capable of being satisfacted with what she got in her life and is willing to sacrifice short-term happiness for the sake of long-term happiness. Not to mention she's so cute with her big eyes.
I agree with the Charlotte being the happiest in the show statement. I don't understand when people say it's peanut butter, the whole point of peanut butter is that he isn't happy with his life, he just ignores and denies everything that makes him unhappy, uts why he hasn't matured for DECADES, we see it in the episode where for once he actually reflects on his life and his previous relationships to find that they failed because he refused to pay attention or think about anything other than immediate happiness. It's another reason I dislike when people put Diane down for their relationship ending, saying they'd love a supportive husband like pb but he isn't supportive, he's positive but that's it, he wasn't supportive when she was going through hard emotional times and didn't bother to communicate with her cause that's what he does, he just ignores anything difficult or upsetting and is confused by people (like diane) who don't do that.
The way Bojack and Charlotte left things genuinely broke my heart. I sincerely want to see them reunited.
When it comes to bojack and Charlotte I’m glad she chose her family over him because in life you have to make hard choices, maybe bojack felt happy around her that doesn’t change the fact they barely knew each other, she created a happy life for herself and didn’t want to throw that away which makes complete sense. I still believe bojack was never gonna have sex with Charlottes daughter but knowing bojack I could see him just doing it anyway.
Bojack is so selfish, he’s willing to ruin his friend’s life, family, and drag her into his miserable life. He wants happiness and he believes Charlotte will make him happy. Charlotte is happy because she doesn’t do whatever she wants no matter the consequences. She recognizes that happiness comes with a price and is willing to pay that price (getting rid of Bojack). If she did go with him, she’d lose her husband, her kids would hate her, and she’d be a miserable drunk like Bojack
Disciplined delay of gratification over short-term, short-sighted instant gratification is a major key to long-term, sustainable growth, success and prosperity in the ways that matter most.
Well on my opinion Charlotte represents an option B on Bojack's life choises, a life with her instead of the fame and the money, I think that we all had options B at some point and some times we wonder about what could have been, only that in this case Charlotte is not hipotetical she is a real person, but the life with her is not, on my opinion there is where all conflic comes from, yea I would like to see albin and the chipmunks tackling something like that.
Understanding what is and isn't beneficial towards you achieving the kind of life that makes you happy is a painful process of growing up that characters like Bojack don't achieve because just as you said they don't see the bigger picture. And also because he doesn't understand what happiness is, it's not a fleeting moment, it's reward for hard work. I find myself confronted with this daily, decisions are difficult but in the long-run the uphill battle is rewarding and I see many friends and acquaintances not understanding this...
But if she didn't want Bojack, why did she insist that he stay so long? Also in his defense, I don't think Bojack knows what happiness is.
I think you are right, Bojack doesn't know what happiness is. As Shady said in the video, he just goes for cheap pleasures (alcohol, drugs, sex) that make him temporarily happy. He doesn't know how to deal with his feelings, or have positive relationships and as a result he is like a traveller lost in a forest without a map. He knows he wants to be free and happy, but he doesn't know how to get there.
She DID want Bojack. That's the problem. Charlotte showed a lot of signs of being interested in Bojack, both in the past and now. It's because she wants Bojack that she had to get rid of him. The kiss was confirmation of her want for him and if she let it continue, she would've threatened everything she had just to pursue a relationship with a guy she knew years ago.
Jess Late
I beg to differ.I mean your obversation is right to the end of season 3.
Bojack especially in season 3 more than before pushes to the edge.
He sleeps with emliy ,knowing it'll hurt Todd ,he tries to numb the pain with drugs and he drags Sarah Lynn with him, which not only demolishes her own success of being sober but inevitable leads to her death.
Bojack goes with the cheap solutions to numb his pain and destroys his own relationships ,everyone at the end of season 3 abandons him ,except mr.peanutbutter and diane.
Even commiting suicide would have been the easy soulution, killing his pain literally ,if his still existing will to life hadn't intervened ,at least I think that's what the horses represented.
So, after reaching his breaking point he actively achieves to overcome it to a larger extend.
Eddie helped him to overcome his grief for Sarah and he actually can build a friendship with him,I'd argue that it's not Bojack's fault it had ended, because in the end Eddie couldn't move on.
Bojack like Shady pointed out celebrates Sarah's life instead of grieving.
Back in Hollywoo ,he actually apopogizes to Todd and means it,he's rewarded with him opening up to Bojack and having a better relationship with him.
He comforts Diane,befriends mr.peanutbutter more than ever,is there for Princess Caroline when she needs it,even helping her out with Filbert ,which I don't think he would have done before.
Fair enough it's with Hollyhawk he can accomplish all that,he learned from his mistakes with Sarah and is an acceptable father figure for her,even with him doing selfless good deeds for her he is rewarded with a trusting sister/brother relationship.
In my opinion he is on a good path of finding real happiness.
Shady Doorags deadass confused so does she even love her husband? And if she doesn’t (since she showed interest in Bojack) then how is she happy living a lie?
Jayden Hutchinson
Yes, Charlotte loves her husband but she is still interested in Bojack. A Person can be interested/ be in love/etc with more than one Person. She's not living a lie. Both Bojack and Kyle make her happy, but the happiness they bring her are not compatible with each other. Charlotte had to choose and she's chose her husband and family over Bojack.
I love how your profile picture conveys boredom and intrigue simultaneously. I also love the way your voice is calm yet not in these videos.
I loved your analasys of this character.
I was always a little confused by some of her actions/words but the way you've explained it cleared things up really well!
Your vids are off the charts, man. Definitely love your wisdom and take on these shows.
As always, you make the best BoJack Horseman comentaries on the internet! Great one!
simply perfect explanations!! more from BJ! thank you so much!!!!
Bojack is a snake. He goes to his friends house and then tries to date her when she has a husband and kids. Then when he rejects her, he almost sleeps with her daughter.
Um... actually, Bojack is a horse.
I follow you for your bojack episodes, theyre all amazing. keep up the fantastic work.
My kind of character in the show, but her last appearance destroyed me with Season 2's F-Bomb.
Of the seasonal F-Bombs, Charotte's was the most impactful, for sure.
I know, right? Hers was so intimidating, my heart sank when she said it. Hope to see her in a Season 6 as a minor/major cameo.
Charlotte comes back and it will be serious ugly. I take her at her word, defending her daughter. She will try to kill BoJack, if she reemerges.
I hope to anticipate it, since Season 6 was justt announced October 30. The sheer suspense is killing me!
Good to see a new Bojack Horseman video.
Yeah and many times when you really love someone and you are with them for a long time, you may find yourself liking someone else, but that is so temporary liking or even infatuation is something that many experience while being in a relationship, but loving someone is completely different and it's a part of the risk, happiness and love is not for cowards.
its better to have loved and lost than never loved at all
Great video! Charlotte is such a facinating character.
Mr peanut butter is happier on the surface appearance. He isn't actually happier, and he's much less fulfilled.
Exactly 👍
I really like your BoJack Horseman analysis. You're very smart and well-spoken. Keep up the good work.
I don't think Charlotte is a defender of her happiness, I think that she is a defender of morality. She have the moral responsibly of taking care of her family and doing the right thing. She eve did the moral thing when Bojack came around and took care of him. But as soon as Bojack did threatened her morality by temping her to cheat on her husband she cut him out. She did the moral thing to protect herself and her family.
Bojack, on the other hand, constantly makes the immoral choice. It was when he made morally improper advances on Charlotte that caused her to cut him out. Had he just done the right thing and set boundaries for himself Bojack probably could have stayed and he would certainly left on good terms be a happier, better person. But he acted immorally and suffered the just consequences.
Charlotte acts morally as her happiness is a byproduct of that good behavior. Bojack often makes immoral choices and his misery is a byproduct of his bad behavior. I think the lesson here is to be a good person and do good things. If you do, you are certain to find happiness.
I think you missed out one of the obvious part where charlotte said that bojack makes her sad
No, Bojack made her sad because Charlotte had to choose between long term happines with her family or short term happines with Bojack, and that's what made her sad, not Bojack himself
Very insightful! I loved this episode.
I know right!? It mt started to make me feel of how I went through myself, albeit much differently.
BoJack's words are verbatim that of a cliche love story. He doesn't know; has never known real love. So he sees the happiness that he didn't take, the literal boat he missed belongs to um.. her husband. Present BoJack wants happiness at any cost but to do that he needs to love himself. Instead, he bases love on what he's known all his life. The same way Bea feels like she missed the goat in what should've been a cliche youth rebellions love story. Reaching, some part of BoJack inherently knows what went wrong and he think the only way to escape failed love is to get "good" love, the love he's known on stage his whole life, parasocial or dramatized when true love is gradual and needs trust.
Always that melancholic music when it comes to Charlotte. You know she represents something Bojack always wants, but can't get it.
Charlotte has something going on for her (her family and her life with them) and values that. Bojack seems to clings to any momentary glimmer of happiness he can find because he's so lost that he doesn't think he has anything worth building long term. He's not actively trying to be awful but he's so messed up that he causes unintentional grief for people like here with Charlotte.
CPTSD often stunts emotional development. Bo is still stuck in the 14 year old dopamine junkie mindset, so he can't see past his opportunistic manipulation. He has yet to figure out that real happiness is a full time job and a lifelong project, not something that is grabbed on the fly. With our hyper individualistic, instant gratification culture I suppose CPTSD is not necessary to miss that point.
Don't forget BPD. Bojack to me is the embodiment of Bordeline personality disorder, probably because as someone who relates to alot of the symptoms I self project onto him alot lol
I would argue it has less to do with her being brave (not a coward) and more to do with she looks at the bigger picture, but Bojack is living for the moment
Spot-on analysis. Can't wait to hear your opinions on Season 5.
Just one more shady doorags video and I’ll go to sleep... just one more...
Momentary happiness is the rotten dream media fuels many of us with. It's always better to learn & grow with people you can about.
Your videos are so interesting cuz I usually have opposite opinions from you on Bojack but this video I am with you 100%
I always felt this episode was pretty unfair to Bojack, and Charlotte plays a major part in that. As pointed out, in their past, Charlotte called Bojack a coward for not pursuing her romantically. Later, when she sees him at Herb's funeral and invites him to see her sometime, she makes no mention of being married. Its like she's setting him up to fail.
What happens next? Well, when he visits and discovers that she is married, he makes his comical attempt at cover it up and tries to leave with what little dignity he has...but Charlotte doesn't let him! She invites him to stay indefinitely. Bojack, damaged as he is, sees this as salvation rather than the emotional trap that is being laid for him. You can blame Bojack for making poor decisions, but what is Charlotte's excuse? Why does she want this older, apparently good-looking movie star living with her and her family? Its one thing to keep in touch, but having another man living at her house seems fraught with potential problems.
Finally, on the fateful night, Charlotte cozies up to Bojack, and after a heart-to-heart, willingly kisses him and clearly enjoys it. BJ's confusion and desire to see this kiss to its reasonable conclusion are pretty understandable. Its Charlotte who set this up, and then, after giving Bojack a taste of what he clearly was wanting, denies him completely, and insists that he leaves. The "knew each other for five minutes" line is pretty harsh, considering that they spent the last two months together.
These things are also Charlotte's decisions, and while it may have led to her having a happy life, they seemed to selfishly deny Bojack of his.
Jason Seipler I like that. Also you can say that Bojacks habit of momentary happiness is due to the fact that he thinks that once somthing leaves it leaves for good and he doesn't want the regret of being a coward and letting it go by.
Yeah it definitely was mixed messaging. Stuff that you interpret wrong when you have feelings for someone, much less when you're damaged. She prolly didn't see it from her end because she THOUGHT she had moved on, but you can see that she is tempted so you know she hasn't. She just makes the right choice for her life anyways at the moment of the kiss. Bojack was kind of put in a situation that made him much less able to cope despite him trying to get out of it. There are normal people that get confused by situations like that, much less someone as damaged as Bojack.
Because she's "human". She might be happy but she still has feelings. She got caught in the moment, quickly realized what was happening, and then stepped back because it would destroy everything in her life that was making her happy. Being in a happy life/relationship doesn't mean you're never tempted by other things and people fuck this up all the time. But she shows her maturity and experience in recognizing what was happening quickly and then making the call she needed to. As an aside, her feelings for him she still had prolly affected how she talked to him via Freudian slips as well as her recommending he stay. But she prolly didn't realize the extent until that exact moment when she realized she was fucking up. She's not innocent, but she made the right choice when she became aware of the situation. Feelings are super messy and even the best of us make mistakes in that. Now the real interesting question is "What exactly did she tell her husband?" THAT, more than anything, will show where she stands. But we don't know that as of season 4.
It'd be a magnificently tragic train wreck if it came back to haunt Bojack in season 5 or 6 though if she told the husband, the husband lost trust in her, and they broke up. Right after some point where Bojack elt happyish she or the daughter angrily calls Bojack blaming him for everything tearing his world to pieces again . They prolly at least considered that.
Drabswim. First of all, he hadn't travelled ages to see her. She lives two states over, so...... I wouldn't qualify a two day drive as "coming all that way". But I agree with you. Charlotte's invitation to stay was likely just a formality. It was BoJack that took it as indefinite, since he was in such a bad place. I don't think Charlotte was setting him up or even keeping Bojack around for herself
I think she thought she was helping an old friend who was having a hard time, nothing more.
i call that chaos..i dont think Charlotte knew what she was doing more than bojack...but she has a better control of her life.
Finally someone analyzes what happend before the shocking scene with penny
Was waiting for this, thank you
This was my introduction to you and you truly put things into perspective for me ever since holy dadongos shady your cool 😎
Kyle is the happiest character
Yup him and his wife are happy
Damn, I am such a Bojack, but I wish I was a Charlotte……I wish i saw this video 25 years ago!!!!
That advice in that "don't do that" joke is actually pretty shitty. Doing something normal shouldn't hurt to the point you avoid that normal thing and if it does, it needs to be fixed and worked on.
Except that what is considered "normal" is a matter of perspective. Bojack was doing the thing that was causing him pain because he believed it was the normal thing to do but to someone like Charlotte, those kinds of actions aren't normal. If it indeed is about doing something normal that hurts, than it's a message to Bojack that he needs to reconsider what a normal action is.
The tricky thing about this show is that everyone has something wrong with them, even if you don’t notice it at first. In fact i would very much argue that Bojack almost seems to have the least wrong with him, he just sees himself as so fucked while everyone else decides to live in peaceful bliss. The thing about Charolette is that you can clearly tell she still has some deeply rooted feelings for him. I’m sure she wonders the same things bojack does except opposite (what would’ve been if she had stayed vs leaving). Charlotte seems to be one of those people who does what she thinks she should rather than doing what would actually make her(more) happy
I actually disagree with your last line . I would replace the "more" with "momentary gush of pleasure" which many people confuse with the eureka happiness moment. She was real..didn't see the world in rosetinted glass. She saw that moment as just what it was..it was not real feeling..it was just a "what if". For her it was real happiness she had built for herself vs a what if. I dont think she has a problem..at least in this case.
I love characters like Charlotte and Hollyhock but it’s a shame that BoJack ruined those relationships ((in a way)), but honestly I think it says a lot about BoJack and even more about those characters, this is an insanely clever show.
Depressed people seek temporary happiness because that’s what happiness is to them, temporary.
Charolette is an interesting character and was a good friend to Bojack. One of the things i like about her besides her happy personality and being a good mother is she married a human dude which is quite refreshing because there's too many human females with furry, xeno and mutant males in mainstream already (I.E. Wolf Children or Roger Rabbit or Gargoyles's Goliath and Eliza to Biker Mice from Mars's Vinnie and Charlene etc.) as it's getting quite boring when i find the reverse much fresher like Hatton Slayden's amazing artworks to Margaret's parents on Regular Show getting rid of the dumb double standard that "only human women are ok to be with nonhuman people", i mean if Minerva Mink dated a human guy in the upcoming animaniacs reboot as one of her dates that be cute.
Yes Bojack should had said no to her daughter when she was seducing him, he knew he was too old for her but he shouldn't tried to do that.
such a great show. i wish i could convince everyone to watch it, but it’s not for everyone. which is part of why it’s great ig
and suddenly i feel like i should stop talking to my best friend, because i have feelings for her and she doesn't and is actively trying to be with other ppl...
Excellent analysis!
Nice avatar I grew up with ducktales
@@Johnlindsey289 says the guy with the mothafuckin ROBOCOP avatar! I just finished playing the arcade game on my retropie arcade the other day. Best accomplishment of the week. I spent so many quarters playing as a kid on that game...
@@tsilikasp
Awesome and i saw the movie in theaters wen i was 5 in St Louis with my family and i remember that game
Alongside Wanda, Charlotte is probably one of my all-time favorite characters of the series, as I hope we see more of her in Season 6 onward.
me too
Wwwaaiiitt...... but Charlotte also made some shitty choices. Which mother, in her right mind, lets, and I quote, "someone (50 year old dude) who you knew for 5 minutes 30 years ago" who you know is a coward and has some dark issues, stay to live in your driveway, and let him go to prom with a 17 year old girl? She might be braver, she might be healthier, even saner, but she made a supper shitty choice. Not saying BoJack is a saint, but we can't ignore Charlotte's part in the whole situation.
True
I got the impression that she had mostly positive feelings for Bojack.
She remembers the sweet, hopeful, somewhat responsible, albeit flawed man in his early 20s.
The way she asked about if he would have asked her out; she probably had feelings for him.
So she saw an old friend who she had mostly positive feelings about who clearly needed some time away from his current lifestyle, so she let him stay for a bit.
And he did blend in well for quite some time and was an asset of sorts.
Then things got weird...
KYLE AND THE KIDS! THAT MADE ME SOOOO UNCOMFORTABLE!!!!!
exceptional analysis
this was very eye opening
It becomes much more apparent in season 6.
Penny wanted to give her side of the story to the reporters, something that would probably allow her to fully move past her trauma and turn it into something she could use to bring attention to the bad things Bojack had done. But Charlotte didn’t want her to. At first it seemed like it was because she cared about Penny and didn’t want her to revisit the events of the prom night, but it becomes clear that she doesn’t want Penny to say anything because she didn’t want the fact she kissed Bojack to get out, which could’ve ruined her marriage. Penny’s attempt to heal threatened Charlotte’s happiness, and thus she talks her out of it. This is where her desire for happiness becomes toxic. She puts her own happiness above the happiness of her own daughter, knowing full well that she is still suffering.
But does penny even know that?
yasbutterfly Y Penny didn’t know the Charlotte kissed Bojack, but it might’ve gotten out during Bojack’s interview if Penny told her story to the reporters. Bojack did admit to a lot of stuff during the follow up interview (for example, having sex with Sarah Lynn), and while Bojack might not have admitted to it, Charlotte didn’t want to take that chance.
@@sambarham8887 ah, but would Charlotte have known bojack would say something in the interview?
yasbutterfly Y Doesn’t matter, there was still a chance he could have and that would have been enough of a reason for Charlotte to stop Penny from helping in the case.
@@sambarham8887 fair enough.
Honestly your comment was kind of an eye-opener
Like "wait WHAT?!"
Cos I didn't even think that charlotte might've not want penny to out her story to the reporters for her own sake and not her daughter.
That might even be why she didn't just call the cops on bojack when he almost had sex with penny
Not many wholesome deer-on-human, err, MIXED deer and human families out there that lead by such a good example.
It’s so nice to finally see human male and anthro female couples in mainstream at last outside internet artworks like hattonslayden’s amazing sci-fi and fantasy illustrations of human guys with alien and furry females.
Regular Show has Margaret’s parents being a bird woman and human man and this also has a Judah and Princess Carolyn.
So tired of always human women x anthro male (ala any beauty and the beast or the parents in wolf children or roger and Jessica or Howard the duck and Beverly in
Marvel comics etc) as they are getting rid of that sexist old double standard “only human women are ok to be with nonhuman folk”.
I mean there’s guys out there who fantasize about furry gals like Rebecca Cunningham, Lola bunny, Minerva mink on animaniacs, Felicia, Callie Briggs etc
@@Johnlindsey289 Hah hah, yeah the only other anthro mixed family that's daring like you say is the anthro deer mother in that one Orangina commercial who has two human children who had taught her children how to eat Orangina cereal without spoons. Ofcourse it's possible she just adopted those kids and no human father was ever in the picture to begin with. It remains a mystery.
But to be fair Belle doesn't end up with Beast because he has to turn back into a generic human. It's just not really allowed for humans to spend their happily ever after with any non-humans/anthros. But any movie or cartoon that DOES will certainly have more imagination and will probably be better written because thinking outside of the little race-supremacist box requires a capable, independent, functional brain!
And I'll have to check out hattonslayden. Not sure i know the artist.
@@AnotherCoyote
How do you feel about Margaret's parents in Regular Show o the parents in the anime movie Wolf children?
@@Johnlindsey289 I didn't watch enough Regular Show to see Margaret's parents so I think that's cool she has a human parent in the mix!
Wolf Children is a great and beautiful movie but that would have been REALLY interesting, and probably even more sexy if it had been a human man with a werewolf lady instead. Would have been a VERY different dynamic! We can only hope such couples lead to braver writers trying out more anthro human couples. But really, furry writers are just going to have to get good at animating and voice casting their own cartoons and 3d animations since I don't expect to see anything decent ever come out of Hollywood. Bojack Horseman and Regular Show were just flukes as far as Hollywood writing goes.
But then, Vivienne Madrano/Vivziepop tried to have human anthro couples with her Zoophobia comic (she got closer to it) and do mini-cartoons about that but she got WAY too many people screaming at her in public calling her nasty names, seeing it as human and animal relationships instead. Even though Vivienne is massively successful with Helluva Boss she still has to live in fear of all the people who want to skin her alive for daring to have anthros get close to humans.
It's tough to break through this kind of boundary, it's going to require a whole new generation of furry writers and animators with a more accepting public to get such relationships into cartoons and movies as a serious thing.
Edit: I just looked up hattonslayden and yeah I know his art! Always fun to look at! Would be awesome if he got his own 3d animation/Source filmmaker projects going and hired voice actors from his circle to make his own media.
Omg!! CAN SOMEONE ANYONE REALIZE MR.PEANUTBUTTER IS A FACE OF DEPRESSION!!
THE SHOW EVEN NOTICES THAT NO O ENIS NOTICING AND SPELLS IT OUT!! JUST DEPRESSION!!
Mr.Peanutbutter IS NOT HAPPY. THAT WAS HIS ARC!
Hey, I just been working on my self mental health recently…and one of my toxic ex contacts me out of the blue. I blocked him right away cuz I remembered 3 years ago the depressed me watching this video telling myself I want to be like Charlotte! Have health boundaries are sooo important !
amazing breakdown
2:06 I hate that chair next to Bojack. It dose not look comfortable to sit in
I mean its probably built for animals
It's that one chair I have PTSD from at the beach yk those plastic ones?
Bojack really fucked this up.
I think the Charlotte and Bojack dynamic is almost a message that the people who hurt you the most are the people you know, not strangers
Wow. Perfectly said.