A boy not getting it the first time and repeatedly asking her is harassment. The fact is, he needs to learn to take NO for an answer. That mother probably spoiled her boy and let him do whatever he wanted and always gave in to him.
She's 12, but people expect her to not get angry when someone is harassing her? She's supposed to be nice and accommodating, but he doesn't have to respect her feelings? It's his parents' job to teach him how to interact with other people and regulate his emotions, not another child's.
NTA. No means no. Period, end of discussion. It's not this girl's responsibility to protect his feelings when he's been told no multiple times. Punishing the girl would send the message that she has no control over her own body, and that her job is to be a sex object for whatever male decides he wants her. Whether on the spectrum or not, the autistic boy needs to learn that he can't have whatever or whoever he wants before he grows up to be a rapist.
NTA. No means no. Autism or not: The kid needs to understand he can’t force people to like him. Especially after the girl stated multiple times she’s not interested.
Almost 40 years ago I had a similar problem with a young man at our church. He kept pestering me for a date and finally said “But I really want to date you!” I replied “Well I don’t want to date you! Don’t you think you deserve someone who at least wants to!”
NTA, a blunt response might seem rude to most people, but it's often necessary for someone on the spectrum. The daughter at a young age already has a skill many adult women lack. She can reject someone in the most explicit way possible.
Why are so many people parents when they shouldn't be? The people defending the autistic kid don't know anything about parenting. If you let a autistic kid or any kid get away with harassment they will NEVER learn. STOP infantilizing autistic PEOPLE and treat them like everyone else. This is what many parents lack understanding with when raising an autistic kid and it's pathetic. Dangerous behaviour like this needs to be stopped at first site before it get's worse which considering how everyone else allows the kid to do whatever then it will.
Coming from a 19 year old who had experience with autistic ex friends and barely any are as successful and stable in life unlike the ones that got punished rightfully so like anybody else. One guy stabs people with pens in class and the other sexually assaulted his sister because of his porn, hentai addiction. All had MANY signs of increasingly bad behaviour and getting away with it and now there are victims as a result....this is what makes people ableist.
As an autistic dude who had trouble taking a hint as a kid, I WISH the girl I was crushing on in high school had been that clear with me, would have saved me years of heartache and might have allowed me to actually get with somebody else if I hadn't been hyper focused on someone who wasn't interested. Assuming the previous rejections were clear and firm but not rude, I feel the harsher language was justified here. NTA In my case, the girl I was chasing was never clear with her rejections, it was always "I don't have time for a boyfriend" or "I'm not interested in dating right now", which to me, meant I should wait until she was ready since it wasn't ME that she was rejecting, it was the entire idea of dating anybody in the first place, it wasn't "no", it was "not now". Then in junior year I was taking tickets to the school play and she showed up with a date and I saw them making out in a side hall during intermission, and that's when it finally sunk in after three years that it really WAS me that she wasn't interested in, and that hurt WAY worse than if she had just bluntly told me she wasn't interested and that I should leave her alone. I rejected other girls who actually WERE interested in me because I was waiting for her, I passed up on offers to set me up with girls my friends thought would be a good match because I was waiting for her, etc. All because she was a coward more interested in being seen as "nice" than in actually being kind. Firmly rejecting someone when you honestly aren't interested is a kindness, yeah you should try to be as nice and gentle as possible, but you can't let that get in the way of being clear about your feelings and boundaries.
To be fair, everyone would be confused by her answers, not just you. On the other hand I wouldn't call her a coward, who knows what other guys have tried to hit on her with nasty reactions to her firm 'no'
@@Leyladjdjx Honestly, I hate the idea that I get held responsible for the bad actions of other people. It's one thing when I'm "just some guy", but when she specifically knows me and what I'm about, it becomes kind of insulting to be reduced to just my gender, as though having a penis makes me automatically untrustworthy and no matter what I do I can never be cleared of suspicion. I don't believe it was because she expected me to be pushy or not take "no" for an answer, but if her behavior was at all influenced by that, then IMO that makes it worse, not better.
@@jacobbissey9311 Ignore what the other reply said. There's nothing confusing about her answers. I guarantee you that most people without autism would have understood it as a polite rejection and moved on. It really is unfortunate that it turned out like this this time but I do feel the need to point out that just because you have difficulties picking up social clues doesn't mean the other party is in the wrong.
@@lighttearvale3958 I am fully aware that most people would have understood her intent. And if we were strangers and she had no reason to suspect I wasn't taking the hint I would agree she wasn't in the wrong. But an important part of communication is phrasing things in a way your intended audience will understand. Look at it this way, if you ask me a question and I respond in Latin (or if you happen to speak Latin, some other language you don't understand), who's fault is it that you don't understand what I'm trying to say? She knew me, we were friends, and we had been having this conversation every couple months for years. Once or twice, yeah that's on me, but sooner or later it should become obvious that I am not picking up what she is putting down, at which point she *does* become at fault for continuing to communicate in a way she *knows* is failing to get the point across. What "most" people would or would not understand is completely irrelevant because she *knew* who she was talking to and how I would take her words. The speaker bears most of the responsibility for being understood in communication.
@@jacobbissey9311 Knowing more about the situation now, I have to agree with you. She should have been direct. Since it happened so often and for such a long time, I'm surprised nobody tried to talk to you about it.
NTA. No means no. It sucks to be autistic in a lot of ways when you're a kid (been there myself), but you don't get tolerance through group pressure. I hope the boy learns and thrives in his life though!
NTA - the 'freak' comment likely knee jerk for having to say no so many times and more a reference to his not leaving her alone than anything else. Autistic or not he should be held accountable for how he is harassing your daughter. And maybe that means counseling for him to learn behavior cues and interactions. But its not the Daughter or her family's responsibility to 'manage' that situation.
The use of the word “freak” is the only part I take issue with at all. But I understand how frustrated she would be (had a medium-high functioning autistic kid in one of my clubs who made the girls feel very uncomfortable), so if I had a conversation with her and she acknowledged that language was a mistake and she wouldn’t say it again, that would be the end of it. But I don’t want to downplay the dehumanization of the word “freak”; if anything, it has a worse history than “the r word”, so I would definitely point out that was wrong.
Mention that she should leave out the personal insults (if only because it reflects badly on her, which is annoying and unfair). But neither she nor you is at fault here. Keep in mind that other people may not be aware of the previous interactions, though.
I'm Autistic. Sometimes we do not get clues. Sometimes we even forget we already asked something. I can't blame the daughter. She tried 4 times. She has had issues and been bullied around this stuff before. So it isn't like he might be the only one triggered, though the freak was unneeded. Then again, had she said ah, butthead, etc., we wouldn't care- but making it about his disability (for the insult) was unnecessary... As the Dad, I'd tell everyone commenting what happened. As a popular kid, she has been pursued a lot, hates it from everyone, and this kid tried to force it four times. At some point you get to stop being nice. No means no. As an adult we tell women to mace dudes and scream at them before they even approach (this is asinine to me, but w/e)... so I don't think yellin "Leave me alone, I already said no!" is anywhere near way too far, though making the rejection about something like race or disability is a problem.
While I understand that she was frustrated with him, lettiny her get away with calling him a freak makes you an ahole. That was wrong and you should make her apologize. People with mental disabilities have a hard time in life. It doesn't help them when they're called names. You need to sut with your daughter snd explain that it wasn't nice to call him that. Explain that she could have handled that situation better. Maybe help her figure out how to deal with anger better so she can control herself better in those kind of situations. Also MAKE HER APOLOGIZE. You need to apologize to the kids mom too. Apologize for not handling the situation better. You should never let your kids get away with treating people like that. Especially those with mental disabilities.
Shes nta for rejecting. Shes the ah for calling him a freak and op needs to acknowledge that. The other kid's parents need to be told so they can explain the situation to the kid so he knows to leave her alone
NO means no. Absolutely. However, a boy asking her out 4 times is not harassment. Geeze. People use words like harassment and abuse so easily. It really diminishes the words. How many times have we seen memes about grown women turning men down and then being upset when the guy just gave up? Also, calling him a freak is not firmly doing anything. It was name-calling. Maybe that is what people were talking about saying she needed to be punished. At most, you should've talked to her about that. Certainly, if a boy she turned down called her a bitch, you would expect something to be said to him.
You don't know whether she was, the first three times. The differences between "nice" and "vague" and between "firm and clear" and "abusive" are hard enough for adults to keep track of. Even without the background of a dozen or so other people using different rule-sets, some of whom can become dangerous.
I’m autistic and while it is different for everyone because there are three levels that determine severity, I can see how social cues might be missed, even if it would be direct for a NT, especially considering he is around the same age. That being said, it can be frustrating or off-putting to have to keep rejecting the same person over and over and I can understand why she snapped and I wouldn’t say punish her for rejecting him, but I would say OP is kinda TA for not punishing her for calling an autistic kid a “freak”. That shit is fucked up; that’s like if if a person of color asked her out repeatedly and she called him the “n” word out of frustration, it would be well within her rights to decline and even be frustrated, but she crossed a line. I get that she is only twelve and she doesn’t have to like everyone, but this would be a good opportunity to teach her that some people’s brains work differently and if someone who is level two or three autistic becomes fixated, in their mind trying at different times in different ways might yield a different result, even if the outcome is clearly fixed from the perspective of the other person; It would be a good opportunity to teach her that compassion is healthier than frustration because there will be lots of situations in life that will be frustrating, but are better dealt with by considering where the other person is coming from. If she had a toddler sibling that kept messing with her things, would it be okay for her to yell at the toddler and call it derogatory names? I’m not comparing the autistic kid to a toddler, I’m simply using it as an example of a situation that is frustrating but should be handled with compassion because the toddler wouldn’t know any better. The sum of all this is to say that OP is TA for not disciplining her daughter for calling a disabled kid a “freak” but in terms of rejection and general frustration she should be using the situation as a teachable moment to help her daughter understand how a neural divergent mind works.
A boy not getting it the first time and repeatedly asking her is harassment. The fact is, he needs to learn to take NO for an answer. That mother probably spoiled her boy and let him do whatever he wanted and always gave in to him.
She's 12, but people expect her to not get angry when someone is harassing her? She's supposed to be nice and accommodating, but he doesn't have to respect her feelings? It's his parents' job to teach him how to interact with other people and regulate his emotions, not another child's.
NTA. No means no. Period, end of discussion. It's not this girl's responsibility to protect his feelings when he's been told no multiple times. Punishing the girl would send the message that she has no control over her own body, and that her job is to be a sex object for whatever male decides he wants her. Whether on the spectrum or not, the autistic boy needs to learn that he can't have whatever or whoever he wants before he grows up to be a rapist.
I doubt a person would grow up to be a rapist because of that but ok
@@some_random_giraffe2806
Literally men.
@@magnarcreed3801women are just as fucked up as men...
@@some_random_giraffe2806 you have no idea how many of frustrated guys specially go to any extent to do it
NTA. No means no. Autism or not: The kid needs to understand he can’t force people to like him. Especially after the girl stated multiple times she’s not interested.
Almost 40 years ago I had a similar problem with a young man at our church. He kept pestering me for a date and finally said “But I really want to date you!” I replied “Well I don’t want to date you! Don’t you think you deserve someone who at least wants to!”
NTA. You don’t owe ANYONE your time or attention
NTA, a blunt response might seem rude to most people, but it's often necessary for someone on the spectrum. The daughter at a young age already has a skill many adult women lack. She can reject someone in the most explicit way possible.
Why are so many people parents when they shouldn't be? The people defending the autistic kid don't know anything about parenting. If you let a autistic kid or any kid get away with harassment they will NEVER learn. STOP infantilizing autistic PEOPLE and treat them like everyone else. This is what many parents lack understanding with when raising an autistic kid and it's pathetic. Dangerous behaviour like this needs to be stopped at first site before it get's worse which considering how everyone else allows the kid to do whatever then it will.
Coming from a 19 year old who had experience with autistic ex friends and barely any are as successful and stable in life unlike the ones that got punished rightfully so like anybody else. One guy stabs people with pens in class and the other sexually assaulted his sister because of his porn, hentai addiction. All had MANY signs of increasingly bad behaviour and getting away with it and now there are victims as a result....this is what makes people ableist.
For a moment i thought you werr pissed at the dad for defending his daughter and im so happy you were speaking on some important stuff
NTA, it’s nobody’s business how you handle your daughter’s decision.
As an autistic dude who had trouble taking a hint as a kid, I WISH the girl I was crushing on in high school had been that clear with me, would have saved me years of heartache and might have allowed me to actually get with somebody else if I hadn't been hyper focused on someone who wasn't interested. Assuming the previous rejections were clear and firm but not rude, I feel the harsher language was justified here. NTA
In my case, the girl I was chasing was never clear with her rejections, it was always "I don't have time for a boyfriend" or "I'm not interested in dating right now", which to me, meant I should wait until she was ready since it wasn't ME that she was rejecting, it was the entire idea of dating anybody in the first place, it wasn't "no", it was "not now". Then in junior year I was taking tickets to the school play and she showed up with a date and I saw them making out in a side hall during intermission, and that's when it finally sunk in after three years that it really WAS me that she wasn't interested in, and that hurt WAY worse than if she had just bluntly told me she wasn't interested and that I should leave her alone. I rejected other girls who actually WERE interested in me because I was waiting for her, I passed up on offers to set me up with girls my friends thought would be a good match because I was waiting for her, etc. All because she was a coward more interested in being seen as "nice" than in actually being kind. Firmly rejecting someone when you honestly aren't interested is a kindness, yeah you should try to be as nice and gentle as possible, but you can't let that get in the way of being clear about your feelings and boundaries.
To be fair, everyone would be confused by her answers, not just you.
On the other hand I wouldn't call her a coward, who knows what other guys have tried to hit on her with nasty reactions to her firm 'no'
@@Leyladjdjx Honestly, I hate the idea that I get held responsible for the bad actions of other people. It's one thing when I'm "just some guy", but when she specifically knows me and what I'm about, it becomes kind of insulting to be reduced to just my gender, as though having a penis makes me automatically untrustworthy and no matter what I do I can never be cleared of suspicion. I don't believe it was because she expected me to be pushy or not take "no" for an answer, but if her behavior was at all influenced by that, then IMO that makes it worse, not better.
@@jacobbissey9311 Ignore what the other reply said. There's nothing confusing about her answers. I guarantee you that most people without autism would have understood it as a polite rejection and moved on. It really is unfortunate that it turned out like this this time but I do feel the need to point out that just because you have difficulties picking up social clues doesn't mean the other party is in the wrong.
@@lighttearvale3958 I am fully aware that most people would have understood her intent. And if we were strangers and she had no reason to suspect I wasn't taking the hint I would agree she wasn't in the wrong. But an important part of communication is phrasing things in a way your intended audience will understand. Look at it this way, if you ask me a question and I respond in Latin (or if you happen to speak Latin, some other language you don't understand), who's fault is it that you don't understand what I'm trying to say? She knew me, we were friends, and we had been having this conversation every couple months for years. Once or twice, yeah that's on me, but sooner or later it should become obvious that I am not picking up what she is putting down, at which point she *does* become at fault for continuing to communicate in a way she *knows* is failing to get the point across. What "most" people would or would not understand is completely irrelevant because she *knew* who she was talking to and how I would take her words. The speaker bears most of the responsibility for being understood in communication.
@@jacobbissey9311 Knowing more about the situation now, I have to agree with you. She should have been direct.
Since it happened so often and for such a long time, I'm surprised nobody tried to talk to you about it.
Tell the mom to teach her son that no means no, and that your daughter already rejected him nicely several times previously.
I feel for daughter. She was pushed to the brink.
NTA. No means no. It sucks to be autistic in a lot of ways when you're a kid (been there myself), but you don't get tolerance through group pressure. I hope the boy learns and thrives in his life though!
NTA - the 'freak' comment likely knee jerk for having to say no so many times and more a reference to his not leaving her alone than anything else. Autistic or not he should be held accountable for how he is harassing your daughter. And maybe that means counseling for him to learn behavior cues and interactions. But its not the Daughter or her family's responsibility to 'manage' that situation.
The use of the word “freak” is the only part I take issue with at all. But I understand how frustrated she would be (had a medium-high functioning autistic kid in one of my clubs who made the girls feel very uncomfortable), so if I had a conversation with her and she acknowledged that language was a mistake and she wouldn’t say it again, that would be the end of it.
But I don’t want to downplay the dehumanization of the word “freak”; if anything, it has a worse history than “the r word”, so I would definitely point out that was wrong.
Mention that she should leave out the personal insults (if only because it reflects badly on her, which is annoying and unfair). But neither she nor you is at fault here. Keep in mind that other people may not be aware of the previous interactions, though.
I'm Autistic. Sometimes we do not get clues. Sometimes we even forget we already asked something. I can't blame the daughter. She tried 4 times. She has had issues and been bullied around this stuff before. So it isn't like he might be the only one triggered, though the freak was unneeded. Then again, had she said ah, butthead, etc., we wouldn't care- but making it about his disability (for the insult) was unnecessary...
As the Dad, I'd tell everyone commenting what happened. As a popular kid, she has been pursued a lot, hates it from everyone, and this kid tried to force it four times. At some point you get to stop being nice. No means no. As an adult we tell women to mace dudes and scream at them before they even approach (this is asinine to me, but w/e)... so I don't think yellin "Leave me alone, I already said no!" is anywhere near way too far, though making the rejection about something like race or disability is a problem.
Except it was. If you’re going to act freakishly for any reason, people will call on it.
That school is shit
While I understand that she was frustrated with him, lettiny her get away with calling him a freak makes you an ahole. That was wrong and you should make her apologize. People with mental disabilities have a hard time in life. It doesn't help them when they're called names. You need to sut with your daughter snd explain that it wasn't nice to call him that. Explain that she could have handled that situation better. Maybe help her figure out how to deal with anger better so she can control herself better in those kind of situations. Also MAKE HER APOLOGIZE. You need to apologize to the kids mom too. Apologize for not handling the situation better. You should never let your kids get away with treating people like that. Especially those with mental disabilities.
Shes nta for rejecting. Shes the ah for calling him a freak and op needs to acknowledge that. The other kid's parents need to be told so they can explain the situation to the kid so he knows to leave her alone
No, some kids need to hear it upfront. If you’re harassing someone and won’t take no for an answer, you are indeed a freak.
NO means no. Absolutely. However, a boy asking her out 4 times is not harassment. Geeze. People use words like harassment and abuse so easily. It really diminishes the words. How many times have we seen memes about grown women turning men down and then being upset when the guy just gave up? Also, calling him a freak is not firmly doing anything. It was name-calling. Maybe that is what people were talking about saying she needed to be punished. At most, you should've talked to her about that. Certainly, if a boy she turned down called her a bitch, you would expect something to be said to him.
Stop babying the autistic boy, if he wasn’t autistic you’d be saying that it was harassment.
Yes, he was harassing her. He kept going at it after she said no. He was harassing her.
Although the boy should have just taken the no, the girl should have been nicer about it.
You don't know whether she was, the first three times. The differences between "nice" and "vague" and between "firm and clear" and "abusive" are hard enough for adults to keep track of. Even without the background of a dozen or so other people using different rule-sets, some of whom can become dangerous.
I’m autistic and while it is different for everyone because there are three levels that determine severity, I can see how social cues might be missed, even if it would be direct for a NT, especially considering he is around the same age. That being said, it can be frustrating or off-putting to have to keep rejecting the same person over and over and I can understand why she snapped and I wouldn’t say punish her for rejecting him, but I would say OP is kinda TA for not punishing her for calling an autistic kid a “freak”. That shit is fucked up; that’s like if if a person of color asked her out repeatedly and she called him the “n” word out of frustration, it would be well within her rights to decline and even be frustrated, but she crossed a line. I get that she is only twelve and she doesn’t have to like everyone, but this would be a good opportunity to teach her that some people’s brains work differently and if someone who is level two or three autistic becomes fixated, in their mind trying at different times in different ways might yield a different result, even if the outcome is clearly fixed from the perspective of the other person; It would be a good opportunity to teach her that compassion is healthier than frustration because there will be lots of situations in life that will be frustrating, but are better dealt with by considering where the other person is coming from. If she had a toddler sibling that kept messing with her things, would it be okay for her to yell at the toddler and call it derogatory names? I’m not comparing the autistic kid to a toddler, I’m simply using it as an example of a situation that is frustrating but should be handled with compassion because the toddler wouldn’t know any better. The sum of all this is to say that OP is TA for not disciplining her daughter for calling a disabled kid a “freak” but in terms of rejection and general frustration she should be using the situation as a teachable moment to help her daughter understand how a neural divergent mind works.
The autistic boys parents also need to teach their son that no means no and pushing it will only make people angry